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Why doesn't God deliver the same revelation of Himself to all nations?

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  • #61
    Re: Why doesn't God deliver the same revelation of Himself to all nations?

    Originally posted by ExNihilo View Post
    Creation myths are common to all cultures and 'first man' stories are almost inevitably a part of that. There is absolutely nothing in what you are saying that supports the notion of Islam as the 'original' version of all other religions. Not only do they not resemble Islam today, they also don't show any progression 'away' from a more Islamic like past, which would support the notion of a pure original being slowly distorted. They look exactly as you would expect from religions that are developing from their own, independent, non Islamic origins.

    I am amazed to find you saying that Sharia is not essential to the core of Islam.
    Allow me to describe my version of evolution.

    When a kid wants to be a doctor for example, he will have to go to school, college, uni, get a degree and qualify for what he wants to be.
    it didnt happen that the kid missed primary school, college and just jumped to the exams so he can get his badge.

    Similarly, the first human beings were given "education" or message that was suitable for that period of time
    the next generations were given a higher level of message to suit their intelligence.
    Now, the intellect overtime evolves. So now in this day n age u can receive a more advanced message and be able to understand it. Digest it.
    so islam is the final message for the exams that will follow on judgement day.
    the basic message of monotheism existed from the very beginning.
    "If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor."

    "Nothing protects the rights of the minority like the tyranny of the majority"

    Comment


    • #62
      Re: Why doesn't God deliver the same revelation of Himself to all nations?

      Originally posted by Saif-Uddin View Post
      I know I thought I'd make it explicit that Islam that Islam and Muslims were on Earth since the First man Adam(as).

      the rest of the Religions are concoctions of Man

      :jkk:
      JazakAllahukhair thank you :)
      "If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor."

      "Nothing protects the rights of the minority like the tyranny of the majority"

      Comment


      • #63
        Re: Why doesn't God deliver the same revelation of Himself to all nations?

        Originally posted by candyapple View Post
        Allow me to describe my version of evolution.

        When a kid wants to be a doctor for example, he will have to go to school, college, uni, get a degree and qualify for what he wants to be.
        it didnt happen that the kid missed primary school, college and just jumped to the exams so he can get his badge.

        Similarly, the first human beings were given "education" or message that was suitable for that period of time
        the next generations were given a higher level of message to suit their intelligence.
        Now, the intellect overtime evolves. So now in this day n age u can receive a more advanced message and be able to understand it. Digest it.
        so islam is the final message for the exams that will follow on judgement day.
        the basic message of monotheism existed from the very beginning.
        I like your idea - but this should be seen everywhere, not just in the ME.

        Also, underestimate the intellect of ancient mankind. They may have lacked knowledge, but they were our equals in capacity for enquiry and understanding.

        Comment


        • #64
          Re: Why doesn't God deliver the same revelation of Himself to all nations?

          Originally posted by Abu 'Abdullaah View Post
          You've created a strawman.

          Nobody claimed that Islam is the 'original' version of all other religions.
          It is claimed that Islam is the original of Judaism and Christianity (ie they are corrupted versions of Islam). I suppose you could choose to argue that all the other religions are not corruptions but total replacements, if that's what you wanted to do.

          Either way, it's just an assertion. There is no evidence so far in this thread which disproves the notion that Islam is a descendent of Christianity and Judaism, rather than an ancestor. And there is little or nothing to indicate that the rest of the world ever received a prophet.

          Comment


          • #65
            Re: Why doesn't God deliver the same revelation of Himself to all nations?

            Originally posted by ExNihilo View Post
            It is claimed that Islam is the original of Judaism and Christianity (ie they are corrupted versions of Islam). I suppose you could choose to argue that all the other religions are not corruptions but total replacements, if that's what you wanted to do...
            Wait, who claimed that?

            Comment


            • #66
              Re: Why doesn't God deliver the same revelation of Himself to all nations?

              Originally posted by Abu 'Abdullaah View Post
              Wait, who claimed that?
              Muslims in general ie don't trust the Bible, it's a corrupted text etc. In what sense is that not correct?

              Comment


              • #67
                Re: Why doesn't God deliver the same revelation of Himself to all nations?

                Originally posted by ExNihilo View Post
                Muslims in general ie don't trust the Bible, it's a corrupted text etc. In what sense is that not correct?
                How did we get here?

                You asked a question earlier on about 'signs' that prophets and messengers were sent to all nations and I thought we were discussing that.

                Comment


                • #68
                  Re: Why doesn't God deliver the same revelation of Himself to all nations?

                  Originally posted by ExNihilo View Post
                  I like your idea - but this should be seen everywhere, not just in the ME.

                  Also, underestimate the intellect of ancient mankind. They may have lacked knowledge, but they were our equals in capacity for enquiry and understanding.
                  Do you have proof to support your theory? I can understand what a wifi is, do u think even 3centuries ago, they could have grasped such a concept?
                  How about for the first few people on earth?
                  Their concerns would have been on survival. Not entertainment. And so humans evolved in that sense where they had simple basic knowledge and over the generations their intelligence evolved.

                  Let me give u an example.
                  over 14 centuries ago when quran was revealed, Allah mentions the fingerprint: Noble Verse(s) [075:004]* Nay, We are able to put together in perfect order the very*tips of his fingers.

                  do you think that 14 centuries ago when this verse was revealed, that these arabs understood fingerprints? Or even cared? It was only very recent that the fingerprinting method was discovered. Yet quran mentions this over 14 centuries ago.

                  Another example would be the process of pregnancy. The Details quran gives are upto date with modern science.
                  these details are for our generations, not previous... because they couldnt grasp the very details given in quran wheras although this discovery is recent to science, quran describes in vivid detail, each stage of pregnancy.
                  So we now have technology to prove this and we can visualise each stage. The older people couldnt have comprehended what was going on. The info wouldn't have been irrelevant to them cause they wouldnt have understood, and it defeats the purpose of a message if no one can comprehend it
                  "If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor."

                  "Nothing protects the rights of the minority like the tyranny of the majority"

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Re: Why doesn't God deliver the same revelation of Himself to all nations?

                    Originally posted by ExNihilo View Post
                    It is claimed that Islam is the original of Judaism and Christianity (ie they are corrupted versions of Islam). I suppose you could choose to argue that all the other religions are not corruptions but total replacements, if that's what you wanted to do.

                    Either way, it's just an assertion. There is no evidence so far in this thread which disproves the notion that Islam is a descendent of Christianity and Judaism, rather than an ancestor. And there is little or nothing to indicate that the rest of the world ever received a prophet.
                    There is an honest explanation for all the confusion. All theses prophets were prophets of god. They all came with similar message.
                    so even if something in Christianity or Judaism is found in islam, thats cause the same God we all share sent this message.

                    if anyone is implying muhammed copied, well that claim has been refuted so many times
                    "If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor."

                    "Nothing protects the rights of the minority like the tyranny of the majority"

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Re: Why doesn't God deliver the same revelation of Himself to all nations?

                      Originally posted by ExNihilo View Post
                      Muslims in general ie don't trust the Bible, it's a corrupted text etc. In what sense is that not correct?
                      You know if anyone is claiming something is corrupt, verify it.
                      Even historical evidence points out that the bible is not in its original form. Its been edited out so many times. So many versions, so msny authors and the bible was written much later after jesus.
                      there are many scientific errors in the bible too.
                      "If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor."

                      "Nothing protects the rights of the minority like the tyranny of the majority"

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Re: Why doesn't God deliver the same revelation of Himself to all nations?

                        Originally posted by candyapple View Post
                        There is an honest explanation for all the confusion. All theses prophets were prophets of god. They all came with similar message.
                        so even if something in Christianity or Judaism is found in islam, thats cause the same God we all share sent this message.

                        if anyone is implying muhammed copied, well that claim has been refuted so many times
                        Yes, but the only ones that show a resemblance or direct link to Islam are the exact two which are said (by non Muslims) to be the ancestors of islam. That's some coincidence.

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Re: Why doesn't God deliver the same revelation of Himself to all nations?

                          Originally posted by ExNihilo View Post
                          Yes, but the only ones that show a resemblance or direct link to Islam are the exact two which are said (by non Muslims) to be the ancestors of islam. That's some coincidence.
                          The two 'most recent' nations who live around Muslims are the closest in resemblance compared to other nations. Amazing, how is that even possible?!

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Re: Why doesn't God deliver the same revelation of Himself to all nations?

                            Originally posted by candyapple View Post
                            Do you have proof to support your theory? I can understand what a wifi is, do u think even 3centuries ago, they could have grasped such a concept?
                            For example, the development of agriculture 12-15000 years ago. Men had to domesticate the animals and the wild forms of grain etc, before they could be useful. Yet early man successfully domesticated almost every single creature or crop that was capable of being domesticated, a process which sometimes took hundreds of generations. Even today, we cannot domesticate any of the species they failed with. That's impressive.

                            If you took a modern man back to that time, he would be useless because of lack of knowledge. but he could be trained. The same could happen in reverse. There is, was, no difference intellectual capacity, but there is a difference in learning and education.

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Re: Why doesn't God deliver the same revelation of Himself to all nations?

                              Originally posted by Abu 'Abdullaah View Post
                              The two 'most recent' nations who live around Muslims are the closest in resemblance compared to other nations. Amazing, how is that even possible?!
                              You are being obtuse. That's what you would expect from the 'historical' version of events - ie they pre-dated and were the direct ancestors of Islam. Whereas, if prophets were scattered across the globe, you should see Islam-like religions elsewhere.

                              There is nothing to suggest that Islam is actually the original, or ancestor religion.

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Re: Why doesn't God deliver the same revelation of Himself to all nations?

                                Originally posted by ExNihilo View Post
                                Yes, but the only ones that show a resemblance or direct link to Islam are the exact two which are said (by non Muslims) to be the ancestors of islam. That's some coincidence.
                                I dont understand what you mean? Coincidence as in why is God only concentrating on Abraham and his descendants?
                                That I dont know.
                                but in the quran God mentions that He sent a prophet to every nation with message to worship only one God.
                                it makes sense that God would send a person from their own nation who speaks their native language so the people may understand.

                                The only exception to this is that quran is for the whole of humankind. Yes it was revealed in arabic... and whats so amazing is non arab learn the language and memorise the entire quran in its native language with ease
                                anyways, if quran says that Allah has sent his message to every nationed, I believe this. So for me this isnt an issue.

                                but for you, maybe evidence that other nations begun by worship of one god may help you. So in shaaAllah, Allah shows His signs to you, ameen
                                "If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor."

                                "Nothing protects the rights of the minority like the tyranny of the majority"

                                Comment

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