Re: the exclusive source of truth

[Owl Mirror]

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Truth

However wise it may be to glean wisdom from the past,
it is folly to regard the past as the exclusive source of truth.
Truth is relative and expanding; it lives always in the present,
achieving new expression in each generation of men-
-even in each human life.

Pardon me for speaking up, as I understand I am a guest in your house but, it does appear that the worst elements of Islam are prevailing on your forum.
True and genuine inward certainty does not in the least fear outward analysis,
nor does truth resent honest criticism.

Sincerely, Richard Owl Mirror

[ponderingstar]

Hey there. I am a muslim and believe rather strongly in my religion (although i'm still trying to figure out exactly what my religion is) but i think this website has a real bad vibe to it. I can't put my finger on what it is though.

Don't judge Islam by a website... please? I do believe that if we sincerely look in ourselves that God has provided a sort of barometer in regards to what is essentially right and wrong, I mean i know there are a few grey areas (IN regards to the why's and what for's etc.) but i think most people KNOW what is right and wrong. I think being kind hearted and patient are key to these things but i feel this website lacks those traits sometimes.

Which may seem hypocritical since i'm quite reactionary and short tempered myself sometimes.:boom: (well i don't own a rocket launcher, but that's probably a good thing...);)

[sajid]

Owl

i see ur point

butto make it short and snappy

this is ummah.com forum where u will find anyone with all sorts of views....

the good thing about this is that not everyone share the same views theres probably a gazillion different views for one specific issue which is what this forum is about

yup i know what u mean.....but freedom of speech is allowed her to an extent personally i dont really like shutting off people for talking their views....

u will find people with views u will find Bizaare, weird, whacky, agreeable, disagreeable etc.....if u know what i mean

this is the essense of this particular discussion board

With regards to what u said "worst elements of islam" bit unsure what u on about but i kinda got a jist of what u trying to say but u may be reffering to something different

[Owl Mirror]

Hey there. I am a muslim and believe rather strongly in my religion (although i'm still trying to figure out exactly what my religion is) but i think this website has a real bad vibe to it. I can't put my finger on what it is though.

Don't judge Islam by a website... please? I do believe that if we sincerely look in ourselves that God has provided a sort of barometer in regards to what is essentially right and wrong, I mean i know there are a few grey areas (IN regards to the why's and what for's etc.) but i think most people KNOW what is right and wrong. I think being kind hearted and patient are key to these things but i feel this website lacks those traits sometimes.

Which may seem hypocritical since i'm quite reactionary and short tempered myself sometimes.:boom: (well i don't own a rocket launcher, but that's probably a good thing...);)
LoL !

In my mind, it is the individual which has elected to follow a wayward interpretation of what it takes to Seek favor in the eyes of our Creator.
You said : "Don't judge Islam by a website... please? ".
I am a student of mankind's needs, desires, and the folly which we all commit, from time to time.
The true meaning of the lessons which we can acquire from the past are being squandered by being repeated, over and over, with no beneficial results.
One can point to an atrocity that another member of a different religion committed, in the name of their God.
The message gets lost, replaced with the wrongful actions of an individual associated with a branch of the sects.

As you may already have assumed, I am not a Muslim follower.
I respect many of the lessons delivered through your written texts but, I feel, these texts should be utilized as a map, by which to follow.
Because someone voices their opinion on a phrase, truth, edict of the preserved words of their forefathers, should not mean they are committing blasphemy.
For if Muhammad did not question the world around him, Islam would not exist.
You might say, but he was visited by Gabrial, on behalf of God.
I would reply: If his personality and stature were not pleasing to Allah, he might not have been chosen.


Personally, I believe Islam's achilles heel is, "The Last Prophet" sent by God to this world.
This eliminates debate and growth, stifling it to it's origins, never progressing.
Without pruning & proper watering, a desert rose grows wild and and less fruitful.

[Semantic]

Not really, you've just not drawn out the proper conclusions from a possible basis that Allah (swt) has all of the attributes we believe he has. Omniscience is cool.

As is not being bound by time and being omnipotent - it would not be possible for the personality/stature of Muhammad (pbuh) to not be pleasing to Allah (swt) if you follow it through logically..

There is plenty of diversity in Islamic thought. There are plenty of paths for the believer to walk and yet still be considered a believer by the majority of scholarship. More than Christianity I'd say.

There has been critcism and counter-criticism - what is not accepted is criticism of certain things that were held as the basis of belief. But that's another story.

In addition, we as muslims believe that this is the final degradation, at the end of which comes the day of judgement and the end of the world.

Oh well, c'est la vie.. Adieu.

[ponderingstar]

Personally, I believe Islam's achilles heel is, "The Last Prophet" sent by God to this world.
This eliminates debate and growth, stifling it to it's origins, never progressing.
Without pruning & proper watering, a desert rose grows wild and and less fruitful.
But i think the nature of islam is dependent on it's divine origins. SO to leave that part of the equation open (the last prophet part) would be to open the divine word to corruption. I believe in progress and feel quite annoyed at the state of Muslims; i mean everyone keeps saying that Islam gave women all these rights etc. so why do some so called muslims so enjoy taking those rights away from us? Anyway that's a bit off topic no? The point was that since the Quran is unchanged and of divine origin (according to us followers) then there is no need (IN our thinking) to worry about the whole last prophet thing...

Debate and discussion should always be encouraged. KNowledge shoudl alwyas be sought, that's what i was taught to be my religion, (although i was taught quite a few funny things also...:rubeyes:

I think one of the funniest things which can be held as testament to the violent nature of the muslim world of today are these darn smiley faces, NOWHERE have i seen such a range of violent expressions on a chat/messsage board/forum. It's SOOOOOOOOO funny i mean SERIOUSLY look at these. (I would however like to applaud the creator of these icons since they give me so much endless amusement):bangbang: :2hammers: :banghead: :badguy: :boom: :spunch: :mujahida: :bang:

And last but not least !!!!:

:torture:

rather funny no?

[Owl Mirror]

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In addition, we as muslims believe that this is the final degradation, at the end of which comes the day of judgement and the end of the world.

Oh well, c'est la vie.. Adieu.
The final degradation; ... ??? As in, a prophesied armageddon?

That is a self-fulfilling prophecy, issued forth by men of many ages past.
Why would the Creator of life, wish to see it chastised and destroyed?
It is man who will destroy himself, and not by Gods desire for it.