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  1. #1
    Senior Member eyes in tears's Avatar
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    at what age does praying becomes farz?

    they usually say its at the age of 7, today its my sisters 7th birthday..and she still doesn't know how to pray independantly.

    There is one very worrying problem with her, she just has no motivation to pray, she knows how to make whudhu, but when we tell her to get up and do whudhu and pray..she refuses and starts getting rebelious.

    Yes, she is addicted to cbeebies like 99% of other children.

    Any tips/ advice would be much appreciated.

  2. #2
    ~ Chicken Little ~ CryingForGaza's Avatar
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    Re: at what age does praying becomes farz?

    they should start training at 7, and if at the age of 10 they do not pray then u can do something to them :S sorry inshalah someone can expants and give u a hadtih or something, but to my knowledge they start training at 7 and should be praying 5times daily at 10.
    "Then Which Of The Favours Of Your Lord Will You Deny"

    Surah Ar Rahman

  3. #3
    pariah *asiya*'s Avatar
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    Re: at what age does praying becomes farz?

    Does he have to wake his children who are seven years old to pray Fajr?

    I have a daughter who is 7 years old, she prays Alhamdulillah. Do I have to wake her up for Fajr prayer, knowing that this made her dislike praying?.

    Praise be to Allaah.

    The father is like the shepherd of his household and is responsible for his flock, as the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said. Based on that, he should educate his children and teach them to fulfil obligations and avoid haraam things. That includes telling them to pray when they reach the age of seven years, because of the report narrated by Abu Dawood (495) from ‘Amr ibn Shu’ayb, from his father, from his grandfather, who said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Tell your children to pray when they are seven years old and smack them if they do not pray when they are ten, and separate them in their beds.” Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood.

    But the father should be kind in teaching his small children how to pray, and he should encourage them by praising them, and giving them gifts and rewards so that they will get used to it and love it.

    You can delay waking your daughter up until near sunrise, and encourage her to sleep early so that it will be easier for her to get up.

    There is nothing wrong with you not waking her up on days when you think it will be too hard for her to wake up, because – for example – she went to sleep late or because it is very cold, and so on.

    Shaykh Ibn ‘Uthaymeen (may Allaah have mercy on him) was asked: I have a son who is about nine years old; should I wake him up for Fajr prayer?

    He replied: Yes, if a man has children, male or female, who have reached the age of ten, he should wake them up. With regard to children who are younger than that, if he wakes them up so that they may pray on time, that is better, but there is no sin on him if he does not do that. But it is better to wake them up, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Tell your children to pray when they are seven tears old and smack them if they do not pray when they are ten, and separate them in their beds.” End quote from Fataawa Noor ‘ala’l-Darb.

    He was also asked: My son is eight years old; should I wake him up to pray Fajr? If he does not pray, am I sinning?

    He replied: It seems that it depends. If it is winter, for example, and it is very cold, then there is nothing wrong with leaving him and telling him to pray when he wakes up. But if the weather is normal and there is no harm done by waking him up, then you should wake him up so that he will get used to praying with the people. Nowadays, praise be to Allaah, there are young boys between the ages of seven and ten whom we see coming with their fathers to pray Fajr. If a child gets used to that from an early age there is a great deal of goodness in that. But if it causes hardship, then you do not have to wake them up. But when they wake up you should tell them to pray. End quote from al-Liqa’ al-Shahri (40/18).

    And Allaah knows best.
    Islam Q&A
    "O you who believe! Stand out firmly for justice, as witnesses to Allah, even as against yourselves, or your parents, or your kin, and whether it be (against) rich or poor: for Allah can best protect both. Follow not the lusts (of your hearts), lest you swerve, and if you distort (justice) or decline to do justice, verily Allah is well-acquainted with all that you do." [An-Nisa 4:135]

    The Prophet said:

    "Whosoever leaves off obedience and separates from the Jamaa'ah and dies, he dies a death of jaahiliyyah. Whoever fights under the banner of the blind, becoming angry for 'asabiyyah (nationalism/tribalism/partisanship) or calling to 'asabiyyah, or assisting 'asabiyyah, then dies, he dies a death of jaahiliyyah."

    muslim

    Narrated 'Abdullah:

    The Prophet, said, "Abusing a Muslim is Fusuq (evil doing) and killing him is Kufr (disbelief)." sahih bukhari


    "Creeping upon you is the diseases of those people before you: envy and hatred. And hatred is the thing that shaves. I do not say it shaves the hair but it shaves the religion!

    By the One in whose Hand is my soul, you will not enter paradise until you believe, and you will not believe until you love one another. Certainly, let me inform you of that which may establish such things: spread the greetings and peace among yourselves."

    [Recorded by Imam Ahmad and Al-Tirmidhi]


  4. #4
    pariah *asiya*'s Avatar
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    Re: at what age does praying becomes farz?

    How do we smack children to make them pray?.

    Praise be to Allaah.

    Abu Dawood (459) and Ahmad (6650) narrated from ‘Amr ibn Shu’ayb from his father that his grandfather said: The Messenger of Allaah (blessings and peace of Allaah be upon him) said: “Teach your children to pray when they are seven years old, and smack them if they do not pray when they are 10 years old, and separate them in their beds.” Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in al-Irwa’ (247).

    Ibn Qudaamah (may Allaah have mercy upon him) said in al-Mughni (1/357):

    This telling and discipline is prescribed in the case of children in order to train them to pray, so that they will be used to it and it will become their habit, and they will not forsake it when they reach puberty. End quote.

    Al-Subki said:

    The guardian must tell the child to pray when he is seven years old and smack him if he does not do so when he is 10.

    We think we should enjoin what is not obligatory and smack for failing to do that which is not obligatory. We smack animals for disciplinary purposes, so what about children? That is in the child's interests, and so that he will get used to praying before he reaches puberty. End quote.

    Fataawa al-Subki, 1/379

    So boys and girls are to be told to pray when they are seven years old and are to be smacked if they do not pray when they reach the age of 10. Similarly they are to be told to fast Ramadan and should be encouraged to do good things, such as reading Qur’aan, offering supererogatory prayers, Hajj and ‘umrah, and reciting a lot of tasbeeh, tahleel, takbeer and tahmeed, and they should be prevented from committing all kinds of sin.

    With regard to smacking a child for not praying, it is stipulated that the smacking should be light and should not be painful and should not break the skin, or break a tooth or bone. It should be on the back or the hand and the like, and the face is to be avoided because it is forbidden to strike it, because the Prophet (blessings and peace of Allaah be upon him) forbade that.

    It should not be more than 10 blows, and it should be done for the purpose of discipline and teaching. So he (the parent etc) should not show his desire to punish, except when there is a need to show that, such as if the child is turning away from prayer and forsaking it, and the like.

    It was narrated from Abu Bardah al-Ansari that he heard the Messenger of Allaah (blessings and peace of Allaah be upon him) say: No one should be given more than 10 lashes except in the case of one of the hadd punishments of Allaah.” narrated by Al Bukhaari (6456) and Muslim (3222).

    Ibn al-Qayyim (may Allaah have mercy upon him) said:

    the words of the Prophet, “No one should be given more than 10 lashes except in the case of one of the hadd punishments of Allaah,” referred to an offence or criminal act, which has to do with what Allaah has prescribed as a punishment.

    If it is said: What do we mean by 10 or less?

    The answer is: This has to do with when a man hits his wife, his slave, his child, or his hired worker for the purpose of discipline and the like: it is not permissible for him to give more than 10 blows. This is the best way to understand the hadeeth. End quote.

    I’laam al-Muwaqqi’een (2/23)

    It should also not be done in front of anyone else, so as to protect the child's self-esteem and his dignity in front of his friends and others.

    It should be known from the father's behaviour with his children and his disciplining of them that he does not smack anybody whom he smacks except in obedience to Allaah and to his Messenger (blessings and peace of Allaah be upon him), and that the only reason he does that is the child's best interests, and his keenness to raise him in the prescribed manner, so that the child will not .grow up hating Islamic teachings which he may find difficult, and that he was smacked for not doing them.

    Shaykh Ibn Baaz (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:

    Take care of the members of your household and do not neglect them, O slave of Allaah. You have to strive hard in their best interests, and tell your sons and daughters to pray at the age of seven, and smack them if they do not do so when they are 10, a light smack that will help them to obey Allaah and make them get used to offering prayers on time, so that they will adhere properly to the religion of Allaah and know the truth, as is narrated in saheeh reports from the Messenger of Allaah (blessings and peace of Allaah be upon him). End quote.

    Majmoo’ Fataawa Ibn Baaz (6/46).

    Shaykh Ibn ‘Uthaymeen (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:

    The Prophet (blessings and peace of Allaah be upon him) commanded us to tell our children to pray when they are seven years old, and to smack them if they do not pray when they are 10 years old, even though they are not obliged to do that yet, so that they may be trained in doing acts of worship and obedience and may get used to them, so that it will be easy for them to do that after they grow up and it will be dear to them. The same applies to all matters that are blameworthy; young children should not get used to them even though they are not yet under any obligation, because otherwise they will get used to them when they grow up and will enjoy indulging in them. End quote.

    Fataawa Noor ‘ala al-Darb, 11/386

    The command implies that it is obligatory, but it is limited only to cases where smacking will be beneficial, because sometimes you smack a child but he does not benefit from being smacked, it only makes him scream and cry more and does not serve any benefit. Moreover what is meant by smacking here is smacking is that is not painful, a light smack that serves the purpose and does not cause any harm. End quote.

    Liqa’ al-Baab il-Maftooh, 95/18

    He (may Allaah have mercy on him) also said:

    it should not be a smack that causes injury, and it should not be a smack in the face for example, or a smack to a lethal site; rather he should be smacked on the shoulder or the hand and the like, which would not cause him to die. Smacking on the face is risky, because the face is the highest and noblest part of a person and if a person is smacked on the face it is more humiliating and shameful then if he were to be smacked on the back. Hence it is forbidden to smack on the face. End quote

    Fataawa Noor ‘ala al-Darb, 13/2

    Shaykh al-Fawzaan said:

    Smacking is one of the means of child rearing. The teacher may smack, the trainer may smack, the guardian may smack for disciplinary purposes; and the husband may smack his wife in cases of wilful defiance (nushooz).

    But that must be within certain limits, and it should not be a blow that causes pain, breaks the skin or breaks the bone; rather it should be only as much as is necessary. End quote.

    Ighaathat al-Mustafeed bi Sharh Kitaab al-Tawheed (282 -- 284)

    It should also be noted that disciplining a child should not be done only for neglecting to pray; rather it should also be done if he is careless about the conditions, essential parts and obligatory duties of prayer. A child may pray, but he combines prayers, or he prays without wudoo’, or he does not pray properly. So he must be taught everything about it, and we should make sure that he is aware of its obligatory duties, essential parts and conditions, then if he neglects any of these things, we must advise him and teach him time after time, then if he persists he may be disciplined by means of smacking until he prays properly.

    And Allaah knows best.

    Islam Q&A
    "O you who believe! Stand out firmly for justice, as witnesses to Allah, even as against yourselves, or your parents, or your kin, and whether it be (against) rich or poor: for Allah can best protect both. Follow not the lusts (of your hearts), lest you swerve, and if you distort (justice) or decline to do justice, verily Allah is well-acquainted with all that you do." [An-Nisa 4:135]

    The Prophet said:

    "Whosoever leaves off obedience and separates from the Jamaa'ah and dies, he dies a death of jaahiliyyah. Whoever fights under the banner of the blind, becoming angry for 'asabiyyah (nationalism/tribalism/partisanship) or calling to 'asabiyyah, or assisting 'asabiyyah, then dies, he dies a death of jaahiliyyah."

    muslim

    Narrated 'Abdullah:

    The Prophet, said, "Abusing a Muslim is Fusuq (evil doing) and killing him is Kufr (disbelief)." sahih bukhari


    "Creeping upon you is the diseases of those people before you: envy and hatred. And hatred is the thing that shaves. I do not say it shaves the hair but it shaves the religion!

    By the One in whose Hand is my soul, you will not enter paradise until you believe, and you will not believe until you love one another. Certainly, let me inform you of that which may establish such things: spread the greetings and peace among yourselves."

    [Recorded by Imam Ahmad and Al-Tirmidhi]


  5. #5
    ~ Chicken Little ~ CryingForGaza's Avatar
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    Re: at what age does praying becomes farz?

    Ban her from the TV. not that hard. reward her when she prays ontime and properly, and if she delays it take something she like away from her.
    "Then Which Of The Favours Of Your Lord Will You Deny"

    Surah Ar Rahman

  6. #6
    pariah *asiya*'s Avatar
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    Re: at what age does praying becomes farz?

    Quote Originally Posted by eyes in tears View Post
    they usually say its at the age of 7, today its my sisters 7th birthday..and she still doesn't know how to pray independantly.

    There is one very worrying problem with her, she just has no motivation to pray, she knows how to make whudhu, but when we tell her to get up and do whudhu and pray..she refuses and starts getting rebelious.

    Yes, she is addicted to cbeebies like 99% of other children.

    Any tips/ advice would be much appreciated.
    turn the t.v off and tell her no t.v until u have prayed. also get your father or brothers if u have any, to take her to the masjid with him when they go there to make the 5 daily salat, it will encourage her when she sees all the muslims there praying insha Allah.
    "O you who believe! Stand out firmly for justice, as witnesses to Allah, even as against yourselves, or your parents, or your kin, and whether it be (against) rich or poor: for Allah can best protect both. Follow not the lusts (of your hearts), lest you swerve, and if you distort (justice) or decline to do justice, verily Allah is well-acquainted with all that you do." [An-Nisa 4:135]

    The Prophet said:

    "Whosoever leaves off obedience and separates from the Jamaa'ah and dies, he dies a death of jaahiliyyah. Whoever fights under the banner of the blind, becoming angry for 'asabiyyah (nationalism/tribalism/partisanship) or calling to 'asabiyyah, or assisting 'asabiyyah, then dies, he dies a death of jaahiliyyah."

    muslim

    Narrated 'Abdullah:

    The Prophet, said, "Abusing a Muslim is Fusuq (evil doing) and killing him is Kufr (disbelief)." sahih bukhari


    "Creeping upon you is the diseases of those people before you: envy and hatred. And hatred is the thing that shaves. I do not say it shaves the hair but it shaves the religion!

    By the One in whose Hand is my soul, you will not enter paradise until you believe, and you will not believe until you love one another. Certainly, let me inform you of that which may establish such things: spread the greetings and peace among yourselves."

    [Recorded by Imam Ahmad and Al-Tirmidhi]



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