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    Umm Kulthoom Rumaysah~'s Avatar
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    'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    From an interview with the wife of ibn uthaymeen

    Is there anything that the Shaykh asked you to do that seemed strange and made you feel hesitant?

    Answer: It may be unknown to most that I was illiterate and did not receive any kind of formal education. When I married the Shaykh, I was fully busy in his service and in providing him the correct, comfortable environment to seek knowledge and teach. After we had our children, I was busy with them, and it took all my time to raise them, in addition to the time I used to spend to help and support the Shaykh in seeking knowledge. After the children grew up and my responsibilities began to ease slightly, I was surprised that the Shaykh began to incite me to join the senior school i.e. for the elderly. Although hesitant at first, I decided to join. During this period, he followed my achievements and would not accept any of my sons signing my transcripts of record. He would say,

    “I am the one to sign for all that relates to your academic achievements.”
    This moment of learning is a period that cannot be forgotten by me due to its great, innumerable benefits.

    “Al-Mutamayyizah” Magazine Issue No. 45, Ramadhan, 1427. Confirmed & Presented in English by Dr. Saleh As-Saleh.
    شَكَوْتُ إلَى وَكِيعٍ سُوءَ حِفْظِي
    فَأرْشَدَنِي إلَى تَرْكِ المعَاصي
    وَأخْبَرَنِي بأَنَّ العِلْمَ نُورٌ
    ونورُ الله لا يهدى لعاصي

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    On A Hired Plane of Logic LailaTheMuslim's Avatar
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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    وَاقْصِدْ فِي مَشْيِكَ وَاغْضُضْ مِن صَوْتِكَ ۚ إِنَّ أَنكَرَ الْأَصْوَاتِ لَصَوْتُ الْحَمِيرِ - 31:19

    And be moderate in your pace and lower your voice; indeed, the most disagreeable of sounds is the voice of donkeys."


    أَلَمْ تَرَوْا أَنَّ اللَّهَ سَخَّرَ لَكُم مَّا فِي السَّمَاوَاتِ وَمَا فِي الْأَرْضِ وَأَسْبَغَ عَلَيْكُمْ نِعَمَهُ ظَاهِرَةً وَبَاطِنَةً ۗ وَمِنَ النَّاسِ مَن يُجَادِلُ فِي اللَّهِ بِغَيْرِ عِلْمٍ وَلَا هُدًى وَلَا كِتَابٍ مُّنِيرٍ - 31:20

    Do you not see that Allah has made subject to you whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth and amply bestowed upon you His favors, [both] apparent and unapparent? But of the people is he who disputes about Allah without knowledge or guidance or an enlightening Book [from Him].


    Please take a look at my travel booking website : https://destinationfindertravel.com/

    Please take a look at my blog : http://thinkingmuslima.blogspot.co.uk/

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    After raising the children!

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Did I read that correctly or Am getting slow with age but Shaykh's wife couldn't read until she was senior citizen?

    Is this correct?

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    Senior Member Juwairiyyah's Avatar
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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Hmmm. May Allah reward her for her patience and sacrifice for her family, but it's kinda sad that she couldn't find a time for herself until she was elderly.

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    Odan Abu julaybeeb's Avatar
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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    So by investment u mean helps her with studies

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Ma sha'Allah, how amazing example for everyone to follow, In shs'Allah.
    What a dream. <3

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Being illiterate doesn't mean she did not learn Quran, hadeeth and other islamic stuff off by heart?

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Mintchocchip View Post
    Being illiterate doesn't mean she did not learn Quran, hadeeth and other islamic stuff off by heart?
    clearly her being educated was not a priority and her having memorized hadith is pretty wishful thinking.


    This thread really,really bothers me. One of the so called great modern scholars wife was illiterate? She was made to have children and serve her husband before learning to read?

    I really need to verify this thru a another source as, if it is true then it dramatically changes that sheikhs standing permanently.

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    Senior Member Juwairiyyah's Avatar
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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by uccello verde View Post
    Ma sha'Allah, how amazing example for everyone to follow, In shs'Allah.
    What a dream. <3
    What exactly is dreamy about this?

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Very nice

    It was not uncommon, even in recent past, for women in certain countries to be illiterate. I found it interesting that a number of the most educated men I met when looking for marriage had illiterate mothers. Once when I asked, but how did you become a doctor and become so knowledgeable in deen, it was said that they had to read the mail and newspapers to their mom, but she raised good children because of the care she provided and from education that was available outside of the house.

    In this case, maybe she didn’t seek education early because she was satisfied with what she was doing in helping her kids and her husband. When your kids are grown, you end up with a lot of free time and so you find activities to occupy you. It’s nice to read that her husband encouraged her to invest in herself.

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Sister_2009 View Post
    Very nice

    It was not uncommon, even in recent past, for women in certain countries to be illiterate. I found it interesting that a number of the most educated men I met when looking for marriage had illiterate mothers. Once when I asked, but how did you become a doctor and become so knowledgeable in deen, it was said that they had to read the mail and newspapers to their mom, but she raised good children because of the care she provided and from education that was available outside of the house.

    In this case, maybe she didn’t seek education early because she was satisfied with what she was doing in helping her kids and her husband. When your kids are grown, you end up with a lot of free time and so you find activities to occupy you. It’s nice to read that her husband encouraged her to invest in herself.
    Were not talking about her not having a PhD,this is basic,,everyday, literacy.

    This opens up a huge can of worms about misogyny and oppression of women.

    how is a mother supposed to teach her children to read if she can't? a child's education starts long before they ever leave the house for school.
    with young children the mother is the first and primary educator,children should have the some basics taught by their mother. I could count,knew the alphabet and had some reading skills before I ever entered public education as that is considered normal and advantageous.
    how is she supposed to better herself educationally and islamically when she can't read her own name?

    What kind of example does this set for young girls? your only value is to push out babies? your only value is waiting on your husband and being available for breeding?

    This quote is not sweet or enlightening or inspirational,it's very,very disturbing. The man was a scholar but couldn't bother to teach his own wife to read?
    \What kind of man is that?what kind of example is that? what kind of leader is that?

    That not part of the sunnah at all,in fact it goes against the sunnah.

    He can teach men from here, there and other places about the deen but can't educate his own wife? seriously?

    If you met a woman in her 30's,40's or 50's tomorrow and she couldn't read but her husband had a PhD what would be your response?
    I would be shocked and horrified. I would do everything I could possibly do to see that that women got immediate help in learning to read.
    It would be top priority.

    when the whites enslaved africans and brought them to the caribbean and southern states to be slaves it was against the law to teach them to read as
    an educated slave was considered a dangerous slave and an ignorant slave is a submissive slave. this immediately came to mind when I read the quote above.

    I'm actually pretty shocked that some sisters approve of this and think it's somehow sweet that he ALLOWED her to learn to read till after her children were grown.

    Whole thing has the foul stench of jahilliyyah and oppression of women hanging about it and there's a part of me that hopes it not true but sadly it probably is.

    If the sheikh had married this women,found out she couldn't read,taught her to read and then had children that would be inspirational.

    Reading is a highly recommended bordering on wajib in islam,not optional,not if you feel like it or when you get around to it.

    universal literacy is one of the goals of islam as can be seen from hadith and seerah.

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    @Samsandman, you missed the point of my post, and I’m not going to entertain the rest of what you’ve written.

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Samsandman View Post
    clearly her being educated was not a priority and her having memorized hadith is pretty wishful thinking.


    This thread really,really bothers me. One of the so called great modern scholars wife was illiterate? She was made to have children and serve her husband before learning to read?

    I really need to verify this thru a another source as, if it is true then it dramatically changes that sheikhs standing permanently.
    I agree. Was going to write a huge reply to the OP but thought forget it.

    It really is disturbing that such a knowledgable person would not consider it a priority to educate his wife.

    Is this article for real??

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    I have mixed feelings about this. Then again, we don't know the whole story.

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Mintchocchip View Post
    I agree. Was going to write a huge reply to the OP but thought forget it.

    It really is disturbing that such a knowledgable person would not consider it a priority to educate his wife.

    Is this article for real??
    seems that way from I can find,there are a number of references online about the article and i found this copy of the article online.

    https://abdurrahman.org/2016/08/10/i...ykh-uthaimeen/

    the quote the sister posted is question #35 in the interview.

    I find this fact extremely shocking and brings many aspect of this man into question.

    seems blatantly hypocritical to be engaged in dawah and teaching (to men only,of course)when your not looking after your own wife's education.

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    اصبر aynina's Avatar
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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    @Samsandman @Mintchocchip @Stoic Believer

    Idk if i should agree with you or be upset at the fact so many people think being a housewoman is not a fulltime job..

    Learning arabic for me has been a huge struggle i still dont know it, (but thats because i dont know how to speak it or understand it, i learned writing it in 2 hours or so)

    Anyway my point is, maybe she was too busy with the household to take on studies Allahu alam

    But then again she didnt have to take a class he could have just taught her at home, or she vould have leatned it along with helping her kids with homework since they learn it in school

    Wel I'm confused now
    يَٰٓأَيُّهَا ٱلنَّاسُ ٱعْبُدُوا۟ رَبَّكُمُ ٱلَّذِى خَلَقَكُمْ وَٱلَّذِينَ مِن قَبْلِكُمْ لَعَلَّكُمْ تَتَّقُونَ

    O mankind, worship your Lord, who created you and those before you, that you may become righteous

    Surah Al Baqarah ayah 21

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by aynina View Post
    @Samsandman @Mintchocchip @Stoic Believer

    Idk if i should agree with you or be upset at the fact so many people think being a housewoman is not a fulltime job..

    Learning arabic for me has been a huge struggle i still dont know it, (but thats because i dont know how to speak it or understand it, i learned writing it in 2 hours or so)

    Anyway my point is, maybe she was too busy with the household to take on studies Allahu alam

    But then again she didnt have to take a class he could have just taught her at home, or she vould have leatned it along with helping her kids with homework since they learn it in school

    Wel I'm confused now
    I understand that housewife and raising children is a full time job(and an honorable one) but YOU can read and write at least one language,she couldn't read and write her own native language(arabic) and pretty safe to assume that she didn't speak,read or write english either.

    She was completely and totally illiterate in her own native tongue for the majority of her life.

    sadly I've come to learn that this isn't uncommon among some cultures, Many aid workers in Canada were shocked to learn that 40% of the syrian refugees that came to Canada are totally illiterate as well. I'm not saying they can't read or write english, they can't read or write their primary and sometimes ONLY language,arabic.

    yes we all know that The Prophet sallahu alayhi wasalam was illiterate but the majority of the companions were not and The Nabi sallahu alayhu wasalam made learning to read a recommended act and would ransom mushrikeen if they taught sahaba to read,that's how valued literacy was,despite the fact paper was rare. the ransom was not to teach 1 person to read either but 10.

    Even the Quran puts an emphasis on literacy. Would Allah swt order believers to write down contracts if reading and writing were optional?

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    Umm Kulthoom Rumaysah~'s Avatar
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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    lol typical ummah forum, always getting the wrong end of the stick and seeing the glass half empty.
    We're not all wowed at the fact that she was illiterate, all of us here can read and write. Two generations ago this was not the case, use your brains and apply her situation to today.

    We have women brought to the west from their home countries who can't read, write or speak english. Their husbands don't bother enrolling them at a school. This is just one example. So instead of backbiting the sheikh who is better than most of you, how about you open your mind a little and understand the time/generation that she was living in and in what state a country like saudi was in back then. Also why are you some of you shocked, she had a good husband. There are men treating their wives like slaves and punching bags but you guys are angry at a sheikh who taught his wife to read and write?
    شَكَوْتُ إلَى وَكِيعٍ سُوءَ حِفْظِي
    فَأرْشَدَنِي إلَى تَرْكِ المعَاصي
    وَأخْبَرَنِي بأَنَّ العِلْمَ نُورٌ
    ونورُ الله لا يهدى لعاصي

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    Quote Originally Posted by aynina View Post
    @Samsandman @Mintchocchip @Stoic Believer

    Idk if i should agree with you or be upset at the fact so many people think being a housewoman is not a fulltime job..

    Learning arabic for me has been a huge struggle i still dont know it, (but thats because i dont know how to speak it or understand it, i learned writing it in 2 hours or so)

    Anyway my point is, maybe she was too busy with the household to take on studies Allahu alam

    But then again she didnt have to take a class he could have just taught her at home, or she vould have leatned it along with helping her kids with homework since they learn it in school

    Wel I'm confused now
    Like I said, mixed feelings. I understand housework and kids is a lot of work. But over all those years she couldn't even read?

    But of course, I don't know the whole story. And I still respect the Sheikh immensely.

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    Umm Kulthoom Rumaysah~'s Avatar
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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Samsandman View Post
    Were not talking about her not having a PhD,this is basic,,everyday, literacy.

    This opens up a huge can of worms about misogyny and oppression of women.

    how is a mother supposed to teach her children to read if she can't? a child's education starts long before they ever leave the house for school.
    with young children the mother is the first and primary educator,children should have the some basics taught by their mother. I could count,knew the alphabet and had some reading skills before I ever entered public education as that is considered normal and advantageous.
    how is she supposed to better herself educationally and islamically when she can't read her own name?

    What kind of example does this set for young girls? your only value is to push out babies? your only value is waiting on your husband and being available for breeding?

    This quote is not sweet or enlightening or inspirational,it's very,very disturbing. The man was a scholar but couldn't bother to teach his own wife to read?
    \What kind of man is that?what kind of example is that? what kind of leader is that?

    That not part of the sunnah at all,in fact it goes against the sunnah.

    He can teach men from here, there and other places about the deen but can't educate his own wife? seriously?

    If you met a woman in her 30's,40's or 50's tomorrow and she couldn't read but her husband had a PhD what would be your response?
    I would be shocked and horrified. I would do everything I could possibly do to see that that women got immediate help in learning to read.
    It would be top priority.

    when the whites enslaved africans and brought them to the caribbean and southern states to be slaves it was against the law to teach them to read as
    an educated slave was considered a dangerous slave and an ignorant slave is a submissive slave. this immediately came to mind when I read the quote above.

    I'm actually pretty shocked that some sisters approve of this and think it's somehow sweet that he ALLOWED her to learn to read till after her children were grown.

    Whole thing has the foul stench of jahilliyyah and oppression of women hanging about it and there's a part of me that hopes it not true but sadly it probably is.

    If the sheikh had married this women,found out she couldn't read,taught her to read and then had children that would be inspirational.

    Reading is a highly recommended bordering on wajib in islam,not optional,not if you feel like it or when you get around to it.

    universal literacy is one of the goals of islam as can be seen from hadith and seerah.
    First of all, this is saudi we are talking about. Women were not even allowed to drive let alone anything else especially in those times. Understand the cultural differences.

    Secondly, the prophet was illiterate. Being illiterate doesn't mean you don't know anything. Arab culture and many others used to emphasise memorising more than writing/reading.

    Thirdly, she did actually learn from him, she mentions it in the interview. He didn't neglect his family unlike a lot of those in the dawah field today.

    Fourthly, she didn't have one or two kids, she had many. Where was she supposed to find the time?

    Unfortunately in a lot of people's minds the only value a woman has is to serve her husband and have children. That's what the whole thread is highlighting.
    شَكَوْتُ إلَى وَكِيعٍ سُوءَ حِفْظِي
    فَأرْشَدَنِي إلَى تَرْكِ المعَاصي
    وَأخْبَرَنِي بأَنَّ العِلْمَ نُورٌ
    ونورُ الله لا يهدى لعاصي

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
    First of all, this is saudi we are talking about. Women were not even allowed to drive let alone anything else especially in those times. Understand the cultural differences.

    Secondly, the prophet was illiterate. Being illiterate doesn't mean you don't know anything. Arab culture and many others used to emphasise memorising more than writing/reading.

    Thirdly, she did actually learn from him, she mentions it in the interview. He didn't neglect his family unlike a lot of those in the dawah field today.

    Fourthly, she didn't have one or two kids, she had many. Where was she supposed to find the time?

    Unfortunately in a lot of people's minds the only value a woman has is to serve her husband and have children. That's what the whole thread is highlighting.
    Maybe this applies to saudi culture and not arab culture as Aisha ra could read and write and as far as I can tell ALL of the Nabi's wives could red and write,Fatima ra could read and write and there were a number of important and influential female scholars in the early days of Islam. literacy and scholarship go hand and hand,you will be very hard pressed to name even ONE islamic male scholar that is illiterate, there is a reason that,Imams,Abu Hanifa,Ahmed,Abu Dawood,Nisa'i,Malik An Nawawi,Ibn Kathir,Bukhari,At Tabari,Ibn Al Qayyim, etc are famous and household names,They WROTE books.

    Arab culture and Islamic culture are not synonymous. lots of arabs are not even muslim keep in mind.

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    Umm Kulthoom Rumaysah~'s Avatar
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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by aynina View Post
    @Samsandman @Mintchocchip @Stoic Believer

    Idk if i should agree with you or be upset at the fact so many people think being a housewoman is not a fulltime job..

    Learning arabic for me has been a huge struggle i still dont know it, (but thats because i dont know how to speak it or understand it, i learned writing it in 2 hours or so)

    Anyway my point is, maybe she was too busy with the household to take on studies Allahu alam

    But then again she didnt have to take a class he could have just taught her at home, or she vould have leatned it along with helping her kids with homework since they learn it in school

    Wel I'm confused now
    She was raising 8 kids, his schedule was full from morning till night, she says he never had any time to rest.
    There simply was no time also she didn't ask to join a school.
    This was a long time ago, I don't know why you guys are so shocked. This is life, there are people who are illiterate for various reasons, being able to read and write is a privilege.
    Scholars are human too, why do we criticise them so much and turn a blind eye to clear oppressors.

    It's only here that people expect the wives (families) of scholars to be some kind of walking miracle, and when we find out she doesn't know much, that she's just an average woman, we think "doesn't her husband teach her anything", then we start criticising him. We hold them up to unrealistic standards and have this weird idea in our heads that the families of scholars are perfect. At the end of the day it's a marriage like any other.

    He had three daughters too, so obviously the problem was more the generation his wife was from and the lack of time.
    شَكَوْتُ إلَى وَكِيعٍ سُوءَ حِفْظِي
    فَأرْشَدَنِي إلَى تَرْكِ المعَاصي
    وَأخْبَرَنِي بأَنَّ العِلْمَ نُورٌ
    ونورُ الله لا يهدى لعاصي

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    Odan Abu julaybeeb's Avatar
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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    U would be busy working day and night to serve a hypocrite kaffir tawagheet monarchy and government

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Samsandman View Post
    Maybe this applies to saudi culture and not arab culture as Aisha ra could read and write and as far as I can tell ALL of the Nabi's wives could red and write,Fatima ra could read and write and there were a number of important and influential female scholars in the early days of Islam. literacy and scholarship go hand and hand,you will be very hard pressed to name even ONE islamic male scholar that is illiterate, there is a reason that,Imams,Abu Hanifa,Ahmed,Abu Dawood,Nisa'i,Malik An Nawawi,Ibn Kathir,Bukhari,At Tabari,Ibn Al Qayyim, etc are famous and household names,They WROTE books.

    Arab culture and Islamic culture are not synonymous. lots of arabs are not even muslim keep in mind.
    Of course but many in those times couldn't read and write, islam encouraged scholarship and writing/reading but that doesn't change the fact that those societies still memorised more than they ever wrote/read. Memorising is a big part of arab culture and other cultures in muslim countries. If it wasn't for their memory, how would the deen have reached us. They relied on memory, not books. Books came later.

    Obviously things did change, islamic/secular education of women declined when people started misunderstanding the deen and putting their cultures first.
    شَكَوْتُ إلَى وَكِيعٍ سُوءَ حِفْظِي
    فَأرْشَدَنِي إلَى تَرْكِ المعَاصي
    وَأخْبَرَنِي بأَنَّ العِلْمَ نُورٌ
    ونورُ الله لا يهدى لعاصي

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Abu julaybeeb View Post
    U would be busy working day and night to serve a hypocrite kaffir tawagheet monarchy and government
    what do you mean?
    شَكَوْتُ إلَى وَكِيعٍ سُوءَ حِفْظِي
    فَأرْشَدَنِي إلَى تَرْكِ المعَاصي
    وَأخْبَرَنِي بأَنَّ العِلْمَ نُورٌ
    ونورُ الله لا يهدى لعاصي

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    On A Hired Plane of Logic LailaTheMuslim's Avatar
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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Samsandman View Post
    Maybe this applies to saudi culture and not arab culture as Aisha ra could read and write and as far as I can tell ALL of the Nabi's wives could red and write,Fatima ra could read and write and there were a number of important and influential female scholars in the early days of Islam. literacy and scholarship go hand and hand,you will be very hard pressed to name even ONE islamic male scholar that is illiterate, there is a reason that,Imams,Abu Hanifa,Ahmed,Abu Dawood,Nisa'i,Malik An Nawawi,Ibn Kathir,Bukhari,At Tabari,Ibn Al Qayyim, etc are famous and household names,They WROTE books.

    Arab culture and Islamic culture are not synonymous. lots of arabs are not even muslim keep in mind.
    Brother you are totally spot on with your comments, and the Nabi Sallallahu alayhi wa salam and the companions were from Makkah and Madinah, which is now Saudi Arabia.
    Last edited by LailaTheMuslim; 31-10-17 at 09:42 PM.
    وَاقْصِدْ فِي مَشْيِكَ وَاغْضُضْ مِن صَوْتِكَ ۚ إِنَّ أَنكَرَ الْأَصْوَاتِ لَصَوْتُ الْحَمِيرِ - 31:19

    And be moderate in your pace and lower your voice; indeed, the most disagreeable of sounds is the voice of donkeys."


    أَلَمْ تَرَوْا أَنَّ اللَّهَ سَخَّرَ لَكُم مَّا فِي السَّمَاوَاتِ وَمَا فِي الْأَرْضِ وَأَسْبَغَ عَلَيْكُمْ نِعَمَهُ ظَاهِرَةً وَبَاطِنَةً ۗ وَمِنَ النَّاسِ مَن يُجَادِلُ فِي اللَّهِ بِغَيْرِ عِلْمٍ وَلَا هُدًى وَلَا كِتَابٍ مُّنِيرٍ - 31:20

    Do you not see that Allah has made subject to you whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth and amply bestowed upon you His favors, [both] apparent and unapparent? But of the people is he who disputes about Allah without knowledge or guidance or an enlightening Book [from Him].


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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
    She was raising 8 kids, his schedule was full from morning till night, she says he never had any time to rest.
    There simply was no time also she didn't ask to join a school.
    This was a long time ago, I don't know why you guys are so shocked. This is life, there are people who are illiterate for various reasons, being able to read and write is a privilege.
    Scholars are human too, why do we criticise them so much and turn a blind eye to clear oppressors.

    It's only here that people expect the wives (families) of scholars to be some kind of walking miracle, and when we find out she doesn't know much, that she's just an average woman, we think "doesn't her husband teach her anything", then we start criticising him. We hold them up to unrealistic standards and have this weird idea in our heads that the families of scholars are perfect. At the end of the day it's a marriage like any other.

    He had three daughters too, so obviously the problem was more the generation his wife was from and the lack of time.
    I can't believe you think literacy is privilege. That's an arrogant,jahil mentality.something that I would expect from christians a 1000 yrs ago but not from a muslimah in the 21st century.

    even if she was married young at 14 or 16 thats still more than enough time for someone to teach here to read.

    literacy for men women and all muslims is a basic right not a privilege. The Quran has been in written form since the khaliphate of Uthman ra for a reason. the Ahadeeth have been in written form for the better part of 1200 years for a reason.

    A man that encourages his sons to learn to read but not his daughters IS an oppressor. Educated,literate woman are strong women. women are the primary educators of children so this is a rather
    important subject.

    I know I sound like a male feminist saying all this but these are some pretty basic rights,like food,clean water and shelter. No wonder the women of this ummah feel oppressed.
    I'm surprised that it's a sister defending this behaviour.

    And if you feel so strongly about literacy for women being a privilege than maybe you shouldn't be reading this,seems it's a privilege you don't deserve since you take it for granted.

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    It's not obligatory on the husband to ensure his wife is literate. Stop attacking the shaykh with your ignorance.
    You think you know more than my scholar's qiyās? He was more learned than you and all other scholars combined. Yeah, the devil was the greatest scholar too and look where his qiyās of fire being better than tīn got him. Sorry.

    You follow your scholar's qiyās, and I will follow the Qur'ān and Sunnah.

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
    Of course but many in those times couldn't read and write, islam encouraged scholarship and writing/reading but that doesn't change the fact that those societies still memorised more than they ever wrote/read. Memorising is a big part of arab culture and other cultures in muslim countries. If it wasn't for their memory, how would the deen have reached us. They relied on memory, not books. Books came later.

    Obviously things did change, islamic/secular education of women declined when people started misunderstanding the deen and putting their cultures first.
    No, the Quran was written down by sahaba in the lifetime of the Prophet sallahu alayhi wasalam and was written in full in book form as they feared that to many huffaz were being killed in jihad and that it was endanger of being lost.
    It was standardized in the reign of Uthman ra(a sahabi himself) and widely circulated in book form from then on.

    google sana manuscripts,the written Quran has been around almost as long as Islam

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Samsandman View Post
    in the lifetime of the Prophet sallahu alayhi wasalam and was written in full in book form as they feared that to many huffaz were being killed in jihad and that it was endanger of being lost.
    Wrong.
    You think you know more than my scholar's qiyās? He was more learned than you and all other scholars combined. Yeah, the devil was the greatest scholar too and look where his qiyās of fire being better than tīn got him. Sorry.

    You follow your scholar's qiyās, and I will follow the Qur'ān and Sunnah.

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Samsandman View Post
    I can't believe you think literacy is privilege. That's an arrogant,jahil mentality.something that I would expect from christians a 1000 yrs ago but not from a muslimah in the 21st century.

    even if she was married young at 14 or 16 thats still more than enough time for someone to teach here to read.

    literacy for men women and all muslims is a basic right not a privilege. The Quran has been in written form since the khaliphate of Uthman ra for a reason. the Ahadeeth have been in written form for the better part of 1200 years for a reason.

    A man that encourages his sons to learn to read but not his daughters IS an oppressor. Educated,literate woman are strong women. women are the primary educators of children so this is a rather
    important subject.n

    I know I sound like a male feminist saying all this but these are some pretty basic rights,like food,clean water and shelter. No wonder the women of this ummah feel oppressed.
    I'm surprised that it's a sister defending this behaviour.

    And if you feel so strongly about literacy for women being a privilege than maybe you shouldn't be reading this,seems it's a privilege you don't deserve since you take it for granted.
    Bring us a verse or hadith where ensuring one's wife is literate is an obligation on her husband.

    Otherwise if you're gonna attack someone, attack the woman herself.
    You think you know more than my scholar's qiyās? He was more learned than you and all other scholars combined. Yeah, the devil was the greatest scholar too and look where his qiyās of fire being better than tīn got him. Sorry.

    You follow your scholar's qiyās, and I will follow the Qur'ān and Sunnah.

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Linkdeutscher View Post
    It's not obligatory on the husband to ensure his wife is literate. Stop attacking the shaykh with your ignorance.
    never said it was HIS obligation but it clearly reflects on his character.

    Seeking knowledge is not the exclusive right of men.

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Samsandman View Post
    never said it was HIS obligation but it clearly reflects on his character.

    Seeking knowledge is not the exclusive right of men.
    Did he stop her? Why didn't she bother herself?

    If you're gonna criticize someone let it be the wife.
    You think you know more than my scholar's qiyās? He was more learned than you and all other scholars combined. Yeah, the devil was the greatest scholar too and look where his qiyās of fire being better than tīn got him. Sorry.

    You follow your scholar's qiyās, and I will follow the Qur'ān and Sunnah.

  35. #35
    On A Hired Plane of Logic LailaTheMuslim's Avatar
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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    “He who has a slave-girl and teaches her good manners and improves her education and then manumits and marries her, will get a double reward; and any slave who observes ALLAH’s right and his master’s right will get a double reward.” (Sahih Bukhari)

    Its rewarded in Islam to even teach women who were slaves.

    Literacy is so important in Islam. How could you learn about our religion without being able to read, since knowledge is no longer spread primarily orally? And to learn other sciences and to do anything in life?

    Check out my avatar.
    وَاقْصِدْ فِي مَشْيِكَ وَاغْضُضْ مِن صَوْتِكَ ۚ إِنَّ أَنكَرَ الْأَصْوَاتِ لَصَوْتُ الْحَمِيرِ - 31:19

    And be moderate in your pace and lower your voice; indeed, the most disagreeable of sounds is the voice of donkeys."


    أَلَمْ تَرَوْا أَنَّ اللَّهَ سَخَّرَ لَكُم مَّا فِي السَّمَاوَاتِ وَمَا فِي الْأَرْضِ وَأَسْبَغَ عَلَيْكُمْ نِعَمَهُ ظَاهِرَةً وَبَاطِنَةً ۗ وَمِنَ النَّاسِ مَن يُجَادِلُ فِي اللَّهِ بِغَيْرِ عِلْمٍ وَلَا هُدًى وَلَا كِتَابٍ مُّنِيرٍ - 31:20

    Do you not see that Allah has made subject to you whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth and amply bestowed upon you His favors, [both] apparent and unapparent? But of the people is he who disputes about Allah without knowledge or guidance or an enlightening Book [from Him].


    Please take a look at my travel booking website : https://destinationfindertravel.com/

    Please take a look at my blog : http://thinkingmuslima.blogspot.co.uk/

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Linkdeutscher View Post
    Wrong.
    you want to refute imam bukhari?

    Bukhari: vol. 6, hadith 509, p. 477; book 61
    Narrated Zaid-bin-Thabit:
    Abu Bakr As-Siddiq sent for me when the people of Yama-ma had been killed (i.e. a number of the prophets companions who fought against Musailama). (I went to him) and found Umar bin Al-Khattab sitting with him. Abu Bakr then said to me, "Umar has come to me and said: `Casualties were heavy among the Qurra of the Qur'an (ie those who knew the Qur'an by heart) on the day of the battle of Yama-ma, and I am afraid that more heavy casualties may take place among the Qurra on other battle fields, whereby a large part of the Qur'an may be lost. Therefore I suggest that you (Abu Bakr) order that the Qur'an be collected'. I said to Umar, `How can you do something Allah's Apostle did not do?' Umar said, `By Allah, that is a good project'. Umar kept on urging me to accept his proposal till Allah opened my chest (persuaded me) for it and I began to realise the good idea which Umar had realised.

  37. #37
    On A Hired Plane of Logic LailaTheMuslim's Avatar
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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Linkdeutscher View Post
    Did he stop her? Why didn't she bother herself?

    If you're gonna criticize someone let it be the wife.
    What an odd comment. do you really think this sister didn't read because of laziness (which is somewhat slander) or because institutional and cultural oppression that limited women from education?
    وَاقْصِدْ فِي مَشْيِكَ وَاغْضُضْ مِن صَوْتِكَ ۚ إِنَّ أَنكَرَ الْأَصْوَاتِ لَصَوْتُ الْحَمِيرِ - 31:19

    And be moderate in your pace and lower your voice; indeed, the most disagreeable of sounds is the voice of donkeys."


    أَلَمْ تَرَوْا أَنَّ اللَّهَ سَخَّرَ لَكُم مَّا فِي السَّمَاوَاتِ وَمَا فِي الْأَرْضِ وَأَسْبَغَ عَلَيْكُمْ نِعَمَهُ ظَاهِرَةً وَبَاطِنَةً ۗ وَمِنَ النَّاسِ مَن يُجَادِلُ فِي اللَّهِ بِغَيْرِ عِلْمٍ وَلَا هُدًى وَلَا كِتَابٍ مُّنِيرٍ - 31:20

    Do you not see that Allah has made subject to you whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth and amply bestowed upon you His favors, [both] apparent and unapparent? But of the people is he who disputes about Allah without knowledge or guidance or an enlightening Book [from Him].


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  38. #38
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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Stoic Believer View Post
    I have mixed feelings about this. Then again, we don't know the whole story.
    Me too and I don’t want to comment on the story exactly for that reason..

    But in general, children and housework shouldn’t prevent a sister from seeking knowledge.
    رَّبِّ ارْحَمْهُمَا كَمَا رَبَّيَانِي صَغِيرًا

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Umm Uthmaan View Post
    Me too and I don’t want to comment on the story exactly for that reason..

    But in general, children and housework shouldn’t prevent a sister from seeking knowledge.
    Neither suckling children nor housework is an obligation for a wife but that's conveniently overlooked entirely in this thread.
    Funny how that is,eh?

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    Re: 'investing' in your wife, an example from the life of sheikh ibn uthaymeen

    Quote Originally Posted by Rumaysah~ View Post
    lol typical ummah forum, always getting the wrong end of the stick and seeing the glass half empty.
    We're not all wowed at the fact that she was illiterate, all of us here can read and write. Two generations ago this was not the case, use your brains and apply her situation to today.


    We have women brought to the west from their home countries who can't read, write or speak english. Their husbands don't bother enrolling them at a school. This is just one example. So instead of backbiting the sheikh who is better than most of you, how about you open your mind a little and understand the time/generation that she was living in and in what state a country like saudi was in back then. Also why are you some of you shocked, she had a good husband. There are men treating their wives like slaves and punching bags but you guys are angry at a sheikh who taught his wife to read and write?
    This is exactly what came to mind. Folks are struggling to think outside of the box and make basic connections.

 

 

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