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Why do we place so much emphasis on education when it comes to marriage?

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  • Why do we place so much emphasis on education when it comes to marriage?

    :salams

    I wonder why everyone, including Muslims, place so much emphasis on education when our current model is broken and needs an overhaul.

    For example, when it comes to marriage discussions here many users mention that they want an educated wife and husband, which is good. They also want someone similar to them, so going to university is a plus. But if a sister is too educated, then she's a turn off. And a brother with an education won't land a dream job right away, or ever really, so he'll have to struggle in the beginning and may not have the comfortable life as the baby boomers did because of the economy...sadly, not many sisters would be willing to marry someone like that.

    At this point, sisters will blame the brother's financial capabilities in sustaining a household and brothers will blame the sister's pickiness in not accepting a good brother who is struggling.

    But isn't it the education model that's more problematic? I mean, universities are four years and during that time you are learning things that may not even be related to your field of study. There are a lot of useless courses and subjects you need to take and money that you need to spend, only to find out later that there was no real point in them.

    Plus, high school in itself is a problem because teachers teach students. I mean, they do, but we learn in a "cram in information and spit it out for tests, then quickly forget about it." The math I learned in calculus is now gone from my head, same with a lot of things that I didn't really care for. We don't teach students about the real world, we don't really teach them at all....it's depressing. Once you graduate, you're not even a proper adult because you don't know anything about the world. You may be 16-18, but most don't know how to support a family, how to live, and how to manage money at that age.

    We're taught that if you do what you're told then there are endless options for you and because you are special, you deserve the best and only the best. Failure is not your fault. What is failure anyways...some schools are not even letting kids fail when they deserve too.

    And this ties into the marriage issue. Brothers and Sisters go through school and then don't realize that the world won't hand everything to them. Brothers won't get wives just because you want them and sisters won't get husbands who are not struggling because that's not realistic anywhere.

    Both blame the other, but the funny thing is that both want someone who is educated in universities which is the problem. Our education system is really broken.

    Now, this isn't true for everyone, mind you, but from what I read in the other thread this is what I've reflected on. Not all education is bad and not every brother or sister feels this way. I'm all about education, but I also feel like the model that we're currently in or have gone through is a huge issue. All it does is raise kids who are not ready for life while they deal with a huge debt.

    Thoughts?

  • Kya
    replied
    Re: Why do we place so much emphasis on education when it comes to marriage?

    Originally posted by Pippin1376 View Post
    .

    That's true Sis and I'm not denying that education is a good thing. It is and I think everyone should be continuing their journey of learning even if they're out of school. From an economic standpoint, even if that person may get a good job somewhere down the line they will still have to pay off a massive debt that may take years to pay off. If they get married, then that's more expenses added to their ever growing bill. Add on a house (either buying or renting), food, utility, and the like and there's more money that will be going down the drain. If a kid comes into the picture, then that's more money gone. This causes a couple to finish paying off their student debt when they are in their 40s.

    If this is the norm, then that's a problem. And that's what we're pushing our kids to get into, without understanding the problems this creates. Plus, many brothers here want a housewife, which is fine, but if she went to school with debt then that's another added cost to the couple and who is going to pay off?
    To be honest I can't comment about the debts. I read about the hardship of student debts. I have coworkers (American, grew up in solid middle class family) who are struggling with their student debts, but I don't know details of their financial situation. To me it does not make sense why people make such a big deal about student debts and take soo long to pay off. Based on my calculation a person should be able to pay it all back with in 3 - 5 years, not 15 years, that is ridicules. House mortgage doesn't take that long. I don't know what these peoples issues are but I come from a different social circle so my exposure to this issue is bias.

    As a low income immigrant family, we qualified for many financial aid & scholarship that are not available to solid middle class family. Even if we had to take out loan, its typically less than a year salary for most graduates. I understand a person can not put their 100% salary to student loan but 25% of your income to pay off debt is reasonable to me. But these people go buy fancy car and move out of their parents house & into nice apartment and start taking fancy vacation & jump into marriage right away.. all while making minimal payment on their student debt or worst deferring it. That is poor financial judgment. It has nothing to do with college degree but everything to do with not managing their money.

    Leave a comment:


  • Pippin1376
    replied
    Re: Why do we place so much emphasis on education when it comes to marriage?

    Originally posted by DaughterOfAdam View Post
    :wswrwb:

    OP, people put emphasis on looks, money, family etc. when it comes to marriage, so what's wrong with putting an emphasis on education?

    At the end of the day, emphasis should mostly be put on religion/deen.

    “A woman may be married for four things: her wealth, her lineage, her beauty and her religious commitment. Seek the one who is religiously-committed, may your hands be rubbed with dust (i.e., may you prosper).” - Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) (Bukhari)

    Just follow his advice and you can't go wrong.
    That's true Sis, but my main quip isn't how education is seen as a sign of status. It's that our education system is a broken one and yet we place so much power in it. We're taught to take everything that our teachers say, spit it out, then forget about it. Take in what our teachers say, spit it out, and then forget about it. That's how it is for a lot of the programs we took back in elementary school.

    For universities, I get how it's a status thing, but people are getting themselves into debt in order to pursue something that they should place on hold until they have the funds available. If someone graduated from university and/or has a phd, but has never worked a day in their life then I'm not thinking, "Hmm, this person has a good social status because they graduated from uni and/or has a phd. To me, I'd be wondering how big their debt is.

    ps. How's married life treating you so far?

    Originally posted by Kya View Post
    Exactly and I think it is more fair/reasonable to place emphasis on education than on looks/family. A person has no control over the family he/she is born into, nor does he/she have control over the look Allah blessed them with. Yet 90% of marriage emphasis is on things a person has no control over. Money is something that a potential can earn unless one is talking about inheritance then that too is unfair because we can't choose what family we are born in to. Education in most case is self earned & it is one of the few criteria a potential earns on his own instead of something he/she is born with. Iman/deen falls in the self earn category but its hard to judge level of iman.

    As someone who place emphasis on education & will do so for my siblings.. I can tell you why I put emphasis on it. Education tells me...
    1) A persons level of commitment. Spending years to study while giving up earning potential during those years require commitment. There will be hardship (tough course, mean teachers) just like there is in marriage. A person who could not put up with that hardship for 4 years in university doesn't give me much confidence that he/she will stick by when the marriage gets tough.
    2) ability to delayed gratification - again giving up those free hours and earning potential for future benefit shows this person is able to give up temporary indulgent or take on temporary struggle for better future. the future might not be there but this person has made the decision to aim for best.
    3) Life time income - yes there are univ graduates working in grocery and coffee shops. But those are the exceptions and just like them there are univ graduates making 6 figure salary out of college. We need to look at average, not these exception, & it is proven that univ graduates make significantly more than HS graduates in life time of earning.

    there is of course compatibility: similar experience and life path. Also the subject a person studies says a lot about them & as it was pointed out university gives many opportunity to take advantage of. Most students don't take advantage of it. A persons univ year can explain how hard working they are & how much they want to cruise thru life.
    That's true Sis and I'm not denying that education is a good thing. It is and I think everyone should be continuing their journey of learning even if they're out of school. From an economic standpoint, even if that person may get a good job somewhere down the line they will still have to pay off a massive debt that may take years to pay off. If they get married, then that's more expenses added to their ever growing bill. Add on a house (either buying or renting), food, utility, and the like and there's more money that will be going down the drain. If a kid comes into the picture, then that's more money gone. This causes a couple to finish paying off their student debt when they are in their 40s.

    If this is the norm, then that's a problem. And that's what we're pushing our kids to get into, without understanding the problems this creates. Plus, many brothers here want a housewife, which is fine, but if she went to school with debt then that's another added cost to the couple and who is going to pay off?

    Leave a comment:


  • quark
    replied
    Re: Why do we place so much emphasis on education when it comes to marriage?

    Originally posted by Kya View Post
    Exactly and I think it is more fair/reasonable to place emphasis on education than on looks/family. A person has no control over the family he/she is born into, nor does he/she have control over the look Allah blessed them with. Yet 90% of marriage emphasis is on things a person has no control over. Money is something that a potential can earn unless one is talking about inheritance then that too is unfair because we can't choose what family we are born in to. Education in most case is self earned & it is one of the few criteria a potential earns on his own instead of something he/she is born with. Iman/deen falls in the self earn category but its hard to judge level of iman.
    Nope. 99% of the time it depends on the parent's background. There are people who move up classes through education sure but they're a minority by a large margin.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kya
    replied
    Re: Why do we place so much emphasis on education when it comes to marriage?

    Originally posted by DaughterOfAdam View Post
    :wswrwb:

    OP, people put emphasis on looks, money, family etc. when it comes to marriage, so what's wrong with putting an emphasis on education?

    At the end of the day, emphasis should mostly be put on religion/deen.
    .
    Exactly and I think it is more fair/reasonable to place emphasis on education than on looks/family. A person has no control over the family he/she is born into, nor does he/she have control over the look Allah blessed them with. Yet 90% of marriage emphasis is on things a person has no control over. Money is something that a potential can earn unless one is talking about inheritance then that too is unfair because we can't choose what family we are born in to. Education in most case is self earned & it is one of the few criteria a potential earns on his own instead of something he/she is born with. Iman/deen falls in the self earn category but its hard to judge level of iman.

    As someone who place emphasis on education & will do so for my siblings.. I can tell you why I put emphasis on it. Education tells me...
    1) A persons level of commitment. Spending years to study while giving up earning potential during those years require commitment. There will be hardship (tough course, mean teachers) just like there is in marriage. A person who could not put up with that hardship for 4 years in university doesn't give me much confidence that he/she will stick by when the marriage gets tough.
    2) ability to delayed gratification - again giving up those free hours and earning potential for future benefit shows this person is able to give up temporary indulgent or take on temporary struggle for better future. the future might not be there but this person has made the decision to aim for best.
    3) Life time income - yes there are univ graduates working in grocery and coffee shops. But those are the exceptions and just like them there are univ graduates making 6 figure salary out of college. We need to look at average, not these exception, & it is proven that univ graduates make significantly more than HS graduates in life time of earning.

    there is of course compatibility: similar experience and life path. Also the subject a person studies says a lot about them & as it was pointed out university gives many opportunity to take advantage of. Most students don't take advantage of it. A persons univ year can explain how hard working they are & how much they want to cruise thru life.

    Leave a comment:


  • YetAnotherUser
    replied
    Re: Why do we place so much emphasis on education when it comes to marriage?

    Originally posted by aabdall_25 View Post
    You reckon comparing these feminist snakes to A'isha?

    Perhaps the one cracking open the book should be you.
    Oh this is simply too rich. Since when does an educated woman equate to radical feminism? When was feminism even mentioned in this thread? Again, like I said, you're likely caught in your feelings.

    Leave a comment:


  • DaughterOfAdam
    replied
    Re: Why do we place so much emphasis on education when it comes to marriage?

    :wswrwb:

    OP, people put emphasis on looks, money, family etc. when it comes to marriage, so what's wrong with putting an emphasis on education?

    At the end of the day, emphasis should mostly be put on religion/deen.

    “A woman may be married for four things: her wealth, her lineage, her beauty and her religious commitment. Seek the one who is religiously-committed, may your hands be rubbed with dust (i.e., may you prosper).” - Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) (Bukhari)

    Just follow his advice and you can't go wrong.

    Leave a comment:


  • nudgetheputri
    replied
    Re: Why do we place so much emphasis on education when it comes to marriage?

    Someone mentioned about learning + reflecting. I think those traits are education. Of course there's a lot of regurgitation and unneccasary anxiety that comes from being in school. That's why we need to reflect what we learn at the end of the day. Are they useful? Are these skills gonna come in handy when I'm older or when I have duties to do? Are we really making full use of the resources that we've paid, 1st thing when we step in to uni? Am I well aware of my own strengths and my own weaknesses and the things I should work on about myself? Am I dealing with the right kind of company in school and are they helping with most importantly, my iman,?

    I just personally think that whatever is man-made, like university, will always be questioned no matter what. And as Muslims, we are supposed to question everything around us and not just follow the norm, or even deviate from the norm. People in power, will control what is right and what is wrong and it trickles down to the way society works - like the profs doing the teaching, the way unis are portrayed, uni certs as status marks etc etc. It's gonna take a thoughtful post like this one to get people to really really really think about what they are signing up for.


    Sorry if this post was a bit vague and too much philos lol. But yeah..

    Allahu alam.
    Last edited by nudgetheputri; 16-10-16, 02:36 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Seoul
    replied
    Re: Why do we place so much emphasis on education when it comes to marriage?

    Originally posted by aabdall_25 View Post
    You reckon comparing these feminist snakes to A'isha?

    Perhaps the one cracking open the book should be you.
    just because a girl rejects you and hurts your feelings, doesn't mean she a feminists, you cry baby.

    Leave a comment:


  • nudgetheputri
    replied
    Re: Why do we place so much emphasis on education when it comes to marriage?

    Originally posted by aabdall_25 View Post
    I think the emphasis should be placed on women's education.

    I find the more educated a woman becomes, the more feministic and aggressive she becomes.

    It is as if education doesn't react well with their bodies, and they produce feminism antibodies as defence. Should be published in a journal of medicine.
    Do you have a logical explanation for this? Because that sounds like generalization.

    Leave a comment:


  • aabdall_25
    replied
    Re: Why do we place so much emphasis on education when it comes to marriage?

    Originally posted by YetAnotherUser View Post
    Mhmm, tell that to Lady Aisha radiAllahu anha, who was the most educated woman when it came to Islamic hadiths.

    But on another note, I find that it's mostly insecure males, and often those who aren't that educated, who take offense to an educated girl/woman.

    Is that you?
    You reckon comparing these feminist snakes to A'isha?

    Perhaps the one cracking open the book should be you.

    Leave a comment:


  • Seoul
    replied
    Re: Why do we place so much emphasis on education when it comes to marriage?

    because education leads to more and better hours. a basic look in income based polls well show that people who have degrees tend to earn much more money than those without.

    Leave a comment:


  • YetAnotherUser
    replied
    Re: Why do we place so much emphasis on education when it comes to marriage?

    Originally posted by aabdall_25 View Post
    I think the emphasis should be placed on women's education.

    I find the more educated a woman becomes, the more feministic and aggressive she becomes.

    It is as if education doesn't react well with their bodies, and they produce feminism antibodies as defence. Should be published in a journal of medicine.
    Mhmm, tell that to Lady Aisha radiAllahu anha, who was the most educated woman when it came to Islamic hadiths.

    But on another note, I find that it's mostly insecure males, and often those who aren't that educated, who take offense to an educated girl/woman.

    Is that you?

    Leave a comment:


  • YetAnotherUser
    replied
    Re: Why do we place so much emphasis on education when it comes to marriage?

    Education doesn't determine intelligence, yes. There are plenty of foolish people with degrees from Harvard.

    However, having an education if you want a decent job nowadays, is almost crucial. It can also open many doors of opportunity for individuals, doors of opportunity that shouldn't be missed.

    Leave a comment:


  • aabdall_25
    replied
    Re: Why do we place so much emphasis on education when it comes to marriage?

    I think the emphasis should be placed on women's education.

    I find the more educated a woman becomes, the more feministic and aggressive she becomes.

    It is as if education doesn't react well with their bodies, and they produce feminism antibodies as defence. Should be published in a journal of medicine.

    Leave a comment:

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