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    Question I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    I came across this story yesterday on Twitter.....

    http://hadithoftheday.com/loving-the-prophet/

    I was curious for a reference. My Google search points towards Musnad Ahmad containing this, but I´m unable to locate as to in which volume or book this is from that collection.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Anyone?

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    😈 Al-Wahhābī 😈 Linkdeutscher's Avatar
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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    You think you know more than my scholar's qiyās? He was more learned than you and all other scholars combined. Yeah, the devil was the greatest scholar too and look where his qiyās of fire being better than tīn got him. Sorry.

    You follow your scholar's qiyās, and I will follow the Qur'ān and Sunnah.

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    Odan ZeeshanParvez's Avatar
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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    It seems as if the author of that piece has written the gist of hadith found on the subject in different sources.

    The part about the fighting is present here in Sahih Muslim.

    Here is the one in Musnad Ahmad Hadith No. 19784

    حدثنا عفان، حدثنا حماد بن سلمة، عن ثابت، عن كنانة بن نعيم العدوي، عن أبي برزة الأسلمي، أن جليبيبا كان امرأ يدخل على النساء، يمر بهن ويلاعبهن فقلت لامرأتي: لا يدخلن عليكم جليبيب؛ فإنه إن دخل عليكم، لأفعلن ولأفعلن. قال: وكانت الأنصار إذا كان لأحدهم أيم لم يزوجها حتى يعلم هل للنبي صلى الله عليه وسلم فيها حاجة؟ أم لا. فقال رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم لرجل من الأنصار: " زوجني ابنتك ". فقال: نعم وكرامة يا رسول الله ونعم عيني. قال: " إني لست أريدها لنفسي ". قال: فلمن يا رسول الله؟ قال: " لجليبيب ".: قال: فقال: يا رسول الله، أشاور أمها فأتى أمها فقال: رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم يخطب ابنتك. فقالت: نعم. ونعمة عيني. فقال: إنه ليس يخطبها لنفسه إنما يخطبها لجليبيب. فقالت: أجليبيب إنية؟ أجليبيب إنية؟ أجليبيب إنية؟ لا. لعمر الله لا نزوجه. فلما أراد أن يقوم ليأتي رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم فيخبره بما قالت أمها: قالت الجارية: من خطبني إليكم؟ فأخبرتها أمها فقالت: أتردون على رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم أمره؟ ادفعوني؛ فإنه لم يضيعني. فانطلق أبوها إلى رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم فأخبره فقال: شأنك بها فزوجها جليبيبا قال: فخرج رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم في غزوة له. قال: فلما أفاء الله عليه قال لأصحابه: " هل تفقدون من أحد؟ " قالوا: نفقد فلانا ونفقد فلانا. قال: " انظروا هل تفقدون من أحد؟ " قالوا: لا. قال: " لكني أفقد جليبيبا ". قال: " فاطلبوه في القتلى ". قال: فطلبوه فوجدوه إلى جنب سبعة قد قتلهم، ثم قتلوه. فقالوا: يا رسول الله ها هو ذا إلى جنب سبعة قد قتلهم، ثم قتلوه، فأتاه النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم فقام عليه فقال: " قتل سبعة وقتلوه هذا مني وأنا منه. هذا مني وأنا منه " مرتين أو ثلاثا، ثم وضعه رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم على ساعديه وحفر له ما له سرير إلا ساعدا رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم، ثم وضعه في قبره، ولم يذكر أنه غسله. قال ثابت: فما كان في الأنصار أيم أنفق منها. وحدث إسحاق بن عبد الله بن أبي طلحة ثابتا قال: هل تعلم ما دعا لها رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم؟ قال: " اللهم صب عليها الخير صبا، ولا تجعل عيشها كدا كدا ". قال فما كان في الأنصار أيم أنفق منها. (1) قال أبو عبد الرحمن: ما حدث به في الدنيا أحد إلا حماد بن سلمة ما أحسنه من حديث



    musnadahmad.jpg

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    I would never take Hadith from such a site as "Hadith of the Day".

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    Beautiful story of July’beeb
    Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم
    It is narrated in the Books of History that Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم was a Sahabee (companion) who was:
    • short in height
    • deformed in appearance
    • his lineage was not known
    • no one knew who his parents were
    • with no clan to protect him
    • no tribe willing to accept him as their own
    • he cut a lonely figure even the small children of Madinah would tease & mock him
    • owing to his disabilities no one would allow him to sit in their company.
    Some of these things are not mentioned in the main books about the Companions. Julaybeeb was not handsome and was not from a noble lineage. Also, some of the narrations mention that he used to sit with the women and one of the Companions, Abu Barzah RA, told his wife not to sit with him. This seems to be because Julaybeeb is described as very charming and very funny. More than likely this had something to do with Abu Barzah not wanting his wife to sit with Julaybeeb, not because of "disabilities".


    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    He survived as best he could, many a lonely night in Madinah he spent wondering the streets in despair, tears of desperation would run down his cheeks, there was no one willing to offer him love or compassion, he had no family and not a single friend in the world.

    Life for him was a lonely struggle.
    This is not found in any books about the Companions or Seerah. It appears to be an embellishment.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    After the arrival of the Prophet of ALLAH ﷺ to Madinah, the fortunes of Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم changed.He would go and sit in the company of the Prophet ﷺ and listen intently, rarely speaking; he would out of shyness keep his gaze lowered. He now, had the best of friends in the Prophet of ALLAH ﷺ; those days of loneliness and despair were over, for the Best of creation ﷺ had arrived.

    Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم was now a part of the community of believers (in Islamic Monotheism).
    One day as he was sitting in the Company of the Prophet ﷺ, The Messenger of ALLAH ﷺ asked him:
    “O Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم ask for something… is there anything you desire?” He raised his head slowly and said in a shy voice; “O Messenger of ALLAH ﷺ, ALLAH has blessed me with your companionship, I get to sit at your blessed feet and hear your blessed words, what more could I desire”.
    The Prophet of ALLAH ﷺ asked:
    “How would you like to get married my dear Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم,”
    He smiled shyly wondering who would want to marry him. “Yes messenger of ALLAH ﷺ I would like that.”
    This conversation does not appear to have ever taken place. It is not reported in any of the books of Hadith, Seerah or History.


    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    The Prophet of ALLAH ﷺ went to the house of a prominent and noble Sahabee from amongst the Ansar. He said “I have come to ask for your daughters hand in marriage”.
    This Companion from the Ansar is never named so it cannot be known if he was "prominent and noble".


    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    The Sahabee was overjoyed he said:
    “O Messenger of ALLAH ﷺ what could be a greater blessing than this.”
    The Prophet ﷺ said:
    “I do not ask of her for myself. It is for Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم that I am asking.”
    An embellishment in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    The Sahabee was left stunned:
    “For Julay’beeb?” he asked in bewilderment. “Yes for Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم” replied The Messenger of ALLAH ﷺ.
    He said:
    “Let me consult with my wife.”
    He went and told her. “The Prophet of ALLAH ﷺ has asked for your daughters hand in marriage, for Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم.”
    She started crying and wailing:
    All embellishments.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    “No not Julay’beeb anyone but Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم I will never allow this.”
    This was never said.


    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    Upon hearing the commotion, the daughter arrived. It is said that she was so beautiful that there was none among the women of the Ansar who could compete with her beauty. She was so shy and modest that perhaps the sky itself had never seen her head uncovered. She had so much Taqwa that she would spend her days & nights in worship.
    None of the reports or versions of the story of Julaybeeb mention this at all.


    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    The daughter asked what was happening; she was told that the Prophet of ALLAH ﷺ wants your hand in marriage for Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم.As the Mother continued her crying and wailing, the daughter spoke, she said:
    “O my Mother, fear ALLAH, think of what you are saying, are you turning away the Prophet of ALLAH ﷺ.
    ‘O my Mother, it does not suit a believer to make their own decision once ALLAH and His Messenger ﷺ have decided on a matter.

    Do you think that the Prophet of ALLAH ﷺ will disgrace us?
    More embellishment.

    Actually most of the reports mention that the daughter overhead the parents talking to the Prophet SAWS. So she did not have to ask what was happening.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    How blessed is the status of Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم, that ALLAH and His Messenger ﷺ are asking for your daughters hand on his behalf. Don’t you know that the angels themselves envy the dust on the feet of one who is a beloved of ALLAH and His Prophet ﷺ.
    Exaggeration.


    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    Ask the Prophet ﷺ, to send me Julay’beeb رضي الله عنه for there is no greater privilege than for me to be blessed by such a husband. The Prophet of Allaah ﷺ has arrived with such a wonderful gift, yet my Mother you cry and wail.”
    Never said.


    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    The Mothers heart being filled with remorse said:
    “Stop, my daughter, don’t say another word, indeed I have erred, I repent and I repent a 1,000 times over for as of this moment there is no one who I would prefer for you than Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم.”
    Never said.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    The following day the Nikaah is made.

    Uthman رضي الله عنهم and Ali رضي الله عنهم present Julay’beeb a gift of money to help arrange the feast of Walimah, and to purchase accommodation.
    No reference for this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    A short time later on an expedition Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم was martyred.

    On the day of the expedition his Father in law, had pleaded with him:
    “‘O Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم this is just an expedition, it is not a compulsory Jihad, it is Fardh Al-Kifaayah, it is a voluntary Jihad, and you are newly married, so spend some time with your wife.”
    No reference for this. Also, this does not appear to be consistent with the rules of Jihad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم, the one who had spent a lifetime in despair had now found a loving wife.But listen to his response to the Father in law’s request.
    He said “‘O my father, you say a strange thing, my Beloved Prophet ﷺ is in the battlefield facing the enemies of Islam and you want me to sit at home with my wife, nay I will sacrifice my blood and my soul rather than see my Prophet ﷺ facing hardship while I sit at home in luxury”.
    No reference for this in any book of history or Seerah.


    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    The diminutive Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم was indeed a strange sight carrying a sword almost the same size as him.
    The Sahabah stared in wonderment at him, the sweet and gentle Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم was transformed in to a Lion.
    No reference for this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    “Who dare wage war upon my Prophet ﷺ?” He said, as he charged into the ranks of the enemy.
    No reference.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    After that battle the Prophet of ALLAH ﷺ, asked the Sahabah to go and to see if anyone was missing from their families and clans.

    Each one returned accounting for all his family members.
    This is part of a narration regarding Julaybeeb mixed in with more falsehood and exaggeration.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    Then the Prophet ﷺ spoke with tears in his eyes he said:
    But I have lost my Beloved Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم go and find him.”
    Not part of any Hadith.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    They found his diminutive body lying next to 7 of the enemies he had slain in the battle.
    Exaggeration.


    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    The Prophet of ALLAH ﷺ asked for a grave to be dug, as the Prophet of ALLAH ﷺ held the body of Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم he said:
    “O’ ALLAH he is from me and I am From Him”, he repeated this 3 times.
    The companions wept profusely,
    One of the few parts of this entire story as related by "Hadith of the Day" that is true.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    “May our Mothers and Fathers be sacrificed for you O’ Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم, how great is your status!”
    No reference.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    Thus, a Sahabee who had once lived as an outcast, shunned by the society around him.
    He loved ALLAH and His Messenger ﷺ and reached such a high status.
    He who was not good-looking was blessed with a beautiful wife.
    He who was poor was blessed by a wealthy wife.
    He who had no family or status, was blessed by a wife with noble status & lineage.
    He who had lived in loneliness and despair, was loved by ALLAH and His Messenger ﷺ.
    Only the underlined is possibly true.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    It is said:
    “That upon his martyrdom, that the sky itself was filled with thousands of angels who had come to participate in his Janazah”.
    No reference.


    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    Julay’beeb رضي الله عنهم ‘The Lonesome one’ had become a beloved of Allaah, and His Prophet ﷺ, he was lonely no more.
    Such is the status of the lovers of the Prophet ﷺ.
    No reference.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadith of the Day
    As for his wife, it is said that there was no widow whose hand was more sought after in marriage than hers.
    [Saheeh Muslim Book 031, Hadeeth Number 6045]
    Only this last part was mentioned in Saheeh Muslim.

    What a scam of a website. No person who respects Hadith would ever refer to this website for any information regarding Hadith.
    Last edited by AbuNajm; 03-10-17 at 02:33 PM. Reason: formatting corrections

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    I cant remembwr where I read this but it said that if there is a jihad that isnt fard al ain then a man who is newly married and wanting to consumate the marriage or a person who has livestock eg camel who will give birth soon should stay and not go to the ghazwa

    Could you comment on this and if its true or not
    I have no clue about the authenticity as I cant remember where I read it
    JazakAllah khair
    @AbuNajm

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by Abu julaybeeb View Post
    I cant remembwr where I read this but it said that if there is a jihad that isnt fard al ain then a man who is newly married and wanting to consumate the marriage or a person who has livestock eg camel who will give birth soon should stay and not go to the ghazwa

    Could you comment on this and if its true or not
    I have no clue about the authenticity as I cant remember where I read it
    JazakAllah khair
    @AbuNajm
    The terminology "so-and-so should stay and not go" carries the connotation of a "recommendation" in legal terms.

    When Jihad is a communal obligation, it is still the most meritorious act of worship that a person can do. So the voluntary Jihad would take precedence over conjugation or overseeing the birth of livestock. In fact, I've never heard of specific merits attributed to conjugation or overseeing the birth of livestock.

    The only deterrents for a person to engage in communally obligated Jihad is lack of permission from a creditor, parents or a master in the case of a slave.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Jazaakallah for the detailed responses and the references, brothers. Much appreciated and very helpful in every way!

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuNajm View Post
    The terminology "so-and-so should stay and not go" carries the connotation of a "recommendation" in legal terms.

    When Jihad is a communal obligation, it is still the most meritorious act of worship that a person can do. So the voluntary Jihad would take precedence over conjugation or overseeing the birth of livestock. In fact, I've never heard of specific merits attributed to conjugation or overseeing the birth of livestock.

    The only deterrents for a person to engage in communally obligated Jihad is lack of permission from a creditor, parents or a master in the case of a slave.
    JazakAllah khair

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuNajm View Post
    I would never take Hadith from such a site as "Hadith of the Day".



    Some of these things are not mentioned in the main books about the Companions. Julaybeeb was not handsome and was not from a noble lineage. Also, some of the narrations mention that he used to sit with the women and one of the Companions, Abu Barzah RA, told his wife not to sit with him. This seems to be because Julaybeeb is described as very charming and very funny. More than likely this had something to do with Abu Barzah not wanting his wife to sit with Julaybeeb, not because of "disabilities".




    This is not found in any books about the Companions or Seerah. It appears to be an embellishment.



    This conversation does not appear to have ever taken place. It is not reported in any of the books of Hadith, Seerah or History.




    This Companion from the Ansar is never named so it cannot be known if he was "prominent and noble".




    An embellishment in the story.



    All embellishments.



    This was never said.




    None of the reports or versions of the story of Julaybeeb mention this at all.




    More embellishment.

    Actually most of the reports mention that the daughter overhead the parents talking to the Prophet SAWS. So she did not have to ask what was happening.



    Exaggeration.




    Never said.




    Never said.



    No reference for this.



    No reference for this. Also, this does not appear to be consistent with the rules of Jihad.



    No reference for this in any book of history or Seerah.




    No reference for this.



    No reference.



    This is part of a narration regarding Julaybeeb mixed in with more falsehood and exaggeration.



    Not part of any Hadith.



    Exaggeration.




    One of the few parts of this entire story as related by "Hadith of the Day" that is true.



    No reference.



    Only the underlined is possibly true.



    No reference.




    No reference.



    Only this last part was mentioned in Saheeh Muslim.

    What a scam of a website. No person who respects Hadith would ever refer to this website for any information regarding Hadith.
    Pardon if I sound like an ignorant despite such a detailed and lengthy insight from you, but, brother, to what exact extent is the story true? By that I´m referring to Julaibeeb marrying to a woman with the Prophet arranging the proposal? And, was Julaibeed really deformed, short in height etc.?

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by Ummati09 View Post
    Pardon if I sound like an ignorant despite such a detailed and lengthy insight from you, but, brother, to what exact extent is the story true? By that I´m referring to Julaibeeb marrying to a woman with the Prophet arranging the proposal? And, was Julaibeed really deformed, short in height etc.?
    I highlighted in red the parts of the story that were embellished by the authors at Hadith of the Day.

    I also mentioned the parts that were never reported in any Hadith or Athar.

    So most of the details of the story as written by Hadith of the Day are unfounded.

    As for the arc of the story, then that is well-known by authentic Hadith- Julaybeeb may have been short and not handsome, but I have found no reference to any "deformity". The Prophet SAWS did speak on behalf of Julaybeeb with a family from the Ansar and marry him off. The young woman submitted to the wishes of the Prophet SAWS as did the parents, who initially expressed some reluctance.

    Julaybeeb then went to fight Jihad, although the details of that Jihad are not known nor the timing after the marriage. The Prophet SAWS did ask for Julaybeeb after the fighting and he was reported to have died with 7 polytheists dead around him. He was not washed, as is fitting for the martyr, and the Prophet SAWS mentioned what he mentioned about Julaybeeb RA.

    The widow of Julaybeeb was sought after due to the way she dealt with the marriage of Julaybeeb and obedience to the Prophet SAWS.

    It is wrong to just add details to stories about the Companions RA, regardless of whether that is for dramatic effect or otherwise. Some of the added details are offensive, such as claiming that Julaybeeb was "deformed" in any way, and other details give a bad impression of Companions RA like the parents allegedly swearing they would never marry their daughter to Julaybeeb, even after the Prophet SAWS spoke on his behalf.

    Embellishing stories can lead to offensive statements and negative impressions that are unnecessary and unfortunately they have long-lasting effects as they're more likely to be remembered and passed on than the authentic aspects of the story. And when these stories are about noble Companions RA, it is even more of a sin to make up things that are untrue and offensive to their posterity.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuNajm View Post
    The Prophet SAWS did speak on behalf of Julaybeeb with a family from the Ansar and marry him off. The young woman submitted to the wishes of the Prophet SAWS as did the parents, who initially expressed some reluctance.

    Julaybeeb then went to fight Jihad, although the details of that Jihad are not known nor the timing after the marriage. The Prophet SAWS did ask for Julaybeeb after the fighting and he was reported to have died with 7 polytheists dead around him. He was not washed, as is fitting for the martyr, and the Prophet SAWS mentioned what he mentioned about Julaybeeb RA.

    The widow of Julaybeeb was sought after due to the way she dealt with the marriage of Julaybeeb and obedience to the Prophet SAWS.
    And this bit, which is the only true bit from the whole story, in which book of Hadeeth is it mentioned?

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by Ummati09 View Post
    And this bit, which is the only true bit from the whole story, in which book of Hadeeth is it mentioned?
    @ZeeshanParvez already posted it.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    It seems as if the author of that piece has written the gist of hadith found on the subject in different sources.

    The part about the fighting is present here in Sahih Muslim.

    Here is the one in Musnad Ahmad Hadith No. 19784

    حدثنا عفان، حدثنا حماد بن سلمة، عن ثابت، عن كنانة بن نعيم العدوي، عن أبي برزة الأسلمي، أن جليبيبا كان امرأ يدخل على النساء، يمر بهن ويلاعبهن فقلت لامرأتي: لا يدخلن عليكم جليبيب؛ فإنه إن دخل عليكم، لأفعلن ولأفعلن. قال: وكانت الأنصار إذا كان لأحدهم أيم لم يزوجها حتى يعلم هل للنبي صلى الله عليه وسلم فيها حاجة؟ أم لا. فقال رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم لرجل من الأنصار: " زوجني ابنتك ". فقال: نعم وكرامة يا رسول الله ونعم عيني. قال: " إني لست أريدها لنفسي ". قال: فلمن يا رسول الله؟ قال: " لجليبيب ".: قال: فقال: يا رسول الله، أشاور أمها فأتى أمها فقال: رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم يخطب ابنتك. فقالت: نعم. ونعمة عيني. فقال: إنه ليس يخطبها لنفسه إنما يخطبها لجليبيب. فقالت: أجليبيب إنية؟ أجليبيب إنية؟ أجليبيب إنية؟ لا. لعمر الله لا نزوجه. فلما أراد أن يقوم ليأتي رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم فيخبره بما قالت أمها: قالت الجارية: من خطبني إليكم؟ فأخبرتها أمها فقالت: أتردون على رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم أمره؟ ادفعوني؛ فإنه لم يضيعني. فانطلق أبوها إلى رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم فأخبره فقال: شأنك بها فزوجها جليبيبا قال: فخرج رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم في غزوة له. قال: فلما أفاء الله عليه قال لأصحابه: " هل تفقدون من أحد؟ " قالوا: نفقد فلانا ونفقد فلانا. قال: " انظروا هل تفقدون من أحد؟ " قالوا: لا. قال: " لكني أفقد جليبيبا ". قال: " فاطلبوه في القتلى ". قال: فطلبوه فوجدوه إلى جنب سبعة قد قتلهم، ثم قتلوه. فقالوا: يا رسول الله ها هو ذا إلى جنب سبعة قد قتلهم، ثم قتلوه، فأتاه النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم فقام عليه فقال: " قتل سبعة وقتلوه هذا مني وأنا منه. هذا مني وأنا منه " مرتين أو ثلاثا، ثم وضعه رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم على ساعديه وحفر له ما له سرير إلا ساعدا رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم، ثم وضعه في قبره، ولم يذكر أنه غسله. قال ثابت: فما كان في الأنصار أيم أنفق منها. وحدث إسحاق بن عبد الله بن أبي طلحة ثابتا قال: هل تعلم ما دعا لها رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم؟ قال: " اللهم صب عليها الخير صبا، ولا تجعل عيشها كدا كدا ". قال فما كان في الأنصار أيم أنفق منها. (1) قال أبو عبد الرحمن: ما حدث به في الدنيا أحد إلا حماد بن سلمة ما أحسنه من حديث



    musnadahmad.jpg

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuNajm View Post
    @ZeeshanParvez already posted it.
    Oh´.... Actually, I didn´t overlook that, but it seems I failed to mention that I don´t understand Arabic. A translated version of it will be highly appreciated. @ZeeshanParvez

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by Ummati09 View Post
    Oh´.... Actually, I didn´t overlook that, but it seems I failed to mention that I don´t understand Arabic. A translated version of it will be highly appreciated. @ZeeshanParvez
    A decent translation would take at least an hour or so.

    It's a lot to ask of anyone.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuNajm View Post
    A decent translation would take at least an hour or so.

    It's a lot to ask of anyone.
    That´s alright. I meant if it was available online in English, not that anyone of you should translate. I understand how hard a task that can be.

    For example, I found three volumes of Musnad Ahmad below translated into English,.....

    http://www.kalamullah.com/musnad-ahmad.html

    ..... and was wondering whether the tradition discussed in this thread can be found on that link.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by Ummati09 View Post
    That´s alright. I meant if it was available online in English, not that anyone of you should translate. I understand how hard a task that can be.

    For example, I found three volumes of Musnad Ahmad below translated into English,.....

    http://www.kalamullah.com/musnad-ahmad.html

    ..... and was wondering whether the tradition discussed in this thread can be found on that link.
    It sure isn't in those volumes.

    They only go up to Hadith #4000 or so in the Musnad of Ibn Mas'ud RA.

    The tradition you're looking for is way further than that near Hadith #19000.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Ive heard different narrations of Julaybeeb ra story

    One said he went to go buy his wife some stuff but heard the call and instead went and bought things to prepare for the ghazwa

    Another said at the end when the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam picked him up and started crying he suddenly smiled and looked away as the hoor of Julaybeeb ra came down and a part of her leg was revealed

    Not actually word for word but as in the story

    Could you tell me if these 2 narrations are authentic if possible jazakAllah khair
    @AbuNajm

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by Abu julaybeeb View Post
    Ive heard different narrations of Julaybeeb ra story

    One said he went to go buy his wife some stuff but heard the call and instead went and bought things to prepare for the ghazwa

    Another said at the end when the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam picked him up and started crying he suddenly smiled and looked away as the hoor of Julaybeeb ra came down and a part of her leg was revealed

    Not actually word for word but as in the story

    Could you tell me if these 2 narrations are authentic if possible jazakAllah khair
    @AbuNajm
    In the biographical, Hadith and historical references I consulted in Arabic, I did not find any of the details you mentioned above. That's not to say they don't exist, I just didn't find them in the most authoritative works like al-Isti'aab, Usd al-Ghaabah, al-Isaabah, Siyar A'lam an-Nubalaa', the Masaaneed, Sunan, etc.

    However, being the Ummah of the Isnad, we don't accept matters pertaining to Islam or the Companions RA, or even news about events without verifying the chain of transmission. This chain can be an actual chain of narrators as in a Hadith or Athar, or it can be verifying the trustworthiness and reliability of the source for information about current events.

    If I spent time trying to verify everything I heard or read that did not have a reference, then I would never stop dealing with spurious and fabricated information.

    However, when I only stick to authoritative and referenced information, I spend more time learning what is authentic and actionable without wasting time on what is doubtful and unverifiable.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    I see thank you for the info
    JazakAllah khair

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    You can find the translation here.

    translation1.jpg
    translation2.jpg
    translation3.jpg
    Last edited by ZeeshanParvez; 09-10-17 at 02:12 AM.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    You´re a legend, a legend, brother! Thank you so much for solving something that I´d been after since nine days I think. A big thanks to @AbuNajm as well for all his help and the detailed posts about it. May Allah reward you both; Aameen.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuNajm View Post
    In the biographical, Hadith and historical references I consulted in Arabic, I did not find any of the details you mentioned above. That's not to say they don't exist, I just didn't find them in the most authoritative works like al-Isti'aab, Usd al-Ghaabah, al-Isaabah, Siyar A'lam an-Nubalaa', the Masaaneed, Sunan, etc.

    However, being the Ummah of the Isnad, we don't accept matters pertaining to Islam or the Companions RA, or even news about events without verifying the chain of transmission. This chain can be an actual chain of narrators as in a Hadith or Athar, or it can be verifying the trustworthiness and reliability of the source for information about current events.

    If I spent time trying to verify everything I heard or read that did not have a reference, then I would never stop dealing with spurious and fabricated information.

    However, when I only stick to authoritative and referenced information, I spend more time learning what is authentic and actionable without wasting time on what is doubtful and unverifiable.
    These are undoubtedly very wise words and an advice to be taken, indeed. However, the only reason why I was after this particular tradition is that it relates to me on a very personal level. So my curiosity for it had its reasons.

    Jazaakallah, brother!

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    There are a few issues with this translation, the main one of which is the following:

    "If any of the Ansar had a single female relative, they would not arrange a marriage for her until they found out whether the Prophet wanted to marry her or not.”

    This is how the author translated:

    وَكَانَتِ الْأَنْصَارُ إِذَا كَانَ لِأَحَدِهِمْ أَيِّمٌ لَمْ يزوجها حتى يعلم هل للنبي صَلَّى اللَّهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ فِيهَا حَاجَةٌ أَمْ لا

    Which literally says:

    "And when any of the Ansar had a single person, they would not marry her off until they knew whether the Prophet SAWS had a need regarding her or not..."

    The Arabic only mentions a variant of the term "marry off" in relation to the Ansar, not the Prophet SAWS. As for the Prophet SAWS, the Arabic only mentions the term "Haajah" or "need." And with regard to the single/unmarried individual, it is "need regarding her".

    I don't know why the author of the linked translation decided to interpret the Prophet's "need" regarding the single individuals of the Ansar as marrying them himself. It is just as likely, according to the literal translation of the Arabic, that the "need" of the Prophet SAWS was related to his custom of pairing up Ansar and Muhajireen, whether it was two men in cooperative brotherhood, or a single man and single woman in marriage.

    This relation of this "need" to the position of the Prophet SAWS as matchmaker in the early community of combined Muhaajireen and Ansar is no more evident than in the text of this Hadith itself where the Prophet SAWS is speaking on behalf of Julaybeeb RA.

    Also, I've yet to come across any reference to this alleged "rule" wherein no females from the Ansar in Madinah were allowed to get married until the Prophet SAWS expressed that he himself didn't want to marry her.

    Unless someone can point to an actual Fiqh reference wherein this was acknowledged as a rule for the first community in Madinah, then the translation has to be very wrong.

    There are other issues with the translation in the link, however that was my main concern.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuNajm View Post
    There are a few issues with this translation, the main one of which is the following:

    "If any of the Ansar had a single female relative, they would not arrange a marriage for her until they found out whether the Prophet wanted to marry her or not.”

    This is how the author translated:

    وَكَانَتِ الْأَنْصَارُ إِذَا كَانَ لِأَحَدِهِمْ أَيِّمٌ لَمْ يزوجها حتى يعلم هل للنبي صَلَّى اللَّهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ فِيهَا حَاجَةٌ أَمْ لا

    Which literally says:

    "And when any of the Ansar had a single person, they would not marry her off until they knew whether the Prophet SAWS had a need regarding her or not..."

    The Arabic only mentions a variant of the term "marry off" in relation to the Ansar, not the Prophet SAWS. As for the Prophet SAWS, the Arabic only mentions the term "Haajah" or "need." And with regard to the single/unmarried individual, it is "need regarding her".

    I don't know why the author of the linked translation decided to interpret the Prophet's "need" regarding the single individuals of the Ansar as marrying them himself. It is just as likely, according to the literal translation of the Arabic, that the "need" of the Prophet SAWS was related to his custom of pairing up Ansar and Muhajireen, whether it was two men in cooperative brotherhood, or a single man and single woman in marriage.

    This relation of this "need" to the position of the Prophet SAWS as matchmaker in the early community of combined Muhaajireen and Ansar is no more evident than in the text of this Hadith itself where the Prophet SAWS is speaking on behalf of Julaybeeb RA.

    Also, I've yet to come across any reference to this alleged "rule" wherein no females from the Ansar in Madinah were allowed to get married until the Prophet SAWS expressed that he himself didn't want to marry her.

    Unless someone can point to an actual Fiqh reference wherein this was acknowledged as a rule for the first community in Madinah, then the translation has to be very wrong.

    There are other issues with the translation in the link, however that was my main concern.
    If you think what you think then you are unaware of the idiom of the Arabic language. That phrase is used according to the idiom to mean to want to marry. I suggest you stop trying to pick at translations especially when they are right.

    Trust me brother, there are very professional translators out there who are better than you. You have a horrible habit of doing what you do, I have seen it on Facebook with other brothers. Finally, please learn the idiomatic use of a language. That is all the advice I have for you.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    If you think what you think then you are unaware of the idiom of the Arabic language.
    I always appreciate when people disagree with me on something and then they automatically default to a stance that necessitates I have some sort of deficiency.

    I would not be a published translator if I was "unaware of the idiom of the Arabic language."

    However I'm certainly not perfect either.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    That phrase is used according to the idiom to mean to want to marry.
    There are two possibilities:

    1) it refers to the Prophet SAWS having the first priority to marry the unmarried women in Madinah; or

    2) it refers to the Prophet SAWS having the discretion to marry off singles in Madinah.

    I have never heard of #1 and the Qareenah of the Hadeeth suggests #2.

    If you are saying that #2 is not possible according to the Arabic language, then it is you who is "unaware of the idiom of the Arabic language."

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    I suggest you stop trying to pick at translations especially when they are right.
    I suggest you mind your own business if you're going to insist on something without backing it up with anything other than conjecture and biased opinion.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    Trust me brother, there are very professional translators out there who are better than you.
    I'm sure there are. I'm also sure you're not one of them.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    You have a horrible habit of doing what you do, I have seen it on Facebook with other brothers.
    People have a horrible habit of posting terrible translations that are clearly NOT RIGHT. Some people appreciate when others point out their mistakes or better ways to translate Arabic to English. Other people just like to cry about things, apparently.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    Finally, please learn the idiomatic use of a language. That is all the advice I have for you.
    Seems like you need to review the difference between advice and admonishment. What you have done is admonish me based on your own opinion without demonstrating any desire whatsoever to correct the issue you see with proof and relevant advice.

    Of course the term "Haajah" is related to marriage in the context provided, however the Qareenah here is that the "need" is related to the Prophet SAWS wanting to marrying the "Ayyimun" to someone else, like in the case of Julaybeeb RA.

    In order to translate the passage as in the link, there must be a Qareenah for the Prophet SAWS himself having to approve every single Khitbah, or marriage proposal. This is a matter of etiquette or a legal ruling that is unknown to me. If it is known to others, then it should be easy to produce a text which indicates this ruling or etiquette.

    There is an instance in another Hadeeth where a woman presented herself to the Prophet SAWS for marriage and he SAWS passed on the offer. Another Companion RA sitting nearby overheard this and said that if the Prophet SAWS had no "need" for her, if he could marry her instead. This was related to etiquette and the chapters of Fiqh related to Khitbah, or marriage proposals, among other Abwaab of Fiqh.

    None of the explanations of this other Hadeeth say that among the Khasa'is of the Prophet SAWS is to have the first priority of marrying any non-married woman in Madinah.

    The translation makes an interpretation that establishes a right specific to the Prophet SAWS that I've never heard of before. That doesn't mean it doesn't exist, however I need to see proof aside from this random translation to establish it as correct.

    If you were sincerely giving "advice" you would show external proof that the translation in the link is a legitimate ruling or matter of etiquette for the early community of Muslims in Madinah.

    Instead you decided to admonish me and avoid giving external proof which demonstrates you have a grudge or ill-will towards me, apparently over some nonsense and crying on Facebook.

    I thought you were a fair brother but apparently you have a vendetta. That makes your "advice" unwelcome. I will take any proof you might have, but I'm not expecting it...

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuNajm View Post

    I would not be a published translator if I was "unaware of the idiom of the Arabic language."
    Is that self published? Or did you get fired? You spend an awful lot of time on random forums as opposed to translating. You had nine days and you couldn't spend one hour - which you claimed - to translate th piece for the OP. Yet, you write a thesis trying to defend yourself now?

    However I'm certainly not perfect either.
    No one is. But I hope this isn't a sympathy call for yeah I know I am kinda wrong here but you know everyone makes mistakes.

    There are two possibilities:

    1) it refers to the Prophet SAWS having the first priority to marry the unmarried women in Madinah; or

    2) it refers to the Prophet SAWS having the discretion to marry off singles in Madinah.

    I have never heard of #1 and the Qareenah of the Hadeeth suggests #2.

    If you are saying that #2 is not possible according to the Arabic language, then it is you who is "unaware of the idiom of the Arabic language."



    I suggest you mind your own business if you're going to insist on something without backing it up with anything other than conjecture and biased opinion.
    I am going to call a spade a spade. You will not find any scholar who understood that phrase like you want to understand it in this hadith here.



    People have a horrible habit of posting terrible translations that are clearly NOT RIGHT. Some people appreciate when others point out their mistakes or better ways to translate Arabic to English. Other people just like to cry about things, apparently.
    People do post terrible translations. When that happens, you call it out. But when the translation is correct and in line with the common usage of the phrase you do not come about confusing those who do not know the language. The phrase here means to want to marry and you will not find a single scholar who understood this hadiith differently.

    Go on find us one who claims what you claim for this hadith.

    If not, then the only one crying right now is you with a thesis long reply which no substance but just whines.

    Seems like you need to review the difference between advice and admonishment. What you have done is admonish me based on your own opinion without demonstrating any desire whatsoever to correct the issue you see with proof and relevant advice.
    I was not advising you. I was admonsighing you for your blunder here. The translator is right and you are wrong. Now, if you will, I have better things to do than waste my time.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    Is that self published?
    Nope. I'm published by a Muslim government and well-known sites for Islamic texts among others.

    It's clear you don't know me, though you pretend as if you do.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    Or did you get fired?
    Now you're just gossiping. I was never fired from any position.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    You spend an awful lot of time on random forums as opposed to translating. You had nine days and you couldn't spend one hour - which you claimed - to translate th piece for the OP. Yet, you write a thesis trying to defend yourself now?
    What "forums" are those? This is the only forum I'm active on. As for translating, let's see what you've translated and had published.

    This would only be about the link you gave except you keep making things personal because you lack honor.

    Now that you mention how I spend my time and lies about my personal life that give a negative impression, it appears you are jealous.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    I am going to call a spade a spade. You will not find any scholar who understood that phrase like you want to understand it in this hadith here.
    The burden in on the person who claims that the translation is correct. Show me an explanation of the Hadith where the interpretation given is mentioned by the scholars.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    People do post terrible translations. When that happens, you call it out. But when the translation is correct and in line with the common usage of the phrase you do not come about confusing those who do not know the language. The phrase here means to want to marry and you will not find a single scholar who understood this hadiith differently.
    The person who translated the Arabic said that "Haajah feehaa" means "marry her", which is not correct at all. Again, if there is a Qareenah which specifies that the "need for her" is to "marry her", then by all means, stop wasting my time and point it out. Rather the Qareenah in the narrative of the Hadith clearly suggests that the "need" is for matching the unmarried woman with a Companion.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    Go on find us one who claims what you claim for this hadith.

    If not, then the only one crying right now is you with a thesis long reply which no substance but just whines.
    Again, the burden in on the claimant not the questioner. This is principles of Islamic debate 101.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    I was not advising you. I was admonsighing you for your blunder here. The translator is right and you are wrong. Now, if you will, I have better things to do than waste my time.
    That's what I thought. You lied about claiming to "advise" me.

    In order to "admonish", you'd have to be in a position to do so. What is your expertise and experience in the Arabic language? Where are your works of translation?

    Indeed you are wasting your time, and more. You are earning sins through gossip, slander and avoiding the point.

    You brought a bad translation and I criticized it with proof. Now you can't back it up except to attack me personally.

    Please don't bother responding without proof for this translation by way of scholarly explanations of this very Hadith showing that the Prophet SAWS had a unique right to have the first priority in marrying any unmarried women in Madinah.

    Again, my understanding and the actual translation of the text gives the Prophet SAWS priority in terms of having the option to marry off the unmarried women to Companions and the other understanding is that the Ansar all preferred that their unmarried female relatives marry the Prophet SAWS, so they made it a habit to check with him SAWS first.

    Neither of those is conveyed by the translation in the link and they are both more likely interpretations than the one mentioned.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuNajm View Post
    Nope. I'm published by a Muslim government and well-known sites for Islamic texts among others.

    It's clear you don't know me, though you pretend as if you do.
    Abu Najm bin al-Iskandar you have been published on Sunnah.com and Kalaamullaah. Both websites pirate material and put them up.

    Is this your credential. Or is that not you? If it isn't, Ill offer you a public apology right now.



    Now you're just gossiping. I was never fired from any position.
    You seem not to understand written language to well. I asked you a question as it baffles me to see you spend so much time on forums [do you deny you were on IA forum and MultaQa]

    What "forums" are those? This is the only forum I'm active on. As for translating, let's see what you've translated and had published.
    Were you on those forums or not?

    This would only be about the link you gave except you keep making things personal because you lack honor.
    Spare me the whines. There is nothing personal when it comes to the truth. You sit on your computer and put down translators who actually have published works, read by thousands, and then cannot take criticism. Are you really this arrogant and deluded by your "excellence?"


    Now that you mention how I spend my time and lies about my personal life that give a negative impression, it appears you are jealous.
    I have lied about your personal life? Go on tell me that person above on Facebook is not you, and you have not published your Introduction to Sahih Muslim on websites which support pirated material.

    If not I will offer you a public apology here right now.

    The burden in on the person who claims that the translation is correct. Show me an explanation of the Hadith where the interpretation given is mentioned by the scholars.
    Again, the burden in on the claimant not the questioner. This is principles of Islamic debate 101.
    No, the burden of proof lies on a person who takes the phrase understood by the customs of the language in a certain way and then claims it is not such.

    You know as well as I do that no scholar understood the hadith as you want the audience to understand it since you have confused an obligation with an act the anSaar did out of love. Confused. Confused. Confused.

    The person who translated the Arabic said that "Haajah feehaa" means "marry her", which is not correct at all.
    It is correct. You see what I mean when I say you do not understand. Read and you will know that the phrase

    كان له فيها حاجة

    Is used when a man has an interest in a woman. And you have already pointed out one hadith where it was justed. That is why it took you so long to reply the first time around. You go on your computer, searched Google and Sunnah to see if was used like that. Didn't you.

    يَا رَسُولَ اللَّهِ جِئْتُ أَهَبُ لَكَ نَفْسِي ‏.‏ فَنَظَرَ إِلَيْهَا رَسُولُ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم فَصَعَّدَ النَّظَرَ فِيهَا وَصَوَّبَهُ ثُمَّ طَأْطَأَ رَسُولُ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم رَأْسَهُ فَلَمَّا رَأَتِ الْمَرْأَةُ أَنَّهُ لَمْ يَقْضِ فِيهَا شَيْئًا جَلَسَتْ فَقَامَ رَجُلٌ مِنْ أَصْحَابِهِ فَقَالَ يَا رَسُولَ اللَّهِ إِنْ لَمْ يَكُنْ لَكَ بِهَا حَاجَةٌ فَزَوِّجْنِيهَا

    Again, if there is a Qareenah which specifies that the "need for her" is to "marry her", then by all means, stop wasting my time and point it out. Rather the Qareenah in the narrative of the Hadith clearly suggests that the "need" is for matching the unmarried woman with a Companion.

    No, there is not any Qareenah which suggest that. Rather, when you read the whole hadith [something called reading in context which you seem not to do as it even shows here where you chop a writers sentences and answer to them not knowing that a whole piece conveys a compete thought and not the individual sentences] you know that the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) [and please type out sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam and not use short hand SAW] said:


    إني لست أريدها لنفسي



    And if you had any clue how the word khataba is used, and how the wife responded which was as follows:

    فقالت: نعم. ونعمة عيني

    To which the husband responded

    إنه ليس يخطبها لنفسه إنما يخطبها لجليبيب


    The fact that the wife understood it to mean he (sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) was asking her for himself (sallaallaahu alayhi wa sallam) shows that this was the presumption they had because of the fact that the anSaar waited to see if the Prophet (sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) might want to marry.

    What more of an honor would it be to have your daughter married to best of creation?

    Second, when the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) came and said:

    زوجني ابنتك


    The father would not have understood that to mean what he thought to which the reply was

    إني لست أريدها لنفسي


    Had they believed what you claim it to be, the thought would not have crossed their mind and the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) would not have to say that I do not want [her] for myself.

    It is called reading in context. You need to learn that it seems.


    So, there isn't a Qareenah but Qaraa'in which oppose what you conjecture.

    As a person going against the customary usage of the phrase and the fact that the context of the text which follows clearly shows that the phrase was used in its customary usage, you have to provide the evidence for your convoluted understanding which is merely a conjecture.

    So, bring a scholar who understood it like you did. In the meantime read this.



    Indeed you are wasting your time, and more. You are earning sins through gossip, slander and avoiding the point.
    Now you demonstrate that you do not know what those words mean in English either.

    You brought a bad translation and I criticized it with proof. Now you can't back it up except to attack me personally.
    The translation is correct. What you have a problem with is thinking you are a Arabic grand master. The fact is that you are not. The translator is right. And you are wrong. Those with sound knowledge of the language will tell you.

    You clearly do not understand Arabic if you think the translation is wrong. Given your weird interpretation I do not think you got beyond the first line hence your troubles.

    Please don't bother responding without proof for this translation by way of scholarly explanations of this very Hadith showing that the Prophet SAWS had a unique right to have the first priority in marrying any unmarried women in Madinah.
    Another cry for please do not criticize me it hurts me but I can criticize anyone I like. You really need to get a grip on your attitude.

    Again, my understanding and the actual translation of the text gives the Prophet SAWS priority in terms of having the option to marry off the unmarried women to Companions and the other understanding is that the Ansar all preferred that their unmarried female relatives marry the Prophet SAWS, so they made it a habit to check with him SAWS first.
    This shows why you want to re-interpret the text. First, you think it was an obligation that they had to wait. No, it was out of their love. Second, you find that to be against a "higher moral value" you have created in your mind. Hence, your need to give it a spin to save yourself from feeling uneasy.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez
    This shows why you want to re-interpret the text. First, you think it was an obligation that they had to wait. No, it was out of their love. Second, you find that to be against a "higher moral value" you have created in your mind. Hence, your need to give it a spin to save yourself from feeling uneasy.
    The translation from the link:

    "If any of the Ansar had a single female relative, they would not arrange a marriage for her until they found out whether the Prophet wanted to marry her or not.”

    If the Ansar checked with the Prophet SAWS first "out of love", then the above translation does not convey that.

    I'm not trying to re-interpret anything. I'm simply looking for a better way to translate the Arabic.

    The rest of your post is more presumptions, conjecture, gossip and slander on your part.

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    Odan ZeeshanParvez's Avatar
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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuNajm View Post
    The translation from the link:

    "If any of the Ansar had a single female relative, they would not arrange a marriage for her until they found out whether the Prophet wanted to marry her or not.”

    If the Ansar checked with the Prophet SAWS first "out of love", then the above translation does not convey that.

    I'm not trying to re-interpret anything. I'm simply looking for a better way to translate the Arabic.

    The rest of your post is more presumptions, conjecture, gossip and slander on your part.
    That is the correct translation. Yours is wrong.

    Muhammad Saed Abdul-Rahman is a translator of many books which have truly been published.

    Any man with any sense on this thread will take his over yours any day. Not to mention that what you are trying to re-interpret shows how lacking in knowledge of the Arabic langauge you are.

    People would say that about you all over the forum. I never believed them.

    Now, I do.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    That is the correct translation. Yours is wrong.

    Muhammad Saed Abdul-Rahman is a translator of many books which have truly been published.

    Any man with any sense on this thread will take his over yours any day. Not to mention that what you are trying to re-interpret shows how lacking in knowledge of the Arabic langauge you are.

    People would say that about you all over the forum. I never believed them.

    Now, I do.
    My translation is 100% accurate.

    You're a sad individual. I'm still waiting for you to share links to your translation works that makes you such an expert.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuNajm View Post
    My translation is 100% accurate.
    I suggest you learn. Have a nice day. Since I am on your ignore list you won't get to see this. I wonder if curiosity will get the better of you!

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    Odan talibilm09's Avatar
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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    All

    I can't judge anything here # 29 since its out of my knowledge (cosm I do not know Aarabic )


    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    Spare me the whines. There is nothing personal when it comes to the truth. You sit on your computer and put down translators who actually have published works, read by thousands, and then cannot take criticism. Are you really this arrogant and deluded by your "excellence?"
    But I Can judge here ''as the truth ;; Since Zeeshan is what he claims .

    Bro Zeeshan , whats that slogan in your signature ? since i can't see now when I am logged on, it said something like
    '' You are not my friend ........'' I love that

    Haq is Haq , even if it goes against Zial ul haq, My slogan yeah, lol n :smile;

    May Allah gives us control on our Nafs ego , and save from being one of the arrogant , since its the way and destination of AZazeel, the cursed One.
    Last edited by talibilm09; 13-10-17 at 02:35 PM.
    My sect - No Sect

    My Aqeedah - http://legacy.quran.com/112 ( The Aqeedah of Sahabas)

    Just a Muslim

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    "رَوْحٌ وَ رَيْحَان" Tayoofa's Avatar
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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Btw أيِّم is the widow not unmarried woman and هَلْ لِلنَّبِيِّ صَلَّى اللهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ فِيهَا حَاجَةٌ أَمْ لَا means whether the Prophet wanted to marry her or not.” thats the correct translation in my opinion because the need or حاجة is related to the prophet peace be upon him ..
    Ibn Al Qayyim may Allah have mercy on him said: ("
    The heart on its journey towards Allah the Exalted is like that of a bird. Love is its head, and fear and hope are its two wings. When the head is healthy, then the two wings will fly well. When the head is cut off, the bird will die. When either of two wings is damaged, the bird becomes vulnerable to every hunter and predator..”
    )

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    An entry from the Kuwaiti Encyclopedia of fiQh which puts the issue at hand to rest.

    وقال الإمام أبو يوسف - من الحنفية -: لا دلالة في الآية الكريمة على أن اللاتي لم يهاجرن كن محرمات على الرسول عليه الصلاة والسلام؛ لأن تخصيص الشيء بالذكر لا ينفي ما عداه

    Imaam Abu Yusuf - from among the Hanafi school of thought - said: There is no evidence in the Noble Verse that the ones [i.e. women] who did not make Hijrah were impermissible for the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) because takhSiiS of something by making mention of it does not negate that which is other than it.


    ويجوز للرسول صلى الله عليه وسلم أن يتزوج من نساء الأنصار، قد تزوج عليه الصلاة والسلام من غير المهاجرات صفية وجويرية

    It was permissible for the Prophet (sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) that he marry women from among the 'Ansaar. He married صفية and جويرية who were not from the muhaajiraat



    وفي مسند الإمام أحمد عن أبي برزة رضي الله عنه قال: كانت الأنصار إذا كان لأحدهم أيم - لم يزوجها حتى يعلم هل للنبي صلى الله عليه وسلم فيها حاجة أم لا

    And it is present in Musnad Ahmad that Imaam Ahmad reported from أبي برزة that when the 'Ansaar had an أيم they would not marry her until they knew if the Prophet (sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) had any "need" in her or not


    فلولا علمهم بأنه يحل له التزوج من نساء الأنصار لما كان هناك داع للتربص والانتظار

    Had they not known that it was permissible for him (sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) to marry women from the Ansaar, there would have been no need here for waiting.


    There is your fiQh reference @AbuNajm.

    As I said. You were wrong. And you were arrogant.

    After the nonsense you said to me in the PM you sent me, the only one who needs to fear humiliation in public or a torment is not me but you. Praise to Allah you left my FB list.

    Pray to Allaah I don't pray against you for your comments in that PM.



    Volume 6 Page 266
    Last edited by ZeeshanParvez; 17-10-17 at 01:50 AM. Reason: spelling mistake

  37. #37
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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeeshanParvez View Post
    An entry from the Kuwaiti Encyclopedia of fiQh which puts the issue at hand to rest.

    فلولا علمهم بأنه يحل له التزوج من نساء الأنصار لما كان هناك داع للتربص والانتظار

    Had they not known that it was permissible for him (sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) to marry women from the Ansaar, there would have been no need here for waiting.


    There is your fiQh reference @AbuNajm.
    You are just digging a deeper hole for yourself.

    This makes it clear that you are driven in this discussion by more than just an obsessive need to be right but by a personal vendetta that has caused you to stoop low enough to lie about another Muslim publicly and then make personal attacks based on those lies.

    I never denied that "Haajah" could include marriage.

    My criticism of the translation in the link you provided is that it restricts and narrows the translation of the term "Haajah" to marriage when this is not the actual meaning of the word nor its full implication in Arabic.

    The only proof that I need is the remainder of the Hadith itself in which the Prophet SAWS speaks for Julaybeeb RA in asking for a woman's hand in marriage.

    In this Hadith, the term "Haajah" is also clearly connected with whether the Prophet SAWS himself had someone in mind for marriage to an eligible woman.

    Readers of this discussion have 2 options:

    1) A translation that is highly interpretive and restrictive to only one possible meaning for the term "Haajah" that opposes the text of the Hadith;

    or

    2) A translation which remains literal and open to any possible meanings for the term "Haajah" including the meaning indicated by the Hadith, i.e. marrying off an eligible woman to a person of the Prophet's SAWS choosing.

    I can't speak for the translator of the link you provided to Tafsir Ibn Kathir, so I can't discount the possibility that he would be open to altering his translation based on a discussion.

    You, on the other hand, are more obsessed with being right and tarnishing my credibility on this forum based on false personal information about me than actually engaging in a discussion.

    It seems you can't even see clearly enough to acknowledge my position in the discussion, much less adequately respond to it.

    There's no need to further embarrass yourself by pressing the issue. You clearly don't understand my position.

    However, feel free to continue to personally attack me as I can think of no better way for you to lower your own position.

    To be clear, my position is this:

    The translation of the term "Haajah" in the Hadith of Abu Barzah should be left as "need" and not "marriage" since the Prophet SAWS clearly took the news of eligible Ansari women and matched them up with eligible males. The Prophet SAWS did not just decide whether the "wanted to marry them or not" and that was that.

    I do not deny that the Ansar who brought news to the Prophet SAWS of an eligible woman also privately hoped that he SAWS might consider taking the eligible women as wives. However there is no proof, NOT A SINGLE SHRED OF EVIDENCE, that this hope was the only motivation in doing so nor was it the only intention the Prophet SAWS had in allowing the custom.

    That is a ridiculous proposition and contrary to the text of the Hadith itself. Yet that is the crux of your argument and basis for your attacks against me, at least in this discussion.

    Only a person Hell-bent on an alternative agenda could be so blind to the facts.

  38. #38
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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by Tayoofa View Post
    Btw أيِّم is the widow not unmarried woman and هَلْ لِلنَّبِيِّ صَلَّى اللهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ فِيهَا حَاجَةٌ أَمْ لَا means whether the Prophet wanted to marry her or not.” thats the correct translation in my opinion because the need or حاجة is related to the prophet peace be upon him ..
    It also means "widow", but that is not the only definition.

    From Ibn Qutaybah's Ghareeb al-Hadeeth:

    لأيم: الْمَرْأَة لَا زوج لَهَا بكرا كَانَت أَو ثَيِّبًا. وَكَذَلِكَ الرجل إِذا لم تكن لَهُ امْرَأَة فَهُوَ أيم

    "Al-Ayyim: the woman who has no husband, whether she is a virgin or not. And likewise the man who has no wife, thus he is "Ayyim"."

    From 2/46.

    It is strange that you would be so restrictive regarding the definition of the term "Ayyim", yet expansive in your reading of the term "Haajah".

    The debate is not whether the term "Haajah" is related to the Prophet SAWS, as that is clearly the case grammatically.

    The question is about "how" it relates to the Prophet SAWS.

    There is no Arab linguist who provides a general meaning of "marriage" for the term "Haajah". The term "Haajah" is an extremely generalized term whose meaning is always going to be subject to the specific context in which it is found.

    In the case of the Hadith of Abu Barzah, the Prophet SAWS approached an Ansari man who had informed the Prophet SAWS of his daughter's availability for marriage and asked for her hand on behalf of Julaybeeb RA. In this specific case, the "Haajah" of the Prophet SAWS was to match of the Ansari's daughter with Julaybeeb RA. The "Haajah" in this case is demonstrably NOT for the Prophet SAWS himself to marry the Ansari's daughter.

    This being the case, it is not possible to restrict the meaning of the term "Haajah" to "marriage", but rather to leave it in its widely-applied and understood meaning of a general "need".
    Last edited by AbuNajm; 17-10-17 at 03:23 AM.

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    Odan ZeeshanParvez's Avatar
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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuNajm View Post

    There is no Arab linguist who provides a general meaning of "marriage" for the term "Haajah". The term "Haajah" is an extremely generalized term whose meaning is always going to be subject to the specific context in which it is found.

    In the case of the Hadith of Abu Barzah, the Prophet SAWS approached an Ansari man who had informed the Prophet SAWS of his daughter's availability for marriage and asked for her hand on behalf of Julaybeeb RA. In this specific case, the "Haajah" of the Prophet SAWS was to match of the Ansari's daughter with Julaybeeb RA. The "Haajah" in this case is demonstrably NOT for the Prophet SAWS himself to marry the Ansari's daughter.

    This being the case, it is not possible to restrict the meaning of the term "Haajah" to "marriage", but rather to leave it in its widely-applied and understood meaning of a general "need".
    You are blinded by your lack of knowledge of the language and arrogance.

    The Kuwaiti Encyclopedia clearly shows how that is understood. You, on the other hand, do not have a single reference to how you understand it.

    Anyone who reads this thread will know that you are ignorant.

    Nothing more needs to be said about you.

    And I think those on this forum who ignore most of what you write already acknowledge the fact that you lack substance.

    As for your claims of someone having a vendetta against you and being jealous of you, let me remind you.

    You are not a big deal. One only has a vendetta against someone or is jealous if he knows that the person is of value.

    For you to even think that someone would be jealous of you or have a vendetta shows how you are drowned in your arrogance.

    And we know that when you said "I have actually put the Prophet (sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) at a higher position" the true reasons why you need re-interpret the text with your misguided understanding were made apparent.

    Your "understanding" is wrong both in context of the hadith, how translators have translated it, and according to writers of the Kuwaiti Encyclopedia understood it.

    Enjoy your solitude.

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    Re: I need a reference from Musnad Ahmad of this Hadeeth

    And on a closing note, what is even more hilarious is that your misguided understanding of the text cannot even be termed a "need" in Arabic.

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuNajm View Post
    The translation of the term "Haajah" in the Hadith of Abu Barzah should be left as "need" and not "marriage" since the Prophet SAWS clearly took the news of eligible Ansari women and matched them up with eligible males. The Prophet SAWS did not just decide whether the "wanted to marry them or not" and that was that.
    You can't tell the difference between a need and a wish.

    You have to be the first person on the planet to think man who has a Haaja in a woman in means he wants to marry her off to someone else. Oh dear!


    I do not deny that the Ansar who brought news to the Prophet SAWS of an eligible woman also privately hoped that he SAWS might consider taking the eligible women as wives. However there is no proof, NOT A SINGLE SHRED OF EVIDENCE, that this hope was the only motivation in doing so nor was it the only intention the Prophet SAWS had in allowing the custom.
    The jurists understood it like it is. And not like you are capitalizing it as you know you are in a predicament.

    I guess you will never be a jurist. Or even understand Arabic at the rate you are going.

    Go on Abu Najm. Make good of your promise. Stop taking peek looks at my posts and put me on block!
    Last edited by ZeeshanParvez; 17-10-17 at 08:00 AM.

 

 

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