Question for those who hate Kuffar

[ZeeshanParvez]

Re: Question for those who hate Kuffar

This is a statement on the fate of the disbelievers. Its not a statement to hate ALL disbelievers.



These verses ARE NOT encouragement for the believers to hate the kaffirs for the sake of Allah. Again, you are retro-fitting your misguided belief of hatred for all disbelievers into these verses. The verse CLEARLY said that the people who believe in Allah and the Last Day will not have affection FOR THOSE WHO OPPOSE ALLAH and HIS MESSENGER. It did not mention THOSE WHO DO NOT OPPOSE ALLAH and HIS MESSENGER. In all the verses where Allah mentioned to fight the disbelievers, its always QUALIFIED BY ‘those who fight you that is they fight you simply for your belief in Allah and His messenger which means if they fight you because of your belief (in Allah) then they are opposing Allah and His Messenger too.


True, but that’s between them and Allah and has nothing to do with you. As a believer, your role and responsibility is only to convey the message of truth of Islam (dakwah), not create confusions and misunderstandings among believers and unbelievers alike. You think you are better than the Prophet (pbuh) whose ONLY role was to convey God’s message ?
“You have NO DUTY EXCEPT TO DELIVER THE MESSAGE” – Quran 42:48.

“Your ONLY DUTY is delivery (of the message). We will call them (the disbelievers) to ACCOUNT.” – Quran 13:40.
This verse also mean that the affairs of the disbelievers are not the concerns of the Prophet (and so they are not yours too) but its ONLY to Allah who will ‘call them to account’.

So, be careful in what you said of what the Quran said and understand the Quran in its true sense and NOT understand the Quran from your emotional perspective such as your hatred for ALL disbelievers. There will come a time when the believers misunderstood the Quran to the point where they will put foolish nonsense (in their interpretation) in the Quran without even realizing it. The Noble Quran warned of such a time in Surah Al-Furqan 25:30 – “Then the Apostle will say ‘O my Lord ! Truly my people (ie. the believers) took the Qu’ran for foolish nonsense’”.

Not my belief but that of a scholars. As a matter of fact of many.

Ill take their opinion over yours. You enjoy loving the Kaafir. We will see on the Day of Judgement who is misguided.

[ZeeshanParvez]

Re: Question for those who hate Kuffar

So, be careful in what you said of what the Quran said and understand the Quran in its true sense and NOT understand the Quran from your emotional perspective such as your hatred for ALL disbelievers. There will come a time when the believers misunderstood the Quran to the point where they will put foolish nonsense (in their interpretation) in the Quran without even realizing it. The Noble Quran warned of such a time in Surah Al-Furqan 25:30 – “Then the Apostle will say ‘O my Lord ! Truly my people (ie. the believers) took the Qu’ran for foolish nonsense’”.

What a joke. You sit on your computer misinterpreting the Qur'aan for yourself and tell me to be careful! The irony!

The only one without any reference backing from orthodox scholars is you. I suggest you get a grip on yourself and your emotions and learn what Islamic scholarship is. Until then you can enjoy loving the Kaafirs.

[ZeeshanParvez]

Re: Question for those who hate Kuffar

There will come a time when the believers misunderstood the Quran to the point where they will put foolish nonsense (in their interpretation) in the Quran without even realizing it. The Noble Quran warned of such a time in Surah Al-Furqan 25:30 – “Then the Apostle will say ‘O my Lord ! Truly my people (ie. the believers) took the Qu’ran for foolish nonsense’”.

And considering that this is how the classical scholars understood it, I think we know who the fool is.

[JerryMyers]

Re: Question for those who hate Kuffar

And considering that this is how the classical scholars understood it, I think we know who the fool is.

And how would you understand that verse ?? Care to explain ??

[ZeeshanParvez]

Re: Question for those who hate Kuffar

فينبغي على كل مسلم عدم الكلام في دين الله إلا بعلم,

It is necessary upon every Muslim to keep from speaking in respect to the Religion of Allah without knowledge.

ومن تكلم بغير ذلك فقد أخطأ طريق الصواب,

And he who speaks without knowledge has made a mistake and deviated from the right path

والقول على الله تعالى بغير علم من الكبائر العظيمة المحرمة,

And attributing anything upon Allah without knowledge is a major sin

قال تعالى: قُلْ إِنَّمَا حَرَّمَ رَبِّيَ الْفَوَاحِشَ مَا ظَهَرَ مِنْهَا وَمَا بَطَنَ وَالْإِثْمَ وَالْبَغْيَ بِغَيْرِ الْحَقِّ وَأَنْ تُشْرِكُوا بِاللَّهِ مَا لَمْ يُنَزِّلْ بِهِ سُلْطَانًا وَأَنْ تَقُولُوا عَلَى اللَّهِ مَا لَا تَعْلَمُونَ {الأعراف:33}

Allah says in the Qur'aan:

Say, "My Lord has only forbidden immoralities - what is apparent of them and what is concealed - and sin, and oppression without right, and that you associate with Allah that for which He has not sent down authority, and that you say about Allah that which you do not know."

[Qur'aan 7:33]



We have people trying to interpret the Qur'aan for themselves.


If you want to put up an explanation of the Qur'aan quote an orthodox Mufassir.
If you want to put up an explanation of the Hadith quote an orthodox Muhaddith
If you want to put up matter relating to Fiqh quote an orthodox Faqeeh


Reference(s):

Fatwaa - حكم من تكلم في الدين بغير علم فأخطأ فتأخر في تصويب خطئه

[JerryMyers]

Re: Question for those who hate Kuffar

Not my belief but that of a scholars. As a matter of fact of many.

Ill take their opinion over yours. You enjoy loving the Kaafir. We will see on the Day of Judgement who is misguided.

Instead of just making empty statements, explain your understanding with facts.

[ZeeshanParvez]

Re: Question for those who hate Kuffar

And how would you understand that verse ?? Care to explain ??

I don't explain Verses. This is the first thing you need to understand.

A Mufassir understands the Verse and I present to you his opinion.

There is no You and I in Islam.

Unless you are a Mufassir or scholar refrain from putting forth your interpretations of the Qur'aan.

Finally, I am not here to discuss or debate with you. You want to abandon orthodox views of Islam, it makes no difference to me.

You start saying I am putting my misguided views into Islam, then you have another thing coming because the only one doing that right now is you unless you can back up your interpretations from classical scholars.

[JerryMyers]

Re: Question for those who hate Kuffar

What a joke. You sit on your computer misinterpreting the Qur'aan for yourself and tell me to be careful! The irony!

The only one without any reference backing from orthodox scholars is you. I suggest you get a grip on yourself and your emotions and learn what Islamic scholarship is. Until then you can enjoy loving the Kaafirs.

Again, stop making foolish statements, back what you said with references. Who knows, you might convince me.

[JerryMyers]

Re: Question for those who hate Kuffar

I don't explain Verses. This is the first thing you need to understand.

A Mufassir understands the Verse and I present to you his opinion.

There is no You and I in Islam.

Unless you are a Mufassir or scholar refrain from putting forth your interpretations of the Qur'aan.

Finally, I am not here to discuss or debate with you. You want to abandon orthodox views of Islam, it makes no difference to me.

You start saying I am putting my misguided views into Islam, then you have another thing coming because the only one doing that right now is you unless you can back up your interpretations from classical scholars.

You don't explain verses ?? It that because you don't understand them ?? I guess we know now who is the fool, don't we ??

[ZeeshanParvez]

Re: Question for those who hate Kuffar

Again, stop making foolish statements, back what you said with references. Who knows, you might convince me.

You don't explain verses ?? It that because you don't understand them ?? I guess we know now who is the fool, don't we ??

Tell me what this says


الأصل المتقرر في الشريعة الغراء : أن المسلم لا بد له من بغض الكافرين ومعاداتهم وإظهار ذلك لهم بقدر الوسع والطاقة وحسب الإمكان , وقدوته في ذلك إمام الحنفاء إبراهيم عليه وعلى نبينا أفضل الصلاة والسلام , قال تعالى حكاية عن خليله إبراهيم : ( قَدْ كَانَتْ لَكُمْ أُسْوَةٌ حَسَنَةٌ فِي إِبْرَاهِيمَ وَالَّذِينَ مَعَهُ إِذْ قَالُوا لِقَوْمِهِمْ إِنَّا بُرَآءُ مِنْكُمْ وَمِمَّا تَعْبُدُونَ مِنْ دُونِ اللَّهِ كَفَرْنَا بِكُمْ وَبَدَا بَيْنَنَا وَبَيْنَكُمُ الْعَدَاوَةُ وَالْبَغْضَاءُ أَبَدًا حَتَّى تُؤْمِنُوا بِاللَّهِ وَحْدَهُ ) الممتحنة/4 .
ولكن إظهار هذا الأصل العقدي : لا يمنع من الإحسان إليهم ، بما يليق بمثلهم ، ومعاملتهم بالعدل ، ماداموا مسالمين ، قال تعالى : ( لا يَنْهَاكُمُ اللَّهُ عَنِ الَّذِينَ لَمْ يُقَاتِلُوكُمْ فِي الدِّينِ وَلَمْ يُخْرِجُوكُمْ مِنْ دِيَارِكُمْ أَنْ تَبَرُّوهُمْ وَتُقْسِطُوا إِلَيْهِمْ إِنَّ اللَّهَ يُحِبُّ الْمُقْسِطِينَ ) الممتحنة/8 .

ولكن ينبغي ألا يشتمل الإحسان إليهم ما يوهم تعظيمهم أو تبجيلهم , أو التصاغر لهم ، واعتقاد فضلهم على المسلمين .
فقد سئل علماء اللجنة الدائمة , هل يجب علينا أن نحترم الكفار حتى أفضل من المسلمين ؟
ج1: تجب معاداة الكفار وبغضهم ؛ لأنهم أعداء الله ، ولا تجوز محبتهم وموالاتهم ؛ لقوله تعالى : ( يَاأَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا لَا تَتَّخِذُوا عَدُوِّي وَعَدُوَّكُمْ أَوْلِيَاءَ تُلْقُونَ إِلَيْهِمْ بِالْمَوَدَّةِ وَقَدْ كَفَرُوا بِمَا جَاءَكُمْ مِنَ الْحَقِّ يُخْرِجُونَ الرَّسُولَ وَإِيَّاكُمْ أَنْ تُؤْمِنُوا بِاللَّهِ رَبِّكُمْ إِنْ كُنْتُمْ خَرَجْتُمْ جِهَادًا فِي سَبِيلِي وَابْتِغَاءَ مَرْضَاتِي تُسِرُّونَ إِلَيْهِمْ بِالْمَوَدَّةِ ) ، وقال تعالى: ( يَاأَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا لَا تَتَّخِذُوا الْيَهُودَ وَالنَّصَارَى أَوْلِيَاءَ بَعْضُهُمْ أَوْلِيَاءُ بَعْضٍ ) ، وقال تعالى : ( قَدْ كَانَتْ لَكُمْ أُسْوَةٌ حَسَنَةٌ فِي إِبْرَاهِيمَ وَالَّذِينَ مَعَهُ إِذْ قَالُوا لِقَوْمِهِمْ إِنَّا بُرَآءُ مِنْكُمْ وَمِمَّا تَعْبُدُونَ مِنْ دُونِ اللَّهِ كَفَرْنَا بِكُمْ وَبَدَا بَيْنَنَا وَبَيْنَكُمُ الْعَدَاوَةُ وَالْبَغْضَاءُ أَبَدًا حَتَّى تُؤْمِنُوا بِاللَّهِ وَحْدَهُ ) " .
انتهى من فتاوى اللجنة الدائمة - 2 (1 / 442), من الفتوى رقم (16592).

فعلم من هذا أنه لا يجوز أن يفعل بهم فعلا يقتضي تعظيمهم أو احترامهم , ومن ذلك تقديمهم لركوب مصعد ونحوه , فهذا من احترامهم وهو غير جائز , فقد قال عمر رضي الله عنه : "لا أكرمهم إذ أهانهم الله ، ولا أعزهم إذ أذلهم الله، ولا أدنيهم إذ أقصاهم الله" انتهى من " أحكام أهل الذمة " (1 / 454).

[JerryMyers]

Re: Question for those who hate Kuffar

I don't explain Verses. This is the first thing you need to understand.

A Mufassir understands the Verse and I present to you his opinion.

There is no You and I in Islam.

Unless you are a Mufassir or scholar refrain from putting forth your interpretations of the Qur'aan.

Finally, I am not here to discuss or debate with you. You want to abandon orthodox views of Islam, it makes no difference to me.

You start saying I am putting my misguided views into Islam, then you have another thing coming because the only one doing that right now is you unless you can back up your interpretations from classical scholars.

By the way, I don't back up my interpretation from classical scholars, I back up my understanding from the verses of the Quran. If you think classical scholars are better reference source than the Quran, then you have another thing coming - you are no different from the disbelievers themselves.

[ZeeshanParvez]

Re: Question for those who hate Kuffar

By the way, I don't back up my interpretation from classical scholars, I back up my understanding from the verses of the Quran. If you think classical scholars are better reference source than the Quran, then you have another thing coming - you are no different from the disbelievers themselves.

Tell me what this says


الأصل المتقرر في الشريعة الغراء : أن المسلم لا بد له من بغض الكافرين ومعاداتهم وإظهار ذلك لهم بقدر الوسع والطاقة وحسب الإمكان , وقدوته في ذلك إمام الحنفاء إبراهيم عليه وعلى نبينا أفضل الصلاة والسلام , قال تعالى حكاية عن خليله إبراهيم : ( قَدْ كَانَتْ لَكُمْ أُسْوَةٌ حَسَنَةٌ فِي إِبْرَاهِيمَ وَالَّذِينَ مَعَهُ إِذْ قَالُوا لِقَوْمِهِمْ إِنَّا بُرَآءُ مِنْكُمْ وَمِمَّا تَعْبُدُونَ مِنْ دُونِ اللَّهِ كَفَرْنَا بِكُمْ وَبَدَا بَيْنَنَا وَبَيْنَكُمُ الْعَدَاوَةُ وَالْبَغْضَاءُ أَبَدًا حَتَّى تُؤْمِنُوا بِاللَّهِ وَحْدَهُ ) الممتحنة/4 .
ولكن إظهار هذا الأصل العقدي : لا يمنع من الإحسان إليهم ، بما يليق بمثلهم ، ومعاملتهم بالعدل ، ماداموا مسالمين ، قال تعالى : ( لا يَنْهَاكُمُ اللَّهُ عَنِ الَّذِينَ لَمْ يُقَاتِلُوكُمْ فِي الدِّينِ وَلَمْ يُخْرِجُوكُمْ مِنْ دِيَارِكُمْ أَنْ تَبَرُّوهُمْ وَتُقْسِطُوا إِلَيْهِمْ إِنَّ اللَّهَ يُحِبُّ الْمُقْسِطِينَ ) الممتحنة/8 .

ولكن ينبغي ألا يشتمل الإحسان إليهم ما يوهم تعظيمهم أو تبجيلهم , أو التصاغر لهم ، واعتقاد فضلهم على المسلمين .
فقد سئل علماء اللجنة الدائمة , هل يجب علينا أن نحترم الكفار حتى أفضل من المسلمين ؟
ج1: تجب معاداة الكفار وبغضهم ؛ لأنهم أعداء الله ، ولا تجوز محبتهم وموالاتهم ؛ لقوله تعالى : ( يَاأَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا لَا تَتَّخِذُوا عَدُوِّي وَعَدُوَّكُمْ أَوْلِيَاءَ تُلْقُونَ إِلَيْهِمْ بِالْمَوَدَّةِ وَقَدْ كَفَرُوا بِمَا جَاءَكُمْ مِنَ الْحَقِّ يُخْرِجُونَ الرَّسُولَ وَإِيَّاكُمْ أَنْ تُؤْمِنُوا بِاللَّهِ رَبِّكُمْ إِنْ كُنْتُمْ خَرَجْتُمْ جِهَادًا فِي سَبِيلِي وَابْتِغَاءَ مَرْضَاتِي تُسِرُّونَ إِلَيْهِمْ بِالْمَوَدَّةِ ) ، وقال تعالى: ( يَاأَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا لَا تَتَّخِذُوا الْيَهُودَ وَالنَّصَارَى أَوْلِيَاءَ بَعْضُهُمْ أَوْلِيَاءُ بَعْضٍ ) ، وقال تعالى : ( قَدْ كَانَتْ لَكُمْ أُسْوَةٌ حَسَنَةٌ فِي إِبْرَاهِيمَ وَالَّذِينَ مَعَهُ إِذْ قَالُوا لِقَوْمِهِمْ إِنَّا بُرَآءُ مِنْكُمْ وَمِمَّا تَعْبُدُونَ مِنْ دُونِ اللَّهِ كَفَرْنَا بِكُمْ وَبَدَا بَيْنَنَا وَبَيْنَكُمُ الْعَدَاوَةُ وَالْبَغْضَاءُ أَبَدًا حَتَّى تُؤْمِنُوا بِاللَّهِ وَحْدَهُ ) " .
انتهى من فتاوى اللجنة الدائمة - 2 (1 / 442), من الفتوى رقم (16592).

فعلم من هذا أنه لا يجوز أن يفعل بهم فعلا يقتضي تعظيمهم أو احترامهم , ومن ذلك تقديمهم لركوب مصعد ونحوه , فهذا من احترامهم وهو غير جائز , فقد قال عمر رضي الله عنه : "لا أكرمهم إذ أهانهم الله ، ولا أعزهم إذ أذلهم الله، ولا أدنيهم إذ أقصاهم الله" انتهى من " أحكام أهل الذمة " (1 / 454).

Tell me what this says or else we know who the fool is.

By the way, I don't back up my interpretation from classical scholars,

Then you are a Jaahil who twists the Verses for his personal gain. :o

[JerryMyers]

Re: Question for those who hate Kuffar

Tell me what this says


الأصل المتقرر في الشريعة الغراء : أن المسلم لا بد له من بغض الكافرين ومعاداتهم وإظهار ذلك لهم بقدر الوسع والطاقة وحسب الإمكان , وقدوته في ذلك إمام الحنفاء إبراهيم عليه وعلى نبينا أفضل الصلاة والسلام , قال تعالى حكاية عن خليله إبراهيم : ( قَدْ كَانَتْ لَكُمْ أُسْوَةٌ حَسَنَةٌ فِي إِبْرَاهِيمَ وَالَّذِينَ مَعَهُ إِذْ قَالُوا لِقَوْمِهِمْ إِنَّا بُرَآءُ مِنْكُمْ وَمِمَّا تَعْبُدُونَ مِنْ دُونِ اللَّهِ كَفَرْنَا بِكُمْ وَبَدَا بَيْنَنَا وَبَيْنَكُمُ الْعَدَاوَةُ وَالْبَغْضَاءُ أَبَدًا حَتَّى تُؤْمِنُوا بِاللَّهِ وَحْدَهُ ) الممتحنة/4 .
ولكن إظهار هذا الأصل العقدي : لا يمنع من الإحسان إليهم ، بما يليق بمثلهم ، ومعاملتهم بالعدل ، ماداموا مسالمين ، قال تعالى : ( لا يَنْهَاكُمُ اللَّهُ عَنِ الَّذِينَ لَمْ يُقَاتِلُوكُمْ فِي الدِّينِ وَلَمْ يُخْرِجُوكُمْ مِنْ دِيَارِكُمْ أَنْ تَبَرُّوهُمْ وَتُقْسِطُوا إِلَيْهِمْ إِنَّ اللَّهَ يُحِبُّ الْمُقْسِطِينَ ) الممتحنة/8 .

ولكن ينبغي ألا يشتمل الإحسان إليهم ما يوهم تعظيمهم أو تبجيلهم , أو التصاغر لهم ، واعتقاد فضلهم على المسلمين .
فقد سئل علماء اللجنة الدائمة , هل يجب علينا أن نحترم الكفار حتى أفضل من المسلمين ؟
ج1: تجب معاداة الكفار وبغضهم ؛ لأنهم أعداء الله ، ولا تجوز محبتهم وموالاتهم ؛ لقوله تعالى : ( يَاأَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا لَا تَتَّخِذُوا عَدُوِّي وَعَدُوَّكُمْ أَوْلِيَاءَ تُلْقُونَ إِلَيْهِمْ بِالْمَوَدَّةِ وَقَدْ كَفَرُوا بِمَا جَاءَكُمْ مِنَ الْحَقِّ يُخْرِجُونَ الرَّسُولَ وَإِيَّاكُمْ أَنْ تُؤْمِنُوا بِاللَّهِ رَبِّكُمْ إِنْ كُنْتُمْ خَرَجْتُمْ جِهَادًا فِي سَبِيلِي وَابْتِغَاءَ مَرْضَاتِي تُسِرُّونَ إِلَيْهِمْ بِالْمَوَدَّةِ ) ، وقال تعالى: ( يَاأَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا لَا تَتَّخِذُوا الْيَهُودَ وَالنَّصَارَى أَوْلِيَاءَ بَعْضُهُمْ أَوْلِيَاءُ بَعْضٍ ) ، وقال تعالى : ( قَدْ كَانَتْ لَكُمْ أُسْوَةٌ حَسَنَةٌ فِي إِبْرَاهِيمَ وَالَّذِينَ مَعَهُ إِذْ قَالُوا لِقَوْمِهِمْ إِنَّا بُرَآءُ مِنْكُمْ وَمِمَّا تَعْبُدُونَ مِنْ دُونِ اللَّهِ كَفَرْنَا بِكُمْ وَبَدَا بَيْنَنَا وَبَيْنَكُمُ الْعَدَاوَةُ وَالْبَغْضَاءُ أَبَدًا حَتَّى تُؤْمِنُوا بِاللَّهِ وَحْدَهُ ) " .
انتهى من فتاوى اللجنة الدائمة - 2 (1 / 442), من الفتوى رقم (16592).

فعلم من هذا أنه لا يجوز أن يفعل بهم فعلا يقتضي تعظيمهم أو احترامهم , ومن ذلك تقديمهم لركوب مصعد ونحوه , فهذا من احترامهم وهو غير جائز , فقد قال عمر رضي الله عنه : "لا أكرمهم إذ أهانهم الله ، ولا أعزهم إذ أذلهم الله، ولا أدنيهم إذ أقصاهم الله" انتهى من " أحكام أهل الذمة " (1 / 454).

You tell me as it is your understanding. By the way, why don't you translate that too so that others reading this thread can share your understanding too or are you testing me whether I understand Arabic ?? Tsk, tsk, Islam is not about you or me testing each other's knowledge or righteousness - that's Allah's prerogative, not yours or mine. I am not here to debate about that too. I am here to share my understanding but if you cannot rebutt my explanations with your own explanation of your understanding, then we are not making any progress to truly understand Islam.

[ZeeshanParvez]

Re: Question for those who hate Kuffar

You tell me as it is your understanding. By the way, why don't you translate that too so that others reading this thread can share your understanding too or are you testing me whether I understand Arabic ?? Tsk, tsk, Islam is not about you or me testing each other's knowledge or righteousness - that's Allah's prerogative, not yours or mine. I am not here to debate about that too. I am here to share my understanding but if you cannot rebutt my explanations with your own explanation of your understanding, then we are not making any progress to truly understand Islam.

The fact is that you cannot carry on a discussion with resorting to childish remarks such as 'misguided views,' 'foolish' etc shows that you are not worthy of being answered unless you first learn how to discuss. Unfortunately, you come across as a person who thinks he knows all.

But now that I know that you only prefer your own understanding of the Qur'aan over how qualified scholarship understands the Verses, I have nothing to talk to you about.

[JerryMyers]

Re: Question for those who hate Kuffar

Then you are a Jaahil who twists the Verses for his personal gain. :o

Why don't you quote the full sentence of what I said and that is "I don't back up my interpretation from classical scholars, I BACK UP MY UNDERSTANDING FROM THE VERSES OF THE QURAN." ? Are you trying to mislead the other readers of this thread ?? If you think understanding the verses of the Quran means one is a 'jaahil', then so be it as Allah knows better in these matters. And just because you cannot explain any of the verses yourself, that does not mean I am twisting the verses for my personal gain. You are acting like those Christians who cannot understand their own scriptures.