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  • #31
    Originally posted by LailaTheMuslim View Post


    When and where did I do this? This comment isn't based on truth, at all. Its shocking to see people who claim to have knowledge behave in such an unprincipled way.
    I've explained what is wrong with your completely false opinions and thoughts every time we've engaged in discussion.

    You've chosen to ignore what doesn't agree with your personal opinion. Don't play the victim now.

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by AbuNajm View Post

      I've explained what is wrong with your completely false opinions and thoughts every time we've engaged in discussion.

      You've chosen to ignore what doesn't agree with your personal opinion. Don't play the victim now.
      No you haven't, actually my discussions with you have been civil until now. Why are you making things up? Its ironic that you're accusing me of playing the victim.
      وَاقْصِدْ فِي مَشْيِكَ وَاغْضُضْ مِن صَوْتِكَ ۚ إِنَّ أَنكَرَ الْأَصْوَاتِ لَصَوْتُ الْحَمِيرِ - 31:19

      And be moderate in your pace and lower your voice; indeed, the most disagreeable of sounds is the voice of donkeys."


      أَلَمْ تَرَوْا أَنَّ اللَّهَ سَخَّرَ لَكُم مَّا فِي السَّمَاوَاتِ وَمَا فِي الْأَرْضِ وَأَسْبَغَ عَلَيْكُمْ نِعَمَهُ ظَاهِرَةً وَبَاطِنَةً ۗ وَمِنَ النَّاسِ مَن يُجَادِلُ فِي اللَّهِ بِغَيْرِ عِلْمٍ وَلَا هُدًى وَلَا كِتَابٍ مُّنِيرٍ - 31:20

      Do you not see that Allah has made subject to you whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth and amply bestowed upon you His favors, [both] apparent and unapparent? But of the people is he who disputes about Allah without knowledge or guidance or an enlightening Book [from Him].


      Please take a look at my travel booking website : https://destinationfindertravel.com/

      Please take a look at my blog : http://thinkingmuslima.blogspot.co.uk/

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by LailaTheMuslim View Post

        No you haven't, actually my discussions with you have been civil until now. Why are you making things up? Its ironic that you're accusing me of playing the victim.
        You said this is not a "Fiqh debate", when it is.

        Someone stated that the "long-term" Jinn-afflicted members of this forum are dealing with the same as what the Prophet and Messengers, peace be upon them, dealt with. Then they suggested that the judgment of these members should not be judged any differently than the judgment of the Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him, since he was once stricken with Sihr.

        This person wrongly quoted a verse of the Quran and a Hadith as "evidence" for this absolutely ridiculous perspective. They referred to someone else as "ignorant" for thinking differently than her.

        I responded with the appropriate amount of derision and disgust for this type of abuse and mockery of the Quran and Sunnah while I provided authoritative explanations for the verse and Hadith in contradiction to what was being misunderstood from them.

        And your equally ridiculous response is to defend this arrogant, ignorant person and accuse me of not being "qualified" to discuss Fiqh.

        You don't even know enough about Fiqh or its sciences to recognize when someone is qualified or not.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by AbuNajm View Post

          You said this is not a "Fiqh debate", when it is.

          Someone stated that the "long-term" Jinn-afflicted members of this forum are dealing with the same as what the Prophet and Messengers, peace be upon them, dealt with. Then they suggested that the judgment of these members should not be judged any differently than the judgment of the Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him, since he was once stricken with Sihr.

          This person wrongly quoted a verse of the Quran and a Hadith as "evidence" for this absolutely ridiculous perspective. They referred to someone else as "ignorant" for thinking differently than her.

          I responded with the appropriate amount of derision and disgust for this type of abuse and mockery of the Quran and Sunnah while I provided authoritative explanations for the verse and Hadith in contradiction to what was being misunderstood from them.

          And your equally ridiculous response is to defend this arrogant, ignorant person and accuse me of not being "qualified" to discuss Fiqh.

          You don't even know enough about Fiqh or its sciences to recognize when someone is qualified or not.
          I'm done, no-one deserves to be mocked and treated derisively for not taking Abu Abdullah's annoying trolling seriously.

          And I don't think the sister was equating anyone's personality or honour next to our beloved Nabi (salAllahu Aleyhi wa salam).

          You are exaggerating her point to attack her. What could even motivate someone to act in the manner you've acted here?

          وَاقْصِدْ فِي مَشْيِكَ وَاغْضُضْ مِن صَوْتِكَ ۚ إِنَّ أَنكَرَ الْأَصْوَاتِ لَصَوْتُ الْحَمِيرِ - 31:19

          And be moderate in your pace and lower your voice; indeed, the most disagreeable of sounds is the voice of donkeys."


          أَلَمْ تَرَوْا أَنَّ اللَّهَ سَخَّرَ لَكُم مَّا فِي السَّمَاوَاتِ وَمَا فِي الْأَرْضِ وَأَسْبَغَ عَلَيْكُمْ نِعَمَهُ ظَاهِرَةً وَبَاطِنَةً ۗ وَمِنَ النَّاسِ مَن يُجَادِلُ فِي اللَّهِ بِغَيْرِ عِلْمٍ وَلَا هُدًى وَلَا كِتَابٍ مُّنِيرٍ - 31:20

          Do you not see that Allah has made subject to you whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth and amply bestowed upon you His favors, [both] apparent and unapparent? But of the people is he who disputes about Allah without knowledge or guidance or an enlightening Book [from Him].


          Please take a look at my travel booking website : https://destinationfindertravel.com/

          Please take a look at my blog : http://thinkingmuslima.blogspot.co.uk/

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by LailaTheMuslim View Post

            I'm done, no-one deserves to be mocked and treated derisively for not taking Abu Abdullah's annoying trolling seriously.
            Melodramatic much?

            Originally posted by LailaTheMuslim View Post
            And I don't think the sister was equating anyone's personality or honour next to our beloved Nabi (salAllahu Aleyhi wa salam).
            Then we'll chalk that up to yet another thing you defended without understanding.

            Originally posted by LailaTheMuslim View Post
            You are exaggerating her point to attack her. What could even motivate someone to act in the manner you've acted here?
            Unfortunately, ridiculous assertions like the ones she made don't require exaggeration to demonstrate their absurdity. I just broke it down to a kindergarten level so you could understand it. Now that you understand her ridiculous point, you think it's "exaggeration" on my part.

            Wow.

            What could motivate me to respond the way I have? How about Gheerah for the Deen. You should grow some...

            Comment


            • #36
              Looks like someone is deeply triggered lol
              شَكَوْتُ إلَى وَكِيعٍ سُوءَ حِفْظِي
              فَأرْشَدَنِي إلَى تَرْكِ المعَاصي
              وَأخْبَرَنِي بأَنَّ العِلْمَ نُورٌ
              ونورُ الله لا يهدى لعاصي

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by AbuNajm View Post

                You said this is not a "Fiqh debate", when it is.

                Someone stated that the "long-term" Jinn-afflicted members of this forum are dealing with the same as what the Prophet and Messengers, peace be upon them, dealt with. Then they suggested that the judgment of these members should not be judged any differently than the judgment of the Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him, since he was once stricken with Sihr.

                This person wrongly quoted a verse of the Quran and a Hadith as "evidence" for this absolutely ridiculous perspective. They referred to someone else as "ignorant" for thinking differently than her.

                I responded with the appropriate amount of derision and disgust for this type of abuse and mockery of the Quran and Sunnah while I provided authoritative explanations for the verse and Hadith in contradiction to what was being misunderstood from them.

                And your equally ridiculous response is to defend this arrogant, ignorant person and accuse me of not being "qualified" to discuss Fiqh.

                You don't even know enough about Fiqh or its sciences to recognize when someone is qualified or not.
                First of all I didn't ask you for an arabic lesson or a tafsir lesson, if I wanted that I have plenty of real people of knowledge to ask. Not self taught abu so and so's online. And I have asked them about this topic. Your entire post just shows how little practical experience you have with jinn posession, sihr and evil eye cases, it would be a waste of time to explain anything since we disagree on the very basics.

                You stick to your idea of satanic whisperings and stick to agreeing with everything Abu Abdullah says. I'll stick to what i've heard the people with knowledge who are qualified say.
                ​​​​​​
                Accusing me of mockery of the quran just because I disagree with you is accusing me of something major. You will answer for that on the day of judgement. You keep telling everyone "you don't know this and you don't know that", Who are you really? You can never bring yourself to say "I don't know" and because of that you will never get anywhere. I don't mind admitting when I don't know something. I know enough to know when someone is qualified and I know that person is not you. Plenty of people have called you out on this before.

                ​​​​​​It's hilarious that you call me arrogant, have you taken a look at yourself lately. Your manners are disgusting, look how you talk to the other sister in islam, telling her to grow some. Is that what all your years of learning have taught you? All the learning you claim to have done and this is all you have to show for it?

                Me and laila don't share an IP, accusing someone of this is not allowed on the forum. she has basic common sense and good character, that's what you find so strange.

                All I can end with is may Allah guide away from arrogance and soften your heart. What else can we do but make dua. Your situation is really sad. You're the perfect example of everything knowledge should not turn someone into.
                شَكَوْتُ إلَى وَكِيعٍ سُوءَ حِفْظِي
                فَأرْشَدَنِي إلَى تَرْكِ المعَاصي
                وَأخْبَرَنِي بأَنَّ العِلْمَ نُورٌ
                ونورُ الله لا يهدى لعاصي

                Comment


                • #38
                  I never claimed the prophets were possessed by jinn or that they did or could ever lose their senses nor did I compare the average people today with prophets. My point was the affect of sihr or jinn is not always insanity, neither do jinn even have the ability to control a righteous individual. Of course, my point was almost entirely missed amd exaggerated into something else.
                  شَكَوْتُ إلَى وَكِيعٍ سُوءَ حِفْظِي
                  فَأرْشَدَنِي إلَى تَرْكِ المعَاصي
                  وَأخْبَرَنِي بأَنَّ العِلْمَ نُورٌ
                  ونورُ الله لا يهدى لعاصي

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post

                    First of all I didn't ask you for an arabic lesson or a tafsir lesson, if I wanted that I have plenty of real people of knowledge to ask. Not self taught abu so and so's online. And I have asked them about this topic. Your entire post just shows how little practical experience you have with jinn posession, sihr and evil eye cases, it would be a waste of time to explain anything since we disagree on the very basics.

                    You stick to your idea of satanic whisperings and stick to agreeing with everything Abu Abdullah says. I'll stick to what i've heard the people with knowledge who are qualified say.
                    ​​​​​​
                    Accusing me of mockery of the quran just because I disagree with you is accusing me of something major. You will answer for that on the day of judgement. You keep telling everyone "you don't know this and you don't know that", Who are you really? You can never bring yourself to say "I don't know" and because of that you will never get anywhere. I don't mind admitting when I don't know something. I know enough to know when someone is qualified and I know that person is not you. Plenty of people have called you out on this before.

                    ​​​​​​It's hilarious that you call me arrogant, have you taken a look at yourself lately. Your manners are disgusting, look how you talk to the other sister in islam, telling her to grow some. Is that what all your years of learning have taught you? All the learning you claim to have done and this is all you have to show for it?

                    Me and laila don't share an IP, accusing someone of this is not allowed on the forum. she has basic common sense and good character, that's what you find so strange.

                    All I can end with is may Allah guide away from arrogance and soften your heart. What else can we do but make dua. Your situation is really sad. You're the perfect example of everything knowledge should not turn someone into.
                    Maashaa Allaah beautiful said

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                      ...You stick to your idea of satanic whisperings and stick to agreeing with everything Abu Abdullah says...
                      You keep pushing this and it couldn't be further from the truth. We've had a few disagreements in the past. Just because we agree on a lot of things, you're trying to make out lie there is some kind of conspiracy.

                      Nothing but inflammatory comments.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                        First of all I didn't ask you for an arabic lesson or a tafsir lesson, if I wanted that I have plenty of real people of knowledge to ask. Not self taught abu so and so's online.
                        When you post incorrect information about Islam, whether about an Ayah or a Hadith, then it is a requirement for those who know to correct you. It shouldn't matter how a person has acquired knowledge from Tafsir or Arabic. What is important is for you to accept that you don't know and to stop trying to spread false information about Islam.

                        Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                        And I have asked them about this topic.
                        Then you should have posted what they said and not your own interpretation.

                        Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                        Your entire post just shows how little practical experience you have with jinn posession, sihr and evil eye cases, it would be a waste of time to explain anything since we disagree on the very basics.
                        You don't disagree with me. Your disagreement is with the scholars of Islam that I quoted and translated. And you're right- it is a waste of time trying to correct someone who thinks they're correct when they couldn't be more wrong. However, my time is not wasted if it means demonstrating to others where you are wrong and why. Perhaps, someone else won't make the same mistakes you're making.

                        Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                        You stick to your idea of satanic whisperings and stick to agreeing with everything Abu Abdullah says. I'll stick to what i've heard the people with knowledge who are qualified say.
                        Unlike you, I've quoted scholars for 99% of what I've said about any given topic in Islam. Just because you say you've "heard" people of knowledge, it is clear from your posts that you haven't understood them.

                        Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                        Accusing me of mockery of the quran just because I disagree with you is accusing me of something major. You will answer for that on the day of judgement.
                        Again, you have some kind of delusion wherein you think you're disagreement is with me. All I do is show how what you say contradicts what scholars say. Afterwards, you do not address the quotes or your mistakes and instead make this a personal issue with me and how I approached correcting you.

                        I will certainly have to account for my self on the Day of Judgment, and that worries me often. However, I will never worry about spending time researching and translating the works of scholars in order to correct misinformation and misinterpretation about the Quran and Sunnah.

                        Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                        You keep telling everyone "you don't know this and you don't know that", Who are you really?
                        I am a well-qualified, and oftentimes paid, researcher, translator and teacher of several Islamic sciences with authorization in some of the major texts as well.

                        The work I do benefits students of knowledge, new Muslims, and fellow academics around the world.

                        Clearly, you don't seem to know that about me, though I'm not sure a person like you would even care who they are talking to from a point of anonymity and lack of responsibility for what is said.

                        Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                        You can never bring yourself to say "I don't know" and because of that you will never get anywhere. I don't mind admitting when I don't know something.
                        I have a very simple approach to discussions about Islam here and elsewhere, online and in person- if I don't know or haven't researched something, then I don't engage in the discussion.

                        So, every thread where someone asks a question about Islam and I'm not participating- it's either because I don't know the answer and haven't researched it, or I'm too busy to participate. That's a lot of threads! Just look at how long I've been a member of this forum and how many fewer posts I have compared to others of comparable time here.

                        Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                        I know enough to know when someone is qualified and I know that person is not you. Plenty of people have called you out on this before.
                        I've been on this forum for over 15 years. Perhaps people may have pointed out my lack of qualification over the years, and at some points in time, they may have been right.

                        That is no longer the case. And you don't know me or my qualifications.

                        Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                        It's hilarious that you call me arrogant, have you taken a look at yourself lately. Your manners are disgusting, look how you talk to the other sister in islam, telling her to grow some. Is that what all your years of learning have taught you? All the learning you claim to have done and this is all you have to show for it?
                        My years of learning and experience with individuals like yourself has taught me to deal with them strongly and not to hold back from exposing ignorance and arrogance. The response from such people is quite typical- they play the victim, become insulting, name-call, run away, demand credentials, lie, or, on rare occasions, actually wise up and realize they don't know what they think they do.

                        Sure, it doesn't win me a huge following, however that's just fine by me.

                        Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                        Me and laila don't share an IP, accusing someone of this is not allowed on the forum. she has basic common sense and good character, that's what you find so strange.
                        Good to know. Though, in this thread, I think you should worry more about speaking without knowledge than the rules of the forum.

                        Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                        All I can end with is may Allah guide away from arrogance and soften your heart. What else can we do but make dua. Your situation is really sad. You're the perfect example of everything knowledge should not turn someone into.
                        You can respond to why what you said is in contradiction to what the scholars have said.

                        Ameen to the Du'a. I ask the same for you. Ameen.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                          I never claimed the prophets were possessed by jinn or that they did or could ever lose their senses
                          If that is really true and wasn't the intent behind your words, then you weren't following the discussion very well when and how you responded with quotes of other discussants.

                          Abu 'Abdullaah said the following:

                          When someone talks about suffering for a long time in one thread, and in other threads they want to discuss and debate politics, is it reasonable to not take them as seriously as you normally would? I think it is.
                          To which Indefinable responded:

                          Are you trying to say that someone afflicted with black magic/possession will have a skewed perception of Politics?
                          So, from this it is clear that with his question, Abu 'Abdullaah was referring to people who "suffer for a long time" from "black magic/possession".

                          You quoted Abu 'Abdullaah and responded by saying that Ayyub, peace be upon him, and the Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him, were afflicted with "touches" from Shaytan and Sihr, respectively.

                          Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                          Why not? Whether politics or anything else. This really shows your ignorance. The prophets themselves were touched with these afflictions from shaytan. "And remember Our slave Ayub (Job), when he invoked his lord (saying): "Verily! Shaitan (satan) has touched me with distress (by losing my health) and torment (by losing my wealth)" 38:41 Ayub wasn't ill for two or three days, it was for years. Did that make his intelligence, common sense, or knowledge any less? No of course not.

                          The messenger of Allah also had sihr done on him which affected him, didn't make him any less of a person or someone whose judgement should be questioned.
                          It was narrated that ‘Aa’ishah (may Allaah be pleased with her) said: A spell was put on the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) until he imagined that he had done a thing when he had not done it. One day he made du’aa’ then he said: “Do you know that Allaah has shown me in what lies my cure? Two men came to me and one of them sat at my head and the other at my feet. One of them said to the other, ‘What is ailing the man?’ He said: ‘He has been bewitched.’ He said: “Who has bewitched him?’ He said: ‘Labeed ibn al-A’sam.’ He said, ‘With what?’ He said: ‘With a comb, the hair that is stuck to it, and the skin of pollen of a male date palm. He said: ‘Where is it?’ He said, ‘In the well of Dharwaan.’”
                          al-Bukhaari, 3268; Muslim, 2189.
                          You quoted an Ayah of the Quran and a Hadith about Prophets suffering from whispers and Sihr in defense of your point that people on this forum who suffer for a long time from black magic/possession should not have their character or opinion questioned any differently than anyone else.

                          The only reason I responded to that post, as I hadn't even participated in the thread itself, is because the apparent meaning of your words contradicted the correct meaning of the Ayah and Hadith you brought.

                          What happened to the Prophet Ayyub, peace be upon him, was not a result of black magic, possession or even an abnormal amount of whispers. It is obvious that you were relying on the English translation and an incorrect understanding of what had happened to Ayyub, since there would be no reason to use him as an example of someone afflicted by black magic, possession or whispers over a long period of time. I demonstrated how the Tafsir for that Ayah proves that it should not say "touch of Shaytan" in English and that the scholars say it refers to whispers suffered by the people around him.

                          You misunderstood that Ayah based on the English translation and falsely used it to support your own personal opinion about how to handle people who suffer from black magic, possession, or severe whispers over the long term.

                          As for the Hadith you quoted in support of your personal opinion- the Sihr done to the Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him, did not effect him as it would an average person and that is because he was Ma'suum/protected with regards to his speech and actions in the Deen. This clearly doesn't apply to anyone else except him, peace be upon him.

                          So, that Hadith also cannot be used as evidence to support your personal opinion about whether people affected over the long term with black magic, possession, or severe whispers should be engaged and held responsible for what they say about politics or the Deen.

                          Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                          nor did I compare the average people today with prophets.
                          I didn't accuse you of equating their nobility. I accused you of confusing examples of their suffering with the kind of suffering we were discussing. You made a false comparison that had no probative value in the discussion. I was concerned and intervened because, based on your usage of the Ayah and Hadith in support of your personal opinion, it is obvious to a person who knows the correct meaning that you completely misunderstood them.

                          Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                          My point was the affect of sihr or jinn is not always insanity, neither do jinn even have the ability to control a righteous individual. Of course, my point was almost entirely missed amd exaggerated into something else.
                          No. That wasn't your point. It might be your point now, but it wasn't before. Your point was clearly stated- no one has the right to judge differently people who suffer from long term black magic, possession, or severe whispers because even the Prophet, peace be upon them, suffered from it.

                          If your point was that long term suffering from black magic, possession, and severe whispers doesn't always lead to insanity, then how would a Prophetic example prove that point if you knew that they were specifically protected from that effect of those afflictions?

                          The `Ismah/protection of the Prophets, peace be upon them, does not extend to righteous people.

                          Even if we accept that was your point, then again, how would this aid the discussion about people on the forum who engage in political and Deeni discussions after admitting elsewhere that they are long term sufferers of black magic, possession, or severe whispers? Their admission to these afflictions would be an admission that they are not "righteous" and protected, according to your "new" point.

                          And, after providing your misinterpretations of the Ayah and Hadith, you state:

                          Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                          Anyone with common sense would know that whether you take someone seriously or not should depend on their character and what they say, not what illness or test they are going through, unless they are insane in which case it would be obvious, and most people with sihr and the like are not insane.
                          The problem with people who suffer from black magic, possession, or severe whispers is that it effects their hearts, intellect, and beliefs. This is well-documented by the scholars of Islam, so there's no need for you to agree or disagree. It doesn't matter what you think about this issue.

                          For that reason, sufferers of specifically these types of spiritual illnesses are not held responsible for what they do and say while suffering. The pen is lifted for them as a lack of consciousness for what they are doing or saying is a credible possibility at any given time. That is the legal side of things. Again, it doesn't matter what you think.

                          Originally posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
                          Otherwise you might as well stop taking people with diabetes or heart disease or cancer seriously as well. They're all illnesses. This is what was said about the prophet (saw) as well, the sihr that was done to him was no different than the poisoning.
                          Equating physical illnesses with spiritual ones is a huge mistake you made as well. They are nothing alike and are not treated that way in the Shari'ah either. Provide proof from the scholars that physical illness like a cold or sprained ankle are the same as suffering from black magic, possession or severe whispers. I can't even believe I have to ask that. I think everyone reading, except for you, knows proof for that doesn't exist because it's such a ridiculous assertion.

                          Also, I asked and you never provided proof for saying that the poisoning of the Prophet, peace be upon him, was "no different" than the Sihr done to him.

                          Another ridiculous assertion that I don't expect to be supported with proof.

                          With the amount of distortions you committed, whether with the Ayah or Hadith, and your inability to distinguish between physical and spiritual suffering, and then your defense of those things, I wonder if all of this isn't because of your own battles.

                          Part of me wonders if I should have taken you seriously, however, when it comes to distorting Islam and then accusing me of things- I had to make sure that your mistakes were made clear and the correct Islamic view stands apart from that.
                          Last edited by AbuNajm; 23-10-18, 07:01 AM.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Ibn al-Qayyim (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:
                            "This has been denied by some people who said that this could not have happened to him, and they thought that it was a shortcoming and a fault. But it is not as they think, rather it comes under the heading of sickness and pain that befell him; it is a kind of illness which befell him just as he was also affected by poison there is no difference between the two.

                            Al-Qaadi Iyaad said: Witchcraft is a kind of sickness which happened to him like other kinds of sickness. That cannot be denied and it does not detract from his Prophethood."
                            Zaad al-Ma'aad, 4/124
                            شَكَوْتُ إلَى وَكِيعٍ سُوءَ حِفْظِي
                            فَأرْشَدَنِي إلَى تَرْكِ المعَاصي
                            وَأخْبَرَنِي بأَنَّ العِلْمَ نُورٌ
                            ونورُ الله لا يهدى لعاصي

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by AbuNajm View Post

                              With the amount of distortions you committed, whether with the Ayah or Hadith, and your inability to distinguish between physical and spiritual suffering, and then your defense of those things, I wonder if all of this isn't because of your own battles.

                              Part of me wonders if I should have taken you seriously, however, when it comes to distorting Islam and then accusing me of things- I had to make sure that your mistakes were made clear and the correct Islamic view stands apart from that.
                              You were doing well until these personal jabs, you can't help yourself. So far I have not insulted your intelligence or ability to think. But you went and did just that.

                              Please do not tell me what I intended and what I meant with my own words. I NEVER claimed the prophets were possesed. I used the translation available that doesn't mean I got my understanding from a translation. You have a problem with using those examples as evidence because the prophets were protected individuals. That's fine. All you had to do was say that and I have plenty of other examples of 'unprotected' people who have problems with sihr/jinn who are mentally fine, able to think and in full control of themselves. Which was my whole point from the start.

                              Spiritual illnesses can and do cause physical illnesses.
                              I KNOW some people who are possessed or suffering with sihr are mentally affected as well as physically.
                              I KNOW some people become insane and are not in control of themselves. I didn't deny any of these things.
                              But to make a blanket statement that everyone with a spiritual illness "can not be taken seriously" ​​​makes no sense and isn't right. Neither have you or the OP proved that.

                              As I said many people are in full control of themselves and the only way their affliction manifests is in physical pains or nightmares or some minor thing along these lines. It's not surprising that some people don't even know they have a problem.
                              شَكَوْتُ إلَى وَكِيعٍ سُوءَ حِفْظِي
                              فَأرْشَدَنِي إلَى تَرْكِ المعَاصي
                              وَأخْبَرَنِي بأَنَّ العِلْمَ نُورٌ
                              ونورُ الله لا يهدى لعاصي

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                              • #45
                                And actually yes I did know you are a translator and a researcher, you make a point of mentioning that everywhere if you haven't noticed. That doesn't make you a scholar of any sort so you should probably think about quitting the act. I wonder if you tell your students to 'grow some' as well, and I wonder why whoever taught you didn't teach you about good character. They must have skipped that chapter.
                                شَكَوْتُ إلَى وَكِيعٍ سُوءَ حِفْظِي
                                فَأرْشَدَنِي إلَى تَرْكِ المعَاصي
                                وَأخْبَرَنِي بأَنَّ العِلْمَ نُورٌ
                                ونورُ الله لا يهدى لعاصي

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