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Sisters who work - Why do you do it instead of staying at home?

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  • Originally posted by Umm Hamasa View Post

    Cheer up zi-zizou...be kind to your Muslim sisters and do not assume badly of them. Indeed, much negative assumption is a sin. Allah created men and women in pairs not to hate each other but to comfort each other and complete one another in the deen so that they may by Allah's mercy, enter paradise. And our beloved Prophet Muhammad alaihi salatu wa salaam said: "The best amongst you are those who are best to your wives."
    I'm not making assumptions, I'm going on what is mentioned on this forum.

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    Comment


    • Originally posted by zi-zizou View Post

      I'm not making assumptions, I'm going on what is mentioned on this forum.

      ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
      Take what applies to you and leave the rest. So if you feel that you do not make negative assumptions, then take the rest of the message "be kind to your Muslim sisters" for Allah enjoined kindness upon this Ummah and as our Prophet Muhammad Alaihi salatu wa salaam said:

      Kindness is a mark of faith, and whoever is not kind has no faith.” (Sahih Muslim)

      O Aisha, Allah is kind and He loves kindness in all matters.

      Source: Sahih Bukhari 6528, Grade: Muttafaqun Alayhi
      Aisha reported: The Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said:
      يَا عَائِشَةُ إِنَّ اللَّهَ رَفِيقٌ يُحِبُّ الرِّفْقَ وَيُعْطِي عَلَى الرِّفْقِ مَا لَا يُعْطِي عَلَى الْعُنْفِ وَمَا لَا يُعْطِي عَلَى مَا سِوَاهُ

      O Aisha, Allah is gentle and He loves gentleness, and He rewards for gentleness what is not granted for harshness, and He does not reward anything else like it.

      Source: Sahih Muslim 2593, Grade: Sahih
      Aisha reported: I was upon a camel which was misbehaving so I began to strike it, then the Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said:
      عَلَيْكِ بِالرِّفْقِ فَإِنَّ الرِّفْقَ لَا يَكُونُ فِي شَيْءٍ إِلَّا زَانَهُ وَلَا يُنْزَعُ مِنْ شَيْءٍ إِلَّا شَانَهُ

      You must be gentle. Verily, gentleness is not in anything except that it beautifies it, and it is not removed from anything except that it disgraces it.

      Source: Musnad Ahmad 24417, Grade: Sahih
      Aisha reported: The Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said:
      إِذَا أَرَادَ اللَّهُ عَزَّ وَجَلَّ بِأَهْلِ بَيْتٍ خَيْرًا أَدْخَلَ عَلَيْهِمْ الرِّفْقَ

      If Allah the Exalted intends goodness for a household, He lets gentleness come over them.

      Source: Musnad Ahmad 23906, Grade: Sahih
      Jareer reported: The Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said:
      مَنْ يُحْرَمْ الرِّفْقَ يُحْرَمْ الْخَيْرَ

      He who is deprived of kindness is deprived of goodness.

      Source: Sahih Muslim 2592, Grade: Sahih
      Abu Ad-Darda reported: The Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said:
      مَنْ أُعْطِيَ حَظَّهُ مِنْ الرِّفْقِ فَقَدْ أُعْطِيَ حَظَّهُ مِنْ الْخَيْرِ وَمَنْ حُرِمَ حَظَّهُ مِنْ الرِّفْقِ فَقَدْ حُرِمَ حَظَّهُ مِنْ الْخَيْرِ

      Whoever is given his portion of kindness has been given his portion of goodness, and whoever is deprived of his portion of kindness has been deprived of his portion of goodness.

      Source: Sunan At-Tirmidhi 2013, Grade: Sahih
      Abu Huraira reported: The Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said:
      الْمُؤْمِنُ مُؤْلَفٌ وَلَا خَيْرَ فِيمَنْ لَا يَأْلَفُ وَلَا يُؤْلَفُ

      The believer is gracious, for there is no goodness in one who is neither kind nor friendly.

      Source: Musnad Ahmad 8945, Grade: Sahih
      Anas ibn Malik reported: The Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said:
      Harshness is not found in anything except that it disgraces it. Verily, Allah is kind and He loves kindness.

      Source: Al-Adab Al-Mufrad 462, Grade: Hasan
      Ibn Mas’ud reported: The Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said:
      أَلَا أُخْبِرُكُمْ بِمَنْ يَحْرُمُ عَلَى النَّارِ أَوْ بِمَنْ تَحْرُمُ عَلَيْهِ النَّارُ عَلَى كُلِّ قَرِيبٍ هَيِّنٍ سَهْلٍ

      Shall I not tell you for whom the Hellfire is forbidden? It is every person accessible, polite, and mild.

      Source: Sunan At-Tirmidhi 2488, Grade: Hasan
      Abu Huraira reported: The Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said:
      رَأْسُ الْعَقْلِ بَعْدَ الْإِيمَانِ بِاللَّهِ التَّوَدُّدُ إِلَى النَّاسِ

      The basis of reasoning, after faith in Allah, is loving kindness toward the people.

      Source: Al-Mu’jam Al-Awsat 6067, Grade: Hasan li ghayri
      Jubair reported:
      وَقَدْ سَمَّاهُ اللَّهُ رَءُوفًا رَحِيمًا

      Allah has named the Prophet as kind and merciful.

      Source: Sahih Muslim 2354, Grade: Sahih


      Allah Ta'ala even said in the Quran فَقُولَا لَهُ قَوْلًا لَّيِّنًا لَّعَلَّهُ يَتَذَكَّرُ أَوْ يَخْشَىٰ

      Speak to Firaun mildly that perhaps he may be reminded or fear Allah.

      Surah TaHa 20:44



      فَوَيْلٌ لِّلْمُصَلِّينَ الَّذِينَ هُمْ عَن صَلَاتِهِمْ سَاهُونَ الَّذِينَ هُمْ يُرَاءُونَ وَيَمْنَعُونَ الْمَاعُونَ

      Woe to those who pray, who are heedless of their prayer, who pray to be seen and withhold small acts of kindness.

      Surah Al-Ma’un 107:4-7

      Comment


      • The messenger of Allah (saw) was sent down as mercy to the nations and Allah said in the Quran:


        "So by mercy from Allah , [O Muhammad], you were lenient with them. And if you had been rude [in speech] and harsh in heart, they would have disbanded from about you. So pardon them and ask forgiveness for them and consult them in the matter. And when you have decided, then rely upon Allah . Indeed, Allah loves those who rely [upon Him]." (3:159)


        Abu Huraira reported: The Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said:
        أَلَا أُخْبِرُكُمْ بِخَيْرِكُمْ مِنْ شَرِّكُمْ خَيْرُكُمْ مَنْ يُرْجَى خَيْرُهُ وَيُؤْمَنُ شَرُّهُ وَشَرُّكُمْ مَنْ لَا يُرْجَى خَيْرُهُ وَلَا يُؤْمَنُ شَرُّهُ

        Shall I not tell you what distinguishes the best of you from the worst of you? The best of you are those from whom goodness is expected and people are safe from their evil. The worst of you are those from whom goodness is not expected and people are not safe from their evil.

        Source: Sunan al-Tirmidhī 2263, Grade: Sahih

        Abu Huraira reported: The Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said:
        الْمُسْلِمُ مَنْ سَلِمَ النَّاسُ مِنْ لِسَانِهِ وَيَدِهِ وَالْمُؤْمِنُ مَنْ أَمِنَهُ النَّاسُ عَلَى دِمَائِهِمْ وَأَمْوَالِهِمْ

        The Muslim is the one from whose tongue and hand the people are safe, and the believer is the one people trust with their lives and wealth.

        Source: Sunan al-Nasā’ī 4995, Grade: Sahih

        Abu Huraira reported: The Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said:
        خَيْرُكُمْ إِسْلَامًا أَحَاسِنُكُمْ أَخْلَاقًا إِذَا فَقُهُوا

        The best of you in Islam are those with the best character, if they have religious understanding.

        Source: Musnad Aḥmad 9880, Grade: Sahih

        Abu Huraira reported: The Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said:
        أَكْمَلُ الْمُؤْمِنِينَ إِيمَانًا أَحْسَنُهُمْ خُلُقًا وَخِيَارُكُمْ خِيَارُكُمْ لِنِسَائِهِمْ خُلُقًا

        The most complete of the believers in faith are those with the most excellent character, and the best of you are the best in behavior to their women.

        Source: Sunan al-Tirmidhī 1162, Grade: Sahih

        It is incumbent upon all of you, who are true Muslimeen to obey what is stated in the Quran and the teachings of Muhammad alaihi salatu wa salaam which was to be kind to each other, to be gentle to each other and not to repulse or ridicule one another. And whoever does so after so much evidence has been provided, fear Allah Azzawajal. Allah will requite you for everything you do on this Earth and he will make known what is in the most innermost part of your breasts to all of mankind on the Day of Resurrection (what is known and what is apparent.) And no one can hide from Allah. Did you forget that you were just dust and that Allah made you from a clot of blood? On the day of Qiyama, you will wish you were dust so you won't have to give account! It is more befitting for you to put your face in the ground in humility for the favor of Allah Ta'ala... A muslim cannot have even an atom's weight of arrogance, for whoever has an atoms weight of pride will not enter paradise. Was Iblis not destined to Hell because he thought he was too good to bow down to Adam? He disobeyed Allah Ta'ala. He believed in Allah but he disobeyed him so Allah destined him to Hell due to his defiant disobedience and pride. So if Allah enjoined kindness and the Messenger enjoined kindness, the believer has no choice but to be kind because a muslim is one who submits. Say: Samina wa athona, we hear and we obey! Obey Allah and His Messenger and you will be successful. Obey Allah and His Messenger and you will be successful. Obey Allah and His Messenger and you will be successful!
        Last edited by Umm Hamasa; 11-02-19, 08:24 PM.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by zi-zizou View Post

          I have mentioned traveling, necessity, dress code, mixing with men, lowering gaze, listening to the husband...she is not going there because she is worried of "exposing" herself. If she continues on form she will ignore this comment and my previous one.
          Expose how? You and your assumptions are getting kind of weird now.

          Akhi, the thread is "Sisters who work - Why do you do it instead of staying at home?" It isn't, "Sisters who work - Why do you think it's halal for you to work when there are a bunch of fitnas outside, isn't being at home the best place for you?"

          With the former, there's no right or wrong answer because the sister is just talking about their experience. It isn't really meant to be a debated on topic. The latter does cause debate where you can mention all of the temptations that crop up. I did mention house husbands as a side point, but you've taken that to mean that I want my imaginary husband to stay home while I bring home the bills. lol

          I don't think there's any brother who has a problem with the idea of women working, but for some reason there's a good amount who will view these sisters in a certain way and that's not right. The entire purpose of the thread was to show brothers that there are many reasons why sisters work, so don't look down on them. This doesn't mean that sisters who don't work are worthy of scorn, they're not. Sisters are sisters and should be respected regardless of their job or lack of one.
          مَّن ذَا الَّذِي يُقْرِضُ اللّهَ قَرْضًا حَسَنًا فَيُضَاعِفَهُ لَهُ أَضْعَافًا كَثِيرَةً وَاللّهُ يَقْبِضُ وَيَبْسُطُ وَإِلَيْهِ تُرْجَعُونَ

          "Who is he that will loan to Allah a beautiful loan, which Allah will double unto his credit and multiply many times?
          It is Allah that giveth (you) Want or plenty, and to Him shall be your return."
          Surah al-Baqarah
          [2:245]

          .:.
          .:. Perfer et Obdura : Dolor Hic Tibi Proderit Olim .:.
          Be patient and strong : someday this pain will be useful to you

          .:.
          ...said the spider to the fly...

          Comment


          • why is this still carrying on

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Pippin1376 View Post

              Expose how? You and your assumptions are getting kind of weird now.
              I wanted to see if you are able to focus on the question or are easily sidetracked...easily sidetracked is a winner.

              Originally posted by Pippin1376 View Post


              Akhi, the thread is "Sisters who work - Why do you do it instead of staying at home?" It isn't, "Sisters who work - Why do you think it's halal for you to work when there are a bunch of fitnas outside, isn't being at home the best place for you?"
              I would stay at home and sell Biryani from my doorstep but my Biryani making skills are all talk.

              Originally posted by Pippin1376 View Post


              With the former, there's no right or wrong answer because the sister is just talking about their experience. It isn't really meant to be a debated on topic. The latter does cause debate where you can mention all of the temptations that crop up. I did mention house husbands as a side point, but you've taken that to mean that I want my imaginary husband to stay home while I bring home the bills. lol
              He shots...he...sees the goalposts have been moved.

              Originally posted by Pippin1376 View Post

              I don't think there's any brother who has a problem with the idea of women working, but for some reason there's a good amount who will view these sisters in a certain way and that's not right. The entire purpose of the thread was to show brothers that there are many reasons why sisters work, so don't look down on them. This doesn't mean that sisters who don't work are worthy of scorn, they're not. Sisters are sisters and should be respected regardless of their job or lack of one.
              Not true, many men out there are happy for women to stay at home and don't want them in the workplace, surprised you have not come across this viewpoint. Have you never heard of "a woman's place is at home"?

              Some people have scorn for these career sisters...just got to live with it I guess. This thread is not going to change minds. All it has shown in the main is that sisters work, not out of necessity but because they want too. Something that was fairly obviously noticeable out in the real world.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Abu julaybeeb View Post
                why is this still carrying on
                ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Janna90 View Post

                  What’s the problem with them working?
                  Working is fine.

                  Issue is working a modern job.
                  That is what i meant, it is haraam and brings about a lot of problems.
                  ''If the bedouins and city dwellers were to fight between themselves until they wipe each other out, it will surely be less significant than them appointing a taghoot in the land which rules by that which is against the Shari'ah of Islaam which Allah sent his Messenger ﷺ with'' - Sheikh Sulayman bin Sahmaan

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by zi-zizou View Post

                    I wanted to see if you are able to focus on the question or are easily sidetracked...easily sidetracked is a winner.
                    .... *sigh*

                    Originally posted by Pippin1376 View Post

                    Click image for larger version

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                    Let's just agree to misunderstand and leave it at that.
                    مَّن ذَا الَّذِي يُقْرِضُ اللّهَ قَرْضًا حَسَنًا فَيُضَاعِفَهُ لَهُ أَضْعَافًا كَثِيرَةً وَاللّهُ يَقْبِضُ وَيَبْسُطُ وَإِلَيْهِ تُرْجَعُونَ

                    "Who is he that will loan to Allah a beautiful loan, which Allah will double unto his credit and multiply many times?
                    It is Allah that giveth (you) Want or plenty, and to Him shall be your return."
                    Surah al-Baqarah
                    [2:245]

                    .:.
                    .:. Perfer et Obdura : Dolor Hic Tibi Proderit Olim .:.
                    Be patient and strong : someday this pain will be useful to you

                    .:.
                    ...said the spider to the fly...

                    Comment


                    • There are more comments by "zi-zizou" then all the sisters combined, yet the discussion was supposed to be from sisters prespetive.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Pippin1376 View Post

                        .... *sigh*


                        Happens when you purposely ignore the questions put to you.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Kya View Post
                          There are more comments by "zi-zizou" then all the sisters combined, yet the discussion was supposed to be from sisters prespetive.
                          Stats please.

                          The problem with this thread is that it was triggered by emotions, one user said “scorn” and that was it. Now common sense would tell you in the main sisters work because they either just want too, a personal decision (studied and then moved into working in that area, delaying marriage, copying others, way to find a spouse, want a nest egg to fall back on, etc etc) or they have a pressing current financial need (no choice but to support family, husband, themselves).

                          There are only a handful of sisters on this forum that work so you are not going to get great insight here. In short this thread was pointless. I tried to move in on from merely asking the obvious to point out real issues that occur with this endeavour. Output of which might get people thinking beyond any short term gains.

                          Think about it from a man'’s point of view. What good is a woman who is not at home when the he gets back from work? Is he just after her money? What happens when children are on the scene? I pointed out a growing trend of sisters getting into their 30s and not being married. We can ignore it and pretend it’s not an issue but that’s really not helpful is it?

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by zi-zizou View Post

                            Stats please.

                            The problem with this thread is that it was triggered by emotions, one user said “scorn” and that was it. Now common sense would tell you in the main sisters work because they either just want too, a personal decision (studied and then moved into working in that area, delaying marriage, copying others, way to find a spouse, want a nest egg to fall back on, etc etc) or they have a pressing current financial need (no choice but to support family, husband, themselves).

                            There are only a handful of sisters on this forum that work so you are not going to get great insight here. In short this thread was pointless. I tried to move in on from merely asking the obvious to point out real issues that occur with this endeavour. Output of which might get people thinking beyond any short term gains.

                            Think about it from a man'’s point of view. What good is a woman who is not at home when the he gets back from work? Is he just after her money? What happens when children are on the scene? I pointed out a growing trend of sisters getting into their 30s and not being married. We can ignore it and pretend it’s not an issue but that’s really not helpful is it?
                            I'm trying to see it from YOUR point of view, I reeaaaally am. Your posts suggest women working doesn't work, when I gave you an example of how it does. It really differs from one couple to another. Can't generalise.

                            You said to think about it from a man's point of view. My husband is a man and his view differs from yours.

                            What good is a woman who is not at home when the he gets back from work? Not all women work long hours. They tend to be home at the same time or earlier.

                            Is he just after her money? No.

                            What happens when children are on the scene? They go to school or get looked after by family. Not much different to those who stay at home but also have a nanny to look after the children.

                            I don't see it as an issue that women work, as long as they can maintain the household and prioritise the family. What's the harm?

                            If you're of the view that women shouldn't work, that's fine. Don't let your wife work. Simple.

                            I don't think I'm a bad person/wrong for working. This seems to be what you're suggesting hence why I take offence to your comments.

                            growing trend of sisters getting into their 30s and not being married. Yes, there may be. But it could be for a number of reasons, not just because they work or are career minded. I have two friends in their early 30s who aren't married but are just doing it for time pass. They actually want to quit after they get married.
                            Last edited by Amira01; 15-02-19, 11:56 AM.

                            Comment


                            • salaams to all

                              there VERY FEW cases where theres a valid reason for a muslim woman to work in the west- and by valid, im referring to what Shariat says- that the womans circumstance was viewed by senior ulama/muftis and they permitted her to work...as long as she is able to fulfil certain conditions.

                              if we leave it to women to decide for themselves, then EVERY single one who works will try & justify her actions.

                              we should also note that a woman in a similar conditions during the times of our ancestors, would rather starve than having to expose herself & mingle with ghair mahrams.
                              even in todays times, theres homes where the girls are raised such that they are very uncomfortable when theyre outdoors in the presence of ghair mahrams.


                              and Allah ta'ala knows best
                              jazakallah

                              Sufyaan Thawri "Whoever is very popular with his relations and neighbours, we suspect him to be compromising in preaching the true teachings of religion."
                              very good site for English bayaans in MP3 format-check it out- u wont be disappointed: http://www.musjidnoor.za.net/index.html & http://alhaadi.org.za/majlis-program...downloads.html

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by msmoorad View Post
                                salaams to all

                                there VERY FEW cases where theres a valid reason for a muslim woman to work in the west- and by valid, im referring to what Shariat says- that the womans circumstance was viewed by senior ulama/muftis and they permitted her to work...as long as she is able to fulfil certain conditions.

                                if we leave it to women to decide for themselves, then EVERY single one who works will try & justify her actions.

                                we should also note that a woman in a similar conditions during the times of our ancestors, would rather starve than having to expose herself & mingle with ghair mahrams.
                                even in todays times, theres homes where the girls are raised such that they are very uncomfortable when theyre outdoors in the presence of ghair mahrams.


                                and Allah ta'ala knows best
                                jazakallah
                                Akhi, if a sister wants to work then that's enough of a valid reason. Unless there's a clear hadith or Quranic ayah about women not being allowed to work, then you can't say that they can't. As long as it isn't haram and what they're doing isn't stopping them from worshiping Allah, then no one should care about it.

                                Before anyone brings up the ayah about the wives of the Prophet (SAW) staying at home, that doesn't say that they should be kept there forever. We have stories of Aisha (raa) leaving her home and Saffiyyah (raa) too. Women still worked on the fields and in the market place. We have women shopping in those market places. We also have women who were warriors and traveled to other countries. Using this ayah as a blanket statement to keep women at home is the reason why some masjids don't have a women's section. It's not right.

                                We can be afraid that they'll interact with men, but Allah told us how to maintain our haya. Wear the hijab and keep your eyes lowered. If women were meant to stay hidden 100%, then why do we have the ayat about hijab?

                                If a sister wants to work, then that's fine as long as she isn't doing anything haram. If a sister doesn't want to work, then that is fine too as long as she isn't doing anything haram as well. If a sister is over 30 and not married, then make du'a for her and don't look down on her for that. As long as she isn't doing anything haram, then we shouldn't treat her any differently for not being married.


                                *sigh* We have 11 pages of posts telling sisters that working isn't valid. But on my other thread about brothers delaying marriage, most of the post say that it's okay and excuses are thrown out. I wonder what would happen if we use the same energy to help sisters and brothers get married instead of bringing them down....
                                مَّن ذَا الَّذِي يُقْرِضُ اللّهَ قَرْضًا حَسَنًا فَيُضَاعِفَهُ لَهُ أَضْعَافًا كَثِيرَةً وَاللّهُ يَقْبِضُ وَيَبْسُطُ وَإِلَيْهِ تُرْجَعُونَ

                                "Who is he that will loan to Allah a beautiful loan, which Allah will double unto his credit and multiply many times?
                                It is Allah that giveth (you) Want or plenty, and to Him shall be your return."
                                Surah al-Baqarah
                                [2:245]

                                .:.
                                .:. Perfer et Obdura : Dolor Hic Tibi Proderit Olim .:.
                                Be patient and strong : someday this pain will be useful to you

                                .:.
                                ...said the spider to the fly...

                                Comment

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