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  • Muslim indifference to violence

    Welcome

    For some time I have been reading a few Islamic boards (including a few Sunni and one Shia site) and there is one thing that strikes me the most - almost complete lack of interest in discussing atrocities committed by Muslims against other groups. Muslims can create dozens of threads to discuss e.g. Palestinians or Syria (indeed a major source of suffering) but they can't even bring themselves to condemn other Muslims for their slaughter of Christians in Nigeria. Or massacres of Shias in Iraq by Saddam Hussain. OR massascres of Ahmadis in Pakistan, persecution of Bahais in Iran or some historical facts such as 300,000 Hindus killed on a single day by Tamerlane's troops etc.

    Come on... Roughly 80% of all armed conflicts that take place anywhere in the world involve Muslims on at least one side even though they constitute only about 25% of the world's population. Pretty much in every place where Islam is a dominant religion, religious minorities live in constant fear for their lives, lives of their relatives and their property. In other places there is neverending war or threat of it, if Muslims' demands are not met. What Palestinians endure from the Israelis is nothing compared to what e.g. Christians in Nigeria or Hindus in Pakistan had to endure from mainstream Islam - constant suicide bombing of worship places, shootings, beheadings, massacres and denial of basic rights. All Western countries give Muslims full citizenship and the same rights the majority has but not a single sharia-based country gives it's minorities equal rights.

    Why do you constantly talk about the oppression of Muslims but rarely of oppression BY Muslims?

  • #2
    Re: Muslim indifference to violence

    agreed, there are a lot of problems when it comes to Muslims blaming muslims. When a muslim kills the first thing we do is say oh he's not muslim. Also since muslims get a lot of bad publicity Muslims do whatever they can to show how they are oppressed and try to get sympathy on their side. I'm Muslim but i dislike muslims who follow the "media" or general mass thought process without any rationalization by themselves.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Muslim indifference to violence

      Originally posted by Panthera tigris View Post
      Welcome

      For some time I have been reading a few Islamic boards (including a few Sunni and one Shia site) and there is one thing that strikes me the most - almost complete lack of interest in discussing atrocities committed by Muslims against other groups. Muslims can create dozens of threads to discuss e.g. Palestinians or Syria (indeed a major source of suffering) but they can't even bring themselves to condemn other Muslims for their slaughter of Christians in Nigeria. Or massacres of Shias in Iraq by Saddam Hussain. OR massascres of Ahmadis in Pakistan, persecution of Bahais in Iran or some historical facts such as 300,000 Hindus killed on a single day by Tamerlane's troops etc.

      Come on... Roughly 80% of all armed conflicts that take place anywhere in the world involve Muslims on at least one side even though they constitute only about 25% of the world's population. Pretty much in every place where Islam is a dominant religion, religious minorities live in constant fear for their lives, lives of their relatives and their property. In other places there is neverending war or threat of it, if Muslims' demands are not met. What Palestinians endure from the Israelis is nothing compared to what e.g. Christians in Nigeria or Hindus in Pakistan had to endure from mainstream Islam - constant suicide bombing of worship places, shootings, beheadings, massacres and denial of basic rights. All Western countries give Muslims full citizenship and the same rights the majority has but not a single sharia-based country gives it's minorities equal rights.

      Why do you constantly talk about the oppression of Muslims but rarely of oppression BY Muslims?


      Go live with the Palestinians in Gaza for a while and then come and tell us they don't have it so bad compared to others. People all over the world are oppressing and killing each other, its just a standard tactic by people like you to blame it all on Muslims.

      And secondly, ther eis no shariah based country anywhere in the world - so whatever happens there has nothing to do with shariah. If there was a shariah state, the rights of non muslims living there would have been protected, but when you got corrupt secularists in charge who care only to line their own pockets and prostrate themselves to their Lord America - then stuff like that is gonna happen and nothing will be done to stop it.
      Allah is always watching [VIDEO]

      How To Weep For The Fear Of Allah

      Please remember to share these links with people you know so they can also benefit from them. :jkk:

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Muslim indifference to violence

        Originally posted by Panthera tigris View Post
        Welcome

        For some time I have been reading a few Islamic boards (including a few Sunni and one Shia site) and there is one thing that strikes me the most - almost complete lack of interest in discussing atrocities committed by Muslims against other groups. Muslims can create dozens of threads to discuss e.g. Palestinians or Syria (indeed a major source of suffering) but they can't even bring themselves to condemn other Muslims for their slaughter of Christians in Nigeria. Or massacres of Shias in Iraq by Saddam Hussain. OR massascres of Ahmadis in Pakistan, persecution of Bahais in Iran or some historical facts such as 300,000 Hindus killed on a single day by Tamerlane's troops etc.

        Come on... Roughly 80% of all armed conflicts that take place anywhere in the world involve Muslims on at least one side even though they constitute only about 25% of the world's population. Pretty much in every place where Islam is a dominant religion, religious minorities live in constant fear for their lives, lives of their relatives and their property. In other places there is neverending war or threat of it, if Muslims' demands are not met. What Palestinians endure from the Israelis is nothing compared to what e.g. Christians in Nigeria or Hindus in Pakistan had to endure from mainstream Islam - constant suicide bombing of worship places, shootings, beheadings, massacres and denial of basic rights. All Western countries give Muslims full citizenship and the same rights the majority has but not a single sharia-based country gives it's minorities equal rights.

        Why do you constantly talk about the oppression of Muslims but rarely of oppression BY Muslims?
        Before I address your question, may I ask you in your opinion which is more prevalent in the world: Oppression by Muslims or Oppression of Muslims?

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Muslim indifference to violence

          The concept of Islam as an intrinsically violent, anti-progressive opponent in the modern world is both ignorant and dangerous. The new prominence of this idea in America provides a good measure of the distorted information that exists in our political environment. It's almost as though the bloody, parochial views of Ariel Sharon on the nature of Palestinians had been exalted to a world view, worthy of every statesman's consideration.

          How easily we forget that the history of organized Christianity provides almost certainly the bloodiest tale in all of human history.

          The Crusades, that dark saga of Christianity written in blood and terror, continued sporadically over hundreds of years. They served little other purpose than gathering wealth through spoils and sacking cities and easing the periodic domestic political difficulties of the papacy and major princes of Europe.

          We hear of the treatment of women under Islam in certain places, not remembering that Christian women were left locked in iron chastity belts for years while their husbands raped their way across the Near East. And the character of Saladin, hard warrior that he was, shines nobly in history compared to the moral shabbiness of Richard Lionheart.

          Europe wove a remarkable tapestry of horrors in the name of Christianity from the beginning of the modern era. There was the Holy Inquisition, the Expulsion of the Jews from Spain, the Reformation, the Counter-Reformation, the Thirty Years' War, the English Civil War, the St Bartholomew Massacre, Cromwell's slaughter in Ireland, the enslavement and widespread extermination of native peoples in the Americas, the Eighty Years' War in Holland, the expulsion of the Huguenots from France, the pogroms, the burning of witches, and numberless other horrific events right down to The Holocaust itself, which was largely the work of people who considered themselves, as did the slave drivers of America's South, to be Christians.



          How anyone with this heritage can describe Islam as notably bloodthirsty plainly tells us that immense ignorance is at work here.

          What limited knowledge I have of Islam is enough to know that there is no history, despite bloody characters like Tamerlane, to overtop Europe's excesses, and, in some cases, there has been generosity of spirit exceeding that shown by Christians.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Muslim indifference to violence

            The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said:

            “Help your brother, whether he is an oppressor or he is oppressed.” The Prophet was asked: “It is right to help him if he is oppressed, but how should we help him if he is an oppressor?” He replied: “By preventing him from oppressing others.”

            {Sahih Bukhari, Volume 3, Hadith 624}


            This hadith teaches us all we need regarding this topic .
            Some Muslims will follow the hadith but some won't unfortunately but it safe to say that Muslims will never stoop so low and do unimaginable things like nuking a whole nation.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Muslim indifference to violence

              Originally posted by innocent_girl View Post
              it safe to say that Muslims will never stoop so low and do unimaginable things like nuking a whole nation.
              Exactly.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Muslim indifference to violence

                Originally posted by Panthera tigris View Post
                Welcome

                For some time I have been reading a few Islamic boards (including a few Sunni and one Shia site) and there is one thing that strikes me the most - almost complete lack of interest in discussing atrocities committed by Muslims against other groups. Muslims can create dozens of threads to discuss e.g. Palestinians or Syria (indeed a major source of suffering) but they can't even bring themselves to condemn other Muslims for their slaughter of Christians in Nigeria. Or massacres of Shias in Iraq by Saddam Hussain. OR massascres of Ahmadis in Pakistan, persecution of Bahais in Iran or some historical facts such as 300,000 Hindus killed on a single day by Tamerlane's troops etc.

                Come on... Roughly 80% of all armed conflicts that take place anywhere in the world involve Muslims on at least one side even though they constitute only about 25% of the world's population. Pretty much in every place where Islam is a dominant religion, religious minorities live in constant fear for their lives, lives of their relatives and their property. In other places there is neverending war or threat of it, if Muslims' demands are not met. What Palestinians endure from the Israelis is nothing compared to what e.g. Christians in Nigeria or Hindus in Pakistan had to endure from mainstream Islam - constant suicide bombing of worship places, shootings, beheadings, massacres and denial of basic rights. All Western countries give Muslims full citizenship and the same rights the majority has but not a single sharia-based country gives it's minorities equal rights.

                Why do you constantly talk about the oppression of Muslims but rarely of oppression BY Muslims?
                I agree with you :) More needs to be done by us to accommodate people who are from different religions.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Muslim indifference to violence

                  Its really just a reaction to kafirs in general being indifferent to violence inflicted upon Muslims. Look at events such as 9/11, 7/7 Muslims were among the first to come out and condemn but do kuffar in general, and not all, condemn attacks by say the US and Israel on Muslims? No they don't and many openly support it. So it's really just a reaction to that.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Muslim indifference to violence

                    Originally posted by Panthera tigris View Post
                    Welcome

                    For some time I have been reading a few Islamic boards (including a few Sunni and one Shia site) and there is one thing that strikes me the most - almost complete lack of interest in discussing atrocities committed by Muslims against other groups. Muslims can create dozens of threads to discuss e.g. Palestinians or Syria (indeed a major source of suffering) but they can't even bring themselves to condemn other Muslims for their slaughter of Christians in Nigeria. Or massacres of Shias in Iraq by Saddam Hussain. OR massascres of Ahmadis in Pakistan, persecution of Bahais in Iran or some historical facts such as 300,000 Hindus killed on a single day by Tamerlane's troops etc.

                    Come on... Roughly 80% of all armed conflicts that take place anywhere in the world involve Muslims on at least one side even though they constitute only about 25% of the world's population. Pretty much in every place where Islam is a dominant religion, religious minorities live in constant fear for their lives, lives of their relatives and their property. In other places there is neverending war or threat of it, if Muslims' demands are not met. What Palestinians endure from the Israelis is nothing compared to what e.g. Christians in Nigeria or Hindus in Pakistan had to endure from mainstream Islam - constant suicide bombing of worship places, shootings, beheadings, massacres and denial of basic rights. All Western countries give Muslims full citizenship and the same rights the majority has but not a single sharia-based country gives it's minorities equal rights.

                    Why do you constantly talk about the oppression of Muslims but rarely of oppression BY Muslims?
                    i stopped reading when you said christians in nigeria.

                    The same christians who murdered and raped their way into towns up north? go cry me a river. Nigeria is controlled by a christian government that had his soldiers rape, kill and loot muslims for years. I didnt you your bleeding heart cry for them. But now when muslims started giving chirstians their own taste in medicine you start crying.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Muslim indifference to violence

                      Originally posted by Panthera tigris View Post
                      Welcome

                      For some time I have been reading a few Islamic boards (including a few Sunni and one Shia site) and there is one thing that strikes me the most - almost complete lack of interest in discussing atrocities committed by Muslims against other groups. Muslims can create dozens of threads to discuss e.g. Palestinians or Syria (indeed a major source of suffering) but they can't even bring themselves to condemn other Muslims for their slaughter of Christians in Nigeria. Or massacres of Shias in Iraq by Saddam Hussain. OR massascres of Ahmadis in Pakistan, persecution of Bahais in Iran or some historical facts such as 300,000 Hindus killed on a single day by Tamerlane's troops etc.

                      Come on... Roughly 80% of all armed conflicts that take place anywhere in the world involve Muslims on at least one side even though they constitute only about 25% of the world's population. Pretty much in every place where Islam is a dominant religion, religious minorities live in constant fear for their lives, lives of their relatives and their property. In other places there is neverending war or threat of it, if Muslims' demands are not met. What Palestinians endure from the Israelis is nothing compared to what e.g. Christians in Nigeria or Hindus in Pakistan had to endure from mainstream Islam - constant suicide bombing of worship places, shootings, beheadings, massacres and denial of basic rights. All Western countries give Muslims full citizenship and the same rights the majority has but not a single sharia-based country gives it's minorities equal rights.

                      Why do you constantly talk about the oppression of Muslims but rarely of oppression BY Muslims?
                      You have a very poor grasp of World History. Atrocities carried out by Muslims are a fraction of 1% when compared to the genocides committed by The Soviet Union, China, Great Britain, America, Spain, France & Germany. Go read Wikipedia or something because you just look ignorant.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Muslim indifference to violence

                        [QUOTE=Erech;5681109]You have a very poor grasp of World History. Atrocities carried out by Muslims are a fraction of 1% when compared to the genocides committed by The Soviet Union, China, Great Britain, America, Spain, France & Germany. Go read Wikipedia or something because you just look ignorant.[/Q

                        Biased media has always been a tool used by the attackers of Islam to defame islam. though its possible there were wars by so called Muslim rulers but the death toll was always greatly exaggerated at least by 300 %. similarly in those wars were Muslims were killed death toll figures are reported very less .example in the Bosnian WAR AS PER EARLIER REPORTS During the siege, 11,541 people lost their lives, including over 1,500 children. An additional 56,000 people were wounded in a population of half million. BUT AS PER WIKI The most recent figures suggest that around 100,000 people were killed during the war.[23][24] In addition, an estimated total of The most recent figures suggest that around 100,000 people were killed during the war.[23][24] In addition, an estimated total of 20,000 to 50,000 women were raped,[25] and over 2.2 million people were displaced,[26] making it the most devastating conflict
                        in Europe since the end of World War II.(I remember atleast 5000 muslims being killed with a month of begining of THE SERBIAN CROATIAN assault which I saw in the BBC)

                        During War in Kosovo , roughly a million ethnic Albanians(muslims) fled or were forcefully driven from Kosovo, during the kososvo war. more than 11,000 deaths have been reported which is very low figure again though Muslim population was more than three times bigger than Sarajevo( Bosnian war).

                        THE Tamerlane WAR was between Muslims & Muslims (NOT between Muslims and Hindus)Timur(MUSLIM) or Tamerlane fought against Sultan Nasir-ud-Din Mahmud Shah Tughlaq ,the writer claims Hindus DEATH TOLL at 300,000(Hindus-incorrect it was a mix of muslims and Hindus) were executed its against wiki 100,000 which is been already an inflated figure since I was born here we have read in history books the figure was not more than 10,000-20000 and it was mainly due to frightened Elephants army of Tughlaq which tramped its own people
                        because of seeing fire created by cunning Tamerlane's army to panic them. I am not justifying even if 100 people killed thats happens according to the Large scale of troops and other demographic facts and when the war is on a large scale and area, but I just want to Prove the Biased media against Muslims and Islam through the below FACT OF A LATEST HISTORY.

                        The below distortion of history thats only 250 years old will enlighten my cause. Tippu sultan the Muslim ruler of Mysore was a Pious Muslim king about whom some NON Muslims still love & revere him after 250 years. Many of his subordinates were Hindus
                        (copied & pasted)
                        Tipu Sultan's treasurer was Krishna Rao, Shamaiya Iyengar was his Minister of Post and Police,
                        his brother Ranga Iyengar was also an officer, and Purnaiya held the very important post
                        of "Mir Asaf". Moolchand and Sujan Rai were his chief agents at the
                        Mughal court, and his chief "Peshkar", Suba Rao, was also a Hindu.[62]
                        Editor of Mysore Gazettes Srikantaiah has listed 156 temples to which Tipu regularly paid
                        annual grants. There is such evidence as grant deeds, and correspondence between his court
                        and temples, and his having donated jewelry and deeded land grants to several temples,

                        But the Christians who ruled India 'by divide and rule Policy' when they left india left their policiy behind in the form of History Books only haunt the Indians UNTILL NOW IN THE SCHOOLS through their History records which says that Tippu sultan was an anti Hindu and anti Christian who used force to convert others to Islam was a WORST LIE.. One of the reason I can guess the reason of defaming him was the invaders (Christians) HATED HIM THE MOST among the Indian Resistance because he once badly defeated the the English against heavy English artilery so more they hated someone more they spread rumours and false claims against him AS THEY ARE STILL DOING AGAINST ISLAM.

                        QURAN SAYS IN 61:8 They desire to put out the light of Allah with their mouths but Allah will perfect His light, though the unbelievers may be averse.

                        Read about TIPPU SULTAN , the tiger of Mysore. ''http://www.thehindu.com/features/friday-review/history-and-culture/honour-for-a-monarch/article4810300.ece
                        read http://www.bangalorebest.com/discove...Line/tiger.asp


                        Again I am not justifying killing of any Innocent human being(muslim or non muslims kindly read my thread '' Is Islam, a Religion of Peace?) but I am tired & dissatisfied with the BLUNT false informations of the Christians and also some who are also WRITING on this blog which must not mislead us or cheat us. we Muslims have to condemn any innocent killings as our Prophet(sal) shown us ,but Dinobot And Erech HAVE THEIR OWN PROOFS WHICH SHOWS that my facts are not wrong.But Muslims are busy defending themselves in from various messy situations we are and we seldom look at this allegations which are sometimes the fruit fro their own trees and seeds sowed earlier.
                        My sect - No Sect

                        My Aqeedah - http://legacy.quran.com/112 ( The Aqeedah of Sahabas)

                        Just a Muslim

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Muslim indifference to violence

                          Non-Muslims under Islamic rule in Spain Vs Muslims under kufr rule in Spain.

                          Yeah we are the violent ones.

                          World History, read it sometime.
                          www.treasureofthescholars.wordpress.com

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Muslim indifference to violence

                            Can you quote eome passages from theological or legal works confirming that it is not permitted to harm civilians? At the moment I don't have time to research it myself. I remember reading some story from either one of hadith or sira collections when Muslims were to conduct a night raid on a village of pagan Arabs and were concerned that civilians will be among the victims so they asked the prophet and he said "they are from them" so he at least accepted such a possibility. He also had a history of applying some kind of "collective (in)justice" in form of e.g. raiding caravans and killing their drivers who had little to do with Meccan politics.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Muslim indifference to violence

                              Originally posted by Panthera tigris View Post
                              Can you quote eome passages from theological or legal works confirming that it is not permitted to harm civilians? At the moment I don't have time to research it myself. I remember reading some story from either one of hadith or sira collections when Muslims were to conduct a night raid on a village of pagan Arabs and were concerned that civilians will be among the victims so they asked the prophet and he said "they are from them" so he at least accepted such a possibility. He also had a history of applying some kind of "collective (in)justice" in form of e.g. raiding caravans and killing their drivers who had little to do with Meccan politics.
                              This was a case where the enemies tried using their ladies as human Shield (since they know Muslims do not attack women,children and the aged) thus cunningly taking advantage of the etiquettes of war of Muslims ONLY to kill the muslims. Therefore ,The companion of Prophet IN THE WAR who spied the matter and informed the matter asking permission of the Prophet to attack Prophet gave the permission to attack saying so ''they are of them'' which is true and FAIR enough. WE have to appreciate the MUSLIMS then who were hesitant to attack them unlike the Bombardments of today(watch Press reporter Yvvone ridely in Afghanistan ). i don't remember in which battle it was.
                              My sect - No Sect

                              My Aqeedah - http://legacy.quran.com/112 ( The Aqeedah of Sahabas)

                              Just a Muslim

                              Comment

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