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'Halal' food outlets . . . HFA/HMC/Halal

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  • #76
    Re: Regarding free range...

    With regards to free range, I don't think this issue has been raised as much in the halaal poulty as it has been in non halaal ones like all those programmes with jamie oliver and hugh fernley

    but I do agree with Zee, it's really awful seeing the chikcne son those massive warehouse spaces :(

    but then there is a real issue of supply vs demand? and people want meat everyday and they want it fresh. and then the issue of cost because they want it cheap?

    It would be good if atleast one person started a free range halaal farm or something, maybe others would follow?

    but best thing in this current state is if you are lucky enough to have a space, have your own free range chickens and eggs. chicks are pretty cheap, or if you wanna buy chickens theyre really cheap too in the animal auctions. I remember when I was younger we would sometimes bring chickens home for 50p frm the auction :D and we'd slaughter them in the back yard.
    "The successful marriage is not when you can live in peace with each other, but when you can't live in peace without each other."
    Friends of Al Aqsa

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    • #77
      Re: 'Halal' food outlets . . . HFA/HMC/Halal

      Originally posted by ze leetle elper View Post
      If its kept in a cage its wholelife, pumped full of steroid and growth hormones so it fattens up by day 30 or something, fed rubbish, cooped up in a 1 metre square cage with 20 other hens, some dead and not removed from the cages, and then shipped off to a slaughterhouse where it gets a HMC sticker stuck on its body...that doesn't sound 'halal' to me at all.

      Lets see some visuals:


      Lets look at some of their cousins who got lucky. Free range or organic ones:



      Big difference!!
      Point still remains same.

      1) Did Allah and his rasool set the condition that bismillah should be recited before slaughtering the animal? Answer is : Yes.

      Hence, Point 1 becomes a condition for the animal to become halal.

      2) Did Allah and his rasool set any conditions for the animal to be halal that it has to be free range? Answer is: No.

      Hence, whether caged or free range, it doesn't nullifies or negates the validity of slaughter as halal as long as it is done by fulfilling the islamic conditions of slaughter.

      I am not justifying their actions of keeping the animals in cage all their life. Nor I see it as a correct action. That comes in animal abuse and a good muslim who knows the haq of Allah, haq of his rasool, haq of his parents, wife, family, kids, neighbours will also be mindful of the haq of animals too.

      However, say a normal simple muslim man who lives an average life in your town in London. Now, he starts halal meat and chicken shop. However, due to his finances he cannot own a big farm land to let his chickens run in free range all the time and hence he keeps the chickens in his shop, even in cage but doesn't feeds them steroids or any sort of rubbish as hes a sincere and devout muslim. And when it comes to slaughter he does it sincerely by reciting the name of Allah. However, like I said due to his limited finances, he cannot own a farm to let his animals run around free range. So, are his animals halal to consume? Absolutely, yes. Is he guilty of animal rights and abusing them by inprisoning them, even tho he feeds them properly and he doesn't cheats with people by feeding them any steroids or any other rubbish. Then it will Allah who will decide on this aspect.

      However, no one can have any objection whether as per islamic Shariah his animals are halaal or not.

      Originally posted by seven View Post
      it may be halaal, but is it tayyib?
      Yes it will be halaal, as for being tayyib that depends on individuals and how they treat their animals.
      لا أريد مِنْكُمْ جَزَاء وَلا شُكُورًا

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      • #78
        Re: 'Halal' food outlets . . . HFA/HMC/Halal

        Originally posted by imo_sa View Post
        Sacrificing an animal in the name of ALLAH (SWT) and making it halaal is just not only about reciting bismillah and slaughtering the animal.

        It is a complete and sacred system of "thabah". The requisites of which are:

        -The animal should be facing the qiblah,
        -Reciting Bismillah whilst slaughtering the animal,
        -The animal may not be inflicted with any type of injury prior to its slaughter(stunning, eletric shocks, etc)
        -The knife has to be exceptionally sharp
        -Removal of entrails of animals prior to immersing in hot water
        -Skinning may not commence whilst there is movement in the animal.
        Exactly. :jkk:
        لا أريد مِنْكُمْ جَزَاء وَلا شُكُورًا

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        • #79
          Re: 'Halal' food outlets . . . HFA/HMC/Halal

          :start:
          Hmmm, in addition to what imo_sa posted, shouldnt be also that we should not slaughter one animal before the other as it gets shocked and terrified?
          O you who believe! Do your duty to Allah and fear Him. Seek the means of approach to Him, and strive hard in His Cause as much as you can. So that you may be successful. (Al-Maeda, Chapter 5, Verse 35)
          Verily, man was created very impatient; irritable when evil touches him; and stingy when good touches him. Except those who are devoted to Salah. (70:19-22).

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          • #80
            Re: 'Halal' food outlets . . . HFA/HMC/Halal

            Originally posted by imo_sa View Post
            Sacrificing an animal in the name of ALLAH (SWT) and making it halaal is just not only about reciting bismillah and slaughtering the animal.

            It is a complete and sacred system of "thabah". The requisites of which are:

            -The animal should be facing the qiblah,
            -Reciting Bismillah whilst slaughtering the animal,
            -The animal may not be inflicted with any type of injury prior to its slaughter(stunning, eletric shocks, etc)
            -The knife has to be exceptionally sharp
            -Removal of entrails of animals prior to immersing in hot water
            -Skinning may not commence whilst there is movement in the animal.
            Jazaka'Allah Khyr for that. As I have Meet-Crazy-Eating - Nomadic/Badawin Background, this is the same way we do when we Sacrificing(Sheep/coat/Caw/Camel). But in the case of Hunted Animal, U have to hit 1st, and make sure U Sacrifice while its stil moveing. But if its Killed during the hunt/hit, then its considered as dead.




            All Bless.~1~
            *WaRRioR*
            http://www.authorsden.com/ikshabeel

            (Quran 3:200)

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            • #81

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              • #82
                Re: 'Halal' food outlets . . . HFA/HMC/Halal

                Originally posted by NewParent View Post
                Even HMC has it's problems, they are by far the most robust organisation for monitoring 'Halal'. They have real Ulema working for them, and they enforce a good system of ongoing checks.

                BUT

                As a Grocer (who had agreed to go HMC) told me on Saturday when I went in looking for HMC Chickens, they are a Mafia, there are three grades of chicken , A, B and C, normally supermarkets our size are supplied B grade chickens, but HMC have been supplying me with C grade chicken's with bruises and I have to dispose of 3-4 of them from each batch I get, and since I make 18p a chicken, it's impossible to make any money.

                So I ended with 6 HMC baby chickens, which to be honest didn't seem so bruised and battered to me, and 3 HMC Broiler's from another store.

                What bugged me the most is that every Butcher (3) tried to fob me off with normal chicken's from their other suppliers saying, these don't have stickers but they are HMC, take them, OR 'We are busy, so we've peeled the chickens skin off, but they are HMC' to which I said, sorry I will only take HMC stickered chickens.


                so they are not so vigorous afterall... and also maybe the ulema that work for them need to go back to the 'halalness' of muaamalaat and hot to do business transaction..
                Please Re-update your Signature

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                • #83
                  Re: Kfc not hallal

                  [QUOTE=rizwan.786;3227255]
                  Please Re-update your Signature

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                  • #84
                    [email protected] | W: www.halalfoodauthority.co.uk

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                    • #85
                      Re: Email from HFA about KFC

                      I'll stick to HMC

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                      • #86
                        Re: Email from HFA about KFC

                        Originally posted by ahaneefah View Post
                        I'll stick to HMC
                        me too.

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                        • #87
                          Re: Email from HFA about KFC

                          MECHANICAL ANIMAL SLAUGHTER
                          By Mufti Muhammad ibn Adam al-Kawtharihttp://www.halalmc.net/resources/mec..._ibn_adam.html
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                          • #88
                            Re: Email from HFA about KFC

                            MECHANICAL SLAUGHTER
                            Darul Uloom Karachi

                            The Answer, and from His is the truth and rectitude.

                            The conditions for an Islamic slaughter are as follows:
                            1. The slaughterer’s being Muslim.
                            2. That Allah’s name is taken at the time of slaughter.
                            3. That the throat, windpipe and jugular veins are cut.

                            If a single one of these conditions is not meant, the slaughter could not be considered Islamic.

                            It is understood from the methods of machine cuts presented in the question that the machine does not slaughter all of the chickens at once, but rather one after the other. In this situation, if a Muslim presses the button (to activate the machine) saying bismillah, the first chicken slaughtered would become Halal whilst the following chickens to be slaughtered by (the machine activated) that initial pressing of the button would be Haram. This is because in such a situation, it is (still) imperative that bismillah be pronounced prior to the slaughter of each chicken. Merely standing close to the machine and saying Allahu Akbar or, similarly, simply placing a hand on the machine would not be sufficient to render the animal slaughtered Halal.

                            As for the needs that you expressed, a non-Islamic slaughter cannot on those grounds be termed an Islamic slaughter when these needs can be fulfilled within Islamic boundaries. For instance, machines that only constrain the chickens could be used while people conduct the slaughter with knives uttering bismillah separately on every chicken and then other machines could be utilised for cleaning purposes. There are, in fact, such plants in operation in some countries.

                            In the course of a permissible slaughter if the chicken is fully decapitated this act would be makruh (reprehensible) but consumption of the chicken would be Halal.

                            It has been mentioned in ad-Durr al-Mukhtaar:
                            …and it is tasmiyah prior to slaughter uninterrupted by a change of activity that it is countable, to the extent that if one was to place two goats one on the other and then slaughter them in a single act they would both become Halal, to the contrary of if he were to slaughter them one after the other since, as the act is [now] more than one, so must the tasmiyah be. (ash-Shaami , v5, p212 Kitaabu ’dh-Dhabaa`ih)
                            And it comes in al-Hidayah:
                            and [tasmiyah] at the time of slaughter upon the animal to be slaughtered is a condition…to the extent that if one laid an animal down and recited tasmiyah over it and then slaughtered another animal with that tasmiyah [intended for the first animal], it would not be permissible. (al-Hidaayah v2., p436)
                            And also:
                            One who cuts through to the nukhaa’ or severs the head, this would be makruh for him to do, though the slaughtered animal would be eaten. (al-Hidayah, v2., p438, Kitaabu ’dh-Dhabaa`ih)
                            And Allah knows best

                            Ihsanullah

                            Verified by Mufti Taqi Uthmani

                            Darul Iftaa, Darul Uloom Karachi, Pakistan

                            http://www.halalmc.net/resources/mec...qi_usmani.html
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                            • #89
                              Re: Email from HFA about KFC

                              Originally posted by ahaneefah View Post
                              I'll stick to HMC
                              i'll stick to HMA

                              They have categorically stated the stunning is controlled. And therefore no chance of it being carrion.

                              However the mafia at HMC , refuse to authorize anyone (without a fee) and especially stunned meat.

                              Well done HMA. Not sure i will be eating at any HMC approved places. It is bordering on Kuffar to state that controlled stunning is haram. The prophet saws deemed those who made that which is halal, haram as committing shirk.

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                              • #90
                                Re: Email from HFA about KFC

                                Originally posted by PhoenixRising View Post
                                i'll stick to HMA

                                They have categorically stated the stunning is controlled. And therefore no chance of it being carrion.

                                However the mafia at HMC , refuse to authorize anyone (without a fee) and especially stunned meat.

                                Well done HMA. Not sure i will be eating at any HMC approved places. It is bordering on Kuffar to state that controlled stunning is haram. The prophet saws deemed those who made that which is halal, haram as committing shirk.
                                get your facts rights.

                                HMC have never said stunning is haraam.

                                just because they do not approved stunned meat, does not mean they are saying it's haraam.

                                here's some facts about stunning:

                                • F.A.W.C. reports more than 1/3 chickens die prior to slaughter and are labelled Halal.
                                • Stunning prevents the drainage of entire blood resulting in it being retained.
                                • Retained blood causes germs and bacteria.
                                • Stunning deprives animals from the benefits of tasmiyah (religious blessing) due to being unconscious.
                                • Stunning is inhumane to animals and causes unnecessary suffering.
                                • The British Law allows the Muslim to carry out religious slaughter without stunning

                                enjoy your stunned meat :up:
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