Cousin marriages amgonst pakistanies in britain.

[Arsalan]

last night on news night.

interesting programme.

FULL ARTICLE AND "RESEARCH" HERE

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/newsnight/4442010.stm

If you missed it then watch the report on the same location.


discuss + and be mature ok.

[sajid]

chk this thread out

http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthread.php?t=30423

[Al-Irhaab]

the prophet (saw) married three of his cousins.

[ur_yusra]

I would never marry my cousin.. but that might have to do with the fact that I dont have any...:p

[HeiGou]

the prophet (saw) married three of his cousins.

He also waited until he was 25 to marry a woman 15 years older than him.

While I know that he is a good model to emulate, it is clear that the Brothers do not have to emulate him in all things (and it is a good thing for them too although perhaps some 40-year-old widows would disagree).

My question would be simple - if you know that marrying your cousin would cause a genetic defect would you do it? Presumably not. If you knew it increased the risk of a genetic defect isn't it unadvisable?

[Al-Irhaab]

the prophet (Saw) married khadijah (ra) he married Aisha (ra) and Zainab (ra) all three were his cousins and Allah (Swt) ordered him to marry the latter two so are you saying Allah (swt) ordered the prophet (saw) to marry someone that if they had children the children would be effected with bad health.

[Arsalan]

Salam , thanks for that Al_Irhab...

just one thing... i dont think Mother of the Believers Aisha Radiallahu anhah was a cousin of the Prophet. SHe was just the daughter of Hazrat Abu Barkr assadiq ra , who was "like " a brother to the Prophet, but not a blood brother.

Just out of interest was Khadijah Radiallahu anho a first cousin or second cousin of the Prophet saw.?

thanks.

[Al-Irhaab]

niether khadijah (ra) nor Aisha (ra) were first cousins but they were cousins I think Khadijah was a third and Aisha (ra) a fourth cousin but im not sure.

Zainab (ra) was a first cousin though.

[Arsalan]

niether khadijah (ra) nor Aisha (ra) were first cousins but they were cousins I think Khadijah was a third and Aisha (ra) a fourth cousin but im not sure.

Zainab (ra) was a first cousin though.

Thanks

Yeh although i dont blindly agree with the supposed "research " of this programme. It was totally focussed on the Kashmiri/Pakistani mirpur community in birmingham .. and its very limited genetic immigrant gene pool, and also only FIRST cousins. genetic studies show the risks of genetic disorers in second or third or forth cousins is Negligible if not nothing.

THe Prophet SAW through his marriage to Zainab RA showed that it is merely permissable to marry cousins, and there is nothing wrong with that. But the majority of his marriages were with either distant cousins or "outside non blood relatives from a variety of backgronds. Possibly suggesting that this is the correct way to go.

[witty]

IF someone wishes to marry their cousin; let them be.

All this genetic nonsense doesn't affect a lot of people. Unless you have inherited recessive genes that could potentially become dominant if two members of one family marry, then perhaps you ought to give it some thought, but if there are no inherited diseases in your family - starting from great grand-parents down to you, then you have nothing to worry about.

:rolleyes:

[marjan]

The problem is minute when there isn't a lot of intermarrying.

If cousins marry cousins who then marry cousins ad infinitum, then they are likely to have a much higher chance of their child developing a recessive disorder.

For this reason I think it's pretty irresponsible to keep with the intermarriage.

If it's a one off, it's not so much of a big deal medically speaking.

"The investigation, carried out for BBC2's Newsnight, found that while British Pakistanis accounted for just 3.4% of all births, they had 30% of all British children with recessive disorders."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4441102.stm


For such a small proportion of births that's pretty high.

Have a watch of this: http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/avdb/news_web/video/9012da68002b058/bb/09012da68002b0a6_16x9_bb.asx

Poor child has 2 lazy eyes. Sheesh.

[Haz]

the prophet (Saw) married khadijah (ra) he married Aisha (ra) and Zainab (ra) all three were his cousins and Allah (Swt) ordered him to marry the latter two so are you saying Allah (swt) ordered the prophet (saw) to marry someone that if they had children the children would be effected with bad health.

neither of them were cousines of prophet (sal). Aisha (ral) was daugther of Abu bakr (ral), Zainab (ral) was a daughter of a Jewish leader who was killed in a battle and Khadijah (ral) wasn't related to Prophet (sal).

[Haz]

..

[Supernova Nebula]

there's a regius (correct?) professor here who married his cousin, and their daughter now is the Gavernor of the National Bank. It is prefereble that u marry someone not related by blood but it's not haram also to marry your cousin.

[HeiGou]

the prophet (Saw) married khadijah (ra) he married Aisha (ra) and Zainab (ra) all three were his cousins and Allah (Swt) ordered him to marry the latter two so are you saying Allah (swt) ordered the prophet (saw) to marry someone that if they had children the children would be effected with bad health.

No. I am saying that many Muslims pick and choose among the examples put before them. You often hear young Muslim men who see that Muhammed married many women and think this is a good idea worthy of emulation. You often hear young Muslim men who hear that Muhammed married a young virgin and think this is a good idea worthy of emulation. I have never heard a Muslim man point out that Muhammed's first wife was a widow 15 years older than him and that this is worth of emulation.

I do not know whether their children would have had health problems. I guess God knows best about such things. I notice that Khadija, Zainab and Aisha were not first cousins of the Prophet. I notice that while Faitmah died rather young, and there is little evidence about the other daughters, he did have four daughters and they lived. He also had only one son but that was with another women - not a cousin. Yet that son died too. Presumably, the Islamic answer is, God knows what is best and God decided that Muhammed should not have a surviving son. I do not know why and could only guess.

My point is that Muslims do not have to emulate Muhammed in everything they do (and they don't anyway). And if they know there is a health risk to the children, I would assume that such marriages are prohibited. But you tell me. Should a Muslim marry a cousin if he knows that, for example, they will all inherit the Tay-Sacks gene and die before they are seven years old? Or should he seek another bride and have healthy children?

[Al-Irhaab]

neither of them were cousines of prophet (sal). Aisha (ral) was daugther of Abu bakr (ral), Zainab (ral) was a daughter of a Jewish leader who was killed in a battle and Khadijah (ral) wasn't related to Prophet (sal).

You really need to check your Islamic history :rolleyes:

Khadijah bint Khuwailid ibn Asad ibn 'Abd al-'Uzza ibn Qusay ibn Kilab (from one of the notable clans of the Quraish). Her mother was Fatima bint Za'ida who was descended from another of the clans of the Quraish:The genealogists of the Arabs describe the Prophet as Muhammad ibn'Abd Allah ibn 'Abd al-Muttalib ibn Hashim ibn 'Abd Manaf ibn Qusay ibn Kilab. He was therefore one of her cousins, or more precisely, one of her nephews, through a mutual great-grandfather Qusay ibn Kilab

Zainab bint Jahsh ibn Ri'ab alAsadiya. Her original name was Barra, which the Prophet changed when she embraced Islam. She was the daughter of Umaima bint 'Abd al-Muttalib and was therefore one of the first cousins of the Prophet

Cant find the lineage for Aisha (Ra) but will get it for you when I can

[Al-Irhaab]

No. I am saying that many Muslims pick and choose among the examples put before them. You often hear young Muslim men who see that Muhammed married many women and think this is a good idea worthy of emulation. You often hear young Muslim men who hear that Muhammed married a young virgin and think this is a good idea worthy of emulation. I have never heard a Muslim man point out that Muhammed's first wife was a widow 15 years older than him and that this is worth of emulation.

I do not know whether their children would have had health problems. I guess God knows best about such things. I notice that Khadija, Zainab and Aisha were not first cousins of the Prophet. I notice that while Faitmah died rather young, and there is little evidence about the other daughters, he did have four daughters and they lived. He also had only one son but that was with another women - not a cousin. Yet that son died too. Presumably, the Islamic answer is, God knows what is best and God decided that Muhammed should not have a surviving son. I do not know why and could only guess.

My point is that Muslims do not have to emulate Muhammed in everything they do (and they don't anyway). And if they know there is a health risk to the children, I would assume that such marriages are prohibited. But you tell me. Should a Muslim marry a cousin if he knows that, for example, they will all inherit the Tay-Sacks gene and die before they are seven years old? Or should he seek another bride and have healthy children?

look let me try explaining it to you in simple ways, the exception does not destroy the rule. As a rule it is allowed to marry your cousin. However if your cousin has a genetic deficiency which you yourself posses for instance she carries the haemophilic genome and you are haemophlic then no its not going to be a good idea to have kids with her, but in the same way if a non-cousin is the same as above you wouldnt marry them. Were talking about the rule here not exceptional cases.

[HeiGou]

look let me try explaining it to you in simple ways, the exception does not destroy the rule. As a rule it is allowed to marry your cousin. However if your cousin has a genetic deficiency which you yourself posses for instance she carries the haemophilic genome and you are haemophlic then no its not going to be a good idea to have kids with her, but in the same way if a non-cousin is the same as above you wouldnt marry them. Were talking about the rule here not exceptional cases.

I have no problem understanding your post. This is basically my point. Islamic law says you can marry your cousin, it does not say you must. So if there is a good reason not to, it is best not to. At least that is my understanding. The problem is whether when something is only a risk you ought to avoid it just in case. I would tend to think so myself, but then only an idiot would come to me for advice on Islamic law. So let me ask you, if marrying your cousin carries an increased risk, how great does that risk have to be before you would advise against such a marriage?

[ur_yusra]

AISHA bint Abu Bakr ibn Abu Quhafa ibn Amir ibn Amr ibn Kaab ibn Saad ibn Thayyem ibn (MURRA BIN KAAB)- the father of KILAB........KILAB ofcourse being the great grandfather of Rasool (SAW)....

[Al-Irhaab]

AISHA bint Abu Bakr ibn Abu Quhafa ibn Amir ibn Amr ibn Kaab ibn Saad ibn Thayyem ibn (MURRA BIN KAAB)- the father of KILAB........KILAB ofcourse being the great grandfather of Rasool (SAW)....



jazakumallah khere.... hmmm strange u helping me :rolleyes: shld i be scared...

[ur_yusra]

jazakumallah khere.... hmmm strange u helping me :rolleyes: shld i be scared...

yes be very scared seems like u have some sort of a comprehending disorder.. I mean why would I help YOU.. :rolleyes:

[Nawar]

yes be very scared seems like u have some sort of a comprehending disorder.. I mean why would I help YOU.. :rolleyes:

:up: :up: :up: lol