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  • #76
    Re: Shias?

    dinobot bro dont get emotional,i also quoted from ahl sunnah books anyway this is not our topic yet,we will discuss on him later InshAllah,right now our topic is those who gave bayyah under the tree and bro mikhaeel didnt give the verse of tabouk

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    • #77
      Re: Shias?

      Originally posted by Molai View Post
      dinobot bro dont get emotional,i also quoted from ahl sunnah books anyway this is not our topic yet,we will discuss on him later InshAllah,right now our topic is those who gave bayyah under the tree and bro mikhaeel didnt give the verse of tabouk
      i am not emotional. i am actually laughing at how you dont even read your own books. Like i said. go and call kamal hydari and ask him about ibn saba.. he will tell you a few truths

      by the way if uthman was such a tyrant and a bad man why did the prophet make a bayah under the tree to avenge his death at the hands of quraysh?

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      • #78
        Re: Shias?

        Originally posted by Molai View Post
        bro mikhaeel bcos you have no knowledge thats why you are saying these things other wise your mostly scholars refute the myth of ibn saba like dr. Taha hussain misri who was famous scholar of ahl sunnah from egypt,he admited that this myth was made aginst shia,in sub-continent za famlus scholar shibli nomani who wtore a book al farouq,he also admit in that book that the ibn saba was a myth and second thing saif bin umer was the guy who wrote first this myth in his book and your all famous scholars said saif bin umar was a kazzab,so please dont quote thyese myths and talk oon facts

        Oh you mean he was a myth just like this guy you claim was a sahabi that was general of the army that killed Uthman, which was a lie??

        It doens't change the fact that your shia brethren support the murderers of Uthman in what they did, they support the false accusations that were made against him - and support the murder of an elderly Sahabi who was denied water for 40 days, from the very well he bought for the Muslims, and from praying the very Masjid he used his own wealth to expand - and then like the dirty cowards that they were, murdered him as he was reading Quran...

        May Allah raise those shia that support these lies against Uthman Radhi-yallaahu 'anhu ( The only man in history to be honoured to marry not 1 but 2 of the daughters of a Nabi ) with these accursed people on the Day of Judgement. Ameen.
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        • #79
          Re: Shias?

          Originally posted by Molai View Post
          dinobot bro dont get emotional,i also quoted from ahl sunnah books anyway this is not our topic yet,we will discuss on him later InshAllah,right now our topic is those who gave bayyah under the tree and bro mikhaeel didnt give the verse of tabouk

          Allah has already forgiven the Prophet and the Muhajireen and the Ansar who followed him in the hour of difficulty after the hearts of a party of them had almost inclined [to doubt], and then He forgave them. Indeed, He was to them Kind and Merciful.
          [Surah At Tawbah: Verse 117]

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          • #80
            Re: Shias?

            So what you think,this ayah revealed for their past,present and for future too ?

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            • #81
              Re: Shias?

              Do you think Allah will let the sahaba go astray after the Prophet :saw: dies, after he has tested them with the most difficult trials and tribulations 1 can imagine and they passed every one of them with flying colours and he has said time and time again that he is pleased with them, testifying they are believers, that he has forgiven them, and will grant them Gardens beanth which rivers flow over and over and over?
              Allah is always watching [VIDEO]

              How To Weep For The Fear Of Allah

              Please remember to share these links with people you know so they can also benefit from them. :jkk:

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              • #82
                Re: Shias?

                Do you think Allah will let the sahaba go astray after the Prophet :saw: dies, after he has tested them with the most difficult trials and tribulations 1 can imagine and they passed every one of them with flying colours and he has said time and time again that he is pleased with them, testifying they are believers, that he has forgiven them, and will grant them Gardens beanth which rivers flow over and over and over?
                Shi'a deny that these ayaat refer to the sahaba(ra) (so do quranists), and they say that the ayaat speaking to the munafiqeen are actually addressing only the sahaba(ra). Audhubillah. That's what happens when you abandon the deen and start making up your tafsir with fake hadith.

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                • #83
                  Re: Shias?

                  Originally posted by Molai View Post
                  Bro Dinobot could you please tell me why prophet saww was upset from only two wives ? And if he was just upset in family matters than why Allah swt revealed that your hearts are turned so you have to do a taubah ? So please tell me when hazrat ayesha and hazrta hifsa sdid a taubah ? And you quote one naration about abu jahel,s daugheter,so my answer is this is in ahl sunnah books and those books are not hujjah for us,so whenever you want to quote something pls quote from shia books.

                  Goodbye shia.

                  This is not a place for spreading your baatil beliefs.
                  Last edited by Darul Ilm; 04-05-14, 08:05 PM.
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                  • #84
                    Re: Shias?

                    Good riddance. This guy clearly lacks the ability to read. They all come hre under the guise of acting like they do not disrespect the sahaba, but it doesn't take long before they start spewing their lies and the hatred shows through, because they cannot help but regurgitate the garbage they are fed by their Mullahs.
                    Allah is always watching [VIDEO]

                    How To Weep For The Fear Of Allah

                    Please remember to share these links with people you know so they can also benefit from them. :jkk:

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                    • #85
                      Re: Shias?

                      Originally posted by jordanla1 View Post
                      As-salamu alaykum

                      Being new to Islam I don't really know the differences between shia and sunnis, but I see that shia's are pretty disliked. What do Shia's believe?
                      Narrations about Abdullah ibn Saba, the creator of Shiism
                      Source: http://alqadissiyah.blogspot.com/201...-ibn-saba.html


                      Posted by Al Qadissiyah |


                      Existence of 'Abdullah ibn Saba is both accepted by Sunnis, Shias and the Westerner historians. Today some Shias try their best to even deny his existence, let alone the role he played in the foundation of Shiahism. He is to Shiahism, what Saint Paul is to Christianity.

                      1. It says in Anwar al-N'umaniyyahAnwar al-N'umaniyyah, 2:234 - Published Iran)
                      http://www.kr-hcy.com/references/shia/070.shtml

                      2. The name of 'Abdullah bin Saba figures in the most reliable book of Shias on Isma ur-Rijal, entitled Rijal-i-Kashshi and it is related in it from Imam Jafar Sadiq that Ibn Saba believed in the divinity of 'Ali (may Allah be pleased with him), and, ultimately, he was burnt alive at his command. About 'Abdullah bin Saba, Rijal-e-Kashshi says,

                      "Many knowledgeable people have stated that 'Abdullah bin Saba was a Jew who had accepted Islam and showed great devotion for Sayyiduna 'Ali (may Allah be pleased with him). As a Jew, he used to exaggerated the personality of Joshua, the son of Nun, and the Wasi of Moses. After becoming a Muslim he began to exalt the personality of Sayyiduna 'Ali much beyond the due limit, and he was the first person to declare that it was obligatory to believe in the Imamat of Sayyiduna 'Ali, and completely dissociated himself form his enemies and he openly opposed them and denounced them as infidels". (Rijal-i-Kashi, p.71)

                      3. The earliest historian Tabri has sketched out the details in these words,

                      "'Abdullah bin Saba was a Jew and lived in Sana. His mother was called Sauda. He embraced Islam during the period of Sayyiduna Uthman. he roamed through the Muslim cities and tried to seduce the Muslims from the straight path. He launched his diabolical campaign from Hijaz and then visited Basra, Kufa and Syria. None of the Syrians cooperated with him. On the contrary, they drove him out of Syria. Thus he moved over to Egypt and settled down there permanently. He started drumming into the minds of the Egyptians that it was strange they believed in the return of Christ and denied the return of Sayyiduna Muhammad [peace be upon him]. God himself had declared. Therefore he has a better claim to return to the world in comparison with Christ. He fabricated the concept of the 'return' or resurrection and the Egyptians turned in into a hot debating issue."

                      4. Hafiz Ibn Kathir (may Allah have mercy on him) and Hafiz Ibn Athir (may Allah have mercy on him) have commented on it on similar lines and 'Allamaj Ibn Khaldun (may Allah have mercy on him) has also written about it,

                      "Abdullah bin Saba, who was popularly known as Ibn Sauda, was a Jew. He had left his country during the tenure of Sayyiduna 'Uthman but he had not embraced Islam from the core of his heart. When he was honked out of Basra, he left for Kufa from where he made a bee - line for Syria. The Syrians also whipped him out of their country and he left for Egypt. He made Sayyiduna 'Uthman (may Allah have mercy on him) the special butt of his critical remarks and secretly invited people to institute the Khilafat of the Ahl-i-Bay't. He pressed upon people to launch the campaign and he spared no opportunity to criticize the rulers. Some of the people openly sided with him. They had come from different cities and therefore they kept up their links through correspondence. Khalid bin Maljim, Saudan bin Hamran and Kinana bin Basher supported the campaign launched by 'Abdullah bin Saba. They had also persuaded 'Ammar not to return to Madina. 'Ammar was one of those people who had openly lambasted Sayyiduna Uthman (may Allah have mercy on him) for first turning Sayyiduna Abu Zar (may Allah have mercy on him) out of Syria into Madinah and then for pushing him out of Madinah towards Abzah, though, under the circumstances, the action of 'Uthman was justified. Abu Zar (may Allah have mercy on him), out of the intensity of his piety and austerity, used to force people to lead their lives on similar lines and to learn to face the hardships of life. He persuaded people to stock for themselves not more than a day's ration. He also illustrate ed with reasoning the undesirability of hoarding gold and silver. Ibn Saba used to instigate Abu Zar (may Allah have mercy on him) against Sayyiduna Muawiyyah by stressing that he supported the distribution of goods among the people. Abu Zar (may Allah have mercy on him) started condemning Muawiyyah (may Allah have mercy on him). Muawiyyah (may Allah have mercy on him) coaxed him a little and told him: I'll also harp on the same turn that all goods belong to Allah."

                      5. Hafiz ibn Hajr (may Allah have mercy on him) has related on the authority of Tarikh Abi Asakir,

                      "He belonged to Yemen. He was a Jew, but he had donned the guise of Islam and roamed through the Muslim cities to lead the Muslims astray and dissuade them from the obedience of their Imams and to sow dissension among them. He also visited Damascus with this end in view". (Tarikh Damishq, 7:430)

                      6. 'Allamah Asfaraini (may Allah have mercy on him) has also commented on it in a similar vein,

                      "Ibn Sauda was a Jew who had donned the gown of Islam to addle the faith of the Muslims".

                      7. Abu Muhammad Hassan bin Musa has unraveled these secrets. He is the earliest Shiah historian who has given an account of the Shiah sects. He is one of the most famous Shiah of the third century A.H. He writes,

                      "Sabais are the companions of 'Abdullah bin Saba. 'Abdullah bin Saba made faces at Sayyiduna Abu Bakr, 'Umar, 'Uthman and other companions (may Allah be pleased with them) of the Prophet (peace be upon him) and disaffiliated himself from them and he imputed his acts to the command of 'Ali (may Allah be pleased with him). When 'Ali caught hold of him and asked him about it, he confessed to it. After his confession, he ordered him to be executed. On hearing the order, [quite a few people] made a humble submission to 'Ali:O Amir al-Muminin! You have ordered the execution of a person who professes your friendship and the love of your Ahl al-Bay't. 'Ali complied with the submission and exiled him to Madain."

                      8. The famous Shia biographer Istrabadi says,

                      "Abdullah bin Saba claimed that 'Ali is Allah and he is his Prophet. When the news reached the Amir al-Muminin, he sent for him and asked him about it. He owned it and insisted that he is really the one [who is the referee of his claim]. The Amir al-Muminin said: The devil has seduced you. Therefore you should repent at once. But he refused to repent and he put him behind the bars for three days. When he did not repent even after three days, he burned him alive".

                      9. Shaykh 'Abdul Qadir Jaylani Baghdadi (may Allah have mercy on him) says,

                      "The followers of 'Abdullah bin Saba are called Sabains. Ibn Saba relied on exaggeration about the status of Sayyiduna 'Ali and claimed that he was a prophet. Then, relying on further exaggeration he claimed that he was God and he invited a party of the Kufi rebels to adopt these beliefs. When the news reached 'Ali, he had some of these people thrown into two pits of fire, as has been hinted at by a poet ."

                      10. All the Shiah scholars have given an account of Ibn Saba, his views and beliefs and his party ; Sayyid Qummi [who died in 301H.], Sheykh Ta'ifah Tusi, Tastri in Qamus al-Rijal, Abbas Qummi in Tuhfat al-Ahbab, Khu Ansari in Raudhat al-Jannat, Sabhani in Nasikh al-Tawarikh and the author of Rawdhat al-Safa, have all mentioned him and his party".

                      11. 'Allamah Shahrastani (may Allah have mercy on him) writes under the heading of Sabaism,

                      "Sabais are the followers of 'Abdullah bin Saba who had told Sayyiduna 'Ali: you are you i.e., you are God, but he had extradited him to Madain The historians suggest that he was actually a Jew, but he had tacked on to himself the label of Islam. During the Jewish phase, he used to claim that Sayyiduna Y'osha bin Nun was the executor of Sayyiduna Moses."

                      12. Ibn 'Asakar has cited a tradition of Sayyiduna Jabir (may Allah be pleased with him) in his history,

                      "When the oath of allegiance was taken at the hand of 'Ali and he delivered his address, 'Abdullah bin Saba stood up and said: you are "Dabat al-Ardh." (Tarikh Dimishq)

                      13. 'Allamah Baghdadi has touched the issue in his book Al-Firq Bayn al-Firq. Similarly, Isfaraini in his book Kitab al-Tabsir and Ibn Hazm in Al-Fasl have also mentioned Ibn Saba.

                      14. Famous Shia scholar Nau Bakhti writes,

                      "It is known as the Sabai sect because 'Abdullah bin Saba was its ring leader." [Khandan-i-Nau-Bakhti, p.275]

                      15. Historian Professor P.K Hitti writes,

                      "The enigmatic 'Abdullah ibn Saba who was converter ed into Islam...embraced 'Ali with his excessive veneration..." (History of the Arabs, p.248 - London)

                      16. Famous historian Dwight M. Donaldon writes,

                      "'Abdullah ibn Saba had traveled widely throughout the Empire, as Tabari says, "seeking to lead the Moslems into error...Another of his teachings that was more immediately, influential was that every Prophet has a wasi and that 'Ali was the wasi of Muhammed..." (The Sheit Religion of Islam, Part 6 p.41)

                      17. Historian Dr. J. N. Hollister writes,

                      "['Abdullah ibn Saba] He was the native of San'a in Yemen...He opened a campaign of behalf of 'Ali suggesting that Abu Bakar, 'Umar, and 'Usman were usurpers..." (Shias of Hind p.15)

                      18. Famous historian Dr. Walter C. Klein writes,

                      "'Abdullah ibn Saba had hailed Ali with the words, "Thou art Thou."...

                      (Al-Ibanah al-Usul al-Diyanah, p.7-8)

                      19. Historian Professor Nicholson writes,

                      "Now the Shi'ite theory of Divine Right certainly harmonized with Persian ideas, ...'Abdullah ibn Saba...went from place to place, seeking to lead Moslems into error..." (The History of the Arabs, p.215)

                      20. Famous historian and former governor of U.P, India, William Moore writes,

                      "...Ibn Saba, a Jew from the South of Arabia...he became the setter forth of strange and startling doctrines...'Ali was his legate, 'Usmsn was a usurper..." (Al-Khilafat, Us ka Uruj, Inhitat aur Zawaal, p.217)

                      21. The says,

                      ABDALLAH IBN SABA
                      By : Hartwig Hirschfeld

                      Jew of Yemen, Arabia, of the seventh century, who settled in Medina and embraced Islam. Having adversely criticized Calif Othman's administration, he was banished from the town. Thence he went to Egypt, where he founded an antiothmanian sect, to promote the interests of Ali. On account of his learning he obtained great influence there, and formulated the doctrine that, just as every prophet had an assistant who afterward succeeded him, Mohammed's vizier was Ali, who had therefore been kept out of the califate by deceit. Othman had no legal claim whatever to the califate; and the general dissatisfaction with his government greatly contributed to the spread of Abdallah's teachings. Tradition relates that when Ali had assumed power, Abdallah ascribed divine honors to him by addressing him with the words, "Thou art Thou!" Thereupon Ali banished him to Madain. After Ali's assassination Abdallah is said to have taught that Ali was not dead but alive, and had never been killed; that a part of the Deity was hidden in him; and that after a certain time he would return to fill the earth with justice. Till then the divine character of Ali was to remain hidden in the imams, who temporarily filled his place. It is easy to see that the whole idea rests on that of the Messiah in combination with the legend of Elijah the prophet. The attribution of divine honors to Ali was probably but a later development, and was fostered by the circumstance that in the Koran Allah is often styled "Al-Ali" [The Most High].

                      Bibliography: Shahrastani Al-Milalhttp://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/vi...h%20ibn%20saba

                      22. And it is narrated from Imam Abu Hanifah (may Allah have mercy on him),

                      "hAbdullah ibn Saba was a Jewish and he [supposedly] accepted Islam during the time of Sayyiduna 'Usman (may Allah have mercy on him) and he urged the people of Egypt to kill 'Usman (may Allah have mercy on him) and he would show much love for 'Ali (may Allah have mercy on him). He was a khabis from inside and his only mission was to create fitnah among the Muslims." (Musnad Imam-i-A'zam, p.158)

                      عبد اللّه بن سبا كان يهوديا فاسلم ايام عثمان وهوالذى حمل اهل مصر على قتل عثمان واظهر
                      الميل الى على وكان خبيث الباطن غرض الفساد بين المسلمين

                      23. Shaykh Abdul Qadir Jaylani (may Allah have mercy on him) says in Ghunyat al-Talibin,

                      "Sabain sect are attributed towards 'Abdullah ibn Saba and they said 'Ali is alive and will come back before Qiyamat."

                      واما لسبائية فمنسوبة الى عبداللّه بن سبا من دعوهم ان عليا لم يمت وانه يرجع قبل يوم القيامة

                      Scan:

                      gs.jpg

                      26.Al-Maqalat wal-Firaq, p.20)
                      And when it is said to them: "Make not mischief on the earth," they say: "We are only peacemakers." - Surat Al-Baqarah ayah number 11 (Qur'an 2:11).

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