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Female genital mutilation,Haram---Female circumcision,Halal

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  • Re: Female genital mutilation-Haram Female circumcision-Halal

    Originally posted by monti View Post
    read carefully :

    type Ia of the WHO/UNICEF/UFPA's definition of FGM is

    "Type Ia, removal of the clitoral hood or prepuce only"

    "Hoodectomy" is exactly that - removal of the clitoral hood or prepuce only

    Once again, I simply wanted to clear up definitions. People are of course free to follow the WHO/UNICEF/UFPA definition or not.

    as i said at the end, a hoodectomy is islamic circumcision, and it is a perfectly legal practice in the uk as is male circumcision. so there is no issue.
    "O you who believe! Stand out firmly for justice, as witnesses to Allah, even as against yourselves, or your parents, or your kin, and whether it be (against) rich or poor: for Allah can best protect both. Follow not the lusts (of your hearts), lest you swerve, and if you distort (justice) or decline to do justice, verily Allah is well-acquainted with all that you do." [An-Nisa 4:135]

    The Prophet :saw: said:

    "Whosoever leaves off obedience and separates from the Jamaa'ah and dies, he dies a death of jaahiliyyah. Whoever fights under the banner of the blind, becoming angry for 'asabiyyah (nationalism/tribalism/partisanship) or calling to 'asabiyyah, or assisting 'asabiyyah, then dies, he dies a death of jaahiliyyah."

    muslim

    Narrated 'Abdullah:

    The Prophet, said, "Abusing a Muslim is Fusuq (evil doing) and killing him is Kufr (disbelief)." sahih bukhari


    "Creeping upon you is the diseases of those people before you: envy and hatred. And hatred is the thing that shaves. I do not say it shaves the hair but it shaves the religion!

    By the One in whose Hand is my soul, you will not enter paradise until you believe, and you will not believe until you love one another. Certainly, let me inform you of that which may establish such things: spread the greetings and peace among yourselves."

    [Recorded by Imam Ahmad and Al-Tirmidhi]

    Comment


    • Re: Female genital mutilation-Haram Female circumcision-Halal

      Originally posted by *asiya* View Post
      as i said at the end, a hoodectomy is islamic circumcision, and it is a perfectly legal practice in the uk as is male circumcision. so there is no issue.
      the main issue (as I see it) is about consent, when performing a medically non-necessary intervention on a minor

      Comment


      • Re: Female genital mutilation-Haram Female circumcision-Halal

        Originally posted by monti View Post
        the main issue (as I see it) is about consent, when performing a medically non-necessary intervention on a minor
        ok so then you just have a general issue with practising jews, muslims and christians performing circumcision on their children. well thats the way its been for thousands of years and its just the way some ppl do things, and others may object and they can object all they like but it wont change, and thats that.

        We are all agreed that the practice of genital mutilation is unaceptable so thats the main thing.
        "O you who believe! Stand out firmly for justice, as witnesses to Allah, even as against yourselves, or your parents, or your kin, and whether it be (against) rich or poor: for Allah can best protect both. Follow not the lusts (of your hearts), lest you swerve, and if you distort (justice) or decline to do justice, verily Allah is well-acquainted with all that you do." [An-Nisa 4:135]

        The Prophet :saw: said:

        "Whosoever leaves off obedience and separates from the Jamaa'ah and dies, he dies a death of jaahiliyyah. Whoever fights under the banner of the blind, becoming angry for 'asabiyyah (nationalism/tribalism/partisanship) or calling to 'asabiyyah, or assisting 'asabiyyah, then dies, he dies a death of jaahiliyyah."

        muslim

        Narrated 'Abdullah:

        The Prophet, said, "Abusing a Muslim is Fusuq (evil doing) and killing him is Kufr (disbelief)." sahih bukhari


        "Creeping upon you is the diseases of those people before you: envy and hatred. And hatred is the thing that shaves. I do not say it shaves the hair but it shaves the religion!

        By the One in whose Hand is my soul, you will not enter paradise until you believe, and you will not believe until you love one another. Certainly, let me inform you of that which may establish such things: spread the greetings and peace among yourselves."

        [Recorded by Imam Ahmad and Al-Tirmidhi]

        Comment


        • Re: FGM : There is a solution. Can it be made a sticky?

          Originally posted by |Sister| View Post
          Sister, you need to be calm and stop the harsh words. There is no need for this. The original two threads were about female circumcision, not FGM, so of course you will get the words of the Prophet(saw) to back up this view. They just were all combined into a single thread. You started ranting about FGM in a circumcision thread when someone posted the sunnah practice by saying "because we all know perfectly well which one is practiced", as if no Muslimas have only the sunnah circumcision.
          First and all, my original post was an actual thread before it was moved by I know who into this thread. I don't have to go through your interminable post or anyone else's to make my point.

          My first post/thread is about giving the possibility for the sisters who have been butchered to be cured. I don't really care about the rest. And AGAIN, if a girl wants vaginoplasty or whatever you want to call it, make an appointment like any civilised person in a hospital by someone who is actually qualified.

          I also don't give a damn about animists, im talking about Muslim countries.

          Originally posted by AbuMubarak View Post
          its not word games, its understanding what is from islam and what is not, and we should never mix the two (which you seem to have no problem doing)
          you're the one who mixed up everything actually since my original post was an actual thread, now go lay in what you created.

          I don't have to justify myself to your highness actually

          Is it possible to leave this post in a place where it is clearly visible and not drown in hundreds of word-games "oh but FGM is haram but circumcision is not", because we all know perfectly well which one is practiced. So to sum up it goes like that in the real world : a guy arrives in the girl's house, take his razor and cuts the girl's clitoris. And case closed.


          Thank you very much

          So now solution :



          Obviously I dont expect people to speak French, but they normally speak English. If they don't the sister in need can PM me and i'll call myself inchallah.
          My Blog http://historyeyesopened.tumblr.com/ Watch out sister Nousername :o
          Ummah forum mentality depiction by BBC (warning) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LS37SNYjg8w

          Comment


          • Re: FGM : There is a solution. Can it be made a sticky?

            Originally posted by Massilia View Post
            First and all, my original post was an actual thread before it was moved by I know who into this thread. I don't have to go through your interminable post or anyone else's to make my point.

            My first post/thread is about giving the possibility for the sisters who have been butchered to be cured. I don't really care about the rest. And AGAIN, if a girl wants vaginoplasty or whatever you want to call it, make an appointment like any civilised person in a hospital by someone who is actually qualified.

            I also don't give a damn about animists, im talking about Muslim countries.



            you're the one who mixed up everything actually since my original post was an actual thread, now go lay in what you created.

            I don't have to justify myself to your highness actually
            if it wasnt for CERTAIN people trying to equate the two, we wouldnt have had to combine the same information into one thread

            you see, when you say something over and over and put it in every one of your posts, it becomes confusing for those who may not know clearly

            so by combining the same information, anyone with a brain can see what you are saying is clearly against islam vs what we are saying is clearly within islam
            .لا نريد زعيما يخاف البيت الإبيض
            نريد زعيما يخاف الواحد الأحد
            دولة الإسلامية باقية





            Comment


            • Re: FGM : There is a solution. Can it be made a sticky?

              Originally posted by AbuMubarak View Post
              so by combining the same information, anyone with a brain can see what you are saying is clearly against islam vs what we are saying is clearly within islam
              Depends on the brain actually. I suggest in your case, a brainoplasty.

              I don't see what is against Islam in this post :

              My Blog http://historyeyesopened.tumblr.com/ Watch out sister Nousername :o
              Ummah forum mentality depiction by BBC (warning) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LS37SNYjg8w

              Comment


              • Re: FGM : There is a solution. Can it be made a sticky?

                This thread is so akward man...too much argh don't even wanna say it...

                Comment


                • Re: Female genital mutilation-Haram Female circumcision-Halal

                  Originally posted by *asiya* View Post
                  ok so then you just have a general issue with practising jews, muslims and christians performing circumcision on their children.
                  yes, in fact I do. Children should not be forced into medically unnecessary surgery. I have researched this issue for an hour or so this evening, and I was appalled at the posts by grown men who are still dealing with the debilitating consequences of their circumcisions gone wrong, and blaming their parents for it.

                  Of course that any surgery can go wrong - this is a good reason for avoiding medically non-necessary interventions
                  Originally posted by *asiya* View Post
                  well thats the way its been for thousands of years and its just the way some ppl do things, and others may object and they can object all they like but it wont change, and thats that.
                  who knows ?

                  never say never

                  Originally posted by *asiya* View Post
                  We are all agreed that the practice of genital mutilation is unaceptable so thats the main thing.
                  yes, on that we agree

                  Comment


                  • Re: Female genital mutilation-Haram Female circumcision-Halal

                    Originally posted by monti View Post
                    yes, in fact I do. Children should not be forced into medically unnecessary surgery. I have researched this issue for an hour or so this evening, and I was appalled at the posts by grown men who are still dealing with the debilitating consequences of their circumcisions gone wrong, and blaming their parents for it.

                    Of course that any surgery can go wrong - this is a good reason for avoiding medically non-necessary interventions who knows ?

                    never say never

                    yes, on that we agree
                    i would like to know how many straight men and muslim men complained about their infancy surgery gone wrong
                    .لا نريد زعيما يخاف البيت الإبيض
                    نريد زعيما يخاف الواحد الأحد
                    دولة الإسلامية باقية





                    Comment


                    • Re: Female genital mutilation-Haram Female circumcision-Halal

                      Originally posted by AbuMubarak View Post
                      i would like to know how many straight men and muslim men complained about their infancy surgery gone wrong
                      my advice : try a google search

                      type something like - my circumcision went badly wrong - in the search box (not in the "exact expression", however) and then explore

                      I don't see however why people would specify their sexual preferences when complaining about this

                      in any case, tell us about your results

                      Comment


                      • Re: Female genital mutilation-Haram Female circumcision-Halal

                        Originally posted by Massilia View Post
                        First and all, my original post was an actual thread before it was moved by I know who into this thread. '
                        I know that, and that is exactly what I said and addressed if you had taken the time to read it like an adult would, so this sentence makes no sense.

                        Originally posted by Massilia View Post
                        I don't have to go through your interminable post or anyone else's to make my point. ~
                        I don't really care about the rest. ~
                        I also don't give a damn ~
                        now go lay in what you created. ~
                        I don't have to justify myself to your highness actually~
                        I suggest in your case, a brainoplasty.~
                        I don't see what is against Islam in this post
                        Really? You don't see what's against Islam in your posts? You imply this circumcision is "not really what happens" and when given proof that it is, you reject it and insult anyone who disagrees.

                        This is not the behaviour of one who submits themselves to the rules of Allah. The non-muslims do not even treat each other with such disrespect when debating, and here you are brazen enough to speak that vulgar language towards your brothers and sisters simply because they do not agree with you. You choose to argue and debate on a forum, yet stubbornly refuse to read or reflect on any proofs given to you.

                        Originally posted by Massilia View Post
                        im talking about Muslim countries.
                        Originally posted by |Sister| View Post
                        In Malaysia and Indonesia, FGM is almost non-existent. They only perform the hoodectomy (which is done in western countries as a cosmetic procedure to improve pleasure). These are the most populous Muslim nations we are talking about, so don't talk like some huge proportion of Muslim women only get mutilated. FGM is an African tradition that spread to certain parts of west Asia, and it is mostly confined to that area (except for immigrant backwards parents, which are rare). The Prophet(saw) saw a woman about to perform the procedure, so he told her to only take a little because it is more pleasurable for her and her husband.

                        Comment


                        • Re: Female genital mutilation-Haram Female circumcision-Halal

                          im not going to dance to illustrate what im saying, im perfectly fine with what im saying, obviously you think im an idiot who does not research before speaking which i appreciate very little, so i'll let you live in "Malaysia", while im living in the real world in Africa
                          My Blog http://historyeyesopened.tumblr.com/ Watch out sister Nousername :o
                          Ummah forum mentality depiction by BBC (warning) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LS37SNYjg8w

                          Comment


                          • Re: Female genital mutilation-Haram Female circumcision-Halal

                            Originally posted by Massilia View Post
                            im not going to dance to illustrate what im saying, im perfectly fine with what im saying, obviously you think im an idiot who does not research before speaking which i appreciate very little, so i'll let you live in "Malaysia", while im living in the real world in Africa
                            Location: France

                            There are plenty of Algerians, Somalis (as shown on this thread), Egyptians and Sudanese Muslims who would disagree with your biased arguments. Do not presume to tell me what I or anyone else thinks, you cannot read our hearts. And there is absolutely no excuse for your rude behaviour, even if we were all wrong and you were right.

                            And when they hear Al-Laghw (dirty, false, evil vain talk), they withdraw from it and say: "To us our deeds, and to you your deeds. Peace be to you. We seek not the ignorant." [Quran, al-Qasas 28:55]

                            Narrated 'Abdullah bin 'Amr: The Prophet said, "A Muslim is the one who avoids harming Muslims with his tongue and hands. And a Muhajir (emigrant) is the one who gives up (abandons) all what Allah has forbidden." [Bukhari book#2 hadith#9]

                            Prophet (Sallallahu Alaihi wa Sallam) also said: “A Muslim is not a person who slanders, curses, speaks obscene words or is abusive.” Bukhari also reported thatAbdullah Bin Omar

                            Salam Alaykum, I'm out of this thread.

                            Comment


                            • Re: Female genital mutilation-Haram Female circumcision-Halal

                              Oh gosh yes thank you for opening my poor eyes

                              My Blog http://historyeyesopened.tumblr.com/ Watch out sister Nousername :o
                              Ummah forum mentality depiction by BBC (warning) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LS37SNYjg8w

                              Comment


                              • Re: Female genital mutilation-Haram Female circumcision-Halal

                                Can I honestly ask something,

                                what is Abu Mubarak's Stance

                                and what is Massilia's Stance?
                                ╰☆╮The Qu'ran is the Fuel of the Muslim's Heart.╰☆╮

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