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Islam's ruling on those who do not pray.

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  • #16
    Re: Islam's ruling on those who do not pray.

    Originally posted by علي View Post
    Is this going to turn into a reading comprehension lesson? Because when things get this bad, I start to suspect trolling. I clearly did not say that.

    No, the minority obviously have a different opinion they are convinced of, and that is the benefit of the doubt they will certainly be afforded. If I do not have that same conviction and see that the evidence against it is overwhelming, obviously I'm not going to share in their conviction. It has nothing to do with them being Muslim or not, and believe me, I'm sure a lot of them if they did not hold this opinion on this matter, may hold an opinion on the death penalty in another matter you will not approve of.

    This is because the genuine scholar doesn't follow his desires, if a genuine scholar says he does not believe it deserves the death penalty it is because he is convinced in this matter. It is not because "for he didst not follow... the path... of death."
    So if minority muslim scholars says it is not a death sentence, and you have no desire to kill those Muslim scholars for having a different opinion, you should have no problem with anyone who follows their different opinion and then there is no reason to kill those who do not pray. They are just following muslim scholars with a different view, and and no reason to kill them since they are just muslims with a different opinion following a different scholar of Islam.

    It just seems odd to me if their are two different views of muslim scholars, why side on the path of death for not praying.

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    • #17
      Re: Islam's ruling on those who do not pray.

      Originally posted by Serada View Post
      So if minority muslim scholars says it is not a death sentence, and you have no desire to kill those Muslim scholars for having a different opinion, you should have no problem with anyone who follows their different opinion and then there is no reason to kill those who do not pray. They are just following muslim scholars with a different view, and and no reason to kill them since they are just muslims with a different opinion following a different scholar of Islam.

      It just seems odd to me if their are two different views of muslim scholars, why side on the path of death for not praying.
      It's not really that simple, it's pretty silly for a Muslim to say "well, some scholars don't think it's a death sentence but it is one of the most major of sins, so I'm just going to ignore it".

      Second, what opinion the common Muslim follows is of no relevance whatsoever. If he was found guilty of this and insisted upon it, we all look towards the judge. If he is of the majority, the person gets the death penalty despite anyone else's opinion on the matter, including his own.

      Also I can't imagine how what you said would seem odd to you. That's like me seeing an apple that is crimson in color, and then I say "hey, that apple looks crimson to me". Then another person sees the same apple in different lighting then says "nope, looks purple to me". And then you come in, who are completely (and arbitrarily) against apples being crimson, tell me "why would you say it's crimson when there are others who said it was purple? I just don't get it."

      Again, people can't help what they're convinced of. It's just like vision, but it's in the mind. It has nothing to do with being blood thirsty or preferring death. If you found that this is what the religion stated, and you claim to follow it, you are bound, end of story. I guess this could be hard coming from a society where everything is freestyled. "Yo hell sounds like a pretty bad place bro.", "Alright listen up guys, Jesus died for your sins so no one goes to hell anymore".
      والمبادرة إلى التكفير إنما تغلب على طباع من يغلب عليهم الجهل - ابن تيمية رحمه الله - بغية المرتاد

      "Rushing towards takfir is an attitude which is dominant over those who are defeated by ignorance." - Ibn Taymiyyah Rahimahullah [Bughyatul Murtaad, page 354]

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: Islam's ruling on those who do not pray.

        Originally posted by UzairAhmed View Post
        I call my self Muslim and i believe in Alllah,Prophets and Quran but the problem is that i don't pray 5 times because i feel lazy. I was watching a video in which a guy told that ISIS, Taliban etc. are following Islam and he told that All the four School of thoughts say that we should kill those people who don't pray 5 times thats why ISIS, Taliban etc. kill Muslims.
        Bro although Isis are not implementing Islamic laws and have corrupted it to the extreme, there's scholars who've said a Muslim who doesn't pray without an excuse (only sleeping or forgetting is permissible) has committed Kurf and this puts you out of the fold of Islam,therefore it's like you've apostacised. They take this from the evidence where the prophet(peace be upon him) has said that the salah separates us from the non-muslims therefore anyone who abandons it out is not a Muslim at that time so they are warned but not killed straight. If they refuse then they would be killed because think about it they have shown arrogance towards Allah since they refuse to prostrate to the one who created them. How can a person call them a Muslim after this? Ofcourse different scholars vary in opinions but I believe this is more correct since why would Allah hold such importance over prayer by making it the second pillar, mentioning it in the Quran various times,making it the first thing judged in the day of judgement and the factor which you will depend on to pass trial of the gave. Honestly I wouldn't risk it, imagine dying without offering your Salah, then meeting Allah whilst he is angry with you. Remember we've not been created except to workship,it's not wise to gamble with your Salah.
        Last edited by Unconditional; 24-12-14, 06:34 PM.

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        • #19
          Re: Islam's ruling on those who do not pray.

          Originally posted by Unconditional View Post
          Bro although Isis are not implementing Islamic laws and have corrupted it to the extreme, there's scholars who've said a Muslim who doesn't pray without an excuse (only sleeping or forgetting is permissible) has committed Kurf and this puts you out of the fold of Islam,therefore it's like you've apostacised. They take this from the evidence where the prophet(peace be upon him) has said that the salah separates us from the non-muslims therefore anyone who abandons it out is not a Muslim at that time so they are warned but not killed straight. If they refuse then they would be killed because think about it they have shown arrogance towards Allah since they refuse to prostrate to the one who created them. How can a person call them a Muslim after this? Ofcourse different scholars vary in opinions but I believe this is more correct since why would Allah hold such importance over prayer by making it the second pillar, mentioning it in the Quran various times,making it the first thing judged in the day of judgement and the factor which you will depend on to pass trial of the gave. Honestly I wouldn't risk it, imagine dying without offering your Salah, then meeting Allah whilst he is angry with you. Remember we've not been created except to workship,it's not wise to gamble with your Salah.
          But even in Apostasy if someone leaves Islam "peacefully" he is not killed. This is what some Scholars Like Dr.Zakir Naik said.

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: Islam's ruling on those who do not pray.

            Originally posted by UzairAhmed View Post
            But even in Apostasy if someone leaves Islam "peacefully" he is not killed. This is what some Scholars Like Dr.Zakir Naik said.
            Yeah I know but we're allowed to have different views,it's a rahmah from Allah. Besides,killing the person is the least of their worries,we all die but no one wants to meet Allah dying in kufr.

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: Islam's ruling on those who do not pray.

              Originally posted by علي View Post
              When will you people learn that really we do not have a say in these matters? It's completely useless asking me what I want. Also don't take things on such a primitive level, Muslims are not eager to off one another, people who fall into these sins are given ample chance to repent and return before it reaches that level. I can't imagine any normal Muslim who intends some good would persist.

              Plus there is getting lazy, then there is leaving prayer, period. We're talking about the person who has, in general, left prayer. It's not just someone who got lazy, overslept, or had circumstances. Depending on those cases, he may be sinful or be completely excused, but if he prays in general he can't possibly be considered a person who has left prayer.
              Why is there so much killing in Islam

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: Islam's ruling on those who do not pray.

                Do all the Imams Agree Neglecting the prayer Continuously Entails Disbelief? (Important Clarification)

                Originally posted by UzairAhmed View Post
                But even in Apostasy if someone leaves Islam "peacefully" he is not killed. This is what some Scholars Like Dr.Zakir Naik said.
                Zakir Naik isn't exactly a scholar. He's a really good speaker though.
                Secure few moments, everyday, to reflect upon the innumerable blessings of Allah and thank Him for bestowing them upon you.

                "A person who is blessed with the ability to be grateful, shall never be deprived of barakah and increase in blessings."
                - Rasulullah (صلی اللہ علیہ وسلم)‎

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: Islam's ruling on those who do not pray.

                  Originally posted by missmirah02 View Post
                  Why is there so much killing in Islam
                  Are you a revert?

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: Islam's ruling on those who do not pray.

                    Originally posted by missmirah02 View Post
                    Why is there so much killing in Islam
                    Because there isn't. All of Islam's rules are ultimately to preserve life, not take it. It is the ultimate religion of pros vs cons, even if there are huddud that involve death, within them is life.

                    When you look at societies without Islam, you can see the real killing. Even if we put aside the ridiculous murder rates in places like the US, it's enough alone just to look at the number of abortions. I would suggest you look a tiny bit harder at the world before asking questions that seem to smear the religion.
                    والمبادرة إلى التكفير إنما تغلب على طباع من يغلب عليهم الجهل - ابن تيمية رحمه الله - بغية المرتاد

                    "Rushing towards takfir is an attitude which is dominant over those who are defeated by ignorance." - Ibn Taymiyyah Rahimahullah [Bughyatul Murtaad, page 354]

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: Islam's ruling on those who do not pray.

                      Originally posted by Unconditional View Post
                      Are you a revert?
                      No

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: Islam's ruling on those who do not pray.

                        Originally posted by missmirah02 View Post
                        No
                        What then? If you were born Muslim what kind of question is that to ask?

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: Islam's ruling on those who do not pray.

                          Originally posted by Unconditional View Post
                          What then? If you were born Muslim what kind of question is that to ask?
                          Doesn't really matter if one is a revert or not though?
                          Secure few moments, everyday, to reflect upon the innumerable blessings of Allah and thank Him for bestowing them upon you.

                          "A person who is blessed with the ability to be grateful, shall never be deprived of barakah and increase in blessings."
                          - Rasulullah (صلی اللہ علیہ وسلم)‎

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: Islam's ruling on those who do not pray.

                            Originally posted by Unconditional View Post
                            What then? If you were born Muslim what kind of question is that to ask?
                            My parents never told me that in Islam you can kill other people under certain rulings as I was growing up so it's a suprise to me

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: Islam's ruling on those who do not pray.

                              Originally posted by missmirah02 View Post
                              My parents never told me that in Islam you can kill other people under certain rulings as I was growing up so it's a suprise to me

                              Why do you say things like that then? For a minute there I didn't think you were even Muslim but I was like maybe it's a revert who's ignorant. My parents didn't either so it's not an excuse, at the end of the day you'll be held responsible so it's important to gain knowledge.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: Islam's ruling on those who do not pray.

                                Originally posted by Unconditional View Post
                                Why do you say things like that then? For a minute there I didn't think you were even Muslim but I was like maybe it's a revert who's ignorant. My parents didn't either so it's not an excuse, at the end of the day you'll be held responsible so it's important to gain knowledge.
                                I said it because I was suprised and علي explained it gosh

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