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Is Allah Above the Throne?

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  • #16
    Re: Is Allah Above the Throne?

    The Arsh of Allah is a created thing. There is enough evidence of that from the Quran and Sunnah. I recall the incident when Sad Ibn Muadh [May Allah be pleased with him] died, and the Prophet :saw: said the throne shook because of his death, and the obvious fact that the Angels will be carrying the Throne of Allah on the Day of Judgement.

    I don't take anything shia websites say at all,,.
    Allah is always watching [VIDEO]

    How To Weep For The Fear Of Allah

    Please remember to share these links with people you know so they can also benefit from them. :jkk:

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    • #17
      Re: Is Allah Above the Throne?

      Originally posted by Bismil View Post
      I think most scholars do believe throne to be physical .

      Though it may indicate the power and sovereignty of Allah ( swt ) , since everything belongs to Allah ( swt ) .
      Of course the majority believe it is physical but a minority believe it is not rather it is idiomatic. Anyhow it is indeed confusing.
      But for sure it is a name or sign of power and knowledge of God.
      Note: I am a shia.

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      • #18
        Re: Is Allah Above the Throne?

        a thread calling Ibn Taymiyyah rahimahullah a "stupid salafi" should be closed

        if u differ then thats your choice but to insult is just lame of u

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        • #19
          Re: Is Allah Above the Throne?

          Originally posted by Mikha’eel View Post
          Shia website.
          Well, it is not a Shia thing. I found this in the book Tafsir Al-Minar too, which is a reputable Sunni book.

          وَأَمَّا عَرْشُ الرَّحْمَنِ - عَزَّ وَجَلَّ - فَهُوَ مِنْ عَالَمِ الْغَيْبِ الَّذِي لَا نُدْرِكُهُ بِحَوَاسِّنَا، وَلَا نَسْتَطِيعُ تَصْوِيرَهُ بِأَفْكَارِنَا، فَأَجْدِرْ بِنَا أَلَّا نَعْلَمَ كُنْهَ اسْتِوَائِهِ عَلَيْهِ، وَصُدُورَ تَدْبِيرِهِ لِأَمْرِ هَذَا الْمُلْكِ الْعَظِيمِ عَنْهُ،
          Throne of God, it is beyond our feelings and considerations, and we can not imagine it, .....
          Volume 12, Page 16
          http://shamela.ws/browse.php/book-12304#page-4809

          Well, the writer of the book believes that the directions, up and down are not physical, when it is used about God and that throne itself is beyond imagination. He believes throne is idiomatic when it is used about God.
          Unfortunately the book is in Arabic.
          Note: I am a shia.

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          • #20
            Re: Is Allah Above the Throne?

            Originally posted by ALAS View Post
            First we should see what throne is ! It is considered somehow the knowledge of God.
            http://www.imamiyya.com/hadith/usul-kafi/book-3/chapter-20
            Doesnt make sense. and majority has accepted arsh being a physical object.
            Rasulullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam) is also reported to have said: “He who is very hasty and so bold as to pass verdicts is also bold in taking the path towards hell

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            • #21
              Re: Is Allah Above the Throne?

              Originally posted by ALAS View Post
              Well, it is not a Shia thing. I found this in the book Tafsir Al-Minar too, which is a reputable Sunni book.

              وَأَمَّا عَرْشُ الرَّحْمَنِ - عَزَّ وَجَلَّ - فَهُوَ مِنْ عَالَمِ الْغَيْبِ الَّذِي لَا نُدْرِكُهُ بِحَوَاسِّنَا، وَلَا نَسْتَطِيعُ تَصْوِيرَهُ بِأَفْكَارِنَا، فَأَجْدِرْ بِنَا أَلَّا نَعْلَمَ كُنْهَ اسْتِوَائِهِ عَلَيْهِ، وَصُدُورَ تَدْبِيرِهِ لِأَمْرِ هَذَا الْمُلْكِ الْعَظِيمِ عَنْهُ،
              Throne of God, it is beyond our feelings and considerations, and we can not imagine it, .....
              Volume 12, Page 16
              http://shamela.ws/browse.php/book-12304#page-4809

              Well, the writer of the book believes that the directions, up and down are not physical, when it is used about God and that throne itself is beyond imagination. He believes throne is idiomatic when it is used about God.
              Unfortunately the book is in Arabic.
              tafsir al manar, written by rashid ridha, the wellknown freemason?
              Rasulullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam) is also reported to have said: “He who is very hasty and so bold as to pass verdicts is also bold in taking the path towards hell

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              • #22
                Re: Is Allah Above the Throne?

                Originally posted by junaid123 View Post
                tafsir al manar, written by rashid ridha, the wellknown freemason?
                I think he is one of the writers. Some people say he was a salafi, part of Muslim brotherhood and some other say he was a freemason ! also they such things about Muhammad Abduh.
                Maybe rumors are after them becausd they thought differently. I think they were a well known group in Egypt. It is amazing that they are considered freemasons. Maybe they are. I do not know.
                Thinking about freemasonry is more confusing than thinking about the throne !
                Note: I am a shia.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: Is Allah Above the Throne?

                  Originally posted by ALAS View Post
                  I think he is one of the writers. Some people say he was a salafi, part of Muslim brotherhood and some other say he was a freemason ! also they such things about Muhammad Abduh.
                  Maybe rumors are after them becausd they thought differently. I think they were a well known group in Egypt. It is amazing that they are considered freemasons. Maybe they are. I do not know.
                  Thinking about freemasonry is more confusing than thinking about the throne !
                  Yes, so let stick to more early scholars opinion inshallah.
                  Rasulullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam) is also reported to have said: “He who is very hasty and so bold as to pass verdicts is also bold in taking the path towards hell

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                  • #24
                    Re: Is Allah Above the Throne?

                    its a matter of tawheed, i think its very important to speak about these issues even if there are people who disagree.
                    أيها الراقد ذا الليل التمام***قم بجد فالليالي في إنصرام

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                    • #25
                      Re: Is Allah Above the Throne?

                      Originally posted by junaid123 View Post
                      Doesnt make sense. and majority has accepted arsh being a physical object.
                      You are right , but still we can say one thing is that the throne is not a place which Allah made to sit upon , in hadeeth we see that it is probably the biggest creation of Allah, thus if someone thinks its to show the power and sovereignty , it is not wrong .

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                      • #26
                        Re: Is Allah Above the Throne?

                        Please read -

                        http://bestoflights.blogspot.com/201...allah.html?m=1

                        (The writer is no better than the reader).

                        May Allah gives HIS RAHMAT for all HIS SERVANTS that looking for the Truth.

                        MasyaAllah


                        La quwwata illa billah.
                        Exalted Allah The Mighty.

                        May Allah give HIS RAHMAT to us all.

                        http://bestoflights.blogspot.com

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: Is Allah Above the Throne?

                          Of course he is. It's crystal clear.
                          You think you know more than my scholar's qiyās? He was more learned than you and all other scholars combined. Yeah, the devil was the greatest scholar too and look where his qiyās of fire being better than tīn got him. Sorry.

                          You follow your scholar's qiyās, and I will follow the Qur'ān and Sunnah.

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                          • #28
                            Re: Is Allah Above the Throne?

                            brothers and sisters who are confused concerning this issue, please read...

                            http://islamqa.info/en/11035

                            :jkk:
                            http://www.ilovepalestine.com/campai...imesinGaza.gif

                            "It does not befit the lion to answer the dogs."

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: Is Allah Above the Throne?

                              Originally posted by Abd al-Rahman View Post
                              :jkk: May Allah give all of us ilm so that we may have the correct 'aqeedah
                              Barakallah feek and Ameen.


                              Due to the unprecedented fitnah created by deviant sects in the Ummah who have been mass-propagating an Aqeedah that has caused its major Imams to fall into clear beliefs of Kufr anthropomorphism such as Allah having a direction (jiha), a body (jism), five fingers, being able to sit upon the back of a mosquito, leaving only a space of four fingers on the Arsh after "sitting down", etc. it is vital that this issue is addressed thoroughly on a wide scale.


                              Or perhaps the 'fitnah' caused by addressing it is worse than the fitnah of allowing the masses to fall into Kufr anthropomorphism. Maybe all those beliefs sampled above are just perfectly acceptable beliefs of kufr....
                              RELIABLE FATWAS

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: Is Allah Above the Throne?

                                Originally posted by Blackbeard View Post
                                What "literal ambiguous matters"?

                                The aqeedah we have is the same exact one as the one of imam Ahmad. I find it funny that you dare to use him against us.

                                If you're talking about the throne and his attributes, he had the same view as us. The same with the rest. This is what happens when you take your deen from Ummah.com jokers who claim things.
                                No not true.. you are still in denial stop being so stubborn, people keep refuting Salafis but Salafis just keep shouting the same rhetoric all the time!

                                I learned my deen before coming to Ummah forum so I know which people here are posting the wrong information [*cough *cough* a lot of misinformation by Salafis here (hint hint at your bestie here who keeps calling Asharis and Maturidis deviants)]

                                Salafis believe that Allah literally sits on the throne (Nauzubillah) that's NOT THE BELIEF OF THE SALAF!
                                The salaf did not attribute body parts to Allah literally, no salaf believed that Allah has eyes, foot, shins etc literally like how modern day "Salafis" do...

                                I'm replying on this thread since I don't wanna derail the other one but Salafis here don't mind derailing other ppl's thread

                                Read the words of the salaf exactly not misinterpreted quotes by the salafs by Salafis...



                                A man asked Imam Malik (d. 179): "How did Allah make istiwa' on the throne?" Imam Malik inclined his head and was silent until the sweat of fever covered his brow, then he looked up and said: "Istiwa' is not unknown (ghayru majhul), the modality of it is inconceivable in the mind (al-kayfu minhu ghayru ma`qul); but belief in it is obligatory, and inquiring about it is a heretical innovation. You are an innovator." And he gave orders for him to be taken out.

                                http://www.sunnah.org/aqida/aqida1.htm


                                ---

                                Imam Shafi'i (Allah have mercy on him) would simply say regarding the mutashabihat texts, "I believe in what has come from Allah as it was intended by Allah, and I believe in what has come from the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him and give him peace) as it was intended by the Messenger of Allah." (Ibn Qudama, Dhamm al-Ta'wil)


                                Imam al-Tahawi (Allah have mercy on him) states, "He (Allah) is beyond having limits placed on Him, or being restricted, or having parts or limbs. Nor is He contained by the six directions like all the created things." (Al-Aqida al-Tahawiyya, Point: 38)

                                It is stated in Al-Fiqh al-Akbar, attributed to Imam Abu Hanifa, "Allah is an entity unlike any other entity. The meaning of [Allah being a] entity [unlike any other] is that He is without body (jism), substance (jawhar), or accident (arad). He has no definition/limit, no opposite, no equal, and no peer..." (See: Minah al-Rawd al-Azhar fi sharh al-Fiqh al-Akbar, P: 117-120


                                Mulla Ali al-Qari states in his commentary of Al-Fiqh al-Akbar, "We are unable to comprehend Allah Most High. Whatever occurs in one's mind [regarding Allah's appearance], Allah is other than that, for Allah says: 'But they shall not encompass Him with their knowledge.'" (Minah al-Rawd al-Azhar fi sharh al-Fiqh al-Akbar, P: 117)

                                Abu 'l-Fadl al-Tamimi al-Hanbali says, "Imam Ahmad ibn Hanbal (Allah have mercy on him) condemned those who said that Allah is a body (jism)... since the term jism/body linguistically is used to indicate things that have length, width, depth, and a compound nature. (See the footnotes to Minah al-Rawd al-Azhar fi sharh al-Fiqh al-Akbar, P: 118)


                                Source: http://www.central-mosque.com/index....is-throne.html
                                Last edited by Qiyamah; 18-02-16, 11:58 PM.

                                They will say, "Had we but listened or used our intelligence, we would not be among the companions of the Blazing Fire." Qur'an 67:10 💚💙💜

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