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  • Men Only! Western practice is destroying marriage

    NOTE: May Allah forgive me if I say something wrong. If you found any error please warn me and provide the reasoning with Quran and Hadith.

    What is the problem?

    You are wondering why young men is in this way. They are suicidal. They are addicted to masturbation. They are having mental issues.

    You have already checked this forums counselling section, and know the trend.
    https://www.ummah.com/forum/forum/mi...elling-section

    You are already tired of telling the men "Stop it". You gave your messages "This is haram, get better". Yet, they do not get better. You have no idea why the men is the way they are.

    Let me introduce you to pareto principle. (Wikipedia) "For many events, roughly 80% of the effects come from 20% of the causes." Few causes are vital and causes most of the problems.

    I will talk about a one vital cause. I will talk about a cause that we are ignorant of, or we ignored on purpose. I will talk about a how western practice is destroying marriage and we are participating it.

    "I am not at the west, why do I care?"

    It is the communication age. Information is travelling with light speed. Fitnah is travelling in light speed. Your wonderful fortified arabic governments will not save you. Your strong but small community will not save you. There is no east or west now, there is only whole world in communication age.

    Now it is coming for your community. Now it is coming for you. Now it is coming for your children. If we keep ignoring it, it will cause more harm. If we can address it and solve it, most of the problems can disappear.

    Before unfair accusations, let me state this clearly. I am bashing the western morality. I am also trying to protect sisters. West is the one that abused your sisters. (Wikipedia) Do not confuse me with those.

    Western practice is destroying marriage

    I will share a glimpse of the reality about how the marriage works in the west.

    1. Before marriage: Females date endlessly for the finding of the husband. Dating is female preferred form of promiscuity. Dating system ambiguous by design, you can cancel it any time, try as much as you can, you won't have any responsibility if you do not like the suitor. Reality is you do have a responsibility by choosing the wrong actions(dating) no matter it leads to marriage or not.

    What is wrong with western dating for women? Communication without Walee(seems as small thing right?), a little alone time(small), and promiscuity(small or not, who cares at this point). She is abused by the bad boy anyway. She needs a better man. Repeat with searching.

    What about men who are dating? Most man have no clue and no success. They constantly get rejected, they don't satisfy female desire. They try to be work endlessly and prepare themselves as good provider.(we'll see them later) Only %10-15 of males, the top alpha bad boy males enjoying the all promiscuity and fun with multiple girls. They are alpha boys, they have no interest in marriage by design. Qualities that attract female desire is not the qualities of being good husband(actually the inverse is true). Bad boys also know this dating game well, the promiscuous women they are dating will not qualify for good wives. They are enjoying having fun promiscuous females with no attachment. They are also thankful to the community for keeping %80 of the males unaware, and letting them enjoy the fun with promiscuous females. Promiscuous females are also thankful to you for encouraging them to have their fun.

    2. In marriage: After endless dating, this young and independent women decide they can't attract the muscular bad boys anymore. Beauty is fading, their body is changing for bad. Depression follows, and they go to the life epiphany around age 30, and decide to settle down with a some work horse husband(%80 of males) who is unaware of anything about marriage, since he was working for his whole life.

    Here comes the marriage, husband have hundred percent of responsibility with zero percent of authority. Be a slave to your wife. The message from the authorities "'Worship to your wife. You are good husband/muslim/male if you make them happy. Your prayers etc.? Nah, worthless. Your taqva? Nah, worthless. You are good husband/muslim/male if only you make your wife happy." Then wife will crave for alpha bad boys that she dated at university(the one that got away), deny intercourse all the time. Husband gets the endless nag. But this is just a start, after the few years of marriage, she is bored already.

    3. End of marriage: After some time when wife decided that she is boooooored, and do not "love" the husband anymore, it calls the authorities. What is better than potentially upgrading your husband?(This lie is sold through all media, tv series and books). Non fault divorces is applied and encouraged in the west. If you are so naive thinking that who benefits divorce, let me guide you. Divorce is a multi-million dollar industry. This is part where feminist duluth model of domestic abuse comes in. Male is always the transgressor. Male is executed without trial. Alimony until end of the life, and seperated from his own kids.

    Men suicide after kids taken away from them. Men go to the prison by cannot paying alimony.

    Women realize their no fault divorce was wrong choice when its too late. There was no rich millionaire waiting for them at the corner as modern literature sold them to. They are not treated as princesses as Disney sold them to. They scream: "Where are the all good men gone?". They suffer too for their bad decisions, this scenario is no good for anyone.

    What can be done about it?

    I'll only try to address only few problems from my understanding. This is not a complete list, just a small one to help you recognize obvious problems.

    1. Before marriage:

    Message to community: There is a need for medium/way for halal marriage. If you do not create a medium, young people will find a haram mediums and go on. Pious people does not want to participate to dating will suffer no marriage, mental problems and extinction(literally, because of no kids.). By not providing a halal medium, you are advocating haram ways, you are participating the extinction of the pious people.

    Message to guardians: Do not let her suffer(from her bad choices). You are assigned role of guardian for some reason. Do not tell her chase her dreams and delay marriage. Do not block possible suitors. If you keep blocking suitors, she will meet someone at café of the university. Do not send her to education oversees with no mahram. She will meet someone at spring break party.
    "My daughter is pure spirit. She will not sin." Females are human and rewarded for good deeds and punished for bad ones.
    "Do you say that education is bad?" I do not. She can get married and continue education. Remember marriage saves young people from haram.
    "How can she do her wonderful career and earn a lot of money and be independent, then I'll be proud?" She do not have to. Your "strong independent women" fantasy is pure western feminist creation. You are actually doing bad to her by unnecessarily delaying her marriage.

    Message to brothers who want to marry: Be aware of the promiscuous females. Do not ignore the red flags. Do your research. Choose the wife that have taqva, if she doesn't have it, skip her. Western "soul mate" thing is a false myth. There is no one that destined for you in their sense. They are good ones and bad ones, you have ability and encouraged to seek the best wife with taqva. Do not obsess with that one girl or chase her. Western "soul mate" thing is a false myth.
    If you suffer since there is no medium for halal marriage: Trust muslims, go to your family/relatives, go muslim community, Aalimsand Shaykhs, and ask for help on marriage. Tell them you don't have a way to find a wife in a halal way. They might help you with finding a wife. (There is a chance they can be ignorant. If so try to let them now about reality, and keep prayers.)
    If you are in the west, you need to be careful about divorce laws. When divorce happens, everyone will be against you. Your solution is to make sure your marriage and divorce is done under Islamic laws. Do not trust only the state laws, you need to find a way that you are protected by Quran. In the west, one way you can do this by doing prenuptial agreement. Do your research and make sure your marriage and possible divorce will be done by Islamic law.

    2. In marriage:

    Message to community: Do not bash males with no reason. Married man provides for his family. Married man guides his family with deen. Married man is practicing sunnah. If your every friday discussion in mosque includes devaluing married husbands, devaluing young males, there is a good chance they will not come. Young ones will do not want to marry. You are blaming the people with taqva for the things that they don't do. Your audience is people with taqva. The messages you are talking about do not reach to promiscuous people, they are not listening to you anyway.

    3. End of marriage:

    Message to community: Do not recommend non-fault divorce. State the reasons for divorce clearly. Let the young brothers know about no fault divorces, unfair alimony and child support. Encourage them to marriages ruled by Islamic Law. In the west, one way to do is a using prenuptial agreement. Make sure they will be guarded by Islamic Law.

    We need more action

    Aalims and Shaykhs you need to aware of this. There is no chance that you can not see this. If you do not give the right message, someone will give the wrong message. If you do not create a medium for halal marriage and marriage covered by Islamic Law, someone else will promote non Islamic marriage. HELP PRACTICING THE ISLAMIC MARRIAGE. IF YOU SOLVE THE VITAL CAUSE, MOST OF THE PROBLEMS CAN DISAPPEAR.

    Please go read the message Shaykh Ibn ‘Uthaymeen gave at least 5 years ago, in his book Concise Manual of Marriage.
    Message is in this part: Introduction from Shaykh Muhammad Ibn Saalih al-’Uthaymeen’s Lecture
    http://www.islamicweblibrary.com/wp-...aalih-al-U.pdf

    To all brothers, please read about marriage. Start with the reading above book. Go read Quran and Hadith. Learn your rights and obligations. Trust Quran and Hadith. Do not let the western sensibilities will misguide you. Do not go youtube etc. and possibly take false information. Go read Quran and Hadith. Internet allows you to reach Quran and Hadith with one click, go and read.

  • #2
    Do you live in the west?

    There's some exaggeration in this post, but a few good points as well.
    Last edited by Stoic Believer; 27-01-20, 04:14 AM.

    Comment


    • #3
      1) Divorce is one sided, its all about women rights, they get half or more wealth of the ex-husband and they keep the children. Even if its wife fault, authorities will arrest husband. Many mean women they know they have upper hand so little things they will create chaos and report her husband.

      2) Many women are obsessed about work and career, to them it is most important, family and husband are secondary.

      3) Parents allow their daughters move far away from home for study even though they can stay home and study, they live their own at uni and get upto no good. For many women going to uni to have fun, not study!

      4) Our prophet warned us men about women and most of the women will be in hellfire.

      5) Women are becoming more like men and men becoming more like women. Women don't like to listen to their husband because this women feel its lowly thing, society brainwashed women to be independent.

      6) Feminist women want equal rights but only when it suits them.

      more coming.........stay tune.

      Comment


      • #4
        Dear brother jannah !Don’t jump on the gun and generalize that the law in the west is lenient on women . It obvious that women are suffering on the hands of men ! In Any where in the world !

        I went through the system that my ex husband dragged me to , it was complicated situation he was not practicing well , there were problems in the beginning of the marriage and I just ignored hoping he would change initially and did not want the Somali community to talk about me and my marriage in our early of the marriage . Alhamdulilaah then 5 children came , from Allah SWT.
        I thought he will change in 20 years ! His problems was depleting the family finances travelling to Somalia ,stock trading loosing borrowing credit cards,lines and lies deception . Not practicing deen .
        I worked 3 jobs and he kept abusing the money ! Then no bedroom relationship he said he was stressed. then we had a special need child from there he was disconnected I found out $250,000 line of credit against the house while the last child had heart problems and bowel and I spent years for her appointments .
        He went to Somalia in 2013 without me knowing. Then that was it !
        I told my uncles to talk to him to change or I am done he refused and gave me the Talaq.
        Upon return he refused to sell the house and divide the assets! He took all the property in Somalia! He re married young woman in Somalia.
        the man who said he had consummation issues due to debt and stress remarried .
        Our divorce was2013, then he took me to court 2014 claiming We own his debt together claiming Iam forcing hijab and deen on the children and custody it went in until 2018 until he had massive stroke !
        After 2 lawyers ! And taking oldest daughter so I don’t get help and giving her freedom! The thulm stopped after wing ill.
        Court just played between us ! Huge files wheeled in family court ! And nothing accomplished.

        He refused mediation!

        Every time he had a new case in each next court ! Child custody , his debt , house appraisal, my pension, the little registered saving plan I saved and the registered saving education plan for the children I was contributing! He just wanted everything!

        court did not help me as you are saying the system helps women . I went to about 4 masjids asking them to talk
        Last edited by Hinda; 27-01-20, 06:31 PM.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Hinda View Post
          Dear brother jannah !Don’t jump on the gun and generalize that the law in the west is lenient on women . It obvious that women are suffering on the hands of men ! In Any where in the world !
          ....

          This is a MALE ONLY forum and I have even used the tag. Fear from Allah.

          You have experienced the thing millions of men experiencing right now. I will repeat the same message. State laws on marriage will not save you. You need your marriage and divorce guarded by Islamic Law.

          Comment


          • #6
            Why is it a male Forum only ? There are women in the forum here who are participating! Can I hear from the admin to clarify this ?

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Hinda View Post
              Why is it a male Forum only ? There are women in the forum here who are participating! Can I hear from the admin to clarify this ?
              He means that this thread was posted in the male only section of the anonymous subforum.
              There is a separate women's only section.
              "Yaa Allah grant me victory, or make me die Shaheed"

              Remember how the Unbelievers plotted against thee, to keep thee in bonds, or slay thee, or get thee out (of thy home). They plot and plan, and Allah too plans; but the best of planners is Allah.
              (surah al-anfal v.30)

              Comment


              • #8
                I fear Allah and I did not insult any one just expressed my experience and how the system played in the role of solving nothing except more financial emotional turmoil!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Oh I see SubhaanaAllah I understand

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by ThisIsJannah View Post
                    1) Divorce is one sided, its all about women rights, they get half or more wealth of the ex-husband and they keep the children. Even if its wife fault, authorities will arrest husband. Many mean women they know they have upper hand so little things they will create chaos and report her husband.

                    2) Many women are obsessed about work and career, to them it is most important, family and husband are secondary.

                    3) Parents allow their daughters move far away from home for study even though they can stay home and study, they live their own at uni and get upto no good. For many women going to uni to have fun, not study!

                    4) Our prophet warned us men about women and most of the women will be in hellfire.

                    5) Women are becoming more like men and men becoming more like women. Women don't like to listen to their husband because this women feel its lowly thing, society brainwashed women to be independent.

                    6) Feminist women want equal rights but only when it suits them.

                    more coming.........stay tune.
                    Thank you. I'll agree with the points and just add my two cents:

                    1) Duluth Model is practiced in US. Their handbook specifically states that male is transgressor by default and there is no trial for male. Direct execution.

                    2) Yeah. Western family schema 2020: "Career > Kids > Whatever > That 200$ shoes > ..... > Husband."

                    3) Some guardians do not want to see it. They think like if I don't intervene, everything will be okay since we are in great modern times. But they are still responsible.

                    4) That hadith was eye opener for me also. Also clearly denoting the behaviors that can cause punishment in hellfire.

                    5) They are trying to reverse the gender norms. Strong independent women and submissive men. The new world order.

                    6) It was never about equality. Feminism is straight male hatred.
                    Last edited by muslim_one; 27-01-20, 06:53 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Didn't realize its male only
                      Last edited by Kya; 27-01-20, 06:18 PM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Hinda View Post
                        I fear Allah and I did not insult any one just expressed my experience and how the system played in the role of solving nothing except more financial emotional turmoil!
                        I see, you didn't know. It's okay. My post is still applicable to you. If you ever want to get married again 1) try to select husband with taqva & involve guardian 2) try to make sure you are guarded by Islamic law. (in most western countries you can do prenuptial agreement)

                        You can further seek discussion/help in women only section.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Dear brother jannah !Don’t jump on the gun and generalize that the law in the west is lenient on women . It obvious that women are suffering on the hands of men ! In Any where in the world !

                          I went through the system that my ex husband dragged me to , it was complicated situation he was not practicing well , there were problems in the beginning of the marriage and I just ignored hoping he would change initially and did not want the Somali community to talk about me and my marriage in our early of the marriage . Alhamdulilaah then 5 children came , from Allah SWT.
                          I thought he will change in 20 years ! His problems was depleting the family finances travelling to Somalia ,stock trading loosing borrowing credit cards,lines and lies deception . Not practicing deen .
                          I worked 3 jobs and he kept abusing the money ! Then no bedroom relationship he said he was stressed. then we had a special need child from there he was disconnected I found out $250,000 line of credit against the house while the last child had heart problems and bowel and I spent years for her appointments .
                          He went to Somalia in 2013 without me knowing. Then that was it !
                          I told my uncles to talk to him to change or I am done he refused and gave me the Talaq.
                          Upon return he refused to sell the house and divide the assets! He took all the property in Somalia! He re married young woman in Somalia.
                          the man who said he had consummation issues due to debt and stress remarried .
                          Our divorce was2013, then he took me to court 2014 claiming We own his debt together claiming Iam forcing hijab and deen on the children and custody it went in until 2018 until he had massive stroke !
                          After 2 lawyers ! And taking oldest daughter so I don’t get help and giving her freedom! The thulm stopped after falling ill.
                          Court just played between us ! Huge files wheeled in family court ! And nothing accomplished.

                          He refused mediation!

                          Every time he had a new case in each next court ! Child custody , his debt , house appraisal, my pension, the little registered saving plan I saved and the registered saving education plan for the children I was contributing! He just wanted everything!

                          court did not help me as you are saying the system helps women . I went to about 4 masjids asking them to talk to him no body did anything or approached !

                          The two white Ladies next door were helping me with the grass and the snow 7 years ago when the children were small !
                          The masjid near us no one knows if you are dead or sick ! They wouldn’t even drop your child back to the house after Quran let’s say I closed my eyes after a long night shift and just late about for half hour ! And kids standing cold looking for me !
                          In churches that my colleagues go they have after class program they help their members who are sick or had crises in life, death , any life celebrations . They are connected and know what is happening in each of their members where as the Muslim community no one is aware of what is going in our lives daily , we just pass by to say each other Asalamu aleykum and that is it!

                          Where are the imams , ustads volunteers to help the weaker Ummah women ,children and the elderly in the western Muslim diaspora. Any how that is another debate for another thread.


                          Courts settled 2018 July he did Physio now he is back to Somalia to his wife to look after him !
                          My eldest whom he took with him to live in an irony end up looking after him after he got sick .
                          Alhamdulilaah and now had returned to me this September alhamdulilaah!
                          Kids went through stress observing our fights between me and him and the weekends was a shared custody as the
                          court stayed to let them stay with him . And ofcourse so they have changed a lot getting too much freedom and not praying! Alhamdulilaah I have all five of them with me and taking control again ! I make Dua for them everyday to soften their heart ! And guide them aamen.


                          So we don’t miss his oppression financial destruction and the freedom he gave to the Daughters to remove hijab .
                          But children miss that he was the fun dad ofcourse and Iam happy they live their father and he played with them but no decipline and he had more time than me so he was the listener but now he is not the same stroke changed his personality .may Allah cure him aameen


                          So system doesn’t help only the women may be if you are on welfare and in a shelter.

                          I paid my legal fees and on top doing two night shifts and looking after the children. Paying all their costs on plus the court ordeal that he created to prove : for what that just being Iam the selfless devoted mother ! The nurse at the night shift Helping the dying and the suffering.

                          I did not care if he took all the children but he asked for child support from me because I made $30,000 more than his yearly income in each child.so why should abandon to suffer with neglect and pay him too ?


                          So in my case I prayed and was patient . Allah answered my Dua alhamdulilaah .
                          and it was almost like the forensic science and dateline suspense ! Was not sure if he would do harm. He was so angry ! I guess He thought now you lost your family but destroy her embracing you and community finding out !then she will let go of everything or will let you be and things will go on as before!

                          Allah SWT said separate kindly ! But Ahmed did not know much deen shaytan was working with him ! He had me hostage while he was going back and forth to his wife !not clearing the property so if I remarried he would have called the police saying there is man in the house . But alhamdulilaah now I have my space to get married to if I wanted .
                          So now alhamdulilaah court ended after he got sick I got my rights and he got his !

                          So please refrain saying system helps women !


                          If the system was fare they will analyze everything and see who is telling the truth and consider the 5 children involved needs and shorten the process ! But the judge and lawyer know each other and work together ! It is not an Islamic court were things are black and white .it is like a business the western courts , the better lawyer you have the more you can do thulm, they are not for muslim interest !

                          But Ahmed by passed Allah’s laws and Allah dealt with him and gave him respite in this Dunya because he was so good to his mom .


                          Any how hope you realize after reading my story that the System is corrupted and confused and treat the same women and men . It is a pure luck to get your rights by the grace of Allah aza wajal.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Salam was editing and couldn’t the previous post I know it is agsinsthr policy !?since it men’s forum dear admin just delete it all JizakaAllah kheyr

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              ...
                              Last edited by muslim_one; 30-01-20, 04:49 AM. Reason: unnecessary information

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