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Wanting to marry a talib/talibah of knowledge

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  • #46
    Originally posted by .khayriyyah. View Post

    But what about when you and your kids need them? For example, I had gone to 9 or 10 people of knowledge in the community to be my wali and none of them were able to properly help. Many of them were too busy to help, so when I'd try to get in contact, there was no reply. I dealt with men on my own. I couldn't help but wonder how it must feel to be a family member or a wife. Of course they can prioritize and aren't going to give some revert and their family the same amount of attention, but I really doubt this doesn't spill into their personal life. That must be a trial on it's own.
    true, idk I didn't consider how my kids would fare. They read about Islam, but its odd that some don't apply the Prophet PBUH's way of dealing with his wives, even though he had the duty of Prophethood he also made lots of time for them.
    وَاقْصِدْ فِي مَشْيِكَ وَاغْضُضْ مِن صَوْتِكَ ۚ إِنَّ أَنكَرَ الْأَصْوَاتِ لَصَوْتُ الْحَمِيرِ - 31:19

    And be moderate in your pace and lower your voice; indeed, the most disagreeable of sounds is the voice of donkeys."


    أَلَمْ تَرَوْا أَنَّ اللَّهَ سَخَّرَ لَكُم مَّا فِي السَّمَاوَاتِ وَمَا فِي الْأَرْضِ وَأَسْبَغَ عَلَيْكُمْ نِعَمَهُ ظَاهِرَةً وَبَاطِنَةً ۗ وَمِنَ النَّاسِ مَن يُجَادِلُ فِي اللَّهِ بِغَيْرِ عِلْمٍ وَلَا هُدًى وَلَا كِتَابٍ مُّنِيرٍ - 31:20

    Do you not see that Allah has made subject to you whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth and amply bestowed upon you His favors, [both] apparent and unapparent? But of the people is he who disputes about Allah without knowledge or guidance or an enlightening Book [from Him].


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    • #47
      Originally posted by Kaas View Post

      Reminds me of a hadith i read the other day

      149. Abu Juhaifah (May Allah be pleased with him) reported: The Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) made a bond of brotherhood between Salman and Abud-Darda'. Salman paid a visit to Abud-Darda' and found Umm Darda' (his wife) dressed in shabby clothes and asked her why she was in that state. She replied: "Your brother Abud-Darda' is not interested in (the luxuries of) this world. In the meantime Abud-Darda' came in and prepared a meal for Salman. Salman requested Abud-Darda' to eat (with him) but Abud-Darda' said: "I am fasting.'' Salman said: "I am not going to eat unless you eat.'' So, Abud-Darda' ate (with Salman). When it was night and (a part of the night passed), Abud-Darda' got up (to offer the night prayer) but Salman asked him to sleep and Abud-Darda' slept. After some time Abud-Darda' again got up but Salman asked him to sleep. When it was the last hours of the night, Salman asked him to get up and both of them offered (Tahajjud) prayer. Then Salman told Abud-Darda': "You owe a duty to your Rubb, you owe a duty to your body; you owe a duty to your family; so you should give to every one his due. Abud-Darda' came to the Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) and reported the whole story. Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) said,"Salman is right".
      [Al-Bukhari].



      Either way, a husband can be busy wether he is a student of knowledge or not, some men are out of the house from morning till night for work, i think in that case you would have the advantage that a student of knowledge knows well enough not to neglect his wifes rights.
      They may know and understand the rights of their family, but it doesnt mean they'll care enough to implement that knowledge. I've known of sisters who were married to prominent people in the community and they ended up treating them like dirt. Of course not all of them were like that, but being knowledgeable doesn't mean they'll really care to be there for their family. A layperson may know the rights of their spouse and be better in this respect. I used to think having knowledge meant something, but I really don't think so anymore.
      وَمَنْ أَعْرَضَ عَنْ ذِكْرِي فَإِنَّ لَهُ مَعِيشَةً ضَنْكًا

      And whoever turns away from My remembrance – indeed, he will have a depressed life.
      (Quran 20:124)

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      • #48
        Originally posted by LailaTheMuslim View Post

        true, idk I didn't consider how my kids would fare. They read about Islam, but its odd that some don't apply the Prophet PBUH's way of dealing with his wives, even though he had the duty of Prophethood he also made lots of time for them.
        Yeah. The time you'd have to yourself would be short lived.

        May Allah guide us all.
        Last edited by .khayriyyah.; 16-03-19, 08:44 PM.
        وَمَنْ أَعْرَضَ عَنْ ذِكْرِي فَإِنَّ لَهُ مَعِيشَةً ضَنْكًا

        And whoever turns away from My remembrance – indeed, he will have a depressed life.
        (Quran 20:124)

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        • #49
          Originally posted by .khayriyyah. View Post
          I used to think having knowledge meant something, but I really don't think so anymore.
          Someone studying Islam is'nt a certificate of him being of good character, it doesnt even prove that the person is on haq or if he is even well grounded in knowledge.

          However the gems who have character, are well-grounded in islamic knowledge can also be found among these tulaab/ulama.

          Therefore the suitor who wants to marry talib/talibah still has to filter out.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by .khayriyyah. View Post

            But what about when you and your kids need them? For example, I had gone to 9 or 10 people of knowledge in the community to be my wali and none of them were able to properly help. Many of them were too busy to help, so when I'd try to get in contact, there was no reply. I dealt with men on my own. I couldn't help but wonder how it must feel to be a family member or a wife. Of course they can prioritize and aren't going to give some revert and their family the same amount of attention, but I really doubt this doesn't spill into their personal life. That must be a trial on it's own.
            The time is a real issue. I have been contemplating personally to enroll in an aalim program and the biggest problem is that we dont have funding, scholarships as we used to have in our history. So a student of knowledge is expected to earn as well as devote time to study Islam which is quite an issue. The only solution I thought to myself was to do part-time some freelancing as an engineer and then devote other time to studying Islam.

            Also the most critical part is when a person is studying, at this time he can only focus on earning minimum to survive. After aalim studies are finished, things may become easier.

            Ofcourse it cuts down the time that one could give to kids however this problem can be solved by a number of steps like having good relations with community. Like the wife can have other women, extended family to help out and likewise kids can go with uncles(friends or relatives of husband) to school etc.

            The main problem is'nt the time itself. A woman can be patient with a man of good character who loves her and cant give her enough time but cannot be patient with a man of bad character. I know sisters who have patiently waited(lived separately) due to visa issues after marriage because they were on good terms with the man. However if the woman is'nt on good terms, she will not be willing to sacrifice.

            ​​​​​​​As for your experience, I think the scholars/imams have an option to offer some services on optional charges like becoming a wali for a revert sister and meeting/investigating a bunch of suitors takes time therefore if the revert sister can afford, she can be charged optionally.
            ​​​​​​

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            • #51
              Originally posted by savo234 View Post

              Someone studying Islam is'nt a certificate of him being of good character, it doesnt even prove that the person is on haq or if he is even well grounded in knowledge.

              However the gems who have character, are well-grounded in islamic knowledge can also be found among these tulaab/ulama.

              Therefore the suitor who wants to marry talib/talibah still has to filter out.
              A lot of converts have a very naive view of the Muslim community that takes time to shake. At first I thought Muslims would be decent because of Islam, but then I realized that's really not the case. Then I thought people with knowledge would be decent because at least they studied and you'd expect them to implement what they learned, but you live and learn. I'm definitely not saying all of them are bad, but they're only human and the title of whatever they are or wherever they studied doesn't always mean they truly follow Islam.
              وَمَنْ أَعْرَضَ عَنْ ذِكْرِي فَإِنَّ لَهُ مَعِيشَةً ضَنْكًا

              And whoever turns away from My remembrance – indeed, he will have a depressed life.
              (Quran 20:124)

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              • #52
                Originally posted by Kaas View Post

                that would probably be an alright question to avoid a wife thats in sweatpants all the time lol
                No, it sounds awkward and slightly offensive to me. If he has a problem with the way she dresses at home after marriage he can talk to her about it and she can change. It's not a deal-breaker and not something that needs to be discussed before marriage.

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by Juwairiyyah View Post

                  No, it sounds awkward and slightly offensive to me. If he has a problem with the way she dresses at home after marriage he can talk to her about it and she can change. It's not a deal-breaker and not something that needs to be discussed before marriage.
                  Isn't it better to avoid those problems after marriage by discussing them beforehand?

                  Not everyone is willing to change. She might not agree with him.

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by Indefinable View Post

                    Isn't it better to avoid those problems after marriage by discussing them beforehand?

                    Not everyone is willing to change. She might not agree with him.
                    This is what happens most of the time

                    The expectation that someone will change their ways after marriage is a high one and quite risky.

                    It is definitely better to tell the person what you don't agree with or something you wouldn't like your spouse to wear or do.

                    'Whatever it be wherein ye differ, the decision thereof is with Allah: such is Allah my Lord: In Him I trust, and to Him I turn.' The Holy Qu'ran Al Shura (Consultation)

                    So, which of the favours of your lord will you deny? ~ Surah Ar Rahman

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Ya'sin View Post

                      This is what happens most of the time

                      The expectation that someone will change their ways after marriage is a high one and quite risky.

                      It is definitely better to tell the person what you don't agree with or something you wouldn't like your spouse to wear or do.
                      Exactly. It's a risk. Why take a risk with something so important.

                      It's better to ask all the necessary questions beforehand, see if you're on the same page and the go ahead. Way less drama.


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                      • #56
                        There's an assumption that religious people inc students of knowledge have their lives together or will make good choices but that's not necessarily true, you still have to do your research and ask questions. I've heard of a religious person who divorced his wife because she attended family weddings. Was this not discussed before and how can a person leave their children behind over this? If that was even the issue. Obviously the issues here might have been freemixing but if it was not discussed before you can't expect everyone to go your way.

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                        • #57
                          Originally posted by .khayriyyah. View Post

                          They may know and understand the rights of their family, but it doesnt mean they'll care enough to implement that knowledge. I've known of sisters who were married to prominent people in the community and they ended up treating them like dirt. Of course not all of them were like that, but being knowledgeable doesn't mean they'll really care to be there for their family. A layperson may know the rights of their spouse and be better in this respect. I used to think having knowledge meant something, but I really don't think so anymore.
                          Yea you may be right, but then that person of knowledge may be of those who knows but does not impliment, which may make him less religious than that layman... but then how do you know that before marrying him right
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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Kaas View Post

                            Yea you may be right, but then that person of knowledge may be of those who knows but does not impliment, which may make him less religious than that layman... but then how do you know that before marrying him right
                            Check out what people who are close to him have to say about his level of religious commitment and put your trust in Allah.
                            وَمَنْ أَعْرَضَ عَنْ ذِكْرِي فَإِنَّ لَهُ مَعِيشَةً ضَنْكًا

                            And whoever turns away from My remembrance – indeed, he will have a depressed life.
                            (Quran 20:124)

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