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Are my expectations too high?

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  • i use to be one of those dudes who wasn't really attracted to blacks/africans that much growing up. i did get made fun of a lot, from the african american chicks so that caused that. But then one summer i saw a lot of attractive somali women,ethiopians, . literally my views on blacks/africans changed after that.My mother lives in another state where there is a high somali population, i would go with her to a lot of places whenever i was there cause she didn't want me bored at the house. multiple homes restaurants and etc. when i came back to texas i started to notice them more and more. Now i don't have a preferences anymore, i grew up.

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    • Originally posted by Janna90 View Post

      lol shes not the only one, I know alot of Arabs who aren't including myself. I would marry a black/african no problem, I don't see them as inferior. That ideology comes from culture not Islam.

      I think its just because shes a female Arab that's why people might be triggered, If it was a male Arab who said hes attracted to white women no one would make it into a big deal.
      Think this is a generational thing, much less issues around marrying non-arabs from the youngsters, the oldies maybe just maybe might accept a white revert but rarely anyone else.

      Problem is the power of guardianship is with the oldies not the youngsters, so it's a problem I can see dying out within 10 or so years as a new generation come through and are looking for spouses or approval of those choices from their parents.

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      • Originally posted by Gingerbeardman View Post

        Think this is a generational thing, much less issues around marrying non-arabs from the youngsters, the oldies maybe just maybe might accept a white revert but rarely anyone else.

        Problem is the power of guardianship is with the oldies not the youngsters, so it's a problem I can see dying out within 10 or so years as a new generation come through and are looking for spouses or approval of those choices from their parents.
        Yh It can be a generational thing, but it depends, Mostly its do with reputation, and how their community would perceive them if they went against the norm. I know people from older generations that are completely open minded and laid back. I don't see this an issue amongst proper practicing families, there open to any culture. It really comes down to the relationship with our Deen, if we put our Deen first we wont be having this problem. Sure we can have a preference, maybe we want to stick to our culture but at the end of the day families shouldn't enforce their preferences on their children. Because their children will have a completely different personality, would of had a different upbringing so their preferences would sometime differ. I mean living in the west don't see mixing cultures as an issue, our way of life is slam. Even speaking different languages, alot of people are bilingual. So marrying into a different culture, communication would not be an issue unless the family didn't speak the language. Which is rare anyway.

        This is a very long topic, we can go on and on, but the point is if we put Islam first before anything we wouldn't have any issues.

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        • Originally posted by Luffy1997 View Post
          i use to be one of those dudes who wasn't really attracted to blacks/africans that much growing up. i did get made fun of a lot, from the african american chicks so that caused that. But then one summer i saw a lot of attractive somali women,ethiopians, . literally my views on blacks/africans changed after that.My mother lives in another state where there is a high somali population, i would go with her to a lot of places whenever i was there cause she didn't want me bored at the house. multiple homes restaurants and etc. when i came back to texas i started to notice them more and more. Now i don't have a preferences anymore, i grew up.
          Having a preference is not about growing up lol I get what your saying, we should keep an open mind. But everyone is entitled to like whatever they want. The issue is people are questioning why do you prefer that, is it because of such such etc

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          • Originally posted by Iwnbd1 View Post
            That's a question I ask myself lately.
            Are my expectations too high? I want to marry a practising, educated (white) man with at the very least an average appearance. He doesn't have to be rich, just educated so I can have a good conversation with him. And I can't imagine myself marrying a man from a different 'race'. Not because I'm racist, this is just my personal preference. Yet my friends give me the feeling as if I'm asking too much, they tried to make me change my preference as well.
            This give me the feeling as if I can't express my wishes as a woman. Despite me telling people what I want, they keep trying to introduce me to men that don't meet my criteria.
            No your expectation isn't too high, you should marry who you want. Some people will try to make you go down so ignore them. I think most people marry someone from their own race and culture because they think they will get on with and understand them better. Sister_2009 taking this too seriously and too hard on you, she should chill and relax. I think white women are very attractive not just because they have white skin.
            Last edited by ThisIsJannah; 31-01-18, 07:18 PM.

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            • If you have a thing for white men, it's your life

              But never think that white guys are better than everyone else, they're not. You've probably been told this the last twelve pages.

              I haven't read the whole thread and every single post, way too many

              Ask your friends why they think you're asking for too much

              You are allowed to have a choice, just be realistic

              All the best

              'Whatever it be wherein ye differ, the decision thereof is with Allah: such is Allah my Lord: In Him I trust, and to Him I turn.' The Holy Qu'ran Al Shura (Consultation)

              So, which of the favours of your lord will you deny? ~ Surah Ar Rahman

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              • Originally posted by Janna90 View Post

                Yh It can be a generational thing, but it depends, Mostly its do with reputation, and how their community would perceive them if they went against the norm. I know people from older generations that are completely open minded and laid back. I don't see this an issue amongst proper practicing families, there open to any culture. It really comes down to the relationship with our Deen, if we put our Deen first we wont be having this problem. Sure we can have a preference, maybe we want to stick to our culture but at the end of the day families shouldn't enforce their preferences on their children. Because their children will have a completely different personality, would of had a different upbringing so their preferences would sometime differ. I mean living in the west don't see mixing cultures as an issue, our way of life is slam. Even speaking different languages, alot of people are bilingual. So marrying into a different culture, communication would not be an issue unless the family didn't speak the language. Which is rare anyway.

                This is a very long topic, we can go on and on, but the point is if we put Islam first before anything we wouldn't have any issues.
                So in essence you see the problem as those who put their culture / ethnic identity first - vs - those who put Islam first, and this is the real problem and that the elders are more likely for various reasons to fall into the first group not the later?
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                • Originally posted by Janna90 View Post

                  Having a preference is not about growing up lol I get what your saying, we should keep an open mind. But everyone is entitled to like whatever they want. The issue is people are questioning why do you prefer that, is it because of such such etc
                  Everyone is entitled to like whatever they want, it's just sometimes the rest of the world, reality turns around and says that's not likely, it's unrealistic, or even that it's stupid... it's just not going to happen.

                  I think it's a good idea that when someone has these preferences someone else points out it's unrealistic nature then if they want to keep going that way, that's their problem
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                  • Originally posted by Gingerbeardman View Post

                    So in essence you see the problem as those who put their culture / ethnic identity first - vs - those who put Islam first, and this is the real problem and that the elders are more likely for various reasons to fall into the first group not the later?
                    The problem is we don't put Islam first yes. As for which category the elders fall into I don't know, I didn't suggest all older generations are cultural and not practicing. I did say I know people from older generations who are completely laid back and open minded. It depends if there practicing or not. Living here in the west, I see alot of older generations putting their culture before Islam in regards to marriage. They care alot about their reputation within their community, so them marrying outside their culture is completely unacceptable. Allah knows best, but this is what I have seen speaking from my experience. Other peoples experiences might be different. And not all people of older generations are like that.

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                    • -
                      Last edited by Iwnbd1; 01-02-18, 11:45 PM.

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                      • Originally posted by Janna90 View Post

                        The problem is we don't put Islam first yes. As for which category the elders fall into I don't know, I didn't suggest all older generations are cultural and not practicing. I did say I know people from older generations who are completely laid back and open minded. It depends if there practicing or not. Living here in the west, I see alot of older generations putting their culture before Islam in regards to marriage. They care alot about their reputation within their community, so them marrying outside their culture is completely unacceptable. Allah knows best, but this is what I have seen speaking from my experience. Other peoples experiences might be different. And not all people of older generations are like that.
                        I don't think it's necessarily true they see themselves as putting culture before Islam, it's that they cannot tell the difference as in the time they got brought up there was little or no difference in the mind of the people
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                        • Originally posted by Gingerbeardman View Post

                          I don't think it's necessarily true they see themselves as putting culture before Islam, it's that they cannot tell the difference as in the time they got brought up there was little or no difference in the mind of the people
                          They definitely can tell the difference between culture and Islam, remember am speaking in the context of marriage here. Even if you don't have that much knowledge in Islam, everyone knows rejecting someone on the basis of colour or race is wrong. But yet so many muslims do it, and sometimes the parents want something different for their children. How can they not tell the difference, Islam clearly teaches us equality. There's a clear hadith, if a righteous man comes and proposes marriage to your daughter you should accept or there will be fitna in the land. Do we not see this today? literally fitna everywhere. Because someone thought it was acceptable to reject someone on the basis of their race. Rather on their character and Deen. Sometimes families don't even give people a chance, before even finding out what kind of job they do, how practicing they are etc They just refuse straight up just by looking at their exterior and they would never consider them in a million years let alone accept them and get to know if the person will be good for their daughters. There's a difference between someone saying I prefer to marry my own culture because its easier or whatever, than someone saying I will never allow my children to marry from another culture. Because the children might like different things, and its wrong to deny them the right to choose and enforce your own preference on them.

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                          • Originally posted by Janna90 View Post

                            They definitely can tell the difference between culture and Islam, remember am speaking in the context of marriage here. Even if you don't have that much knowledge in Islam, everyone knows rejecting someone on the basis of colour or race is wrong. But yet so many muslims do it, and sometimes the parents want something different for their children. How can they not tell the difference, Islam clearly teaches us equality. There's a clear hadith, if a righteous man comes and proposes marriage to your daughter you should accept or there will be fitna in the land. Do we not see this today? literally fitna everywhere. Because someone thought it was acceptable to reject someone on the basis of their race. Rather on their character and Deen. Sometimes families don't even give people a chance, before even finding out what kind of job they do, how practicing they are etc They just refuse straight up just by looking at their exterior and they would never consider them in a million years let alone accept them and get to know if the person will be good for their daughters. There's a difference between someone saying I prefer to marry my own culture because its easier or whatever, than someone saying I will never allow my children to marry from another culture. Because the children might like different things, and its wrong to deny them the right to choose and enforce your own preference on them.
                            You over estimate the level of religious knowledge among these types, I've read fatawah from traditionalist indo-pak scholars justifying not just racism, that's a given but also marriage on caste lines based upon the recommendations for compatibility.
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                            • Originally posted by Gingerbeardman View Post

                              You over estimate the level of religious knowledge among these types, I've read fatawah from traditionalist indo-pak scholars justifying not just racism, that's a given but also marriage on caste lines based upon the recommendations for compatibility.
                              Just because two people are from the same culture it does not mean your automatically compatible, Iv met people who are completely different to me in every way but according to culture we should be compatible. That's nonsense especially f you live here in the west, we definitely won't be the same as people from back home. Especially if we don't follow our culture.

                              I wouldn't listen to anyone who clearly justifies whats haram. How can you justify racism? At the end of the day I follow my prophet, and if a scholar goes against what the prophet taught why should I follow him?

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