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View Poll Results: Who are worse?

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  • Americans

    150 65.50%
  • "Alqaeda"

    79 34.50%
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  1. #1
    Renegade Ali_Khan's Avatar
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    Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Americans:

    Massacred 180 thousand civilians in Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
    Massacred 500 thousand civilians in Iraq every year for 12 years with Uranium bombing.
    Massacred tens of Thousands of muslims in Afghanistan.
    Lynched black people for being... black.
    Carried out the largest genocide in History by massacaring Native Indians.
    Run torture camps in Iraq and Afghanistan where guards are trained to rape small children.


    "Alqaeda":
    Bombed 3 thousand Americans in response to the above.
    Please Re-update your Signature

  2. #241
    jagshemash dragonsden's Avatar
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    al qaeda by a country mile
    February 12 is Darwin Day,a chance to remember the great man!!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l6NLpJrn1Zk&NR=1

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jDbdtiJRVg

  3. #242
    Bosanski Musliman Abdulah's Avatar
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by dragonsden View Post
    al qaeda by a country mile
    America have actually done more damage than Al Qaeda. I don't support Al Qaeda.

    Al Qaeda,
    9/11
    7/7

    America,
    Iraq
    Vietnam
    Afganistan
    and more

    The numbers are much higher.
    Last edited by Abdulah; 06-05-07 at 08:19 AM.
    Nature has determinism, man has destiny. The acceptance of this destiny is the supreme and final idea of Islam. - Alija Izetbegovic

  4. #243
    Odan
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Abdulah View Post
    America have actually done more damage than Al Qaeda. I don't support Al Qaeda.

    Al Qaeda,
    9/11
    7/7

    America,
    Iraq
    Vietnam
    Afganistan
    and more

    The numbers are much higher.
    But this poll wasn't about America as a nation. It was about individual Americans.

    We all know that Americans are pretty much homogenous. They all think the same way despite various religions, cultural backgrounds, etc., and all white Americans are pretty much the same.

    I didn't agree with our decision to go to Iraq and wasn't even alive when Vietnam was going on. Nevertheless, I as a white American am directly responsible for it.
    Please Re-update your Signature

  5. #244
    Jaish Al-Naqshbandiya Abu_Mohammad_21's Avatar
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by UnoDosTres View Post
    But this poll wasn't about America as a nation. It was about individual Americans.

    We all know that Americans are pretty much homogenous. They all think the same way despite various religions, cultural backgrounds, etc., and all white Americans are pretty much the same.

    I didn't agree with our decision to go to Iraq and wasn't even alive when Vietnam was going on. Nevertheless, I as a white American am directly responsible for it.
    hahaha

    Great post.
    "Allah Almighty says: "Lo! Allah and His angels shower blessings on the Prophet. O ye who believe! Ask blessings on him and salute him with a worthy salutation." (Al-Ahzab: 56)

  6. #245

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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    The answer to this question is very simple.

    Nobody would like to take his family to settle in any country which would be ruled by Al-qaida.

    People can spend millions to get visa for their families to live in America.

    Now you can easily judge which is better and which is worse.

    See how I made it simple for you !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  7. #246
    Enough AbuMusaab's Avatar
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Sheikh Osama bin Laden's (may Allah (swt) preserve him and make him successful) "Letter to America":

    In the Name of Allah, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful, "Permission to fight (against disbelievers) is given to those (believers) who are fought against, because they have been wronged and surely, Allah is Able to give them (believers) victory" [Quran 22:39]

    "Those who believe, fight in the Cause of Allah, and those who disbelieve, fight in the cause of Taghut (anything worshipped other than Allah e.g. Satan). So fight you against the friends of Satan; ever feeble is indeed the plot of Satan."[Quran 4:76]

    Some American writers have published articles under the title 'On what basis are we fighting?' These articles have generated a number of responses, some of which adhered to the truth and were based on Islamic Law, and others which have not. Here we wanted to outline the truth - as an explanation and warning - hoping for Allah's reward, seeking success and support from Him.

    While seeking Allah's help, we form our reply based on two questions directed at the Americans:

    (Q1) Why are we fighting and opposing you?
    Q2)What are we calling you to, and what do we want from you?

    As for the first question: Why are we fighting and opposing you? The answer is very simple:

    (1) Because you attacked us and continue to attack us.

    a) You attacked us in Palestine:

    (i) Palestine, which has sunk under military occupation for more than 80 years. The British handed over Palestine, with your help and your support, to the Jews, who have occupied it for more than 50 years; years overflowing with oppression, tyranny, crimes, killing, expulsion, destruction and devastation. The creation and continuation of Israel is one of the greatest crimes, and you are the leaders of its criminals. And of course there is no need to explain and prove the degree of American support for Israel. The creation of Israel is a crime which must be erased. Each and every person whose hands have become polluted in the contribution towards this crime must pay its*price, and pay for it heavily.

    (ii) It brings us both laughter and tears to see that you have not yet tired of repeating your fabricated lies that the Jews have a historical right to Palestine, as it was promised to them in the Torah. Anyone who disputes with them on this alleged fact is accused of anti-semitism. This is one of the most fallacious, widely-circulated fabrications in history. The people of Palestine are pure Arabs and original Semites. It is the Muslims who are the inheritors of Moses (peace be upon him) and the inheritors of the real Torah that has not been changed. Muslims believe in all of the Prophets, including Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad, peace and blessings of Allah be upon them all. If the followers of Moses have been promised a right to Palestine in the Torah, then the Muslims are the most worthy nation of this.

    When the Muslims conquered Palestine and drove out the Romans, Palestine and Jerusalem returned to Islaam, the religion of all the Prophets peace be upon them. Therefore, the call to a historical right to Palestine cannot be raised against the Islamic Ummah that believes in all the Prophets of Allah (peace and blessings be upon them) - and we make no distinction between them.

    (iii) The blood pouring out of Palestine must be equally revenged. You must know that the Palestinians do not cry alone; their women are not widowed alone; their sons are not orphaned alone.

    (b) You attacked us in Somalia; you supported the Russian atrocities against us in Chechnya, the Indian oppression against us in Kashmir, and the Jewish aggression against us in Lebanon.

    (c) Under your supervision, consent and orders, the governments of our countries which act as your agents, attack us on a daily basis;

    (i) These governments prevent our people from establishing the Islamic Shariah, using violence and lies to do so.

    (ii) These governments give us a taste of humiliation, and places us in a large prison of fear and subdual.

    (iii) These governments steal our Ummah's wealth and sell them to you at a paltry price.

    (iv) These governments have surrendered to the Jews, and handed them most of Palestine, acknowledging the existence of their state over the dismembered limbs of their own people.

    (v) The removal of these governments is an obligation upon us, and a necessary step to free the Ummah, to make the Shariah the supreme law and to regain Palestine. And our fight against these governments is not separate from out fight against you.

    (d) You steal our wealth and oil at paltry prices because of you international influence and military threats. This theft is indeed the biggest theft ever witnessed by mankind in the history of the world.

    (e) Your forces occupy our countries; you spread your military bases throughout them; you corrupt our lands, and you besiege our sanctities, to protect the security of the Jews and to ensure the continuity of your pillage of our treasures.

    (f) You have starved the Muslims of Iraq, where children die every day. It is a wonder that more than 1.5 million Iraqi children have died as a result of your sanctions, and you did not show concern. Yet when 3000 of your people died, the entire world rises and has not yet sat down.

    (g) You have supported the Jews in their idea that Jerusalem is their eternal capital, and agreed to move your embassy there. With your help and under your protection, the Israelis are planning to destroy the Al-Aqsa mosque. Under the protection of your weapons, Sharon entered the Al-Aqsa mosque, to pollute it as a preparation to capture and destroy it.

    (2) These tragedies and calamities are only a few examples of your oppression and aggression against us. It is commanded by our religion and intellect that the oppressed have a right to return the aggression. Do not await anything from us but Jihad, resistance and revenge. Is it in any way rational to expect that after America has attacked us for more than half a century, that we will then leave her to live in security and peace?!!

    (3) You may then dispute that all the above does not justify aggression against civilians, for crimes they did not commit and offenses in which they did not partake:

    (a) This argument contradicts your continuous repetition that America is the land of freedom, and its leaders in this world. Therefore, the American people are the ones who choose their government by way of their own free will; a choice which stems from their agreement to its policies. Thus the American people have chosen, consented to, and affirmed their support for the Israeli oppression of the Palestinians, the occupation and usurpation of their land, and its continuous killing, torture, punishment and expulsion of the Palestinians. The American people have the ability and choice to refuse the policies of their Government and even to change it if they want.

    (b) The American people are the ones who pay the taxes which fund the planes that bomb us in Afghanistan, the tanks that strike and destroy our homes in Palestine, the armies which occupy our lands in the Arabian Gulf, and the fleets which ensure the blockade of Iraq. These tax dollars are given to Israel for it to continue to attack us and penetrate our lands. So the American people are the ones who fund the attacks against us, and they are the ones who oversee the expenditure of these monies in the way they wish, through their elected candidates.

    (c) Also the American army is part of the American people. It is this very same people who are shamelessly helping the Jews fight against us.

    (d) The American people are the ones who employ both their men and their women in the American Forces which attack us.

    (e) This is why the American people cannot be not innocent of all the crimes committed by the Americans and Jews against us.

    (f) Allah, the Almighty, legislated the permission and the option to take revenge. Thus, if we are attacked, then we have the right to attack back. Whoever has destroyed our villages and towns, then we have the right to destroy their villages and towns. Whoever has stolen our wealth, then we have the right to destroy their economy. And whoever has killed our civilians, then we have the right to kill theirs.

    The American Government and press still refuses to answer the question:

    Why did they attack us in New York and Washington?

    If Sharon is a man of peace in the eyes of Bush, then we are also men of peace!!! America does not understand the language of manners and principles, so we are addressing it using the language it understands.

    (Q2) As for the second question that we want to answer: What are we calling you to, and what do we want from you?

    (1) The first thing that we are calling you to is Islam.

    (a) The religion of the Unification of God; of freedom from associating partners with Him, and rejection of this; of complete love of Him, the Exalted; of complete submission to His Laws; and of the discarding of all the opinions, orders, theories and religions which contradict with the religion He sent down to His Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). Islam is the religion of all the prophets, and makes no distinction between them - peace be upon them all.

    It is to this religion that we call you; the seal of all the previous religions. It is the religion of Unification of God, sincerity, the best of manners, righteousness, mercy, honour, purity, and piety. It is the religion of showing kindness to others, establishing justice between them, granting them their rights, and defending the oppressed and the persecuted. It is the religion of enjoining the good and forbidding the evil with the hand, tongue and heart. It is the religion of Jihad in the way of Allah so that Allah's Word and religion reign Supreme. And it is the religion of unity and agreement on the obedience to Allah, and total equality between all people, without regarding their colour, sex, or language.

    (b) It is the religion whose book - the Quran - will remained preserved and unchanged, after the other Divine books and messages have been changed. The Quran is the miracle until the Day of Judgment. Allah has challenged anyone to bring a book like the Quran or even ten verses like it.

    (2) The second thing we call you to, is to stop your oppression, lies, immorality and debauchery that has spread among you.

    (a) We call you to be a people of manners, principles, honour, and purity; to reject the immoral acts of fornication, homosexuality, intoxicants, gambling's, and trading with interest.

    We call you to all of this that you may be freed from that which you have become caught up in; that you may be freed from the deceptive lies that you are a great nation, that your leaders spread amongst you to conceal from you the despicable state to which you have reached.

    (b) It is saddening to tell you that you are the worst civilization witnessed by the history of mankind:

    (i) You are the nation who, rather than ruling by the Shariah of Allah in its Constitution and Laws, choose to invent your own laws as you will and desire. You separate religion from your policies, contradicting the pure nature which affirms Absolute Authority to the Lord and your Creator. You flee from the embarrassing question posed to you: How is it possible for Allah the Almighty to create His creation, grant them power over all the creatures and land, grant them all the amenities of life, and then deny them that which they are most in need of: knowledge of the laws which govern their lives?

    (ii) You are the nation that permits Usury, which has been forbidden by all the religions. Yet you build your economy and investments on Usury. As a result of this, in all its different forms and guises, the Jews have taken control of your economy, through which they have then taken control of your media, and now control all aspects of your life making you their servants and achieving their aims at your expense; precisely what Benjamin Franklin warned you against.

    (iii) You are a nation that permits the production, trading and usage of intoxicants. You also permit drugs, and only forbid the trade of them, even though your nation is the largest consumer of them.

    (iv) You are a nation that permits acts of immorality, and you consider them to be pillars of personal freedom. You have continued to sink down this abyss from level to level until incest has spread amongst you, in the face of which neither your sense of honour nor your laws object.

    Who can forget your President Clinton's immoral acts committed in the official Oval office? After that you did not even bring him to account, other than that he 'made a mistake', after which everything passed with no punishment. Is there a worse kind of event for which your name will go down in history and remembered by nations?

    (v) You are a nation that permits gambling in its all forms. The companies practice this as well, resulting in the investments becoming active and the criminals becoming rich.

    (vi) You are a nation that exploits women like consumer products or advertising tools calling upon customers to purchase them. You use women to serve passengers, visitors, and strangers to increase your profit margins. You then rant that you support the liberation of women.

    (vii) You are a nation that practices the trade of sex in all its forms, directly and indirectly. Giant corporations and establishments are established on this, under the name of art, entertainment, tourism and freedom, and other deceptive names you attribute to it.

    (viii) And because of all this, you have been described in history as a nation that spreads diseases that were unknown to man in the past. Go ahead and boast to the nations of man, that you brought them AIDS as a Satanic American Invention.

    (xi) You have destroyed nature with your industrial waste and gases more than any other nation in history. Despite this, you refuse to sign the Kyoto agreement so that you can secure the profit of your greedy companies and*industries.

    (x) Your law is the law of the rich and wealthy people, who hold sway in their political parties, and fund their election campaigns with their gifts. Behind them stand the Jews, who control your policies, media and economy.

    (xi) That which you are singled out for in the history of mankind, is that you have used your force to destroy mankind more than any other nation in history; not to defend principles and values, but to hasten to secure your interests and profits. You who dropped a nuclear bomb on Japan, even though Japan was ready to negotiate an end to the war. How many acts of oppression, tyranny and injustice have you carried out, O callers to freedom?

    (xii) Let us not forget one of your major characteristics: your duality in both manners and values; your hypocrisy in manners and principles. All*manners, principles and values have two scales: one for you and one for the others.

    (a)The freedom and democracy that you call to is for yourselves and for white race only; as for the rest of the world, you impose upon them your monstrous, destructive policies and Governments, which you call the 'American friends'. Yet you prevent them from establishing democracies. When the Islamic party in Algeria wanted to practice democracy and they won the election, you unleashed your agents in the Algerian army onto them, and to attack them with tanks and guns, to imprison them and torture them - a new lesson from the 'American book of democracy'!!!

    (b)Your policy on prohibiting and forcibly removing weapons of mass destruction to ensure world peace: it only applies to those countries which you do not permit to possess such weapons. As for the countries you consent to, such as Israel, then they are allowed to keep and use such weapons to defend their security. Anyone else who you suspect might be manufacturing or keeping these kinds of weapons, you call them criminals and you take military action against them.

    (c)You are the last ones to respect the resolutions and policies of International Law, yet you claim to want to selectively punish anyone else who does the same. Israel has for more than 50 years been pushing UN resolutions and rules against the wall with the full support of America.

    (d)As for the war criminals which you censure and form criminal courts for - you shamelessly ask that your own are granted immunity!! However, history will not forget the war crimes that you committed against the Muslims and the rest of the world; those you have killed in Japan, Afghanistan, Somalia, Lebanon and Iraq will remain a shame that you will never be able to escape. It will suffice to remind you of your latest war crimes in Afghanistan, in which densely populated innocent civilian villages were destroyed, bombs were dropped on mosques causing the roof of the mosque to come crashing down on the heads of the Muslims praying inside. You are the ones who broke the agreement with the Mujahideen when they left Qunduz, bombing them in Jangi fort, and killing more than 1,000 of your prisoners through suffocation and thirst. Allah alone knows how many people have died by torture at the hands of you and your agents. Your planes remain in the Afghan skies, looking for anyone remotely suspicious.

    (e)You have claimed to be the vanguards of Human Rights, and your Ministry of Foreign affairs issues annual reports containing statistics of those countries that violate any Human Rights. However, all these things vanished when the Mujahideen hit you, and you then implemented the methods of the same documented governments that you used to curse. In America, you captured thousands the Muslims and Arabs, took them into custody with neither reason, court trial, nor even disclosing their names. You issued newer, harsher laws.

    What happens in Guatanamo is a historical embarrassment to America and its values, and it screams into your faces - you hypocrites, "What is the value of your signature on any agreement or treaty?"

    (3) What we call you to thirdly is to take an honest stance with yourselves - and I doubt you will do so - to discover that you are a nation without principles or manners, and that the values and principles to you are something which you merely demand from others, not that which you yourself must adhere to.

    (4) We also advise you to stop supporting Israel, and to end your support of the Indians in Kashmir, the Russians against the Chechens and to also cease supporting the Manila Government against the Muslims in Southern Philippines.

    (5) We also advise you to pack your luggage and get out of our lands. We desire for your goodness, guidance, and righteousness, so do not force us to send you back as cargo in coffins.

    (6) Sixthly, we call upon you to end your support of the corrupt leaders in our countries. Do not interfere in our politics and method of education. Leave us alone, or else expect us in New York and Washington.

    (7) We also call you to deal with us and interact with us on the basis of mutual interests and benefits, rather than the policies of sub dual, theft and occupation, and not to continue your policy of supporting the Jews because this will result in more disasters for you.

    If you fail to respond to all these conditions, then prepare for fight with the Islamic Nation. The Nation of Monotheism, that puts complete trust on Allah and fears none other than Him. The Nation which is addressed by its Quran with the words: "Do you fear them? Allah has more right that you should fear Him if you are believers. Fight against them so that Allah will punish them by your hands and disgrace them and give you victory over them and heal the breasts of believing people. And remove the anger of their (believers') hearts. Allah accepts the repentance of whom He wills. Allah is All-Knowing, All-Wise." [Quran9:13-1]

    The Nation of honour and respect:

    "But honour, power and glory belong to Allah, and to His Messenger (Muhammad- peace be upon him) and to the believers." [Quran 63:8]

    "So do not become weak (against your enemy), nor be sad, and you will be*superior ( in victory )if you are indeed (true) believers" [Quran 3:139]

    The Nation of Martyrdom; the Nation that desires death more than you desire life:

    "Think not of those who are killed in the way of Allah as dead. Nay, they are alive with their Lord, and they are being provided for. They rejoice in what Allah has bestowed upon them from His bounty and rejoice for the sake of those who have not yet joined them, but are left behind (not yet martyred) that on them no fear shall come, nor shall they grieve. They rejoice in a grace and a bounty from Allah, and that Allah will not waste the reward of the believers." [Quran 3:169-171]

    The Nation of victory and success that Allah has promised:

    "It is He Who has sent His Messenger (Muhammad peace be upon him) with guidance and the religion of truth (Islam), to make it victorious over all other religions even though the Polytheists hate it." [Quran 61:9]

    "Allah has decreed that 'Verily it is I and My Messengers who shall be victorious.' Verily Allah is All-Powerful, All-Mighty." [Quran 58:21]

    The Islamic Nation that was able to dismiss and destroy the previous evil Empires like yourself; the Nation that rejects your attacks, wishes to remove your evils, and is prepared to fight you. You are well aware that the Islamic Nation, from the very core of its soul, despises your haughtiness and arrogance.

    If the Americans refuse to listen to our advice and the goodness, guidance and righteousness that we call them to, then be aware that you will lose this Crusade Bush began, just like the other previous Crusades in which you were humiliated by the hands of the Mujahideen, fleeing to your home in great silence and disgrace. If the Americans do not respond, then their fate will be that of the Soviets who fled from Afghanistan to deal with their military defeat, political breakup, ideological downfall, and economic bankruptcy.

    This is our message to the Americans, as an answer to theirs. Do they now know why we fight them and over which form of ignorance, by the permission of Allah, we shall be victorious?
    They have indeed rejected (the Message): so they will know soon (enough) the truth of what they mocked at! - al-Qur'an 26:6

  8. #247
    Morris
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    I don't think you can compare a nation made up of millions, of various backgrounds, religions, political persuasions to a mysterious, small, single- minded religious organisation.

  9. #248
    Bosanski Musliman Abdulah's Avatar
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Morris View Post
    I don't think you can compare a nation made up of millions, of various backgrounds, religions, political persuasions to a mysterious, small, single- minded religious organisation.
    I think it refers to the American goverment or their attitudes and mainstream beliefs.
    Nature has determinism, man has destiny. The acceptance of this destiny is the supreme and final idea of Islam. - Alija Izetbegovic

  10. #249
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    AbuMusaab - is that really a bin laden statement?

    if so, i think he's concerns are legitimate - i think all muslims would agree with that

    however i think al-qaedas brutal tactics alienate the people who agree with their goals - i.e freeing the muslim lands

    muslims hate american precisely for it brutality - al-qaeda repeating that brutality (but on a lesser scale) doesnt win the muslims over its side

  11. #250
    Enough AbuMusaab's Avatar
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by dimension View Post
    AbuMusaab - is that really a bin laden statement?

    if so, i think he's concerns are legitimate - i think all muslims would agree with that

    however i think al-qaedas brutal tactics alienate the people who agree with their goals - i.e freeing the muslim lands

    muslims hate american precisely for it brutality - al-qaeda repeating that brutality (but on a lesser scale) doesnt win the muslims over its side

    It is a translation of his letter to America, yes.

    The sword is necessary because words are no longer appropriate.
    They have indeed rejected (the Message): so they will know soon (enough) the truth of what they mocked at! - al-Qur'an 26:6

  12. #251
    Saeed Al-Muslim
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by dimension
    if so, i think he's concerns are legitimate - i think all muslims would agree with that
    You are right, all we now have to do is stop getting our news stories from the Fasiq/Evildoers, Insha'Allah.

    Ma'aSalaama

  13. #252
    You tell me Yurt's Avatar
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    The thread is silly. Its like asking a muslim if the pagens of Arabia are worse than them based solely on the number of deaths.

    Americans:

    Massacred 180 thousand civilians in Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
    Massacred 500 thousand civilians in Iraq every year for 12 years with Uranium bombing.
    Massacred tens of Thousands of muslims in Afghanistan.
    Lynched black people for being... black.
    Carried out the largest genocide in History by massacaring Native Indians.
    Run torture camps in Iraq and Afghanistan where guards are trained to rape small children.


    "Alqaeda":
    Bombed 3 thousand Americans in response to the above.

    If you are going to judge by this standard, Muslims I challenge you to stand up to the deaths caused by your hand in the name of your religion.

    Also the initial standard is ludicrious:


    Massacred 180 thousand civilians in Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
    Muslims have no idea how many have been killed in their wars for supremecy or, er, "defense." So muslims have no room to talk.

    Massacred 500 thousand civilians in Iraq every year for 12 years with Uranium bombing.
    Iraq only has 25 million people. What a stupid lie.

    Massacred tens of Thousands of muslims in Afghanistan.
    Muslims ever slaughter people? An entire city perhaps?

    Lynched black people for being... black.
    Though muslims refuse to admit it, the arabic muslims had MANY black slaves, solely for being black. Ever hear of the arabic slave trade? I didn't think so.

    Carried out the largest genocide in History by massacaring Native Indians.
    Where are the pagens? And what is this word: hash-shashin

    Run torture camps in Iraq and Afghanistan where guards are trained to rape small children.
    I thought lying is haram in Islam.

  14. #253
    Odan
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Abdulah View Post
    I think it refers to the American goverment or their attitudes and mainstream beliefs.
    Actually, no, he doesn't.


    (3) You may then dispute that all the above does not justify aggression against civilians, for crimes they did not commit and offenses in which they did not partake:

    (a) This argument contradicts your continuous repetition that America is the land of freedom, and its leaders in this world. Therefore, the American people are the ones who choose their government by way of their own free will; a choice which stems from their agreement to its policies. Thus the American people have chosen, consented to, and affirmed their support for the Israeli oppression of the Palestinians, the occupation and usurpation of their land, and its continuous killing, torture, punishment and expulsion of the Palestinians. The American people have the ability and choice to refuse the policies of their Government and even to change it if they want.

    (b) The American people are the ones who pay the taxes which fund the planes that bomb us in Afghanistan, the tanks that strike and destroy our homes in Palestine, the armies which occupy our lands in the Arabian Gulf, and the fleets which ensure the blockade of Iraq. These tax dollars are given to Israel for it to continue to attack us and penetrate our lands. So the American people are the ones who fund the attacks against us, and they are the ones who oversee the expenditure of these monies in the way they wish, through their elected candidates.

    (c) Also the American army is part of the American people. It is this very same people who are shamelessly helping the Jews fight against us.

    (d) The American people are the ones who employ both their men and their women in the American Forces which attack us.

    (e) This is why the American people cannot be not innocent of all the crimes committed by the Americans and Jews against us.
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuMusaab View Post
    Sheikh Osama bin Laden's (may Allah (swt) preserve him and make him successful) "Letter to America":

    In the Name of Allah, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful, "Permission to fight (against disbelievers) is given to those (believers) who are fought against, because they have been wronged and surely, Allah is Able to give them (believers) victory" [Quran 22:39]

    "Those who believe, fight in the Cause of Allah, and those who disbelieve, fight in the cause of Taghut (anything worshipped other than Allah e.g. Satan). So fight you against the friends of Satan; ever feeble is indeed the plot of Satan."[Quran 4:76]

    Some American writers have published articles under the title 'On what basis are we fighting?' These articles have generated a number of responses, some of which adhered to the truth and were based on Islamic Law, and others which have not. Here we wanted to outline the truth - as an explanation and warning - hoping for Allah's reward, seeking success and support from Him.

    While seeking Allah's help, we form our reply based on two questions directed at the Americans:

    (Q1) Why are we fighting and opposing you?
    Q2)What are we calling you to, and what do we want from you?

    As for the first question: Why are we fighting and opposing you? The answer is very simple:

    (1) Because you attacked us and continue to attack us.

    a) You attacked us in Palestine:

    (i) Palestine, which has sunk under military occupation for more than 80 years. The British handed over Palestine, with your help and your support, to the Jews, who have occupied it for more than 50 years; years overflowing with oppression, tyranny, crimes, killing, expulsion, destruction and devastation. The creation and continuation of Israel is one of the greatest crimes, and you are the leaders of its criminals. And of course there is no need to explain and prove the degree of American support for Israel. The creation of Israel is a crime which must be erased. Each and every person whose hands have become polluted in the contribution towards this crime must pay its*price, and pay for it heavily.

    (ii) It brings us both laughter and tears to see that you have not yet tired of repeating your fabricated lies that the Jews have a historical right to Palestine, as it was promised to them in the Torah. Anyone who disputes with them on this alleged fact is accused of anti-semitism. This is one of the most fallacious, widely-circulated fabrications in history. The people of Palestine are pure Arabs and original Semites. It is the Muslims who are the inheritors of Moses (peace be upon him) and the inheritors of the real Torah that has not been changed. Muslims believe in all of the Prophets, including Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad, peace and blessings of Allah be upon them all. If the followers of Moses have been promised a right to Palestine in the Torah, then the Muslims are the most worthy nation of this.

    When the Muslims conquered Palestine and drove out the Romans, Palestine and Jerusalem returned to Islaam, the religion of all the Prophets peace be upon them. Therefore, the call to a historical right to Palestine cannot be raised against the Islamic Ummah that believes in all the Prophets of Allah (peace and blessings be upon them) - and we make no distinction between them.

    (iii) The blood pouring out of Palestine must be equally revenged. You must know that the Palestinians do not cry alone; their women are not widowed alone; their sons are not orphaned alone.

    (b) You attacked us in Somalia; you supported the Russian atrocities against us in Chechnya, the Indian oppression against us in Kashmir, and the Jewish aggression against us in Lebanon.

    (c) Under your supervision, consent and orders, the governments of our countries which act as your agents, attack us on a daily basis;

    (i) These governments prevent our people from establishing the Islamic Shariah, using violence and lies to do so.

    (ii) These governments give us a taste of humiliation, and places us in a large prison of fear and subdual.

    (iii) These governments steal our Ummah's wealth and sell them to you at a paltry price.

    (iv) These governments have surrendered to the Jews, and handed them most of Palestine, acknowledging the existence of their state over the dismembered limbs of their own people.

    (v) The removal of these governments is an obligation upon us, and a necessary step to free the Ummah, to make the Shariah the supreme law and to regain Palestine. And our fight against these governments is not separate from out fight against you.

    (d) You steal our wealth and oil at paltry prices because of you international influence and military threats. This theft is indeed the biggest theft ever witnessed by mankind in the history of the world.

    (e) Your forces occupy our countries; you spread your military bases throughout them; you corrupt our lands, and you besiege our sanctities, to protect the security of the Jews and to ensure the continuity of your pillage of our treasures.

    (f) You have starved the Muslims of Iraq, where children die every day. It is a wonder that more than 1.5 million Iraqi children have died as a result of your sanctions, and you did not show concern. Yet when 3000 of your people died, the entire world rises and has not yet sat down.

    (g) You have supported the Jews in their idea that Jerusalem is their eternal capital, and agreed to move your embassy there. With your help and under your protection, the Israelis are planning to destroy the Al-Aqsa mosque. Under the protection of your weapons, Sharon entered the Al-Aqsa mosque, to pollute it as a preparation to capture and destroy it.

    (2) These tragedies and calamities are only a few examples of your oppression and aggression against us. It is commanded by our religion and intellect that the oppressed have a right to return the aggression. Do not await anything from us but Jihad, resistance and revenge. Is it in any way rational to expect that after America has attacked us for more than half a century, that we will then leave her to live in security and peace?!!

    (3) You may then dispute that all the above does not justify aggression against civilians, for crimes they did not commit and offenses in which they did not partake:

    (a) This argument contradicts your continuous repetition that America is the land of freedom, and its leaders in this world. Therefore, the American people are the ones who choose their government by way of their own free will; a choice which stems from their agreement to its policies. Thus the American people have chosen, consented to, and affirmed their support for the Israeli oppression of the Palestinians, the occupation and usurpation of their land, and its continuous killing, torture, punishment and expulsion of the Palestinians. The American people have the ability and choice to refuse the policies of their Government and even to change it if they want.

    (b) The American people are the ones who pay the taxes which fund the planes that bomb us in Afghanistan, the tanks that strike and destroy our homes in Palestine, the armies which occupy our lands in the Arabian Gulf, and the fleets which ensure the blockade of Iraq. These tax dollars are given to Israel for it to continue to attack us and penetrate our lands. So the American people are the ones who fund the attacks against us, and they are the ones who oversee the expenditure of these monies in the way they wish, through their elected candidates.

    (c) Also the American army is part of the American people. It is this very same people who are shamelessly helping the Jews fight against us.

    (d) The American people are the ones who employ both their men and their women in the American Forces which attack us.

    (e) This is why the American people cannot be not innocent of all the crimes committed by the Americans and Jews against us.

    (f) Allah, the Almighty, legislated the permission and the option to take revenge. Thus, if we are attacked, then we have the right to attack back. Whoever has destroyed our villages and towns, then we have the right to destroy their villages and towns. Whoever has stolen our wealth, then we have the right to destroy their economy. And whoever has killed our civilians, then we have the right to kill theirs.

    The American Government and press still refuses to answer the question:

    Why did they attack us in New York and Washington?

    If Sharon is a man of peace in the eyes of Bush, then we are also men of peace!!! America does not understand the language of manners and principles, so we are addressing it using the language it understands.

    (Q2) As for the second question that we want to answer: What are we calling you to, and what do we want from you?

    (1) The first thing that we are calling you to is Islam.

    (a) The religion of the Unification of God; of freedom from associating partners with Him, and rejection of this; of complete love of Him, the Exalted; of complete submission to His Laws; and of the discarding of all the opinions, orders, theories and religions which contradict with the religion He sent down to His Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). Islam is the religion of all the prophets, and makes no distinction between them - peace be upon them all.

    It is to this religion that we call you; the seal of all the previous religions. It is the religion of Unification of God, sincerity, the best of manners, righteousness, mercy, honour, purity, and piety. It is the religion of showing kindness to others, establishing justice between them, granting them their rights, and defending the oppressed and the persecuted. It is the religion of enjoining the good and forbidding the evil with the hand, tongue and heart. It is the religion of Jihad in the way of Allah so that Allah's Word and religion reign Supreme. And it is the religion of unity and agreement on the obedience to Allah, and total equality between all people, without regarding their colour, sex, or language.

    (b) It is the religion whose book - the Quran - will remained preserved and unchanged, after the other Divine books and messages have been changed. The Quran is the miracle until the Day of Judgment. Allah has challenged anyone to bring a book like the Quran or even ten verses like it.

    (2) The second thing we call you to, is to stop your oppression, lies, immorality and debauchery that has spread among you.

    (a) We call you to be a people of manners, principles, honour, and purity; to reject the immoral acts of fornication, homosexuality, intoxicants, gambling's, and trading with interest.

    We call you to all of this that you may be freed from that which you have become caught up in; that you may be freed from the deceptive lies that you are a great nation, that your leaders spread amongst you to conceal from you the despicable state to which you have reached.

    (b) It is saddening to tell you that you are the worst civilization witnessed by the history of mankind:

    (i) You are the nation who, rather than ruling by the Shariah of Allah in its Constitution and Laws, choose to invent your own laws as you will and desire. You separate religion from your policies, contradicting the pure nature which affirms Absolute Authority to the Lord and your Creator. You flee from the embarrassing question posed to you: How is it possible for Allah the Almighty to create His creation, grant them power over all the creatures and land, grant them all the amenities of life, and then deny them that which they are most in need of: knowledge of the laws which govern their lives?

    (ii) You are the nation that permits Usury, which has been forbidden by all the religions. Yet you build your economy and investments on Usury. As a result of this, in all its different forms and guises, the Jews have taken control of your economy, through which they have then taken control of your media, and now control all aspects of your life making you their servants and achieving their aims at your expense; precisely what Benjamin Franklin warned you against.

    (iii) You are a nation that permits the production, trading and usage of intoxicants. You also permit drugs, and only forbid the trade of them, even though your nation is the largest consumer of them.

    (iv) You are a nation that permits acts of immorality, and you consider them to be pillars of personal freedom. You have continued to sink down this abyss from level to level until incest has spread amongst you, in the face of which neither your sense of honour nor your laws object.

    Who can forget your President Clinton's immoral acts committed in the official Oval office? After that you did not even bring him to account, other than that he 'made a mistake', after which everything passed with no punishment. Is there a worse kind of event for which your name will go down in history and remembered by nations?

    (v) You are a nation that permits gambling in its all forms. The companies practice this as well, resulting in the investments becoming active and the criminals becoming rich.

    (vi) You are a nation that exploits women like consumer products or advertising tools calling upon customers to purchase them. You use women to serve passengers, visitors, and strangers to increase your profit margins. You then rant that you support the liberation of women.

    (vii) You are a nation that practices the trade of sex in all its forms, directly and indirectly. Giant corporations and establishments are established on this, under the name of art, entertainment, tourism and freedom, and other deceptive names you attribute to it.

    (viii) And because of all this, you have been described in history as a nation that spreads diseases that were unknown to man in the past. Go ahead and boast to the nations of man, that you brought them AIDS as a Satanic American Invention.

    (xi) You have destroyed nature with your industrial waste and gases more than any other nation in history. Despite this, you refuse to sign the Kyoto agreement so that you can secure the profit of your greedy companies and*industries.

    (x) Your law is the law of the rich and wealthy people, who hold sway in their political parties, and fund their election campaigns with their gifts. Behind them stand the Jews, who control your policies, media and economy.

    (xi) That which you are singled out for in the history of mankind, is that you have used your force to destroy mankind more than any other nation in history; not to defend principles and values, but to hasten to secure your interests and profits. You who dropped a nuclear bomb on Japan, even though Japan was ready to negotiate an end to the war. How many acts of oppression, tyranny and injustice have you carried out, O callers to freedom?

    (xii) Let us not forget one of your major characteristics: your duality in both manners and values; your hypocrisy in manners and principles. All*manners, principles and values have two scales: one for you and one for the others.

    (a)The freedom and democracy that you call to is for yourselves and for white race only; as for the rest of the world, you impose upon them your monstrous, destructive policies and Governments, which you call the 'American friends'. Yet you prevent them from establishing democracies. When the Islamic party in Algeria wanted to practice democracy and they won the election, you unleashed your agents in the Algerian army onto them, and to attack them with tanks and guns, to imprison them and torture them - a new lesson from the 'American book of democracy'!!!

    (b)Your policy on prohibiting and forcibly removing weapons of mass destruction to ensure world peace: it only applies to those countries which you do not permit to possess such weapons. As for the countries you consent to, such as Israel, then they are allowed to keep and use such weapons to defend their security. Anyone else who you suspect might be manufacturing or keeping these kinds of weapons, you call them criminals and you take military action against them.

    (c)You are the last ones to respect the resolutions and policies of International Law, yet you claim to want to selectively punish anyone else who does the same. Israel has for more than 50 years been pushing UN resolutions and rules against the wall with the full support of America.

    (d)As for the war criminals which you censure and form criminal courts for - you shamelessly ask that your own are granted immunity!! However, history will not forget the war crimes that you committed against the Muslims and the rest of the world; those you have killed in Japan, Afghanistan, Somalia, Lebanon and Iraq will remain a shame that you will never be able to escape. It will suffice to remind you of your latest war crimes in Afghanistan, in which densely populated innocent civilian villages were destroyed, bombs were dropped on mosques causing the roof of the mosque to come crashing down on the heads of the Muslims praying inside. You are the ones who broke the agreement with the Mujahideen when they left Qunduz, bombing them in Jangi fort, and killing more than 1,000 of your prisoners through suffocation and thirst. Allah alone knows how many people have died by torture at the hands of you and your agents. Your planes remain in the Afghan skies, looking for anyone remotely suspicious.

    (e)You have claimed to be the vanguards of Human Rights, and your Ministry of Foreign affairs issues annual reports containing statistics of those countries that violate any Human Rights. However, all these things vanished when the Mujahideen hit you, and you then implemented the methods of the same documented governments that you used to curse. In America, you captured thousands the Muslims and Arabs, took them into custody with neither reason, court trial, nor even disclosing their names. You issued newer, harsher laws.

    What happens in Guatanamo is a historical embarrassment to America and its values, and it screams into your faces - you hypocrites, "What is the value of your signature on any agreement or treaty?"

    (3) What we call you to thirdly is to take an honest stance with yourselves - and I doubt you will do so - to discover that you are a nation without principles or manners, and that the values and principles to you are something which you merely demand from others, not that which you yourself must adhere to.

    (4) We also advise you to stop supporting Israel, and to end your support of the Indians in Kashmir, the Russians against the Chechens and to also cease supporting the Manila Government against the Muslims in Southern Philippines.

    (5) We also advise you to pack your luggage and get out of our lands. We desire for your goodness, guidance, and righteousness, so do not force us to send you back as cargo in coffins.

    (6) Sixthly, we call upon you to end your support of the corrupt leaders in our countries. Do not interfere in our politics and method of education. Leave us alone, or else expect us in New York and Washington.

    (7) We also call you to deal with us and interact with us on the basis of mutual interests and benefits, rather than the policies of sub dual, theft and occupation, and not to continue your policy of supporting the Jews because this will result in more disasters for you.

    If you fail to respond to all these conditions, then prepare for fight with the Islamic Nation. The Nation of Monotheism, that puts complete trust on Allah and fears none other than Him. The Nation which is addressed by its Quran with the words: "Do you fear them? Allah has more right that you should fear Him if you are believers. Fight against them so that Allah will punish them by your hands and disgrace them and give you victory over them and heal the breasts of believing people. And remove the anger of their (believers') hearts. Allah accepts the repentance of whom He wills. Allah is All-Knowing, All-Wise." [Quran9:13-1]

    The Nation of honour and respect:

    "But honour, power and glory belong to Allah, and to His Messenger (Muhammad- peace be upon him) and to the believers." [Quran 63:8]

    "So do not become weak (against your enemy), nor be sad, and you will be*superior ( in victory )if you are indeed (true) believers" [Quran 3:139]

    The Nation of Martyrdom; the Nation that desires death more than you desire life:

    "Think not of those who are killed in the way of Allah as dead. Nay, they are alive with their Lord, and they are being provided for. They rejoice in what Allah has bestowed upon them from His bounty and rejoice for the sake of those who have not yet joined them, but are left behind (not yet martyred) that on them no fear shall come, nor shall they grieve. They rejoice in a grace and a bounty from Allah, and that Allah will not waste the reward of the believers." [Quran 3:169-171]

    The Nation of victory and success that Allah has promised:

    "It is He Who has sent His Messenger (Muhammad peace be upon him) with guidance and the religion of truth (Islam), to make it victorious over all other religions even though the Polytheists hate it." [Quran 61:9]

    "Allah has decreed that 'Verily it is I and My Messengers who shall be victorious.' Verily Allah is All-Powerful, All-Mighty." [Quran 58:21]

    The Islamic Nation that was able to dismiss and destroy the previous evil Empires like yourself; the Nation that rejects your attacks, wishes to remove your evils, and is prepared to fight you. You are well aware that the Islamic Nation, from the very core of its soul, despises your haughtiness and arrogance.

    If the Americans refuse to listen to our advice and the goodness, guidance and righteousness that we call them to, then be aware that you will lose this Crusade Bush began, just like the other previous Crusades in which you were humiliated by the hands of the Mujahideen, fleeing to your home in great silence and disgrace. If the Americans do not respond, then their fate will be that of the Soviets who fled from Afghanistan to deal with their military defeat, political breakup, ideological downfall, and economic bankruptcy.

    This is our message to the Americans, as an answer to theirs. Do they now know why we fight them and over which form of ignorance, by the permission of Allah, we shall be victorious?
    Was that letter actually sent by Al qaeeda to America?

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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuMusaab View Post
    It is a translation of his letter to America, yes.

    The sword is necessary because words are no longer appropriate.
    the sword maybe neccessary but its the way you use the sword that is important

    when the prophet (saw) sent out his armies - when abu bakr (ra) sent out his armies , they instructed them not to harm women , children, places of worship and so on..

    al-qaeda dont have authority to over-rule the prophet's (saw) instructions - they never will

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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redmist. View Post
    Was that letter actually sent by Al qaeeda to America?
    You didn't get your copy? Talk to your postman.
    Please Re-update your Signature

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    Enough AbuMusaab's Avatar
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redmist. View Post
    Was that letter actually sent by Al qaeeda to America?
    Yes. And ignored, of course.
    They have indeed rejected (the Message): so they will know soon (enough) the truth of what they mocked at! - al-Qur'an 26:6

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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuMusaab View Post
    Yes. And ignored, of course.
    But the thing is bro.......it would be ignored wouldnt it.

    Why make it so longwinded and make it so easy for them - this is what u have done wrong blah blah blah. Why not just state to them " islam is the truth and you - america know what you have done to muslims and continue to do. if you dont stop we will keep on attacking you?"

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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Shake Osama bin Laden's (may Jesus Christ send him to hell, and have up sucking on pus and mucus amongst demons for eternity) "Letter to America"


    Binny's just doing what all Islamofascists do. They are creating some pretext that would rationalize violence for decades to come. Why did his little angels set bombs off in Bali? Why did they bomb Algiers? Are the letters for that still in the postman's bag?

    The objective of Bin Laden and his henchmen is violence. That is the beginning and the end of it. Chopping heads, stoning women, from now until doomsday. The warn of hellfire while turning this world into hell. Don't fall for their rhetoric whereby they claim their actions can be rationalized. They target civilians. They've killed Pakistanis, they've killed Indonesians, Sudanese, Algerian, they've tried to kill Italians...It's never ending. They've killed humanitarian workers and journalists. They've killed scores of fellow Muslims as well. They've raped.

    Binny's been urging little Afghan kids to take bullets to the head and go to paradise, and yet HE'S hiding up in the mountains. Is what's good for the Jihadi not good for him as well? Is 73 virgins not enough? He doesn't seem to believe wholeheartedly what he'd have his little murderers believe.
    Last edited by Johann Krauss; 27-07-07 at 10:33 PM.

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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by UnoDosTres View Post
    You didn't get your copy? Talk to your postman.
    ha ha ha.......ur so funny unodestres. NOT!

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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Johann Krauss View Post
    Binny's just doing what all Islamofascists do. They are creating some pretext that would rationalize violence for decades to come. Why did his little angels set bombs off in Bali? Why did they bomb Algiers? Are the letters for that still in the postman's bag?

    The objective of Bin Laden and his henchmen is violence. That is the beginning and the end of it. Chopping heads, stoning women, from now until doomsday. The warn of hellfire while turning this world into hell. Don't fall for their rhetoric whereby they claim their actions can be rationalized. They target civilians. They've killed Pakistanis, they've killed Indonesians, Sudanese, Algerian, they've tried to kill Italians...It's never ending. They've killed humanitarian workers and journalists. They've killed scores of fellow Muslims as well. They've raped.

    Go back to drinking ur beer mate and eating a bacon sarnie!

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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redmist. View Post
    ha ha ha.......ur so funny unodestres. NOT!
    I know, I know. All I'd have to do is start supporting the killing of civilians and I'd be a riot.

    Sorry. That's just not in me.
    Please Re-update your Signature

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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redmist. View Post
    Go back to drinking ur beer mate and eating a bacon sarnie!
    What's a sarnie ... ... can you have one without bacon? ...

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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by UnoDosTres View Post
    I know, I know. All I'd have to do is start supporting the killing of civilians and I'd be a riot.

    Sorry. That's just not in me.
    Its not in me either. Makes it understandable though. It does'nt change the fact that America has done all those things to Muslims and should be made to pay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ignatius F. Peace View Post
    What's a sarnie ... ... can you have one without bacon? ...
    Its a sandwich ignatius Im sure you can!

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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Well, al-Qaa'idah have set beliefs, ideas, objectives and visions. Americans don't - they come in different shapes and sizes! What we can compare is the Gov. and/or it's military personnel, who are currently engaged in fighting and wars with them.
    Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?
    Where exactly would `Azzaam al-Amreekee fit in that question?

    - MO

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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Well, Americans have set beliefs, ideas, objectives and visions. alqaeda doesn't - they come in different shapes and sizes! What we can compare its the ideoligies. and/or it's religious personnel, who are currently engaged in fighting and wars with them.Where exactly would `Azzaam al-Amreekee fit in that question?

    -Bub
    From the Many, One

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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    It's kind of a hard comparison.... a state of 300 million which has been around for 200+ years so a small group around for 20-30 years. So, how do we calculate per capita worseness over time? Or, is it really a good idea to lump such a big group together? I mean... I may pay taxes to fund soldiers in Iraq (well, so do our British friends...) but I didn't exactly plan any genocide of Indians... or even want to go to Iraq for that matter. Whereas with Al-Qaeda is a voluntary group where it is safer to say that they agree--more or less--with the objectives of the group. So, I'll stick with opposing the bad aspects of American policy and opposing Al-Qaeda... although, I can affect the former more.

  29. #268
    Fatimah tickledpinko's Avatar
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    US Government is worse, more blood on their hands, those greedy blood suckers. This is clear.
    I wonder what the world would say if the US got nuked.
    When third world countries get nuked, it's like everyday news to most folks.
    I suppose we third world people are considered subhuman and should bow down to the powers of the West, otherwise we'd start getting bombs dropped over our heads.

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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    A bit like arguing which bunch of lunatics is to run the asylum.

    Although, if forced, surely the US government.

    I mean, we expect 'terrorism' from a bunch of barbarians living in a mountain, who still don't know to use a knife and fork properly.

    We don't expect it from, purportedly, highly civilised men in white shirts and suits deliberating philosophically on who best to bomb to make the United States richer.




    One sort of terrorism is for greed, the other for a set of principles, however wrong. Difficult choice here.
    ...sermons from this minbar come with tongue planted quite firmly in cheek.


    "Let your boat of life be light, packed with only what you need -
    a homely home and simple pleasures, one or two friends,
    worth the name, someone to love and someone to love you,
    a cat, a dog, and a pipe or two, enough to eat and enough to wear,
    and a little more than enough to drink; for thirst is a dangerous thing."

    -- Jerome K. Jerome
    (Three Men in a Boat)

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    Yeah Nah Ruprecht's Avatar
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by tickledpinko View Post
    US Government is worse, more blood on their hands, those greedy blood suckers. This is clear.
    I wonder what the world would say if the US got nuked.
    When third world countries get nuked, it's like everyday news to most folks.
    I suppose we third world people are considered subhuman and should bow down to the powers of the West, otherwise we'd start getting bombs dropped over our heads.
    I wouldn't really call Japan 3rd world, nor say that it was everyday news.
    "I shall be telling this with a sigh. Somewhere ages and ages hence: Two roads diverged in a wood, and I -- I took the one less travelled by, And that has made all the difference."
    ~ Robert Frost, The Road Not Taken

  32. #271
    أنا مسلم AbuMubarak's Avatar
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    : Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Joha View Post
    I mean, we expect 'terrorism' from a bunch of barbarians living in a mountain, who still don't know to use a knife and fork properly.

    .
    so would you also refer to the Prophet and those who followed as barbarians?

    they could have used knives and forks, but we all know that the Prophet chose not to

    when muslims say dumb things like this, i always laugh, because it is no more than a witness of how much they detest the sunnah and love the ways of the kuffar

    i have heard kafirs say this, its no big deal, but when a muslim repeats the words of euromericans, it is truly disturbing

    yet, they clamor how much they love islam and our Prophet
    .لا نريد زعيما يخاف البيت الإبيض
    نريد زعيما يخاف الواحد الأحد
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  33. #272
    أنا مسلم AbuMubarak's Avatar
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    : Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by UnoDosTres View Post
    I know, I know. All I'd have to do is start supporting the killing of civilians and I'd be a riot.

    Sorry. That's just not in me.
    so i guess this statement is a statement saying how much you detest the history of america

    good

    but it doesnt show your position regarding alqaaida
    .لا نريد زعيما يخاف البيت الإبيض
    نريد زعيما يخاف الواحد الأحد
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  34. #273
    أنا مسلم AbuMubarak's Avatar
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    : Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by dimension View Post
    AbuMusaab - is that really a bin laden statement?

    if so, i think he's concerns are legitimate - i think all muslims would agree with that

    however i think al-qaedas brutal tactics alienate the people who agree with their goals - i.e freeing the muslim lands

    muslims hate american precisely for it brutality - al-qaeda repeating that brutality (but on a lesser scale) doesnt win the muslims over its side
    good conclusion, dimension

    but what does one do? throw out the baby with the bathwater? (another european practice)

    bin laden is fighting for something he believes in, and as you said, most muslims would agree

    also, the weaponry and tactics play a major part, but you have to play the hand you are dealt

    if i had to summarize how it appears to me, it would go like this

    america blows up a building, and there are innocents, they basically reclassify them as collateral damage, because in the overall scheme of things, they were not intentionally attacking civilians, but the goal of their mission superseded any concern for civilians

    similarly, alqaaida wants to terrorize america into backing out of muslim lands, so it does not have air, naval or ground superiority, so they attack these american targets, inadvertently killing civilians, but just like america, the goal of their mission superseded any concern for civilians

    that being said, america has a large media machine to support and present her actions

    alqaaida does not
    .لا نريد زعيما يخاف البيت الإبيض
    نريد زعيما يخاف الواحد الأحد
    دولة الإسلامية باقية






  35. #274
    Member Opening Batsman's Avatar
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    The establishment media is seemingly obsessed with "grim milestones" in the War on Terror, as the Associated Press reminds us this past weekend.



    But in the next week those same establishment media outlets will probably stand mute when yet another "grim milestone" is reached:

    The 10,000th attack by Islamic terrorists and militants since 9/11, which is responsible for approximately 60,000 dead and 90,000 injured.



    Assyrian International News Agency 15th Nov 2007

  36. #275
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    And the article continues

    The figures doesnt include combat-related statistics, and acknowledges that the death toll may increase in the days and months following the attack as victims die from their injuries, which almost never get reported.

    The list also doesnt account for the genocide in Darfur committed by the Islamist government in Sudan and their Janjaweed marauding militias, which the UN estimated last year had resulted in 400,000 dead and 2 million displaced.

  37. #276
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    Re: : Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuMubarak View Post
    similarly, alqaaida wants to terrorize america into backing out of muslim lands, so it does not have air, naval or ground superiority, so they attack these american targets, inadvertently killing civilians, but just like america, the goal of their mission superseded any concern for civilians
    How is it inadvertent?
    They attack public transport and civilian buildings which just happen, by chance, to be full of civilians?
    "I shall be telling this with a sigh. Somewhere ages and ages hence: Two roads diverged in a wood, and I -- I took the one less travelled by, And that has made all the difference."
    ~ Robert Frost, The Road Not Taken

  38. #277
    Morris
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Difference is America is a nation and Al queda is not. How can you rationally compare the two.

    Sorry edit...Al-CIA-da

  39. #278
    أنا مسلم AbuMubarak's Avatar
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    : Re: : Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ruprecht View Post
    How is it inadvertent?
    They attack public transport and civilian buildings which just happen, by chance, to be full of civilians?
    i know nothing of public transport, but if you are referring to sept 11 you are seeing an american icon attacked, NOT 3000 people

    the mission was to chip the armor in america, which was done, the mission was to draw america into showing her true love for islam and the muslims, which was done, the mission was to arouse the muslims, which was done

    and on top of that, a few million new muslims entered islam

    so i would say that every group has their mission, innocent civilians are just cannon fodder
    .لا نريد زعيما يخاف البيت الإبيض
    نريد زعيما يخاف الواحد الأحد
    دولة الإسلامية باقية






  40. #279
    أنا مسلم AbuMubarak's Avatar
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    : Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Opening Batsman View Post
    The establishment media is seemingly obsessed with "grim milestones" in the War on Terror, as the Associated Press reminds us this past weekend.



    But in the next week those same establishment media outlets will probably stand mute when yet another "grim milestone" is reached:

    The 10,000th attack by Islamic terrorists and militants since 9/11, which is responsible for approximately 60,000 dead and 90,000 injured.



    Assyrian International News Agency 15th Nov 2007
    interesting statistic

    how many dead by american and coalition forces? how many injured?

    or is this another ronald dumsfeld moment where we dont care about innocents we kill?
    .لا نريد زعيما يخاف البيت الإبيض
    نريد زعيما يخاف الواحد الأحد
    دولة الإسلامية باقية






  41. #280
    Member Opening Batsman's Avatar
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    Re: Who are worse? Americans or "Alqaeda"?

    the mission was to chip the armor in america, which was done, the mission was to draw america into showing her true love for islam and the muslims, which was done, the mission was to arouse the muslims, which was done

    Really

    And is this part of the same mission:

    The 10,000th attack by Islamic terrorists and militants since 9/11, which is responsible for approximately 60,000 dead and 90,000 injured.

 

 

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