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divorce in islam vs west

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  • Angel Barchild
    replied
    Re: divorce in islam vs west

    Originally posted by Kya View Post
    xFedal -- Chill out man. You are hijacking the thread with your crazy emotion. Just because your cousin was stupid enough to not get imam involved when his wife was taking haram money doesn't mean everyone else has to follow his footstep. A simple imam involvement would have solved it (as you have suggested to Muslim_London)



    Isn't that promoting a haram culture. Now the census will have even larger stat of cohabitation out of marriage & this will push the culture even more toward this haram act of child out of wedlock. Even if they are islamically married, you are encouraging a teenager reading your stat & not knowing your case will say "if that many Muslims are having child out of wedlock why can't I have premaritual sex". Its like eating in a bar. Even if you don't drink alcohol you are promoting a haram business. So even if you are married & you are listening yourself as "unmarried cohabitant" then you are promoting a haram culture.

    Anyways, xFedral ruined this topic with his emotional outbreak. Not worth writing here.
    This is partially my fault, I engaged his argument, and I"m sorry. I am old enough to know better.

    Leave a comment:


  • raze599
    replied
    Re: divorce in islam vs west

    Originally posted by Angel Barchild View Post
    You guys have some weird ideas on what goes on in the nebulous "west" with divorce. I live in the "west" the U.S. and we have 50 states, all of which have their own rules for divorce. On top of that, divorce is a civil matter here, and 99% of divorces are settled without any government intervention at all. People work out an agreement (sometimes with their lawyers involved sometimes not) and the judge just signs off on the divorce decree. Same with child custody, the default is joint legal custody, with people working out the details between them.

    As far as not getting legally married, in the U.S. that is a terrible idea. Just a few of the down sides are, having to pay estate tax on anything inherent from non legal spouse, no death benefits, in the U.S. you can not will government benefits to anyone it's only for your spouse and children, no right to make health care decisions, no right to make funeral/burial arrangements, and a big one, you can not be on your husbands health insurance if you are not legally married. The U.S. does not have free health care, if it's not an emergency, they do not have to treat you if you can't pay, and medical care is extremely expensive. A friend of mine spent four days in the hospital with pneumonia, she is uninsured, and is now $40,000 in debt.

    Here is a list of some of the rights that come with being legally married in the U.S. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rights_..._United_States
    Very good points here. In the west I think it would be unwise to not register your marriage especially for the healthcare decision reason. If your wife/husband is in hospital with a serious illness (God forbid) what will you do, you can't legally tell the doctors to do anything and they can't tell you what's going on. You'll be kicking yourself then if you didnt register it.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kya
    replied
    Re: divorce in islam vs west

    xFedal -- Chill out man. You are hijacking the thread with your crazy emotion. Just because your cousin was stupid enough to not get imam involved when his wife was taking haram money doesn't mean everyone else has to follow his footstep. A simple imam involvement would have solved it (as you have suggested to Muslim_London)

    Originally posted by xFedal View Post
    Cohabiting partners? According to the law you will be cohabiting but islamically married so your not doing anything wrong islamically, and its not illegal to have sex or children outside of marriage in western countries, so the law can't prosecute you.
    Isn't that promoting a haram culture. Now the census will have even larger stat of cohabitation out of marriage & this will push the culture even more toward this haram act of child out of wedlock. Even if they are islamically married, you are encouraging a teenager reading your stat & not knowing your case will say "if that many Muslims are having child out of wedlock why can't I have premaritual sex". Its like eating in a bar. Even if you don't drink alcohol you are promoting a haram business. So even if you are married & you are listening yourself as "unmarried cohabitant" then you are promoting a haram culture.

    Anyways, xFedral ruined this topic with his emotional outbreak. Not worth writing here.

    Leave a comment:


  • Angel Barchild
    replied
    Re: divorce in islam vs west

    Originally posted by xFedal View Post
    Proof would be that while 70% of all divorces are initiated by women, 85 to 90% of custody awards go to the women & men account for more than 90 percent of alimony payers, according to census.
    None of that proves anyone is getting "shafted". These are private agreements made by divorcing couples. They agree to this settlement. That is what you are not getting. People agree to the terms of their divorce! A man is not getting a bad deal, when he agrees to pay alimony after the ending of a long term marriage.

    Child custody is also handled out of court 90% of the time. Custody is agreed on by the parents and signed off on by a judge. They parents are the ones deciding that the kids should live with the mother most of the time, not the government. In the state I live in 50% of men who seek primary custody of their children get it.

    I get the feeling you are an unmarried, possibly teenaged boy, who thinks women are all out to get his money.

    Leave a comment:


  • xFedal
    replied
    Re: divorce in islam vs west

    Originally posted by Angel Barchild View Post
    Since divorce cases almost never make it court in the U.S. and divorce settlements are private, you really have no way of knowing if anyone gets "shafted".
    Unless you are implying you have personal knowledge of the marital statues of 150,000,000 men in the U.S.
    Proof would be that while 70% of all divorces are initiated by women, 85 to 90% of custody awards go to the women & men account for more than 90 percent of alimony payers, according to census.

    Leave a comment:


  • Angel Barchild
    replied
    Re: divorce in islam vs west

    Originally posted by xFedal View Post
    Look everybody knows what happens to the richer spouse when you divorce them and in most cases its men and you get to divorce them and wrongfully take their money.
    No everybody doesn't know what happens between two people with a private divorce settlement, because it is just that, private! They are settlements, worked out and agreed upon by the divorcing couple, almost never involving the government intervention.
    Not to mention there are hundreds of millions of people in the U.S. alone, how can you possibly "know" who is getting what in a divorce?

    Leave a comment:


  • xFedal
    replied
    Re: divorce in islam vs west

    Originally posted by Angel Barchild View Post
    Since divorce cases almost never make it court in the U.S. and divorce settlements are private, you really have no way of knowing if anyone gets "shafted".
    Unless you are implying you have personal knowledge of the marital statues of 150,000,000 men in the U.S.
    Look everybody knows what happens to the richer spouse when you divorce them and in most cases its men and you get to divorce them and wrongfully take their money.

    Leave a comment:


  • Angel Barchild
    replied
    Re: divorce in islam vs west

    Originally posted by xFedal View Post
    it's no secret who gets shafted in court.
    Since divorce cases almost never make it court in the U.S. and divorce settlements are private, you really have no way of knowing if anyone gets "shafted".
    Unless you are implying you have personal knowledge of the marital statues of 150,000,000 men in the U.S.

    Leave a comment:


  • xFedal
    replied
    Re: divorce in islam vs west

    Originally posted by Angel Barchild View Post
    There are 300,000,000 people in the U.S. and around half of them are men, how can you claim to know men get a bad deal in "most cases"?
    it's no secret who gets shafted in court.

    Leave a comment:


  • Angel Barchild
    replied
    Re: divorce in islam vs west

    Originally posted by xFedal View Post
    thats true in most cases.
    There are 300,000,000 people in the U.S. and around half of them are men, how can you claim to know men get a bad deal in "most cases"?

    Leave a comment:


  • hassaan561
    replied
    Re: divorce in islam vs west

    Originally posted by xFedal View Post
    thats true in most cases.
    alright dude u made ur point...move on

    Leave a comment:


  • xFedal
    replied
    Re: divorce in islam vs west

    Originally posted by hassaan561 View Post
    thanks for the response sis...i don't know all the details but i just keep hearing that men get the bad deal when it comes to divorce that's why i was inquiring
    thats true in most cases.

    Leave a comment:


  • hassaan561
    replied
    Re: divorce in islam vs west

    Originally posted by Angel Barchild View Post
    You guys have some weird ideas on what goes on in the nebulous "west" with divorce. I live in the "west" the U.S. and we have 50 states, all of which have their own rules for divorce. On top of that, divorce is a civil matter here, and 99% of divorces are settled without any government intervention at all. People work out an agreement (sometimes with their lawyers involved sometimes not) and the judge just signs off on the divorce decree. Same with child custody, the default is joint legal custody, with people working out the details between them.

    As far as not getting legally married, in the U.S. that is a terrible idea. Just a few of the down sides are, having to pay estate tax on anything inherent from non legal spouse, no death benefits, in the U.S. you can not will government benefits to anyone it's only for your spouse and children, no right to make health care decisions, no right to make funeral/burial arrangements, and a big one, you can not be on your husbands health insurance if you are not legally married. The U.S. does not have free health care, if it's not an emergency, they do not have to treat you if you can't pay, and medical care is extremely expensive. A friend of mine spent four days in the hospital with pneumonia, she is uninsured, and is now $40,000 in debt.

    Here is a list of some of the rights that come with being legally married in the U.S. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rights_..._United_States
    thanks for the response sis...i don't know all the details but i just keep hearing that men get the bad deal when it comes to divorce that's why i was inquiring

    Leave a comment:


  • xFedal
    replied
    Re: divorce in islam vs west

    Originally posted by Grimmjow View Post
    And people have had many other experiences opposite of yours. Whats the point of arguing.
    I was saying the Islamic method is more fair, I dont see anything wrong in that.

    Leave a comment:


  • Angel Barchild
    replied
    Re: divorce in islam vs west

    You guys have some weird ideas on what goes on in the nebulous "west" with divorce. I live in the "west" the U.S. and we have 50 states, all of which have their own rules for divorce. On top of that, divorce is a civil matter here, and 99% of divorces are settled without any government intervention at all. People work out an agreement (sometimes with their lawyers involved sometimes not) and the judge just signs off on the divorce decree. Same with child custody, the default is joint legal custody, with people working out the details between them.

    As far as not getting legally married, in the U.S. that is a terrible idea. Just a few of the down sides are, having to pay estate tax on anything inherent from non legal spouse, no death benefits, in the U.S. you can not will government benefits to anyone it's only for your spouse and children, no right to make health care decisions, no right to make funeral/burial arrangements, and a big one, you can not be on your husbands health insurance if you are not legally married. The U.S. does not have free health care, if it's not an emergency, they do not have to treat you if you can't pay, and medical care is extremely expensive. A friend of mine spent four days in the hospital with pneumonia, she is uninsured, and is now $40,000 in debt.

    Here is a list of some of the rights that come with being legally married in the U.S. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rights_..._United_States

    Leave a comment:

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