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  1. #1
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    Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Asalamu Alaikum,

    I was wondering if anyone on here knew of any Hajj groups for women? I dont have a mahram to travel with but I would love to go for Hajj this year and the visas etc are already sorted for me.
    Have any of the women on here traveled with a group of other women that was safe/organized and had enough resources to provide for guidance etc?

    I have seen Umrah groups of women traveling with scholars in the past, and that seemed very beneficial.

    Ive been googling...unsuccessfully, so any information would be very helpful inshallah.

    I am not looking for a discussion on whether or not it is permissible for women to perform Hajj without a mahram, thank you.

    Looking forward to hearing back from you all, jazakallah

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    Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    When my dad went to hajj we found a group of men in Hajj he went along with them

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    Saudi Arabia taqwa435's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Quote Originally Posted by missRainydays25 View Post
    Asalamu Alaikum,

    I was wondering if anyone on here knew of any Hajj groups for women? I dont have a mahram to travel with but I would love to go for Hajj this year and the visas etc are already sorted for me.
    Have any of the women on here traveled with a group of other women that was safe/organized and had enough resources to provide for guidance etc?

    I have seen Umrah groups of women traveling with scholars in the past, and that seemed very beneficial.

    Ive been googling...unsuccessfully, so any information would be very helpful inshallah.

    I am not looking for a discussion on whether or not it is permissible for women to perform Hajj without a mahram, thank you.

    Looking forward to hearing back from you all, jazakallah
    err..visas are already sorted for you? How?

    Anyways, Not permissible. And no sane member on this forum will direct you to such agents. It's not permissible.

    Khalaas

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    Saudi Arabia taqwa435's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Quote Originally Posted by Elyaouti900 View Post
    When my dad went to hajj we found a group of men in Hajj he went along with them
    Yes, me don't require mahrams to perform hajj.

    only women.

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    Odan Ismail Simjee's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Quote Originally Posted by taqwa435 View Post
    err..visas are already sorted for you? How?

    Anyways, Not permissible. And no sane member on this forum will direct you to such agents. It's not permissible.

    Khalaas
    Very eloquently put Taqwa. I could'nt have said it any better.

    Women wanting to perform haj "without" mehrim and dont want to know whether it is permissable ??? Yeah right.

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    Odan Ismail Simjee's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Quote Originally Posted by taqwa435 View Post
    Yes, me don't require mahrams to perform hajj.

    only women.
    I think Elyaouti900 need to read and re-read the comments s/he posts here. I cant make any sense of what is being suggested.

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    Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    I have never been to Hajj

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    Member Zulkifli's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ismail Simjee View Post
    Women wanting to perform haj "without" mehrim and dont want to know whether it is permissable ??? Yeah right.
    I think OP meant she was not looking for a discussion whether it is permissible or not, probably she has already found fatwa allowing travel based on her circumstances? I Googled and found the following:

    reported by al-Bukari in his Sahih, that Omar (ra) gave permission to the wives of the Prophet (pbuh) to perform hajj. He sent Othman Ibn-Affan and Abdul-Rahaman to accompany them. Omar, Othman, Abudl-Rahman along with the Prophet’s wives, all approved it. Nobody of the companions denied what they did. This is considered unanimous resolution.
    I am not saying every women can use this as each circumstances differ.

    All I can say is, always travel with a Mahram.

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    Odan Ismail Simjee's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zulkifli View Post
    I think OP meant she was not looking for a discussion whether it is permissible or not, probably she has already found fatwa allowing travel based on her circumstances? I Googled and found the following:



    I am not saying every women can use this as each circumstances differ.

    All I can say is, always travel with a Mahram.
    Many thanks for your attempt to clarify. Unfortunately your clarification is based on what you "think" OP is saying whereas it is crystal clear she does not want anyone to remind her about the permissability of her intended objective.

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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    May Allah guide us all and help us be on the right path.

    http://islamqa.info/en/34380

    I understand that OP did not want discussion on the subject - but clearly it is not allowed and should not even be considered, no matter what the circumstances may be. And of course, one should not help someone in doing a forbidden act.

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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ismail Simjee View Post
    Many thanks for your attempt to clarify. Unfortunately your clarification is based on what you "think" OP is saying whereas it is crystal clear she does not want anyone to remind her about the permissibility of her intended objective.
    Actually he was right. I know what I am basing the permissibility of my intended Hajj upon, not that I feel the need to share it here as none of you are my mahrams and have no say in where/when/with whom I travel.

    My visas are already sorted because my father works in Saudi and has for a very long time, visas/permissions are not the problem for me.

    I just want to know if there are groups of organized women that go for Hajj. I would prefer people that they were focused on studying/guidance, spoke English and were committed to really making the most of their Hajj experience. Otherwise Id just travel with a Saudi group (which I have done before and found it to be less than beneficial).

    Again, if anyone has any information that would help me Id appreciate it. All the brothers that want to tell me what is permissible for me, without knowing my situation or what me and my father are relying upon, I would encourage you to put those efforts where they belong...with the women youre actually responsible for.

    Thankyou

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    Saudi Arabia taqwa435's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Quote Originally Posted by missRainydays25 View Post
    Actually he was right. I know what I am basing the permissibility of my intended Hajj upon, not that I feel the need to share it here as none of you are my mahrams and have no say in where/when/with whom I travel.

    My visas are already sorted because my father works in Saudi and has for a very long time, visas/permissions are not the problem for me.

    I just want to know if there are groups of organized women that go for Hajj. I would prefer people that they were focused on studying/guidance, spoke English and were committed to really making the most of their Hajj experience. Otherwise Id just travel with a Saudi group (which I have done before and found it to be less than beneficial).

    Again, if anyone has any information that would help me Id appreciate it. All the brothers that want to tell me what is permissible for me, without knowing my situation or what me and my father are relying upon, I would encourage you to put those efforts where they belong...with the women youre actually responsible for.

    Thankyou
    sorry, we aren't quoting what we deem is correct. Rather, we are telling you what our religion states.

    If your father word in Saudi....well there you go you have a mahram! You can visit him via family visa and then perform hajj with him.

    As mentioned no hajj umrah agent will allow sisters to perform hajj with thier group without a mahram.

    maybe speak to your local Imam or a shaikh whom you trust seeing as you're not understanding that no umrah hajj agent will allow a sister to perform hajj with them without a mahram!

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    Saudi Arabia taqwa435's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zulkifli View Post
    I think OP meant she was not looking for a discussion whether it is permissible or not, probably she has already found fatwa allowing travel based on her circumstances? I Googled and found the following:



    I am not saying every women can use this as each circumstances differ.

    All I can say is, always travel with a Mahram.
    Err...yes we know what the OP said in her post


    However sorry it's not permissible to perform an without mahram, maybe she needs to speak to her local imam or a trustworthy shaikh for furher clarification.

    I mean of umrah hajj agents allowed sisters to perform with them without a mahram, this would be very well known in the UK, but no agent will accept this.

    Our religion is easy walhamdulilah,

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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Assalamou Alaikoum Sister
    I think going with a mehram is the safest way to be honest even in Maccah the things are not as safe as here for a single women the SKA have applied this rules to safeguard the single women from being left to themselves there and also before I would say about a 50 years ago you do not see women in Hajj at all but nowadays the Ulama have allowed this to happen anyway sister if you do not have mehram I do not think you are required to perform hajj as a men if it was not a requirement I would not go for so many issues there and here it is not easy even for a men it is becoming a source of business people are getting opportunity from it even some state it is a source of about $2.5billion dollars every years so through what I have read here in the forum and elswhere it is becoming more a package holiday than ibadha people are looking for 5starts hotel full package and etc.... what to say about the best of all of us the Prophet Mohammed SALA ALAHO ALAIHI WA SALAM VERY STRANGE TIME INDEED

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    Member Zulkifli's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Quote Originally Posted by taqwa435 View Post
    Err...yes we know what the OP said in her post


    However sorry it's not permissible to perform an without mahram, maybe she needs to speak to her local imam or a trustworthy shaikh for furher clarification.

    I mean of umrah hajj agents allowed sisters to perform with them without a mahram, this would be very well known in the UK, but no agent will accept this.

    Our religion is easy walhamdulilah,
    I agree, I wouldn't encourage anyone to travel without Mahram, please see my last sentence in my post.

    All I can say is, always travel with a Mahram.

  16. #16
    Odan Ismail Simjee's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Quote Originally Posted by missRainydays25 View Post
    Actually he was right. I know what I am basing the permissibility of my intended Hajj upon, not that I feel the need to share it here as none of you are my mahrams and have no say in where/when/with whom I travel.

    My visas are already sorted because my father works in Saudi and has for a very long time, visas/permissions are not the problem for me.

    I just want to know if there are groups of organized women that go for Hajj. I would prefer people that they were focused on studying/guidance, spoke English and were committed to really making the most of their Hajj experience. Otherwise Id just travel with a Saudi group (which I have done before and found it to be less than beneficial).

    Again, if anyone has any information that would help me Id appreciate it. All the brothers that want to tell me what is permissible for me, without knowing my situation or what me and my father are relying upon, I would encourage you to put those efforts where they belong...with the women youre actually responsible for.

    Thankyou

    I encourage you to put your efforts where they belong - learn the Deen first. You will discover that the Deen makes it obligatory on everyone not only to abide by the laws of the Deen but also the laws of the country we reside in and the one we visit as their guests.

    Clearly you are determined to flount both.

    The Saudi government explicitly forbids anyone to perform haj without proper permission. You appear to have acquired a visit visa, based on your father's stay status in Saudia, and to use it - sorry abuse it - by performing haj.

    If you want to learn the Deen, as you also appear to be suggesting, there are better ways and means to do so like joining a college etc.

  17. #17
    Sit on my sofa I dare you chameleon's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    I know what the OP is alluding to. In fact I was gonna do the same thing this year too.

    I was gonna visit my brother in KSA, like I have a couple of times in the past, using a visitor visa provided by him thru his employer. This visitor visa unlike the Hajj and Umrah visa allows you to travel all over KSA unhindered. This is very handy cos the last 2 times I've done Umrah has been off season meaning after Hajj when the whole place is closed off to foreign pilgrims and only locals are allowed in. I was gonna visit him in Dammam, where he lives, and was then gonna tag along with a local Hajj group (called a Hamla). In the past this was very easy. The leader of the group handles all the Hajj permits cos even local Saudis need permits to do Hajj. Lots of expats use this method to send visiting relatives on Hajj.

    The above was the plan. But about 4-5 months ago, my brother told me the authorities there have clamped down very hard, and that it would be difficult to use this route. Hence I'm doing it the conventional way from the UK this year.
    Last edited by chameleon; 16-09-13 at 12:14 AM.

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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Salam, hajj of a woman cannot be performed without the presence of Mehram, and Sharia command us to follow in this way. It is not like a service that can be availed against some money.

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    Odan
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Assalamou Aalikoum bro Ismail
    I do not agree the way she is saying the things but bro you must understand she is just asking be soft please do not use the word abuse, she is not abusing anything if she wanted to go alone she would have already tried without asking the Islam point of view from people who seemingly know about Islam chariaa so bro the Prophete sala Allahou Alaihi wa salam use always to answer people without being as dictate

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    Odan Ismail Simjee's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Quote Originally Posted by BENTALHA View Post
    Assalamou Aalikoum bro Ismail
    I do not agree the way she is saying the things but bro you must understand she is just asking be soft please do not use the word abuse, she is not abusing anything if she wanted to go alone she would have already tried without asking the Islam point of view from people who seemingly know about Islam chariaa so bro the Prophete sala Allahou Alaihi wa salam use always to answer people without being as dictate
    Bentalha, your intentions are, MashaAllah, good but that is not matched by your command of english language.

    Some of the thing you have written, itself, gives rise to concern. However, I can see that your poor english is the reason and not your intentions.

    The word "abuse" has different connotations same as Arabic language and it depends in what circumstances certain words, such as the one I used, are employed and meant to be understood.

    The sister clearly intends to perform Haj without a mehrim. That is an "mis-use or abuse" of the Islamic law. The sister also intend to enter Saudi Arabia on a visitor visa but the central aim is to perform Haj. That is a "mis-use or abuse" of the visa.

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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Assalamou alaikoum Brother Ismail
    I meant what I have written I assume that you have understood what I wanted to say this is not personal just would like to be fair in explaining the Islam Chariaa who ever have the intellectual ability and attended schools, lectures from Ulamah etc.... this is said so we can answer to our sister request politely and according to all Ulamas And Islamic Fiqh this is not possible and try to explain that by some Ahadith and Ayates and the problem is resolved. for the case if she is abusing the system or not you are not the King of Saudi Arabia to judge this matter it is none of your business.

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    Odan Ismail Simjee's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Quote Originally Posted by BENTALHA View Post
    Assalamou alaikoum Brother Ismail
    I meant what I have written I assume that you have understood what I wanted to say this is not personal just would like to be fair in explaining the Islam Chariaa who ever have the intellectual ability and attended schools, lectures from Ulamah etc.... this is said so we can answer to our sister request politely and according to all Ulamas And Islamic Fiqh this is not possible and try to explain that by some Ahadith and Ayates and the problem is resolved. for the case if she is abusing the system or not you are not the King of Saudi Arabia to judge this matter it is none of your business.


    King of Saudi Arabia? Me? No thank you.

    You are being personal and very insolent too and not for the first time either.

    I know my Deen, thank you.

    I dont think it is any of your business telling me what is in accordance with Islam as you are not The Shaikh ul Islam or head of Al Azhar University or any similar institution.

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    Odan
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Assalam Brother
    Allah soubhanouhou wa taala said: Wa Qool Rabi Zidni Ilma - و قـل ربـي زدنـي عـلـمـا
    Please this is not personal please it is just charing ideas please

  24. #24
    Odan Ismail Simjee's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Quote Originally Posted by BENTALHA View Post
    Assalam Brother
    Allah soubhanouhou wa taala said: Wa Qool Rabi Zidni Ilma - و قـل ربـي زدنـي عـلـمـا
    Please this is not personal please it is just charing ideas please
    Which translates as " And say (to Allah) Increase in me knowledge".

    What has this Ayah and a Du'a got to do with your very personal attack on me telling me I was not King of Saudi Arabia and that it was none of my business?

    Now that you tried to introduce a diversory tactic I will bring you back on track, InshaAllah, with quoting another very crucial Ayah from The Noble Qur'an:

    Surah Al Ahzab..70~71:

    Ya “ay-yuha al-ladhina “amanu it-taqu Allaha wa-qulu qawlan sadida

    Which, when translated, means

    O you who have Taqwa in Allah, when you speak, speak straight.

    I have spoken straight to this sister and have used appropriate words to describe her intentions. That does not warrant a personal attack on me from you. Do you understand?

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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    I agree with uncle Simjee. If we see a wrong act, it is our duty as muslims to advise our brothers and sisters about it. We cannot just assume that they already have knowledge. At the end of the day, it's our job to help each other to be better muslims. We have the nobel Quran, the hadith, the rest is up to us.

    And I am sure as muslims we cannot go against the law of the country we are in (providing it doesnt contradict Islam)!
    Last edited by moona; 18-09-13 at 12:47 PM.

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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Assalamou alaikoum
    In any case to end this discussion all what matteris my point , your point and to be fair where is Allah point, 'Indeed Allah looked into the hearts of the servants and found the heart of the heart of the Muhammad (p.b.u.h.) to be the best of the hearts of His servants and so He chose him for himself and sent him as a messenger….. so i hope i end with that Allah clean our hearts from a sin and egoisim and nifak please Allah help us to believe on you and only on you and not in any one else for interest or other things please arina al haka haka wa arzoukna itibaaouh
    Assalam Brother and full stop

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    Saudi Arabia taqwa435's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    I received a Pm from bentalatoo.

    Like really?! Who are you advising us as though we have wronged the sister, when this isn't the case at all.

    I wish people would stop messaging me nonsense.


    anyways, final piece. Feel free to read the below opinions.

    http://islamqa.info/en/5207
    http://islamqa.info/en/52703

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    Odan
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Last edited by BENTALHA; 18-09-13 at 07:39 PM. Reason: pm

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    Odan Ismail Simjee's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Bentalha, I very much hope it was indeed a last comment from you. You still could not resist a final dig by implying I or others have ego. You are fooling nobody but yourself by quoting all sort of irrelevant quotes just to support your ridiculous argument.

    You are going on Haj, from the PM you sent me, and I hope it is accepted by Allah-SWT and that you return back thoughly cleaned of sins and this current hypocrisy you so clearly demonstrated.
    Last edited by Ismail Simjee; 18-09-13 at 07:11 PM. Reason: spelling

  30. #30
    Saudi Arabia taqwa435's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Quote Originally Posted by BENTALHA View Post
    What nonsense is this? Your pm was a copy and paste of what you said to Ismail.

    thank you very much. Nothing personal about it.

  31. #31
    Odan Ismail Simjee's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    The use of a nauseating icon on another demonstrates that you are indeed a hypocrite, Bentalha. You proved that very clearly.

    Taqwa is a sister. I am sure she does not need your advise on what that term means.

    Worry about your own Taqwa and, if you find time, try and learn the english language if you wish to use it for your communications.

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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Assalam all

    We have Failed the test;
    1-the question was {does women can perform Hajj Alone?? } According to Islamic Sharia the answer is no without Mahrem full stop
    2- through various points of view given by members in the forum some have given there answer with a big ((No) without giving any further source of references in Fiqh Al Islami
    3-remember brothers this a forum open to a billion of people over the world freely to read and comments as they wish and according to there believes
    4- open mind should direct the forum, we have to expect some different point of views,
    5- after few days and challenges the heat went up
    6- our ego took over
    7-Start stamping with words like hypocrite, etc...............................................
    8- if this was happen between two Muslims countries this would have ended in war?? Aoudhou bi Allah
    9-So brothers we should say the wrongs is on us as Muslims??
    10- We still do not get the real message from the Prophet Mohammed
    11- just being niece and thankfull to Allah
    12-are we really a Muslims representing the continuity of this noble Religion????

    Assalamou Alaikoum

  33. #33
    Odan Ismail Simjee's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Ask these questions of yourself. The man with inflated ego telling others they are not King of Saudi Arabia and telling them to mind their own business?Is this what you practice and than you preach something else to others?

    You use smiley icon vomiting on Taqwa? You send outrageous comment in private PMs.

    Does that not make you a hypocrite?

    You keep referring to Allah, Our Nabi-pbuh-, and Hadith and quote from Qura'n but fail to follow what the Qur'an requires from you?

    And you said it was your last message but continue?

  34. #34
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Assalamou alaikoum
    Brother ismail I have not send any outrageous PM Allah is my witness also for Taqwa I BELIEVE he is a man (read above his messageNo4) -responding to this thread also the English is my mother tongue but I try to excel in Arabic the language of the NOBLE Quran I even try not to think in English anymore???????? BECauSE THE DAY i meet Allah in Chaa Allah we all will be addressing Allah in Arabic isn't? it is the language of the Paradise. anyway who will be allowed to enter after their sins have been forgiven well the one who have no hate in there heart, commited crime, spoiled people, nore loved this life will be allowed the others Allah Aalamou bi their destinations.....................
    Last edited by BENTALHA; 19-09-13 at 07:06 AM.

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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Reading through this thread made it so clear why muslims have trouble uniting. Their understanding of religion starts seeming rigid, inflexible, dictatory and limited ( which is nothing like Islam in my opinion) when muslims impose on eachother how they should live their lives and see each other as ignorant of their own religion. It´s precisely why so many new converts leave Islam. That would mean its on you!

    I really don´t think the prophet made people feel the way we muslims make each other feel ( stupid, foolish, ignorant and irresponsible and in need). If any of you are familiar with philosophy you´d be familiar with the idea of a self fulfilling prophecy. Treat people like they will make a mess out of things and they probably will. I mean seriously, If you talk to someone like they need your wisdom, who are you doing favors here, the person youre talking to or your inflated ego and distorted image of self importance? Most of us help each other because it makes us feel good, its those who help each other making each other feel good and inspired that actually see positive results. If the results you see are negative, check your intentions.


    General message: Check yourselves, please.

  36. #36
    اصبر aynina's Avatar
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    Re: Women's Hajj Groups/Packages?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hindaq View Post
    Reading through this thread made it so clear why muslims have trouble uniting. Their understanding of religion starts seeming rigid, inflexible, dictatory and limited ( which is nothing like Islam in my opinion) when muslims impose on eachother how they should live their lives and see each other as ignorant of their own religion. It´s precisely why so many new converts leave Islam. That would mean its on you!

    I really don´t think the prophet made people feel the way we muslims make each other feel ( stupid, foolish, ignorant and irresponsible and in need). If any of you are familiar with philosophy you´d be familiar with the idea of a self fulfilling prophecy. Treat people like they will make a mess out of things and they probably will. I mean seriously, If you talk to someone like they need your wisdom, who are you doing favors here, the person youre talking to or your inflated ego and distorted image of self importance? Most of us help each other because it makes us feel good, its those who help each other making each other feel good and inspired that actually see positive results. If the results you see are negative, check your intentions.


    General message: Check yourselves, please.
    How can we unite upon other than the truth
    يَٰٓأَيُّهَا ٱلنَّاسُ ٱعْبُدُوا۟ رَبَّكُمُ ٱلَّذِى خَلَقَكُمْ وَٱلَّذِينَ مِن قَبْلِكُمْ لَعَلَّكُمْ تَتَّقُونَ

    O mankind, worship your Lord, who created you and those before you, that you may become righteous

    Surah Al Baqarah ayah 21

 

 

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