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Hadiths on Najd (Wahabism)

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    #16
    Re: Hadiths on Najd (Wahabism)

    your understanding of this religion is quite frankly very poor and your making statements that are no offense very out of context and very deemining. your defininition of sunni islam is very strange one one that is conflict with all the previous imams. not even modern sufis agree with you. take your beef elsewhere

    Comment


      #17
      Re: Hadiths on Najd (Wahabism)

      Originally posted by AlayhisSalaam View Post
      Wa alaikum salaam

      I'm not sure why it seems nobody ever reads what I write.



      Rather than insulting me brother for posting something I found, why do you not explain in a logical and sophisticated manner a different interpretation and why do you not show some evidences contrary to what this says?

      I'm not trying to argue but inshallah to only find the truth in all matters.

      I have seen Wahhabism/Salafi destroy people's lives, so I have a biased perspective which doesn't see Wahabbi in a good light, but I don't go out of my way to insult them, if I do insult them then it is due to my bias and not because of any ill intention in my heart, I don't hate anyone, but I dislike seeing people suffer and seeing the "Sincerity, Peace" part of Seen Lam Meem (ISLAM) being taken out, and tasawwuf being laughed at... Islam is meant to make us break away from this dunya, we're meant to feel like prisoners if we're true believers, we're meant to detach from the material.. and we're meant to embrace spirituality and true love of Allah swt... I just think that Wahhabism is the opposite, they attach to dunya and do not care what is in the heart and they are confident that they're already going to heaven when even the Sahabah feared hell-fire and didn't see a single cloud over their head except that they ran to the masjid to pray and fear Allah swt.

      Inshallah you see my point and inshallah I would appreciate anyone with more knowledge to bring some scholarly information regarding this subject as opposed to insults inshallah.

      Wasalaam
      huh, what are you on about, salafism destroying people's lives? lol, what do you find wrong with salafis anyway?

      Comment


        #18
        Re: Hadiths on Najd (Wahabism)

        Originally posted by hamza89 View Post
        your understanding of this religion is quite frankly very poor and your making statements that are no offense very out of context and very deemining. your defininition of sunni islam is very strange one one that is conflict with all the previous imams. not even modern sufis agree with you. take your beef elsewhere
        Asalaamu alaikum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatoh

        To begin with the Islamic greeting, "Peace and mercy and blessings of Allah swt be upon you"

        Are you Muslim, hamza89? There is a difference between Sunni and Salafi. I am a Sunni Muslim, in that I follow the Hanafi Madhab, one of four major beliefs in Sunni Islam which the majority of scholars agree are all correct and it is personal preference as to which one to follow. Salafi do not belong to these four Madhabs, it is a relatively new sect created by Muhammad ibn Abd-al-Wahhab http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_ibn_Abd-al-Wahhab in the 18th Century CE, or

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salafi

        He was born in Najd, present day Saudi Arabia.... The Hadiths I quoted, Muhammad(saws) spoke of Najd, yes? And apparently Muhammad ibn Abd-al-Wahhab's own brother told him: “The horn of Shaytan which the Prophet (Sallallahu’ aliahi wa sallam) referred to is you.” [Sawaa’iqul Ilahiya] (His brother's name is Shaykh Sulaiman bin Abdul Wahab)

        So I thought this was interesting and I was asking about it. I have said several times that I don't like to call myself Sufi because I don't know enough about it, but I'm interested in Tasawwuf, which is the knowledge of the heart (www.tasawwuf.org) and has nothing to do with Bida'a or graveworship or anything like that lol astagfirullah.

        I worship only Allah swt and I love Allah swt and I love Rasoolallah (saws) and I respect Rasoolallah(saws) and I follow Rasoolallah(saws)'s Sunnah inshallah as much as I can. Anyone who asks me what I am I say Sunni, and if they ask which Madhab I tell them Hanafi.

        So I think you are confusing your knowledge of the sects. Inshallah if you have any information regarding the topic then please share it, but please do not insult people, especially if you have no platform to stand on in which to defend your reasons as to why you're insulting someone.

        In this case, you're insulting me because I asked a question and posted some hadith which speak about Najd, which encompasses Saudi Arabia including Riyadh, and the place of birth of Muhammad ibn Abd-a-Wahhab.

        I have not insulted anyone, if anyone is upset with what I've written then you should know that it was the Prophet Muhammad (saws) who said this, so you should calm down and not be angry at our Rasoolallah (saws), but you should offer a scholarly interpretation opposite to the obvious one, if there is any other interpretation to this hadith inshallah.

        So inshallah if you are angry at me, know that you're being deceived by shaytan, because it is my Beloved Prophet (saws) who said this, and I am not angry at him for saying it, so why are you?
        http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/157...rtsinsults.jpg
        O ye who believe! Let not some among you laugh at others: It may be that the (latter) are better than the (former) Nor defame nor be sarcastic to each other, nor call each other by (offensive) nicknames: Ill-seeming is a name connoting wickedness, after he has believed: And those who do not desist are doing wrong. (QURAN, Sura Hujurat, 49:11)

        Comment


          #19
          Re: Hadiths on Najd (Wahabism)

          i have no interrest in debating with someone who is ignorant it produces nothing beneficial to me , my advice is please read the comments on the ahaadith that you have quoted and then please come back to forum and apoligize to the deceased shaykh muhamed ibn abdul wahaab rahamilulah

          your understanding of salafiyya is also very poor. salafiya has its problems like any other sect has its problems. and the vast majoroty of them follow the fiqh of imam Ahmed rh

          Comment


            #20
            Re: Hadiths on Najd (Wahabism)

            Originally posted by in_exile View Post
            so what happened to the hadith about worshipping false gods like that munafiq nazim haqqani... do you want to post them up as well? i heard you need to be careful cus the guy watches you whilst you taking a shower...
            how many times I have seen you respond in an insulting manner, it is really distasteful and unislamic

            I am interested in what the OP said, I have personally been driven to kufr because of the wahabi Islam, until i found true Islam again, so dont talk about how has wahabism destroyed people's life when it has

            the majority of the ummah are not salafis, and the prophet said the majority are always on the right, al sunah wal jamah so no need to get angry

            yes good job with salafis dont commit shirk, but i find it surprising that muslims generally are very free to insult other sects but God forbid anyone should say anythign about salafis even if you just wonder with a good intetion because you are curious, we are all mature and we dont need to get emotional about eveerything, what is wrong with elaborating on matters, I personally elaborate whether an action of mine is hypocritical etc, I question my actions, then why should we be so scared to question anything else, that is what being truthful is about

            Salafis, also attribute physical attributes to Allah, something which the majority of muslims dont, i find that disturbing, but i dont see anybody pointing a finger at them for that, but if this was any other sect then we would hear "munafiq, kafir" all over it

            I am not a sufi, or salafi or shia, so before you attack me hold your breath, I follow the sunnah and that is all I need
            " O you who have believed, do not follow the footsteps of Satan. And whoever follows the footsteps of Satan - indeed, he enjoins immorality and wrongdoing. And if not for the favor of Allah upon you and His mercy, not one of you would have been pure, ever, but Allah purifies whom He wills, and Allah is Hearing and Knowing. "
            Surah An-Nur, Verse 21

            Comment


              #21
              Re: Hadiths on Najd (Wahabism)

              Originally posted by hamza89 View Post
              i have no interrest in debating with someone who is ignorant it produces nothing beneficial to me , my advice is please read the comments on the ahaadith that you have quoted and then please come back to forum and apoligize to the deceased shaykh muhamed ibn abdul wahaab rahamilulah

              your understanding of salafiyya is also very poor. salafiya has its problems like any other sect has its problems. and the vast majoroty of them follow the fiqh of imam Ahmed rh
              why dont you share your knowlege instead of saying people are ignorant. I undertand you dont want to debate with people that dont want to listen and stick to their own opinion anyway, but the OP has asked for input and is open to accepting knowledge, why is everyone responding in this manner

              I find this very annoying when you have so many liars in this forum doing nothign but spreading fire and the muslims are completely oblivious to their agenda, then you have a muslim who is open to learning adn everyone shuns him with insults
              " O you who have believed, do not follow the footsteps of Satan. And whoever follows the footsteps of Satan - indeed, he enjoins immorality and wrongdoing. And if not for the favor of Allah upon you and His mercy, not one of you would have been pure, ever, but Allah purifies whom He wills, and Allah is Hearing and Knowing. "
              Surah An-Nur, Verse 21

              Comment


                #22
                Re: Hadiths on Najd (Wahabism)

                salam

                that is ignorant isint it. not bringing any evidence to bring an oppisite oppinion. i hear many people say the exact same thing about hadeith "but it doset benifit me"

                fact of the matter is, if you want to look at things from a dunya point of view, islam dosent offer much(to the best of my knowledge), it requres alot of sacrafise, and one must always chage their ways and attitudes to be in line with the sunnah.

                this is a very interesting topic, with a wealth of scholerly knowledge that can be peered into. also the brother specificly stated tht hes not attacking anybody here, so i dont see the issue. the point of a debate is to clear up misconceptions so that the truth is exposed. so instead if bringing ourself to insulting other people, we should remember the ayah that tells muslim to debate in a good way. there is khair in following that.

                remember shaytan is our worst enemy, moreso then anybody in the planet. lets follow the example of our prophet sallaho alahi wa sallam and keep things civil here, and debate in a good way. i doubt any of us want our last words on this earth to be of those who shun another brother. we can die at any time.
                Last edited by uncle umar; 25-02-10, 02:45 PM.
                And the (faithful) slaves of the Most Gracious (All‚h) are those who walk on the earth in humility and sedateness, and when the foolish address them (with bad words) they reply back with mild words of gentleness. (25:63)

                O You who believe! Shall I guide you to a trade that will save you from a painful torment? (10) That you believe in All‚h and His Messenger (Muhammad SAW),and that you strive hard and fight in the Cause of All‚h with your wealth and your lives, that will be better for you, if you but know! (11) (If you do so) He will forgive you your sins, and admit you into Gardens under which rivers flow, and pleasant dwellings in Adn (Edn) Paradise; that is indeed the great success. (12)

                JazakAllah khair for the duas but i would prefer duas for shahadah instead.

                sponsor an orphan

                Comment


                  #23
                  Re: Hadiths on Najd (Wahabism)

                  Originally posted by uncle umar View Post
                  salam

                  that is ignorant isint it. not bringing any evidence to bring an oppisite oppinion. i hear many people say the exact same thing about hadeith "but it doset benifit me"

                  fact of the matter is, if you want to look at things from a dunya point of view, islam dosent offer much(to the best of my knowledge), it requres alot of sacrafise, and one must always chage their ways and attitudes to be in line with the sunnah.

                  this is a very interesting topic, with a wealth of scholerly knowledge that can be peered into. also the brother specificly stated tht hes not attacking anybody here, so i dont see the issue. the point of a debate is to clear up misconceptions so that the truth is exposed. so instead if bringing ourself to insulting other people, we should remember the ayah that tells muslim to debate in a good way. there is khair in following that.

                  remember shaytan is our worst enemy, moreso then anybody in the planet. lets follow the example of our prophet sallaho alahi wa sallam and keep things civil here, and debate in a good way. i doubt any of us want our last words on this earth to be of those who shun another brother. we can die at any time.
                  Salam alaykum wa rahmatullahu wa barakatuhu

                  Brother, I am so happy to read your posts because you always write some useful stuff and respond with Islamic attitude, May Allah bless you with more good manners and knowledge

                  I understand we must never try to break the ummah, and in my opinion trying to learn is not evil, if we dont clear misconceptions they wil only stay in the corner of your mind and shaytan will use them against you

                  I have a sore spot for the salafi group, I know they are not all the same and I am not even blaming them, but as I have said in some other posts, I belive we should be open as brothers to question everything, because how do we know otherwise how is shaytan leading us astray?

                  Let me tell you this, and wallahi I am not lying to you, I was a salafi for 5 years, I suffered a great deal for some matters which majority of muslim ummah did not, in that time I heard of two salafi sisters who left islam and I was so shocked, then it came and I left islam too because of the mental distress I suffered, I later after two years found the true islam again, alhamduliAllah

                  until recentlly ther was a blog by a brother called "salafi burntout", it has now been removed, I dont know by who, but this brother tells his sad story of his life, he was a sunni muslim married to a wife who became salafi, soon she became so 'extreme' even though the brother was practicing pretty much the salafi friends were consipring and caused a lot of marital problems between the non-salafi husband and the salafi wife, they had four kids together, later the sister is driven into kufr and he had to divorce her, now he was saying how painful it was to watch her in shorts and the kids seeing their mother in hte weekends.......in his blog page a number of sisters and brothers wrote their response to that, and about 4 of them said the same thing about how that life made their lives miserable

                  now please before we shun this completely, I believe we have sufficient evidence to see that this is a problem, there is a problem there, I am not saying that there is a problem with the whole idiology, no, like i said, they are to be commended for the avoidance of shirk, but there is something wrong ther and as muslims we must address it before more lives are ruined or affected badly, why would we not want to remove evil from our community?

                  my saudi friend who is salafi has told me that salafis in Saudi are not like that, but it seems there is a problem with salafis in London, their understanding has gone wrong, they treat people harshy and they have a judgmental attitude, it really affects the more ignorant muslims, and we dont want to see that, it is not even good for them, because now I have this peace and nice relationship with Allah, before my head was down all the time thinking Allah is about to strike me any minute

                  The prophet saws talked about always staying in the middle path and about moderation, is it surprising that the shaytan will use an extreme road to lead us astray? Shaytan is clever, he does not try to trick a believer with alcohol, cos that will never work, he will try to lead him astray in good deeds

                  Please lets consider this with an open mind, we only want good for our community, and there s nothing wrong with considereing facts, we may be wrong but we wont find out without exploring

                  May Allah guide us all to the truth, mercy and peace with with Muhammad saws came with
                  Last edited by IDK; 25-02-10, 03:08 PM.
                  " O you who have believed, do not follow the footsteps of Satan. And whoever follows the footsteps of Satan - indeed, he enjoins immorality and wrongdoing. And if not for the favor of Allah upon you and His mercy, not one of you would have been pure, ever, but Allah purifies whom He wills, and Allah is Hearing and Knowing. "
                  Surah An-Nur, Verse 21

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Re: Hadiths on Najd (Wahabism)

                    Originally posted by IDK View Post
                    Salam alaykum wa rahmatullahu wa barakatuhu

                    Brother, I am so happy to read your posts because you always write some useful stuff and respond with Islamic attitude, May Allah bless you with more good manners and knowledge

                    I understand we must never try to break the ummah, and in my opinion trying to learn is not evil, if we dont clear misconceptions they wil only stay in the corner of your mind and shaytan will use them against you

                    I have a sore spot for the salafi group, I know they are not all the same and I am not even blaming them, but as I have said in some other posts, I belive we should be open as brothers to question everything, because how do we know otherwise how is shaytan leading us astray?

                    Let me tell you this, and wallahi I am not lying to you, I was a salafi for 5 years, I suffered a great deal for some matters which majority of muslim ummah did not, in that time I heard of two salafi sisters who left islam and I was so shocked, then it came and I left islam too because of the mental distress I suffered, I later after two years found the true islam again, alhamduliAllah

                    until recentlly ther was a blog by a brother called "salafi burntout", it has now been removed, I dont know by who, but this brother tells his sad story of his life, he was a sunni muslim married to a wife who became salafi, soon she became so 'extreme' even though the brother was practicing pretty much the salafi friends were consipring and caused a lot of marital problems between the non-salafi husband and the salafi wife, they had four kids together, later the sister is driven into kufr and he had to divorce her, now he was saying how painful it was to watch her in shorts and the kids seeing their mother in hte weekends.......in his blog page a number of sisters and brothers wrote their response to that, and about 4 of them said the same thing about how that life made their lives miserable

                    now please before we shun this completely, I believe we have sufficient evidence to see that this is a problem, there is a problem there, I am not saying that there is a problem with the whole idiology, no, like i said, they are to be commended for the avoidance of shirk, but there is something wrong ther and as muslims we must address it before more lives are ruined or affected badly, why would we not want to remove evil from our community?

                    my saudi friend who is salafi has told me that salafis in Saudi are not like that, but it seems there is a problem with salafis in London, their understanding has gone wrong, they treat people harshy and they have a judgmental attitude, it really affects the more ignorant muslims, and we dont want to see that, it is not even good for them, because now I have this peace and nice relationship with Allah, before my head was down all the time thinking Allah is about to strike me any minute

                    Please lets consider this with an open mind, we only want good for our community, and there s nothing wrong with considereing facts, we may be wrong btu we wont find out without exploring

                    May Allah guide us all to the truth, mercy and peace with with Muhammad saws came with
                    I think that salafis in london have different attitude, hre in egypt they are the biggest religious group and most people respect them, but the kind your talking about are the school of rabee' Al madkhali.
                    islamway
                    اللهم ارزقنا حُسن الخاتِمة

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Re: Hadiths on Najd (Wahabism)

                      Originally posted by Abu Jaffar View Post
                      I think that salafis in london have different attitude, hre in egypt they are the biggest religious group and most people respect them, but the kind your talking about are the school of rabee' Al madkhali.
                      Salam thank you for your response

                      I dont know what the problem is but there must be a link, when you see all the group have the same attitude, then it would be ingorant not to draw a link between the teacher and their followers, as I have said before, the teacher himself may not have said anything wrong per say or at least did not have a bad intention but it was interpreted badly by the ingorant followers and now they all like to take examples and blame people, then there are many lives that have been affected, we cannot brush all this off as a coincidence
                      " O you who have believed, do not follow the footsteps of Satan. And whoever follows the footsteps of Satan - indeed, he enjoins immorality and wrongdoing. And if not for the favor of Allah upon you and His mercy, not one of you would have been pure, ever, but Allah purifies whom He wills, and Allah is Hearing and Knowing. "
                      Surah An-Nur, Verse 21

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Re: Hadiths on Najd (Wahabism)

                        Jazakallah khayr Uncle Umar, Asalaamu alaikum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuhu

                        I appreciate the patience and wisdom of those people who have displayed it, alhamdulilah, may Allah SWT continue to increase you in these attributes, and protect you from the shaytan. Ameen.

                        Inshallah we wait to hear some other points of view and inshallah no more insulting each other, let us follow Rasoolallah(saws) when he has said to us:

                        "Allah is not kind to him who is not kind to people." - Bukhari & Muslim

                        Abu Darda' reported that the Prophet of Allah, upon him be peace, said, "Nothing is weightier on the Scale of Deeds than one's good manners." (Hadith - Bukhari's Book of Manners #271, Abu Dawud, Tirmidhi, Ahmad, and Ibn Hibban.)



                        Authu bilahi minaysh shaytani rajeem, Bismillahir Rahmanir Raheem.
                        http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/157...rtsinsults.jpg
                        O ye who believe! Let not some among you laugh at others: It may be that the (latter) are better than the (former) Nor defame nor be sarcastic to each other, nor call each other by (offensive) nicknames: Ill-seeming is a name connoting wickedness, after he has believed: And those who do not desist are doing wrong. (QURAN, Sura Hujurat, 49:11)

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Re: Hadiths on Najd (Wahabism)

                          It emerged from the science of Jarh and ta'deel, used in the science of hadith they mixed it with wala' and bara', were shuning is religion to some. They even call the mujahideen Khawarij.
                          islamway
                          اللهم ارزقنا حُسن الخاتِمة

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Re: Hadiths on Najd (Wahabism)

                            Originally posted by Abu Jaffar View Post
                            It emerged from the science of Jarh and ta'deel, used in the science of hadith they mixed it with wala' and bara', were shuning is religion to some. They even call the mujahideen Khawarij.
                            yes I dont know which mujahideen you are refering to but I know they used to say about bosnian muslims who died in the war while fighting, they used to say their fighting was in vain because they faught for country and not Allah and they did not die as martyrs, that surely comes in great contradiction with majority of poeple, which is when someone attacks your home and your wife and children you defend yourselves and your community and die as a result then that is martyrdom, what is the poor man to do?

                            This is why i find some of their views extreme, where for example everything has to be done for the sake of Allah conciously in your head, but some people cannot do that all the time, its not natural, if you are dying while defending your wife or child then that is martyrdom very simple

                            when the prophet said about a mother who dies because of childbirth is a martyr, did he say only if she did it for the sake of Allah...astaghfirullah, this is how I think shaytan leads us astray in very subtle matters whch we think are good
                            Last edited by IDK; 25-02-10, 03:24 PM.
                            " O you who have believed, do not follow the footsteps of Satan. And whoever follows the footsteps of Satan - indeed, he enjoins immorality and wrongdoing. And if not for the favor of Allah upon you and His mercy, not one of you would have been pure, ever, but Allah purifies whom He wills, and Allah is Hearing and Knowing. "
                            Surah An-Nur, Verse 21

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Re: Hadiths on Najd (Wahabism)

                              Originally posted by IDK View Post
                              yes I dont know which mujahideen you are refering to but I know they used to say about bosnian muslims who died in the war while fighting, they used to say their fighting was in vain because they faught for country and not Allah and they did not die as martyrs, that surely comes in great contradiction with majority of poeple, which is when someone attacks your home and your wife and children you defend yourselves and your community and die as a result then that is martyrdom, what is the poor man to do?

                              This is why i find some of their views extreme, where for example everything has to be done for the sake of Allah conciously in your head, but some people cannot do that all the time, its not natural, if you are dying while defending your wife or child then that is martyrdom very simple
                              meaning, afghanistan, iraq, somal etc...
                              islamway
                              اللهم ارزقنا حُسن الخاتِمة

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Re: Hadiths on Najd (Wahabism)

                                Originally posted by IDK View Post
                                Salam alaykum wa rahmatullahu wa barakatuhu

                                Brother, I am so happy to read your posts because you always write some useful stuff and respond with Islamic attitude, May Allah bless you with more good manners and knowledge

                                I understand we must never try to break the ummah, and in my opinion trying to learn is not evil, if we dont clear misconceptions they wil only stay in the corner of your mind and shaytan will use them against you

                                I have a sore spot for the salafi group, I know they are not all the same and I am not even blaming them, but as I have said in some other posts, I belive we should be open as brothers to question everything, because how do we know otherwise how is shaytan leading us astray?

                                Let me tell you this, and wallahi I am not lying to you, I was a salafi for 5 years, I suffered a great deal for some matters which majority of muslim ummah did not, in that time I heard of two salafi sisters who left islam and I was so shocked, then it came and I left islam too because of the mental distress I suffered, I later after two years found the true islam again, alhamduliAllah

                                until recentlly ther was a blog by a brother called "salafi burntout", it has now been removed, I dont know by who, but this brother tells his sad story of his life, he was a sunni muslim married to a wife who became salafi, soon she became so 'extreme' even though the brother was practicing pretty much the salafi friends were consipring and caused a lot of marital problems between the non-salafi husband and the salafi wife, they had four kids together, later the sister is driven into kufr and he had to divorce her, now he was saying how painful it was to watch her in shorts and the kids seeing their mother in hte weekends.......in his blog page a number of sisters and brothers wrote their response to that, and about 4 of them said the same thing about how that life made their lives miserable

                                now please before we shun this completely, I believe we have sufficient evidence to see that this is a problem, there is a problem there, I am not saying that there is a problem with the whole idiology, no, like i said, they are to be commended for the avoidance of shirk, but there is something wrong ther and as muslims we must address it before more lives are ruined or affected badly, why would we not want to remove evil from our community?

                                my saudi friend who is salafi has told me that salafis in Saudi are not like that, but it seems there is a problem with salafis in London, their understanding has gone wrong, they treat people harshy and they have a judgmental attitude, it really affects the more ignorant muslims, and we dont want to see that, it is not even good for them, because now I have this peace and nice relationship with Allah, before my head was down all the time thinking Allah is about to strike me any minute

                                The prophet saws talked about always staying in the middle path and about moderation, is it surprising that the shaytan will use an extreme road to lead us astray? Shaytan is clever, he does not try to trick a believer with alcohol, cos that will never work, he will try to lead him astray in good deeds

                                Please lets consider this with an open mind, we only want good for our community, and there s nothing wrong with considereing facts, we may be wrong but we wont find out without exploring

                                May Allah guide us all to the truth, mercy and peace with with Muhammad saws came with
                                I could write something similiar true events and stories relating to shaykh nuh kellar cult , the habashi cult, the shaykh nazim cult, there are so many differnt people that use the label salafi or sufi etc that infact those labels mean almost nothing now

                                Comment

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