Satellites witness truth of Muhammad (pbuh)

[Mace]

Re: Satellites witness truth of Muhammad (pbuh)

To further put this in perspective, we're talking about a difference of 120m relative to the peak of the mountain. This is not a very serious issue.

The only reason it has come up is because this video makes the exaggerated claim, based on a faulty methodology, that the 3 points line up perfectly with the line going "directly through" the military camp.

The video claims the aim is perfect (and therefore I guess miraculous). I'm saying the aim is not perfect, but just very good.

[Abu 'Abdullaah]

Re: Satellites witness truth of Muhammad (pbuh)

So how did you calculate this Mace?

Also, I don't understand what you said earlier about flight plans. Surely one could just fly from point A to point B in a straight line?

[Abu Rago]

Re: Satellites witness truth of Muhammad (pbuh)

Just thought I'd let you know the Sheikh who done this research; Sheikh Zindani was the founder and former secretary-general of the Commission on Scientific Signs in the Quran and Sunnah, based in Saudi Arabia and he is a pretty clever bloke.

And who are you? If you want to discredit the Sheikhs research at least bring real proof.

Thanks.

[Mace]

Re: Satellites witness truth of Muhammad (pbuh)

So how did you calculate this Mace?

I just put the coordinates into my flight planner. I could do the calculations by hand to verify. I have not done that yet.

Also, I don't understand what you said earlier about flight plans. Surely one could just fly from point A to point B in a straight line?

Right, you would fly a straight line. But what was drawn in that video was not a straight line in reality.

[Mace]

Re: Satellites witness truth of Muhammad (pbuh)

Just thought I'd let you know the Sheikh who done this research; Sheikh Zindani was the founder and former secretary-general of the Commission on Scientific Signs in the Quran and Sunnah, based in Saudi Arabia and he is a pretty clever bloke.

And who are you? If you want to discredit the Sheikhs research at least bring real proof.

Thanks.

I'm nobody really. Just someone interested in these sorts of things. And as a private pilot and someone with a background in math, this was interesting.

I'd be interested in reading about this sheikh's other work or the findings of that commission. What is his academic background?

[THHuxley]

Re: Satellites witness truth of Muhammad (pbuh)

No .. your stupid.

Actually, I'm not. But if that is the best you can do and it makes you feel better, go for it.

[THHuxley]

Re: Satellites witness truth of Muhammad (pbuh)

Let's assume your calculations are correct.

Is it possible that the shift in tectonic plates (or another geographical/ geological development) during the period of time from the life of Muhammed salAllahu alayhe wasallam to the present day, may account for the slight inaccuracy (assuming your calculations are correct) in what is witnessed today?

Well, in the first place, what does it matter? Muhammad never said the line had to be perfect. That's an invention of the film maker.

But as to tectonic shift, probably not. Mecca, Mount Deyn and San'a all rest on the same Arabian Plate and so would have all experienced the same teconic movement, meaning they would not have moved in relationship to each other.

[THHuxley]

Re: Satellites witness truth of Muhammad (pbuh)

Just thought I'd let you know the Sheikh who done this research; Sheikh Zindani was the founder and former secretary-general of the Commission on Scientific Signs in the Quran and Sunnah, based in Saudi Arabia and he is a pretty clever bloke.

Very clever and yet still often wrong.

He was, for example, the actual author of the embryology text additions that Muslims falsely try to give Keith Moore credit for. And he got almost all of those wrong, too.

This video is only one of his many scientific errors, and not by far his worst.

[THHuxley]

Re: Satellites witness truth of Muhammad (pbuh)

Also, I don't understand what you said earlier about flight plans. Surely one could just fly from point A to point B in a straight line?

Exactly. But the line drawn by Zindani would not have been that line.

The "straight line" between Sana'a and Mecca is not the line that Zaindani drew passing through the mountain peak.

[Abu 'Abdullaah]

Re: Satellites witness truth of Muhammad (pbuh)

Ah, so you are saying that If one was to draw a straight line from Sana'a to Makkah, it would not pass through the mountain as illustrated?

[THHuxley]

Re: Satellites witness truth of Muhammad (pbuh)

Ah, so you are saying that If one was to draw a straight line from Sana'a to Makkah, it would not pass through the mountain as illustrated?

Yes. If one were to draw a straight line from the Grande Mosque in Sana'a to the Kaba'a in Mecca, it would not pass through the mountain "as illustrated." It would be close. But hardly the "miracle" this video pretends.

[Al-Farooq]

Re: Satellites witness truth of Muhammad (pbuh)

I don't know. It's possible the error could have been worse 1400 years ago. How would we know? We would need precise coordinates for each of the 3 points taken 1400+ years ago. Which is obviously impossible.

But again to put this in perspective, if you're praying in the masjid, you're praying in pretty much the right direction. It's a just a small error. If the mountain had been further away, only then would be error be more significant.

But then if the mountain had been further away, they probably wouldn't have used it as a landmark.

I'm sure you can find greater errors in direction in other masjids. For that matter, some people I know here on the east coast of the US actually stubbornly pray to the SE (because that's how it looks on a typical projected map), which of course is totally wrong. They are not facing anywhere near the kabaa if they do that. But most people get it right and pray to a NE bearing from here.

Thank you for the explanation, Mace.

May Allah ta'ala guide you back to the His protection, to the noor and haq of al-Islam. Ameen.

Well, in the first place, what does it matter? Muhammad never said the line had to be perfect. That's an invention of the film maker.

But as to tectonic shift, probably not. Mecca, Mount Deyn and San'a all rest on the same Arabian Plate and so would have all experienced the same teconic movement, meaning they would not have moved in relationship to each other.

OK, thanks.

I really know very little of such matters, I am not scientifically minded in the slightest, so I appreciate the explanation.