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'MISQUOTED' Noble Quran verses by Apologetics.

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    #16
    Re: 'MISQUOTED' Noble Quran verses by Apologetics.

    Additionally, saying the Koran states Allah's words are unalterable is not misquoted. But Muslims that say Matthew 7:22-23King James Version (KJV) is to those who call Jesus Lord, Lord is represented and out of context.

    Jesus didn't say it was for calling him Lord; it was for calling him Lord and doing their own thing for God instead of doing God's will. Jesus would also say the same to all who don't call him Lord.

    Look carefully at the verse. It doesn't state one is wrong for calling him Lord. He means it this way: Why call me Lord and do not the things I say?

    22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
    Last edited by AJ4u; 09-01-15, 03:04 PM.

    Comment


      #17
      Re: 'MISQUOTED' Noble Quran verses by Apologetics.

      Originally posted by AJ4u View Post
      Additionally, saying the Koran states Allah's words are unalterable is not misquoted. But Muslims that say Matthew 7:22-23King James Version (KJV) is to those who call Jesus Lord, Lord is represented and out of context.

      Jesus didn't say it was for calling him Lord; it was for calling him Lord and doing their own thing for God instead of doing God's will. Jesus would also say the same to all who don't call him Lord.

      Look carefully at the verse. It doesn't state one is wrong for calling him Lord. He means it this way: Why call me Lord and do not the things I say?

      22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
      Sorry, I am not here to answer kids who want have fun and does EVEN not understand their own books (matthew 7:22-23) where Jesus gives a so kindly have a nice time some where else like on a Giant wheel with all your dubious members who + repped you dude ;)
      My sect - No Sect

      My Aqeedah - http://legacy.quran.com/112 ( The Aqeedah of Sahabas)

      Just a Muslim

      Comment


        #18
        Re: 'MISQUOTED' Noble Quran verses by Apologetics.

        Originally posted by talibilm09 View Post
        Sorry, I am not here to answer kids who want have fun and does EVEN not understand their own books (matthew 7:22-23) where Jesus gives a so kindly have a nice time some where else like on a Giant wheel with all your dubious members who + repped you dude ;)
        Sir stop being rude and disrespectful. there is no call for it. deal with the issues. I am telling you what we Christians understand Matthew 7: 22, 23 to mean. You are understanding and quoting it out of context. You don't strike me as being interested in knowing truth. You just want to bash Christianity and not understand it or what true believers know and think. Please keep in mind that your good standing on the forum doesn't mean good standing with God; we must all account to God for our words and deeds.

        Comment


          #19
          Re: 'MISQUOTED' Noble Quran verses by Apologetics.

          Originally posted by AJ4u View Post
          Sir stop being rude and disrespectful. there is no call for it. deal with the issues. I am telling you what we Christians understand Matthew 7: 22, 23 to mean. You are understanding and quoting it out of context. You don't strike me as being interested in knowing truth. You just want to bash Christianity and not understand it or what true believers know and think. Please keep in mind that your good standing on the forum doesn't mean good standing with God; we must all account to God for our words and deeds.
          Thanks , sir , so do pass time on an amusement park sir, I can't amuse you any more and I am not free for such time wasting sir.:inlove:
          My sect - No Sect

          My Aqeedah - http://legacy.quran.com/112 ( The Aqeedah of Sahabas)

          Just a Muslim

          Comment


            #20
            Re: 'MISQUOTED' Noble Quran verses by Apologetics.

            Another Most misquoted verse by the attackers of Islam is this verse 9:29 and claim something Which is MOST UNFAIR & Blunt Lies

            Noble Quran 9:29 '' Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture - [fight] until they give the jizyah willingly while they are humbled.''

            (Noble Quran )Tafsir ibn Abbas(raa)
            (Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture) the Jews and Christians (as believe not in Allah nor the Last Day) nor in the bliss of Paradise, (and forbid not) in the Torah (that which Allah hath forbidden by His messenger, and follow not the religion of truth) do not submit themselves to Allah through confession of Allah's divine Oneness, (until they pay the tribute readily) standing: from hand to hand, (being brought low) abased.

            This verse 9:29 was revealed in 9th muslim year after establishment of Islamic State and this state did not recruit Non-Muslims in the army because the Law was not same for both and the Muslim Army can get easily corrupted by the JOLLY LIFE living of NON MUSLIMS by ways of Liquor,Gambling, Adultery, Betraying, Hypocrisy etc. "'Jizzya' From the word ''Jazza" meaning ''To Compensate" was levied on Non Muslims as a "'Compensation' ' in lieu of not to partcipate in Muslim Army" BUT get ''Protection'' from them for their Life & property as every Muslim Citizen would.

            Also it points to the Jews & Christians who boasted as being the chosen people of God ie very Pious but never abstained from Haram or prohibitted things, iow they never lived by it (covenant)EVEN BY ABIDING THEIR OWN SCRIPTURES so these people who did not take as prohibited which was prohibited By the Islamic state and were to be fought till they were humbled and followed ATLEAST their books firmly by avoiding the prohibitions seen there like adultery, wine,swine, usury and pay Jizzya tax while Muslims paid the Zakat tax but they (non muslims) need not pay zakat tax.

            Just think of a Islamic neighbourhood sticking to their purity and a next Neighbour a drunkard playing music and exhibit erotic , fondelling moves with his fiancee or a whore on a open terrace or a visible lawn, lol, this is ok for him but not for that pure community then under Prophet (pbuh ) and the muslim children will learn from their neighbour. on Such time those who arrogant defying rules of the Islamic state has to be fought untill they are humbled and pay jizzya as well which is just a tax in lieu on non participation in Muslim army but can get get protection from them like every other Muslim is entitled to.

            The Jizzya was returned back when the Muslim army could not keep its promise of protecting the non Muslims for proof read my posts in this thread

            http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthrea...t=#post6201448
            My sect - No Sect

            My Aqeedah - http://legacy.quran.com/112 ( The Aqeedah of Sahabas)

            Just a Muslim

            Comment


              #21
              Re: 'MISQUOTED' Noble Quran verses by Apologetics.

              Originally posted by talibilm09 View Post
              Another Most misquoted verse by the attackers of Islam is this verse 9:29 and claim something Which is MOST UNFAIR & Blunt Lies

              Noble Quran 9:29 '' Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture - [fight] until they give the jizyah willingly while they are humbled.''

              (Noble Quran )Tafsir ibn Abbas(raa)
              (Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture) the Jews and Christians (as believe not in Allah nor the Last Day) nor in the bliss of Paradise, (and forbid not) in the Torah (that which Allah hath forbidden by His messenger, and follow not the religion of truth) do not submit themselves to Allah through confession of Allah's divine Oneness, (until they pay the tribute readily) standing: from hand to hand, (being brought low) abased.

              This verse 9:29 was revealed in 9th muslim year after establishment of Islamic State and this state did not recruit Non-Muslims in the army because the Law was not same for both and the Muslim Army can get easily corrupted by the JOLLY LIFE living of NON MUSLIMS by ways of Liquor,Gambling, Adultery, Betraying, Hypocrisy etc. "'Jizzya' From the word ''Jazza" meaning ''To Compensate" was levied on Non Muslims as a "'Compensation' ' in lieu of not to partcipate in Muslim Army" BUT get ''Protection'' from them for their Life & property as every Muslim Citizen would.

              Also it points to the Jews & Christians who boasted as being the chosen people of God ie very Pious but never abstained from Haram or prohibitted things, iow they never lived by it (covenant)EVEN BY ABIDING THEIR OWN SCRIPTURES so these people who did not take as prohibited which was prohibited By the Islamic state and were to be fought till they were humbled and followed ATLEAST their books firmly by avoiding the prohibitions seen there like adultery, wine,swine, usury and pay Jizzya tax while Muslims paid the Zakat tax but they (non muslims) need not pay zakat tax.

              Just think of a Islamic neighbourhood sticking to their purity and a next Neighbour a drunkard playing music and exhibit erotic , fondelling moves with his fiancee or a whore on a open terrace or a visible lawn, lol, this is ok for him but not for that pure community then under Prophet (pbuh ) and the muslim children will learn from their neighbour. on Such time those who arrogant defying rules of the Islamic state has to be fought untill they are humbled and pay jizzya as well which is just a tax in lieu on non participation in Muslim army but can get get protection from them like every other Muslim is entitled to.

              The Jizzya was returned back when the Muslim army could not keep its promise of protecting the non Muslims for proof read my posts in this thread

              http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthrea...t=#post6201448
              BUMP for Cotzy replying your questions , verses 5:47,9:29
              My sect - No Sect

              My Aqeedah - http://legacy.quran.com/112 ( The Aqeedah of Sahabas)

              Just a Muslim

              Comment


                #22
                Re: 'MISQUOTED' Noble Quran verses by Apologetics.

                Noble Quran 9:29 '' Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture - [fight] until they give the jizyah willingly while they are humbled.''

                But this is a Scripture verse in the Quran! I could understand your interpretation of this if it was in the hadith instead, and what Muslims had to follow for a certain time in history, but as a verse in the Quran, people can take it for just what it says without your interpretation. In fact, may radical Muslims do. It is clear, IMO, and needs no interpretation whatsoever.

                Now, if we compare religions, we see fight those who don't believe in the Muhammad, Allah and the last day, but in the gospel it says love your enemies; so, the Quran follows more the OT except when God judged and fought people, he didn't say go and do likewise perpetually until the last day; moreover, God revealed his love and mercy to sinners as Jesus did in the gospel as a friend of sinners. Therefore, it is the goodness of God that leads sinners to repentance not his wrath, but his wrath will come for God will not strive with man indefinitely. A man being often rebuked and still hardens his heart will be eventually destroyed without remedy.

                Comment


                  #23
                  Re: 'MISQUOTED' Noble Quran verses by Apologetics.

                  Noble Quran 9:29 '' Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture - [fight] until they give the jizyah willingly while they are humbled.'' When I look at a verse in the Quran I really like to deliberate on it and study it. The more I do I am convinced it is very clear and self-explanatory. This, IMHO, is in no need of interpretation.

                  I had a typo in my last post, but I meant to show this comparison as well, this verse says fight those who don't believe in Allah. I don't believe even in the OT God had the children of Israel fight those who didn't believe in God, but he did have them fight when God wanted them to go somewhere and the heathen wouldn't let them pass and for such things as that; so, that is another comparison or contrast I noticed.

                  Now the verse also states fight those who don't believe in what Allah and Muhammad consider unlawful. I find this interesting, and maybe if anything could use a little explanation as to how Muslims see this, but then again one can argue it is clear for them as well as us. My questions is in this interesting dichotomy fight those who don't consider unlawful what Allah considers unlawful and fight those who don't consider unlawful what Muhammad considers unlawful. Does that mean fight those who disagree with what Muhammad considers unlawful independently of Allah or are they (Allah & Muhammad) working as one and yet being two separate individuals considering certain things unlawful independent of each other? Do you see where I am going with this interesting dichotomy? It makes me think of the way we see Jesus as one with God but they are two persons with the exception that Jesus wouldn't consider anything unlawful independent of his father in heaven.

                  As for your explanation of a next Neighbor a drunkard playing music and exhibit erotic, fondling moves with his fiancée or a whore on a open terrace or a visible lawn is an unrealistic analogy. Even in a corrupt society people wouldn't do that in the open, because it is against the law. They would get arrested. Isolated situations might happen, but it can be easily snuffed out by the law of the land or a moral person's rebuke. It is even against the laws of heathen atheistic nations. People know that's wrong behavior, because God's moral laws are written on the hearts of all peoples even in remote places. So, you are trying to justify a verse in the Quran with your private interpretation when the verse stand on its own without your help to give in meaning. I take it for what it says exactly nothing more or less!

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Re: 'MISQUOTED' Noble Quran verses by Apologetics.

                    Originally posted by AJ4u View Post
                    Noble Quran 9:29 '' Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture - [fight] until they give the jizyah willingly while they are humbled.''

                    But this is a Scripture verse in the Quran! I could understand your interpretation of this if it was in the hadith instead, and what Muslims had to follow for a certain time in history, but as a verse in the Quran, people can take it for just what it says without your interpretation. In fact, may radical Muslims do. It is clear, IMO, and needs no interpretation whatsoever.

                    Now, if we compare religions, we see fight those who don't believe in the Muhammad, Allah and the last day, but in the gospel it says love your enemies; so, the Quran follows more the OT except when God judged and fought people, he didn't say go and do likewise perpetually until the last day; moreover, God revealed his love and mercy to sinners as Jesus did in the gospel as a friend of sinners. Therefore, it is the goodness of God that leads sinners to repentance not his wrath, but his wrath will come for God will not strive with man indefinitely. A man being often rebuked and still hardens his heart will be eventually destroyed without remedy.
                    The Noble Quran repeats in many verses strictly to follow the Messenger who bought this message and also instructs us to ENTER ISLAM COMPLETELY So ITS A MUST Muslims have to follow the OPINION OF THEIR PROPHET which is as follows in the Hadith

                    ''Jundub reported Allah's Messenger (saw) as saying: He who speaks about the Qur'an on the basis of his personal opinion (by any accord) he commits an error, even if he is right (because it is by accident that he arrives at the truth) (Tirmidhi & Abu Dawud)

                    Since the Noble Quran was revealed in 23 years (approx) in different situations revealing conspiracies, enemies, hypocrites, true believers etc answers to questions of Jews, Christians, Magians , Muslims etc we are supposed to know the CONTEXT of the verse why,and when it was revealed or else we will never know the EXACT meaning for why those Noble Quran verses are told. Such is the verse 9:29 which is revealed in the 9th Hijirah is explained in the quote of Post # 21
                    My sect - No Sect

                    My Aqeedah - http://legacy.quran.com/112 ( The Aqeedah of Sahabas)

                    Just a Muslim

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Re: 'MISQUOTED' Noble Quran verses by Apologetics.

                      Originally posted by talibilm09 View Post
                      The Noble Quran repeats in many verses strictly to follow the Messenger who bought this message and also instructs us to ENTER ISLAM COMPLETELY So ITS A MUST Muslims have to follow the OPINION OF THEIR PROPHET which is as follows in the Hadith

                      ''Jundub reported Allah's Messenger (saw) as saying: He who speaks about the Qur'an on the basis of his personal opinion (by any accord) he commits an error, even if he is right (because it is by accident that he arrives at the truth) (Tirmidhi & Abu Dawud)

                      Since the Noble Quran was revealed in 23 years (approx) in different situations revealing conspiracies, enemies, hypocrites, true believers etc answers to questions of Jews, Christians, Magians , Muslims etc we are supposed to know the CONTEXT of the verse why,and when it was revealed or else we will never know the EXACT meaning for why those Noble Quran verses are told. Such is the verse 9:29 which is revealed in the 9th Hijirah is explained in the quote of Post # 21
                      I understand context is important
                      ; it is the same with the Bible, but some verses in the Bible are clear and already have context built into it. The verse in question here S 9: 29 is clear to me and has the context built in and has no need of interpretation or a search for its context. Now searching to see how different Muslims live out that verse is a different story completely. You could explain that, but this verse, IMO, doesn't need you help; in fact, I would be as bold as to say that none of the Quran needs your explaining help. Doesn't the recitations state it is clear in of itself? :D

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Re: 'MISQUOTED' Noble Quran verses by Apologetics.

                        Originally posted by AJ4u View Post
                        I understand context is important
                        ; it is the same with the Bible, but some verses in the Bible are clear and already have context built into it. The verse in question here S 9: 29 is clear to me and has the context built in and has no need of interpretation or a search for its context. Now searching to see how different Muslims live out that verse is a different story completely. You could explain that, but this verse, IMO, doesn't need you help; in fact, I would be as bold as to say that none of the Quran needs your explaining help. Doesn't the recitations state it is clear in of itself? :D
                        Recitation is clear but guidance is from Allah...sometimes even clear verse doesnt guide someone..and sometimes a complex verse with pretext (tafseer) when fully explained make one convert to islam.Verses are quite clear but many non muslims out of ignorance about verses,related events,hadeeths go for wrong interpretations...Intention is another thing.Like if you are interesting in islam...you ll be guided but if someone just intend to use these verses for debates against muslims to show them that thrre are faults...then no matter how ckear those verses are ,they wont appear easy to them...because their hearts get sealed.
                        ".......He giveth and spendeth (of His bounty) as He pleaseth. But the revelation that cometh to thee from Allah increaseth in most of them (kuffar) their obstinate rebellion and blasphemy.Amongst them we have placed enmity and hatred till the Day of Judgment. Every time they kindle the fire of war, Allah doth extinguish it;but they (ever) strive to do mischief on earth. And Allah loveth not those who do mischief."(5:64)

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Re: 'MISQUOTED' Noble Quran verses by Apologetics.

                          Originally posted by AJ4u View Post
                          Noble Quran 9:29 '' Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture - [fight] until they give the jizyah willingly while they are humbled.'' When I look at a verse in the Quran I really like to deliberate on it and study it. The more I do I am convinced it is very clear and self-explanatory. This, IMHO, is in no need of interpretation.

                          I had a typo in my last post, but I meant to show this comparison as well, this verse says fight those who don't believe in Allah. I don't believe even in the OT God had the children of Israel fight those who didn't believe in God, but he did have them fight when God wanted them to go somewhere and the heathen wouldn't let them pass and for such things as that; so, that is another comparison or contrast I noticed.

                          Now the verse also states fight those who don't believe in what Allah and Muhammad consider unlawful. I find this interesting, and maybe if anything could use a little explanation as to how Muslims see this, but then again one can argue it is clear for them as well as us. My questions is in this interesting dichotomy fight those who don't consider unlawful what Allah considers unlawful and fight those who don't consider unlawful what Muhammad considers unlawful. Does that mean fight those who disagree with what Muhammad considers unlawful independently of Allah or are they (Allah & Muhammad) working as one and yet being two separate individuals considering certain things unlawful independent of each other? Do you see where I am going with this interesting dichotomy? It makes me think of the way we see Jesus as one with God but they are two persons with the exception that Jesus wouldn't consider anything unlawful independent of his father in heaven.

                          As for your explanation of a next Neighbor a drunkard playing music and exhibit erotic, fondling moves with his fiancée or a whore on a open terrace or a visible lawn is an unrealistic analogy. Even in a corrupt society people wouldn't do that in the open, because it is against the law. They would get arrested. Isolated situations might happen, but it can be easily snuffed out by the law of the land or a moral person's rebuke. It is even against the laws of heathen atheistic nations. People know that's wrong behavior, because God's moral laws are written on the hearts of all peoples even in remote places. So, you are trying to justify a verse in the Quran with your private interpretation when the verse stand on its own without your help to give in meaning. I take it for what it says exactly nothing more or less!
                          Verse of fighting that many non muslims usually use as weapon...is when muslims are attacked...2nd there were muslims sent to non muslim lands for dawah purposes and they were opposed ,killed or tortured.Here comes fighting.Obviously if dawah is working whats the need of fighting...Various rulers received letters from prophet :saw: for dawah but some tore letters,some killed the delegates etc...the result of which ended up in war but that too quite late...like in era of umar ra ...Offensive jehad comes when the rulers were arrogant and oppressed daes and people...even this comes for defensive category.
                          ".......He giveth and spendeth (of His bounty) as He pleaseth. But the revelation that cometh to thee from Allah increaseth in most of them (kuffar) their obstinate rebellion and blasphemy.Amongst them we have placed enmity and hatred till the Day of Judgment. Every time they kindle the fire of war, Allah doth extinguish it;but they (ever) strive to do mischief on earth. And Allah loveth not those who do mischief."(5:64)

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Re: 'MISQUOTED' Noble Quran verses by Apologetics.

                            Originally posted by snow_flakes View Post
                            Verse of fighting that many non muslims usually use as weapon...is when muslims are attacked...2nd there were muslims sent to non muslim lands for dawah purposes and they were opposed ,killed or tortured.Here comes fighting.Obviously if dawah is working whats the need of fighting...Various rulers received letters from prophet :saw: for dawah but some tore letters,some killed the delegates etc...the result of which ended up in war but that too quite late...like in era of umar ra ...Offensive jehad comes when the rulers were arrogant and oppressed daes and people...even this comes for defensive category.
                            I don't doubt what you say, but you didn't address all my points and questions

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Re: 'MISQUOTED' Noble Quran verses by Apologetics.

                              Originally posted by snow_flakes View Post
                              Recitation is clear but guidance is from Allah...sometimes even clear verse doesnt guide someone..and sometimes a complex verse with pretext (tafseer) when fully explained make one convert to islam.Verses are quite clear but many non muslims out of ignorance about verses,related events,hadeeths go for wrong interpretations...Intention is another thing.Like if you are interesting in islam...you ll be guided but if someone just intend to use these verses for debates against muslims to show them that thrre are faults...then no matter how ckear those verses are ,they wont appear easy to them...because their hearts get sealed.
                              I understand, but that can also be said about the gospel and it would be true as well.

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Re: 'MISQUOTED' Noble Quran verses by Apologetics.

                                Originally posted by AJ4u View Post
                                I understand, but that can also be said about the gospel and it would be true as well.
                                You can ask..i ll answer iA...what specifically you wanna know?
                                ".......He giveth and spendeth (of His bounty) as He pleaseth. But the revelation that cometh to thee from Allah increaseth in most of them (kuffar) their obstinate rebellion and blasphemy.Amongst them we have placed enmity and hatred till the Day of Judgment. Every time they kindle the fire of war, Allah doth extinguish it;but they (ever) strive to do mischief on earth. And Allah loveth not those who do mischief."(5:64)

                                Comment

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