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Secular Humanist arguing with Zakir Naik.

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  • Secular Humanist arguing with Zakir Naik.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jc-M0mdQ_xk
    Where there are no Ulemah(Scholars) there are many Muftis.

    I
    deal System of Living for All Mankind .

  • #2
    Re: Secular Humanist arguing with Zakir Naik.

    His answer was rather weak. He says he is a Muslim, because he thought critically. But of course, when you grow up as a Muslim you will be biased in favour of it in your research. Must Muslims are Muslims, because of their upbringing. This is obvious by looking at the regional distribution of the different religions.

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    • #3
      Re: Secular Humanist arguing with Zakir Naik.

      Originally posted by Philip87 View Post
      His answer was rather weak. He says he is a Muslim, because he thought critically. But of course, when you grow up as a Muslim you will be biased in favour of it in your research. Must Muslims are Muslims, because of their upbringing. This is obvious by looking at the regional distribution of the different religions.
      And what do you have to say about the remaining 3rd of the Speakers at that Islamic convention who were born and brought up in Non-muslim families and societies ?

      Donot forget that He is also an expert on comparative religion .

      I personally know of many Muslims who were not even willing to attend the friday prayers but hang out with Christians and Hindus and knew their religion as much as they knew about Islam .

      But then they had observed the differences between them and chose what they felt was right .Many Muslims adopt the lifestyle of other communities too but then being a strict Muslim is returning back to guidelines of Islam with conviction and not b/c your Parents were one .

      With the exception of Judaism and to a large extent Hinduism other religious Groups have preachers trying to attract others into their fold .

      Which includes Muslims , Christians , Buddhists , Sikhs and there are those who force their beliefs on others like Secular Democrats and Communists with brute force .
      Where there are no Ulemah(Scholars) there are many Muftis.

      I
      deal System of Living for All Mankind .

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Secular Humanist arguing with Zakir Naik.

        But of course, when you grow up as a Muslim you will be biased in favour of it in your research. Must Muslims are Muslims, because of their upbringing. This is obvious by looking at the regional distribution of the different religions.
        Actually of what I've understood of Human physiology ...
        When matters such a religion are enforced upon you ...
        You tend to revolt against it :)

        About the regional thing ...
        Well anther point of view could be that Muslims are Muslims in Muslim Majority Areas cause they are better aware of Islam ...
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        • #5
          Re: Secular Humanist arguing with Zakir Naik.

          I thought Naik came across as very rude in that tape, and the boy asking the question showed poise in remaining polite and on the point in the fact of the abuse and evasions he was receiving.

          The fact that there are ten Muslim that were "reverts" there does nothing to disprove the main point: The vast majority of people retain the faith in which they were brought up.

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          • #6
            Re: Secular Humanist arguing with Zakir Naik.

            Originally posted by Brother Hassan View Post
            Actually of what I've understood of Human physiology ...
            When matters such a religion are enforced upon you ...
            You tend to revolt against it :)

            About the regional thing ...
            Well anther point of view could be that Muslims are Muslims in Muslim Majority Areas cause they are better aware of Islam ...
            The death penalty for apostasy might also play some role....

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            • #7
              Re: Secular Humanist arguing with Zakir Naik.

              Originally posted by Shrunk View Post
              I thought Naik came across as very rude in that tape, and the boy asking the question showed poise in remaining polite and on the point in the fact of the abuse and evasions he was receiving.

              The fact that there are ten Muslim that were "reverts" there does nothing to disprove the main point: The vast majority of people retain the faith in which they were brought up.
              Many People feel he sounds arrogant .

              But We dont know his inner feelings . There are almost a 100,000 audience and many questions , so anybody would be irritated if one Person tries to take more time by interrupting .
              Where there are no Ulemah(Scholars) there are many Muftis.

              I
              deal System of Living for All Mankind .

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              • #8
                Re: Secular Humanist arguing with Zakir Naik.

                Originally posted by Shrunk View Post
                The death penalty for apostasy might also play some role....
                Have you heard of migration ?

                If someone doesnot wish to remain a Muslim in a Land governed by the Islamic Shariah then he can migrate without disclosing the reasons behind his migration.

                The truth of the matter is a Christian has far more rights under the Islamic Shariah than a Muslim would in a land governed by secular and liberal democratic laws .
                Where there are no Ulemah(Scholars) there are many Muftis.

                I
                deal System of Living for All Mankind .

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                • #9
                  Re: Secular Humanist arguing with Zakir Naik.

                  Originally posted by Abdul-Curim View Post
                  Have you heard of migration ?

                  If someone doesnot wish to remain a Muslim in a Land governed by the Islamic Shariah then he can migrate without disclosing the reasons behind his migration.

                  The truth of the matter is a Christian has far more rights under the Islamic Shariah than a Muslim would in a land governed by secular and liberal democratic laws .
                  Did you read what you just wrote there?

                  First you admit that, if someone wants to became a Christian in an Islamic country, he must leave the country.

                  Then you say Christians have more rights in Islamic countries than Muslims do in secular countries.

                  Tell me, which secular country bans people from joining your faith? In fact, show me how a seculalr country legally restricts your ability to practice your faith in anyway. Are their any Churches or Synagogues in Mecca?

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                  • #10
                    Re: Secular Humanist arguing with Zakir Naik.

                    Originally posted by Shrunk View Post

                    Tell me, which secular country bans people from joining your faith? In fact, show me how a seculalr country legally restricts your ability to practice your faith in anyway. Are their any Churches or Synagogues in Mecca?
                    Well in my country when you wear a veil you cannot participate in the political life (if we were allowed to by Islam), you cannot be a teacher, you cannot access some important positions in the cultural life like big museums etc...
                    My Blog http://historyeyesopened.tumblr.com/ Watch out sister Nousername :o
                    Ummah forum mentality depiction by BBC (warning) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LS37SNYjg8w

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                    • #11
                      Re: Secular Humanist arguing with Zakir Naik.

                      Originally posted by Massilia View Post
                      Well in my country when you wear a veil you cannot participate in the political life (if we were allowed to by Islam), you cannot be a teacher, you cannot access some important positions in the cultural life like big museums etc...
                      For the record, I do not support bans on the veil, hijab, etc. If those bans are based on religion, then they are a violation of the principle of secularism.

                      But if the laws are based on concerns about safety, etc, then they are not a restriction of your religious rights. Secularism means that the state takes no position on issues of religion. So if there are valid reason, such as safety, security, etc for banning a veil, then it would be unfair to waive those rules for people of a particular religious group.

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                      • #12
                        Re: Secular Humanist arguing with Zakir Naik.

                        Originally posted by Shrunk View Post
                        Did you read what you just wrote there?

                        First you admit that, if someone wants to became a Christian in an Islamic country, he must leave the country.

                        Then you say Christians have more rights in Islamic countries than Muslims do in secular countries.

                        Tell me, which secular country bans people from joining your faith? In fact, show me how a seculalr country legally restricts your ability to practice your faith in anyway. Are their any Churches or Synagogues in Mecca?
                        Yes I repeat Christians and Jews have better rights in a Land ruled by the Islamic Shariah and currently there is not a single country ruled totally by the Islamic shariah .

                        I said a Christian or a Jew not an Apostate . As an Apostate could pose a serious security risk to the Dar ul Islam .

                        But He is given time to reconsider his decision of leaving Islam while engaging in discussions with Islamic Scholars but if He has made up his mind and not interested to revert back then for his own safety He may migrate to a Christian , Jewish or Secular liberal Country .

                        Secular Countries in Europe ban Muslims from wearing the hijab in schools and universities , some have banned the Niqab(faceveil) , some have banned the Minarets ( which is not an integral part of a Masjid btw , but a clear sign of hatred for Islam ), some are contemplating banning halal slaughtered meat , some are deliberately provoking through cartoons and publishing books and presenting documentaries which are blatantly anti-Islamic .

                        And in America a Muslim in general cannot take a break from work to attend dhuhr , asr or magrib salat .while a Christian or a Jew has ample time off to attend the synagogue or church .Not to forget how Muslims are frisked a lot more than Non-Muslims .

                        So to say Europe and America are pseudo-secular states and infact pseudo-democratic too for prohibiting anything critical of the holocaust but encouraging anything Anti-Islamic .
                        Where there are no Ulemah(Scholars) there are many Muftis.

                        I
                        deal System of Living for All Mankind .

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Secular Humanist arguing with Zakir Naik.

                          Originally posted by Shrunk View Post
                          For the record, I do not support bans on the veil, hijab, etc. If those bans are based on religion, then they are a violation of the principle of secularism.

                          But if the laws are based on concerns about safety, etc, then they are not a restriction of your religious rights. Secularism means that the state takes no position on issues of religion. So if there are valid reason, such as safety, security, etc for banning a veil, then it would be unfair to waive those rules for people of a particular religious group.
                          Your personal opinions are insignificant as majority of the People of Netherlands , Belgium , Switzerland , France have not objected to their Govts passing laws hurting Muslims .

                          Similarly for safety and security a Land ruled by the Quran and Sunnah considers apostasy no less than treason and we know the punishment for treason in the USA .
                          Ten years since 9/11/2001 there has not been a single case of a Muslim Woman with veil being caught for attempting an act of terror anywhere across the European Union.

                          This is a hogwash meant to supress the growth of Muslim population as well as the revival of Islamic values amongst European Muslims so that they are forced to migrate back to Muslim Lands .

                          The difference between Islam and other systems and beliefs is that we do it upfront while the rest decieve and camouflage to force people to fall into their scheme of things .
                          Where there are no Ulemah(Scholars) there are many Muftis.

                          I
                          deal System of Living for All Mankind .

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Secular Humanist arguing with Zakir Naik.

                            Originally posted by Shrunk View Post
                            For the record, I do not support bans on the veil, hijab, etc. If those bans are based on religion, then they are a violation of the principle of secularism.

                            But if the laws are based on concerns about safety, etc, then they are not a restriction of your religious rights. Secularism means that the state takes no position on issues of religion. So if there are valid reason, such as safety, security, etc for banning a veil, then it would be unfair to waive those rules for people of a particular religious group.
                            how many mosques do u see in the vatican? .... heard that so many times and replied it the same way and people still dont get it.



                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Secular Humanist arguing with Zakir Naik.

                              Originally posted by Philip87 View Post
                              His answer was rather weak. He says he is a Muslim, because he thought critically. But of course, when you grow up as a Muslim you will be biased in favour of it in your research. Must Muslims are Muslims, because of their upbringing. This is obvious by looking at the regional distribution of the different religions.
                              That's funny, wonder why the most converts any faith gains is Islam, especially in the "educated, free thinking, west".

                              Truth is by nature self-evident. As soon as you remove the cobwebs of ignorance that surround it, it shines clear. - Mohandas Gandhi
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                              www.Searching-Islam.com

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