Apostasy

[History]

What is the definition of "apostasy" in Islam?
What is the fate of apostates?

Respectfully,
History

[History]

And most important:
Traditionally, how do Muslim families treat their children who leave the faith?
Or is this as variable as among families of all faiths?

Respectfully,
History

[Crono]

apostacyh is an act that takes you completely and utterly out of islam..and you alsao lose every good deed you have gotten, and all the bad deeds stay

apostates go to hellfire...with the kafir, unless they reppent, by saying the shahdah again

[dhakiyya]

well a friend of my husband's left Islam (but returned recently alhamdulillah) his parents of course still treated him like their son, though were upset that he wasn't Muslim, and are delighted that he has returned to Islam. Alhamdulillah.

[History]

Thank you both for your responses.
Are they contradictory?

Respectfully,
History

[Crono]

are what contradictory?..apostate actions and beliefs?...i hope that is nto what ytour asking..becasue there are WAY to many apostate actions and beliefs to list

[History]

Were the answers contradictory?

Your (Crono's) answer suggests the Muslim apostate is a pariah and completely dissociated (and, I infer, shunned) by Muslim society as one doomed to "hellfire."

Dhakiyya suggests that the Muslim apostate is not shunned. In fact, he "was still treated...like their son." This suggests respectful disagreement and being open (and active through their love) for the potentiality of reversion.

The two stated attitudes seem contradictory.

Respectfully,
History

[Crono]

in shariah...apostates are put to death....though not all muslims like to follow shariah

[Tahajjud]

Were the answers contradictory?

Your (Crono's) answer suggests the Muslim apostate is a pariah and completely dissociated (and, I infer, shunned) by Muslim society as one doomed to "hellfire."

Dhakiyya suggests that the Muslim apostate is not shunned. In fact, he "was still treated...like their son." This suggests respectful disagreement and being open (and active through their love) for the potentiality of reversion.

The two stated attitudes seem contradictory.

Respectfully,
History

How would you treat your child who got sidetracked into the whisperings of satan and fell into evil and was destined to doom?

wouldnt you feel sad or depressed or maybe like in the west, they dont really care about their children right...thats why their children are out creating fitnah because they were not taught otherwise?

Or maybe your asking because alot of people in your faith accepted Islam?

[Paris]

"Murtad" means apostate. Murtad can be of two types: fitri and milli. (1) Murtad Fitri means a person born of a Muslim parent and then he rejects Islam. Fitri means nature or natural. The term "murtad fitri" implies that the person has apostated from his nature, the nature of believing in God. (2) "Murtad Milli" means a person who converted to Islam and then later on he rejects Islam. Milli is from millat which means a community. The term "murtad milli" implies that the person has apostated from his community.

In the first case, the apostacy is like treason against God; whereas in the second case, the apostacy is like treason against the Muslim community. Probably, that is why there is also a difference in dealing with these two kinds of murtads:

A former kãfir who became a Muslim and then apostates (Murtad Milli) is given a second chance; if he repents, then he is not to be killed.

But one who is born as a Muslim and then apostates (Murtad Fitri) he is to be killed even if he repents. His repentance might be accepted by Allãh but he still has to go through the punishment prescribed for his treason in this world.

This punishment is only applicable in case of apostacy by men; in case of women, the punishment is not death but life imprisonment. And if such a woman repents, then her repentance is accepted and the punishment is suspended. The writings of some of the mujtahideen implies that the punishment of a murtad is to be implemented only in dãru 'l-Islãm (i.e., the Muslim world) and not if the murtad flees to dãru 'l-kufr (i.e., the abode of kufr).

[History]

Dear Tahajjud,
Thank you for your post.
How would you treat your child who got sidetracked into the whisperings of satan and fell into evil...[quote]
Non sequitur.
I do not define "whisperings of satan and falling into evil" by choice of faith (e.g. Islam, Christianity, etc.) but by a person's evil deeds (e.g. murder, rape, extortion, slander, etc.).
Thus "children" of all faiths (including Islam) and none commit evil acts ("whisperings of satan" if you choose).
And, similarly, children of all faiths (including Islam) can overcome these evil tendencies (stop their ears to satan) and follow the One G-d--evidenced through acts of lovingkindness.
[quote]... and was destined to doom?
As I believe in a Just and Compassionate G-d, I do not believe in either "eternal damnation"(Hell) nor that one's "doom" is based on choice of one "religion."
wouldnt you feel sad or depressed or maybe like in the west, they dont really care about their children right...thats why their children are out creating fitnah because they were not taught otherwise?
Unjust generalization. And people who live in glass houses should not throw stones.
However it is true I would be hurt if my child left the faith of her forebears, but I would respect her and always (and eternally) love her.
Or maybe your asking because alot of people in your faith accepted Islam?
Few, actually.
But I asked my question because of the opposite occurence. A young Muslim from our inter-religious coalition wishs to convert to Judaism, and asked me about it. I have stated that there is no need for him to convert and have put him off repeatedly and suggested he not approach the Rabbi, but he is quite adament. He is angry with me, for I have shared, when the subject has come up in our get-togethers, that Judaism does indeed welcome and honor converts, and he now (justly) accuses me of hypocrisy. I do so because I know his family. His father is wise and learned, and a friend. I am not usually at such a loss when it comes to what to do on matters of faith, but I know this is why we have imams and rabbis, and I will be meeting with my rabbi tomorrow.

Respectfully,
History

[Tahajjud]

Dear Tahajjud,
Thank you for your post.
[quote]How would you treat your child who got sidetracked into the whisperings of satan and fell into evil...[quote]
Non sequitur.
I do not define "whisperings of satan and falling into evil" by choice of faith (e.g. Islam, Christianity, etc.) but by a person's evil deeds (e.g. murder, rape, extortion, slander, etc.).
Thus "children" of all faiths (including Islam) and none commit evil acts ("whisperings of satan" if you choose).
And, similarly, children of all faiths (including Islam) can overcome these evil tendencies (stop their ears to satan) and follow the One G-d--evidenced through acts of lovingkindness.

As I believe in a Just and Compassionate G-d, I do not believe in either "eternal damnation"(Hell) nor that one's "doom" is based on choice of one "religion."

Unjust generalization. And people who live in glass houses should not throw stones.
However it is true I would be hurt if my child left the faith of her forebears, but I would respect her and always (and eternally) love her.

Few, actually.
But I asked my question because of the opposite occurence. A young Muslim from our inter-religious coalition wishs to convert to Judaism, and asked me about it. I have stated that there is no need for him to convert and have put him off repeatedly and suggested he not approach the Rabbi, but he is quite adament. He is angry with me, for I have shared, when the subject has come up in our get-togethers, that Judaism does indeed welcome and honor converts, and he now (justly) accuses me of hypocrisy. I do so because I know his family. His father is wise and learned, and a friend. I am not usually at such a loss when it comes to what to do on matters of faith, but I know this is why we have imams and rabbis, and I will be meeting with my rabbi tomorrow.

Respectfully,
History

No eternal damnation for the evil doers ...hmm...well thats a lie.
Yah Allah SWT is surely just and compassionate but punishes as well when there is unjust evil humans.

well theres still some that convert

I have known no muslims...Alhumdulilah...may i never know such ignorance.

MAy Allah guide us all to the right path. Ameen

[Tahajjud]

"Murtad" means apostate. Murtad can be of two types: fitri and milli. (1) Murtad Fitri means a person born of a Muslim parent and then he rejects Islam. Fitri means nature or natural. The term "murtad fitri" implies that the person has apostated from his nature, the nature of believing in God. (2) "Murtad Milli" means a person who converted to Islam and then later on he rejects Islam. Milli is from millat which means a community. The term "murtad milli" implies that the person has apostated from his community.

In the first case, the apostacy is like treason against God; whereas in the second case, the apostacy is like treason against the Muslim community. Probably, that is why there is also a difference in dealing with these two kinds of murtads:

A former kãfir who became a Muslim and then apostates (Murtad Milli) is given a second chance; if he repents, then he is not to be killed.

But one who is born as a Muslim and then apostates (Murtad Fitri) he is to be killed even if he repents. His repentance might be accepted by Allãh but he still has to go through the punishment prescribed for his treason in this world.

This punishment is only applicable in case of apostacy by men; in case of women, the punishment is not death but life imprisonment. And if such a woman repents, then her repentance is accepted and the punishment is suspended. The writings of some of the mujtahideen implies that the punishment of a murtad is to be implemented only in dãru 'l-Islãm (i.e., the Muslim world) and not if the murtad flees to dãru 'l-kufr (i.e., the abode of kufr).

Thanks for the info, brother.

[Stillcurious]

What is the definition of "apostasy" in Islam?
What is the fate of apostates?

Why in Islam? Don't the words mean more or less the same irrespective of peoples' beliefs?

Webster's Encyclopedic Unabridged Dictionary of the English Language (over 2000 pages) defines the word as 'total desertion of or departure from from one's religion, principles, party, cause etc.'.

[History]

Dear Paris,
Thank you for your informative post.
It suggests one should be very very very careful in converting to (or from) Islam, risking death from the Muslim community more than justice from G-d/Allah (imho).
Sad.
And only makes my quandry greater.

Respectfully,
History

[mehmet]

But one who is born as a Muslim and then apostates (Murtad Fitri) he is to be killed even if he repents. His repentance might be accepted by Allãh but he still has to go through the punishment prescribed for his treason in this world.

Isnt this in contradiction with surah Al-Kafiroon? Can you give some evidence on this (hadith or ayah) ?
This seems very unlikely to me...:confused:

salaams

[Uthman]

:salams

Isnt this in contradiction with surah Al-Kafiroon?

Can somebody please explain to me how this is in contradiction to Surah Al-Kaafiroon? :confused:

:wswrwb:

[Tahajjud]

One can never translate the actual meaning of the words of the Qur'an, but here it is...

The Disbelievers

In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful.

[109.1] Say: O unbelievers!
[109.2] I do not serve that which you serve,
[109.3] Nor do you serve Him Whom I serve:
[109.4] Nor am I going to serve that which you serve,
[109.5] Nor are you going to serve Him Whom I serve:
[109.6] You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion.

This is one of my favorite surah, beautiful.

However, no where in this surah does it talk about apostasy..on apostasy there is:

"Let there be no compulsion in the religion: Surely the Right Path is clearly distinct from the crooked path." Al Baqarah, 2:256.

"Those who blasphemed and back away from the ways of Allah and die as blasphemers, Allah shall not forgive them." Suratan Nisa', Ayah 48.

"Those who believe, then disbelieve, then believe again, then disbelieve, and then increase in their disbelief - Allah will never forgive them nor guide them to the path." Surah An-Nisa', 4:137.

Killing whoever blasphemes from Islam, is basically a punishment in "Islamic" countries that say they prescribe to the sha'riah, Allah knows best.

It is also mentioned in a Hadith that if a person apostates from Islam, he will be told not to, if he refuses, than he will punished and the punishment is death (In my opinion it is so fitnah does not spread)
BUT No one besides the caliph or his representative may kill the apostate. If someone else kills him, the killer is disciplined (for arrogating the caliph's prerogative and encroaching upon his rights, as this is one of his duties).

there are no caliphs in our world today...

Its like Islam does not force anyone to be muslim, but if they are ...and they blaspheme and become apostates, this is a betrayal, not to humanity but also to Allah SWT, and the punishment is right when looking at it this way.

Allah knows best.

[Paris]

Mehmet, your mistaken, there is no contradiction.

My post seems to have created a confusion amongest one or two so I'd like to clarify it further.

In addition, to what I've already written about who is an apostate and what category they fall into and the penalties for each category - the most important thing to note is that the execution of the apostate can only occur under the rule of the KHILAAFAH. So, If today, I reject Islam and even if I live in a Muslim country, no man can lay hands on me, becuase, presently, a khilaafah does not exist.

The above view is held by some Muslims - as a result of a hadith. The other view does not offer any worldly punishment for Murtads.

I am not up for writing a lengthy post so I'll just copy and paste Islamic Research Foundation International. Hope no one minds.



Is Killing An Apostate in the Islamic Law?





Ridda or Irtidãd: Literally means "turning back". The act of apostasy -- leaving Islam for another religion or for a secular lifestyle.

Murtadd: Literally means "one who turns the back." An apostate.

Murtad Fitri:Literally means apostate - natural. A person born of a Muslim parent who later rejects Islam.

Murtad Milli: Literally means apostate - from the community. A person who converted to Islam and later rejected the religion.

Due lack of education and critical thinking several myths have taken root in the Muslim world over the ages, and there have not been any efforts in the past to clear these doubts. On the contrary, there has been a sort of effort to strengthen these myths and misconceptions. These misinterpretations of Islamic teachings have taken their toll on the Muslim world and have strengthened a misplaced perception that Islam is a symbol of obscurantism, a religion of intolerance and answers everything with the sword.

And there is no bigger misconception-strengthened with misunderstanding of Islamic beliefs over the years-other than the belief that Islam doesn't tolerate apostasy. The Christian missionaries and the Western world are cashing in on it. Ulama have tried to strengthen their point of view and several leading Muslim reformists have failed to tackle the issue. This misconception has also presented Islam as a medieval and killer religion. Islam bashers have time and again tried to carry the point by pointing out that Islam orders the killing of a person if he or she reverts to another religion from Islam.

No body is forthcoming to challenge this widely held belief as well as put forth a convincing argument about the misinterpretation of Qur'anic teachings by Ulama.

The Qur’an is completely silent on any worldly punishment for apostasy and the sole Tradition that forms the basis of rulings is open to many interpretations.

Prophet (pbuh) is reported to have said: ‘Whosoever changes his religion, Kill Him (man baddala Dinahu faqtuluhu)’”. It is this last quote from the Prophet that forms the basis of the said ruling.

While jurists are agreed on the authenticity of this tradition, they differ very widely on the appropriate interpretation and thus, the law concerning apostasy. Understanding the different viewpoints, and arriving at the truth is crucial to our discussion of this subject.



This tradition does not refer to Muslims who leave the religion of Islam for other religions. Finally, there is the crucial dispute over the nature of the punishment and the crime. Al-Nakha’ee and, according to Sha’rani, al-Thawri, hold that the apostate is a grave sinner who should however be continuously called back to the fold for the rest of his life, and not killed. By implication, they do not consider the offence a hadd (fixed penalty) offence with a fixed punishment that must be carried out. This view is similar to the view that apostasy is a sin that carries no fixed punishment, and any penalty for it is discretionary (ta’zeer). This is a view held by the Hanbali scholar, Ibn Taimiya and he attributes it as well to the Maliki Imam al-Baji. Among Hanafites, the jurist Shamsuddeen al-Sarakhshi holds the same view. He says in al Mabsut that the fixed penalties or hudud are generally not suspended because of repentance, especially when they are reported and become known to the Imam. He then adds in the case of apostasy “renunciation of the faith and conversion to disbelief is admittedly the greatest of offences, yet it is a matter between man and his Creator, and its punishment is postponed to the day of Judgement. (“fa’l jaza’ ‘alayha mu’akhkhar ila dar al-jaza”).



If repentance is accepted, then apostasy is not a hadd offence with a fixed punishment. Secondly, once scholars accept that a Muslim apostate has the right to be given the opportunity to repent, they lose the right to set a time limit for his repentance.



Allah (SWT) says in the Glorious Qur’an (39: 53-54: Say: “ O you servants of Mine who have transgressed against your own selves! Despair not of God’s mercy. Behold God forgives all sins, for verily He is much forgiving, a dispenser of grace! Hence, turn toward your sustainer and surrender yourselves unto him before the suffering (of death and resurrection) comes upon you for then you will not be succored.”



Any scholar who says the death sentence applies to leaving the faith, then the convict is to be given a life-time to repent, and this is the view of Sufyan al-Thawri, Ibrahim al-Nakha’ee, Shamsuddeen al-Sarakhshi, Imam al-Baji and, by strong implication, Ahmad Ibn Taimiya. One must conclude that the death sentence is not for “simple apostasy” (mujarrad al-ridda), but for apostasy accompanied by treason and sedition, or by the abuse and slander (sabb) of the Noble Prophet.

Freedom to convert to or from Islam

"Everyone has the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion; this right includes freedom to change his religion or belief, and freedom, either alone or in community with others and in public or private, to manifest his religion or belief in teaching, practice, worship and observance." Article 18 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.

The Glorious Qur'an says, "Let there be no compulsion in the religion: Surely the Right Path is clearly distinct from the crooked path." Al Baqarah, 2:256.

"Those who believe, then disbelieve, then believe again, then disbelieve, and then increase in their disbelief - Allah will never forgive them nor guide them to the path." Surah An-Nisa', 4:137.

For example, the Qur'an says: "Let him who wishes to believe, do so; and let him who wishes to disbelieve, do so." (Al-Kahf: 29)

In another verse, Allah Almighty says: "Yours is only the duty to convey the message; you are not a guardian over them." (Al-Ghashiyah: 21- 22)

The quotation from Surah An-Nisa', 4:137, shown above, seems to imply that multiple, sequential apostasies are possible. That would not be possible if the person were executed after the first apostasy.

From the above verses it can be argued that religious freedom and the absence of compulsion in religion requires that individuals be allowed adopt a religion or to convert to another religion without legal penalty.

Hence the death penalty is not an appropriate response to apostasy.

The former Chief Justice of Pakistan, SA Rahman, has written that there is no reference to the death penalty in any of the 20 instances of apostasy mentioned in the Qur'an.

Muslims who support the death penalty for apostasy use as their foundation the above cited hadith, in which the Prophet (pbuh) is reported to have said: "Kill whoever changes his religion." But this is a weak foundation because this hadith was only transmitted from Muhammad (pbuh) by one individual. It was not confirmed by a second person. According to Islamic law, this is insufficient confirmation to impose the death penalty. The Shari`ah has not fixed any punishment for apostasy.



The hadith is so generally worded that it would require the death penalty for a Christian or Jew who converted to Islam. This is obviously not the prophet's intent. The hadith is in need of further specification, which has not been documented. Many scholars interpret this passage as referring only to instances of high treason. (e.g. declaring war on Islam, Muhammad (pbuh), God, etc.).

There is no historical record, which indicates that Muhammad (pbuh) or any of his companions ever sentenced anyone to death for apostasy.

The issue of killing a murtad or the apostate is not a simple one. Scholars have debated it from various angles and it is not simply an issue of killing someone for choosing one religion or another.

The question of apostasy has been debated among scholars based on their interpretations of some hadiths since the Qur'an does not specify any worldly punishment for it. For example, there was a case at the time of the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) where a man came to him in three consecutive days and told him that he wanted to apostate. The Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) never took any action against him, and when the man finally left Madina, the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) never sent anyone to arrest him, let alone kill him.

This is why some scholars distinguished between individual apostasy and apostasy which is accompanied by high treason. So, it cannot be confused with the freedom of conscience for every individual, which has been guaranteed in the Qur'an through hundreds of verses.

For example, one version of a hadith narrated by `A'isha (RA) concerning apostasy relates to one who left his religion and fought against Muslims.

QUR'ANIC VIEWS

The Qur’an has referred to the issue of apostasy at more than one place (for example see Al-Baqarah 2: 217, Al-Baqarah 2: 108, A’l Imra’n 3: 90, Al-Nisa’ 4: 137 and Al-Nahl 16: 106). But at none of these places does the Qur’an mention the punishment of death for such people who change their religion. The Qur’an does mention that such people shall face a terrible punishment in the hereafter but no worldly punishment is mentioned at any of these instances in the Qur’an. This situation obviously raises a question mark in the mind of the reader that if Allah had wanted to give the punishment of an apostate a permanent position in the Shari`ah, the punishment should have been mentioned, at least at one of the above mentioned places. If the Qur’an had kept completely silent about the apostate, the matter would have been different. But the strange thing is that the Qur’an mentions apostasy, and still does not mention the punishment (if any) it wants the apostate to be subjected to.

Furthermore, the Qur’an has strictly disallowed the imposition of the death penalty except in two specific cases. One of them is where the person is guilty of murdering another person and the other is where a person is guilty of creating unrest in the country (fasa’d fil-ardh) like being involved in activities that create unrest in a society, for example activities like terrorism etc. The Qur’an says:

Whoever kills a person without his being guilty of murder or of creating unrest in the land, is as though he kills the whole of mankind. (Al-Ma’idah, 5: 32)

Obviously, apostasy can neither be termed as "murder" nor "creating unrest in the land".

Thus, in view of the above facts, we are left with one option only. We can only say that either the saying has been wrongly ascribed to the Prophet (pbuh), as it is clearly contradictory to the Qur’an and the Prophet could not have said anything contradictory to the Qur’an, or that the saying ascribed to the Prophet (pbuh) relates not to all apostates but to a particular and specific people.

Shaykh Subhani

Shaykh Inayatullah Subhani (author of the Book Apostasy doesn't carry death penalty in Islam) says that neither Islam forces any person to embrace neither Islam nor it forces him to remain within its fold. He writes, "Apostasy has been mentioned several times in Qur'an. It also describes the bad treatment that will be meted out for committing apostasy, but it never talks of punishment for the crime in this world." The learned scholar mentions three Ayaat (verses) from Qur'an on apostasy (Al-Baqara 217, Muhammad 25-27 and Al-Maida 54) and then says that none of these Ayaat prescribes any punishment for that though these Ayaat pass strictures on the people who commit it. There are several other Ayaat on the same issue and none of them prescribes either death penalty or any other punishment for apostasy in this world. He then adds that had there been some punishment in Islam for apostasy there was no reason as to why the issue was mentioned repeatedly in Qur'an but no punishment was prescribed.

Misinterpretation of the hadith, Man baddala Dinahu faqtuluh (kill him who changes his religion) has caused the problem. This order has been made to look general and permanent, though it was said in a particular circumstance for a particular group. Shaykh Subhani writes that this order was made to counter a scheme prepared by Jews of Madinah. They had planned that some of them embrace Islam for some time and then return to their old religion. Then some other people do the same. It was aimed to create restlessness among Muslims against their own leadership so that the strong Muslim unity should start crumbling. It was made clear in Qur'an in (Aal Imran, 3: 72-73).

To counter this planning the Prophet (SAW) ordered his companions to act in such a manner. Despite this order lengthy investigations were made to ascertain that the case was true and the person concerned was given adequate time to explain before the punishment was carried out.

Shaykh Subhani says lack of clear grasp of Qur'an misguided even leading Ulama. Otherwise it was not difficult to understand the hadith. Qur'anic teachings on the issue were not kept in mind.

He emphasizes that people who were awarded death penalty for reverting to other religions from Islam during the time of the Prophet (SAW) or during the reign of his caliphs were not given the punishment for the crime of apostasy but for the fact that they were at war with Muslims and Islamic government.
Shaykh Subhani regrets that punishment that was prescribed for certain people under special circumstances was made to look like a general order. He says that it was the order for people who posed threat to Islamic state and became at war with Islam and not for any person who reverts to other religion.

A number of Islamic scholars from past centuries, Ibrahim al-Naka'I, Sufyan al-Thawri, Shams al-Din al-Sarakhsi, Abul Walid al-Baji and Ibn Taymiyyah, have all held that apostasy is a serious sin, but not one that requires the death penalty. In modern times, Mahmud Shaltut, Sheikh of al-Azhar, and Dr Mohammed Sayed Tantawi have concurred.

In conclusion, we must never confuse the issue of killing a murtad with the freedom of conscience guaranteed in the Glorious Qur'an. For a detailed discussion, one should read (1) the Dr. Yusuf Al-Qaradawi's book on this issue: Jareemat ar-riddah wal murtadd (The Crime of Apostasy and Apostate) - published by Ar-Risalah foundation.

(2) Apostasy doesn't carry death penalty in Islam (Book: Tabdili-e-Mazhab aur Islam) by Maulana Inayatullah Asad Subhani)-published by Idara Ihya-e-Deen, Bilariya Ganj, Azamgarh (UP, India) Pages: 108, Price Rs 30.

[History]

Thank you, Paris.
Excellent.
Thank you for sharing "Peace."

Respectfully,
History

[Paris]

Glad I could be of some help.


And peace to you.

[Uthman]

:salams:

Jazak'Allah khairan for re-assuring me. I got confused when I heard that there was a contradiction. :) Thank you for clarifying brother. :)

Indeed Allah (SWT) knows best. :)

:wswrwb:

One can never translate the actual meaning of the words of the Qur'an, but here it is...

The Disbelievers

In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful.

[109.1] Say: O unbelievers!
[109.2] I do not serve that which you serve,
[109.3] Nor do you serve Him Whom I serve:
[109.4] Nor am I going to serve that which you serve,
[109.5] Nor are you going to serve Him Whom I serve:
[109.6] You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion.

This is one of my favorite surah, beautiful.

However, no where in this surah does it talk about apostasy..on apostasy there is:

"Let there be no compulsion in the religion: Surely the Right Path is clearly distinct from the crooked path." Al Baqarah, 2:256.

"Those who blasphemed and back away from the ways of Allah and die as blasphemers, Allah shall not forgive them." Suratan Nisa', Ayah 48.

"Those who believe, then disbelieve, then believe again, then disbelieve, and then increase in their disbelief - Allah will never forgive them nor guide them to the path." Surah An-Nisa', 4:137.

Killing whoever blasphemes from Islam, is basically a punishment in "Islamic" countries that say they prescribe to the sha'riah, Allah knows best.

It is also mentioned in a Hadith that if a person apostates from Islam, he will be told not to, if he refuses, than he will punished and the punishment is death (In my opinion it is so fitnah does not spread)
BUT No one besides the caliph or his representative may kill the apostate. If someone else kills him, the killer is disciplined (for arrogating the caliph's prerogative and encroaching upon his rights, as this is one of his duties).

there are no caliphs in our world today...

Its like Islam does not force anyone to be muslim, but if they are ...and they blaspheme and become apostates, this is a betrayal, not to humanity but also to Allah SWT, and the punishment is right when looking at it this way.

Allah knows best.

[Stillcurious]

Glad I could be of some help.


And peace to you.

We often wish peace to you, but do you know why?

Do you also know why most motorists keep to the right and not to the left, as in Britain?

Well, the sword was usually in the right hand and it was more difficult to kill others if you drove/rode on the right hand side.

[Paris]

We often wish peace to you, but do you know why?

Do you also know why most motorists keep to the right and not to the left, as in Britain?

Well, the sword was usually in the right hand and it was more difficult to kill others if you drove/rode on the right hand side.

Cut the crap and spit it out in plain English, whatever it is that you want to say.

I don't have time for riddles.

[Stillcurious]

Cut the crap and spit it out in plain English, whatever it is that you want to say.

I don't have time for riddles.

Excuse me, if I made too many mistakes in my English. English was only the third language I learned. And not well, it seems.

[Paris]

Excuse me, if I made too many mistakes in my English. English was only the third language I learned. And not well, it seems.

You've done your part, now allow me to do mine:

Ball of Yarn.

[Sala-Uddin]

We often wish peace to you, but do you know why?


Becuase we wish it to you first? Becuase our religion means peace?

Well, the sword was usually in the right hand and it was more difficult to kill others if you drove/rode on the right hand side.

Have you been reading excerpts written by the Crusaders...does that term ring a bell?

[Stillcurious]

Becuase we wish it to you first? Becuase our religion means peace?

Salam = Islam? Doesn't the word salam come from the Latin greeting 'salve', which was commonly used along with 'vale'?

[Paris]

Salam = Islam? Doesn't the word salam come from the Latin greeting 'salve', which was commonly used along with 'vale'?

No, it comes from the Arabic root word SLM.

I see, you have conviniently decided not to respond to Salah-Uddin's response to the sword riddle. Ouchhh...

[Stillcurious]

No, it comes from the Arabic root word SLM.

I see, you have conviniently decided not to respond to Salah-Uddin's response to the sword riddle. Ouchhh...

My reply would have been 'no', so I didn't consider worth answering...