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The original Najdi/ Wahhabi movement was more extreme in bloodshed & Takfir than ISIS

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  • #76
    Re: The original Najdi/ Wahhabi movement was more extreme in bloodshed & Takfir than

    Originally posted by Abu Sulayman View Post
    Al-salamu 'alaykum,

    how are you, dear brother?

    I've an off-topic question if you don't mind:
    What happened to the Marifah forums?
    'alaikum salam
    alhamdulillah all good
    re the forum we had some serious issues which I can't talk about openly. Hopefully we will be able to salvage it and bring it back in some form or other
    www.marifah.info

    Wahhabis Refuted
    Ash'aris

    Comment


    • #77
      Re: The original Najdi/ Wahhabi movement was more extreme in bloodshed & Takfir than

      Originally posted by Abd al-Rahman View Post
      Im not going to wade into this ethnic mess, all I know is that OP is slandering a magnificent sheikh of islam and he needs to stop
      What happened in the past is over and they will be asked of what they did and we will be asked of what we did. To 99% of the Ummah, these past events are not of any concern.

      Muhammad ibn Abdul Wahhab was a man. The Ummah is not obliged to follow him or do taqleed of him. If he said anything correct, previous Muslims have said what was correct so it's not like he is irreplaceable.


      Right now it's pretty sad OP is trying to bring his opinion on this at a time it is not going to benefit anyone and we have a rabid pack of backstabbing murderers and thieves creating chaos everywhere they go. It's like telling the Palestinians "Rohingya have it worse than you." It may be true but how on earth is it helpful? Such a foolish thing to bring in your own views which are only going to create harm and no benefit.
      Humiliating people in the name of religion is the practice of someone deprived of the first fruit of religion, humility.-Nouman Ali Khan

      Comment


      • #78
        Re: The original Najdi/ Wahhabi movement was more extreme in bloodshed & Takfir than

        Originally posted by Abd al-Rahman View Post
        Do you believe Rasullulah(saw) is everywhere or that he has knowledge of the unseen?
        Do you believe it is halal to make sajdah to other than Allah?
        Do you believe Ahlul bayt are perfect and put them above the anbiyya?
        Do you believe your sheikh can bless something and it will help you?
        Do you believe in pilgrimages to shrines?
        Do you believe the Shari'a isn't necesary anymore and khilafa is useless?
        Do you believe dancing and singing are a form of ibadah?
        Do you accept Abu Bakr(ra) as Khalifa to the Nabi(saw)?
        Do you believe Allah(swt) is above his arsh?
        Do you believe it is halal to wear an amulet for good luck?
        Do you celebrate mawlid?
        No to everything except what is underlined. Yes to what is underlined and bolded. Allah rose over the throne, this is how Nouman Ali Khan translated it and I believe Nouman Ali Khan's translation. Also, Abu Bakr RA is the best man after the Anbiya and Mursaleen so how can he not be the Khalif after Rasulullah sallahualayhiwasalam.
        Humiliating people in the name of religion is the practice of someone deprived of the first fruit of religion, humility.-Nouman Ali Khan

        Comment


        • #79
          Re: The original Najdi/ Wahhabi movement was more extreme in bloodshed & Takfir than

          Originally posted by Mustafa Mahmud View Post
          No to everything except what is underlined. Yes to what is underlined and bolded. Allah rose over the throne, this is how Nouman Ali Khan translated it and I believe Nouman Ali Khan's translation. Also, Abu Bakr RA is the best man after the Anbiya and Mursaleen so how can he not be the Khalif after Rasulullah sallahualayhiwasalam.
          Mashallah akhi you are sound in 'Aqidah. May Allah bless you and continue to guide you
          وَمَا قَدَرُوا اللَّهَ حَقَّ قَدْرِهِ وَالْأَرْضُ جَمِيعًا قَبْضَتُهُ يَوْمَ الْقِيَامَةِ وَالسَّمَاوَاتُ مَطْوِيَّاتٌ بِيَمِينِهِ ۚ سُبْحَانَهُ وَتَعَالَىٰ عَمَّا يُشْرِكُونَ
          They have not appraised Allah with true appraisal, while the earth entirely will be [within] His grip on the Day of Resurrection, and the heavens will be folded in His right hand. Exalted is He and high above what they associate with Him. (Az-Zumar: 67)

          Comment


          • #80
            Re: The original Najdi/ Wahhabi movement was more extreme in bloodshed & Takfir than

            Originally posted by Abd al-Rahman View Post
            Mashallah akhi you are sound in 'Aqidah. May Allah bless you and continue to guide you
            Please help me de with the comparative religion issue.
            Humiliating people in the name of religion is the practice of someone deprived of the first fruit of religion, humility.-Nouman Ali Khan

            Comment


            • #81
              Re: The original Najdi/ Wahhabi movement was more extreme in bloodshed & Takfir than

              Originally posted by Mustafa Mahmud View Post
              Please help me de with the comparative religion issue.
              Whats the issue?
              وَمَا قَدَرُوا اللَّهَ حَقَّ قَدْرِهِ وَالْأَرْضُ جَمِيعًا قَبْضَتُهُ يَوْمَ الْقِيَامَةِ وَالسَّمَاوَاتُ مَطْوِيَّاتٌ بِيَمِينِهِ ۚ سُبْحَانَهُ وَتَعَالَىٰ عَمَّا يُشْرِكُونَ
              They have not appraised Allah with true appraisal, while the earth entirely will be [within] His grip on the Day of Resurrection, and the heavens will be folded in His right hand. Exalted is He and high above what they associate with Him. (Az-Zumar: 67)

              Comment


              • #82
                Re: The original Najdi/ Wahhabi movement was more extreme in bloodshed & Takfir than

                Originally posted by Abd al-Rahman View Post
                Whats the issue?
                over with except I can't comment on the comparative religions section
                Humiliating people in the name of religion is the practice of someone deprived of the first fruit of religion, humility.-Nouman Ali Khan

                Comment


                • #83
                  Re: The original Najdi/ Wahhabi movement was more extreme in bloodshed & Takfir than

                  Originally posted by Mustafa Mahmud View Post
                  over with except I can't comment on the comparative religions section
                  Why?
                  وَمَا قَدَرُوا اللَّهَ حَقَّ قَدْرِهِ وَالْأَرْضُ جَمِيعًا قَبْضَتُهُ يَوْمَ الْقِيَامَةِ وَالسَّمَاوَاتُ مَطْوِيَّاتٌ بِيَمِينِهِ ۚ سُبْحَانَهُ وَتَعَالَىٰ عَمَّا يُشْرِكُونَ
                  They have not appraised Allah with true appraisal, while the earth entirely will be [within] His grip on the Day of Resurrection, and the heavens will be folded in His right hand. Exalted is He and high above what they associate with Him. (Az-Zumar: 67)

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    Re: The original Najdi/ Wahhabi movement was more extreme in bloodshed & Takfir than

                    Originally posted by Abd al-Rahman View Post
                    Why?
                    Dunno don't worry now
                    Humiliating people in the name of religion is the practice of someone deprived of the first fruit of religion, humility.-Nouman Ali Khan

                    Comment


                    • #85
                      Re: The original Najdi/ Wahhabi movement was more extreme in bloodshed & Takfir than

                      I don't know much about the original poster's beliefs. But in terms of what he's stated he seems like he's winning the argument. Everyone is crowding against him but no one is answering his points.

                      Comment


                      • #86
                        Re: The original Najdi/ Wahhabi movement was more extreme in bloodshed & Takfir than

                        Originally posted by Libyan View Post
                        I don't know much about the original poster's beliefs. But in terms of what he's stated he seems like he's winning the argument. Everyone is crowding against him but no one is answering his points.
                        That is because what he says is truth. Do you think that a lot of scholars back then just came up with the idea of making accusations against some peaceful good Imam? Why did the Ottomans send a huge army to Mecca and Medina?

                        Yet you still get people who insist that all ibn abdul Wahhab did was fight against shirk. No he fought against Devlet-i Aliye. People only joined him out of their ignorance and their greed for plunder and fighting (which was already common in those areas).

                        An Ottoman general records the Wahhabis as they enter Taif,

                        “Wahhabis took all of the things they found in Taif and piled them. They did not heed the books and threw them away into the streets. Therefore, thousands of books including Bukhari and Muslim books, other hadith books, fiqh books of four sects, books on literature, science and other books were downtrodden. There were even mushafs (Quran) among them. So many valuable books and works were trampled underfoot for a long time. Their emirs divided one fifth of the goods among themselves and the rest were divided among those savage people.”

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          Re: The original Najdi/ Wahhabi movement was more extreme in bloodshed & Takfir than

                          This was very interesting to read. Thank you OP. Lots of people mocking and putting down OP without no evidence, quite funny to see. Good muslims.

                          Comment


                          • #88
                            Re: The original Najdi/ Wahhabi movement was more extreme in bloodshed & Takfir than

                            The Wahhabiyyah attack a market near al-Basrah, kill the people there and let those who flee from them drown in the water

                            The known Wahhabi historian Ibn Bishr (d. 1288 AH) said regarding the events of the year 1212 AH:

                            وفيها في رمضان سار سعود رحمه المعبود , بالجنود المنصورة والخيل العتاق المشهورة , من جميع نواحي نجد وعربانها وقصد الشمال , وأغار على سوق الشيوخ المعروف عند البصرة , وقتل منهم قتلى كثيرة , وهرب أناس وغرقوا في الشط

                            "And in [that year] in [the month of] Ramadhan (!) Sa'ud [I. bin 'Abd al-'Aziz] - may the worshipped One have mercy upon him - set out with the victorious armies and the famous horses, from all of the areas of Najd and its [bedouin] Arabs and intended the North (i.e. 'Iraq). He attacked the known al-Shuyukh market near al-Basrah and killed many of them. The people fled and drowned in the river."

                            Source:
                            'Unwan al-Majd 1/240

                            So here we see that the Wahhabiyyah attacked a random market of a Muslim town without any reason whatsoever and killed whoever was on that market. And as if that is not enough: They ran after the poeple who tried to flee from them, so that the people had to throw themselves into the river. Then these evil criminals waited until the people drowned in the water!
                            And they did all of this in the month of Ramadhan!!!

                            Know that doing this is not even allowed against disbelievers, so what about doing this against Muslims?
                            (Our religion makes a distinction between fiqhters and non-fighers and the Jumhur of the classical scholars have mentioned that the reason for fighting is Muqatalah (fighting) and not Kufr (disbelief).)
                            Last edited by Abu Sulayman; 06-06-15, 03:24 PM.

                            Comment


                            • #89
                              Re: The original Najdi/ Wahhabi movement was more extreme in bloodshed & Takfir than

                              Ibn 'Abd al-Wahhab (d. 1206 AH): The lying Dajjal from Najd

                              He said:

                              ومعلوم: أن أهل أرضنا، وأرض الحجاز، الذي ينكر البعث منهم أكثر ممن يقر به، والذي يعرف الدين أقل ممن لا يعرفه

                              "It's known regarding the people of our land (i.e. Najd) and the land of al-Hijaz, that those among them who reject the resurrection [after death] are more than those who accept it and that those [among them] who know the religion are less than those who do not..."

                              Source: al-Durar al-Saniyyah 10/43

                              This is such a shameless lie from him and whoever believes his claim must have lost his mind.

                              Just imagine: He accuses the majority of the people of Hijaz - which by the way was full of scholars [of the Ahl al-Sunnah] at that time - and the people of his land of the rejection of the resurrection after death.
                              I mean even in our time, when ignorance regarding the religion is becoming widespread (and "Salafism" is one of the forms of this ignorance), we do not see anywhere people from the Ahl al-Qiblah rejecting the resurrection!

                              So how for God's sake can one trust this person after knowing this? How can one trust a person, who lies and deceives?!
                              And if you ask why he was lying like that, then the answer is: He was doing this so that his blind followers can attack al-Hijaz (and they attacked it more than once!).

                              And know that lying is something that some of his followers do until today:

                              So you'll see them accusing other Muslims of things that they have never done nor would ever do! Or they will interpret an action that may be even allowed in the divine law in the worst possible manner, so that they can accuse their opponent of disbelief and polytheism and this and that.

                              And what is also widespread among their Mashayikh is to deceive their followers and give them false informations regarding events of the past, other Muslims, etc. (And this unites them with the Mashayikh of the Rafidhah!)
                              Last edited by Abu Sulayman; 06-06-15, 03:02 PM.

                              Comment


                              • #90
                                Re: The original Najdi/ Wahhabi movement was more extreme in bloodshed & Takfir than

                                Originally posted by Abu Sulayman View Post
                                Ibn 'Abd al-Wahhab (d. 1206 AH): The lying Dajjal from Najd

                                He said:

                                ومعلوم: أن أهل أرضنا، وأرض الحجاز، الذي ينكر البعث منهم أكثر ممن يقر به، والذي يعرف الدين أقل ممن لا يعرفه

                                "It's known regarding the people of our land (i.e. Najd) and the land of al-Hijaz, that those among them who reject the resurrection [after death] are more than those who accept it and that those [among them] who know the religion are less than those who do not..."

                                Source: al-Durar al-Saniyyah 10/43

                                This is such a shameless lie from him and whoever believes his claim must have lost his mind.

                                Just imagine: He accuses the majority of the people of Hijaz - which by the way was full of scholars [of the Ahl al-Sunnah] at that time - and the people of his land of the rejection of the resurrection after death.
                                I mean even in our time, when ignorance regarding the religion is becoming widespread (and "Salafism" is one of the forms of this ignorance), we do not see anywhere people from the Ahl al-Qiblah rejecting the resurrection!

                                So how for God's sake can one trust this person after knowing this? How can one trust a person, who lies and deceives?!
                                And if you ask why he was lying like that, then the answer is: He was doing this so that his blind followers can attack al-Hijaz (and they attacked it more than once!).

                                And know that lying is something that some of his followers do until today:

                                So you'll see them accusing other Muslims of things that they have never done nor would ever do! Or they will interpret an action that may be even allowed in the divine law in the worst possible manner, so that they can accuse their opponent of disbelief and polytheism and this and that.

                                And what is also widespread among their Mashayikh is to deceive their followers and give them false informations regarding events of the past, other Muslims, etc. (And this unites them with the Mashayikh of the Rafidhah!)
                                Well speaking of my situation I am actually curious though I am Muslim now.


                                The entire majid I went to impressed on me a blasphemous idea of 2:62. Is started to have a feeling something was wrong but I didn't know what. One Muslim friend told me of course you are wrong and I read a hadith(or more) contradicting my belief but I was still in falsehood since I didn't have 2:62 explained.

                                I think it was when I was 16 or 17 and listening to Nouman Ali Khan or Yasir Qadhi (or both really) that it really hit me that I was wrong and I converted to the right faith that believe in Rasulullah sallahualayhiwasalam was necessary for Jannah.

                                Also later on I read the tafsir of 2:62 which completely made me firm on the truth.

                                I know this belief is kufr by consensus but it incredibly widespread in the West and I would say at least half of all Muslims in America believe this blasphemous falsehood due to ignorance.

                                Good to know how serious it is. But here you can even find Muslims who don't know pork is haram, kids who don't know what la ilaha ilalllah means or who Rasulullah sallahualayhiwasalam is!!!
                                Humiliating people in the name of religion is the practice of someone deprived of the first fruit of religion, humility.-Nouman Ali Khan

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