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Salams Guys
quick question
For a guy and a girl to get married a Girl needs a "Wali permission"
but my question is does it have to be in family order
i.e Father
if father not around then brother
or can it be brother even if the father is around
just curious :p
ye the brother can be the wali/..but er so can the uncle..but then again ure the guy..so why wud u need..er forget.. it. maybe its for ure 'fiance'..:outta:
sunrise
29-05-06, 08:00 PM
As salam ou lakoum
Actually i was under the impression that the brother/uncle/local imam
can only be wali's if the father is absent??
I will try and find you a fatwaa inshAllah bro
Sunrise
As salam ou lakoum
Actually i was under the impression that the brother/uncle/local imam
can only be wali's if the father is absent??
I will try and find you a fatwaa inshAllah bro
Sunrise
please do...as i think the local imam can only act as wali if he is appointed as such in some extenuating circumstance(s)
Well the argument can be applied here is if u dont have a good relationship wid ur father or something although he is still present then???
do find out please :)
*Anisah*
30-05-06, 02:19 AM
Asalamu alaikum
I got this from another forum..........generally I don't like to post Fatwas but in this case I find it necessary.
Order of succession for guardians
Question: If the father of a Muslim girl is deceased, who becomes her guardian?
Answered by the Fatwa Department Research Committee - chaired by Sheikh `Abd al-Wahhâb al-Turayrî
The girl’s father is her guardian if he is alive unless he is proven unfit on grounds of insanity, unbelief, gross immorality, or malicious intent by a Muslim judge in an Islamic court or other presiding Islamic authority in the locality.
In such cases, his guardianship is revoked and the next closest male Muslim relative will become her guardian. That guardian, in turn, remains her guardian until he is also proven unfit on grounds of insanity, unbelief, gross immorality, or malicious intent by a Muslim judge in an Islamic court or other presiding Islamic authority in the locality.
If and when the girl has no valid guardian from her family, then that presiding Muslim authority will take direct control of her affairs and act in the capacity of her guardian.
The order of preference for guardians is fixed and is as follows:
1. The father.
2. The paternal grandfather, then her paternal grandfather, then her paternal great-great grandfather…
3. The woman’s mature sons in order of seniority.
4. The mature sons of the woman’s sons in order of seniority.
5. He full brothers in order of seniority.
6. Her paternal half-brothers in order of seniority.
7. The sons of her brothers in order of seniority and then their sons and then their sons…
8. Her paternal uncles in order of seniority.
9. The sons of her paternal uncles and then their sons and then their sons…
10. Her father’s paternal uncles.
11. The Muslim ruler or presiding Muslim authority in the locality who deals with such issues.
And Allah knows best.
(http://www.islamtoday.net/english/)
NotOverYet
30-05-06, 09:14 AM
A question from all of those who has answered this;
could you please tell me based on which Fiqhi group have you answered all these? because different groups are giving different Ijtihads about them. some groups (out of these four) say that a girl can do her nikah even without asking her Wali! i need some specifications please.
Al-ghurabah
30-05-06, 09:21 AM
a guy does not need a wali. the girl does.. its her dad or brother or uncle.. beofre they could even go to the khalif if the family did not agree..
What if the family did not agree then ?
Al-ghurabah
30-05-06, 10:24 AM
What if the family did not agree then ?
well try to convince them broo.. ;) ... good to get family involved..
remind them of the hadeeth which states not allowed to reject a offer from good muslim..
oh rite
u got the hadith for that bro?
Al-ghurabah
30-05-06, 10:38 AM
oh rite
u got the hadith for that bro?
Abu Hurayrah, may Allaah be pleased with him, reported that the Prophet sallallaahu 'alayhi wa sallam said: “If a man whose religious commitment and moral conduct you approve of proposes for marriage to your daughter, then marry her to him; otherwise, trials will prevail and great corruption will spread upon the earth.” [At-Tirmithi & Ibn Maajah] Imaam As-Sindi, may Allaah have mercy upon him, commented upon this narration, saying: “A person’s religious commitment assures fulfilling his obligations, and his good moral conduct assures his kind treatment of others.” [End of quote]
A question from all of those who has answered this;
could you please tell me based on which Fiqhi group have you answered all these? because different groups are giving different Ijtihads about them. some groups (out of these four) say that a girl can do her nikah even without asking her Wali! i need some specifications please.
Hanafi madhab states the girl does not need a wali to marry.
The others, as far as I am aware, state a wali is required.
Taken from Sunnipath >>
Only the Hanafi School gives women the option to marry without their guardian's permission, provided the husband is kuf' or legally suitable.
[The full query was as follows]
Getting married without parental permission in order to avoid temptations
Answered by Ustadha Zaynab Ansari
I am 20 years old and have lived in America my whole life. I live in a community where the Muslims are not very strong in Iman. I have many times been in very bad situations where I almost committed zinnah. Alhamdulilah I have decided to live a good life and get married asap. I have found a girl in college and have the ability to marry her. She would like to marry me but her parents want her to wait because her older bro and sister are not married. She is almost 20 years and is very mature. I have had my cousins wife who is married speak to her so she can see if she is good for my deen and she agreed she is good for me. My question is whether she can get married without her parents' permission. There is no reason for them to say no except that I don't know urdu and grew up in America. I practice the deen, and am financially secure. For the sake of our chastity and Islam can we get married without her parents permission and find a wali in place of them? This situation is faced by many youth who prefer Islam over dating and zinnah. They are constantly forced into a situation of zinnah because of societal and parental pressures.
In the Name of Allah, the Gracious, the Merciful.
Dear Brother,
I pray that you have resolved your situation.
Normally, the scholars on SunniPath advise strongly against secret marriages. Only the Hanafi School gives women the option to marry without their guardian's permission, provided the husband is kuf' or legally suitable.
However, since marrying against one's parents' wishes entails so much heartache, scholars urge young people to seek their parents' blessing before getting married.
You and the sister need to impress upon her parents that it is far more superior and pleasing to Allah to let the marriage take place rather than leaving the door open for the unlawful.
The fact that she has older siblings who are unmarried should not prevent her from getting married. The fact that you don't speak Urdu and grew up in America also has no bearing on the situation.
Please find someone who can advocate on your behalf, such as a knowledgeable member of the community or a respected elder.
And Allah knows best.
See this is where it gets all Confusing
So with hanafi a girl can marry without Parental Permission right?
You know issues like these where people find something like this that permits this sorta stuff they go and follow it
if that makes sense even if they dont follow the school of thought..
hmmmm
Ok Another Question you need 2 witnesses right
do they have to be muslims?
A more detailed answer re the issue of a wali >>
Marriage & a Woman's Guardian
Answered by Shaykh Faraz Rabbani
http://www.sunnipath.com/images/Q_Image.jpgThere are two families that would like their children to get married to each other. However, they'd like to wait 1 year for the nikkah. They're planning to do an engagement (no such thing in Shariah right?) this summer - InshAllah. Now the the bride and groom know each other prior to the families agreement, and would like to speak to one another on the phone. I asked a Shaykh about this situation, he stated in the Hanafi Maddhab the bride can choose her wakeel (implying the groom). Then the groom can go to the local masjid ask the Imam and two witnesses to get them married. Thus the groom is the wakeel for the bride and is also the groom. The Shaykh said this is valid in the Hanafi Madhhab and stated this as an option. He preferred this by stating that as long as both families agree to marry their child to other family and the issue is time (because of wedding plans) than this is an option. My question, the Shafi'i Madhhab has designated the father as the wakeel from my research, thus is there any differences of opinion in the Shafi'i Madhhab that allow the women to choose her own wakeel (the person who marries her of)?
http://www.sunnipath.com/images/A_Image.jpg
http://www.sunnipath.com/images/bism01.jpg
Walaikum assalam,
Just a clarification:
According to the famous relied upon position within the school, the marriage of a woman without the approval of her wali is only valid if the person she is marrying is legally considered a suitable match (kuf'). Otherwise, the marriage is invalid, and they would be considered to be living in zina. This is the position adopted by the overwhelming majority of the Hanafi fuqaha, and was chosen by Ibn Abidin in his Hashiya as well. Shaykh Mahmoud Ashraf Usmani says that this is the generally adopted position of the fuqaha of the Subcontinent, and this is what I heard Shaykh Adib al-Kallas of Damascus say is generally adopted.
Given the danger of this issue, each specific case should be referred to a qualified God-fearing scholar.
It is very important to note that the fuqaha point out, as Shaykh Muhammad Shafi` does in his Imdad al-Mufteen, that even when a woman's marriage without the explicit approval of her wali is *valid*, it is: (a) going against the Sunna and (b) may well entail being bad to one's parents, which is among the most serious of enormities.
The fuqaha explain that the "approval" is not a general "acceptance" to marry but, rather, an approval of the actual marriage contract taking place, because at the legal level, the marriage contract must be seen as a civil contract where the approval of the wali is an expected part.
As for who the guardian (wali) is supposed to be, this is known, and the order of closeness of guardianship must be followed.
As such: In order to do that which is best, the two parties should press their parents to allow them to have the nikah as soon as possible, which adhering to good manners and respect. It must be noted that it is very much possible to be firm and insistent while adhering to good manners, a point lost on many. If the parents are being 'unreasonable' then the reasonable solution is to take the case to a qualified God-fearing scholar.
If such scholars seem few, then we should ask ourselves what we are doing to change this situation.
Wassalam,
Faraz Rabbani.
http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=1&ID=568&CATE=10
NotOverYet
30-05-06, 12:09 PM
See this is where it gets all Confusing
So with hanafi a girl can marry without Parental Permission right?
You know issues like these where people find something like this that permits this sorta stuff they go and follow it
if that makes sense even if they dont follow the school of thought..
hmmmm
thats not right then, because then someone would be looking for find easy aHkaam in each one.
yeah if you are able to do Ijtihad, then you go for finding things yourself. otherwise you should follow all the priniciples that he (Abu Hanifa or Imam Shafi'i or anyone of the Imams) has chosen.
NotOverYet
30-05-06, 12:12 PM
Hanafi madhab states the girl does not need a wali to marry.
The others, as far as I am aware, state a wali is required.
Taken from Sunnipath >>
Only the Hanafi School gives women the option to marry without their guardian's permission, provided the husband is kuf' or legally suitable.
[The full query was as follows]
Getting married without parental permission in order to avoid temptations
Answered by Ustadha Zaynab Ansari
I am 20 years old and have lived in America my whole life. I live in a community where the Muslims are not very strong in Iman. I have many times been in very bad situations where I almost committed zinnah. Alhamdulilah I have decided to live a good life and get married asap. I have found a girl in college and have the ability to marry her. She would like to marry me but her parents want her to wait because her older bro and sister are not married. She is almost 20 years and is very mature. I have had my cousins wife who is married speak to her so she can see if she is good for my deen and she agreed she is good for me. My question is whether she can get married without her parents' permission. There is no reason for them to say no except that I don't know urdu and grew up in America. I practice the deen, and am financially secure. For the sake of our chastity and Islam can we get married without her parents permission and find a wali in place of them? This situation is faced by many youth who prefer Islam over dating and zinnah. They are constantly forced into a situation of zinnah because of societal and parental pressures.
In the Name of Allah, the Gracious, the Merciful.
Dear Brother,
I pray that you have resolved your situation.
Normally, the scholars on SunniPath advise strongly against secret marriages. Only the Hanafi School gives women the option to marry without their guardian's permission, provided the husband is kuf' or legally suitable.
However, since marrying against one's parents' wishes entails so much heartache, scholars urge young people to seek their parents' blessing before getting married.
You and the sister need to impress upon her parents that it is far more superior and pleasing to Allah to let the marriage take place rather than leaving the door open for the unlawful.
The fact that she has older siblings who are unmarried should not prevent her from getting married. The fact that you don't speak Urdu and grew up in America also has no bearing on the situation.
Please find someone who can advocate on your behalf, such as a knowledgeable member of the community or a respected elder.
And Allah knows best.
for this brother;
about the Wali. if the wali is putting an un-islamic condition, then the Islamic Judge or Imam could be the girl's wali and this Nikah could be Valid (if s/he is even not the follower of Hanafi group).
so this brother has this last option. for us Islam comes first than everything else (AT LEAST FOR ME IT IS, Alhamdulillah)!
Like people have said above, it depends on the madhab...
It isnt encouraged, if you marry someone, and it auses some of the family to get ****ed...maybe you shouldnt get married, lay off, marry someone else, I mean, it isnt love is it... ;)
Getting married on the sly hey Sajid, you playa, you.... :hidban:
Oh, first second third or fourth? OH WOW, YOU CHIEF, ALL 4 AT THE SAME TIME ON THE SLY? You legend masha allah...
:p
SoulAsylum
30-05-06, 03:56 PM
Depending on the circumstances marrying without a wali or guardian should not be looked down upon. The madhab allowing it should be encouraged. When there are two people who are suitable and like each other and find no faults in each others religion or character than the marriage should not be disallowed for some petty reason that the parents hold to reject the marriage from taking place which is based on their own petty personal selfish reasons rather than the well being of the boy or the girl.
HandsomeMujahid
30-05-06, 03:58 PM
SoulAsylum, are you married dear brother?
SoulAsylum
30-05-06, 04:10 PM
SoulAsylum, are you married dear brother?
EDIT....
No im not married.
Tahiyah
30-05-06, 04:34 PM
Abu Hurayrah, may Allaah be pleased with him, reported that the Prophet sallallaahu 'alayhi wa sallam said: “If a man whose religious commitment and moral conduct you approve of proposes for marriage to your daughter, then marry her to him; otherwise, trials will prevail and great corruption will spread upon the earth.” [At-Tirmithi & Ibn Maajah] Imaam As-Sindi, may Allaah have mercy upon him, commented upon this narration, saying: “A person’s religious commitment assures fulfilling his obligations, and his good moral conduct assures his kind treatment of others.” [End of quote]
beautiful hadith
great corruption has spread upon the earth :(
parents today are more concerned about how much a brother makes, they dont care about his Deen
i know a brother who asked a man for his daughters hand, and the mans first question to the brother was, are you a doctor? i only want a doctor for my daughter.
subhanAllah.. how sad is that?
ur_yusra
30-05-06, 04:47 PM
Salams Guys
quick question
For a guy and a girl to get married a Girl needs a "Wali permission"
but my question is does it have to be in family order
i.e Father
if father not around then brother
or can it be brother even if the father is around
just curious :p
very interesting that you should ask this.. :rolleyes:
I don't get what you mean.. do you mean the actual nikah or do you mean when a girl is looking to get married who should she look to, to arrange such things..
If you mean the latter then what is the problem if the brother gets involved initially and then later on the father does. Its not like the father is not going to know about it, of course the marriage will take place with both his knowledge and permission.
SoulAsylum
30-05-06, 05:36 PM
That would depend on who classifies as Wali. Who has the most right of wali.........the father, the brother or the uncle. And can the brother override the position of wali over the father or not.
I think i knew where you are heading at Sajid :p
elefantebianco
30-05-06, 06:51 PM
salaams....
Lets turn the tables around here...i understand that the dude does not need his parents permission.....bt wouldnt it be really hard on both him and the girl if he did jst marry against his parents will...and what do ppl do in such a situation....
as for Sajids question....
i feel that its best to try with her parents first...dnt wnt to start marriage on a bad foot...plus the dad may feel that u have undermined his authority by not asking him for his daughters hand...the other thing...this could get the brother involved in a massive family fued....
if the parents reason is not legit...like due to race etc...then u can use islamic evidence agaisnt them if they are practing if not then u can tell them...ur plannin to get married time and date..and they are invite bt islamically their reason is not legit...so u dnt require thier permision....
bt becareful for this puts the girl in a very awkward position one that could effect her for the rest of her life.........
Humble1
30-05-06, 07:18 PM
acording to the hanafi fiqh a wali is not neccesary, the girl and guy can get married on thier own.
elefantebianco
30-05-06, 07:21 PM
HUH why are all the madhabs saying diff things...btw...i doubt hanafi say u dnt need a wali...i swear it said that she can use a local shiekh etc...or another mahraam as a wali....
so if its...only Hanafi that allow certain thigs...does that mean ahli sunnah wa jamaah are the views of the other three...
does everyone follow a specific madhab here? :confused:
MalikOne™
30-05-06, 09:28 PM
HUH why are all the madhabs saying diff things...btw...i doubt hanafi say u dnt need a wali...i swear it said that she can use a local shiekh etc...or another mahraam as a wali....
so if its...only Hanafi that allow certain thigs...does that mean ahli sunnah wa jamaah are the views of the other three...
does everyone follow a specific madhab here? :confused:
All four Madhabs are ahle sunnah wa jamaah, all madhabs are correct and the four sheikhs all understood and respected each others opinions.
NotOverYet
31-05-06, 06:49 AM
I'm a sister.
sorry. Ghussa kyon kar rahi hoo? Ghaltia to ham sab sai ho jata hai!
sorry. Ghussa kyon kar rahi hoo? Ghaltia to ham sab sai ho jata hai!
Ghussa? I simply stated i'm not a brother...i'm not angry about it :p
NotOverYet
01-06-06, 04:42 AM
Ghussa? I simply stated i'm not a brother...i'm not angry about it :p
JazzakAllah o Khair fee darain
abuahmed
01-06-06, 06:58 PM
Salams Guys
quick question
For a guy and a girl to get married a Girl needs a "Wali permission"
but my question is does it have to be in family order
i.e Father
if father not around then brother
or can it be brother even if the father is around
just curious :p
http://63.175.194.25/index.php?ln=eng&ds=qa&lv=browse&CR=343&dgn=4 sister u have here all questions u need for marriage
http://63.175.194.25/index.php?ln=eng&ds=qa&lv=browse&CR=343&dgn=4
www.islam-qa.com
islamirama
02-06-06, 01:52 PM
acording to the hanafi fiqh a wali is not neccesary, the girl and guy can get married on thier own.
Any proof on this? The prophet *S* said marraige without a wali is invalid.
What is a wali?
Protector, Guardian, Supporter, Helper, Friend etc. [plural 'Auliyâ (http://muttaqun.com/auliya.html)] see 33:17
The wali is the represention/mediator/guardian for women seeking marriage.
Who needs a Wali for marriage?
Men do not need a wali.
Women who have previously had
marital relations with a man, can represent themselves and do not have to have a wali for seeking the husband, but they WILL need a wali for the actual marriage contract, i.e. Regardless, she still must not be alone with a non-mahram man, and she MAY of course, and is encouraged to, have a wali be involved to whatever level she is comfortable with. All of this is for her protection, so that she may be protected from inquiries by inappropriate men and possibly "fall in love" and regret it later. This way, the men's character is first screened for her, still leaving her with the ultimate decision.
Note that it may be argued that new reverts to Islam are as innocent as a virgin (since all sins are forgiven upon embracing Islam) and is recommended for new muslimahs have a wali for seeking marriage.
The Prophet SAAWS said: "A guardian has no concern with a woman previously married and has no husband, and an orphan girl (i.e. virgin) must be consulted, her silence being her acceptance." [Sunan of Abu Dawud 2095, Narrated Abdullah ibn Abbas]
Malik bin Anas told us from 'Abdallah bin yazid- freed slave of al-aswad bin sufyan- from Abu Salma bin AbdalRahman from Fatimah, daughter of Qays who said,: Her husband divorced her and the Apostle of Allah ordered her to fullfil the 'Iddah in the house of Ibn Umm Maktum before she could lawfully remarry, and told her to let him know when she had become lawful for remarriage. When the time had come, she told him that Mu'awiyah bin Abu Sufyan and Abu Jahm had proposed to her.......
Umm Salamah, r.a., a widowed woman, was proposed in marriage by Abu Bakr, and refused. Then she was proposed to by Umar and she refused. Then she was proposed to by Prophet Muhammad saaws and accepted. [source: The Alim for Windows release 4.51, Biography of Umm Salamah] In all cases, the woman must consent to the marriage or the marriage can be ruled invalid. Virgins need not speak up to declare that they want a marriage; simply not speaking out against the marriage (her silence) is sufficient consent for a virgin.
Malik related to me from Abdullah ibn al-Fadl from Nafi ibn Jubayr ibn Mutim from Abdullah ibn Abbas that the Messenger of Allah, SAAWS, said, "A woman who has been previously married is more entitled to her person than her guardian, and a virgin must be asked for her consent for herself, and her consent is her silence " [Malik's Muwatta, Book 28, Number 28.2.4]
The Prophet saaws said, "A matron should not be given in marriage except after consulting her; and a virgin should not be given in marriage except after her permission." The people asked, "O Allah's Apostle! How can we know her permission?" He said, "Her silence (indicates her permission)." [Sahih Al-Bukhari 7.67]
Narrated Khansa bint Khidam Al Ansariya "...that her father gave her in marriage when she was a matron and she disliked that marriage. So she went to Allah's Apostle and he declared that marriage invalid." [Sahih Al-Bukhari 7.69]
"...Her guardian should not make a promise (to somebody to get her married to him) without her knowledge..." [Sahih Al-Bukhari 7.56] Women who are virgins must have a wali when getting married.
"No marriage is valid without a wali." [related by Ahmed and others and deemed sound by Ahmed, Ibn Hajar and others]
The Prophet SAAWS said: "There is no marriage without the permission of a guardian." [Sunan of Abu Dawood 2080, Narrated Abu Musa]
"When a woman marries without the permission of her wali, then her marriage is not valid, not valid, not valid." [Related by Ahmad, Tirmidhi and others. Tirmidhi said, this is a hasan Hadith] If the woman does not have a male mahram relative, the Imam closest to her locality, of the same faith as her, becomes her wali.
"If they dispute, then the sultan (man in authority) is the wali of those who have no wali." [Dawud 2078, Narrated 'Aisha , also related by Tirmidhi and others. Tirmidhi said, this is a hasan Hadith. Ibn Majah and Imam Ahmad, Hadith number 1880; also in Salih al-Jaami', hadeeth number 7556.) Shaykh Al Albaanee declares it authentic in Saheeh Al Jaami' vol. 2, no. 7556. ]
"The believers, men and women, are awilyaa’a (allies and protectors) of one another." [The Noble Qur'an 9:71]
"...And never will Allâh grant to the disbelievers a way (to triumph) over the believers. [The Noble Qur'an 4:141]
"O you who believe! Take not for Auliyâ' (protectors or helpers or friends) disbelievers instead of believers. Do you wish to offer Allâh a manifest proof against yourselves?" [The Noble Qur'an 4:144]
"And those who disbelieve are allies to one another..." [The Noble Qur'an 8:73] If the wali is non-mahram, such as is the case with many new reverts to Islam, she should avoid ever being alone with him.
"A man is never alone with a woman except that shaitan will be the third." (Related by Ahmed and Tirmidhi)
Abu Mus'ab
02-06-06, 02:09 PM
What if the family did not agree then ?
Then They Cant get Married.
"No marriage is valid without a wali."
[related by Ahmed and others and deemed sound by Ahmed, Ibn Hajar and others]
The Prophet SAllallahu Alayhi Wa Sallam said: "There is no marriage without the permission of a guardian." [Sunan of Abu Dawood 2080, Narrated Abu Musa]
"When a woman marries without the permission of her wali, then her marriage is not valid, not valid, not valid." [Related by Ahmad, Tirmidhi and others. Tirmidhi said, this is a hasan Hadith]
Abu Mus'ab
02-06-06, 02:19 PM
http://63.175.194.25/index.php?ln=eng&ds=qa&lv=browse&CR=343&dgn=4
sister u have here all questions u need for marriage
http://63.175.194.25/index.php?ln=eng&ds=qa&lv=browse&CR=343&dgn=4
www.islam-qa.com
Sajid Is A Man Not A Woman.
islamirama
02-06-06, 03:00 PM
Then They Cant get Married.
"No marriage is valid without a wali."
[related by Ahmed and others and deemed sound by Ahmed, Ibn Hajar and others]
The Prophet SAllallahu Alayhi Wa Sallam said: "There is no marriage without the permission of a guardian." [Sunan of Abu Dawood 2080, Narrated Abu Musa]
"When a woman marries without the permission of her wali, then her marriage is not valid, not valid, not valid." [Related by Ahmad, Tirmidhi and others. Tirmidhi said, this is a hasan Hadith]
Actually a girl can still get married if the family doesn't agree. It all depends on the circumstances. If the family knows the guy is a crook and the girl (their daughter) will be misearable and its bad then it the family should be obeyed and disobedience in this case may be a sin.
But if the girl is good and her deen and her family is cultural who don't care about deen, mom /daddy is chasing a guy with lot of money for her and don't care what evil things he does. Then she can seek help from the imaam and in this case the imaam can act as her wali (guardian) to protect her and her interests and make sure she gets her islamic rights.
Of course, best to consult scholars/alims/imaams if things are different then normal circumstances.
Niqaabi
02-06-06, 04:45 PM
Sajid i'll give you an example.
My dad was in england looking after his daughters, one a very cute lil 4year old daughter named Niqaabi :meow:. My sister was about to get married to a guy back home and my dad couldnt go with her.
My brother was only 19 or something and couldnt go either, so my uncle was the wali. :)
This is the order of wali AFAIK:
Father,
Grandfather,
Brother,
Uncle,
Son,
Nephew,
Leader of the community. (no sisters Tony Blair cannot be your wali :p)
Niqaabi
02-06-06, 04:56 PM
Who Can Be Woman's Wali for Nikaah
qualifications of the wali
- muslim, sane, adult, male
- of the same faith as the sister
- informed of the matters relating to Nikaah
- be fair and just
- have the ability to select a suitable match for the sister
The fuqahaa' put possible walis in a certain order, and a wali who is more closely-related should not be ignored unless there is no such person or the relatives do not meet the specified conditions.
1. A woman's wali is her father, then whoever her father may have appointed before his death,
2. then her paternal grand-father or great-grand-father,
3. then one of her sons could initiate the contract or delegate a suitable guardian to do this,
4. then her grand-sons
5. then her father's sons, her brother through both her parents (full brother), her brother through her father only (half-brother),
6. then her father's grand-sons (from male line) the sons of her brother through both her parents (full brother) the sons of her brother through her father only (half-brother),
7. then her paternal uncles her father's brother through both his parents, her father's brother through his father only,
8. then her paternal uncles' sons the sons of her father's brother though both his parents, the sons of her father's brother through his father only,
9. then whoever is more closely related, and so on - as is the case with inheritance.
10. The Muslim leader (or his deputy, such as a qaadi or judge) is the wali for any woman who does not have a wali of her own.
LiveIslam
02-06-06, 05:07 PM
i heard many imamsgiving different opinions. depends on which school of thoughts you thoughts you follow some say that gals and guys can get married by them self of couse they have to have a good reason e.g parents say no without a good reason to a practising brother and sis. and some say that the marriage wont be valid if they dnt have permission from a mehram. so it all depnds
I know a sister whose father died a few years ago. Her family did not get on with the elder relatives (her father's brothers). When she wanted to get married, I suggested that her younger brother (who was about 19 years old at the time) should be the wali because he took responsibility for her and her mother after the father died (and also because she was considering getting a non mahram male relative to act as her wali). I think some girls find it strange to seek permission from someone younger, even though it is more appropriate than asking a non mahram.
elefantebianco
02-06-06, 10:29 PM
I think some girls find it strange to seek permission from someone younger, even though it is more appropriate than asking a non mahram.
salams...erm my Wali is erm my bst mates daddy...i was jst wondering is this permisable...never looked into it..jst thought its best cos im close to the fam...needed one...and my daddy was dead....
Abu Mus'ab
03-06-06, 12:12 PM
salams...erm my Wali is erm my bst mates daddy...i was jst wondering is this permisable...never looked into it..jst thought its best cos im close to the fam...needed one...and my daddy was dead....
Yes, I Think It Is Permissable,
If You Base It Upon Ukhti Niqaabis Post,
Since He Passes All These Qualifications,
qualifications of the wali
- muslim, sane, adult, male
- of the same faith as the sister
- informed of the matters relating to Nikaah
- be fair and just
- have the ability to select a suitable match for the sister
Niqaabi
03-06-06, 02:07 PM
salams...erm my Wali is erm my bst mates daddy...i was jst wondering is this permisable...never looked into it..jst thought its best cos im close to the fam...needed one...and my daddy was dead....
After your dad, its your grandfather, then your brother, then your uncle etc etc, but that is only the case if they meet the requirments that i posted before.
If they do not, i would think that your best mates dad is your wali if he is your guardian. But this does not mean he is your mahram.
Ask an imam if you are not sure. And dont be too confused about it, because if you want to marry and none of your family are muslim, then the imam will give you away :insha:
salam alaikum
one situation poped up in my mind (my close friends try to deal with it now)
guy studies abroad, but comes home for every vacation. he wasnt practicing, neither her girlfriend was. now they are both back to Islam MashaAllah, and dont wanna sin again, and want to get married. but parents dont agree, and say that thay should wait untill guy comes back home. so, guy and the girl are planning to make nikah, and ask local imam to be girl's wali. (they cant avoid seeing each other, at the same time they started practicing to avoid sins and become pure persons not to live like thay lived). so there are many details which i think, may let them make this nikaah:
1)father/brothers and all other men relatives are not practicing and dont even think that nikah is something extremely important to stay away from sins, and think that there's nothing wrong in goin' to the cinema together, etc
2)girl's family know everything about the guy and agree with her choice.
i personally think that they must make nikaah, cuz practicing and performing zina-is something unexplainable stupid, performing nikah with imam as a wali is the best decision. whachu think, brothers and sisters?
masalam
salam alaikum
one situation poped up in my mind (my close friends try to deal with it now)
guy studies abroad, but comes home for every vacation. he wasnt practicing, neither her girlfriend was. now they are both back to Islam MashaAllah, and dont wanna sin again, and want to get married. but parents dont agree, and say that thay should wait untill guy comes back home. so, guy and the girl are planning to make nikah, and ask local imam to be girl's wali. (they cant avoid seeing each other, at the same time they started practicing to avoid sins and become pure persons not to live like thay lived). so there are many details which i think, may let them make this nikaah:
1)father/brothers and all other men relatives are not practicing and dont even think that nikah is something extremely important to stay away from sins, and think that there's nothing wrong in goin' to the cinema together, etc
2)girl's family know everything about the guy and agree with her choice.
i personally think that they must make nikaah, cuz practicing and performing zina-is something unexplainable stupid, performing nikah with imam as a wali is the best decision. whachu think, brothers and sisters?
masalam
well if girls family agrees then girls relatives can become her wali. guy doesnt need a wali.
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