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  • Women passing in front while praying

    Assalamu 'alaykum

    When I pray in the praying room, even sutrah (the wall), there are women who will pass in front of me rather than behind me even though I leave space for them to pass. I repeated dhur 3 times because of this. Does anyone know if the ruling differs with regards to women (women passing women in front during prayer)? If it doesn't differ, does anyone have any tips? It's very annoying. There's always a corner/place where it's safe from that because people don't generally pass there but most of the time it's full which means I can't always wait for it to empty because of time limit.

  • #2
    Re: Women passing in front while praying

    Originally posted by Sarah5 View Post
    Assalamu 'alaykum

    When I pray in the praying room, even sutrah (the wall), there are women who will pass in front of me rather than behind me even though I leave space for them to pass. I repeated dhur 3 times because of this. Does anyone know if the ruling differs with regards to women (women passing women in front during prayer)? If it doesn't differ, does anyone have any tips? It's very annoying. There's always a corner/place where it's safe from that because people don't generally pass there but most of the time it's full which means I can't always wait for it to empty because of time limit.
    Asalaamualaykum
    You going to have different opinions regarding this topic. One hanafi opinion regarding this matter is that your salaah will not break.
    It makes sense to me as if you have to repeat the salaah, then you will build an OCD complex amongst the people praying. They will end up rushing and diving and fighting just to pray in a secured area.
    There is no Shariah ruling on exactly how far the Sutrah should be so it will differ from country to country as per the custom.
    Does the pain weigh out the pride? And you look for a place to hide,
    Did someone break your heart inside, You're in ruins.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Women passing in front while praying

      I couldn't find a translation:

      " السترة للمصلي سنة في حق الرجل والمرأة ، ولا يجوز لكل منهما المرور بين يدي المصلي أو بينه وبين سترته ، سواء كان المصلي رجلاً أو امرأة ، وسواء كان المار امرأة أو رجلاً ، لكن إن كان المار امرأة قطعت صلاة من مرت بين يديه أو بينه وبين سترته إلا في المسجد الحرام ، فيعفى عن ذلك لعدم إمكان التحرز منه ، وقد قال الله عز وجل : ( فَاتَّقُوا اللَّهَ مَا اسْتَطَعْتُمْ ) ، وقال سبحانه : ( وَمَا جَعَلَ عَلَيْكُمْ فِي الدِّينِ مِنْ حَرَجٍ ) " انتهى من "فتاوى اللجنة الدائمة" (7 /87) .
      وقال الشيخ ابن عثيمين رحمه الله :
      " المرأة تقطع صلاة المرأة كما تقطع صلاة الرجل " انتهى من "لقاء الباب المفتوح" (78 /9) .
      وقال الشيخ الألباني رحمه الله :
      " الصلاة تنقطع ولو كانت المصلية امرأة والمارة امرأة ؛ لأن الخطاب لجميع الأمة " انتهى .


      So it seems your salah is invalid if she walks between you and the sutrah. But you should be really close to the sutrah -- as close as possible. If she still tries to pass, you have to prevent her.

      بارك الله فيكم

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Women passing in front while praying

        Originally posted by R2-D2 View Post
        Asalaamualaykum
        You going to have different opinions regarding this topic. One hanafi opinion regarding this matter is that your salaah will not break.
        It makes sense to me as if you have to repeat the salaah, then you will build an OCD complex amongst the people praying. They will end up rushing and diving and fighting just to pray in a secured area.
        There is no Shariah ruling on exactly how far the Sutrah should be so it will differ from country to country as per the custom.
        I believe the Sunnah indicates how close the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم used to be to his sutrah.

        Comment


        • #5
          Wa alaykum Salam

          Why are you not physically stopping them? You need to do this, if they are daring enough, use your arm and push them back.

          This is not acceptable.
          You think you know more than my scholar's qiyās? He was more learned than you and all other scholars combined. Yeah, the devil was the greatest scholar too and look where his qiyās of fire being better than tīn got him. Sorry.

          You follow your scholar's qiyās, and I will follow the Qur'ān and Sunnah.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Women passing in front while praying

            Originally posted by A.Basheer View Post
            I believe the Sunnah indicates how close the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم used to be to his sutrah.
            As I said - There would be different opinions regarding this matter. As far as I know - there is no real definition on that which is what lead to that opinion in the first place.
            Does the pain weigh out the pride? And you look for a place to hide,
            Did someone break your heart inside, You're in ruins.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Women passing in front while praying

              Originally posted by R2-D2 View Post
              As I said - There would be different opinions regarding this matter. As far as I know - there is no real definition on that which is what lead to that opinion in the first place.
              You didn't say there was a difference of opinion about the distance from the sutrah. You said There is no Shar'iah ruling....
              Last edited by Abu Abdur_Rahman; 15-11-16, 09:12 PM.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Women passing in front while praying

                Originally posted by A.Basheer View Post
                You didn't say there was a difference of opinion about the distance from the sutrah. You said There is no Shar'iah ruling....
                And i will say it again : there is no Shariah Ruling on how far that sutrah is
                Does the pain weigh out the pride? And you look for a place to hide,
                Did someone break your heart inside, You're in ruins.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Women passing in front while praying

                  Originally posted by R2-D2 View Post
                  Asalaamualaykum
                  You going to have different opinions regarding this topic. One hanafi opinion regarding this matter is that your salaah will not break.
                  It makes sense to me as if you have to repeat the salaah, then you will build an OCD complex amongst the people praying. They will end up rushing and diving and fighting just to pray in a secured area.
                  There is no Shariah ruling on exactly how far the Sutrah should be so it will differ from country to country as per the custom.
                  Brother I get so close that when I do sujood, my head touches the wall, and I believe the sutrah should be enough to allow a sheep to pass through (so enough to make sujood) however, it can extend to about 3 cubits (I think, but I am not sure so forgive me if I am wrong). And you are right, I end up having to rush because there are those who go in front and those who go in the back, usually they don't cut my prayer, but if someone gets close and I am in a position where I cannot move (jalsa) I end up rushing. :jkk:

                  Originally posted by A.Basheer View Post
                  I couldn't find a translation:

                  " السترة للمصلي سنة في حق الرجل والمرأة ، ولا يجوز لكل منهما المرور بين يدي المصلي أو بينه وبين سترته ، سواء كان المصلي رجلاً أو امرأة ، وسواء كان المار امرأة أو رجلاً ، لكن إن كان المار امرأة قطعت صلاة من مرت بين يديه أو بينه وبين سترته إلا في المسجد الحرام ، فيعفى عن ذلك لعدم إمكان التحرز منه ، وقد قال الله عز وجل : ( فَاتَّقُوا اللَّهَ مَا اسْتَطَعْتُمْ ) ، وقال سبحانه : ( وَمَا جَعَلَ عَلَيْكُمْ فِي الدِّينِ مِنْ حَرَجٍ ) " انتهى من "فتاوى اللجنة الدائمة" (7 /87) .
                  وقال الشيخ ابن عثيمين رحمه الله :
                  " المرأة تقطع صلاة المرأة كما تقطع صلاة الرجل " انتهى من "لقاء الباب المفتوح" (78 /9) .
                  وقال الشيخ الألباني رحمه الله :
                  " الصلاة تنقطع ولو كانت المصلية امرأة والمارة امرأة ؛ لأن الخطاب لجميع الأمة " انتهى .


                  So it seems your salah is invalid if she walks between you and the sutrah. But you should be really close to the sutrah -- as close as possible. If she still tries to pass, you have to prevent her.

                  بارك الله فيكم
                  :jkk: Alhamdulillah I was able to understand. And brother I get so close that when I do sujood my head touches the wall, and when I am in a vulnerable position like jalsa, it's impossible to move forward (to block their passage). I would try to find a secluded area to pray but my only problem is that I don't know the direction of Qibla and the wifi has terrible signal so the Qibla app I use will give me a false direction.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Women passing in front while praying

                    Originally posted by R2-D2 View Post
                    And i will say it again : there is no Shariah Ruling on how far that sutrah is
                    Ajeeb wallahi.

                    Some of them said that the distance is three cubits from the feet of the one who is praying, because the Prophet (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) prayed in the Ka‘bah with three cubits between him and the wall. Narrated by al-Bukhaari (506). This is the view of the Hanafis, Shaafa‘is and Hanbalis, and it is what may be understood from the words of Maalik, because the distance between the one who is praying and the sutrah should be as much as he needs to stand, bow and prostrate.

                    See: al-Mawsoo‘ah al-Fiqhiyyah (24/184).

                    Others were of the view that the distance should be sufficient to allow a sheep to pass, from the place where the worshipper prostrates, because of the report narrated by al-Bukhaari (474) and Muslim (508) from Sahl ibn Sa‘d (may Allah be pleased with him) who said: Between the place where the Messenger of Allaah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) prayed and the wall there was a space where a sheep could pass

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Women passing in front while praying

                      I actually didn't know walking through breaks the salah. This happens a lot actually , especially during the busy ramadan.. never saw anyone renew their salah due to it.

                      Is there not a hadith that says you should physically stop the person?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Women passing in front while praying

                        Originally posted by Linkdeutscher View Post
                        Wa alaykum Salam

                        Why are you not physically stopping them? You need to do this, if they are daring enough, use your arm and push them back.

                        This is not acceptable.
                        This mainly happens when I am doing ruku' and I don't see them or I am in jalsa, and they pass so quickly (thinking it helps or something).

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by AmantuBillahi View Post
                          I actually didn't know walking through breaks the salah. This happens a lot actually , especially during the busy ramadan.. never saw anyone renew their salah due to it.

                          Is there not a hadith that says you should physically stop the person?
                          It's limited to a woman, a dog (black? not sure) and a donkey.

                          If a man passes in front of you it is fine. Also some scholars said these three things don't literally break your prayer, rather they affect its perfection, like loss of khushoo.

                          Yes there is a hadeeth where such a person was called a shaytaan by RasoolAllah صلى الله عليه وسلم.
                          You think you know more than my scholar's qiyās? He was more learned than you and all other scholars combined. Yeah, the devil was the greatest scholar too and look where his qiyās of fire being better than tīn got him. Sorry.

                          You follow your scholar's qiyās, and I will follow the Qur'ān and Sunnah.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Women passing in front while praying

                            Originally posted by AmantuBillahi View Post
                            I actually didn't know walking through breaks the salah. This happens a lot actually , especially during the busy ramadan.. never saw anyone renew their salah due to it.

                            Is there not a hadith that says you should physically stop the person?
                            Three things brother, if a woman, a black dog and a donkey pass, it breaks prayer UNLESS praying behind an imam, in which case, the imam's sutrah is your sutrah. Allah SWT knows best please anyone correct me if I am wrong.
                            Last edited by Sarah5; 15-11-16, 09:41 PM. Reason: black dog

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Women passing in front while praying

                              Originally posted by Linkdeutscher View Post
                              It's limited to a woman, a dog (black? not sure) and a donkey.

                              If a man passes in front of you it is fine. Also some scholars said these three things don't literally break your prayer, rather they affect its perfection, like loss of khushoo.

                              Yes there is a hadeeth where such a person was called a shaytaan by RasoolAllah صلى الله عليه وسلم.
                              You are correct - Black dog
                              Does the pain weigh out the pride? And you look for a place to hide,
                              Did someone break your heart inside, You're in ruins.

                              Comment

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