Seeking intercession with the Prophet (s): Its ruling according to classical scholars

[Bolt]

this thread is just degenerate now.

[aMuslimForLife]

A good series of short lectures / videos regarding Tawassul and connected issues

Lecture 2a Intro and the Prophet as a direct means of obtaining benefit

Lecture 2b Life of the Prophets in their Graves

Lecture 2c Hearing of the Prophet Allah bless him and give him peace

Lecture 2d Evidence for requesting dua from the Prophet Allah bless him and give him peace

Lecture 2e Incidents of the Early Muslims calling out to the Prophet Allah bless him and give him

Lecture 2f Sunni Madhabs on seeking help from the Prophet Allah bless him and give him peace

Lecture 2g Requesting dua from the Prophet from a distance

Lecture 2h The Salafi Wahabi viewpoint on requesting dua from the Prophet

Lecture 2i Shaykh Abd al Hayy al Kattani incident of Istighatha

There are also other beneficial videos from the same channel regarding connected issues, which I'll insha`Allah also post here.

These are excellent.

[Fais]

What some people say, as knowledgable and pious as they may be, doesn't automatically become shariah. Their statements can be accepted or rejected.

Oh no, you didn't. C'mon man .. there's still some fight left in you. What you giving up for?




So thread was the reason you were triggered ...

[Abu Sulayman]

Table of contents (16-11-2020):


- OP: Summary of its ruling by 'Allama 'Abd al-Rahman bin Muhammad al-Mashhur (d. 1320 AH) and 'Allama Muhammad bin Sulayman al-Kurdi (d. 1194 AH)

- Some proofs from the Qur`an al-karim and the Sunna regarding the permissibility of seeking intercession with the Prophet ﷺ

- MIAW's son admitting that the main reason why they killed Muslims was the issue of seeking intercession, which the classical scholars allowed!
- Is the simple asking for intercession condemned in the Qur`an as polytheism? (part 1)
- Is the simple asking for intercession condemned in the Qur`an as polytheism? (part 2)

- Imam Malik's (d. 179 AH) response to al-Mansur (d. 158 AH): Rather face him and seek his intercession!

- Imam 'Abdullah bin al-Mubarak (d. 181 AH), Imam Ahmad bin Hanbal (d. 241 AH), Imam al-Nawawi (d. 676 AH) and other scholars from the Salaf and Khalaf ACTED UPON the Hadith "O slaves of Allah! Help me!"
- One of the supporting routes of the narration "O slaves of Allah! Help me!"

- Imam Ibn Abi Dunya (d. 281 AH): The Salaf acted upon the Hadith of the blind man and performed Tawassul!

- Imam al-Mawardi [al-Shafi'i] (d. 450 AH) recommends visitation of the blessed grave and seeking intercession through the Prophet ﷺ
- Imam al-Ghazali [al-Shafi'i] (d. 505 AH) recommends seeking intercession through the Prophet ﷺ
- Imam Ibn al-Salah [al-Shafi'i] (d. 643 AH) regards the fullfillment of one’s needs when one performs Tawassul with the Prophet ﷺ among the miracles (Mu'jizat) that Allah granted to our Prophet ﷺ
- Imam al-Nawawi [al-Shafi'i] (d. 676 AH) recommends seeking intercession through the Prophet ﷺ and mentions that this is the position of his Shafi'i colleagues in general!
- Imam Kamal al-Din Ibn al-Zamlakani [al-Shafi'i] (d. 727 AH) seeks intercession with the Prophet ﷺ in poetry
- Imam Taqi al-Din al-Subki [al-Shafi'i] (d. 756 AH): The permissibility and goodness of performing Tawassul, Istighatha and Tashaffu' with the best of creation ﷺ
- Scholarly support for the work Shifa` al-Siqam of Imam Taqi al-Din al-Subki (d. 756 AH)
- Imam Ibn Hajar al-'Asqalani [al-Shafi'i] (d. 852 AH) asking the Prophet ﷺ for intercession in his poetry (+ his comment on the Tawassul of 'Umar through al-'Abbas, may Allah be pleased with them)
- Imam Taqi al-Din al-Hisni [al-Shafi'i] (d. 829 AH) on seeking aid with the Prophet ﷺ
- Imam al-Samhudi [al-Shafi'i] (d. 911 AH) on Tawassul, Tashaffu' and Istighatha
- Shaykh al-Islam Zakariyya al-Ansari [al-Shafi'i] (d. 926 AH) recommends seeking intercession through the Prophet ﷺ
- Imam al-Qastallani [al-Shafi'i] (d. 923 AH) on Tawassul, Tashaffu' and Istighatha (+ his own experience)
- Imam Ibn Hajar al-Haytami [al-Shafi'i] (d. 974 AH) regarding Tawassul, Tashaffu' and Istighatha with the Prophet ﷺ
- Imam Shihab al-Din al-Ramli [al-Shafi'i] (d. 957 AH) and his son Imam Shams al-Din al-Ramli [al-Shafi'i] (d. 1004 AH) regarding the seeking of aid with the Prophet ﷺ by saying "Ya Rasulullah!"

- Imam Ibn 'Aqil [al-Hanbali] (d. 513 AH) recommends seeking intercession with the Prophet ﷺ
- Imam 'Abd al-Qadir al-Jilani [al-Hanbali] (d. 561 AH) recommends seeking intercession with the Prophet ﷺ
- Imam Ibn Qudama al-Maqdisi [al-Hanbali] (d. 620 AH) recommends seeking intercession with the Prophet ﷺ (+ recommendation to act on the Hadith of bling man when in need)
- Imam Yahya bin Yusuf al-Sarsari [al-Hanbali] (d. 656 AH) seeks intercession with the Prophet ﷺ in his poetry

- Imam 'Abdullah bin Mahmud bin Mawdud al-Mawsili [al-Hanafi] (d. 683 AH) recommends seeking intercession with the Prophet ﷺ

- Imam Ibn Taymiyya (d. 728 AH) ADMITTING that the Hadith of the blind man was acted upon by the Salaf al-salih and that Imam Ahmad (d. 241 AH) permitted Tawassul!
- Ibn Taymiyya's (d. 728 AH) exact position on Tawassul and Tashaffu'
- Who was the [leader of] state and who were the scholars who stood against Ibn Taymiyya's (d. 728 AH) abnormal Fatawa?
- Imam al-Jazari [al-Shafi'i] (d. 711 AH) and Imam al-Tufi [al-Hanbali] (d. 716 AH): On seeking aid with the best of creation ﷺ and responding to Ibn Taymiyya's (d. 728 AH) objections

- Famous incident that proves silent consensus (Ijma' sukuti) among the Sahabat al-kiram - radhiallahu 'anhum ajma'in - on the issue of Tawassul bil Dhat
(+ supporting evidences) (+ correction of mistranslation)

- A good series of short lectures / videos regarding Tawassul and connected issues


To be continued insha`Allah...

[faqir]

May Allah reward your efforts Abu Sulayman. You should consider compiling these posts on a blog somewhere also as many of the quotes are not available elsewhere in English.

[TheHaqq]

So in summary, what even Ibn Taymiyyah considered haraam or bidah, the najdis considered major shirk and made mass takfeer over it and killed muslims as a result of it.

[Abu 'Abdullaah]

May Allah reward your efforts Abu Sulayman. You should consider compiling these posts on a blog somewhere also as many of the quotes are not available elsewhere in English.

wahhabisrefuted?

-_-

[faqir]

Library Chat #14: On the Najdī Dawah (and the Issue of Istighātha) | Shaykh Dr. Yasir Qadhi



https://www.youtube.com/watch?fbclid...ature=youtu.be

[BintFulaan]

May Allah reward your efforts Abu Sulayman. You should consider compiling these posts on a blog somewhere also as many of the quotes are not available elsewhere in English.

I think that would be beneficial insha'Allah. Perhaps Telegram would be a good outlet too. It's very easy to find posts through the search function. And you can set functions so people can't respond or like posts. It's only one sided from what I'v seen so far. And Allah knows best.

[AbuNajm]

Imam Ibn Qudama al-Maqdisi [al-Hanbali] (d. 620 AH) recommends seeking intercession with the Prophet ﷺ

He said in his famous al-Mughni 3/478 - 488 (or see HERE) the following in the context of the visitation (he mentioned in the beginning of the section that the visitation of the Prophetic grave is desirable ("وَيُسْتَحَبُّ زِيَارَةُ قَبْرِ النَّبِيِّ - صَلَّى اللَّهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ")):

اللَّهُمَّ إنَّك قُلْت وَقَوْلُك الْحَقُّ: {وَلَوْ أَنَّهُمْ إِذْ ظَلَمُوا أَنْفُسَهُمْ جَاءُوكَ فَاسْتَغْفَرُوا اللَّهَ وَاسْتَغْفَرَ لَهُمُ الرَّسُولُ لَوَجَدُوا اللَّهَ تَوَّابًا رَحِيمًا} [النساء: 64] . وَقَدْ أَتَيْتُك مُسْتَغْفِرًا مِنْ ذُنُوبِي، مُسْتَشْفِعًا بِك إلَى رَبِّي، فَأَسْأَلُك يَا رَبِّ أَنْ تُوجِبَ لِي الْمَغْفِرَةَ، كَمَا أَوْجَبْتهَا لِمَنْ أَتَاهُ فِي حَيَاتِهِ، اللَّهُمَّ اجْعَلْهُ أَوَّلَ الشَّافِعِينَ، وَأَنْجَحَ السَّائِلِينَ، وَأَكْرَمَ الْآخَرِينَ وَالْأَوَّلِينَ، بِرَحْمَتِك يَا أَرْحَمَ الرَّاحِمِينَ

O Allah, You spoke and your saying is the truth: { If they had only, when they were unjust to themselves, come unto thee and asked Allah's forgiveness, and the Messenger had asked forgiveness for them, they would have found Allah indeed Oft-returning, Most Merciful } [4:64].
So I've come to you, asking [my Lord] for forgiveness for my sin and seeking intercession through you unto my Lord.
So I ask you, o Lord, that you grant me forgiveness just like you granted it to the one who came to him during his life.
O Allah, grant to him that he be the first of the intercessors, the most successful of those who ask, and the most honorable of the first and the last, through Your Mercy - o Most Merciful of the Merciful!.
- end of quote -

Why did you leave out the part where 'Ibn Qudaamah says:

وَإِذَا حَجَّ الَّذِي لَمْ يَحُجَّ قَطُّ - يَعْنِي مِنْ غَيْرِ طَرِيقِ الشَّامِ - لَا يَأْخُذُ عَلَى طَرِيقِ الْمَدِينَةِ، لِأَنِّي أَخَافُ أَنْ يَحْدُثَ بِهِ حَدَثٌ، فَيَنْبَغِي أَنْ يَقْصِدَ مَكَّةَ مِنْ أَقْصَرِ الطُّرُقِ، وَلَا يَتَشَاغَلَ بِغَيْرِهِ.

"And when the one who performs Hajj has not done so before, in other words, aside from the road from ash-Shaam, he should not take preoccupy himself with the road to al-Madinah because I fear that through it will take place an innovation [Hadath]. So, one ought to set out for Makkah from the shortest of routes and not preoccupy himself with anything else..."

Of course this Tawassul mentioned by 'Ibn Qudaamah is remarkably different from the type promoted by the others in your list like ar-Ramli, the Subkis, and others among the Asha'irah and Sufiyyah, who were extreme in their Tawassul and it rose to the level of Shirk.

Again, it's a shame that the ignorant people on this forum can't see your propaganda for what it is- shameless up-selling of the extremist Sufi and Ash'ari agenda.

Comment: The above is supported by the very words of the Messenger of Allah ﷺ himself as found in the Hadith of the blind man (which is not just authentic by agreement, but also GENERAL in wording such that it applies to ALL times), so attacking the above recommendation - as done by some innovators and heretics in our time - is attacking the divine law in itself. As for declaring a Muslim - who acts upon the above recommendation - a polytheist, then this is disbelief in itself, because it means that one regards Islam as disbelief.

'Ibn Qudaamah said visiting the grave of the Prophet SAWS, without setting out for it or making the journey longer for it, is "recommended". He did not also recommend acting upon the report of al-'Utbi which contains the incident of the Bedouin and the Du'a. It is dishonest to leave this impression for ignorant readers on this forum.

Opposition to a "recommendation" NOT based on explicit Sunnah of the Prophet SAWS, but rather actions arrived at by 'Ijtihaad among the later generations, does not constitute "Kufr" by any principle of Ahl as-Sunnah.

This is, yet again, another example of the extremist Sufi/Ash'ari position in regards to the matter of Tawassul. You have done nothing but distort the "permission" by some scholars with specific criteria and the "recommendation" by others, again within very specific boundaries, and turn it into a wash with the extremism in Tawassul promoted by other scholars who were CLEARLY MISGUIDED in the subject of Tawassul.

[AbuNajm]

So in summary, what even Ibn Taymiyyah considered haraam or bidah, the najdis considered major shirk and made mass takfeer over it and killed muslims as a result of it.

No, there are different forms of Tawassul- some of which 'Ibn Taymiyyah clearly identified as constituting Shirk, some which he identified as constituting Bid'ah leading to Shirk, some which he identified as obligatory, and some which he identified as prohibited, some of which he identified as permissible. In summary- there are several different forms of Tawassul. There is not a single ruling dealing with the entire subject.

The Ash'aris and Sufis love to conflate all these different forms of Tawassul in order to confuse laypeople into thinking that certain scholars weren't as opposed to specific forms of it.

[AbuNajm]

wahhabisrefuted?

-_-

All these ridiculous distortions and severed quotes have already been compiled in Arabic all over the Sufi/Ash'ari network of forums and sites. Abu Sulayman is just plagiarizing what has been available in Arabic for over a decade. There's nothing new in this thread. All of it has also been refuted as well.

Leave it up to non-Arabic speaking laypeople to think sliced-bread with Sufi jam is a "new thing".

[Abu 'Abdullaah]

All these ridiculous distortions and severed quotes have already been compiled in Arabic all over the Sufi/Ash'ari network of forums and sites. Abu Sulayman is just plagiarizing what has been available in Arabic for over a decade. There's nothing new in this thread. All of it has also been refuted as well.

Leave it up to non-Arabic speaking laypeople to think sliced-bread with Sufi jam is a "new thing".

Oh I know that none of his points are original or clever.

He is essentially an Iraqi ‘Barelwi’ so I’m somewhat familiar with their clownish ways.

[aMuslimForLife]

Library Chat #14: On the Najdī Dawah (and the Issue of Istighātha) | Shaykh Dr. Yasir Qadhi



https://www.youtube.com/watch?fbclid...ature=youtu.be

This an excellent refutation of Wahabi innovations and their khawatij mentality...

[Abu Sulayman]

All these ridiculous distortions and severed quotes have already been compiled in Arabic all over the Sufi/Ash'ari network of forums and sites. Abu Sulayman is just plagiarizing what has been available in Arabic for over a decade. There's nothing new in this thread. All of it has also been refuted as well.

Leave it up to non-Arabic speaking laypeople to think sliced-bread with Sufi jam is a "new thing".

Yeah, and these "refutations" that you're referring to are filled with absolute ignorance and lack of basic comprehension skills just like your "refutation" above!

By the way: There are many more quotes, but due to time reasons I can't post them all here.

Oh I know that none of his points are original or clever.

He is essentially an Iraqi ‘Barelwi’ so I’m somewhat familiar with their clownish ways.

Whatever you say! I'm glad that you've finally acknowledged that you're a troll mod by writing it under your name. And trolls need to be ignored!