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    Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    1 ~ The Comforter would come in the life time of Jesus' disciples.. in fact before they depart Jerusalem see Acts 1:4-5, John 16:7 ........ Mohammed was born long after the Comforter must have come, i.e. 500+ years later.

    2 ~ The Comforter is not a physical being and can't be seen ordinarily see John 14:17 ....... Mohammed was a physical being and ordinarily visible.

    3 ~ The Comforter would come from Heaven directly from God see John 15:26..... Mohammed with all due respect, was ordinarily born in this World to parents; grew up ordinarily, became an employed trader etc before he eventually became the Prophet of Islam.

    4 ~ The Comforter, according to Jesus himself, was the Holy Spirit which his disciples Knew because he (the Spirit) was with them and was going to dwell in their mind see John 14:17......... Mohammed never lived with Jesus' disciples and he was a physical being who did not dwell in the mind.

    5 ~ The Comforter would be with Jesus' disciples and, of course the subsequent faithful for ever see John 14:16 .........Mohammed died long ago and has a tomb.

    6 ~ As Jesus promised, the Comforter came to the disciples before they departed Jerusalem see Acts 2:3-4...... Like I said earlier, Mohammed came a distant 6 generations later, and is there any evidence that Mohammed was in Jerusalem at Pentecost?

    7 ~ Jesus said the Comforter would bring to their remembrance His teachings. In preparation for their mission to take the Gospel of Jesus to all peoples.... Mohammed never heard Jesus teach so would have been unable to assist the disciples in this way. Besides Mohammed brought a message that was diametrically opposed to the mission of Jesus.

    So in conclusion.. The Comforter Jesus promised is the Holy Spirit.. Whom proceeded from God and was sent by Jesus..

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by talibilm09 View Post
    Bumped , Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was THE LONG AWAITED COMFORTER prophesied in the NT, IF it was not Prophet Muhammad , who was that Comforter who has not popped out for the last 2015 years ? is the question Now ?
    You're deluded if you think the comforter is Muhammed. Never mind the rest of John 14 verses 16 - 17 pretty much clinch it.

    Firstly, verse 16 - Jesus prayed to the father, this in itself must be a problem for you seeing as you maintain God is father to no one, even metaphorically speaking. Another Comforter (like Jesus?) Jesus preformed the role of the first Comforter. He will abide with you forever. Jesus was speaking to His disciples here, not only would God send the comforter in Jesus' name the comforter would stay with them forever. Muhammed died a death so is not with anyone forever, and this death occurred centuries after the disciples had all died. Yet the comforter must have been with them as Jesus promised it would be because the Comforter brought to them remembrance of everything Jesus had taught, which was well known in the world long before Muhammed was born.

    Secondly, verse 17 - the Spirit of truth, the world can't receive because it cannot see Him or know Him. Muhammed was man people both saw and knew him. However, the disciples would know the Comforter because it will be with them so close as to be dwelling in them. Not sure how you twist this to fit Muhammed, he never knew the disciples let alone dwelt inside of them.

    Give it up dude, it doesn't work for Muhammed. If you're looking for Muhammed mentioned in scripture you need to look in the Qur'an. I think you know that already.

    John 14 16:17

    16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

    17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

    BTW, the Comforter arrived soon after Christ's accession and remained with believers ever since. You just don't know it.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by Arbed View Post
    1 ~ The Comforter would come in the life time of Jesus' disciples.. in fact before they depart Jerusalem see Acts 1:4-5, John 16:7 ........ Mohammed was born long after the Comforter must have come, i.e. 500+ years later.

    2 ~ The Comforter is not a physical being and can't be seen ordinarily see John 14:17 ....... Mohammed was a physical being and ordinarily visible.

    3 ~ The Comforter would come from Heaven directly from God see John 15:26..... Mohammed with all due respect, was ordinarily born in this World to parents; grew up ordinarily, became an employed trader etc before he eventually became the Prophet of Islam.

    4 ~ The Comforter, according to Jesus himself, was the Holy Spirit which his disciples Knew because he (the Spirit) was with them and was going to dwell in their mind see John 14:17......... Mohammed never lived with Jesus' disciples and he was a physical being who did not dwell in the mind.

    5 ~ The Comforter would be with Jesus' disciples and, of course the subsequent faithful for ever see John 14:16 .........Mohammed died long ago and has a tomb.

    6 ~ As Jesus promised, the Comforter came to the disciples before they departed Jerusalem see Acts 2:3-4...... Like I said earlier, Mohammed came a distant 6 generations later, and is there any evidence that Mohammed was in Jerusalem at Pentecost?

    7 ~ Jesus said the Comforter would bring to their remembrance His teachings. In preparation for their mission to take the Gospel of Jesus to all peoples.... Mohammed never heard Jesus teach so would have been unable to assist the disciples in this way. Besides Mohammed brought a message that was diametrically opposed to the mission of Jesus.

    So in conclusion.. The Comforter Jesus promised is the Holy Spirit.. Whom proceeded from God and was sent by Jesus..
    Looks like it was already answered. Why did you "bump" the thread? Lol

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    You're deluded if you think the comforter is Muhammed. Never mind the rest of John 14 verses 16 - 17 pretty much clinch it.

    Hi Pip 1 Thanks for giving it up on John 14 :16-17 https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...18&version=CJB

    15 “If you love me, you will keep my commands; 16 and I will ask the Father, and he will give you ''ANOTHER comforting Counselor LIKE ME, '' ''the Spirit of Truth '', to be with you forever. 17 The world cannot receive him, because it neither sees nor knows him. You know him, because he is staying with you and will be united with you. 18 I will not leave you orphans — I am coming to you.''

    But let me affirm some more Many truths which is EXPLICITLY PROVED from the above verse which you say its on Muslims side

    1) ''Another Comforter'' '' LIKE ME'' While Jesus said that he was alive and good ( not crucified nor resurrected) at the last supper in a Human Form so JESUS DID NOT mean ' A Spirit , a Ghost '' like me '' but a '' Human like me ''

    So conclusion is all those words of '' SPIRIT '' which are found in all chapters of John (except verse John14:26( a contradiction, usual style of NT) were spoken Not to refer the Holy Ghost but the spirit (the trait) of truth which means who spoke TRUTH (like we call some A MAN OF WEALTH means a Rich person and such Spirit in figurative speech are many in NT like Spirit of Evil, Spirit of Slavery etc) So it does not mean a holy ghost , a cock eyed view, but is a Prophesy about a future, ONLY Truth speaking Person. because it says '' ANOTHER'' ' LIKE ME '' . Another means who was not PRESENT THERE < THEN but we all know as per your beliefs the holy ghost was always there with Jesus and disciples.


    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    Firstly, verse 16 - Jesus prayed to the father, this in itself must be a problem for you seeing as you maintain God is father to no one,
    I am sorry you loose again on your STRONGEST POINT that Jesus spoke to his Father which the Muslims will Never accept. Let me kindly remind you Jesus was a Jew and he himself said that '' he came to fullfill the Mosaic Law '' The Jews used the term Father TO REFER to God in a figurative way like using the term '' Son '' Israel is the son of god. David is the son of God etc. See a jewish proof since you will not believe me

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_the_Father

    God the Father
    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    God the Father is a title given to God in various religions. In Judaism, God is described as "Father" as he is seen as the absolute one, indivisible and incomparable, transcendent, immanent, and non-corporeal God of creation and history.[1][2][3][4] The God in Judaism is the giver of the shabbath and the torahs—written, oral, mystical—to his chosen people.[5] However, in Judaism the use of the "Father" title is generally a metaphor and is one of many titles by which Jews speak of and to God.[6]

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    Another Comforter (like Jesus?) Jesus preformed the role of the first Comforter. He will abide with you forever. Jesus was speaking to His disciples here, not only would God send the comforter in Jesus' name the comforter would stay with them forever. Muhammed died a death so is not with anyone forever, and this death occurred centuries after the disciples had all died. Yet the comforter must have been with them as Jesus promised it would be
    Yes this comforter is the one who will stay for ever , what is the doubt in it ? is there any Comforter after Muhammad (pbuh) , while Jesus (pbuh) being the earlier Comforter . You prove my Stance More by your assertion '' forever'' which means till the last days of this world and this is true there is no major semetic Religion after Islam and the comforter , Muhammad (pbuh) is living with us for ever in his sunnah and teachings and undistorted PRESERVED NOBLE QURAN . So this another Comforter is living for ever in those three ways.

    How many Jesus you see among the Christians, even the Pope does not appear like Jesus with a beard. But you can see millions Muhammad (pbuh) the last comforter in his sunnah , as we see they say Elvis Lives, Michel Jackson Lives BUT '' in their fans''

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    because the Comforter brought to them remembrance of everything Jesus had taught, which was well known in the world long before Muhammed was born.
    Ands Its ONLY MUHAMMAD who brought to the rememberance of everything which Jesus taught but forgotten by his followers like saying Sholamalikum (asalamalikum of Aramaic) Avoid swine, Avoid Wine, Usury, bared idol worship, women rights, etc etc
    Last edited by talibilm09; 15-09-15 at 01:40 AM.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by talibilm09 View Post
    Hi Pip 1 Thanks for giving it up on John 14 :16-17 https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...18&version=CJB

    15 “If you love me, you will keep my commands; 16 and I will ask the Father, and he will give you ''ANOTHER comforting Counselor LIKE ME, '' ''the Spirit of Truth '', to be with you forever. 17 The world cannot receive him, because it neither sees nor knows him. You know him, because he is staying with you and will be united with you. 18 I will not leave you orphans — I am coming to you.''

    But let me affirm some more Many truths which is EXPLICITLY PROVED from the above verse which you say its on Muslims side

    1) ''Another Comforter'' '' LIKE ME'' While Jesus said that he was alive and good ( not crucified nor resurrected) at the last supper in a Human Form so JESUS DID NOT mean ' A Spirit , a Ghost '' like me '' but a '' Human like me ''
    Your assumption. There is no benefit in another prophet, a human, with another message. It can only logically mean the same in Spirit. The Spirit proceeds from God the father. Muhammed was not a Spirit whom proceeded from God. He was like all men born the normal way the offspring of his parents. Jesus said He would not leave His disciples orphans -- I am coming to you. Why would Jesus say that if He never meant it? You forget Jesus here is talking to His disciples, it's not a prophecy to come to fruition 600 years later. It is a message for that time, Jesus is talking of His death and subsequent resurrection and what would happen to the Disciples after that. Namely the coming of the Spirit at Pentecost. Jesus saying "I am coming to you" spiritually Jesus and the comforter are one. It can only be the Holy Spirit.

    So conclusion is all those words of '' SPIRIT '' which are found in all chapters of John (except verse John14:26( a contradiction, usual style of NT) were spoken Not to refer the Holy Ghost but the spirit (the trait) of truth which means who spoke TRUTH (like we call some A MAN OF WEALTH means a Rich person and such Spirit in figurative speech are many in NT like Spirit of Evil, Spirit of Slavery etc) So it does not mean a holy ghost , a cock eyed view, but is a Prophesy about a future, ONLY Truth speaking Person. because it says '' ANOTHER'' ' LIKE ME '' . Another means who was not PRESENT THERE < THEN but we all know as per your beliefs the holy ghost was always there with Jesus and disciples.
    Sorry, but you can't pick and choose bits of the Bible you like and dismiss the bits that don't suit your agenda. Bible scripture is clear on the identity of the Holy Spirit. Jesus said He had to go in order for the Spirit to come to them. The comforter will be sent in Jesus' name. The comforter will remind the disciples of all Jesus had said to them. The Comforter will testify about Jesus. The comforter will convict the world of guilt regarding sin. The Comforter will bring glory to Jesus. If you are a truly honest person as God is your witness you must surely see that Muhammed doesn't meet this criteria so cannot be the comforter. You can only say then that the bits of the Bible that don't work for you must have been change by some unknown person for reasons unknown. If it was believed at the time the comforter was the Holy Spirit with no knowledge of any prophet to come a long 600 years in the future, then there was no motive to change anything. The only logical conclusion in the absence of any proof to the contrary is the Bible accounts are truth.

    John 14:15-17

    "All this I have spoken while still with you. But the Comforter, the Holy Spirit whom The Father will send in my name and will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you." John 14:25, 26

    "When the Comforter comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who goes out from the Father, he will testify about Me."

    John 15:26

    "But I tell you the truth: It is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Comforter will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. When he comes he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment...."

    John 16:7, 8

    "But when he, the Spirit of Truth comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own, he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. He will bring glory to Me by taking from what is Mine and making it known to you. All that belongs to the Father is Mine. That is why I said the Spirit will take from what is Mine and make it known to you."


    I am sorry you loose again on your STRONGEST POINT that Jesus spoke to his Father which the Muslims will Never accept. Let me kindly remind you Jesus was a Jew and he himself said that '' he came to fullfill the Mosaic Law '' The Jews used the term Father TO REFER to God in a figurative way like using the term '' Son '' Israel is the son of god. David is the son of God etc. See a jewish proof since you will not believe me

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_the_Father

    God the Father
    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    God the Father is a title given to God in various religions. In Judaism, God is described as "Father" as he is seen as the absolute one, indivisible and incomparable, transcendent, immanent, and non-corporeal God of creation and history.[1][2][3][4] The God in Judaism is the giver of the shabbath and the torahs—written, oral, mystical—to his chosen people.[5] However, in Judaism the use of the "Father" title is generally a metaphor and is one of many titles by which Jews speak of and to God.[6]
    Didn't know we were in competition here so what's with the "I lose again" about? There IS ONLY the figurative way to refer to God as father. God is NOT a father in physical terms. So don't know what you're talking about here but the point you may be implying (if there is one) is void.

    Yes this comforter is the one who will stay for ever , what is the doubt in it ? is there any Comforter after Muhammad (pbuh) , while Jesus (pbuh) being the earlier Comforter . You prove my Stance More by your assertion '' forever'' which means till the last days of this world and this is true there is no major semetic Religion after Islam and the comforter , Muhammad (pbuh) is living with us for ever in his sunnah and teachings and undistorted PRESERVED NOBLE QURAN . So this another Comforter is living for ever in those three ways.
    Big doubt for me. Jesus never left and lives on in the heart of all believers in Spirit. If you believe Muhammed to be your comforter then fair enough, but don't go claiming it's the same comforter mentioned in John. It just doesn't work.
    May I ask a question at this point? Why are you so adamant that the comforter Jesus sent to the disciples has to be Muhammed? Why aren't you content with how Muhammed is found in the Qur'an? Why do you need to find reference to Muhammed in the Bible? Especially since you guys are always saying how corrupt and unreliable it is.

    How many Jesus you see among the Christians, even the Pope does not appear like Jesus with a beard. But you can see millions Muhammad (pbuh) the last comforter in his sunnah , as we see they say Elvis Lives, Michel Jackson Lives BUT '' in their fans''
    Are you serious with this statement? There is only One Jesus, emulating Jesus in superficial ways like appearance has no meaning whatsoever ever. We follow the message not the messenger. Jesus never said "dress like me, grow a beard like me" etc. He never attached importance on His person his humility would not have made such demands.

    [QUOTE\Ands Its ONLY MUHAMMAD who brought to the rememberance of everything which Jesus taught but forgotten by his followers like saying Sholamalikum (asalamalikum of Aramaic) Avoid swine, Avoid Wine, Usury, bared idol worship, women rights, etc etc[/QUOTE]

    Are you now saying in order to follow Jesus we all need to speak Aramaic, or Hebrew or greek? That was never a teaching. Jesus actually taught the way to makes oneself right before God, the way to restore us to the state of righteousness that is lost to us through sin. Jesus fulfilled the law because the Law has no power for salvation. The only way to Salvation is by Gods grace .

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Apparently, Christians and Jews were awaiting a new prophet in the 6th century CE: http://www.islamreligion.com/article...hammad-part-1/

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by daniel_agnostic View Post
    Apparently, Christians and Jews were awaiting a new prophet in the 6th century CE: http://www.islamreligion.com/article...hammad-part-1/
    Yes this is true but they do not have an answer who is that for 2000 year though the know the truth they will not accept it and they will call themselves followers of Jesus but do opposite to his commandments ?
    John 14:15-16 (CJB)

    15If you love me, you will keep my commands; 16 and I will ask the Father, and he will give you another comforting Counselor like me, the Spirit of Truth, to be with you forever.

    Similar are the question of the Vedhas who are awaiting for Kalki Avatar, a leader for the past 4000 years when one their Scholars proved it was Muhammad The Prophet who matched exactly all the traits of Kalki Avatar the threw even their highest Scholar out .

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    I have been trying to post my reply to Pip1 i could not post if for the past 15 minutes, it shows this


    This web page is not available

    ERR_CONTENT_DECODING_FAILED

    but my post to danielAgnostic is posted without any hitch. And This I have experienced 10's of times when posting ONLY TO APOLOGETICS. So I am right in claiming the apologetic cheaters use all ways and methods to obstruct Islam by deleting records pro to Proofs of Islam, By editing, creating double records and even using hackers to obstruct posting our posts against these apologetics. worst people on Earth and let them remember they will REPAID definetly on the day of Judgement

    Islam is the only religion which has strictly spoken against using lies and deception in spreading its religion but all others do all immoral things and use lies and they think they will earn virtues if they use lies and deception to spread their Religion
    Last edited by talibilm09; 16-09-15 at 05:17 AM.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    Your assumption. There is no benefit in another prophet, a human, with another message. It can only logically mean the same in Spirit.
    So you call me I assumed and you assume in contrary to your verse itself

    ''16 and I will ask the Father, and he will give you ''ANOTHER comforting Counselor LIKE ME, '' ''the Spirit of Truth '', to be with you forever.

    if you do not understand your bible's words '' ANOTHER'' what else are you going to understand and accept Arbed .?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    The Spirit proceeds from God the father. Muhammed was not a Spirit whom proceeded from God. He was like all men born the normal way the offspring of his parents.
    I had told you many many times the 'spirit ' here has been used as figurative way and such figures of speech is very common to your NT (Spirit of slavery, Spirit of wisdom etc ) by which you people had got deviated from the right path taking sons and fathers to real

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    Jesus said He would not leave His disciples orphans -- I am coming to you. Why would Jesus say that if He never meant it? You forget Jesus here is talking to His disciples, it's not a prophecy to come to fruition 600 years later. It is a message for that time, Jesus is talking of His death and subsequent resurrection and what would happen to the Disciples after that. Namely the coming of the Spirit at Pentecost. Jesus saying "I am coming to you" spiritually Jesus and the comforter are one. It can only be the Holy Spirit.
    So how many Spirits do you have arbed. ? like you have many sons ? is this a religion , but a mumbo jumbo puzzle. The Spirit was already
    there when Jesus was present
    Luke 10:21 At that very time He rejoiced greatly in the Holy Spirit .
    Matt. 12:28 But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.

    and now you say its the spirit of Jesus which came to Pentecost.and before you said its the Holy spirit so you people juggle very well like you juggle with your IDs ARBED, Pip1 and Debra . you should know I bumped this old thread to catch you red handed and also to answer another guy to whom I mentioned about the Comforter.

    Its a pity to see you pious people being battered like ping pong ball in your assumptions so its upto you since your claims are fake because you never even follow Jesus or his commandments and claim to living with his spirit, inside , weird and BS . So read Matthew 7:22-23 where Jesus rightly calls you ''Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness!’[a]

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    Sorry, but you can't pick and choose bits of the Bible you like and dismiss the bits that don't suit your agenda
    This is what YOU DO when you take some words verbatim and same words allegorically which ever suits your Agenda

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    . Bible scripture is clear on the identity of the Holy Spirit. Jesus said He had to go in order for the Spirit to come to them. The comforter will be sent in Jesus' name. The comforter will remind the disciples of all Jesus had said to them. The Comforter will testify about Jesus. The comforter will convict the world of guilt regarding sin. The Comforter will bring glory to Jesus. If you are a truly honest person as God is your witness you must surely see that Muhammed doesn't meet this criteria so cannot be the comforter. You can only say then that the bits of the Bible that don't work for you must have been change by some unknown person for reasons unknown. If it was believed at the time the comforter was the Holy Spirit with no knowledge of any prophet to come a long 600 years in the future, then there was no motive to change anything. The only logical conclusion in the absence of any proof to the contrary is the Bible accounts are truth.
    Bible is clear in all verses of John except 14:26 (the usual contradiction with 10's of POINTS , PROOFS< TRAITS about Comforter but its you heart and minds are PREJUDICED . listen John 14 :15 where Jesus says “If you love me, you will keep my commands '' but you are slaves to your ego and you take 14:26 (a contradiction, usual NT style) over all other 10's verses which are aginst it as seen from your below quotes too


    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    John 14:15-17

    "All this I have spoken while still with you. But the Comforter, the Holy Spirit whom The Father will send in my name and will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you." John 14:25, 26

    "When the Comforter comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who goes out from the Father, he will testify about Me."
    The Spirit of Pentecost what did it say no one knows , no proofs , no records though you say there were 150 disciples ? except your words . Its only Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) Reminded, repeated , fullfilled the words of Jesus and commandments that Allah is above all, No idols, No swine, No wine, Usury saying Salam, peace etc etc, Its only Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) Testified that Jesus was the Messiah, Miraculously born without father when the world (except Chrsitians) were throwing insults on Jesus and his mother

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    John 15:26

    "But I tell you the truth: It is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Comforter will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. When he comes he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment...."
    So you yourselves prove the Comforter is not the Holy Spirit because the holy spirit was always there when Jesus was present
    Luke 4:1 And Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan and was led about by the Spirit in the wilderness . . . (NASB)
    Luke 4:14 And Jesus returned to Galilee in the power of the Spirit; and news about Him spread through all the surrounding district. (NASB)
    Luke 10:21 At that very time He rejoiced greatly in the Holy Spirit . (nasb)

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    John 16:7, 8

    "But when he, the Spirit of Truth comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own, he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. He will bring glory to Me by taking from what is Mine and making it known to you. All that belongs to the Father is Mine. That is why I said the Spirit will take from what is Mine and make it known to you."
    let me put the above verse in parts

    1) Spirit of truth a figurative speech for THE truth speaking person since the bible have such figurative speeches in tons like Father (God) Son of God ( the Pious person ) and also see different spirits ( From Bible ) 1) spirit of wisdom 2) spirit of jealousy 3) Spirit of slavery 4) Spirit of Evil etc all from your books But Prophet Muhammad was the Spirit of truth , Never lied in his life and and even disclosed to the public those noble Quran verses which exposed his errors as a Human '' the spirit of truth ''

    2) he will guide you into all the truth; , what did the holy spirit at Pentacost'' GUIDE " ? in what truth ? Guide means to guide someone when they are Mislead . But the Spirit saints at Pentecost which happened in just 150 days Right ? So were they misguided in just a few days or years ? this verse prophesizes , Chrisitians will be MISLEAD so then you will require a GUIDE to guide you to THE TRUTH , if so what did holy spirit say ? to which truth ? give narrations like hadith with chain of narrators but ITS ONLY Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) WHO guided you & the world to all the truth that Mary was chaste ,Jesus was the messiah, a prophet and a servant of Allah not begotten , not killed like a criminal and the books have been distorted, All prophets like Lot(pbuh) were the best and not criminals etc etc etc


    3) for he will not speak on his own initiative but will say only what he hears , but the holy spirit ghost spoke of its own in different languages but its only Muhammd who fullfilled this as in the Noble Quran 53: 3- 4

    ''Nor does he speak from [his own] inclination. It is not but a revelation revealed,''

    4) He will also announce to you the events of the future which is IRREFUTABLE with Prophet Muhammds more than 240 prophecies with over 80 % fullfilled the remaining awaited to be full filled but poor Holy GHOST did not prophesize even just ONE Prophesy . [B]ONLY THIS PROOF IS ENOUGH TO PROVE COMFORTER WAS NEVER AND NOT THE HOLY GHOST WHICH NEVER MADE A PROPHESY

    5) He will glorify me,, where and how did the holy Ghost Glorified Jesus when the world lead by the Jews were calling Jesus with 7 letter filthy word and was insulting his Mother Maryam , so what was the Holy Ghost doing for 600 years ?
    watching HBC ? ( Hebrew brodcasting Channel ? ) BUT I will CHALLENGE YOU ITS ONLY PROPHET MUHAMMAD '' an OUTSIDER glorified dignified Jesus for 1st time after 600 years of blasphemy and indeed man is very ungrateful than dogs and Jesus says (something like that too ) calling them the people of ''inequity or lawlessness '' in Matthew 7:22-23 and those who claim Muhammad (pbuh) did not glorify Jesus will surely come under this

    6) [COLOR="#FF0000"]he will receive from what is mine and announce it to you[/COLOR] Again its only Muhammad the prophet who received or continued the POST of the Prophet from after Jesus(pbuh) and announced to you all that he was the continual of Prophet Hood of Jesus and he confirmed us that no Prophet came in between Jesus and Muhammad (pbuh) is another proof of it.





    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    Didn't know we were in competition here so what's with the "I lose again" about? There IS ONLY the figurative way to refer to God as father. God is NOT a father in physical terms. So don't know what you're talking about here but the point you may be implying (if there is one) is void.
    This is a shrewd way to pacify ones loosing of face When you claimed that Muslims do not accept Jesus had a Father but I proved from the Link What It really meant from the Jewish link where God was called the father .

    We can take a horse to a PURE stream but you cant make it drink So there is no meaning in proving you the Truth because the FACT is you are twisters of Truth as you did here and You choose misguidance over guidance and you do against what Jesus said and the below point that Jesus lives in you is just utter lies and a satanic illusion

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    can i try this way

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    Your assumption. There is no benefit in another prophet, a human, with another message. It can only logically mean the same in Spirit.
    So you call me I assumed and you assume in contrary to your verse itself

    ''16 and I will ask the Father, and he will give you ''ANOTHER comforting Counselor LIKE ME, '' ''the Spirit of Truth '', to be with you forever.

    if you do not understand your bible's words '' ANOTHER'' what else are you going to understand and accept Arbed .?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    The Spirit proceeds from God the father. Muhammed was not a Spirit whom proceeded from God. He was like all men born the normal way the offspring of his parents.
    I had told you many many times the 'spirit ' here has been used as figurative way and such figures of speech is very common to your NT (Spirit of slavery, Spirit of wisdom etc ) by which you people had got deviated from the right path taking sons and fathers to real

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    Jesus said He would not leave His disciples orphans -- I am coming to you. Why would Jesus say that if He never meant it? You forget Jesus here is talking to His disciples, it's not a prophecy to come to fruition 600 years later. It is a message for that time, Jesus is talking of His death and subsequent resurrection and what would happen to the Disciples after that. Namely the coming of the Spirit at Pentecost. Jesus saying "I am coming to you" spiritually Jesus and the comforter are one. It can only be the Holy Spirit.
    So how many Spirits do you have arbed. ? like you have many sons ? is this a religion , but a mumbo jumbo puzzle. The Spirit was already
    there when Jesus was present
    Luke 10:21 At that very time He rejoiced greatly in the Holy Spirit .
    Matt. 12:28 But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.

    and now you say its the spirit of Jesus which came to Pentecost.and before you said its the Holy spirit so you people juggle very well like you juggle with your IDs ARBED, Pip1 and Debra . you should know I bumped this old thread to catch you red handed and also to answer another guy to whom I mentioned about the Comforter.

    Its a pity to see you pious people being battered like ping pong ball in your assumptions so its upto you since your claims are fake because you never even follow Jesus or his commandments and claim to living with his spirit, inside , weird and BS . So read Matthew 7:22-23 where Jesus rightly calls you ''Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness!’[a]

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    Sorry, but you can't pick and choose bits of the Bible you like and dismiss the bits that don't suit your agenda
    This is what YOU DO when you take some words verbatim and same words allegorically which ever suits your Agenda

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    . Bible scripture is clear on the identity of the Holy Spirit. Jesus said He had to go in order for the Spirit to come to them. The comforter will be sent in Jesus' name. The comforter will remind the disciples of all Jesus had said to them. The Comforter will testify about Jesus. The comforter will convict the world of guilt regarding sin. The Comforter will bring glory to Jesus. If you are a truly honest person as God is your witness you must surely see that Muhammed doesn't meet this criteria so cannot be the comforter. You can only say then that the bits of the Bible that don't work for you must have been change by some unknown person for reasons unknown. If it was believed at the time the comforter was the Holy Spirit with no knowledge of any prophet to come a long 600 years in the future, then there was no motive to change anything. The only logical conclusion in the absence of any proof to the contrary is the Bible accounts are truth.
    Bible is clear in all verses of John except 14:26 (the usual contradiction with 10's of POINTS , PROOFS< TRAITS about Comforter but its you heart and minds are PREJUDICED . listen John 14 :15 where Jesus says “If you love me, you will keep my commands '' but you are slaves to your ego and you take 14:26 (a contradiction, usual NT style) over all other 10's verses which are aginst it as seen from your below quotes too


    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    John 14:15-17

    "All this I have spoken while still with you. But the Comforter, the Holy Spirit whom The Father will send in my name and will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you." John 14:25, 26

    "When the Comforter comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who goes out from the Father, he will testify about Me."
    The Spirit of Pentecost what did it say no one knows , no proofs , no records though you say there were 150 disciples ? except your words . Its only Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) Reminded, repeated , fullfilled the words of Jesus and commandments that Allah is above all, No idols, No swine, No wine, Usury saying Salam, peace etc etc, Its only Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) Testified that Jesus was the Messiah, Miraculously born without father when the world (except Chrsitians) were throwing insults on Jesus and his mother

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    John 15:26

    "But I tell you the truth: It is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Comforter will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. When he comes he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment...."
    So you yourselves prove the Comforter is not the Holy Spirit because the holy spirit was always there when Jesus was present
    Luke 4:1 And Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan and was led about by the Spirit in the wilderness . . . (NASB)
    Luke 4:14 And Jesus returned to Galilee in the power of the Spirit; and news about Him spread through all the surrounding district. (NASB)
    Luke 10:21 At that very time He rejoiced greatly in the Holy Spirit . (nasb)

    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    John 16:7, 8

    "But when he, the Spirit of Truth comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own, he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. He will bring glory to Me by taking from what is Mine and making it known to you. All that belongs to the Father is Mine. That is why I said the Spirit will take from what is Mine and make it known to you."
    let me put the above verse in parts

    1) Spirit of truth a figurative speech for THE truth speaking person since the bible have such figurative speeches in tons like Father (God) Son of God ( the Pious person ) and also see different spirits ( From Bible ) 1) spirit of wisdom 2) spirit of jealousy 3) Spirit of slavery 4) Spirit of Evil etc all from your books But Prophet Muhammad was the Spirit of truth , Never lied in his life and and even disclosed to the public those noble Quran verses which exposed his errors as a Human '' the spirit of truth ''

    2) he will guide you into all the truth; , what did the holy spirit at Pentacost'' GUIDE " ? in what truth ? Guide means to guide someone when they are Mislead . But the Spirit saints at Pentecost which happened in just 150 days Right ? So were they misguided in just a few days or years ? this verse prophesizes , Chrisitians will be MISLEAD so then you will require a GUIDE to guide you to THE TRUTH , if so what did holy spirit say ? to which truth ? give narrations like hadith with chain of narrators but ITS ONLY Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) WHO guided you & the world to all the truth that Mary was chaste ,Jesus was the messiah, a prophet and a servant of Allah not begotten , not killed like a criminal and the books have been distorted, All prophets like Lot(pbuh) were the best and not criminals etc etc etc


    3) for he will not speak on his own initiative but will say only what he hears , but the holy spirit ghost spoke of its own in different languages but its only Muhammd who fullfilled this as in the Noble Quran 53: 3- 4

    ''Nor does he speak from [his own] inclination. It is not but a revelation revealed,''

    4) He will also announce to you the events of the future which is IRREFUTABLE with Prophet Muhammds more than 240 prophecies with over 80 % fullfilled the remaining awaited to be full filled but poor Holy GHOST did not prophesize even just ONE Prophesy . [B]ONLY THIS PROOF IS ENOUGH TO PROVE COMFORTER WAS NEVER AND NOT THE HOLY GHOST WHICH NEVER MADE A PROPHESY

    5) He will glorify me,, where and how did the holy Ghost Glorified Jesus when the world lead by the Jews were calling Jesus with 7 letter filthy word and was insulting his Mother Maryam , so what was the Holy Ghost doing for 600 years ?
    watching HBC ? ( Hebrew brodcasting Channel ? ) BUT I will CHALLENGE YOU ITS ONLY PROPHET MUHAMMAD '' an OUTSIDER glorified dignified Jesus for 1st time after 600 years of blasphemy and indeed man is very ungrateful than dogs and Jesus says (something like that too ) calling them the people of ''inequity or lawlessness '' in Matthew 7:22-23 and those who claim Muhammad (pbuh) did not glorify Jesus will surely come under this

    6) [COLOR="#FF0000"]he will receive from what is mine and announce it to you[/COLOR] Again its only Muhammad the prophet who received or continued the POST of the Prophet from after Jesus(pbuh) and announced to you all that he was the continual of Prophet Hood of Jesus and he confirmed us that no Prophet came in between Jesus and Muhammad (pbuh) is another proof of it.





    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    Didn't know we were in competition here so what's with the "I lose again" about? There IS ONLY the figurative way to refer to God as father. God is NOT a father in physical terms. So don't know what you're talking about here but the point you may be implying (if there is one) is void.
    This is a shrewd way to pacify ones loosing of face When you claimed that Muslims do not accept Jesus had a Father and consequently that verse of Comforter cannot be utilised by muslims, really how corrupt and shrewd minded you are you can twist anything anyhow to suit your Agenda . but I proved from the Link What It really meant from the Jewish link where God was called the father .

    We can take a horse to a PURE stream but you cant make it drink So there is no meaning in proving you the Truth because the FACT is you are twisters of Truth as you did here and You choose misguidance over guidance and you do against what Jesus said and the below point that Jesus lives in you is just utter lies and a satanic illusion
    Last edited by talibilm09; 16-09-15 at 06:59 AM.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by talibilm09 View Post
    Yes this is true but they do not have an answer who is that for 2000 year though the know the truth they will not accept it and they will call themselves followers of Jesus but do opposite to his commandments ?
    John 14:15-16 (CJB)

    15If you love me, you will keep my commands; 16 and I will ask the Father, and he will give you another comforting Counselor like me, the Spirit of Truth, to be with you forever.

    Similar are the question of the Vedhas who are awaiting for Kalki Avatar, a leader for the past 4000 years when one their Scholars proved it was Muhammad The Prophet who matched exactly all the traits of Kalki Avatar the threw even their highest Scholar out .
    In case you don't know what Jesus' commandments actually were, and they were not conditional on sending the comforter. The Comforter was sent to the DISCIPLES.

    Matthew 22:37-40King James Version (KJV)

    37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

    38 This is the first and great commandment.

    39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

    40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by talibilm09 View Post
    can i try this way



    So you call me I assumed and you assume in contrary to your verse itself

    ''16 and I will ask the Father, and he will give you ''ANOTHER comforting Counselor LIKE ME, '' ''the Spirit of Truth '', to be with you forever.

    if you do not understand your bible's words '' ANOTHER'' what else are you going to understand and accept Arbed .?



    I had told you many many times the 'spirit ' here has been used as figurative way and such figures of speech is very common to your NT (Spirit of slavery, Spirit of wisdom etc ) by which you people had got deviated from the right path taking sons and fathers to real



    So how many Spirits do you have arbed. ? like you have many sons ? is this a religion , but a mumbo jumbo puzzle. The Spirit was already
    there when Jesus was present
    Luke 10:21 At that very time He rejoiced greatly in the Holy Spirit .
    Matt. 12:28 But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.

    and now you say its the spirit of Jesus which came to Pentecost.and before you said its the Holy spirit so you people juggle very well like you juggle with your IDs ARBED, Pip1 and Debra . you should know I bumped this old thread to catch you red handed and also to answer another guy to whom I mentioned about the Comforter.

    Its a pity to see you pious people being battered like ping pong ball in your assumptions so its upto you since your claims are fake because you never even follow Jesus or his commandments and claim to living with his spirit, inside , weird and BS . So read Matthew 7:22-23 where Jesus rightly calls you ''Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness!’[a]


    This is what YOU DO when you take some words verbatim and same words allegorically which ever suits your Agenda



    Bible is clear in all verses of John except 14:26 (the usual contradiction with 10's of POINTS , PROOFS< TRAITS about Comforter but its you heart and minds are PREJUDICED . listen John 14 :15 where Jesus says “If you love me, you will keep my commands '' but you are slaves to your ego and you take 14:26 (a contradiction, usual NT style) over all other 10's verses which are aginst it as seen from your below quotes too




    The Spirit of Pentecost what did it say no one knows , no proofs , no records though you say there were 150 disciples ? except your words . Its only Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) Reminded, repeated , fullfilled the words of Jesus and commandments that Allah is above all, No idols, No swine, No wine, Usury saying Salam, peace etc etc, Its only Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) Testified that Jesus was the Messiah, Miraculously born without father when the world (except Chrsitians) were throwing insults on Jesus and his mother



    So you yourselves prove the Comforter is not the Holy Spirit because the holy spirit was always there when Jesus was present
    Luke 4:1 And Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan and was led about by the Spirit in the wilderness . . . (NASB)
    Luke 4:14 And Jesus returned to Galilee in the power of the Spirit; and news about Him spread through all the surrounding district. (NASB)
    Luke 10:21 At that very time He rejoiced greatly in the Holy Spirit . (nasb)



    let me put the above verse in parts

    1) Spirit of truth a figurative speech for THE truth speaking person since the bible have such figurative speeches in tons like Father (God) Son of God ( the Pious person ) and also see different spirits ( From Bible ) 1) spirit of wisdom 2) spirit of jealousy 3) Spirit of slavery 4) Spirit of Evil etc all from your books But Prophet Muhammad was the Spirit of truth , Never lied in his life and and even disclosed to the public those noble Quran verses which exposed his errors as a Human '' the spirit of truth ''

    2) he will guide you into all the truth; , what did the holy spirit at Pentacost'' GUIDE " ? in what truth ? Guide means to guide someone when they are Mislead . But the Spirit saints at Pentecost which happened in just 150 days Right ? So were they misguided in just a few days or years ? this verse prophesizes , Chrisitians will be MISLEAD so then you will require a GUIDE to guide you to THE TRUTH , if so what did holy spirit say ? to which truth ? give narrations like hadith with chain of narrators but ITS ONLY Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) WHO guided you & the world to all the truth that Mary was chaste ,Jesus was the messiah, a prophet and a servant of Allah not begotten , not killed like a criminal and the books have been distorted, All prophets like Lot(pbuh) were the best and not criminals etc etc etc


    3) for he will not speak on his own initiative but will say only what he hears , but the holy spirit ghost spoke of its own in different languages but its only Muhammd who fullfilled this as in the Noble Quran 53: 3- 4

    ''Nor does he speak from [his own] inclination. It is not but a revelation revealed,''

    4) He will also announce to you the events of the future which is IRREFUTABLE with Prophet Muhammds more than 240 prophecies with over 80 % fullfilled the remaining awaited to be full filled but poor Holy GHOST did not prophesize even just ONE Prophesy . [B]ONLY THIS PROOF IS ENOUGH TO PROVE COMFORTER WAS NEVER AND NOT THE HOLY GHOST WHICH NEVER MADE A PROPHESY

    5) He will glorify me,, where and how did the holy Ghost Glorified Jesus when the world lead by the Jews were calling Jesus with 7 letter filthy word and was insulting his Mother Maryam , so what was the Holy Ghost doing for 600 years ?
    watching HBC ? ( Hebrew brodcasting Channel ? ) BUT I will CHALLENGE YOU ITS ONLY PROPHET MUHAMMAD '' an OUTSIDER glorified dignified Jesus for 1st time after 600 years of blasphemy and indeed man is very ungrateful than dogs and Jesus says (something like that too ) calling them the people of ''inequity or lawlessness '' in Matthew 7:22-23 and those who claim Muhammad (pbuh) did not glorify Jesus will surely come under this

    6) [COLOR="#FF0000"]he will receive from what is mine and announce it to you[/COLOR] Again its only Muhammad the prophet who received or continued the POST of the Prophet from after Jesus(pbuh) and announced to you all that he was the continual of Prophet Hood of Jesus and he confirmed us that no Prophet came in between Jesus and Muhammad (pbuh) is another proof of it.







    This is a shrewd way to pacify ones loosing of face When you claimed that Muslims do not accept Jesus had a Father and consequently that verse of Comforter cannot be utilised by muslims, really how corrupt and shrewd minded you are you can twist anything anyhow to suit your Agenda . but I proved from the Link What It really meant from the Jewish link where God was called the father .

    We can take a horse to a PURE stream but you cant make it drink So there is no meaning in proving you the Truth because the FACT is you are twisters of Truth as you did here and You choose misguidance over guidance and you do against what Jesus said and the below point that Jesus lives in you is just utter lies and a satanic illusion
    I can't believe you made the effort to post all that!!!! I've read through this whole thread and it would seem this has been answered upside down and inside out. Nothing more to add. Bedsides I have no wish to add to your paranoia. You didn't answer the questions I asked so I repeat them again in the hope you answer them. At least then I may be able to understand better why you are so driven on this hopeless quest you're on. There is not a christian in the whole of Christendom that would be persuaded that your deliberations are anything approaching reality.

    May I ask a question at this point?
    Why are you so adamant that the comforter Jesus sent to the disciples has to be Muhammed?
    Why aren't you content with how Muhammed is found in the Qur'an?
    Why do you need to find reference to Muhammed in the Bible? Especially since you guys are always saying how corrupt and unreliable it is.

    BTW, thanks for the negative reputation. Lol

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Pip1 says (quoted in post # 90

    ''In case you don't know what Jesus' commandments actually were, and they were not conditional on sending the comforter. The Comforter was sent to the DISCIPLES.

    Matthew 22:37-40King James Version (KJV)

    37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

    38 This is the first and great commandment.

    39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

    40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.''

    Talibilm09 replies

    ''You are such a Liar (calling your self a Christian,lol ok the invented one) , Arbed and a such a Paranoid that you do not beleive your own NT and will TOTALLY throw ALL the chapters of John which speaks all about the sending of the comforter Since you loose the case totally with the Muslims.

    The Noble Quran confirms my faith in some verses which says something why Allah has created some people only for the hell and some bought Misguidance

    Noble Quran, 7:30 ''Some He hath guided: Others have (by their choice) deserved the loss of their way; in that they took the evil ones, in preference to Allah, for their friends and protectors, and think that they receive guidance.''

    So take satan and ego as your friend when your books (my description in above posts ) Explicitly proves neither Holy Spirit was that Comforter Nor Jesus's spirit ( New story -assumption) was that Comforter. You keep wandering in a land of confusion but still you will never pay heed even to your Jesus (pbuh) who warned you and directed You to take the Help of the Comforter and Testify in him , but you won't and in contrast you lie you love Jesus, Lol So see your own post TESTIFYING against you

    Pip1quoted the below verses

    John 15:26

    "But I tell you the truth: It is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Comforter will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. When he comes he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment...." ( Talibilm09: its only P Muhammad (pbuh) proved Christians were sining by going against their own books)

    John 16:7, 8

    "But when he, the Spirit of Truth comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own, he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. He will bring ''glory'' to Me by taking from what is Mine and making it known to you. All that belongs to the Father is Mine. That is why I said the Spirit will take from what is Mine and make it known to you." ( Talibilm09 replies : So many proofs but the blind will not see, the spirit is the ''spirit of truth'' here which is '' Alameen . Assadique, the truthful Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) [/QUOTE]
    Last edited by talibilm09; 19-09-15 at 10:05 AM.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by talibilm09 View Post
    Pip1 says (quoted in post # 90

    ''In case you don't know what Jesus' commandments actually were, and they were not conditional on sending the comforter. The Comforter was sent to the DISCIPLES.

    Matthew 22:37-40King James Version (KJV)

    37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

    38 This is the first and great commandment.

    39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

    40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.''



    Talibilm09 replies

    ''You are such a Liar (calling your self a Christian,lol ok the invented one, Arbed) and a such a Paranoid that you do not beleive your own NT and will TOTALLY throw ALL the chapters of John which speaks all about the sending of the comforter Since you loose the case totally against the Noble Quran and Muslims. So Now you reject your own Books ONLY bcos it Proves the Noble Quran and you STILL call yourself a Christian ???!!! . You are in no religion which was also foretold told in our Noble Quran in verse http://www.altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?...0&LanguageId=2 and you prove it now,lol, . Even some Jews rejected EXODUS (youtube) only because they want to disprove the Noble Quran. You will melt and die in your jealousy

    The Noble Quran confirms my faith in some verses which says something why Allah has created some people only for the hell and some bought Misguidance

    Noble Quran, 7:30 ''Some He hath guided: Others have (by their choice) deserved the loss of their way; in that they took the evil ones, in preference to Allah, for their friends and protectors, and think that they receive guidance.''

    So take satan and ego as your friend when your books (my description in above posts ) Explicitly proves neither Holy Spirit was that Comforter Nor Jesus's spirit ( New story -assumption) was that Comforter. You keep wandering in a land of confusion but still You never even pay heed even to your Jesus (pbuh) who warned you and directed you to ' TESTIFY & TAKE THE HELP OF THE COMFORTER WHO WILL GUIDE YOU TO ALL TRUTH ' and you lie in contrast you love Jesus, Lol So see your own post TESTIFYING against you

    Pip1quoted the below verses

    John 15:26

    "But I tell you the truth: It is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Comforter will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. When he comes he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment...." ( Talibilm09: its only P Muhammad (pbuh) proved Christians were sinning by going against their own books )

    John 16:7, 8

    "But when he, the Spirit of Truth comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own, he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. He will bring ''glory'' to Me by taking from what is Mine and making it known to you. All that belongs to the Father is Mine. That is why I said the Spirit will take from what is Mine and make it known to you." ( Talibilm09 replies : So many proofs but the blind will not see, the spirit is the ''spirit of truth'' here which is '' Alameen . Assadique, the truthful Prophet Muhammad (pbuh)


    Note : am unable to post direct against Pip1s quote so had posted as above


    [/QUOTE]


    Note : am unable to post direct against Pip1s quote so had posted as above



    BUMP.
    Last edited by talibilm09; 20-09-15 at 09:05 AM.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by talibilm09 View Post
    [COLOR="#000000"]

    So you prove Bart Erhmans claims that the originals of NT disappeared because Jesus spoke the semetic language ' Aramaic'' and was born among Aramaic speaking peasants and he did not Utter anything directly in GREEK , Right ?



    If Arbed says he is not '' begotten '' it does not mean all others of 40000 denomination say the same. Even Causative was arguing with me that '' Begotten '' was the correct concept . Begotten means https://www.google.co.in/?gfe_rd=cr&...q=begets+means So cool down sister you cant hide a world known fact though i understand you want to uplift your dying religion with your renewed views but fact is a fact or the word '' beget '' would have never found in your books when it talks about god's & Jesus's relationship




    How may times i 've told you not to preach your defunct views on a Muslim forum . If you people do not come here and preach your ' absurd ' views than there is n't any need to discuss YOUR books about the filthy things to which you turn blind eyes. Why did jehovah came and ate hot buns & calf meat ? clear this first Why he can't do his job sitting in the skies, that does consonants with the Majesty of the LORD MOST HIGH !!! .



    Most of your above claims i 've refuted proving it was Jesus the comforter, the spirit of truth as every prophet was , who was eating, living, sleeping and staying with the disciples and who will re united with you in the last days of the world and not the holy spirit .

    Sister Arbed, you have been ALWAYS ELUDING MY QUESTION to you, after how many days after Jesus's vanishing did the spirit of Pentacost descended on disciples after how many days ? and also how may disciiples were there ? any Narration direct or verses from your book describing what did the Holy Spirit say ? ( Like hadith, quote a narration with chain of transmitters ) Or I will declare that ITS JUST A FAKE INCIDENT a Fairy tale and there is nothing a holy spirit except the Angel Gabriel who is called the PURE SPIRIT in the Noble Quran


    So hope you grasp why the comforter is ONLY Muhammad (pbuh) See 6 PROOFS from JUST ONE VERSE from your NT


    ''John 16:13-15Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)

    13 However, when the Spirit of Truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own initiative but will say ONLY WHAT HE HEARS. He will also announce to you the events of the future. 14 He will glorify me, because he will receive from what is mine and announce it to you.''

    Points to note ( explaining the above verse of John )

    1) Spirit of truth a figurative speech for THE truth speaking person since the bible have such figurative speeches in tons like Father (God) Son of God ( the Pious person ) and also see different spirits ( From Bible ) 1) spirit of wisdom 2) spirit of jealousy 3) Spirit of slavery 4) Spirit of Evil etc all from your books But Prophet Muhammad was the Spirit of truth , Never lied in his life and and even disclosed to the public those noble Quran verses which exposed his errors as a Human '' the spirit of truth '' And in another verse Jesus says Spirit of Truth 'LIKE ME'' who was in flesh at that time when he spoke them.

    2) he will guide you into all the truth; , what did the holy spirit '' GUIDE " ? in what truth ? Guide means to guide someone when they are Mislead So the verse prophesizes , you Arbed, aj4u and all Chrisitians will be MISLEAD so then you will require a GUIDE to guide you to THE TRUTH , whereas the Spirit of Pentacoste descended with in 15 days ( or 150 days , Right ? as per earlier your post ? ) Do you think your 12 disciples and their followers were misguided with 150 days of Jesus vanishing ? if so what did holy spirit say ? to which truth ? give narrations like hadith with chain of narrators but Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) guided you to all the truth that Mary was chaste ,Jesus was the messiah, a prophet and a servant of Allah not begotten , not killed like a criminal and the books have been distorted, All prophets like Lot(pbuh) were not criminals etc etc etc


    3) for he will not speak on his own initiative but will say only what he hears , but the holy spirit ghost spoke of its own in different languages but its only Muhammad who full filled this as in the Noble Quran 53: 3- 4

    ''Nor does he speak from [his own] inclination. It is not but a revelation revealed,''

    4) He will also announce to you the events of the future which is IRREFUTABLE with Prophet Muhammds more than 240 prophecies with over 80 % fullfilled the remaining awaited to be full filled but poor Holy GHOST did not prophesize even just ONE Prophesy . ONLY THIS PROOF IS ENOUGH TO PROVE HOLY GHOST WAS NOT THE COMFORTER WHICH NEVER MADE A SINGLE PROPHESY which you have kept trumpeting for 2000 years .

    5) He will glorify me,, where and how did the holy Ghost Glorified Jesus when the world lead by the Jews were calling Jesus with 7 letter filthy word and was insulting his Mother Maryam , so what was the Holy Ghost doing for 600 years ?
    watching HBC ? ( Hebrew brodcasting Channel ? ) BUT I will CHALLENGE YOU ITS ONLY PROPHET MUHAMMAD '' an OUTSIDER glorified dignified Jesus for 1st time after 600 years of blasphemy and indeed man is very ungrateful than dogs and Jesus says (something like that too ) calling them the people of ''inequity or lawlessness '' in Matthew 7:22-23 and those who claim Muhammad (pbuh) did not glorify Jesus will surely come under this

    6) he will receive from what is mine and announce it to you[/COLOR] Again its only Muhammad the prophet who received or continued the POST of the Prophet from after Jesus(pbuh) and announced to you all that he was the continual of Prophet Hood of Jesus and he confirmed us that no Prophet came in between Jesus and Muhammad (pbuh) is another proof of it.

    Conclusion Tal: 9 Arb : 1 : : ( only John 14:26, a contradiction and not an EXCEPTION to NT ) in favor of Muhammad (pbuh) is the another and Last comforter of the world
    who was also foretold in every major religion of the world


    peace , peace, peace on to you all, , Thanks Allah
    Bumped for Saba Sulava , The Expert and specialist in twisting scriptures, videos and its contents .
    Last edited by talibilm09; 20-10-15 at 09:44 AM.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Post transfered from the thread '' 100 Miracles of the Prophet (Pbuh) http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthrea...pon-him)/page3


    Quote Originally Posted by Pip1 View Post
    You emphasised the wrong bit. ~ He will glorify me, because he will receive from what is mine and announce it to you. Announce it to YOU. Jesus was addressing the Disciples here. The Spirit was promises to THEM. To prepare THEM for the task ahead even though at that time they did not fully understand it, it was not until after the resurrection and the receiving of the Spirit at Pentecost (about forty days after the death and resurrection) that full understanding came to them. How do we know this? The existence of the Gospels. Which were complete and in wide use centuries before the coming of Muhammed and Islam.

    Muhammed never knew or met the Disciples so never had occasion to guide them on anything.

    When a King says ' You ' to his subjects and when a Prophet of ANY RELIGION says ' You' to his disciples is not in the same sense since the king is going to die in a 100 years or less but the religion A Prophet Brings is going to last for millenniums so the '' You '' applies to all his folloers who are going to come in the FUTURE ie to all Christians which is understandable by the common sense every Reasonable thinking Person uses ( not like saba Sulava )


    First Christians are very confused with the days and years when the spirit of Pentecoste appeared each changing as per his needs ( 150 days, 100 years and now 40 days ) suiting his argument and Agenda which shows the weakness of authenticity of this incident which is THE ARTICLE OF FAITH on which stands the whole Christendom.


    let see more from the Verse

    John 16:13-15 (CJB)

    13 However, when the Spirit of Truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own initiative but will say only what he hears. He will also announce to you the events of the future. 14 He will glorify me, because he will receive from what is mine and announce it to you.

    As quoted in the above post # 94 all other PROOFS from each bit of the above verse ie 6 points are PROVED in favour of Prophet Muhammad and when you take and Twist the only '' TERM '' ie '' You '' and leave all the 10's of proofs CLEARLY INCLINED COMPLETELY towards Prophet Muhammad either in terms of the Truth speaking spirit, guiding from sins and methods of Living & exposing the puzzles that was world was confused with,,PROPHESIES ( spirit of Pentacoste never made a single Prophesy) etc etc ( atleast 10 from John) then you should ask your heart which can judge fairly who is inclined towards the Truth and who is not ?

    So lets see some of the 'You" s in John 14:15-18Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)

    15 “If you love me, you will keep my commands; ''


    ''If you love me You will keep my commandments '' this statement of Jesus is not for the 12 disciples ALONE its for the billions to come including You ' Pip1 ''. So Jesus is addressing You as well , Do you agree ? though you are NOT from the disciples ..

    16 and I will ask the Father, and he will give you another comforting Counselor like me, the Spirit of Truth, to be with you forever. 17 The world cannot receive him, because it neither sees nor knows him. You know him, because he is staying with you and will be united with you. 18 I will not leave you orphans — I am coming to you.

    https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...18&version=CJB

    We know by many verses of NT the Spirit was always with both Jesus and his disciples so Jesus would never say as ' ANOTHER COMFORTING COUNSELOR " if he was referring to the same Holy Spirit that was present at that time with Jesus and his 12 disciples, so how many spirits do you have ??

    1) Holy Ghost or spirit with Jesus and disciples when Jesus was alive

    2) Another Holy Spirit at Pentecost and ?? So Do not make an U turn as Arbed did changing her earlier claim from Holy Spirit INTO the spirit of Jesus just to score Just ONE point + in this debate, but lies do not solve the Problem, So use some more lies ,lol

    and that's why Jesus MENTIONED the word '' LIKE ME "", the spirit of truth., IMPLYING that that Comforting Counselor will be Human BUT ANOTHER Human LIKE ME - (Jesus) When Jesus said that he was still ALIVE in flesh not crucified or in spirit form shows that Comforting Counselor will be a HUMAN and NOT a spirit and you know him is again Jesus Himselves since he was staying living eating with them in open (Not hidden as a Spirit)


    ''and will be united with you. 18 I will not leave you orphans — I am coming to you.''

    Yes so the same Jesus will be united with you all in second coming since he will not leave you as orphans ( of Knowledge as per hadith he will come break the cross,kill the swine, abolish Jizzya etc ) so again ' YOU ' again means to those Christians at the last days of the world when he will be united. (not appearing for few minutes from the Tomb) and not the disciples because they are in their respective graves and not in this world

    So ' I am Coming to you '' in above John 14 and does not mean the '' Disciples '' to whom he said those words before milleniums because they are dead before milleniums and they will not meet Jesus but the Christians near the day of Judgement will meet him and Jesus will get angry on Saba Sulava and Christians like him. Matthew 7:22-23 ''Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness'' https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...23&version=CJB
    Last edited by talibilm09; 22-10-15 at 12:23 PM.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by talibilm09 View Post
    Post transfered from the thread '' 100 Miracles of the Prophet (Pbuh) http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthrea...pon-him)/page3





    John 16:13-15 (CJB)

    13 However, when the Spirit of Truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own initiative but will say only what he hears. He will also announce to you the events of the future. 14 He will glorify me, because he will receive from what is mine and announce it to you.


    Editing ....
    No problem with you transferring the post whatever suits you. I can see this has been explained to you at length as to why the "comforter" cannot be applied to Muhammed. You haven't grasped it so far so I see no point discussing it further with you. You always seem to think small - example " convict of Sin" you seem to take as something levelled at christians! It's actually the world and includes everyone in it.

    I'm not sure why you even used this verse in your thread attributed to "miracles" of Muhammed. There's nothing miraculous about it and it can't apply to Muhammed for a number of reasons as already discussed.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by talibilm09 View Post

    Islam is the only religion which has strictly spoken against using lies and deception in spreading its religion but all others do all immoral things and use lies and they think they will earn virtues if they use lies and deception to spread their Religion
    Psalm 34:12-13
    Verse Concepts
    Who is the man who desires life And loves length of days that he may see good? Keep your tongue from evil And your lips from speaking deceit.

    Ephesians 4:25
    Verse Concepts
    Therefore, laying aside falsehood, SPEAK TRUTH EACH ONE of you WITH HIS NEIGHBOR, for we are members of one another.

    Colossians 3:9-10
    Verse Concepts
    Do not lie to one another, since you laid aside the old self with its evil practices, and have put on the new self who is being renewed to a true knowledge according to the image of the One who created him--

    Exodus 20:16
    Verse Concepts
    "You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
    Leviticus 19:11-12
    'You shall not steal, nor deal falsely, nor lie to one another. 'You shall not swear falsely by My name, so as to profane the name of your God; I am the LORD.

    Proverbs 6:16-17
    Verse Concepts
    There are six things which the LORD hates, Yes, seven which are an abomination to Him: Haughty eyes, a lying tongue, And hands that shed innocent blood,
    Last edited by Serada; 22-10-15 at 10:10 AM.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by Serada View Post
    Psalm 34:12-13
    Verse Concepts
    Who is the man who desires life And loves length of days that he may see good? Keep your tongue from evil And your lips from speaking deceit.

    Ephesians 4:25
    Verse Concepts
    Therefore, laying aside falsehood, SPEAK TRUTH EACH ONE of you WITH HIS NEIGHBOR, for we are members of one another.

    Colossians 3:9-10
    Verse Concepts
    Do not lie to one another, since you laid aside the old self with its evil practices, and have put on the new self who is being renewed to a true knowledge according to the image of the One who created him--

    Exodus 20:16
    Verse Concepts
    "You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
    Leviticus 19:11-12
    'You shall not steal, nor deal falsely, nor lie to one another. 'You shall not swear falsely by My name, so as to profane the name of your God; I am the LORD.

    Proverbs 6:16-17
    Verse Concepts
    There are six things which the LORD hates, Yes, seven which are an abomination to Him: Haughty eyes, a lying tongue, And hands that shed innocent blood,
    Serada these are general warnings every religion give even Hinduism , sikhism etc but I am a talking about Concrete STERN warnings and and Code when we talk about our holy books like these.


    The Prophet (pbuh) said, "It is enough for a man to prove himself a liar when he goes on narrating whatever he hears." [Sahih Muslim]

    Sayyidina Jundub ibn Abdullah (RA) reported that Allah’s Messenger (SAW) said, “If any one speaks on the Qur’an giving his own opinion and even if he is correct, he has done wrong.”[Abu Dawud 3652]


    Ibn Abbas (RA) narrated that the Prophet (SAW) said, “Guard against narrating hadith frome except what you know definitely. He who forges a lie against me deliberately must find his seat in the Fire.”[Ahmed 2675]


    And Many many WARNINGS more like these deters us recklessly to write anything about our Religion EXCEPT the TRUTH because all what we are doing here on the ummah is to please our Lord and Salvation and Paradise, and what will be the use if we spend hours writing ultimately to fall in Hell ? In that case we better do not write at all . when people fall in arguments, to prove their point they twist verses, misquote them and insert their own words so There is stern warning of Hell FIRE at which writers like me are at stake so that's why If you had noted I will always use the word '' Something Like '' when quoting the Hadiths since our WORDS are not those exact words though my Text may mean the same.

    Hope you will find the difference about in what I claim and Muslims are the most careful in quoting Holy books.
    Last edited by talibilm09; 22-10-15 at 11:49 AM.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by talibilm09 View Post


    Serada these are general warnings every religion give even Hinduism , sikhism etc but I am a talking about Concrete STERN warnings and and Code when we talk about our holy books like these.


    The Prophet (pbuh) said, "It is enough for a man to prove himself a liar when he goes on narrating whatever he hears." [Sahih Muslim]

    Sayyidina Jundub ibn Abdullah (RA) reported that Allah’s Messenger (SAW) said, “If any one speaks on the Qur’an giving his own opinion and even if he is correct, he has done wrong.”[Abu Dawud 3652]


    Ibn Abbas (RA) narrated that the Prophet (SAW) said, “Guard against narrating hadith frome except what you know definitely. He who forges a lie against me deliberately must find his seat in the Fire.”[Ahmed 2675]


    And Many many WARNINGS more like these deters us recklessly to write anything about our Religion EXCEPT the TRUTH because all what we are doing here on the ummah is to please our Lord and Salvation and Paradise, and what will be the use if we spend hours writing ultimately to fall in Hell ? In that case we better do not write at all . when people fall in arguments, to prove their point they twist verses, misquote them and insert their own words so There is stern warning of Hell FIRE at which writers like me are at stake so that's why If you had noted I will always use the word '' Something Like '' when quoting the Hadiths since our WORDS are not those exact words though my Text may mean the same.

    Hope you will find the difference about in what I claim and Muslims are the most careful in quoting Holy books.
    Revelation 22:18-19

    18 I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy in this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will strike him with the plagues that are written in this book. 19 If anyone takes away any words from the book of this prophecy, God will take away his portion of the tree of life and the holy city that are described in this book.

    Do you mean a warning along the same lines as this one above? If we add or change or do not in truth relay the message God revealed in the Bible, we'll be struck by plagues and eternal life denied us. That's a pretty strong clear message to me and an incentive to abide by Gods truth.

    Is the Bible a Holy Book? If you feel it is then you should accord it the same respect and reverence that you would your own Holy Book. To be honest, you haven't on the whole shown this in many of your posts dealing with Biblical scripture.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    peace be on you

    the comforter is none other than muhammad pbuh because the holy spirit was already with john and jesus peace be on them. and jesus pbuh said if i do not go the comforter will not come, but if i go the comforter will come. the spirit of truth will come and he will only speak what he hears this fits muhammad pbuh perfectly as he only recited the words he heard from gabriael ,


    peace be on you.
    Last edited by cloud9; 18-01-16 at 01:21 PM.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    deutronomy 18:8 the book of moses pbuh says he will be like unto me, this means he will be like moses and not jesus christ pbuh because both muhammad and moses had natural births, both fought in battles, both died natural deaths, and both were law givers. whereas jesus christ was born miraculously, he did not bring a new law, he did not die a natural death and he did not fight in any battles. also both moses and muhammad were accepted by their people whereas jesus christ pbuh was rejected by the jews. so you see moses speaks of a prophet to come like unto him and not like unto jesus christ pbuh. and deutronomy is of the old testament, the torah.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by cloud9 View Post
    peace be on you

    the comforter is none other than muhammad pbuh because the holy spirit was already with john and jesus peace be on them. and jesus pbuh said if i do not go the comforter will not come, but if i go the comforter will come. the spirit of truth will come and he will only speak what he hears this fits muhammad pbuh perfectly as he only recited the words he heard from gabriael ,


    peace be on you.
    If you read through this thread you will see how it is NOT possible that Muhammed could ever have been the comforter referred to by Jesus. Firstly, context shows that Jesus was addressing the disciples in this verse - did Muhammed ever meet or know the disciples? - No.

    God would send the Spirit in Jesus' name to the disciples, to equip them for their mission by bringing to remembrance all Jesus had taught them during His time with them. Did Muhammed hear Jesus teachings first hand? No. Muhammed was not born until six centuries later.

    The Bible shows the disciples received the Spirit (as promised) at Pentecost about forty days after the resurrection, we know this because they then went forth and preached the Gospel of Jesus and by the time Muhammed was born six centuries later the Gospel was already widespread in the lands. Did Muhammed assist with this task? No, he brought a different message.

    The same Gabriel who announced that Mary's child would be named of Jesus and He would be Son of The most High, that His Kingdom would last forever ? Why do you think Gabriel was the spirit of truth? Angels are only messengers.

    The Spirit Jesus referred to was The Holy Spirit.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    These comparisons you make can apply equally to many of the prophets or Kings at that time. The fact it's in the Old Testament shows it referred to Jesus. Deuteronomy 18 is a messianic prophecy Moses was talking of a prophet God would raise from the breath den of the Israelite. Not a prophet from the Arabs, Moses was claiming the prophet would be Messiah, Muhammed never claimed to be Messiah. The link below explains the similarities between Moses and Jesus at a greater depth and explains how Jesus fulfilled this prophecy of Moses. I hope you take the time to read it.

    http://www.messiahrevealed.org/deuteronomy.html

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    peace be upon you

    jesus christ pbuh did not die on the cross therefore there is no question of resurrection. and if jesus is god and he died on the cross who looked after the world while he was dead for three days.
    jesus christ pbuh prayed to god to save him and god's will was done, god raised him to heaven. god would not give jesus christ pbuh such a cruel and painful death, this is god's justice.

    peace be upon you.
    Last edited by cloud9; 18-01-16 at 11:25 PM.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    peace be upon you my brother pip

    the link that you have posted does not show all the differences between moses pbuh and jesus christ pbuh and all the similarities between moses pbuh and muhammad pbuh as i have stated

    if jesus christ pbuh was god who said be to create him and who did jesus pbuh cry out to when he said elah elah thou hast forsaken me. and how can jesus pbuh be god and the son of god at the same time. and how can god have a mother?

    peace be with you

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    muhammad pbuh came from the first born of abraham pbuh ismail pbuh the son of hagar and moses pbuh came from the second son of sarah isaac therefore moses pbuh and muhammad pbuh were cousins hence the scripture states that he will raise one from amongst them from their own brethren. muhammad came from the ismailites and moses came from the isrealites.
    Last edited by cloud9; 19-01-16 at 02:21 AM.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by cloud9 View Post
    peace be upon you

    jesus christ pbuh did not die on the cross therefore there is no question of resurrection. and if jesus is god and he died on the cross who looked after the world while he was dead for three days.
    jesus christ pbuh prayed to god to save him and god's will was done, god raised him to heaven. god would not give jesus christ pbuh such a cruel and painful death, this is god's justice.

    peace be upon you.
    Cloud 9. The crucifixion is the most certain proven fact about Jesus. He died and was raised again on the third day as Scripture prophesied He would and Jesus Himself stated He would. You are free to reject it but you do so against all evidence. Jesus dies that you may live. God looked after the world as without God behind creation the world would cease to be. Yes, God raised Him to heaven. After three days the resurrected Christ in His glorified state returned from whence He came - God. It's Gods mercy and love for us that Jesus endured such pain. Jesus gave Himself for us as it was Gods will.

    The Qur'an offers no alternative satisfactory explanation for the crucifixion. It's almost like a mans view, that somehow cannot understand how a merciful God would allow a prophet to suffer. That's a small view. You need to think bigger. Gods ways are not our ways.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    so you think that because jesus died for the sins of the world then there is no accountability and we can do what we want

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by cloud9 View Post
    peace be upon you my brother pip

    the link that you have posted does not show all the differences between moses pbuh and jesus christ pbuh and all the similarities between moses pbuh and muhammad pbuh as i have stated

    if jesus christ pbuh was god who said be to create him and who did jesus pbuh cry out to when he said elah elah thou hast forsaken me. and how can jesus pbuh be god and the son of god at the same time. and how can god have a mother?

    peace be with you

    It shows important difference and similarities. Many prophets and kings fought wars, they all came to die a natural death and for sure all were the result of a natural birth. Jesus fulfilled the law.

    I can see you're trying to understand, God created everything by His word, Jesus IS the word not A word but the Word. Scripture shows that Jesus is the "Be" (as you think of Gods word in relation to creation) that God spoke everything into being.

    Jesus said, "Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?" that is, "My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?"

    First of all, Jesus quoted Psalm 22:1, which begins with, "My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?" Jesus quoted this Psalm in order to draw attention to it and the fact that He was fulfilling it there on the cross. Consider verses 11-18 in Psalm 22:

    "Be not far from me, for trouble is near; For there is none to help. 12 Many bulls have surrounded me; Strong bulls of Bashan have encircled me. 13 They open wide their mouth at me, As a ravening and a roaring lion. 14 I am poured out like water, And all my bones are out of joint. My heart is like wax; It is melted within me. 15 My strength is dried up like a potsherd, and my tongue cleaves to my jaws; And Thou dost lay me in the dust of death. 16 For dogs have surrounded me; A band of evildoers has encompassed me. They pierced my hands and my feet. 17 I can count all my bones. They look, they stare at me; 18 They divide my garments among them, And for my clothing they cast lots."

    This was written about a thousand years before the crucifixion of Jesus. You ask the question, so now do you think Jesus was crucified?

    Rather than Son of God think God the Son. See the difference? Christians believe Jesus is Gods word made flesh, fully God and fully man. Mary was a chosen human vessel to bring the word (Jesus) into the world. You could say the Jesus is the human vessel that revealed Gods nature to mankind.

    God doesn't have a mother, God is eternal and uncreated. The humanity that was Jesus had a mother - Mary. Try to separate the spiritual from the physical. Hope that goes some way to answer your questions.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by cloud9 View Post
    muhammad pbuh came from the first born of abraham pbuh ismail pbuh the son of hagar and moses pbuh came from the second son of sarah isaac therefore moses pbuh and muhammad pbuh were cousins hence the scripture states that he will raise one from amongst them from their own brethren. muhammad came from the ismailites and moses came from the isrealites.

    Deuteronomy is a Bible book, so in order to be correct regards context you need to see how the term brethren was used in the Bible. It was always used for the Israelites descendants of Isaac and not Ishmaelite's. God said it was through Isaac that prophets and Kings would come. Gods promise to Ishmael was different. His descendants would be many and be a great nation. No promise of any prophets.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    god cannot be mortal and immortal at the same time and if jesus was god and died on the cross who looked after the world while he was dead
    Last edited by cloud9; 20-01-16 at 01:36 AM.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    if jesus pbuh is the word than who said be to create him

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by cloud9 View Post
    so you think that because jesus died for the sins of the world then there is no accountability and we can do what we want

    No, absolutely not. God gives us provision of a saviour to meet His divine justice, He pays the penalty on our behalf out of love for us. Only God can do this. In order to be worthy of this grace we have to be truly repentant in our hearts. We live our lives in Jesus, it's not enough to say we believe in Jesus, we need to live our lives through Him as best we can. His two commandments to us are to love God with all our hearts and all our souls and to love our neighbours as ourselves. If we love as this we don't want to live a life of sin, because that is disobedience to God and if we truly love God as Jesus commands we do, then we do not want to disobey Him. We want to live our lives to the glory of God as best we can, and when we fail, which for sure we will sometimes. We need to be repentant... Without that how can we hope for forgiveness. Without the blood of the Lamb of God (Jesus) we are dead in our sin. If we have the Christ we have life.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    jesus christ pbuh said love the lord your god with all your heart and all your soul, he was talking about the creator and not about himself

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by cloud9 View Post
    if jesus pbuh is the word than who said be to create him

    The word is eternal and uncreated as God is eternal and uncreated. There was not a time when the word of God did not exist. How do you see God without His word?

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    Quote Originally Posted by cloud9 View Post
    jesus christ pbuh said love the lord your god with all your heart and all your soul, he was talking about the creator and not about himself

    Yes. And your point is?

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    so jesus christ was not created in the womb of the virgin mary if you think he is god the uncreated word

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    god cannot be man and man cannot be god at the same time.nor at any other time. god cannot be mortal and immortal at the same time. you should worship the creator and not the created.

    there is a surah in the quran that describes god and it is as follows

    there is not god but allah the absolute
    the one and only
    none is born of him and niether is he born
    and there is none like him
    Last edited by cloud9; 20-01-16 at 01:58 AM.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    allah is eternal and uncreated. but jesus christ pbuh was created in the womb of the virgin mary. the creator does not look like anything of his creation. and does not eli eli sound like allah allah
    Last edited by cloud9; 20-01-16 at 02:17 AM.

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    Re: Talibilm.. Reasons why the Comforter cannot be Mohammed

    and you say that the virgin mary was only a vessel, so she was not the mother of jesus christ pbuh who suckled him, dressed him and washed him and fed him when he was growing up

    also you say that the virgin mary is the mother of god, not that god needs a mother, so she could not have been a vessel
    Last edited by cloud9; 20-01-16 at 02:33 AM.

 

 

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