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I am a revert, Can I choose my wali when I'm ready to get married?

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  • neelu
    replied
    I think it's a good idea to start taking into consideration your choice of wali. Whilst you've come across some horror stories about convert marriages, the silver lining is that at least forewarned is forearmed, so that reduces the likelihood of you falling for the usual traps of getting married too soon, or for the wrong reasons, or getting duped by a passport monger or a bad wali who is superficially seen as a "pillar of the community". Abu Mubarak's advice on avoiding private interaction with a wali is very good.

    At least this means you know it's not a good idea to rush into such matters whilst you're still at an early stage of a steep learning curve. Take your time, nothing has to be decided in a hurry. Get to know your community well enough to get an idea of what people are like and take it from there. Niqab is not obligatory in Islam, but people choose to wear it in order to emulate the family of the Prophet (saw). Wearing the headscarf and jilbab/abaya is obligatory and the norms of modern society should not really have anything to do with whether you intend to wear it or not.
    Last edited by neelu; 16-05-18, 05:35 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • AbuMubarak
    replied
    Originally posted by ELM View Post

    You are right. I'm sorry. It's just hard when all this information is being thrown at me and I remember it all (arguments for and against, different positions, sects, etc) and everyone (outside this forum) is telling me to pick a side inadvertently by their actions. I have a case of too much too soon. I end up trying to discover what I believe about Sharia through arguing for or against to see if it holds up or I put my foot in it like Aisha and that's not right. Maybe I should take a break from studying the cogs of Islam and focus more on getting close to Allah, before I even bother with the rules and regulations...
    That's the best thing you've siad

    take it easy

    you don't eat dinner by swallowing the whole plate

    Leave a comment:


  • Abu julaybeeb
    replied
    Originally posted by ELM View Post

    The internet is a good and bad thing brother. It teaches me a lot about Islam, but it does not teach me what I should do with such knowledge, how I should examine it and know whether of not it is truthful. Is there a Hadith about how to filter knowledge? It is a problem because I am like a toddler, this is a whole new world for me having been raised with western ideals, and when I hear fifty different opinions at once, instead of focusing on what is important I feel I have to pick and choose using the skills I learned in a western critical thinking class instead of from the Quran and Hadith.

    Thanks to you I'm rethinking/questioning my stance on the Niqab.(and the fact that all schools of thought actually says it is a requirement, or very encouraged). So there is hope for me yet lol.
    You will hear a million opinioms from different people

    read the quran and read tafsir jalalayn(small exogenus about 7 to 800 pages to help understand quran so u dont intetpret it yourself which can be found as pdf on internet)

    read the sealed nectar( areehukul makhtum) a bio of the prophet

    stick to bukhari and muslim hadith books as they contain authentic hadiths that are reliable

    there is also al lulu wal marjan( pearls and corals a combination of bukhari and muslim and every single hadith is authentic 100% reliable)

    listen to scholars after first gain a foundation by reading quran tafsir bio and some hadith

    Leave a comment:


  • ELM
    replied
    Originally posted by Abu julaybeeb View Post
    Where do u hear so much when your not in a muslim area in the country
    The internet is a good and bad thing brother. It teaches me a lot about Islam, but it does not teach me what I should do with such knowledge, how I should examine it and know whether of not it is truthful. Is there a Hadith about how to filter knowledge? It is a problem because I am like a toddler, this is a whole new world for me having been raised with western ideals, and when I hear fifty different opinions at once, instead of focusing on what is important I feel I have to pick and choose using the skills I learned in a western critical thinking class instead of from the Quran and Hadith.

    Thanks to you I'm rethinking/questioning my stance on the Niqab.(and the fact that all schools of thought actually says it is a requirement, or very encouraged). So there is hope for me yet lol.

    Leave a comment:


  • Abu julaybeeb
    replied
    Where do u hear so much when your not in a muslim area in the country

    Leave a comment:


  • ELM
    replied
    Originally posted by AbuMubarak View Post
    I am not telling you what to wear. I am saying don't make definitive statements about niqab or Aisha or even "what we should do today"

    You are new. Act like it
    You are right. I'm sorry. It's just hard when all this information is being thrown at me and I remember it all (arguments for and against, different positions, sects, etc) and everyone (outside this forum) is telling me to pick a side inadvertently by their actions. I have a case of too much too soon. I end up trying to discover what I believe about Sharia through arguing for or against to see if it holds up or I put my foot in it like Aisha and that's not right. Maybe I should take a break from studying the cogs of Islam and focus more on getting close to Allah, before I even bother with the rules and regulations...

    Leave a comment:


  • AbuMubarak
    replied
    I am not telling you what to wear. I am saying don't make definitive statements about niqab or Aisha or even "what we should do today"

    You are new. Act like it

    Leave a comment:


  • ELM
    replied
    Originally posted by AbuMubarak View Post
    Sister, we are to emulate the best of people, not fear the worst of people

    stay away from the "does it apply today?" mentality. It is full of pitfalls

    Though we may abused for being Muslim, that is not what is meant by that what.

    It is the protection from lewdness and illicit looks and behavior

    That does not mean you have a forcefield of protection from physical attack, but a modest woman gets treated with more respect than an immodest woman, in every society

    our modesty is outlined by our religion, ,not temporal social mores
    Yes you are right, but are we really truly respected or are we misunderstood, shamed for it, in fear of violence, etc. Doesn't it reflect badly back to the men in our lives as well? Even if we were the ones to make that choice, someone will always say no matter what you tell them: You are being brainwashed.

    Another thing, If the men don't have modestly they will always be looking at someone wondering what's underneath the veil, I've heard of sisters getting compliments on their eyes, and even feet/ ankles if they are showing accidentally. Should we be like Afghanistan then and cover all the way up, not even allowing our eyes to be seen? but men will still look it is in their nature (according to the Quran and Hadith), but at some point the responsibility has to be passed over to men to keep their eyes to themselves, especially when us women are trying our best.

    I want to wear the veil (probably not black though, because I love colour and patterns too much) Insha Allah, not because men won't look at me (not my problem if I'm covered). I'd be wearing it for the comfort of knowing that no one can judge me for how I appear, but for the quality of my mind, and that I'm going against everyone who teaches that the more of ourselves we show the better woman we are. So it is more of a rejection of modern culture and an embracing of Islamic ideals.
    Last edited by ELM; 14-05-18, 05:07 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • AbuMubarak
    replied
    Sister, we are to emulate the best of people, not fear the worst of people

    stay away from the "does it apply today?" mentality. It is full of pitfalls

    Though we may abused for being Muslim, that is not what is meant by that what.

    It is the protection from lewdness and illicit looks and behavior

    That does not mean you have a forcefield of protection from physical attack, but a modest woman gets treated with more respect than an immodest woman, in every society

    our modesty is outlined by our religion, ,not temporal social mores

    Leave a comment:


  • ELM
    replied
    Originally posted by AbuMubarak View Post
    Why do you say Niqab is only for the prophets wives? Have you excelled in your knowledge of Islam to make such definitive statements?
    I looked it up and you are right it does say women believers but it also says "so that they may not be abused", um in this world unless a woman is in the middle east, she'll get A LOT of abuse for wearing the veil, even physical, so it was definitely not a modesty thing, more for protection from the surrounding tribes (The veil was a Jewish and Christian garb at the time history tells us as much). The real question is "Does it apply today?" "Is the Quran telling us that we need to blend in to local customs so we are not abused?".

    Leave a comment:


  • Abu julaybeeb
    replied
    Niqaab was for all women not just the prophets wives

    thats why in the quran ayat in surah ahzab it says tell the prophets wives and the believing women

    Leave a comment:


  • AbuMubarak
    replied
    Why do you say Niqab is only for the prophets wives? Have you excelled in your knowledge of Islam to make such definitive statements?

    Leave a comment:


  • ELM
    replied
    Originally posted by Abu julaybeeb View Post

    Take your time study the religion

    but know that we have to stick to the quran and sunnah yes we stick to the fundamentals theres nithing wrong with that infact this should be what we do and we stick by that more then the views of scholars (im not saying neglect scholars and histort and context u need all of it but quran sunnah then scholars history etc)


    An-Nahl 16:89

    وَيَوْمَ نَبْعَثُ فِى كُلِّ أُمَّةٍ شَهِيدًا عَلَيْهِم مِّنْ أَنفُسِهِمْۖ وَجِئْنَا بِكَ شَهِيدًا عَلَىٰ هَٰٓؤُلَآءِۚ وَنَزَّلْنَا عَلَيْكَ ٱلْكِتَٰبَ تِبْيَٰنًا لِّكُلِّ شَىْءٍ وَهُدًى وَرَحْمَةً وَبُشْرَىٰ لِلْمُسْلِمِينَ

    And [mention] the Day when We will resurrect among every nation a witness over them from themselves. And We will bring you, [O Muhammad], as a witness over your nation. And We have sent down to you the Book as clarification for all things and as guidance and mercy and good tidings for the muslims.

    Al-Ma'idah 5:3

    حُرِّمَتْ عَلَيْكُمُ ٱلْمَيْتَةُ وَٱلدَّمُ وَلَحْمُ ٱلْخِنزِيرِ وَمَآ أُهِلَّ لِغَيْرِ ٱللَّهِ بِهِۧ وَٱلْمُنْخَنِقَةُ وَٱلْمَوْقُوذَةُ وَٱلْمُتَرَدِّيَةُ وَٱلنَّطِيحَةُ وَمَآ أَكَلَ ٱلسَّبُعُ إِلَّا مَا ذَكَّيْتُمْ وَمَا ذُبِحَ عَلَى ٱلنُّصُبِ وَأَن تَسْتَقْسِمُوا بِٱلْأَزْلَٰمِۚ ذَٰلِكُمْ فِسْقٌۗ ٱلْيَوْمَ يَئِسَ ٱلَّذِينَ كَفَرُوا مِن دِينِكُمْ فَلَا تَخْشَوْهُمْ وَٱخْشَوْنِۚ ٱلْيَوْمَ أَكْمَلْتُ لَكُمْ دِينَكُمْ وَأَتْمَمْتُ عَلَيْكُمْ نِعْمَتِى وَرَضِيتُ لَكُمُ ٱلْإِسْلَٰمَ دِينًاۚ فَمَنِ ٱضْطُرَّ فِى مَخْمَصَةٍ غَيْرَ مُتَجَانِفٍ لِّإِثْمٍۙ فَإِنَّ ٱللَّهَ غَفُورٌ رَّحِيمٌ

    Prohibited to you are dead animals, blood, the flesh of swine, and that which has been dedicated to other than Allah, and [those animals] killed by strangling or by a violent blow or by a head-long fall or by the goring of horns, and those from which a wild animal has eaten, except what you [are able to] slaughter [before its death], and those which are sacrificed on stone altars, and [prohibited is] that you seek decision through divining arrows. That is grave disobedience. This day those who disbelieve have despaired of [defeating] your religion; so fear them not, but fear Me. This day I have perfected for you your religion and completed My favor upon you and have approved for you Islam as religion. But whoever is forced by severe hunger with no inclination to sin - then indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful.

    Allah says in the quran this book is clarrification for all things and Allah says this day i have perfected for you your religion

    so Allahs saying the quran is guidance for everything and its perfect so anyone who says a part of it cant be applied today or tomorrow due to whatever situation time or so on does not know what their on about unless they can provide islamic evidence from the quran and sunnah

    An-Najm 53:3

    وَمَا يَنطِقُ عَنِ ٱلْهَوَىٰٓ

    Nor does he speak from [his own] inclination.

    get Quran App:https://goo.gl/w6rESk
    An-Najm 53:4

    إِنْ هُوَ إِلَّا وَحْىٌ يُوحَىٰ

    It is not but a revelation revealed,

    get Quran App:https://goo.gl/w6rESk

    and the sunnah is from Allah as stated in the quran the prophet doesnt speak from inclination he speaks from revelation so yes above the scholars we stick to the quran and hadith thus sunnah
    but at them same time we should listen to scholars as they know more than us but not blindly follow
    Priority should be quran and sunnah as this is from allah because outside of that is only desires and this is from creation
    Not saying the opposite brother, but we need to know why we believe in what we believe.

    I want to wear the Niqab Insha Allah, not because it is mandatory (because It was only meant for the prophet's (peace be upon him) woman folk), but because like the prophet's (peace be upon him) wives I want to protect myself from gossip and slander, and have that extra layer reminding me to watch my words (I'm a bit of a loudmouth if you couldn't tell and that trait gets me into trouble).

    I know about the battles in the Quran, which gives context to what is being said, if you take away the context you can have brothers and sisters who think the Quran encourages the all out massacre of infidels and Jews when in fact the first agreement between the religions was from Muhammad (peace be upon him) in Medina, and how he spared the lives of the Meccans who had tortured the Umma for so long once they asked forgiveness.

    See how it adds so much richness to the Quran to know the context of such things? The same is true for the Hadith. I'm fundamentalist in the sense that I want to see what was going on so I can better follow the teachings of Allah, because some meanings are skin deep (don't eat pork), while others need context to be followed and/or understood properly like in the Quran where Allah says that the Arabs can be the worst of hypocrites, why would Allah say such a thing? What can we learn from that? Etc.

    The Quran itself encourages us to examine it thoroughly and not just follow with no understanding beyond the skin deep. Now saying this I do not know if the Salafi's do this, but from what I've seen they are generally VERY literal and that is problematic. Not to mention it is a political movement too... and I know that some of the leaders have endorsed some very shady (dark) things.

    I might be a newbie, but I do A LOT of research and I have a lot of prior experiences that has helped me understand all different sorts of religious mindsets.

    Leave a comment:


  • Abu julaybeeb
    replied
    Originally posted by ELM View Post

    Black just isn't my colour brother lol and the Niqab is a choice (a choice I want to make someday Insha Allah). And the even bigger reason why I'd run is that I was raised by a theologian and even though he was Christian he taught me that it is dangerous not to have a historical/situational/cultural context to any religious text (If you go to an Islamic school, or listen to a Muslim Scholar they will say the same thing unless they are Salafi).

    I've seen fundamentalist Christians do the most nastiest down right "Un-christian" things because they do not understand the historical/situational context of Deuteronomy or Paul's letters (like beating their wives and children to a pulp for no reason and using the Bible as an excuse). It's true with Muslims too. I'm not saying Salafis are bad or un-Muslim, but it is a slippery slope affect when you read the Quran/Hadiths and have no knowledge of it's context, and then you have scholars who are preaching at you their political agenda "straight out of the Hadiths".
    Take your time study the religion

    but know that we have to stick to the quran and sunnah yes we stick to the fundamentals theres nithing wrong with that infact this should be what we do and we stick by that more then the views of scholars (im not saying neglect scholars and histort and context u need all of it but quran sunnah then scholars history etc)


    An-Nahl 16:89

    وَيَوْمَ نَبْعَثُ فِى كُلِّ أُمَّةٍ شَهِيدًا عَلَيْهِم مِّنْ أَنفُسِهِمْۖ وَجِئْنَا بِكَ شَهِيدًا عَلَىٰ هَٰٓؤُلَآءِۚ وَنَزَّلْنَا عَلَيْكَ ٱلْكِتَٰبَ تِبْيَٰنًا لِّكُلِّ شَىْءٍ وَهُدًى وَرَحْمَةً وَبُشْرَىٰ لِلْمُسْلِمِينَ

    And [mention] the Day when We will resurrect among every nation a witness over them from themselves. And We will bring you, [O Muhammad], as a witness over your nation. And We have sent down to you the Book as clarification for all things and as guidance and mercy and good tidings for the muslims.

    Al-Ma'idah 5:3

    حُرِّمَتْ عَلَيْكُمُ ٱلْمَيْتَةُ وَٱلدَّمُ وَلَحْمُ ٱلْخِنزِيرِ وَمَآ أُهِلَّ لِغَيْرِ ٱللَّهِ بِهِۧ وَٱلْمُنْخَنِقَةُ وَٱلْمَوْقُوذَةُ وَٱلْمُتَرَدِّيَةُ وَٱلنَّطِيحَةُ وَمَآ أَكَلَ ٱلسَّبُعُ إِلَّا مَا ذَكَّيْتُمْ وَمَا ذُبِحَ عَلَى ٱلنُّصُبِ وَأَن تَسْتَقْسِمُوا بِٱلْأَزْلَٰمِۚ ذَٰلِكُمْ فِسْقٌۗ ٱلْيَوْمَ يَئِسَ ٱلَّذِينَ كَفَرُوا مِن دِينِكُمْ فَلَا تَخْشَوْهُمْ وَٱخْشَوْنِۚ ٱلْيَوْمَ أَكْمَلْتُ لَكُمْ دِينَكُمْ وَأَتْمَمْتُ عَلَيْكُمْ نِعْمَتِى وَرَضِيتُ لَكُمُ ٱلْإِسْلَٰمَ دِينًاۚ فَمَنِ ٱضْطُرَّ فِى مَخْمَصَةٍ غَيْرَ مُتَجَانِفٍ لِّإِثْمٍۙ فَإِنَّ ٱللَّهَ غَفُورٌ رَّحِيمٌ

    Prohibited to you are dead animals, blood, the flesh of swine, and that which has been dedicated to other than Allah, and [those animals] killed by strangling or by a violent blow or by a head-long fall or by the goring of horns, and those from which a wild animal has eaten, except what you [are able to] slaughter [before its death], and those which are sacrificed on stone altars, and [prohibited is] that you seek decision through divining arrows. That is grave disobedience. This day those who disbelieve have despaired of [defeating] your religion; so fear them not, but fear Me. This day I have perfected for you your religion and completed My favor upon you and have approved for you Islam as religion. But whoever is forced by severe hunger with no inclination to sin - then indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful.

    Allah says in the quran this book is clarrification for all things and Allah says this day i have perfected for you your religion

    so Allahs saying the quran is guidance for everything and its perfect so anyone who says a part of it cant be applied today or tomorrow due to whatever situation time or so on does not know what their on about unless they can provide islamic evidence from the quran and sunnah

    An-Najm 53:3

    وَمَا يَنطِقُ عَنِ ٱلْهَوَىٰٓ

    Nor does he speak from [his own] inclination.

    get Quran App:https://goo.gl/w6rESk
    An-Najm 53:4

    إِنْ هُوَ إِلَّا وَحْىٌ يُوحَىٰ

    It is not but a revelation revealed,

    get Quran App:https://goo.gl/w6rESk

    and the sunnah is from Allah as stated in the quran the prophet doesnt speak from inclination he speaks from revelation so yes above the scholars we stick to the quran and hadith thus sunnah
    but at them same time we should listen to scholars as they know more than us but not blindly follow
    Priority should be quran and sunnah as this is from allah because outside of that is only desires and this is from creation

    Leave a comment:


  • .khayriyyah.
    replied
    Originally posted by ELM View Post

    Black just isn't my colour brother lol and the Niqab is a choice (a choice I want to make someday Insha Allah). And the even bigger reason why I'd run is that I was raised by a theologian and even though he was Christian he taught me that it is dangerous not to have a historical/situational/cultural context to any religious text (If you go to an Islamic school, or listen to a Muslim Scholar they will say the same thing unless they are Salafi).

    I've seen fundamentalist Christians do the most nastiest down right "Un-christian" things because they do not understand the historical/situational context of Deuteronomy or Paul's letters (like beating their wives and children to a pulp for no reason and using the Bible as an excuse). It's true with Muslims too. I'm not saying Salafis are bad or un-Muslim, but it is a slippery slope affect when you read the Quran/Hadiths and have no knowledge of it's context, and then you have scholars who are preaching at you their political agenda "straight out of the Hadiths".
    You don't have to wear black, many scholars say it's preferable but not mandatory. And about the niqab, there is debate around it, but in the end believing that the niqab isn't mandatory doesn't remove someone from ahlus sunnah. Shaykh al Albani didn't consider the niqab to be fard and no one considered him to be an innovator for that. He's still regarded as one of the major scholars.

    I'm not sure what you mean by taking the Quran and sunnah out of context.
    https://islamqa.info/en/20760

    Leave a comment:

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