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Are you even allowed to marry a secular muslim?

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  • #31
    Re: Are you even allowed to marry a secular muslim?

    Marriage proposal from one who smokes and drinks, and doesn’t pray regularly



    The one who does not pray is not a Muslim. The fact that he is a kaafir is mentioned in the Qur’aan and Sunnah, and that was the consensus of the Sahaabah (may Allaah be pleased with them). The one who prays but neglects prayer in congregation is an evildoer (faasiq). The one who smokes is also an evildoer, as is the one who drinks alcohol, which is the mother of all evils. Such a man should not be married and he cannot be trusted to take care of his wife and protect her honour, and he cannot be trusted to take care of his children.

    Allaah has made you the guardians in charge of arranging your sister’s marriage, and He has enjoined upon you to fulfil the trust and be sincere towards her in the best of ways. This means that you should find out how religiously committed the one who proposes marriage to your sister is, and how good his character is. If you find that he does not pray, then do not give your sister in marriage to him, because by not praying he is a kaafir. But you must advise him. If he is careless about praying on time or he does not pray in congregation, or he drinks alcohol, then do not give your sister in marriage to him either, because the trust requires you to marry her to one whose religious commitment and character are good.


    It was narrated that Jaabir (may Allaah be pleased with him) said: I heard the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) say: “Between a man and shirk and kufr there stands his giving up prayer.” Narrated by Muslim (82).

    ‘Abd-Allaah ibn Shaqeeq said: The companions of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) did not think that failing to do any deed counted as kufr, except prayer. Narrated by al-Tirmidhi (2622). If you are not praying, then you must repent from this deed and you have to go back to praying regularly, as Allaah has enjoined you, at the proper times fulfilling the conditions of prayer and doing all the obligatory parts of prayer.

    2 – You should note that neglecting the prayer until the time for it is over is one of the deeds for which Allaah has warned of punishment. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

    “Then, there has succeeded them a posterity who have given up As‑Salaat (the prayers) [i.e. made their Salaat (prayers) to be lost, either by not offering them or by not offering them perfectly or by not offering them in their proper fixed times] and have followed lusts. So they will be thrown in Hell”

    [Maryam 19:59]



    Shaykh Muhammad ibn Saalih al-‘Uthaymeen (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:

    The most important characteristics for which a woman should choose a suitor are good character and religious commitment. Wealth and good lineage are secondary matters. The most important thing is that the suitor should be religiously committed and of good character, because the woman will not lose anything with a husband who is religiously committed and of good character. If he keeps her, he will keep her on reasonable terms and if he divorces her he will release her with kindness. Moreover the one who is religiously committed and of good character will be a blessing for her and her children, and she will learn good attitudes and religion from him. But if he is not like that, then she should keep away from him, especially some of those who are negligent about performing prayers or who are known to drink alcohol – Allaah forbid. As for those who do not pray at all, they are kuffaar and it is not permissible for them to marry believing women, and they are not permissible for (believing women) either. What matters is that the believing woman should focus on good character and religious commitment. As for good lineage, if that is present too, then it is better, because the Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “If there comes to you one with whose religious commitment and character you are pleased, then give (your daughter or female relative under your care) in marriage to him.” But if they are socially compatible, that is better.

    Fataawa al-Mar’ah al-Muslimah (2/702)

    And he (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:

    But if the suitor does not pray at all, whether in congregation or alone, then he is a kaafir who is beyond the pale of Islam who must be asked to repent. If he repents and starts to pray, then Allaah will accept his repentance if it is sincerely for the sake of Allaah, otherwise he should be executed as a kaafir and apostate, and he should be buried somewhere other than the Muslim graveyard, without being washed or shrouded or having the funeral prayer offered for him. The evidence that he is a kaafir is to be found in the texts of the Book of Allaah and the Sunnah of the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). – He quoted the evidence for the one who does not pray being a kaafir, then he said:

    As it is clear from the texts of Qur’aan and Sunnah that the one who does not pray is a kaafir whose kufr puts him beyond the pale of Islam, it is not permissible for him to marry a Muslim woman, according to the texts and scholarly consensus. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

    “So if a marriage is to be annulled because the husband gives up praying, unless he repents and comes back to Islam by praying, so what about marrying someone who is already known not to pray?

    To sum up: with regard to this suitor who does not pray, if he does not pray in congregation then he is a faasiq (evildoer) whose evil deed does not make him a kaafir, and it is permissible to marry him in that case, but one who is religiously committed and of good character is better than him.

    If he does not pray at all, either in congregation or alone, then he is a kaafir and apostate who is beyond the pale of Islam, and it is not permissible for him to marry a Muslim woman under any circumstances, unless he repents sincerely and starts to pray and adhere to the religion of Islam.

    Majmoo’ Fataawa al-Shaykh Ibn ‘Uthaymeen (12/question no 31).

    Seek the help of Allaah with patience, prayer and du’aa’, and we ask Allaah to make you steadfast in obeying Him, and to bless you with a righteous husband and good offspring.

    And Allaah knows best.
    https://islamqa.info/en/89709
    Know that the life of this world is but amusement and diversion and adornment and boasting to one another and competition in increase of wealth and children...

    -Quran (57:20)

    Comment


    • #32
      Re: Are you even allowed to marry a secular muslim?

      Originally posted by Stoic Believer View Post
      You'd probably couldn't even if you tried. Secular people only want people like them.
      True..telling from experience.
      ".......He giveth and spendeth (of His bounty) as He pleaseth. But the revelation that cometh to thee from Allah increaseth in most of them (kuffar) their obstinate rebellion and blasphemy.Amongst them we have placed enmity and hatred till the Day of Judgment. Every time they kindle the fire of war, Allah doth extinguish it;but they (ever) strive to do mischief on earth. And Allah loveth not those who do mischief."(5:64)

      Comment


      • #33
        Re: Are you even allowed to marry a secular muslim?

        Asalaamu alaykum,

        Please change the thread title, there is no such thing as a "secular muslim". You might misguide many who are glancing over thread topics and might form a wrong idea.

        JazakAllahu khayr

        Comment


        • #34
          Re: Are you even allowed to marry a secular muslim?

          unfortunately a lot of Muslim families in US have a hard time finding someone for their daughter or son because there are only a limited number to choose from and must meet the following hypothetical criteria:

          1)Must be Muslim obviously (this creates the initial pool)
          2)Must have same ethnicity (this decreases the pool)
          3)Must come from a good family (this further decreases the pool)
          4) Must have a good job (Guys) (this drastically decreases the pool)
          5) Must actually end up being attracted to each other (this further decreases the pool again)

          in reality no one can find all that so some families compromise and unfortunately in some cases it can be so bad, that some just settle for someone who just calls themselves Muslim (worse case scenario)
          The girls have it worse in my opinion. From my observation there are more girls than guys here.
          "The duty of the man who investigates the writings of scientists, if learning the truth is his goal, is to make himself an enemy of all that he reads, and,.. attack it from every side. He should also suspect himself as he performs his critical examination of it, so that he may avoid falling into either prejudice or leniency."
          -Alhazen Ibn Al-Haythem

          Comment


          • #35
            Re: Are you even allowed to marry a secular muslim?

            Originally posted by Fakhri View Post
            The only thing I can think of is that they are unaware of the seriousness of it. Those who know what it means to do so yet still do so... that's a different matter and you fear the worst for them if they were to be taken in death.
            Akhi no muslim is unaware of the Obligation to pray Salaah,

            :jkk:
            http://www.ilovepalestine.com/campai...imesinGaza.gif

            "It does not befit the lion to answer the dogs."

            – Imam al-Shafi’i (Rahimahullah)

            Comment


            • #36
              Re: Are you even allowed to marry a secular muslim?

              Even the term "Secular Muslim" is an Oxymoron,

              OP should be well aware of this,
              http://www.ilovepalestine.com/campai...imesinGaza.gif

              "It does not befit the lion to answer the dogs."

              – Imam al-Shafi’i (Rahimahullah)

              Comment


              • #37
                Re: Are you even allowed to marry a secular muslim?

                Originally posted by Harun1004 View Post
                Muslims have lowered the Deen requirements for marriage in pursuit of the dunya which is why this is occurring. You have men willing to mary beautiful women who don't even wear hijab let alone make salat and women with out of this world mahr prices throwing themselves at men with money but not Deen. More women would cover and men would pray if they knew that it would prevent them from marriage but what's the point to them if they still get all the perks of the Muslim community?
                its not some people's fault. depending on where they live, they just cant find anyone. especially for the women where there are more women to begin with than men. then out of those men how many have a job, then out of the ones with a job how many are decent Muslims, then out of the many that are decent Muslims how many will propose...

                atleast in US its like that, some parts atleast. There are big Muslim communities around though but still way more girls than guys.
                "The duty of the man who investigates the writings of scientists, if learning the truth is his goal, is to make himself an enemy of all that he reads, and,.. attack it from every side. He should also suspect himself as he performs his critical examination of it, so that he may avoid falling into either prejudice or leniency."
                -Alhazen Ibn Al-Haythem

                Comment


                • #38
                  Re: Are you even allowed to marry a secular muslim?

                  Originally posted by Mabbasi View Post
                  Asalaamu alaykum,

                  Please change the thread title, there is no such thing as a "secular muslim". You might misguide many who are glancing over thread topics and might form a wrong idea.

                  JazakAllahu khayr
                  Wa'Alaikum salam

                  I can't edit the title anymore. It's up to the moderators now.

                  Originally posted by Saif-Uddin View Post
                  Even the term "Secular Muslim" is an Oxymoron,

                  OP should be well aware of this,
                  I would've added quotation marks on secular Muslims to imply that I'm being sarcastic but were you really, truly unable to grasp the general point I was making?

                  Do I have to slow down everything to the lowest common denominator, so it's never misunderstood?

                  Perhaps spend a few moments thinking of what I may have generally been saying.
                  Last edited by hassan246; 03-02-17, 02:50 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: Are you even allowed to marry a secular muslim?

                    Originally posted by hassan246 View Post
                    Wa'Alaikum salam

                    I can't edit the title anymore. It's up to the moderators now.



                    I would've added quotation marks on secular Muslims to imply that I'm being sarcastic but were you really, truly unable to grasp the general point I was making?

                    Do I have to slow down everything to the lowest common denominator, so it's never misunderstood?

                    Perhaps spend a few moments thinking of what I may have generally been saying.
                    Calm down no need for a Tantrum,

                    You described a Kaafir in your op, used a phrase which is Oxymoronic,

                    "Secular Muslim" two words which are opposite of each other and then asked if a Muslim can marry such a person,

                    There's no point mocking others,

                    Any Muslim could have told you the answer to your question.
                    http://www.ilovepalestine.com/campai...imesinGaza.gif

                    "It does not befit the lion to answer the dogs."

                    – Imam al-Shafi’i (Rahimahullah)

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: Are you even allowed to marry a secular muslim?

                      Originally posted by Saif-Uddin View Post
                      Doesn't pray, don't care if they pray, disagrees with parts of the Shariah?

                      You've described a Kaafir.

                      Which automatically rules them out

                      We marry muslims with good character,

                      Not Kuffar with screw loose tendencies, they are Forbidden for us

                      :jkk:
                      be careful about classifications, only Allah s.w.t. knows that information. I know many people like this, some of them are very good people, some of them are okay, some of them started praying at some point... I would say let's not jump into conclusions, but marrying someone who doesn't pray or care for the deen would be some sort of suicide from the ambush...

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: Are you even allowed to marry a secular muslim?

                        Originally posted by Jade Vine View Post
                        be careful about classifications, only Allah s.w.t. knows that information. I know many people like this, some of them are very good people, some of them are okay, some of them started praying at some point... I would say let's not jump into conclusions, but marrying someone who doesn't pray or care for the deen would be some sort of suicide from the ambush...
                        Nullifiers were posted, we judge by the apparent

                        The "only God can judge" argument is from Christians, although even their Bible refutes this belief.

                        We judge by the apparent as stated in the hadith,
                        Last edited by Saif-Uddin; 03-02-17, 10:32 AM.
                        http://www.ilovepalestine.com/campai...imesinGaza.gif

                        "It does not befit the lion to answer the dogs."

                        – Imam al-Shafi’i (Rahimahullah)

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Re: Are you even allowed to marry a secular muslim?

                          Originally posted by hassan246 View Post
                          I'm talking about those who don't pray and only celebrate eid & ramadan. They disagree with some parts of Sharia but still call themselves Muslims. In my family they don't even care if the spouses pray and allow their daughters and sons to marry them.
                          Allowed 😁😁
                          For my family side they call themselves religious.
                          But when considering a proposal for daughter caste, education, money comes first and yes "khaandani sharafat"(a desi term) matters. Daily salah or Quran are never considered, in fact no body thinks to ask.
                          So 100% allowed. Sighhh..

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Re: Are you even allowed to marry a secular muslim?

                            Originally posted by Saif-Uddin View Post
                            Nullifiers were posted, we judge by the apparent

                            The "only God can judge" argument is from Christians, although even their Bible refutes this belief.

                            We judge by the apparent as stated in the hadith,
                            what hadith?

                            And even if there was, judging by the apparent is superficial and incomplete, as there are many things we don't see, not included in the "judgement". And also, we have so many sins of our own, that judging others is just as pointless as throwing coins into a fountain.
                            Last edited by Jade Vine; 06-02-17, 08:41 AM.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Re: Are you even allowed to marry a secular muslim?

                              Originally posted by Jade Vine View Post
                              what hadith?

                              And even if there was, judging by the apparent is superficial and incomplete, as there are many things we don't see, not included in the "judgement". And also, we have so many sins of our own, that judging others is just as pointless as throwing coins into a fountain.
                              this one...

                              Abdullah ibn Utbah reported: I heard Umar ibn Al-Khattab, :RA: , say, “Verily, in the time of the Messenger of Allah, :saw:, the people would be judged by revelation, but the revelation has ended. Now we judge you according to your outward deeds. Whoever shows us good, we will trust him and favor him and it is not for us to judge his inner secrets, for Allah will hold him accountable for those. Whoever shows us evil, then we will not trust him or believe in him even if he claims his intention is good.”

                              (Sahih Bukhari Hadith number 2498)

                              it's been cited several times,

                              yet some Muslims keep regurgitating Christian beliefs,

                              Not praying Salaah, not caring if they Pray and Rejecting parts of the Shariah all add up to Kufr.

                              hence such people are Disbelievers.

                              :jkk:
                              http://www.ilovepalestine.com/campai...imesinGaza.gif

                              "It does not befit the lion to answer the dogs."

                              – Imam al-Shafi’i (Rahimahullah)

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Re: Are you even allowed to marry a secular muslim?

                                Originally posted by Saif-Uddin View Post
                                this one...

                                Abdullah ibn Utbah reported: I heard Umar ibn Al-Khattab, :RA: , say, “Verily, in the time of the Messenger of Allah, :saw:, the people would be judged by revelation, but the revelation has ended. Now we judge you according to your outward deeds. Whoever shows us good, we will trust him and favor him and it is not for us to judge his inner secrets, for Allah will hold him accountable for those. Whoever shows us evil, then we will not trust him or believe in him even if he claims his intention is good.”

                                (Sahih Bukhari Hadith number 2498)

                                it's been cited several times,

                                yet some Muslims keep regurgitating Christian beliefs,

                                Not praying Salaah, not caring if they Pray and Rejecting parts of the Shariah all add up to Kufr.

                                hence such people are Disbelievers.

                                :jkk:
                                And even if there was, judging by the apparent is superficial and incomplete, as there are many things we don't see, not included in the "judgement". And also, we have so many sins of our own, that judging others is just as pointless as throwing coins into a fountain.


                                Whoever shows us evil, then we will not trust him or believe in him even if he claims his intention is good. What does it mean, exactly? People should be evil so we can consider them evil? And what if they are not evil, but they don't pray Salah. Do we consider them evil? Do we know if they will maybe start praying? Is being evil and not praying Salah the same thing? I really don't think so.

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