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Why Do Some Muslims Hate the Islamic Belief of the Necessity of a Caliphate?

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  • #46
    Originally posted by AbuMubarak View Post

    the romans and persians had more training and weaponry than the Muslims

    Yes, technology is good, but it is a tool, but heart and will are the weapons that win wars, not technology
    It were the Sahabat al-kiram (radhiallahu 'anhum ajma'in) and their students who fought against the Romans and the Persians. Their ranks were filled with Awliya` of Allat ta'ala, so don't think that any generation after them will reach their rank or will get the same degree of Tawfiq from Allah jalla jalaluhu like them or be honoured with their Karamat.

    Additionally the only great difference to the Romans and Persians was their lower number, but otherwise they were well organized and they had good tactics in war. If one looks at how the early Muslims administered the newly opened regions, then one can't deny them to be very intelligent. The early Muslims also benefitted from other nations regarding different sciences and soon became leaders in those sciences. So they clearly would take the means that Allah ta'ala has created into consideration.

    The imagination that some people unfortunately today have of the early Muslims is quite wrong. They think that they were a bunch of unorganized bedouins (like the people that unfortunately rule the Arabian peninsula today!), who somehow were able to defeat their enemies.
    The reality was not like that. The Muhajirin and Ansar were mostly from the cities of Makka al-mukarrama and Madina al-munawwara and Makka was the heart and center of the Arabian peninsula even before Islam. The majority of them were of good conduct and character even before embracing Islam. The rulers were also not some random bedouins, but rather from the Quraysh, who are the most noble of tribes among all Arabs.

    If you go through Islamic history and see how major battles were fought against the disbelievers, you will see the Muslim leadership back then all taking the correct means in order to defeat their enemies. Just read for example how Istanbul was opened by the Muslims and read what kind of weapons and tactics the Muslims back then used and then you'll understand how far away Muslims today are from their mindset and their preparation.

    They indeed acted upon the command of Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala:

    { وَأَعِدُّواْ لَهُمْ مَّا ٱسْتَطَعْتُمْ مِّن قُوَّةٍ وَمِن رِّبَاطِ ٱلْخَيْلِ تُرْهِبُونَ بِهِ عَدْوَّ ٱللَّهِ وَعَدُوَّكُمْ وَآخَرِينَ مِن دُونِهِمْ لاَ تَعْلَمُونَهُمُ ٱللَّهُ يَعْلَمُهُمْ وَمَا تُنفِقُواْ مِن شَيْءٍ فِي سَبِيلِ ٱللَّهِ يُوَفَّ إِلَيْكُمْ وَأَنْتُمْ لاَ تُظْلَمُونَ }

    { And prepare against them whatever you are able of power and of steeds of war by which you may terrify the enemy of Allah and your enemy and others besides them whom you do not know [but] whom Allah knows. And whatever you spend in the cause of Allah will be fully repaid to you, and you will not be wronged. }

    [8:60]


    What is power today? It is having advanced weapons and a strong military. You can not expect to win a war against your enemies while they have the best war jets and a highly trained army and you have close to nothing in comparison.
    Last edited by Abu Sulayman; 06-06-21, 01:37 PM.

    Comment


    • #47
      The vietnamese chased france and the usa out of vietname

      the afghans chased the russians and the talban chased the americans out of afghanistan

      many times has the smaller party victored over the larger party

      But we are mentally too weak, spiritually too weak as an ummah

      technology wont help us
      .لا نريد زعيما يخاف البيت الإبيض
      نريد زعيما يخاف الواحد الأحد
      دولة الإسلامية باقية





      Comment


      • #48
        Originally posted by AbuMubarak View Post
        The vietnamese chased france and the usa out of vietname

        the afghans chased the russians and the talban chased the americans out of afghanistan

        many times has the smaller party victored over the larger party

        But we are mentally too weak, spiritually too weak as an ummah

        technology wont help us
        Being spiritually strong is important. I'm not denying this.

        But you really can't expect to prevail over your enemies, while your weapons and army are nothing compared to theirs.

        Even the examples you gave are not very convincing: If the different parties you mentioned would go for all out war on each other, then the US would win without any doubt, because they can just bomb their enemies in Hiroshima-style and destroy them completely.

        ​​​​​

        Comment


        • #49
          Originally posted by AbuMubarak View Post
          The vietnamese chased france and the usa out of vietname

          the afghans chased the russians and the talban chased the americans out of afghanistan

          many times has the smaller party victored over the larger party

          But we are mentally too weak, spiritually too weak as an ummah

          technology wont help us
          I see your point of not being on the spiritual level..

          ​​​​​​It is definitely a point of concern as materialism can very well blur one's principles and morals.
          ​​​​​​
          Surely an upliftment is needed .
          I don't think anyone is denying that.

          But we must also note that being spiritual doesn't necessarily mean abandoning material.

          One can work on both simultaneously without any contradiction.

          I have heard and even read of many occasions on which the most Noble one upon him be peace and salutations calling people to provide with as much material as they can before a campaign and the most Noble one would praise those who gave more material

          Like " 'Uthman tajir Al Rahman"

          And his saying that Allah loves/prefers the stronger(physically fit) slave.

          So yes all kinds of laxity (spiritual and material) needs to be dealt with to the degree possible.



          https://followthemoney.com/preparing...system-part-1/
          https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-2/
          https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-3/
          https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-4/

          Comment


          • #50
            Originally posted by AbuMubarak View Post
            The vietnamese chased france and the usa out of vietname

            the afghans chased the russians and the talban chased the americans out of afghanistan

            many times has the smaller party victored over the larger party

            But we are mentally too weak, spiritually too weak as an ummah

            technology wont help us
            Without any disrespect to the oppressed vietnamese

            Or to the afghans

            Let's be honest there were many parties involved.

            It was really part of the cold war wherein USSR and USA fought their proxy wars.


            No doubt small party wins over large party bi idhn illah
            Last edited by ອາໄສຢູ່ ຣາຮາມ; 06-06-21, 05:21 PM.
            https://followthemoney.com/preparing...system-part-1/
            https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-2/
            https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-3/
            https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-4/

            Comment


            • #51
              Originally posted by Abu Sulayman View Post

              Being spiritually strong is important. I'm not denying this.

              But you really can't expect to prevail over your enemies, while your weapons and army are nothing compared to theirs.

              Even the examples you gave are not very convincing: If the different parties you mentioned would go for all out war on each other, then the US would win without any doubt, because they can just bomb their enemies in Hiroshima-style and destroy them completely.

              ​​​​​
              The US are greedy (meaning their establishment)
              I thought they would nuke as well before
              but then after coming across few of the articles and their mindset I seriously doubt they would nuke an area full of minerals and of geostrategic importance.
              They are highly materialistic people they have on their minds how to conduct invasions in such a discreet manner as to do least harm to the oil/gas related facilities and transportation infrastructure while at same time not caring anything about civilian casualties

              Was Hiroshima Nagasaki required ?
              Like seriously?
              Would they have bombed Germany?
              of course not!

              Seeing a documentary on Marshall islands makes me think it was a nuclear "test" on Hiroshima Nagasaki and a "message" to future adversaries


              https://followthemoney.com/preparing...system-part-1/
              https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-2/
              https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-3/
              https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-4/

              Comment


              • #52
                Originally posted by Abu Sulayman View Post

                Being spiritually strong is important. I'm not denying this.

                But you really can't expect to prevail over your enemies, while your weapons and army are nothing compared to theirs.

                Even the examples you gave are not very convincing: If the different parties you mentioned would go for all out war on each other, then the US would win without any doubt, because they can just bomb their enemies in Hiroshima-style and destroy them completely.

                ​​​​​
                Times have changed
                new domains of warfare have come up In addition to the conventional 3rd 4th generation based :
                Land sea air

                ​​​​​​now you also have :
                electromagnetic spectrum warfare (EMW)
                Cyberwarfare
                Space warfare

                As for NBC (nuclear biological chemical)
                Then they might be increasingly disguised.

                But in order to take lead in such technologies rather than buying old stuff from foreigners would require intensive R&D.
                And if one engages in R&D then there can be espionage and coups to thwart such plans

                This is why a strong (courageous and smart) leadership is needed.

                I am truly amazed at China's rise ( I am no fan of ccp) how they shifted their policies after the fall of USSR and started working for long term goals. And after their power now they are reshifting policies.
                Last edited by ອາໄສຢູ່ ຣາຮາມ; 06-06-21, 05:24 PM.
                https://followthemoney.com/preparing...system-part-1/
                https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-2/
                https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-3/
                https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-4/

                Comment


                • #53
                  Does US EU allows for anyone to dictate their policies or even interfere in their decisions or even remotely influence them?

                  What about China and Russia?

                  The first objective is to remove and discard all foreign dictats on matters of economy/politics/defense/ideology etc

                  I don't think much could be done with such dependence.

                  It's like saying I am not able to solve my problems so please help me.
                  And these problems are largely created in the first place by those whom I am asking for help
                  ​​the irony indeed

                  There is a need for a courageous and smart leader and hopefully righteous too so that people may not turn against him
                  https://followthemoney.com/preparing...system-part-1/
                  https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-2/
                  https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-3/
                  https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-4/

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Originally posted by ອາໄສຢູ່ ຣາຮາມ View Post
                    Does US EU allows for anyone to dictate their policies or even interfere in their decisions or even remotely influence them?

                    What about China and Russia?

                    The first objective is to remove and discard all foreign dictats on matters of economy/politics/defense/ideology etc

                    I don't think much could be done with such dependence.

                    It's like saying I am not able to solve my problems so please help me.
                    And these problems are largely created in the first place by those whom I am asking for help
                    ​​the irony indeed

                    There is a need for a courageous and smart leader and hopefully righteous too so that people may not turn against him
                    Very good point regarding the issue of leadership.

                    In Turkey Erdogan is actually trying this and is successful to a certain degree.

                    What would be really important is if the Arabian peninsula would be lead by a smart and independent leader.

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Abu Sulayman View Post

                      Very good point regarding the issue of leadership.

                      In Turkey Erdogan is actually trying this and is successful to a certain degree.

                      What would be really important is if the Arabian peninsula would be lead by a smart and independent leader.
                      Please don't get me wrong...
                      I am not saying Arab leaders are not smart.

                      On the contrary they are very smart.. the way they deal with each other and internal affairs.

                      What I mean is a combination of Strong and cunning statesmanship in the sense as to repell the influence of western powers and put the East in front of West and west in front of East to neutralize threats. This requires tactic diplomacy and with the way the leaders deal it seems to be not a cup of tea for everyone.


                      ​​​​​​lets take for example Libya which as far as I know despite all the ill practices was still the most prosperous country in Africa.
                      But Gaddafi went "vocal" with his gold dinar

                      ​​​​​​Things like these need to be done in disguise and with unpredictability and confidentiality.

                      Or take 'Iraq which was the most technologically advanced country in the Arab world.
                      But again Saddam went head on with USA plus allies in order to dump dollar and sell oil.

                      It requires sustainable strategies that can be moulded as required from time to time, simply reacting spontaneously may not yield the result.

                      Now look China ,
                      Has created alternatives to IMF and world Bank but still engages with former.
                      Is bringing DC petroyuan to replace petrodollar but still holds large dollar reserves.
                      Is building belt and road initiative but still manages to trade in US influence areas.
                      Seeks partners within Europe to weaken western alliance.
                      Offers support to countries ravaged by US sanctions and invasions to further enhance Eastern block.
                      China Russia ties at all time high - formidable

                      So strong and cunning leadership here I would say means farsightedness,
                      Determination, consistency, discipline

                      https://followthemoney.com/preparing...system-part-1/
                      https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-2/
                      https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-3/
                      https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-4/

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        As for turkey and erdogan ,
                        I am a bit sceptical

                        At the end of the day all nations/people try to gather their own strengths for their own benefits and in order to overcome their own problems.

                        But this not a bad thing as everyone gets their chance.
                        https://followthemoney.com/preparing...system-part-1/
                        https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-2/
                        https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-3/
                        https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-4/

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Originally posted by ອາໄສຢູ່ ຣາຮາມ View Post
                          As for turkey and erdogan ,
                          I am a bit sceptical

                          At the end of the day all nations/people try to gather their own strengths for their own benefits and in order to overcome their own problems.

                          But this not a bad thing as everyone gets their chance.
                          You're right, and that's why I said "to a certain degree".

                          Would you say that there is any leader in our countries, who is farsighted and good in tactic diplomacy?

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Abu Sulayman View Post

                            You're right, and that's why I said "to a certain degree".

                            Would you say that there is any leader in our countries, who is farsighted and good in tactic diplomacy?
                            Yes even I have a favourable view of erdogan and turkey to a certain degree but it's just that I don't expect much.
                            The enemies may pounce upon him at the very instant they precieve a threat.

                            To be honest, I just hope in the coming decades focus will shift to South China Sea and ural range mountains so that the Muslims get a sigh of relief and can breathe a little.
                            It's too much to ask for it seems.

                            I also think that the other person may have a valid point about lack in spirituality , if we are not able to be just and fair amongst ourselves then how can we morally rule over others.

                            As for tactic diplomacy and farsightedness, then I once read a quote by one of the European sovereign of 19th century that the best statesman/ diplomat in all of Europe is Abdul Hamid ii sultan


                            The thing about China is that they are an autocracy so decision making is fast and easy.
                            And they are competitive (too highly I must say)
                            Whereas in Arab countries it's monarchy which quite obviously fears competition



                            If you look up some Chinese media , you may see how they describe the pains of the century of humiliation, opium wars etc

                            Their history is different.

                            On the other hand the modern Arab states were carved up by europeans.

                            It's hard for me to find farsighted ruler as of now but it may not be long before one arises.

                            I am fairly confident the US China are gonna have a stand off in the Asia Pacific coupled with Russian friction in eastern Europe.

                            The relative peace that comes with it (in west Asia) may cause flower to blossom.

                            https://followthemoney.com/preparing...system-part-1/
                            https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-2/
                            https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-3/
                            https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-4/

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              I hope west and east are able to resolve their issues and come to terms with each other as to avoid economic turmoil and much bloodshed.

                              But in case they didn't the Muslim countries should try to stay away from it.
                              https://followthemoney.com/preparing...system-part-1/
                              https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-2/
                              https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-3/
                              https://followthemoney.com/petrodollar-collapse-part-4/

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