Is it OK for a Muslim woman to see a male Gynecologist??

[saadullahkhan]

Is it OK for a Muslim woman to see a male Gynecologist? Lots of Muslim woman doing it, not just in the west but even if they live in Asia and other parts of the world as well. I know for fact that the Prime Minister of a Islamic Republic country had a male Gynecologist and he delivered her baby (atleast one, probably rest of them too).

Also is it OK for a Muslim woman to get the Mammogram done by a male? Similarly, other exams and treatment in which they have to show or let the male Doctor touch their private parts?

[nousername]

A female should really be the practitioner in all cases, and a male only when there are no females around.

[.mirror.]

Treating a Female Patient's Genital Areas

Doctors and the Issue of Seclusion with the Opposite Gender

Those help.

[saadullahkhan]

Treating a Female Patient's Genital Areas

Doctors and the Issue of Seclusion with the Opposite Gender

Those help.

Thanks for your good reference brother. The position according to shariah is understandable but there still is a lot of grey area in this. And when it is like this, a lot of confusions and misinterpretations comes in.

Well, the main concern is, most of the times these days there are options available to particularly ask for a male doctor, gynecologist or a radiologist/technician, but I have commonly seen and heard cases where women don't bother to put any effort to ask or look for a male doctor. In some cases, women by their choice or preference, engage male Gynecologist etc. (like the example of a female Prime Minister of an Islamic Republic. Well, in most cases, it is becoming so common among the women to show 'don't care, male or female' attitude. For this, I would encourage Muslim brothers and sisters on the forum to share their thoughts and experiences and some examples.

[.mirror.]

Well, the main concern is, most of the times these days there are options available to particularly ask for a female doctor, gynecologist or a radiologist/technician, but I have commonly seen and heard cases where women don't bother to put any effort to ask or look for a female doctor.

I'm confused. Do you mean female doctor?

[.: Anna :.]

Thanks for your good reference brother. The position according to shariah is understandable but there still is a lot of grey area in this. And when it is like this, a lot of confusions and misinterpretations comes in.

Well, the main concern is, most of the times these days there are options available to particularly ask for a male doctor, gynecologist or a radiologist/technician, but I have commonly seen and heard cases where women don't bother to put any effort to ask or look for a male doctor. In some cases, women by their choice or preference, engage male Gynecologist etc. (like the example of a female Prime Minister of an Islamic Republic. Well, in most cases, it is becoming so common among the women to show 'don't care, male or female' attitude. For this, I would encourage Muslim brothers and sisters on the forum to share their thoughts and experiences and some examples.

of course that is wrong, if we can ask for a female we should do so. male drs is for necessity

[Massilia]

I have trouble finding a female practitioner in here i dont even imagine what it must be elsewhere. Btw it's not something new, Muslim women before had male doctors even under Caliphate so i guess they had to deal with it. No joke with health.

[naila-k]

the problem is it is hard to find females in these fields, because of the length of study required etc, and most women after 6 years uni, then specialising and then practicing for a few years, then take career breaks for family and kids.

[Peacenik]

I wonder what Muslimah would actually see a male practitioner in relation to this ?

Gynecology is a fairly new area in medicine. Have there been any instances in the past of Muslimahs being treated for this, whether from male or female gynecologists (if they existed that is) ?

And wonder why any male would go into this 'profession' in the first place.... ?

[~ Jumana ~]

I wonder what Muslimah would actually see a male practitioner in relation to this ?

Gynecology is a fairly new area in medicine. Have there been any instances in the past of Muslimahs being treated for this, whether from male or female gynecologists (if they existed that is) ?

And wonder why any male would go into this 'profession' in the first place.... ?

I keep asking myself the same question , not only that but whether his work would be halal especially if he was a muslim that COULD choose a different medical field (pediatric, surgical , dermatology , etc) !

[Peacenik]

I keep asking myself the same question , not only that but whether his work would be halal especially if he was a muslim that COULD choose a different medical field (pediatric, surgical , dermatology , etc) !

As a Muslim, I could never see myself working in the 'profession' of gynecology.

[sis_niqabi]

if you can't find a female gyno then it's permissible. but you should only go to a male gyno if you absolutely need to like if you are pregnant or having some serious female issues.

al humduillah i think nowadays it's easy to find a female gyno. the hospital i go to has a lot of female gynos on staff.

[Juvegirl]

In Canada it is usually your Family Doctor who performs the basic exams (pap/breast) and you go to a Gyno only if you have something more serious, like pregnancy, disease or complications in your sex organs.

You don't always have much of a choice here on who your doctor is, but alhamdulilah, all my doctors/therapists are female, except the podiatrist (food doctor).

[saadullahkhan]

In Canada it is usually your Family Doctor who performs the basic exams (pap/breast) and you go to a Gyno only if you have something more serious, like pregnancy, disease or complications in your sex organs.

You don't always have much of a choice here on who your doctor is, but alhamdulilah, all my doctors/therapists are female, except the podiatrist (food doctor).

Well, my inquiry is not just limited to the Gynecologists. That is more towards examining female private parts or such as delivering a baby, mammography, etc. etc., by a male Doctor. What the hell men are doing in these areas, particularly at this time and age? Where is the concern for the privacy and the hijaab of our wives, sisters and the women in general? Why men are still trying to go into this and chose to make it their career? Do women of this day have any objection or suggestion to discourage or stop this??

[naila-k]

its like i said, because women cant go in to these careers unless they are not going to have a family, due to the time needed to study, and if men dont go in to these careers then there would be a shortage of these professionals, which would not benefit women.

as a woman,how can i say to another woman, go out to work and study, for long hours, on call shifts, for over 15 years of your life, then once you qualifies you are already in mid 30s, and then you have a demanding career, and dont want to waste all those years studying so have to practice for the benefit of other women at the expense of having your own family?

[.mirror.]

Hmmm...that's why I think we need more female Muslimahs in these fields.

I guess, they can practice in this field, while they are married. It'd take a lot of sacrifice and patience from the husband, though.

[Damascus Girl]

First of all, most mammograms and vaginal ultrasounds are performed by female technicians. Maybe in asia or africa that is not the case, but certainly in North America.

So you already have options.

Secondly, there are more women than men in medical schools right now, at least in North America. I know there are similar statistics in Pakistan, believe it or not, and Iran is pretty close too.

Finally, gynecology is female-heavy. Many female doctors specialize in this area, whereas the men prefer things like surgery, cardiology, emergency medicine, etc.

So you always have options.

Now, I have no idea what the situation is in the arab or asian countries. If it is rare for women to practice or specialize in these countries, then you are out of luck. In fact, this is one of th ereasons why Afghanistan has such a high maternal death rate and infant mortality rate - the Taliban only allow the women to be treated by females, but they don't allow women into medical schools, and don't allow female doctors into the villages unless they are accompanied by a mehram. It is the pregnant women and babies that lose out because of this.

[~ Jumana ~]

First of all, most mammograms and vaginal ultrasounds are performed by female technicians. Maybe in asia or africa that is not the case, but certainly in North America.

So you already have options.

Secondly, there are more women than men in medical schools right now, at least in North America. I know there are similar statistics in Pakistan, believe it or not, and Iran is pretty close too.

Finally, gynecology is female-heavy. Many female doctors specialize in this area, whereas the men prefer things like surgery, cardiology, emergency medicine, etc.

So you always have options.

Now, I have no idea what the situation is in the arab or asian countries. If it is rare for women to practice or specialize in these countries, then you are out of luck. In fact, this is one of th ereasons why Afghanistan has such a high maternal death rate and infant mortality rate - the Taliban only allow the women to be treated by females, but they don't allow women into medical schools, and don't allow female doctors into the villages unless they are accompanied by a mehram. It is the pregnant women and babies that lose out because of this.

I know about UAE ....i can not think of even ONE male doctor who is a gynecologist.
It is not allowed here , alhamdulillah.

[naila-k]

Hmmm...that's why I think we need more female Muslimahs in these fields.

I guess, they can practice in this field, while they are married. It'd take a lot of sacrifice and patience from the husband, though.

unfortunately a lot of brothers dont think like this, and they say if we have non muslim women in these fields, so no need for muslim women to do it, or to encourage muslim women to do it, aka QMU

[Damascus Girl]

Hmmm...that's why I think we need more female Muslimahs in these fields.

I guess, they can practice in this field, while they are married. It'd take a lot of sacrifice and patience from the husband, though.

He will have a smart, knowledgeable wife who helps other women.

What kind of patience and sacrifices will be required of him?????

[.mirror.]

He will have a smart, knowledgeable wife who helps other women.

What kind of patience and sacrifices will be required of him?????

From what I know, doctors work odd hours and they might get call late at night and have to go. Plus, if she's a doctor, then it'll definitely mean she won't be spending as much time doing household chores as a wife who stay at home.

unfortunately a lot of brothers dont think like this, and they say if we have non muslim women in these fields, so no need for muslim women to do it, or to encourage muslim women to do it, aka QMU

I disagree with those brothers, then.

In fact, the awrah of a Muslim woman in Hanafi fiqh is same as in front of a man. So, by going to a non-Muslim woman doctor, even for something on her chest, she'd be revealing her awrah.

[naila-k]

He will have a smart, knowledgeable wife who helps other women.

What kind of patience and sacrifices will be required of him?????

erm a wife who is not around a lot, works long hours in a stressfull job, is often on call for 48 hours at a time, may have to sleep away from the home, having to delay children until she is in her mid to late 30s due to the time reqired for training, and then the children being put in childcare etc etc. it is a lot for a relationship to handle all that.

[Damascus Girl]

erm a wife who is not around a lot, works long hours in a stressfull job, is often on call for 48 hours at a time, may have to sleep away from the home, having to delay children until she is in her mid to late 30s due to the time reqired for training, and then the children being put in childcare etc etc. it is a lot for a relationship to handle all that.

Naila and brother Mirror:

You are both incorrect. Gynecology is actually quite lucrative because unlike specialities like cardiology, thoracic surgery, emergency medicine, etc, doctors can keep regular work hours, like 8 to 5 or 9 to 5. You are on call if you choose to have hospital privileges, but not all doctors do. Also, for many minor procedures, surgical procedures can actually be performed in the doctor's office; even day surgeries in hospitals shut down after 5 pm.

See, these are the myths associated with muslim male mindsets. As long as these myths exist, muslim women will be criticized for pursuing these specialized fields. The reality is, women are more patient and exacting, and have far more respectable "bedside manners", than men - hence would make wonderful doctors.

Regarding the "household chores", look around you. In many families, men and women work and their homes stay clean, their meals prepared and their children loved. Furthermore, Islam does not require that women actually get down on their hands and knees and scrub floors or brush toilets -- it suggest that women have control over the household domain. By control, they can hire assistance. As long as the job is getting done.

[Peacenik]

Whatever happened to Muslimahs of today living the lives of the female Sahabas (ra)

[parwaaz]

Around the world,women do face the issue pf not being able to find a female doctor/gynacologist.

However, here in the UK there should be no excuses at all. patients are now given the option to choose from varios hospitals, so you should opt for an appointment where you can see a female.

what I find very disturbing is male muslim gynacologists here in the UK!!!!what is the appeal, why would they train in that field knowing well it's be-hyaai...there is no shortage of female gynacologists, so they can well stay out of it!

[.mirror.]

You are both incorrect. Gynecology is actually quite lucrative because unlike specialities like cardiology, thoracic surgery, emergency medicine, etc, doctors can keep regular work hours, like 8 to 5 or 9 to 5. You are on call if you choose to have hospital privileges, but not all doctors do. Also, for many minor procedures, surgical procedures can actually be performed in the doctor's office; even day surgeries in hospitals shut down after 5 pm.

That's good Alhamdulillah, esp. for gynecologists.

See, these are the myths associated with muslim male mindsets. As long as these myths exist, muslim women will be criticized for pursuing these specialized fields. The reality is, women are more patient and exacting, and have far more respectable "bedside manners", than men - hence would make wonderful doctors.

I don't think it's OK to target men like this. Even sister Naila thought it would require patience from the husband. Plus, for women working in hospitals, it'd be different. They might be on-call at odd hours and they might not have full control over their schedules. So, it's not a full myth, there's some truth to it.

Maybe, women are more patient, but I'm not sure where bedside manners came from? How does that relate to her medical profession?

I don't doubt, however, that women would make great doctors, esp. in certain fields, like gynecology.

Regarding the "household chores", look around you. In many families, men and women work and their homes stay clean, their meals prepared and their children loved. Furthermore, Islam does not require that women actually get down on their hands and knees and scrub floors or brush toilets -- it suggest that women have control over the household domain. By control, they can hire assistance. As long as the job is getting done.

I hope you're right. I don't personally know any families like that.

[yusuf.]

hmm
Lucrative -yes

socialble hours?- hmm i dont know how the system works in your country sister, but in uk, the consultants still have to do night shifts in this speciality. i was recently speaking to a muslim brother whose a gynaecologist, and if i remember correctly he said his usual hours are around 7am to 7pm. without asking him directly (cos he might take it as an offense) i managed to elicit from him why he a "brother" went into this speciality - he said because he liked the variety of the job (medicine combined with surgery).

most gynaeocolists are male for some reason. One of my friends, again another practising brother, is saying he want to go into this speciality too!!!, his reasoning is he wants to save lives in poor countries by helping deliver babies (because alot of deaths happen in childbirth in 3rd world countries).

[.mirror.]

hmm
Lucrative -yes

socialble hours?- hmm i dont know how the system works in your country sister, but in uk, the consultants still have to do night shifts in this speciality. i was recently speaking to a muslim brother whose a gynaecologist, and if i remember correctly he said his usual hours are around 7am to 7pm. without asking him directly (cos he might take it as an offense) i managed to elicit from him why he a "brother" went into this speciality - he said because he liked the variety of the job (medicine combined with surgery).

most gynaeocolists are male for some reason. One of my friends, again another practising brother, is saying he want to go into this speciality too!!!, his reasoning is he wants to save lives in poor countries by helping deliver babies (because alot of deaths happen in childbirth in 3rd world countries).

Hmmm...that's interesting.

[SILURES]

would it be ok for a muslim man to go to a female doctor for a prostate exam? or genital exam?

[AyoubAlgeria]

Salam Alaykoum,
It is not allowed for a woman to have a male one, and vice versa. However, in the worst case it might be allowed but this means a valid reason.
Salam Alaykoum

[.mirror.]

Prostate exams are not extremely urgent, so I think he can look around until he finds a male doctor.

[SILURES]

Prostate exams are not extremely urgent, so I think he can look around until he finds a male doctor.

i dont know about not extremly urgent. if you have prostate cancer the better its sorted the better the outcome, but i get what you mean. if its not a emergency then wait till you get a suitable doc.

[.mirror.]

I mean, you'd have to go to the doctor first to find out that you have prostate cancer, unless there are some symptoms (I don't really know about this).

[SILURES]

I mean, you'd have to go to the doctor first to find out that you have prostate cancer, unless there are some symptoms (I don't really know about this).

yeah true. hope none of us get in that situation though.

i had to turn a bloke away from our gym because he had prostate cancer that progressed into his stomach. he was doing all the big exercises, squats, deads etc and would literally collapse after each workout. i had to tell him he couldnt train there no more for his own good (and tbh he frightned me, i keep thinking he was gonna die).

[smraye6]

If all the Muslim women OBs choose to not have hospital hours or perform surgeries after 5 pm, who will do the crash c-sections/deliveries, etc. in the middle of the night? Babies don't come during office hours...male OBs are needed; sorry, but it's true. With my 6 pregnancies, I did my best to always see a female; I couldn't, however, predict the circumstances of my super fast labors and deliveries, so I had to deal with the occasional male.

We do our best.

[naila-k]

In reality if you have high risk birth requiring consultant care, in UK you don't have a choice as not all hospitals have the facilities

[cho09082489]

you can say you only want females and that might be ok if everything goes smoothly at a birth, but when there are complications they often bring a male in whether you like it or not, of course the most important thing is to save mother and baby

[Damascus Girl]

That's good Alhamdulillah, esp. for gynecologists.



I don't think it's OK to target men like this. Even sister Naila thought it would require patience from the husband. Plus, for women working in hospitals, it'd be different. They might be on-call at odd hours and they might not have full control over their schedules. So, it's not a full myth, there's some truth to it.

Maybe, women are more patient, but I'm not sure where bedside manners came from? How does that relate to her medical profession?

I don't doubt, however, that women would make great doctors, esp. in certain fields, like gynecology.



I hope you're right. I don't personally know any families like that.

I guess the phrase "bedside manners" isn't used in the UK. In my neck of the woods, it refers to a doctor's manner towards his patient. Many patients find their doctors' attitude to be cold and impersonal -- not a good thing if you are sick and have questions. Also embedded in this phrase is an assumption that the doctor exhibits some pride.

Female doctors are known to have a gentler, more patient-focused "bedside manner." They talk to their patients and make sure that their questions are answered. They make them feel at ease. They exhibit warmth. At the end of the day, medicine is a caring profession - so the people who work in it must be caring too.

I'm not "targetting" men. The fact is, everyone has said that husbands need a lot of patience to accept that their wives will have careers especially in medicine. So I am responding to that by saying that if you examine the reality closely, that lack of patience isn't necessary. Its 2011. Women go to university. They get professional jobs. They earn money. They have babies. They read the Quran, they give zakaat, they pray salaat. They hire cleaning ladies or they ask their mothers to help out (which many do, happily) - if anything, there is a resurgence in the extended family environment of old, where grandparents play an active role in the household management of their adult children and the raising of their grandchildren.

Perhaps, brother mirror, you are still young and don't know many muslim professional couples who are raising families. I know many. In fact, my sister is a doctor and has been for 20 years; she also has 3 children. She also practices Islam. She also cooks dinner every night, unless she is too tired in which case she makes her husband cook. Her mother in law lives with them and helps take care of the house and the kids. There is harmony in the house.

But I know another couple where the wife stays home all day. Did not go to university. Her husband has a 9 to 5 job then goes out with his friends. He barely knows his children, because while she cooks, cleans, runs after the kids, takes them to school, picks them up from school, wipes their noses, washes dishes, does his laundry and her children's laundry, takes them to the doctor, takes heself to the doctor, etc...he is relaxing from his "long" day at work.

[Damascus Girl]

hmm
Lucrative -yes

without asking him directly (cos he might take it as an offense) i managed to elicit from him why he a "brother" went into this speciality - he said because he liked the variety of the job (medicine combined with surgery).

most gynaeocolists are male for some reason. One of my friends, again another practising brother, is saying he want to go into this speciality too!!!, his reasoning is he wants to save lives in poor countries by helping deliver babies (because alot of deaths happen in childbirth in 3rd world countries).

Ewe.

You don't need to specialize in gynecology to deliver babies. Family medicine gives you that training.

But he's a gynecologist because of the "variety"??? I'm sorry but here's a jolt of reality for you. Gynecologists examine women's vagina's and everything behind them. No more, no less. This "brother" is sick. Variety my foot. He's weird.

Family medicine is varied. Emergency medicine is varied. But gynecology....?

I think male muslim doctors should practice pediatrics. If he is intrested in newborns, then neonatology is a good area - they don't have to look at a woman's private parts for that.

[.mirror.]

Allah knows best his intentions. I don't think it's right to say he wanted to look at women or that he's sick.