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Female genital mutilation,Haram---Female circumcision,Halal

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  • Re: What is the point of female circumcision?

    Originally posted by amirkhan780 View Post
    I've read that hadith but it never goes on to explain why which leads to my question. I know it's required, but the question of why never seems to be explained.

    Off topic: I've seen plenty of sisters with long nails
    Not me! My nails are nice and trimmed! I can't stand long nails... No offense to sisters who have them, but I also consider this unclean!

    Hmm maybe we don't know from any hadith what the islamic benefit for circumsicion is, but with health point of view it does make sense to be circumsized. If people undergo the knife to look a lot more attractive. Well why not undergo this procedure.. Circumcision is a lot a lot better. Its a win win situation, but if one wants to look like an uncircumcised non muslim, that's his perogative.
    "If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor."

    "Nothing protects the rights of the minority like the tyranny of the majority"

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    • Re: What is the point of female circumcision?

      Originally posted by candyapple View Post
      Not me! My nails are nice and trimmed! I can't stand long nails... No offense to sisters who have them, but I also consider this unclean!

      Hmm maybe we don't know from any hadith what the islamic benefit for circumsicion is, but with health point of view it does make sense to be circumsized. If people undergo the knife to look a lot more attractive. Well why not undergo this procedure.. Circumcision is a lot a lot better. Its a win win situation, but if one wants to look like an uncircumcised non muslim, that's his perogative.
      I would consider someone with long nails to even worse than someone who's not circumsized since bacteria and dirt can trap underneath and well, you eat and do everythgin with your hands.

      Exactly my point. There's no hadith that states the Islamic benefit, only modern day western medicine benefit which can be contradictory depending on how you look at it since research on this isn't exactly uniform or consisntent. I was just curious to the Islamic justification of acting this way so to say.

      Is circumcision attractice? I wouldn't know, I dont personally find genitalia attractive or nice to look at hahah.

      But I think it's a little mean to say of attractive vs unattractive. I wouldn't force my wife to undergo a vaginal alteration after giving birth "just because it looks better". I'm only saying "looks and disguisting" make a far pitty justification

      From my own personal experience, a belly button/navel is more prone to infection than someone's genitilia (virgin, no sexual history), but when it comes to cleansiness, people are more arouse to the idea of cirumcisision than cleaning their own belly button/navel and have the notion that a circumsision is cleaner but there is no islamic basis in that
      Last edited by amirkhan780; 09-12-13, 04:45 PM.

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      • Re: What is the point of female circumcision?

        Originally posted by amirkhan780 View Post
        I would consider someone with long nails to even worse than someone who's not circumsized since bacteria and dirt can trap underneath and well, you eat and do everythgin with your hands.

        Exactly my point. There's no hadith that states the Islamic benefit, only modern day western medicine benefit which can be contradictory depending on how you look at it since research on this isn't exactly uniform or consisntent. I was just curious to the Islamic justification of acting this way so to say.

        Is circumcision attractice? I wouldn't know, I dont personally find genitalia attractive or nice to look at hahah.
        Hadith also do not state the medical benefits of fasting during the long summer months, from dawn to dusk, every year during the month of Ramadan.

        In fact, you can probably find many western studies talking about how bad it is for your health.

        But we still do it.

        And in regards to an uncircumcised penis. I can't speak about what is more/less attractive comparatively. However, from a hygienic point of view (dirt getting trapped, more difficult to clean, more prone to sti etc).

        It's obvious why a uncircumcised penis would be considered disgusting,
        https://sufisticated101.wordpress.com

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        • Re: What is the point of female circumcision?

          Can someone explain how the Qu'ran or other documents explain the fact that we were created by god with an obvious imperfection, and we have to do surgery on babies to remove part of their penis?

          Similarly, about the hoodectomy that was mentioned earlier.

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          • Re: What is the point of female circumcision?

            Originally posted by iwasjimmyjimmy View Post
            Can someone explain how the Qu'ran or other documents explain the fact that we were created by god with an obvious imperfection, and we have to do surgery on babies to remove part of their penis?

            Similarly, about the hoodectomy that was mentioned earlier.
            There can also be rationale that a hoodectomy can be "cleaner" and more "attractive, but no one's making that claim here.

            I understand there are differences between males and females, but there seems to be a consensus that a circumsion is necessary for a male, but a hoodectomy is not necessary for a female.

            Easier for females to say since they never had to go through a surgical removal of their genitilia and not knowing what difference it means.

            I'm looking for answers and hopefully, logic. Sorry for being a realist.

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            • Re: What is the point of female circumcision?

              Originally posted by amirkhan780 View Post
              I would consider someone with long nails to even worse than someone who's not circumsized since bacteria and dirt can trap underneath and well, you eat and do everythgin with your hands.

              Exactly my point. There's no hadith that states the Islamic benefit, only modern day western medicine benefit which can be contradictory depending on how you look at it since research on this isn't exactly uniform or consisntent. I was just curious to the Islamic justification of acting this way so to say.

              Is circumcision attractice? I wouldn't know, I dont personally find genitalia attractive or nice to look at hahah.

              But I think it's a little mean to say of attractive vs unattractive. I wouldn't force my wife to undergo a vaginal alteration after giving birth "just because it looks better". I'm only saying "looks and disguisting" make a far pitty justification

              From my own personal experience, a belly button/navel is more prone to infection than someone's genitilia (virgin, no sexual history), but when it comes to cleansiness, people are more arouse to the idea of cirumcisision than cleaning their own belly button/navel and have the notion that a circumsision is cleaner but there is no islamic basis in that
              Maybe you're terrified of getting a circumcision.. And eeeew hell no I'm not talking about looks here its the cleanliness point of view which is either attractive or not

              I don't know from where you get the idea a woman changes afer childbirth.... That's not something I've personally experienced.
              "If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor."

              "Nothing protects the rights of the minority like the tyranny of the majority"

              Comment


              • Re: What is the point of female circumcision?

                Originally posted by candyapple View Post
                Maybe you're terrified of getting a circumcision.. And eeeew hell no I'm not talking about looks here its the cleanliness point of view which is either attractive or not

                I don't know from where you get the idea a woman changes afer childbirth.... That's not something I've personally experienced.
                I already had one?

                And no in terms of sexual satisfaction is what I was more concerned about since according to one of my anatomy textbooks "Males and females have analogous erectile tissues. The three main erecticle bodies in males are 2 corpus cavernosa and a corpus spogiosum. Females have 2 corpus caverosa plus 2 vestibular bulbs which are analogs to the corpus sponiosum. So, females acually have more erticle bodies than males."

                On top of that, females have 9000+ nerve endings and males have something like 6000+, with a good chunk being in the prepuce which is later removed by circumcision. I have no problems with the idea being cleansiness, but you're taking out the sexual satisfaction of that out of a male and I'm not sure why that was justified by Islam. The idea of cleansiness I understand, the rest I dont

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                • Re: What is the point of female circumcision?

                  Originally posted by amirkhan780 View Post
                  I already had one?

                  And no in terms of sexual satisfaction is what I was more concerned about since according to one of my anatomy textbooks "Males and females have analogous erectile tissues. The three main erecticle bodies in males are 2 corpus cavernosa and a corpus spogiosum. Females have 2 corpus caverosa plus 2 vestibular bulbs which are analogs to the corpus sponiosum. So, females acually have more erticle bodies than males."

                  On top of that, females have 9000+ nerve endings and males have something like 6000+, with a good chunk being in the prepuce which is later removed by circumcision. I have no problems with the idea being cleansiness, but you're taking out the sexual satisfaction of that out of a male and I'm not sure why that was justified by Islam. The idea of cleansiness I understand, the rest I dont
                  Lol I have no idea what u said there. But if you're worried about ur sexual satisfaction being reduced and many guys will be, well how about you get to keep your stamina up during intercourse long enough to satisfy your spouse
                  "If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor."

                  "Nothing protects the rights of the minority like the tyranny of the majority"

                  Comment


                  • Re: What is the point of female circumcision?

                    Originally posted by candyapple View Post
                    Lol I have no idea what u said there. But if you're worried about ur sexual satisfaction being reduced and many guys will be, well how about you get to keep your stamina up during intercourse long enough to satisfy your spouse
                    Wouldn't know, I wouldn't feel as much there. And what's the point if it doesn't feel as great?

                    I just find it to be a bit contradictory that Islam teaches us that sex is not a want, but a need of being human, but then it tells you to indirectly decrease the feeling by circumcision.

                    Granted, the pleasure factor is still there, but just decreased a great bit.

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                    • Re: What is the point of female circumcision?

                      Originally posted by amirkhan780 View Post
                      Wouldn't know, I wouldn't feel as much there. And what's the point if it doesn't feel as great?

                      I just find it to be a bit contradictory that Islam teaches us that sex is not a want, but a need of being human, but then it tells you to indirectly decrease the feeling by circumcision.

                      Granted, the pleasure factor is still there, but just decreased a great bit.
                      Oh you're upset cause you had circumcision done in your adulthood..

                      Its like saying your first love is your true love, like for example one had broke their virginity with a spouse but for some reason ended up remarrying, they will never feel quite the love they had for their first love if you get what I'm saying

                      Or its like you must be accustomed tointercourse before circumcision... So this change feels wrong?

                      Yea its a need.. And regardless of the pleasure being decreased, the need is still there right, and there are other considerations you need to take into account rather than thinking its just sex.

                      It is also much better for both you and spouse if you can sustain your stamina long enough for both of you to enjoy it, right?

                      Anyways I understand why you're questioning this.. Keep in mind our real pleasure is in paradise, so what ever decreased from your pleasure here, its a blessing in disguise and inshaaAllah you'll receive it in paradise a million times over.. You'll receive everything perfectly pleasurable to your senses

                      So who cares if you don't get a few more years worth of pleasure lol.. Save it for the eternal life kkkk
                      "If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor."

                      "Nothing protects the rights of the minority like the tyranny of the majority"

                      Comment


                      • Re: What is the point of female circumcision?

                        Yeah I get what you're saying. iA what you're saying comes to be completely true.

                        FYI, I'm not married. I just was cut as an older child like at 8 or 9 if I remember correctly.

                        Back then I never understood the point of circumcision, all I remmbered was that it was THE worst pain of my life.

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                        • Re: What is the point of female circumcision?

                          Originally posted by amirkhan780 View Post
                          Yeah I get what you're saying. iA what you're saying comes to be completely true.

                          FYI, I'm not married. I just was cut as an older child like at 8 or 9 if I remember correctly.

                          Back then I never understood the point of circumcision, all I remmbered was that it was THE worst pain of my life.
                          WooT so u don't know from experience if its more enjoyable without circumcision or not?? You got that from a text book hehe
                          "If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor."

                          "Nothing protects the rights of the minority like the tyranny of the majority"

                          Comment


                          • Re: What is the point of female circumcision?

                            http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthrea...umcision-Halal

                            Originally posted by Radec View Post
                            It's a horrible procedure. The ONLY thing it does is reduce sexual pleasure. Is it an attempt to control women from having sex? Is this a way to control women from having any pleasure?
                            sigpic

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                            • Re: What is the point of female circumcision?

                              I would advise some of you here to watch your mouths. I hope that you do realize that there are revert men who have not been circumcised (and do not have to be). So, you are calling them disgusting? Your words are more disgusting than a man's intact genitalia. There are those of us who chose not to circumcise our sons. Who was I to decide to remove a part of my child's body without his permission? There may be positive effects to removing the foreskin, but there are also negative effects which have been documented by adult men who have been uncircumcised their entire life and then chose to be circumcised. They would be best fit to describe what the negative effects are. My son is a revert, and he has chosen not to be circumcised. I have permission to discuss this topic. He is anything but disgusting, and I am highly offended by some of your ignorant comments. Educate yourselves.

                              Regarding female circumcision, as has already been mentioned, there is a difference between clitorectomy and hoodectomy. Hoodectomy is said to potentially have benefits for the female. Hoodectomy is not something I would have done to my daughter without her making that choice, but to each his own. I don't consider it disgusting, nor would I tell that to someone who had this procedure done.

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                              • Re: What is the point of female circumcision?

                                Chill all of you......

                                http://www.islamqa.info/en/20015
                                Humiliating people in the name of religion is the practice of someone deprived of the first fruit of religion, humility.-Nouman Ali Khan

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