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Just keeping it in the family

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  • #16
    Re: Just keeping it in the family

    Its not always cousin, sometimes second cousins etc etc, but may still be within the family.

    'Inbred children' is a rather derogatory term and I would refrain from using it in the manner you did ^^^. That term doesnt even make sense in the context you have used it

    Marrying within the family is 'bad for the gene pool' only if there are many cousins that have married each other in one family and the trend continues on for a long period of time, you will see the effects in the children. In this case someone may need to be cautious.

    Anyway, if the persons are happy, whats the problem. Obviously they should not be forced against their will. Marrying outside of the family has its own benefits, so that is good too. Allahu alim, wherever someone is happy and found a suitable partner.
    Last edited by Nawar; 19-07-06, 06:14 PM.

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    • #17
      Re: Just keeping it in the family

      Marry someone you like for his/her deen and mutual compatibility: that may be someone within the family (like a cousin) or someone completely 'foreign'. The mistake that parents make is when they treat cousin marriages like an obligation, which it is not; rather it is as much a viable option as marrying a good Muslim from outside the family. Islamically, NO ONE is OBLIGED to marry the person of their parents choice. The bride/grooms consent is a prerequisite for marriage, without it the marriage is not valid!

      Never allow family pressures to push you into a cousin marriage (or any marriage for that matter) if you see potentially serious reasons for incompatibility. The truth is that even if you marry someone dodgy due to emotional blackmail "to keep the family together", the chances are you'd end up splitting up later on and also breaking up the marriages of any siblings who have married into the same family
      The Lyme Disease pandemic: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5u73ME4sVU

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      • #18
        Re: Just keeping it in the family

        Salaam,

        I think the following fatwa fits in nicely here:

        Question :


        Is it better or preferable for a Muslim to marry someone he is not related to rather than a relative?".



        Answer :


        Praise be to Allaah.


        A number of scholars regarded it as mustahabb for a man to marry a woman who is not related to him, and they gave a number of reasons for that:


        1 – The child would have good characteristics, because he would take characteristics from his father’s side and his mother’s side.


        2 – There is no guarantee that they will not separate which would lead to severing of the ties of kinship.


        It says in al-Insaaf (8/16): It is mustahabb to choose a woman who is religiously committed and fertile, a virgin of good lineage who is not a relative. End quote.


        It says in Mataalib Ooli al-Nuha (5/9): A non-relative, because her children will have better characteristics, and because there is no guarantee that they will not separate, which in the case of marriage to a relative would lead to severing of the ties of kinship, which we are enjoined to uphold. And it is said that non-relatives give children with better characteristics and female cousins have more patience. End quote.


        Al-Nawawi said in al-Manhaaj: It is mustahabb to choose a religiously committed virgin who is of good lineage but is not a close relative.” Al-Jalaal al-Mahalli said in his Sharh: “Not a close relative” means a non-relative or a distant relative. The one who is distantly related is better than one who is not related at all. End quote from Sharh al-Mahalli ma’a Haashiyat Qalyoobi wa ‘Umayrah, 3/208.


        You can see that there is no text concerning this matter, rather it is the ijtihaad of the fuqaha’ which they based on these interests, which differ from one person to another, and from one type of relationship to another. A man may decide to marry a relative so as to protect her and honour her family, or she may be religiously committed and of good character.


        The basic principle is that marriage is permissible. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) married Zaynab bint Jahsh who was the daughter of his paternal aunt, and he gave his daughter Zaynab in marriage to Abu’l-‘Aas who was the son of her maternal aunt, and ‘Ali married Faatimah, and he was the son of her father’s paternal uncle.


        Shaykh Ibn ‘Uthaymeen (may Allaah have mercy on him) said, after quoting the reasons that the fuqaha’ gave, of seeking good characteristics in the children and the fear of severing the ties of kinship:


        What they said is true, but if there is someone among the relatives who is better in terms of other considerations (such as religious commitment, lineage and beauty), then that is better. In the event that they are equal in these terms, then a non-relative is better.


        So if a female cousin is religiously committed and of good character, and he is in a weak position and needs kindness and support, then undoubtedly such a marriage serves a great interest. A man should pay attention to his interests in this case. There is no shar’i text concerning this matter that has to be followed, hence a person should do what he thinks is in his best interests. End quote from al-Sharh al-Mumti’, 5/123.


        The scholars of the Standing Committee were asked about marrying relatives and whether that causes retardation in the children.


        They replied: There are no saheeh ahaadeeth which forbid marriage to relatives. The incidence of retardation happens by the will and decree of Allaah and is not caused by marriage to relatives as is widely believed. End quote.


        Fataawa al-Lajnah al-Daa’imah, 18/13


        And Allaah knows best.



        Islam Q&A (www.islam-qa.com)
        W'Salaam
        ...

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        • #19
          Re: Just keeping it in the family

          i'd say the gene pool is a buncha crap, the only way is through insest that a problem could arrise, else why would Allah SWT the All Knowing allow one to marry a cousin.

          the only thing that could arrise if there are problems is family feuds. It does not mean if ur parents say u should get married to such and such a person, the choice is the individuals, you not disrepecting ur parents or being the "bad" child, in quran it says who to choose, it does not say take what ur parents give you.

          but anyways i too wouldnt have married a cousin who ive known for years, due to family situations either way, weather it be the parents having feuds or the married couple having problems, it could lead to a breakup of families, especially in todays times.
          Please Re-update your Signature

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          • #20
            Re: Just keeping it in the family

            "I'd say the gene pool is a buncha crap, the only way is through insest that a problem could arrise, else why would Allah SWT the All Knowing allow one to marry a cousin. ..."

            Say what you want, but in societies such as Saudi Arabia where cousin-marriage is rather strictly enforced, the incidence of genetic birth defects is much higher than that of other societies. This is a matter of scientific fact.

            It's also important to remember that some families insist upon cousin-marriage for reasons that are entirely contrary to Islam, namely the fear and hatred of other racial and ethnic groups.

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            • #21
              Re: Just keeping it in the family

              Someone once said to me...

              But divorcing your cousin is the best break-up.

              "Listen... it's not working out. We're breaking up. But we can still be cousins"

              :banbear:
              Please Re-update your Signature

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              • #22
                Re: Just keeping it in the family

                Originally posted by Cashew
                Say what you want, but in societies such as Saudi Arabia where cousin-marriage is rather strictly enforced, the incidence of genetic birth defects is much higher than that of other societies. This is a matter of scientific fact.

                It's also important to remember that some families insist upon cousin-marriage for reasons that are entirely contrary to Islam, namely the fear and hatred of other racial and ethnic groups.
                If that was the case, then ALL married cousins would have genetic birth defects. But its only some. Therefore, it ONLY happens at the will of Allah!

                The basic principle is that marriage is permissible. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) married Zaynab bint Jahsh who was the daughter of his paternal aunt, and he gave his daughter Zaynab in marriage to Abu’l-‘Aas who was the son of her maternal aunt, and ‘Ali married Faatimah, and he was the son of her father’s paternal uncle.

                The scholars of the Standing Committee were asked about marrying relatives and whether that causes retardation in the children.

                They replied: There are no saheeh ahaadeeth which forbid marriage to relatives. The incidence of retardation happens by the will and decree of Allaah and is not caused by marriage to relatives as is widely believed. End quote.
                ...

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                • #23
                  Re: Just keeping it in the family

                  Birth defects do not occur in all children born from cousin marriages that is true, but a much much larger proportion of defects tend to occur either in families where cousin marriages are enforced generation after generation or else in cases where there is a particular gene running in the family and if both parents have it (which is much more likely in cousin marriage situations), then children will almost certainly would reap the consequences of that. I know it's not the norm but it's worthwhile for people to get medical check ups before marriage to ensure such problems are unlikely to arise or at least be prepared for such problems if they insist on marrying each other anyway.

                  Generally speaking, an isolated incident of a cousin marriage in a family will not incur any greater chances of birth defects than in non related families. Basically the more distant people are from Islam, the more they create problems for themselves. The Prophet (saw) matched up people who were related for marriage and also matched up people who were of completely different races and backgrounds. Both types of marriages should be a non issue.
                  Last edited by neelu; 20-07-06, 05:53 PM.
                  The Lyme Disease pandemic: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5u73ME4sVU

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                  • #24
                    Re: Just keeping it in the family

                    Would you remember that its an obligaton to obey your parents as long as they're asking for halaal?
                    Or would you make vomiting gestures indicating your disgust at such an idea?
                    YOU DO NOT HAVE TO OBEY YOUR PARENTS IF THEY TELL YOU TO MARRY SOMEONE YOU DO NOT WANT TO MARRY...
                    EVEN IF IT IS HALAL...IF U SIMPLY DON'T FEEL ATTRACTED TO THE PERSON THEN U CAN SAY NO.
                    Our Brothers and Sisters need our help. Do what you can to help them!!
                    Inna Ma Al-Usri Yusra :::::
                    "Verily, with every difficulty, there is relief".(94.6)

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                    • #25
                      Re: Just keeping it in the family

                      Forced marriages arent considered valid in Islam... if u dont wanna marry relatives u dont have to :D

                      Narrated Khansa' bint Khidam Al-Ansariya

                      That her father gave her in marriage when she was a matron and she disliked that marriage. So she came and (complained) to the Prophets and he declared that marriage invalid. (See Hadith No. 69, Vol. 7)
                      Oh Allah,
                      Make me want that which is beneficial for me...
                      And make beneficial for me that which I want.

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                      • #26
                        Re: Just keeping it in the family

                        I was having a discussion with someone about this a short while back infact..The thing that scares me most about marrying within family(and I am specifically referring to my own here..)Is that SubhanAllah ive seen my uncle and aunt who were 1st cousins,they got married,and both of the children that they had were severely disabled,both were blind,heavily distinctively autistic and had many many problems..It was a so-called arranged marriage wherof they were betrothed to eachother since birth..and then didnt know how to say no to their parents when the time arised..And the other thing is that both families knew of running ilnesses in the family,yet they were still married.It is increasingly difficult to look after the sons now as they are growing up..
                        May Allah swt grant them patience and bless them with Jannah al fidaus al a3la and reward them immensely..Ameen..

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                        • #27
                          Re: Just keeping it in the family

                          Originally posted by nami
                          If that was the case, then ALL married cousins would have genetic birth defects. But its only some. Therefore, it ONLY happens at the will of Allah!
                          Nami, I am not a Muslim, so if what I say sounds like fiqh (is that the right word?) to you, then by all means disregard it.

                          However, what you have stated is not how genetics works. Of course not all children born of "consanguineous marriages," or cousin marriages, have genetic birth defects.

                          But a number of studies have clearly demonstrated that children born of "cousin marriages" have a significantly greater chance of having genetic birth defects.

                          Now, that said, this is not an issue encountered only among Muslims. The same problem exists in other societies and other religions. (There are Hindu communities, for example, that practice cousin marriage.)

                          Also, please know that it is now possible for potential mates to seek genetic counselling well before they decide to get married.

                          Genetic counselling -- a careful study of the genetic make-up of both individuals -- can advise a couple of what genetic risks they might face should they choose to marry and have children.

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