Raising glasses

[Outcider]

This is again a simple question to all Muslims, but for outsiders like me it might be good to know what Muslims do when other people raise their glasses, for instance, after a victory or a speech. Surely Muslims don't have champagne in their glasses, but is there anything? Are glasses ever raised?

One never knows when one is in a situation where you'd like to propose a toast.

[AbuMubarak]

try not to put yourself in that type of position

stay keep company amongst the pious and those who remember their Lord, seeking His face, fearful of the day of Judgement

and if by chance you are in that atmosphere, not to violate basic islamic ettiquette by displeasing your Lord, by immitating a people and trying to please a people who do not keep the rememberance of their Lord foremost

[Outcider]

I am sad to learn that more and more people here do not even enjoy simple things by showing it to others. One would believe that a graduation, wedding, victory etc. would be a happy moment and worth celebrating in one way or another.

[Kaiser]

But they do, in Afganistan they celebrate by shooting their ak47 into the air.

[AbuMubarak]

In The Name Of Allah The Most Gracious The Most Merciful


Ayah

Surah Al-'Imran(3) Ayah 175: (Interpretors: M Al-Hilali & M Muhsin Khan)

It is only Shaitan (Satan) that suggests to you the fear of his Auliya' [supporters and friends (polytheists, disbelievers in the Oneness of Allah and in His Messenger, Muhammad p.b.u.h)], so fear them not, but fear Me, if you are (true) believers.


Hadith

Aishah narrated that Allah's Messenger p.b.u.h said:

"Whoever seeks Allah's Pleasure at the cost of men's displeasure, will win the Pleasure of Allah and Allah will cause men to be pleased with him. Whoever seeks to please man at the cost of Allah's displeasure, will win the displeasure of Allah, and Allaah will cause men to be displeased with Him."

[Reported by Ibn Hibban in his Sahih]


www.Quraan.com

[Outcider]

Raafi quoted: "Whoever seeks to please man at the cost of Allah's displeasure, will win the displeasure of Allah, and Allaah will cause men to be displeased with Him."

What a complicated way of saying a simple thing. Or maybe I just don't understand complicated sentences!

If you want to honour somebody's graduation, marriage or victory, the question certainly cannot cause Allah displeasure! Shouldn't he be pleased, if his people are happy? If anyone knew what Allah thinks himself, but maybe that's too much to ask even in the case of the most devout Muslims.

As for the shooting thing mentioned by Ibn. etc and Kohr-Ah, yes, I had seen TV pictures of this way of celebration, but somehow I couldn't comprehend that it was a way of merrymaking. Does Allah really approve of that?

[AbuMubarak]

Outsider, i hope that my arrogance is under control and i hope tht my arrogance doesnt disway you from islam

but who are you that every iota of islam needs to be explained to you

you fail to understand the basis, which is recognition of the One True God, then recognition of His Messenger, and then establishing the salat

if you havent entered the arena, how can you expect to understand the internal intricasies of islam

for example, Allah commands women to cover, you have a problem with that, so you will not be able to understand much else

Allah commands the making of salat, which you dont do

Allah commands wholehearted obedience, which you dont do

so you sit at your computer, and request explanation to items that are waaaay beyond your comprehension

[Outcider]

Raafi, thanks a lot for your answers! Surely you are quite right, I don't understand much by your standards, but there are many of us who don't understand either.

I just happened to read in a magazine yesterday that in actual fact Allah didn't think this way: "Allah commands women to cover, you have a problem with that, so you will not be able to understand much else".

The report was about women in Iran and there was a brief mention that Allah, in fact, never ordered women to cover their heads or many of the other parts.

Can you pinpoint the place where the order is given, so I can look it up in my Qu'ran myself. There may have been a mistake in the report.

And I am not asking you any interpretations, but the actual place! Thanks in advance.

[Outcider]

Originally posted by ibn ul ibn aadam
Outsider,

I can't see why firing an Ak into the air would be cause for Allah's displeasure. It is a way of showing happiness, more than anything else it does not contradict anything in Islam.

Consider it like fireworks. Just under different circumstances.

Possibly you are right. We should really know his present opinion.

[Machiavelli]

bogata:1999
15 people killed by shots apparently fired into the air. All died from bullet wounds they recieved to the top of their heads.
kabul:1984
3 people killed by rounds shot into the air.
kansas city:2000
kansas city reported its first death of the year when a man was killed by a bullet fired into the air during new years eve celebrations.
all stories are from the AP.

see, with fireworks they dont come down like screaming projectiles. what kinda moron fires a gun up into the air and expects the bullet to never come down? I guess no one ever taught them safe handling of deadly weapons. judging from the al qaeda videos they dont recieve much of any useful training.

"oh well duhh the odds are so slim someone will be hit! and even then it can't be proved i fired that shot. ah duhh"

[Info.]

fireworks has killed more people than using guns at celebrations. The latest was at mexico or someplace where around 20 some people died and scores got injured. Lets not forget about japan.

[Abu_Isa]

Asalaamu alaikum.

"One would believe that a graduation, wedding, victory etc. would be a happy moment and worth celebrating in one way or another."

To Outsider,
I think you are under the misconception that Muslims dont have fun! heh heh.

and Jazakallah khair to Raafi, who i think explained it quite well when he posted a saying of Muhammad (peace be upon Him):

"Whoever seeks Allah's Pleasure at the cost of men's displeasure, will win the Pleasure of Allah and Allah will cause men to be pleased with him. Whoever seeks to please man at the cost of Allah's displeasure, will win the displeasure of Allah, and Allaah will cause men to be displeased with Him."


But having said that there ARE celebrations that we as Muslims are involved in. These celebrations are those that have been given to us by God Almighty.

To quote one shaykh when asked about Islamic celebrations, he states :

"As Muslims, we celebrate only two ‘eid (festivals): ‘eid ul-fitr (after the end of Ramadhan), and ‘eid ul-Udh-ha, the day of the greater hajj (pilgrimage). During these two festivals, we offer felicitations, spread joy, and entertain children. But more importantly, we offer remembrance of Allaah's blessings, celebrate His name and offer the ‘eid salaat (prayer). Other than these two occasions, we do not recognize or celebrate any other days in the year.

Of course, there are other joyous occasions for which the Islamic shari’ah dictates appropriate celebration, such as gathering for special meals during weddings or on the occasion of the birth of a child (aqeeqah). However, these days are not specified as particular days in the year; rather, they are celebrated as they happen in the course of a Muslim’s life."

So there is celebrations in islam. and we stick to the celebrations that have been prescribed to us, rather than celebrations from culture, or those of another faith (i.e Christmas etc)

When having these celebrations, it is a joyous occassion where the unity of muslims, (irrelevent of race) is practised and enjoin in the blessings from the All Mighty in acordance to the Islamic Law.

I hope this helps.

All praise is due to Al Khaaliq (The Creator)
Wa Allahu alam. (And Allah knows best.)

[Lala]

I guess I wonder why Outsider keeps asking about a booze oriented rite in a culture that denies booze?

Maybe you have to rephrase you question?
For example, at christian & jewish weddings, the guests can rise, hold up thier cup, and say something nice about the groom, or bride or both, the we all take a sip.

Is something similar done at an islamic wedding? A ritual where the guests can spontaneously praise the couple or the individuals, and have everybody join in the sentiment?

Lala

[Outcider]

Lala, the connection to booze was purely accidental. I didn't even think of it earlier. Besides, there are lots of non-alcoholic beverages.

So, anyone who wishes to to answer that question could think of answering whether rice seeds are thrown upon a couple after a wedding ceremony. What, if anything, is used instead of rice, which to my understanding is not prohibited.

[Info.]

there was nothing accidental in your questions outsider. You just keep saying that to keep your behind from getting banned. Your days here are numbered old man just like your teeth.

[Machiavelli]

the original post clearly suggests no booze by saying 'surely muslims dont have champagne in their glasses'

does every little thing need to be nitpicked on the basis of semantics and connotations? or can ppl just answer the question??

how do muslims toast/salut someone?

[Lala]

mmm but they probably don;t have glasses -- wine has a special significance in culture that partake of it -- (wine in the mass -- the couple shares wine at a jewish wedding, in classical culture there was a god and awhole set of ritual attached to wine) we raise a glass of booze for that very reason -- we would have no reason to raise a glass of fruit juice,or tea .. Thus it really isn't semantic quibbling on my part -- its recognizing a cultural/anthopological thang- the idea of speaking a toast to somone is culturally completely bound up and tied to the alchohol. An alcohol free culture would have no reason to do such a thing. Do you see what I mean?

[Machiavelli]

There are lots of examples of people offering up a toast to people without using booze in western culture. Now it may happen that as you have more booze in ya, you toast more, but the two aren't co-dependent