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  • No access to religious families, and other dilemmas

    :salams:

    I have 3 dilemmas I've been mulling over recently. I'm interested to hear your thoughts.

    Dilemma 1)
    I spoke to my mother about marriage today. She began listing some candidates, none of which were practicing sisters.

    My family doesn't really associate with religious people. Everyone we know is more of the cultural type. I don't see how my mother can find me a suitable wife if we have no connections to practicing people. She doesn't even want to; she doesn't want someone "extremist".

    A solution would be to bypass the entire desi marriage system and start searching on my own, since I do have a few connections myself. This leads to dilemma 2 and 3.


    Dilemma 2)
    But even if I found someone I like, I don't think my parents would like her. And I don't think any girl wants her in laws to dislike her right off the bat. I fear my extended family would not like her either.

    Dilemma 3) And then there's the question of whether I myself am qualified. Tbh I don't have much ilm and have never formally studied Islam, so perhaps I would not be the best match for a pious woman.
    Last edited by Stoic Believer; 14-03-17, 12:02 AM.

  • #2
    Re: No access to religious families, and other dilemmas

    Originally posted by Stoic Believer View Post
    :salams:

    I have 3 dilemmas I've been mulling over recently. I'm interested to hear your thoughts.

    Dilemma 1)
    I spoke to my mother about marriage today. She began listing some candidates, none of which were practicing sisters.

    My family doesn't really associate with religious people. Everyone we know is more of the cultural type. I don't see how my mother can find me a suitable wife. She doesn't even want to; she doesn't want someone "extremist".

    A solution would be to bypass the entire desi marriage system and start searching on my own. This leads to dilemma 2 and 3.


    Dilemma 2)
    But even if I found someone I like, I don't think my parents would like her. And I don't think any girl wants her in laws to dislike her right off the bat. I fear my extended family would not like her either.

    Dilemma 3) And then there's the question of whether I myself am qualified. Tbh I don't have much ilm and have never formally studied Islam, so perhaps I would not be the best match for a pious woman.
    :wswrwb:

    1) Typical ... If your parents are not strict , or affiliated with practising families etc , then they may not be the right way to go about seeking a wife. No offence but don't even ask them. At this point you just need to convince them that you are serious about your deen and you want to raise a religious family. I could imagine it being somewhat weird, and everyones situation is different. Depending on how open and free you are with your parents , maybe you can say something like "What is extreme to you is not extreme to me".. That's what I would say, and alhamdulillah , I would get away with it.

    2) Similar to 1) . You need to speak openly with your parents, and be stern , yet respectful.

    3) Kind of tricky. Depends what you mean by "studying ilm". Just be able to read/teach Qur'an with tajweed, and be well acquainted with the english Qur'an. Have a good relationship with the masjid, listen to lectures online etc etc. Do that and you are considered pious. At least where we are from, that is 'knowledgeable / pious'.

    barak Allah feekum , may Allah make it easy.
    Last edited by AmantuBillahi; 14-03-17, 12:11 AM.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: No access to religious families, and other dilemmas

      Walaykum salam,

      You are a man so first of all Islamically you do not actually need your parents permission to marry, though I do understand that as a courtesy and out of respect for them, you'd want them to approve of the person you choose. You need to let your family know what your parameters are in terms of what you want in a spouse so that they can start looking for someone who can fulfill your requirements; this is about your search for a compatible wife not their search for a daughter in law who suits them at the expense of what you want. I know that's easier said than done, but I can tell you from experience because my family aren't practising either, so it was just a matter of explaining things to them and alhamdullilah they respect my outlook on this enough to not be dismissive. If your family are dismissive and want to impose their whims on you, then you're better off looking for someone without their input and just invite them to the wedding when you've found someone. Perhaps they are hoping that if you're too nice and compliant to stand up for what you want, they can impose an unsuitable and unpractising woman on you and you'll eventually feel resigned to the situation enough to accept that.

      Dilemma 2; I wouldn't worry too much, these sorts of potential issues can occur in any rishta situation. If they didn't object to her practising, they'd object to something else like her weight or skin colour or family status or something. Don't let that deter you from looking for someone who is compatible with you. The MOST IMPORTANT point here, is that even if your parents don't like someone who covers and practises, your wife needs to know that you'll stand up for her if they make snide remarks or show her any disrespect. If you're someone who can never say no to your parents, then forget about finding a practising sister and just marry an uncovered woman of their choice because if you don't show enough backbone to stand up for a wife for upholding her Islamic values regardless of her in laws opposition to it, then you don't deserve a practising wife. So the issue here is not whether a sister will be apprehensive that your parents want an uncovered daughter in law, the issue here is whether you wont allow that to become a battling ground between her and them.

      The third dilemma is not a dilemma at all. It's a moot point. Most practising people have not necessarily formally studied at any Islamic institution or under any scholar. There are probably plenty of practising sisters out there who aren't qualified in these areas either. It's entirely unnecessary, it shouldn't even be considered as a factor in terms of suitability for marriage. Just find out if the girl you like is compatible, wants the same things out of the marriage as you, is practising and that you're both on the same page when it comes to the important issues. Everything else is secondary/
      The Lyme Disease pandemic: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5u73ME4sVU

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: No access to religious families, and other dilemmas

        Originally posted by AmantuBillahi View Post
        :wswrwb:

        1) Typical ... If your parents are not strict , or affiliated with practising families etc , then they may not be the right way to go about seeking a wife. No offence but don't even ask them. At this point you just need to convince them that you are serious about your deen and you want to raise a religious family. I could imagine it being somewhat weird, and everyones situation is different. Depending on how open and free you are with your parents , maybe you can say something like "What is extreme to you is not extreme to me".. That's what I would say, and alhamdulillah , I would get away with it.

        2) Similar to 1) . You need to speak openly with your parents, and be stern , yet respectful.

        3) Kind of tricky. Depends what you mean by "studying ilm". Just be able to read/teach Qur'an with tajweed, and be well acquainted with the english Qur'an. Have a good relationship with the masjid, listen to lectures online etc etc. Do that and you are considered pious. At least where we are from, that is 'knowledgeable / pious'.

        barak Allah feekum , may Allah make it easy.
        Some good advice bro :jkk:. "Going rogue" so to speak and finding someone myself is probably what I'm going to end up doing.

        Yeah, I do need to work on myself. I always assumed a religious girl wants someone with lots of ilm so that they can be good leaders of the household and good teachers for them and the kids.

        Ameen.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: No access to religious families, and other dilemmas

          Originally posted by neelu View Post
          Walaykum salam,

          You are a man so first of all Islamically you do not actually need your parents permission to marry, though I do understand that as a courtesy and out of respect for them, you'd want them to approve of the person you choose. You need to let your family know what your parameters are in terms of what you want in a spouse so that they can start looking for someone who can fulfill your requirements; this is about your search for a compatible wife not their search for a daughter in law who suits them at the expense of what you want. I know that's easier said than done, but I can tell you from experience because my family aren't practising either, so it was just a matter of explaining things to them and alhamdullilah they respect my outlook on this enough to not be dismissive. If your family are dismissive and want to impose their whims on you, then you're better off looking for someone without their input and just invite them to the wedding when you've found someone. Perhaps they are hoping that if you're too nice and compliant to stand up for what you want, they can impose an unsuitable and unpractising woman on you and you'll eventually feel resigned to the situation enough to accept that.

          Dilemma 2; I wouldn't worry too much, these sorts of potential issues can occur in any rishta situation. If they didn't object to her practising, they'd object to something else like her weight or skin colour or family status or something. Don't let that deter you from looking for someone who is compatible with you. The MOST IMPORTANT point here, is that even if your parents don't like someone who covers and practises, your wife needs to know that you'll stand up for her if they make snide remarks or show her any disrespect. If you're someone who can never say no to your parents, then forget about finding a practising sister and just marry an uncovered woman of their choice because if you don't show enough backbone to stand up for a wife for upholding her Islamic values regardless of her in laws opposition to it, then you don't deserve a practising wife. So the issue here is not whether a sister will be apprehensive that your parents want an uncovered daughter in law, the issue here is whether you wont allow that to become a battling ground between her and them.

          The third dilemma is not a dilemma at all. It's a moot point. Most practising people have not necessarily formally studied at any Islamic institution or under any scholar. There are probably plenty of practising sisters out there who aren't qualified in these areas either. It's entirely unnecessary, it shouldn't even be considered as a factor in terms of suitability for marriage. Just find out if the girl you like is compatible, wants the same things out of the marriage as you, is practising and that you're both on the same page when it comes to the important issues. Everything else is secondary/
          I am not so spineless that I cannot defend my wife if my family are being oppressive to her. Not that I believe my parents would do such a thing though, especially my mother who is a very kind woman. Extended family is another story.

          In shaa Allah I will look for such a woman. It's just, a man is expected to be the amir of the family, so he should have as much ilm as possible, preferably more than the wife so that he can teach and guide her to what's good, and the kids too.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: No access to religious families, and other dilemmas

            I was just making a general point regarding standing up for the wife. I wasn't accusing you or your parents of being like that- sorry if it came across that way. I mentioned that because it occurred to me I've come across guys who sincerely wanted a specific type of wife who is suited to them (in the case that springs to mind, it was a well educated brother who wanted and educated, confident, independent wife with her own mind etc), then when they actually get what they want and there's some inevitable disagreement between the wife and the mother in law, suddenly it becomes intolerable that why is my wife so confident and all the things I wanted to be? Why can't she be submissive in front of my mother... that couple ended up divorced within a year and then some years later the guy married a girl who was exactly what his mother wanted. As the saying goes "be careful what you wish for- you might just get it". So really you have to ask yourself what lengths you're willing to go to in order to not just get the type of wife you want but sustain the relationship even through hurdles and potential conflict between her and the in laws.

            As a man and a leader of the family, I guess it is better to have more ilm but it isn't a deal breaker if you don't.
            The Lyme Disease pandemic: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5u73ME4sVU

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: No access to religious families, and other dilemmas

              Originally posted by neelu View Post
              I was just making a general point regarding standing up for the wife. I wasn't accusing you or your parents of being like that- sorry if it came across that way. I mentioned that because it occurred to me I've come across guys who sincerely wanted a specific type of wife who is suited to them (in the case that springs to mind, it was a well educated brother who wanted and educated, confident, independent wife with her own mind etc), then when they actually get what they want and there's some inevitable disagreement between the wife and the mother in law, suddenly it becomes intolerable that why is my wife so confident and all the things I wanted to be? Why can't she be submissive in front of my mother... that couple ended up divorced within a year and then some years later the guy married a girl who was exactly what his mother wanted. As the saying goes "be careful what you wish for- you might just get it". So really you have to ask yourself what lengths you're willing to go to in order to not just get the type of wife you want but sustain the relationship even through hurdles and potential conflict between her and the in laws.

              As a man and a leader of the family, I guess it is better to have more ilm but it isn't a deal breaker if you don't.
              Sorry, I didn't mean to imply you were accusing me of anything. I was just saying.

              I want to be as fair and just as I can when it comes mediating between my mother and my wife. I will side with whoever is in the right. It's unfortunate that that usually ends up with the opposite party feeling betrayed.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: No access to religious families, and other dilemmas

                Originally posted by Stoic Believer View Post
                :salams:

                I have 3 dilemmas I've been mulling over recently. I'm interested to hear your thoughts.

                Dilemma 1)
                I spoke to my mother about marriage today. She began listing some candidates, none of which were practicing sisters.

                My family doesn't really associate with religious people. Everyone we know is more of the cultural type. I don't see how my mother can find me a suitable wife if we have no connections to practicing people. She doesn't even want to; she doesn't want someone "extremist".

                A solution would be to bypass the entire desi marriage system and start searching on my own, since I do have a few connections myself. This leads to dilemma 2 and 3.


                Dilemma 2)
                But even if I found someone I like, I don't think my parents would like her. And I don't think any girl wants her in laws to dislike her right off the bat. I fear my extended family would not like her either.

                Dilemma 3) And then there's the question of whether I myself am qualified. Tbh I don't have much ilm and have never formally studied Islam, so perhaps I would not be the best match for a pious woman.
                One thing I forgot to mention is, the reason why having my parents on board is preferable to me is because of marital stability. I think if the families are all good with each other, then this will lend strength to the marriage.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: No access to religious families, and other dilemmas

                  :wswrwb:

                  it's important to have parents on board from both sides.

                  they weren't practicing sisters in what sense?
                  Indeed we belong to Allah,
                  and indeed to Him we will return.


                  Quran 2:156

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: No access to religious families, and other dilemmas

                    Originally posted by ninety1daisies View Post
                    :wswrwb:

                    it's important to have parents on board from both sides.

                    they weren't practicing sisters in what sense?
                    If necessary, I may have to go on ahead without my parents' approval.

                    No hijab, immodest dress/behavior, etc.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: No access to religious families, and other dilemmas

                      Originally posted by Stoic Believer View Post
                      If necessary, I may have to go on ahead without my parents' approval.

                      No hijab, immodest dress/behavior, etc.
                      does your mother see hijab as 'extremist'?
                      Indeed we belong to Allah,
                      and indeed to Him we will return.


                      Quran 2:156

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: No access to religious families, and other dilemmas

                        Originally posted by ninety1daisies View Post
                        does your mother see hijab as 'extremist'?
                        She likes the modern, "trendy hijabis". A woman in jilbab, abaya, or niqab would be "extreme".

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: No access to religious families, and other dilemmas

                          Originally posted by Stoic Believer View Post
                          She likes the modern, "trendy hijabis". A woman in jilbab, abaya, or niqab would be "extreme".
                          is a modern trendy hijabi one that wears skinny jeans etc with just the hijab on the head and she blends in with almost all the other hijabi girls in your community?

                          I know people shouldn't expect someone to change after marriage, and they should only change from their self for the sake of Allah... perhaps if your parents know such families where the girl wears the hijab atleast, maybe meet them as potentials and ask them questions that are important to you and see how they respond. maybe they have high iman but are just misguided on dress and stuff since everyone else in the community dresses like that, I don't know. Don't even know if i'm making sense.
                          Indeed we belong to Allah,
                          and indeed to Him we will return.


                          Quran 2:156

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: No access to religious families, and other dilemmas

                            perhaps some guys in similar situations go ahead without the parents approval and find a girl they feel suitable with, and then the girl is always kind and caring in character and behavior with her in-laws that she wins over their love as well by the will of Allah.


                            Allahu Alam.
                            Indeed we belong to Allah,
                            and indeed to Him we will return.


                            Quran 2:156

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: No access to religious families, and other dilemmas

                              Originally posted by ninety1daisies View Post
                              is a modern trendy hijabi one that wears skinny jeans etc with just the hijab on the head and she blends in with almost all the other hijabi girls in your community?

                              I know people shouldn't expect someone to change after marriage, and they should only change from their self for the sake of Allah... perhaps if your parents know such families where the girl wears the hijab atleast, maybe meet them as potentials and ask them questions that are important to you and see how they respond. maybe they have high iman but are just misguided on dress and stuff since everyone else in the community dresses like that, I don't know. Don't even know if i'm making sense.
                              Right, it's the colorful headscarf with the tight jeans, etc. Yes, it's the typical hijabi in my community.

                              That is a big gamble to me, because words are cheap. I'm sure if she wants to marry me, she will say she'll change. But there's no guarantee. And there is something so amazing and special about a girl who dresses properly while still single. I want to marry such a girl, but maybe the fitnah in this society is too much for a woman to manage that all by herself. I don't know. In shaa Allah I can find the person I'm looking for.

                              Comment

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