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Shi'ite VS sunni Islam

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  • Re: Shi'ite VS sunni Islam

    Originally posted by Musa Sadr View Post
    We dislike him because he was one of the generals for aisha during the battle of jamal.

    The simple fact is, Shia want to think evil of the sahaba in that incident, where as we know they are absolved of any wrong doing. It was those that murdered Uthman, that started the fighting between the 2 armies, after they had already decide the night before they would side with Ali [May Allah be pleased with him]. These are the facts. I do not see how any one can call into questions the actions of a man that used his own body to protect the Prophet :saw:, and had his hand paralyzed in the process.

    Neither Aisha, Talha or Zubayr [May Allah be pleased with them] or anyone else in that army, went out with the purpose of opposing Ali let alone going to war against him. The statements of Aisha, Talha and Zubayr all know this, and when Talha and Zubayr were martyred, he wept profusely over them and gave glad tidings of Jahhanum to the murderer of Zubayr.

    I can't understand the mentality of people wan tto think the worst of everything the sahaba did, when Allah has praised them in Quran.


    “And the first to embrace Islam of the Muhajirun and Ansar and all those who followed them exactly (in faith). Allah is well pleased with them and they are pleased with Him and Allah has prepared for them gardens beneath which rivers flow to dwell therein forever and that is the great success.” [Soorah at-Tawbah (9): 100]

    Abi Burda reports from his father: “… He (Prophet Muhammad (sallallahu alaihe wa-sallam) raised his head toward the heavens and said: "The stars are the protection for the sky - when the stars have gone, that which has been forewarned will come to the sky. I am the protection for my Companions (radiallahu anhu) - when I have gone, that which has been forewarned will come to my companions. My Companions are the protection for this Ummah - when they have gone, that which has been forewarned will come to this Ummah." [Saheeh Muslim


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    • Re: Shi'ite VS sunni Islam

      Originally posted by Musa Sadr View Post
      We dislike him because he was one of the generals for aisha during the battle of jamal.
      mate , Talha ( ra ) moved away from the battle , when he remembered what prophet had said , that Ali was right , he was killed by Marwan. You cannot blame him for that kind of mistake. You need to look into full history of events.

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      • Re: Shi'ite VS sunni Islam

        Originally posted by Bismil View Post
        What can I say anything more , if something is crystal clear you will not believe it.

        If my comments are wrong or I have misquoted something , mention it here.

        You yourself said that no companion is infalliable , yet you refuse to believe that they made mistakes.

        You say Umar was not wrong here , can you kindly tell me where was he wrong , if not here ?

        I've never said they didn't make mistakes or commit sins, difference is we have no business speaking about or criticizing said mistakes in any way at all, because they are the sahaba and Allah has already forgiven them.

        if you want to know the truth read this:

        http://www.kalamullah.com/Books/Umar...b-Volume-1.pdf

        Specifically page 136 i believe, or look for the section about Umar and the illness of the Prophet :saw: , the Ulema have already dealt with this matter.
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        • Re: Shi'ite VS sunni Islam

          Originally posted by Musa Sadr View Post
          So when one companion goes to war with another companion what are you supposed to do ?. Curse them both ? Praise them both ? Side with the just one ? What ?.

          I just don't carry the belief that every companion is of equal importance.

          It doesn't matter what you believe becauyse Allah has already said this:

          “Rather, the Prophet and those who believe with him fought with their property and their lives for these are all good things, they are the successful ones and Allah has prepared for them gardens beneath which rivers flow to dwell therein forever and that is the great success” [ (9): 88-89]

          “And the first to embrace Islam of the Muhajirun and Ansar and all those who followed them exactly (in faith). Allah is well pleased with them and they are pleased with Him and Allah has prepared for them gardens beneath which rivers flow to dwell therein forever and that is the great success.” [Soorah at-Tawbah (9): 100]

          Allah has already forgiven the Prophet and the Muhajireen and the Ansar who followed him in the hour of difficulty after the hearts of a party of them had almost inclined [to doubt], and then He forgave them. Indeed, He was to them Kind and Merciful.
          [9-117]

          Hour of difficulty referring to the expedition of Tabuk.

          They are the sahaba, if they went to war with 1 another, that will be between them, and both are still believers, just as the verse that states

          And if two factions among the believers should fight, then make settlement between the two. But if one of them oppresses the other, then fight against the one that oppresses until it returns to the ordinance of Allah. And if it returns, then make settlement between them in justice and act justly. Indeed, Allah loves those who act justly.
          [49:9]

          And per what the Prophet :saw: said regarding Al-Hasan [May Allah be pleased with him] to paraphrase, "this son of mine is a leader, and perhaps Allah will unite 2 parties of believers through him] which was referring to him giving up the Khilafah to Muawiyah [May Allah be pleased with him] ( even though he was more entitled to it) which brought p[eace and unity in the ummah once more.


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          • Re: Shi'ite VS sunni Islam

            Certainly Allah was well pleased with the believers when they swore allegiance to you under the tree, and He knew what was in their hearts, so He sent down tranquillity on them and rewarded them with a near victory.
            Sura Al-Fath, Ayah 18

            All of those that took part were believers as per what Allah has said,m with the only exception being 1 munafiq that was among them that did not pledge bayah under the tree, and for Uthman Ibn Affan, the Prophet :saw: used his own hand in his place to pledge for him.

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            • Re: Shi'ite VS sunni Islam

              Originally posted by Mikha’eel View Post
              I've never said they didn't make mistakes or commit sins, difference is we have no business speaking about or criticizing said mistakes in any way at all, because they are the sahaba and Allah has already forgiven them.

              if you want to know the truth read this:

              http://www.kalamullah.com/Books/Umar...b-Volume-1.pdf

              Specifically page 136 i believe, or look for the section about Umar and the illness of the Prophet :saw: , the Ulema have already dealt with this matter.
              Brother if speaking about these things is a sin , then why did the Muhaddith wrote them ? If they had not , we would have never known.
              Also , kindly read what I mentioned yesterday here , the sunnis will interpret it own way , shia will interpret in own way, we can never know , why exactly Umar ( Ra ) , did not give the pen.

              That is because No one asked him. Thus the reason would be unknown to us in this life , we can only see what he did , we cannot know why he did. Its better we do not assume things , and that is what I told @ Musa also .

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              • Re: Shi'ite VS sunni Islam

                You call brother to a person that has slandered the mothers of the believers .
                Assalamualaikum,

                Because it is not part of Aqeedah. A Muslim is: Believe in Allah and Prophet Muhammad SAW, follow al-qur'an and Hadith. Their opinion about sahabah is not part of aqeedah Islam, because they Worship Allah and Follow Prophet Muhammad SAW. Even when their opinion about sahabah or Aishah RA is hurting me and you, they are still Muslim. Rosulullah said: Muslims are brother. That's why I call him brother.

                My opinion about Aishah RA is, she will enter jannah not because of she is Rosulullah's wife or mother of believers, I believe she will enter jannah because she is good Muslimah and Rosulullah teach her directly. I hope my opinion won't hurt anyone. :)

                Allahu alam.

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                • Re: Shi'ite VS sunni Islam

                  Originally posted by Bismil View Post
                  Brother if speaking about these things is a sin , then why did the Muhaddith wrote them ? If they had not , we would have never known.
                  Also , kindly read what I mentioned yesterday here , the sunnis will interpret it own way , shia will interpret in own way, we can never know , why exactly Umar ( Ra ) , did not give the pen.

                  That is because No one asked him. Thus the reason would be unknown to us in this life , we can only see what he did , we cannot know why he did. Its better we do not assume things , and that is what I told @ Musa also .
                  I'll repeat what i said before, no one has any right to criticize anything the sahaba did be that mistakes or sins, Allah has forgiven them.
                  The incident is clear to those that have ilm, and it is a very obvious thing to understand if you know the life of the Prophet :saw: , and Umar and the relationship and the rules of this religion.

                  Those that want to see it in some negative light will do so because of their emnity towards these sahaba.
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                  • Re: Shi'ite VS sunni Islam

                    Originally posted by rahmat89 View Post
                    Assalamualaikum,

                    Because it is not part of Aqeedah. A Muslim is: Believe in Allah and Prophet Muhammad SAW, follow al-qur'an and Hadith. Their opinion about sahabah is not part of aqeedah Islam, because they Worship Allah and Follow Prophet Muhammad SAW. Even when their opinion about sahabah or Aishah RA is hurting me and you, they are still Muslim. Rosulullah said: Muslims are brother. That's why I call him brother.

                    My opinion about Aishah RA is, she will enter jannah not because of she is Rosulullah's wife or mother of believers, I believe she will enter jannah because she is good Muslimah and Rosulullah teach her directly. I hope my opinion won't hurt anyone. :)

                    Allahu alam.

                    Allah has praised the sahaba in Quran, the Prophet :saw: has invoked the Curse of Allah upon those that abuse and speak ill of his companions and warned anyone from doing so.
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                    • Re: Shi'ite VS sunni Islam

                      Originally posted by Mikha’eel View Post
                      I'll repeat what i said before, no one has any right to criticize anything the sahaba did be that mistakes or sins, Allah has forgiven them.
                      The incident is clear to those that have ilm, and it is a very obvious thing to understand if you know the life of the Prophet :saw: , and Umar and the relationship and the rules of this religion.

                      Those that want to see it in some negative light will do so because of their emnity towards these sahaba.
                      Mentioning hadeeth to you is criticizm ? Unbelievable.

                      what positive do you think in that ?

                      Prophet wanted to write a kind of will , everyone is entitled to that.

                      Prophet said people will not quarrel after this , so it shows the importance of that document.

                      There became two groups , one who wanted it to be written , one who did not want that to be written. That shows there were sahabas who wanted it to be written.

                      There was a kind of chaos , where as Quran says we need to keep our voice down in front of prophet.

                      Its a possiblity that maybe Abu Bakr ( ra ) would have been made the khalifa , thus there would be no issues .

                      Comment


                      • Re: Shi'ite VS sunni Islam

                        Originally posted by rahmat89 View Post
                        Assalamualaikum,

                        Because it is not part of Aqeedah. A Muslim is: Believe in Allah and Prophet Muhammad SAW, follow al-qur'an and Hadith. Their opinion about sahabah is not part of aqeedah Islam, because they Worship Allah and Follow Prophet Muhammad SAW. Even when their opinion about sahabah or Aishah RA is hurting me and you, they are still Muslim. Rosulullah said: Muslims are brother. That's why I call him brother.

                        My opinion about Aishah RA is, she will enter jannah not because of she is Rosulullah's wife or mother of believers, I believe she will enter jannah because she is good Muslimah and Rosulullah teach her directly. I hope my opinion won't hurt anyone. :)

                        Allahu alam.
                        <3 There are actually amazing Muslim's on this forum.

                        Comment


                        • Re: Shi'ite VS sunni Islam

                          Originally posted by Bismil View Post
                          Mentioning hadeeth to you is criticizm ? Unbelievable.

                          what positive do you think in that ?

                          Prophet wanted to write a kind of will , everyone is entitled to that.

                          Prophet said people will not quarrel after this , so it shows the importance of that document.

                          There became two groups , one who wanted it to be written , one who did not want that to be written. That shows there were sahabas who wanted it to be written.

                          There was a kind of chaos , where as Quran says we need to keep our voice down in front of prophet.

                          Its a possiblity that maybe Abu Bakr ( ra ) would have been made the khalifa , thus there would be no issues .
                          Finally someone that speaks sense!. I fully agree with you. If the prophet said that Abu Bakr would be the khalifa after him I would 100% support this, similarly to if he said Imam Ali (as) was going to succeed him in that will then I would 100% support that too.

                          Comment


                          • Re: Shi'ite VS sunni Islam

                            Originally posted by Musa Sadr View Post
                            You are amazing you put me and everyone else on this post who preaches sectarianism to shame.
                            Assalamualaikum brother :)
                            Alhamdulillah, All praise to Allah.
                            I hope so. Allah tell us to be a Muslim not Sunni or Shiah. If someone submit his will to Allah he is a Muslim. Whoever scholar you follow (Sunni or Shiah).
                            I believe it is Dajjal's deception. Dajjal (zionist) has enter the world of Sunni and Shiah, makes Sunni looks bad for Shiah and Makes Shiah looks bad for Sunni. This issue getting hotter after Islam invade Palestine. I read in several articles Sunni and Shiah live peacefully side by side for century. :)

                            Allahu Alam

                            Comment


                            • Re: Shi'ite VS sunni Islam

                              Originally posted by rahmat89 View Post
                              Assalamualaikum brother :)
                              Alhamdulillah, All praise to Allah.
                              I hope so. Allah tell us to be a Muslim not Sunni or Shiah. If someone submit his will to Allah he is a Muslim. Whoever scholar you follow (Sunni or Shiah).
                              I believe it is Dajjal's deception. Dajjal (zionist) has enter the world of Sunni and Shiah, makes Sunni looks bad for Shiah and Makes Shiah looks bad for Sunni. This issue getting hotter after Islam invade Palestine. I read in several articles Sunni and Shiah live peacefully side by side for century. :)

                              Allahu Alam
                              Just for the record, ypou said its not part of our aqeedah, yes it is.

                              In aqeedah Tahhwiyah by Imam Tahawi
                              These specific points came up in regards to thte aqeedah of Ahlul Sunnah :

                              93. We love the Companions of the Messenger of Allah but we do not go to excess in our love for any oneindividual among them; nor do we disown any one of them. We hate anyone who hates them or does not speakwell of them and we only speak well of them. Love of them is a part of Islam, part of belief and part of excellentbehavior, while hatred of them is unbelief, hypocrisy and rebellion.

                              94. We confirm that, after the death of Allah's Messenger, peace be upon him, the caliphate went first to AbuBakr al-Siddiq, thus proving his excellence and superiority over the rest of the Muslims; then to `Umar ibn alKhattab;then to `Uthman; and then to `Ali ibn Abi Talib; may Allah be well pleased with all of them. These are theRightly-Guided Caliphs and upright leaders.

                              95. We bear witness that the ten who were named by the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant himpeace, and who were promised the Garden by him, will be in the Garden, as the Messenger of Allah, peace beupon him, whose word is truth, bore witness that they would be. The ten are: Abu Bakr, `Umar, `Uthman, `Ali,Talha, Zubayr, Sa`d, Sa`id, `Abd al-Rahman ibn `Awf, and Abu `Ubayda ibn al-Jarrah whose title was the Trusteeof this Community, may Allah be pleased with all of them.

                              96. Anyone who speaks well of the Companions of the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant himpeace, and his wives and offspring, who are all pure and untainted by any impurity, is free from the accusation ofhypocrisy.
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                              • Re: Shi'ite VS sunni Islam

                                Originally posted by Bismil View Post
                                Mentioning hadeeth to you is criticizm ? Unbelievable.

                                what positive do you think in that ?

                                Prophet wanted to write a kind of will , everyone is entitled to that.

                                Prophet said people will not quarrel after this , so it shows the importance of that document.

                                There became two groups , one who wanted it to be written , one who did not want that to be written. That shows there were sahabas who wanted it to be written.

                                There was a kind of chaos , where as Quran says we need to keep our voice down in front of prophet.

                                Its a possiblity that maybe Abu Bakr ( ra ) would have been made the khalifa , thus there would be no issues .

                                No, you questioning Umar and saying he was in error, is the issue here. Who do you think you are to accuse Umar of being in error regarding that incident when no one else questioned him or said any such thing??? If the Prophet :saw: wanted to do something, he would have done so.

                                People like you should do yourself a favour and stop talking about matters involving sahaba that you have no understanding of. Anything you said is baseless speculating.
                                Last edited by Mikha’eel; 02-05-15, 05:31 PM.
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