بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم
First of all, I should warn that this is a theological discussion/debate primarily between myself and my interlocutor TheHaqq in the realm of Ilm al-Kalam, and if you are not accustomed to the terminology etc. then most of this discussion will not make much sense or be accessible to you. I am simply refuting some false philosophical notions that certain people hold - these and other abstract issues do not need to be understood by most Muslims, who by default will never think about such things in their entire lives, just like most of the Sahabah.
For those unaccustomed to Kalam, just know that is Allah is not like anything else, he is absolutely unlike his creation etc. He is the one, and he is unique. We cannot imagine Allah. We affirm for him what he has affirmed in the Qur'an and negate for him what he has negated (any similarity to his creation). We do not try and imagine how Allah - our limited minds cannot comprehend him. That is pretty much all I am proving to my interlocutor.
I do not want someone to get confused by the back and forth between me and the brother, so I reiterate that the vast majority of people, who do not understand these issues should not be reading this thread. It is particularly due to the nature of Kalam, that a large group of Sunni Muslims, the Hanbalis, historically prohibited it.
Others such as Imam Shafi'i said that there must always be a group who learns these doctrines to refute heresy and disbelief, but that such debates with the heretics/disbelievers should take place in private, away from the common people unaccustomed to such terminology and who are unaccustomed to and uneducated in this style of thinking (slow, methodical, extremely dangerous if you make the slightest error*).
I think Kalam is useful and should be taught to people exposed to heretical/philosophical thinking, especially in this day and age, but this is not a teaching session. Go and watch this lecture or this series on Aqeedah Sanusiyyah if you want a qualified student of knowledge/ scholar to teach you Kalam etc.
* Dangerous for two reasons. 1) Islam is the truth and conforms wholly to reason, so if you err in rational thinking, then you enter the realm of innovation or at worse disbelief. 2) If you start teaching false proofs for the truth (e.g. the like of the ontological arguments of westerners and egyptian intellectuals that the Mutakallimun such as Shaykh Mustafa Sabri refuted and that foolish people like Mufti Abu Layth tries advocating today), then down the line it will cause some people, of weak iman and lack of will to reason, to question their faith when they realise the nature of such proofs.
First of all, I should warn that this is a theological discussion/debate primarily between myself and my interlocutor TheHaqq in the realm of Ilm al-Kalam, and if you are not accustomed to the terminology etc. then most of this discussion will not make much sense or be accessible to you. I am simply refuting some false philosophical notions that certain people hold - these and other abstract issues do not need to be understood by most Muslims, who by default will never think about such things in their entire lives, just like most of the Sahabah.
For those unaccustomed to Kalam, just know that is Allah is not like anything else, he is absolutely unlike his creation etc. He is the one, and he is unique. We cannot imagine Allah. We affirm for him what he has affirmed in the Qur'an and negate for him what he has negated (any similarity to his creation). We do not try and imagine how Allah - our limited minds cannot comprehend him. That is pretty much all I am proving to my interlocutor.
I do not want someone to get confused by the back and forth between me and the brother, so I reiterate that the vast majority of people, who do not understand these issues should not be reading this thread. It is particularly due to the nature of Kalam, that a large group of Sunni Muslims, the Hanbalis, historically prohibited it.
Others such as Imam Shafi'i said that there must always be a group who learns these doctrines to refute heresy and disbelief, but that such debates with the heretics/disbelievers should take place in private, away from the common people unaccustomed to such terminology and who are unaccustomed to and uneducated in this style of thinking (slow, methodical, extremely dangerous if you make the slightest error*).
I think Kalam is useful and should be taught to people exposed to heretical/philosophical thinking, especially in this day and age, but this is not a teaching session. Go and watch this lecture or this series on Aqeedah Sanusiyyah if you want a qualified student of knowledge/ scholar to teach you Kalam etc.
* Dangerous for two reasons. 1) Islam is the truth and conforms wholly to reason, so if you err in rational thinking, then you enter the realm of innovation or at worse disbelief. 2) If you start teaching false proofs for the truth (e.g. the like of the ontological arguments of westerners and egyptian intellectuals that the Mutakallimun such as Shaykh Mustafa Sabri refuted and that foolish people like Mufti Abu Layth tries advocating today), then down the line it will cause some people, of weak iman and lack of will to reason, to question their faith when they realise the nature of such proofs.
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