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Do all non-Muslims go to Hell?

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    #16
    Re: Do all non-Muslims go to Hell?

    Originally posted by Hulk View Post
    It is not in our place to condemn anyone in particular to hell. That said, kafir refers to people who have been presented the truth and rejected it. So people who have never even heard of Islam then they will be excused, someone who is not of sound mind will be excused, there may be more that I don't know of.

    Please read this article http://sandala.org/wp-content/upload...sbelievers.pdf

    Allahualam
    Correct,

    And to add, the truth is not just a simple message. It is a message with practicle examples. As of today, muslims are in such a bad state that we are making people run away from Islam. If a non muslim receives a distorted message of Islam, he may be excused in the day of judgement. Imam Ghazali mentions this in his book, Fayasl al-tafriqa bayn al-Islam wa-l-zandaqa (The Criterion of Distinction between Islam and Clandestine Unbelief)

    Comment


      #17
      Re: Do all non-Muslims go to Hell?

      Originally posted by Due2MyWeakness View Post
      Correct,

      And to add, the truth is not just a simple message. It is a message with practicle examples. As of today, muslims are in such a bad state that we are making people run away from Islam. If a non muslim receives a distorted message of Islam, he may be excused in the day of judgement. Imam Ghazali mentions this in his book, Fayasl al-tafriqa bayn al-Islam wa-l-zandaqa (The Criterion of Distinction between Islam and Clandestine Unbelief)
      except one small fact

      islam is growing now faster than ever, in spite of the war against muslims, in spite of hundreds of anti-islam preachers and in spite of the excuses you mentioned

      this is Allah's deen and Allah will bring into whoever, whenever He pleases, it is not upon us to do anything except remind and warn the people, as for ourselves, we must all take into account our actions and intentions before we enter the grave
      .لا نريد زعيما يخاف البيت الإبيض
      نريد زعيما يخاف الواحد الأحد
      دولة الإسلامية باقية





      Comment


        #18
        Re: Do all non-Muslims go to Hell?

        Originally posted by gariba View Post
        you have only one brain, and one conscience. You simply do your best and explore reality.

        so, you examine the world, you read, you speak, you experience, you interact with your environment, then you draw conclusions. These conclusions you can also change, based on different experiences you have later in life, etc

        with regard to religion, many people draw different conclusions, and subscribe (with different degrees of conviction) to widely diverging sets of beliefs

        does this mean that there is no truth in religions, and that they are all equivalent ? no of course

        but it means that there is no sort of "privileged religious highway" where all people will converge, if they are not idiots or dishonest. On the contrary, people, based on their particular environment and experiences, will reach in fact widely different conclusions, and this is something we have all witnessed.

        the idea that any honest and intelligent person will automatically convert to Islam, once he is familiarized with it, is a strange idea which, in my experience, lacks any sort of evidence for it

        this idea is, in fact, quite offensive for non-muslims : if, as a non-muslim with an interest in Islam, you don't eventually convert after learning about it, you will automatically be considered as either dishonest or idiotic

        this is, in itself, not only offensive but downright dangerous : it depicts (well-informed) non-muslims as automatically dishonest or even evil. This distorted image can have then very serious consequences, in fostering hostility and contempt

        And this is the main obstacle in having a dialogue between muslims and non-muslims : where hostility and disrespect set in, and prejudices prevail (the perverted, dishonest kuffar vs. the medieval, terrorist muslims) any possibility for a dialogue disappears rapidly

        In fact, I don't think that, on this particular forum, many muslims are interested in a real dialogue; rather they aim to "instruct" those "ignorant kuffar" , and then they sound surprised if the "ignorant kuffar" don't accept their "superior knowledge"

        In fact, I don't think that you, in particular, are interested in a dialogue at all: you think you possess the truth (because you know exactly what God wants from us) and that honest, upright people should simply recognize this basic reality

        in my humble opinion, you are severely deluded : but I am sure you think the same about me.

        Best
        not too much humble in your opinion, but answer this

        your layout sounds fine for YOU, but what about society at large, you are not the end or the beginning of anything but yourself, however society demands laws, and knowledge of right and wrong, are you only concerned about your thoughts and emotions and leave off everyone else

        seems like your program of solution is very limited, if it is even a program of solution, if not, then why share it with anyone else

        man is going to follow a way, whatever that way may be, communism, socialism, darwinism, or whatever other isms man can think of

        good news is that he doesnt have to, Allah has already laid out the way
        bad news, even if islam is perfect in every aspect, man will still choose to follow other ways

        present company included
        .لا نريد زعيما يخاف البيت الإبيض
        نريد زعيما يخاف الواحد الأحد
        دولة الإسلامية باقية





        Comment


          #19
          Re: Do all non-Muslims go to Hell?

          :start:

          When the day started, you must have thought you will obey as you wished but in accordance to peace and harmony with others be it your neighbor or anyone else.But you had the position that you will not accept Islam.And on the time of judgment you will be passed by because you did good.

          But to me it does not make sense.As you don't believe in hell and heaven.But you are concerned about it.We Muslims know that we have to answer of what we did on that day.But I don't think you believe in such, then if you do.Then why not accept Islam when you are half way through accepting Islam.

          A human whom the message of Allah did not came are just like animals.Such as those people who used to live on high mountains and they passed by before the message of Allah could come to them.Their judgment is left in the hands of Allah.As they did accordingly what their conscious told them to do.And animals also have conscious i.e. if you put a meat to a goat and ask him to eat.He will never eat it.This is conscious gifted by Allah.

          Where as those people to whom the message of Allah came down.Their decision and action is judged.Accordingly they are given punishment or reward.It is important to understand that when we hear the word of Allah and if we deny it.Then it is sin in itself and that will be asked on the day of judgment.This denial is the reason for the non-muslim to go to hell.
          صلى الله على حبيبه محمد و على آله و أصحابه و سلم
          Al-Muslimeen

          Comment


            #20
            Re: Do all non-Muslims go to Hell?

            If you had been able to say the Arabic words "Muslim" and "Islam" to Jesus in his time, he probably wouldn't have understood what you were talking about. He wasn't a muslim in name, but that didn't mean he wasn't a muslim in truth. Truth acknowledged by people that may not call themselves "Muslims" is still the truth. Allah will know best about what they received or didn't receive or what they deserve and what they don't deserve. People pretend they can make the judgements for themselves and they pretend they can read hearts and minds, and judge whether the truth reaches these people or not; but their knowledge is but a speck compared to the breadth of how much there is to know and the possibilities of truth getting to someone is a lot greater than you may be understanding, and the possibilities of Allah/God have mercy is much greater than your understanding. Therefore no one should say that all non-muslims are going to hell, because many very good people that are called "non-muslims" might have converged on the truth, and many that are called "muslims" might have deviated from the truth. Only Allah/God will be able to know for sure.

            Comment


              #21
              Re: Do all non-Muslims go to Hell?

              Originally posted by Pen View Post
              If you had been able to say the Arabic words "Muslim" and "Islam" to Jesus in his time, he probably wouldn't have understood what you were talking about. He wasn't a muslim in name, but that didn't mean he wasn't a muslim in truth. Truth acknowledged by people that may not call themselves "Muslims" is still the truth. Allah will know best about what they received or didn't receive or what they deserve and what they don't deserve. People pretend they can make the judgements for themselves and they pretend they can read hearts and minds, and judge whether the truth reaches these people or not; but their knowledge is but a speck compared to the breadth of how much there is to know and the possibilities of truth getting to someone is a lot greater than you may be understanding, and the possibilities of Allah/God have mercy is much greater than your understanding. Therefore no one should say that all non-muslims are going to hell, because many very good people that are called "non-muslims" might have converged on the truth, and many that are called "muslims" might have deviated from the truth. Only Allah/God will be able to know for sure.
              if a kafir accepts Islam, he is no longer a kafir

              Allah says, if He sees any good in them, He guides them to Islam
              .لا نريد زعيما يخاف البيت الإبيض
              نريد زعيما يخاف الواحد الأحد
              دولة الإسلامية باقية





              Comment


                #22
                Re: Do all non-Muslims go to Hell?

                :start:

                Originally posted by Pen View Post
                If you had been able to say the Arabic words "Muslim" and "Islam" to Jesus in his time, he probably wouldn't have understood what you were talking about. He wasn't a muslim in name, but that didn't mean he wasn't a muslim in truth. Truth acknowledged by people that may not call themselves "Muslims" is still the truth. Allah will know best about what they received or didn't receive or what they deserve and what they don't deserve. People pretend they can make the judgements for themselves and they pretend they can read hearts and minds, and judge whether the truth reaches these people or not; but their knowledge is but a speck compared to the breadth of how much there is to know and the possibilities of truth getting to someone is a lot greater than you may be understanding, and the possibilities of Allah/God have mercy is much greater than your understanding. Therefore no one should say that all non-muslims are going to hell, because many very good people that are called "non-muslims" might have converged on the truth, and many that are called "muslims" might have deviated from the truth. Only Allah/God will be able to know for sure.
                Syedinna Isaah alaihisalaam (Jesus) knew who are muslims and Islam.In fact all messengers of knew Islam and muslims.
                صلى الله على حبيبه محمد و على آله و أصحابه و سلم
                Al-Muslimeen

                Comment


                  #23
                  Re: Do all non-Muslims go to Hell?

                  Originally posted by AbuMubarak View Post

                  your layout sounds fine for YOU, but what about society at large, you are not the end or the beginning of anything but yourself, however society demands laws, and knowledge of right and wrong, are you only concerned about your thoughts and emotions and leave off everyone else

                  seems like your program of solution is very limited, if it is even a program of solution, if not, then why share it with anyone else
                  why should I have a solution for the world's problems ? I am not so ambitious. I try to live my life without doing too much harm, and this is already quite something. In any case, each society works out a set of laws, for the better or for the worse.

                  Originally posted by AbuMubarak View Post
                  man is going to follow a way, whatever that way may be, communism, socialism, darwinism, or whatever other isms man can think of
                  why should there be a "global solution" at all ? life and the Universe are a mistery, and each person searches for his way. Global theories are just attempts at finding logic in what does not necessarily have one.
                  In any case, even global theories are then interpreted differently by each person.

                  Originally posted by AbuMubarak View Post
                  good news is that he doesnt have to, Allah has already laid out the way
                  bad news, even if islam is perfect in every aspect, man will still choose to follow other ways
                  to this, I will simply repeat what I said in my previous post :

                  Originally posted by gariba
                  I don't think that you, in particular, are interested in a dialogue at all: you think you possess the truth (because you know exactly what God wants from us) and that honest, upright people should simply recognize this basic reality

                  in my humble opinion, you are severely deluded : but I am sure you think the same about me.
                  You can see, even simply from this forum, how diverse opinions are on life and religion, even among Muslims themselves (who, by the way, seem to spend most of their time discussing how to push other Muslims "out of the fold of Islam")

                  This diversity may seem as chaos, but in my view it corresponds simply to a very reassuring fact : i.e. that we humans enjoy our individuality, and that "one size fits all" does not work, and least of all when the ultimate questions about life and the Universe are concerned.

                  Best

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Re: Do all non-Muslims go to Hell?

                    Originally posted by AbuMubarak View Post
                    if a kafir accepts Islam, he is no longer a kafir

                    Allah says, if He sees any good in them, He guides them to Islam
                    OK

                    so, since Allah has not guided me, it means I'm a bad person.

                    Makes sense.

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Re: Do all non-Muslims go to Hell?

                      Originally posted by gariba View Post
                      OK

                      so, since Allah has not guided me, it means I'm a bad person.

                      Makes sense.
                      this is your soul you are playing with
                      .لا نريد زعيما يخاف البيت الإبيض
                      نريد زعيما يخاف الواحد الأحد
                      دولة الإسلامية باقية





                      Comment


                        #26
                        Re: Do all non-Muslims go to Hell?

                        Originally posted by AbuMubarak View Post
                        this is your soul you are playing with
                        I'm not playing at all

                        I have explained my position very clearly

                        that's all

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Re: Do all non-Muslims go to Hell?

                          :start:

                          Originally posted by gariba View Post
                          OK

                          so, since Allah has not guided me, it means I'm a bad person.

                          Makes sense.
                          Allah shows guidance to the person who wishes for it.

                          Do you really wish for the guidance?
                          صلى الله على حبيبه محمد و على آله و أصحابه و سلم
                          Al-Muslimeen

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Re: Do all non-Muslims go to Hell?

                            Originally posted by gariba View Post
                            OK

                            so, since Allah has not guided me, it means I'm a bad person.

                            Makes sense.
                            Hopefully at least one Non-Muslims who can see tha folly of caliming to be "Good" Non-Muslims ... (self-contradictory)

                            Good and Evil is defined by Allah ta'ala, not the Kuffars whims/desires ...

                            those who who have Died as Non-Muslim have led a Life of Munkar, with No Repentance, as such Allah ta'ala has destined them to Jahannam.

                            Brothers and sisters be aware that the Shaytaan will use such Illogical argumentation to create Doubt in your Imaan.

                            Lastly Gariba If you are Not Guided by Allah ta'ala to Islam, then you are at fault ...

                            Al-Quran, Surah Baqarah, Chapter 2, Ayah 26
                            --------------------------------------------
                            "Allah disdains not to use the similitude of things, lowest as well as highest. Those who believe know that it is truth from their Lord; but those who reject Faith say: "What means Allah by this similitude?" By it He causes many to stray, and many He leads into the right path; but He causes not to stray, except those who forsake (the path)"

                            regards
                            Last edited by Saif-Uddin; 31-12-11, 06:24 PM.
                            http://www.ilovepalestine.com/campai...imesinGaza.gif

                            "It does not befit the lion to answer the dogs."

                            – Imam al-Shafi’i (Rahimahullah)

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Re: Do all non-Muslims go to Hell?

                              Originally posted by Due2MyWeakness View Post
                              According to Imam Ghazali, if the message of Islam is distorted (like how it is today, with so many non practicing muslims), the non-muslims may be excused in the Day of judgement.

                              Though, Imam Ghazali is widely discredited by the Contemporary so called Salafs.
                              Another ignorant allegation of yours .

                              Most Salafis ( Ahlus Sunnah ) regard Imam Ghazali to be a good Scholar though we donot make taqleed of him .

                              A person who has never heard of Islam or the Prophet SAWS (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), and who has never heard the message in its correct and true form, will not be punished by Allaah if he dies in a state of kufr (disbelief). If it were asked what his fate will be, the answer will be that Allaah will test him on the Day of Resurrection: if he obeys, he will enter Paradise and if he disobeys he will enter Hell. The evidence (daleel) for this is the hadeeth of al-Aswad ibn Saree’, who reported that the Prophet of Allaah SAWS (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “There are four (who will protest) to Allaah on the Day of Resurrection: the deaf man who never heard anything, the insane man, the very old man, and the man who died during the fatrah (the interval between the time of ‘Eesaa (Jesus, upon whom be peace) and the time of Muhammad SAWS (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him)). The deaf man will say, ‘O Lord, Islam came but I never heard anything.’ The insane man will say, ‘O Lord, Islam came but the children ran after me and threw stones at me.’ The very old man will say, ‘O Lord, Islam came but I did not understand anything.’ The man who died during the fatrah will say, ‘O Lord, no Messenger from You came to me.’ He will accept their promises of obedience, then word will be sent to them to enter the Fire. By the One in Whose hand is the soul of Muhammad, if they enter it, it will be cool and safe for them.”

                              http://islamqa.info/en/ref/1244
                              Where there are no Ulemah(Scholars) there are many Muftis.

                              I
                              deal System of Living for All Mankind .

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Re: Do all non-Muslims go to Hell?

                                Originally posted by ahmed_abdullah View Post
                                Allah shows guidance to the person who wishes for it.

                                Do you really wish for the guidance?
                                what a strange question

                                the world is a complex place, and human life is full of problems, suffering, etc

                                who would refuse effective, positive guidance ? no one

                                The idea that people, out of pride, arrogance etc doggedly insist on voluntarily burning in hellfire is absurd.

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