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  • #31
    Originally posted by lonely_me


    (I NEVER refer to WEAK Hadiths ;) )
    Yes, but you refer to weak understanding of the Hadiths ;)


    Also, if I may add, you cannot take one Hadith in isolation, ignoring the other relevant Ahadith and the understanding of the companions on this issue.


    Oh, and that Hadith has been discussed in the above two articles. Read, in the name of thy Lord.
    www.marifah.info

    Wahhabis Refuted
    Ash'aris

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    • #32
      I rest my case... but I take none of what I posted back. It's just that I'm not a scholar and would never want to CLAIM knowledge! I'm not in the position to issue a fatwa... and I'm not a jew to go on arguing and conducting fruitless conversations when facts can speak for themselves... You're entitled to your opinion and true...Allah knows BEST!
      May Allah forgive my shortcomings and guide me to the right path ... and May He take me Muslimah...Mu'minah... Oh Allah we beg of You through Your infinite mercy which encompasses everything to forgive all our sins...Oh Allah Grant us good in this world and good in the life to come and keep us safe from the torment of the Fire..Bestow on us endurance and make our foothold sure and give us help against those who reject faith. Let not our hearts deviate from the truth after You have guided us!

      Ameen


      sis Star... May Allah bless your heart... help those relatives of yours get rid of such things... gradually people will start believing in those charms' power and that would surely affect their tawheed...and Allah ALONE knows best. Take care.

      Life goes on ...

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      • #33
        okay now i am confused again....

        i feel perpetually confused on this forum, may Allah guide me to the right path.

        brother Faqir (it is bro' right?) I had assumed that this post:
        http://www.ummah.com/forum/showpost....9&postcount=21
        was directed at me. am i wrong in this assumption? (my assumptions are usually wrong..)

        and as for the taveez... i don't like the whole idea. it doesn't sound logical to me.

        for example: someone got a thaveez for someone i know for them to get married soon. when they lost the thaveez (and still are not married) people began to say that it was a sign form Allah that this person would not get married...

        is that not problematic to you brother faqir?
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        • #34
          PS... In Cape Town we've got the same type of thing... We call it taweez (same type of thing) and there's also this practise of writing verses with saffron water on a tray, rinsing it with water and drinking the water. The "holy men/women" are called Tuans (I think it's derived from a malaysian word meaning teacher or leader).

          This is a very good post, because I wondered the self-same thing many times. There are also people here who do exorcisms of the evil eye, and bala'in from people.

          I'm not too sure on the Ulamah's take on this though. It's more widespread than I thought.
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          • #35
            Ponderingstar - witchcraft etc... is true.

            QUESTION:
            What is the way to deal with sihr (magic/witchcraft)?
            ANSWER :
            Praise be to Allaah.


            [al-Munaafiqoon 63:11]

            Soorat al-FaatihahshirkAl-Faatihah, Aayat al-KursiyQul Huwa Allaahu Ahadshirk
            Allaah may heal the sick person and the person affected by sihr, and others, without any ruqyah and without any action on the part of other people, because He is Able to do all things, and He is Wise in all that He does. Allaah says in His Holy Book:
            [Yaa-Seen 36:82]
            To Him be praise and thanks for all that He wills and decrees, for He is wise in all that He does.
            The sick person may not be healed if his appointed time has come and it is decreed that he should die from this disease. Among the things that may be used in ruqyah are the verses which speak of sihr, which may be recited into water. These are the verses about sihr in , where Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

            Thus truth was confirmed, and all that they did was made of no effect.
            So they were defeated there and returned disgraced

            And in Soorat Yoonus (interpretation of the meaning):




            [Yoonus 10:79-82]
            And in Soorat Ta-Ha (interpretation of the meaning):


            So Moosa conceived fear in himself.


            [Ta-Ha 20:65-69]
            Soorat al-Faatiha, Aayat al-KursiyQul Huwa Allaahu AhadFath al-Majeed, quoting from some of the scholars in the chapter entitled -Nushrah. It is mustahabb to recite the three soorahs, namely Qul Huwa Allaahu Ahad, and il-Naas. The point is that these and similar treatments which are used to treat this problem of sihr, may also be used to treat the one who is prevented by magic from having intercourse with his wife. This has been tried a great deal and Allaah caused it to yield results. A person may be treated with al-Faatihah alone and be healed, or with Qul Huwa Allaahu Ahad and
            __________________________________________________ ____
            QUESTION:
            Is sihr (magic, witchcraft) real? Does it have any effect? What are its types?

            ANSWER :
            Praise be to Allaah.
            Praise be to Allaah and blessings and peace be upon the Messenger of Allaah, and his family and companions and those who follow his guidance.


            Sihr is so called because its means are hidden or secret, and because the practitioners of sihr deal with things in secret which enable them to perform illusions to confuse the people and deceive their eyes, and to cause them harm or steal their money, etc., in a secretive manner so that in most cases nobody realizes what is happening. Hence the last part of the night is called sahar, because at the end of the night people are unaware and they do not move about much. And the lungs are also called sahr, because they are hidden inside the body.



            So Moosa conceived fear in himself.


            [Ta-Ha 20:65-69]

            [al-Falaq 113:4]


            [al-Baqarah 2:102]
            Allaah informs us that they (the shayaateen) committed kufr by teaching men magic. Then He says (interpretation of the meaning):
            [al-Baqarah 2:102]
            Then Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
            [al-Baqarah 2:102]


            [al-Baqarah 2:102]

            Verily, We have created all things with Qadar (Divine Preordainments of all things before their creation as written in the Book of Decrees Al‑Lawh Al‑Mahfooz)[al-Qamar 54:49]

            [al-Hadeed 57:22]
            The evils that come at the hands of the magicians or others do not happen because our Lord is ignorant, for He knows all things and nothing at all is hidden from Him, as He says (interpretation of the meaning):
            [al-Anfaal 8:75]
            [al-Talaaq 65:12]
            So Allaah knows all things, and nothing happens in His Dominion that He does not will, but He has perfect wisdom and good aims in whatever He decrees should happen to people of honour or humiliation, losing or gaining power, sickness or health, magic and other things.
            Everything that happens to people happens by the will of Allaah and in accordance with His prior decree. These magicians may perform their illusions, as stated in the aayah quoted above (interpretation of the meaning):

            [Ta-Ha 20:65-66]
            It appeared to the onlooker as if these sticks and ropes were snakes, moving fast in the valley. They were only sticks and ropes, but the magicians, through what they had learned, made what they demonstrated before the people look different in their eyes to what it really was.
            Allaah says (interpretation if the meaning):

            [Ta-Ha 20:66]


            taqmeer (interpretation of the meaning):

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            • #36
              i am not doubting witchcraft brother i am doubting the fact that almost EVERY desi household in london feels they have had witchraft practiced against them.

              I am also doubting whether it is wise to have other people do things on your behalf, like read Quran etc. NOt just if the person is incapable but also if the person is absolutely able to do such things himself but instead goes to a man to read verses on water and then drink them. (like if a man can't get a job, instead of prayeing to Allah for guidance and being proactive by applying like crazy, he might just go to a bazurq and ask him for help. THe bazurq it seems to me, inevitably tells this guy that he has a curse in him and tells him to drink some of thjis water or wear a taveez etc.WHy not getthe man to read some verses of teh Quran himself? OR how about her tell him to get his lazy butt on the internet and apply for some jobs?)

              I know witchcraft exists. I just think (IMHO) it is noWHERE near as prevalent as EVERY pakistani house seems to think it is. As though there are all these witchcraft parctitioners and demons and evil people out there just waiting to affect your life.

              Im ean they could be. They really could be. But for example the issue you had with this girl. I just cannot get my head round that. SO MANY Muslim girls stray and do typically "gauri" things in the western countries. ARe you saying that each and every one of them has a curse on them? That they are completely unaware of the choices they make? That Allah will not judge them on such acts because they are influenced by some outer being. (for surely you cannot be judged for acts which are not really your doing) i think personally that this girl need not repent if that is the case since if their is a curse in her MAKING her do thes ethings then it wasn't actually HER doing them. IT just doesn't add up in my head.

              Please do not take this as a personal attack brother. I think this girl you mention is probably very good, not because she was under the influence of a cruse BUT because she (hopefully) has realised the error of her ways and REPENTED. surely she would not have repented or would have no need to repent if these things were out of her control? Also please forgiveme for i am ignorant and she could very well be under a curse. Allah knows best. I just want to get over what my concerns are with putting so much faith in these bazurqs etc.
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              • #37
                What is a desi household?

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                • #38
                  "desi" means bascially all those peple from south asia who are pretty much of indian origin. That would be the paksitanis and the indians and the bangladeshis.
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                  • #39
                    Ok. I see where you coming from. Thing is that many muslim nowadays don't bother studing Islam. They read the Qu'ran but dont study it. So when comes to situations such as this they dont know what to do, so they goto someone who does and can help them.
                    About the girl i like. Well, she's saying that their's a possibility her cousins could of done this as they used to always compliment her which usually is a sign of jealousy. She was a very good muslim then, she stopped wearing her hijab and it all started from there. You were right about me being jealous of her previous boyfriends. But also the fact that i find it hard to trust her. Another worry is, what if she is lying to me? that she has not repented.
                    But, the istikhara came out positive, and ive asked her to do it too just to be sure.
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                    • #40
                      Who truly knows the workings of the spiritual world?
                      And how they interact with our own world?

                      If one believes in such a world, they are more prone to notice goings-on
                      If you don't believe in such activity, you will find a logical reason for it's existence.
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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Stanley Stunodd
                        Who truly knows the workings of the spiritual world?
                        And how they interact with our own world?

                        If one believes in such a world, they are more prone to notice goings-on
                        If you don't believe in such activity, you will find a logical reason for it's existence.
                        Well usually they are only able to interact with us through another being. That being commits shirk because he no longer believes in Allah but obeys the jinn. The jinn does things for the man. In return the the jinn asks for the man's soul.
                        If you have heard of that jewish magician guy who actually moved a boat over the grand canyon in a matter of seconds. No man in the world could ever do that, it is impossible. He gave up his soul to the jinn whom carried out the task for him. As Allah created the jinn and gave them powers like being able to travel at the speed of light, and turn into any object they wish.
                        If you still dont believe it, then goto pakistan, and walk alone in the middle of the night in a deserted road, or alley way. You'll be supprised on what you'll see...
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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Shaid_b
                          If you still dont believe it, then goto pakistan, and walk alone in the middle of the night in a deserted road, or alley way. You'll be supprised on what you'll see...
                          *interested and planning to go there someday to get surprised,herself*
                          Life goes on ...

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Shaid_b
                            If you still dont believe it, then goto pakistan, and walk alone in the middle of the night in a deserted road, or alley way. You'll be supprised on what you'll see...
                            yeah all these brown people..it's scary man....

                            :D

                            j/k shaid, you know i like to mess wid yo' head ay?

                            things are spookier in pakistan...
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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Shaid_b
                              If you still dont believe it, then goto pakistan, and walk alone in the middle of the night in a deserted road, or alley way. You'll be supprised on what you'll see...
                              yeah..most of the time u see a man (men/women) walking about wearing a cloak, wailing and weeping..cz he has nowhere else to go

                              quite easy to mistake them for ghosts and what not i suppose :eek2:
                              You are not aware of the consequences that would result (if you were granted what you desire) because what you seek might be to your detriment. (O soul) be conscious that your Master is more aware about your well-being than you are.

                              ~Ibn Al-Jawzee

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                              • #45
                                Ok. Lemme tell you lot a story :P. My dad was about 14. He lived in pakisatn at the time. And you know how 14 year olds are like...Well back to the story. He was playing catch catch with his friend. He was chasing his friend, but then lost him. Then my dad spotted his friend after looking high and low for about 30seconds. He chased him. His friend ran, he kept running as my dad chased him. My dad chased him for about 40 seconds. The friend ran into the forest. He, would not stop, he kept running. My dad thought that this is pretty dodgy, so he stopped chasing him. He went back home, took him about 5minutes as he had ran far for his house. When he got back, he saw his friend sitting on the doorstep waiting for him. My dad said "Didnt you run into the jungle?". His friend replied "No, ive been sitting here waiting for you for the last 10 minutes".
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