View Full Version : "Summer babies" starting school 1 year early
Asalaam alaikum
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/7178969.stm
what do u guys think of summer children (i.e. born in the summer months) having to start education 1 year earlier i.e. at 4years old, yet children born the following month (september) get to wait a whole year till they are 5 yrs old to start.
I feel summer babies have a big disadvantage, they are in classes where most of the class is 1 year older than them, they have to work that lil bit harder to "keep up", now even education ministers are wanting a review, as this can potentially affect a child's education up until GCSE's..
I want to request my boy's school to put him a year back, so he is with children his own age and doesnt always have to do extra work jus to keep up with an average grade!
Comments from people who are or have been in this predicament would be great and people who are in the education field.
jazakallah
Phoenix CG
11-01-08, 04:27 PM
I was a summer baby :D was the youngest in the year
ze leetle elper
11-01-08, 05:21 PM
I was 3rd youngest :p And my best friend in my class and throughout school years was 1 year and 16 days older than me... :p
i was youngest in class wasnt eva at a disadvantage. Actually its quite good being youngest coz it motivates u todo aswell as those older den you and when u do better u can call em dumb old people.
.: Anna :.
11-01-08, 05:44 PM
sis i dont think it makes such a difference? me and my sis summer babies we never felt it difficult to keep up with the others or felt affected by it.
r u sure about putting him back bc he might have to repeat a year then?
i was youngest in class wasnt eva at a disadvantage. Actually its quite good being youngest coz it motivates u todo aswell as those older den you and when u do better u can call em dumb old people.
sis i dont think it makes such a difference? me and my sis summer babies we never felt it difficult to keep up with the others or felt affected by it.
r u sure about putting him back bc he might have to repeat a year then?
he is mashallah doing really well but i feel thats only becos im doing stuff at home with him nearly everyday , otherwise he wouldnt be getting the results he is getting in tests etc.
Even the kids in his class look like proper grown up and there is lil o' him in there...
I dont feel it would be a bad thing if he repeats a year, if they agree he will only be repeating about 5-6months not a whole year and i think thats an advantage bcos he doesnt have to feel like he is playing catch up to the older kids in his class cos their more mentally mature etc, if he goes a year back, he is with kids his own age, can take his time and not have to work so hard at home as well, jus to meet the normal test scores and get to the normal levels that older boys in his class are expected to reach?
Most parents i have spoken to and have had summer babies, wish that their child had gone back year and therefore it would be less pressure on them.
I dont even know if the headteacher will agree,im seeing him next week inshallah he does :rubeyes:
ummbilal
11-01-08, 06:54 PM
I think children by year 2 are on the same level, many winter babies spend that extra year at home and are more ready to join school at reception but i think if the school is good and makes the transition from nursery to reception it really doesnt make that much difference, and this is coming from a mum who used to home educate, many home educators do so because they feel their children are not ready for school at 4.
I made a big thing about this with my second son and i think my attention to it caused him some confidence problems, next child was a august baby and hes in a great nurturing school, hes one of the youngest and yet is gaining confidence and is quite happy.
I wish every parent had the right to choose whether to send their child to school at 4 or 5 but as it is, if the teachers are attentive and caring your son should be fine inshaallah.
ummbilal
11-01-08, 06:56 PM
also..how does your son feel about this, you could seriously knock his confidence by putting him back, esspecially if hes been working really hard he'll think he wasnt working hard enough...but allahu alam, i know you are just a concerned mum, how old is your son?
Phoenix CG
11-01-08, 06:59 PM
hm i always was like haha im the youngest and im in a higher group then u..could be a good thing for ur kid.
insomniac
11-01-08, 07:02 PM
yeah I'm a late summer baby too - but I don't think it keeps you behind actually gives you a challenge - if you start at the level then to be honest your at advantage over your peers due to you age too :) alhamdulillah it has it's plus sides :)
do you feel it's affecting your son's abilities and keeping him behind?
Noor_Usman
11-01-08, 07:23 PM
Asalamalikum.
My brother is always the oldest in the class as his b-day is 2nd sept.
The girl accross the road from us was the youngest...her birthday was late August.
And trust me! When you saw them side by side you could tell that he was a year older - and girls are meant to mature faster than boys. But even up until high school she always looked like she was "pretending to be older"...even compaired to the other kids :rolleyes:
It's certainly not a good thing :(
insomniac
11-01-08, 07:24 PM
:scratch:
but then where is the cut off date - someone will always be at one end of the age spectrum and another at the other end..... :confused:
$HugoBoss$
11-01-08, 07:38 PM
The earlier the better, the faster education you get and the earlier you earn $$$$ and the sooner you can look for a mate ;)
Another summer baby here and i dont think it really made much of a difference at all! My sister is a later summer baby and again- no probs Alhamdullilah :) If anything it makes you feel good that youre able to handle the work that kids nearly a year older then you are doing! Infact in honesty, i didnt even think of it in that way.
ibn suleman
11-01-08, 08:01 PM
im a summer baby too :D
i dont think it makes a difference
Me and my older sister are both summer babies too, n yeh academically, i don't think it has made that much of a difference :)
I think children by year 2 are on the same level, many winter babies spend that extra year at home and are more ready to join school at reception but i think if the school is good and makes the transition from nursery to reception it really doesnt make that much difference, and this is coming from a mum who used to home educate, many home educators do so because they feel their children are not ready for school at 4.
I made a big thing about this with my second son and i think my attention to it caused him some confidence problems, next child was a august baby and hes in a great nurturing school, hes one of the youngest and yet is gaining confidence and is quite happy.
I wish every parent had the right to choose whether to send their child to school at 4 or 5 but as it is, if the teachers are attentive and caring your son should be fine inshaallah.
yes i mean this is what the govt wants to review, cos in some areas kids start at 6yrs old :rubeyes:
how do u know/think it caused him confidence problems? how did u tell him about it?
also..how does your son feel about this, you could seriously knock his confidence by putting him back, esspecially if hes been working really hard he'll think he wasnt working hard enough...but allahu alam, i know you are just a concerned mum, how old is your son?
my boy was like "noooooooo!" and "why!!!!!" and i didnt wanna go into the complexities ans also dont want him to think he is not working hard enuff like u said but he is like "i dont want to move mummy" at the mo ...:rubeyes:
yeah I'm a late summer baby too - but I don't think it keeps you behind actually gives you a challenge - if you start at the level then to be honest your at advantage over your peers due to you age too :) alhamdulillah it has it's plus sides :)
do you feel it's affecting your son's abilities and keeping him behind?
i think if they are in the year they are SUPPOSED to be in from the start then they can take their time and have more chance of getting better grades becos they are not always being "challenged" mentally (dont know if that made sense!)
ummbilal
11-01-08, 08:26 PM
MG, if your son is happy and doing well dont rock the boat by changing his year group, trust me i upset my little boy too often by doing what i felt was best without really stepping back to look at the big picture, as of now my oldest is on his fifth school and spent several years being home educated, while i dont regret any decisions i made i do regret all the up heavel for him as a child.
If your son is happy and doing well, remember he has many years until GCSE and lets face it they dont count for jack anyway...he could be an internet wizkid at 15! or a sheikh..inshaallah make your duas and do what u feel is right but dont forget to look at the big picture, and think how it will affect him as a child.
hth
encourage him in what hes good at and help with the other stuff, i used to push and push, my eldest was doing GCSE maths when home educated, but he hated it, so i stepped back, now hes at school hes top in math but because he wants to be, not coz i am there nagging him..stafiglah..
as mothers its never going to be 100% perfect, but if your son has done ok up until now, and hes happy, why change things, also i have to say i am yet to meet a parent who has successfully got their child held back a year at school and i know several who have tried.
Have you ever thought about home educating your son?
http://www.education-otherwise.org/
http://www.islamichomeeducation.co.uk/
Inshaallah you'll make the best decision for your son x
Allah reward you for your efforts and time worrying about him, us mums have a hard job mashallah.
Me and my older sister are both summer babies too, n yeh academically, i don't think it has made that much of a difference :)
Another summer baby here and i dont think it really made much of a difference at all! My sister is a later summer baby and again- no probs Alhamdullilah :) If anything it makes you feel good that youre able to handle the work that kids nearly a year older then you are doing! Infact in honesty, i didnt even think of it in that way.
yeah I'm a late summer baby too - but I don't think it keeps you behind actually gives you a challenge - if you start at the level then to be honest your at advantage over your peers due to you age too :) alhamdulillah it has it's plus sides :)
do you feel it's affecting your son's abilities and keeping him behind?
sis i dont think it makes such a difference? me and my sis summer babies we never felt it difficult to keep up with the others or felt affected by it.
r u sure about putting him back bc he might have to repeat a year then?
i was youngest in class wasnt eva at a disadvantage. Actually its quite good being youngest coz it motivates u todo aswell as those older den you and when u do better u can call em dumb old people.
how do u guys know it hasnt made a difference to you? :p
maybe you could all have been even more better than than u are now mashallah, if u had been kept behind a year with kids of your own age?
hmmmmm.....
MG, if your son is happy and doing well dont rock the boat by changing his year group, trust me i upset my little boy too often by doing what i felt was best without really stepping back to look at the big picture, as of now my oldest is on his fifth school and spent several years being home educated, while i dont regret any decisions i made i do regret all the up heavel for him as a child.
If your son is happy and doing well, remember he has many years until GCSE and lets face it they dont count for jack anyway...he could be an internet wizkid at 15! or a sheikh..inshaallah make your duas and do what u feel is right but dont forget to look at the big picture, and think how it will affect him as a child.
hth
encourage him in what hes good at and help with the other stuff, i used to push and push, my eldest was doing GCSE maths when home educated, but he hated it, so i stepped back, now hes at school hes top in math but because he wants to be, not coz i am there nagging him..stafiglah..
as mothers its never going to be 100% perfect, but if your son has done ok up until now, and hes happy, why change things, also i have to say i am yet to meet a parent who has successfully got their child held back a year at school and i know several who have tried.
Have you ever thought about home educating your son?
http://www.education-otherwise.org/
http://www.islamichomeeducation.co.uk/
Inshaallah you'll make the best decision for your son x
Allah reward you for your efforts and time worrying about him, us mums have a hard job mashallah.
see my PM sis :up:
the difficulty i feel is finding the balance, becos yes now they might be doing well but what about when it comes towards the end and they find they woulda done better if they were a year back? and it would be to little to late :rubeyes:
ummbilal
11-01-08, 09:08 PM
sister i am a summer baby, throughout secondary school i was way ahead of my winter baby mates..coz i worked hard...what time of year i was born was irrelevant after yr 2!
sometimes parents can be funny, if a child doesnt do too well at GCSE they say all kinds of things...the examiners are bias..my child shouldnt be in this year..my fav(NOT) is, the school is racisit....some asian girls at school said this to their parents whenever they did badly..sigh..
sister..
honestly it sounds like your little man is doing just fine, let him find his feet, dont pull the rug from under him, keep teaching him at home and encouraging but let him gain his confidence, he needs to feel like a little man, no child wants mummy rushing in all the time..trust me my eldest who is 12 has even asked me to back off.....:rubeyes: and hubby agreed!
insomniac
11-01-08, 09:10 PM
how do u guys know it hasnt made a difference to you? :p
maybe you could all have been even more better than than u are now mashallah, if u had been kept behind a year with kids of your own age?
hmmmmm.....
lol never worry about the ifs is my motto - :insha: assess how he does - he'll just get things done earlier if he stays in his present year insha'Allaah :) - he'll have an extra year later on insha'Allaah :)
The earlier the better, the faster education you get and the earlier you earn $$$$ and the sooner you can look for a mate ;)
I'm an August baby and so was always the youngest in my year. I agree with Hugo I don't think it was a disadvantage at all- in fact I think it was an advantage as it gave me a bit of an early headstart. The only way I'd have seen it as a disadvantage would be if I clearly lagged behind due to being younger and having the bar set too high for my age in terms of my level of work- but that never happened. In fact I was always above average in my class and it was never an issue that I was younger than anyone else cos' we were all still born within the same 12 month bracket (except those put back a year were older than us obviously but then they seemed a little out of place among us).
I think your son should stay where he is if he's adjusting well there. It could give him an advantage in future. If he wants to take a gap year out after school then he could return to studies and still be amongst people his own age- so this can open up other opportunities for him.
Unique Muslimah
11-01-08, 10:44 PM
I was a summer baby,i was a whole year ahead,youngest by far in my class:Dwas so fun
.: Anna :.
12-01-08, 06:22 AM
sis he is doing well and doesnt wna move i agree with umm bilal its better if u dont, and i think it would affect his confidence.. at that age he will see it like he had to go back cos not good enough :(
as u said if u didnt work with him at home he wouldnt be doing well, imo that is true whatever age they are in the class.. because class size is big they dnt get individual attention, they need extra attention at home and parents to show interest in education as u doing. even if he was a sept baby, if u dont do that he wont do as good as he can do.
i think dont worry sis, it seems like he is doing fine?
dhakiyya
12-01-08, 08:48 AM
A lot of schools don't start summer kids in september, they have to wait until the term before their 5th birthday, so they actually get one or two fewer terms in infant school. When my cousin was five the schools in his area were so oversubscribed they were only taking kids the term *after* their fifth birthday, he was a summer baby so he actually would have been starting a whole year later than if he'd been in a different part of the country, and he could already read and count and stuff so his parents sent him to private school for a year, because they felt he was definitely ready for school.
Not all kids are ready for school when they have just turned four, some are. Having kids doing formal education too young can be harmful to their confidence, a lot of nursery and infant schools push kids into learning they're not ready for. Meanwhile some kids are ready for school before schools are willing to take them, many can already read and even add up when they go to school yet are given the same work as the other kids, the time when kids are started in school is based purely on age, not on their level of development - kids who are later in their development are not given a chance to catch up before being moved on with the rest of the kids.... that causes big problems which last throughout a kids education.
Anyway there are many many problems with they way schools operate - suffice it to say most likely I'm home edcuating inshaAllah.
hmm jazakallah for all your comments, i talked to my boy (but obviously have to becareful what i say becos as u say, dont want him to think its cos he is not good enuff) but he aint budging, he is a stern "no, i dont want to move"....ill cancel my appt for now maybe and have a further think about it
dhakiyya
12-01-08, 06:14 PM
Please take into consideration your son's ability before making a decision inshaAllah. There is more difference in ability between kids in the same yeargroup, than there is between the average child in year 7 and the average child in year 11. In other words, if all the kids in a whole secondary school were to take the same test, a very small number of year 7 kids would get higher scores than a very small number of year 11 students.
Kids at both ends of the ability spectrum have problems in school because the curriculum is geared up for the average child. The problems that kids with below average ability have will be exaggerated if they are also the youngest in the year. Below average kids are not given time to properly learn at their own pace, instead they are constantly being moved on with the average child. This means they are constantly failing to learn then being expected to do harder work that they a) don't have the foundation upon which to learn it and b) even if they had they'd still need longer to learn it! This obviously has dire consequences for the child's confidence and so they stop trying and learn even less. The further their ability is from average, the worse this problem will be and the more they'll struggle. If they are also the youngest in the year - then they'll be just that little bit further behind the average child. Even a child who is average ability or very close to average ability will be just that little bit behind as a result of being a summer baby. Its these kids who make up the statistical difference when compared to winter babies. These kids will also benefit from being moved to the year below, because they'll be that much less behind as a result. Although if a child's ability is quite a lot behind the average it won't make a huge difference.
For kids with above average ability, they face different problems, and if they are a lot above average ability, the small difference between summer and winter babies will not be noticable. Kids who have above average ability are likely to find schoolwork boring and unchallenging, if they read a lot at home they may know half or even more than that (in some cases all!) of what the teacher is teaching them. They get used to finding everything easy so they don't try hard, and later on in school can mess up because they've never encountered anything difficult before. If they are a lot above average ability, they may prefer the company of older children, and make friends with kids in higher year groups, and can have difficulty making close friendships within their class. To move such a child down a year because they are a summer baby would do more harm than good - it would increase the gap between their ability and the work that they are expected to do, and if they do prefer the company of older children then it would be crazy to put them in a class of younger children.
Anyway inshaAllah I hope this gives you information inshaAllah to help you make the right decision for your son inshaAllah. It really depends on his ability whether such a move would do good, or cause worse problems inshaAllah.
.: Anna :.
12-01-08, 07:23 PM
thats actually what i was gonna mention aswell, as he is doing okay or well in his current class, repeating year may be boring for him.. can be TOO easy which can lead him disliking school because he is so bored, then he can become disruptive in lessons thru boredom? also if bored and seperated from the friends in his year he might start wanting to skip school and give u trouble going there in mornings... so u may be better of letting him stay in his class sis
Please take into consideration your son's ability before making a decision inshaAllah. There is more difference in ability between kids in the same yeargroup, than there is between the average child in year 7 and the average child in year 11. In other words, if all the kids in a whole secondary school were to take the same test, a very small number of year 7 kids would get higher scores than a very small number of year 11 students.
Kids at both ends of the ability spectrum have problems in school because the curriculum is geared up for the average child. The problems that kids with below average ability have will be exaggerated if they are also the youngest in the year. Below average kids are not given time to properly learn at their own pace, instead they are constantly being moved on with the average child. This means they are constantly failing to learn then being expected to do harder work that they a) don't have the foundation upon which to learn it and b) even if they had they'd still need longer to learn it! This obviously has dire consequences for the child's confidence and so they stop trying and learn even less. The further their ability is from average, the worse this problem will be and the more they'll struggle. If they are also the youngest in the year - then they'll be just that little bit further behind the average child. Even a child who is average ability or very close to average ability will be just that little bit behind as a result of being a summer baby. Its these kids who make up the statistical difference when compared to winter babies. These kids will also benefit from being moved to the year below, because they'll be that much less behind as a result. Although if a child's ability is quite a lot behind the average it won't make a huge difference.
For kids with above average ability, they face different problems, and if they are a lot above average ability, the small difference between summer and winter babies will not be noticable. Kids who have above average ability are likely to find schoolwork boring and unchallenging, if they read a lot at home they may know half or even more than that (in some cases all!) of what the teacher is teaching them. They get used to finding everything easy so they don't try hard, and later on in school can mess up because they've never encountered anything difficult before. If they are a lot above average ability, they may prefer the company of older children, and make friends with kids in higher year groups, and can have difficulty making close friendships within their class. To move such a child down a year because they are a summer baby would do more harm than good - it would increase the gap between their ability and the work that they are expected to do, and if they do prefer the company of older children then it would be crazy to put them in a class of younger children.
Anyway inshaAllah I hope this gives you information inshaAllah to help you make the right decision for your son inshaAllah. It really depends on his ability whether such a move would do good, or cause worse problems inshaAllah.
aslaam alaikum
sis i got some of what u sed in there but i found the rest quite confusing to understand :rubeyes: u knwo how slow i am sis....are u saying what anna is saying below?
thats actually what i was gonna mention aswell, as he is doing okay or well in his current class, repeating year may be boring for him.. can be TOO easy which can lead him disliking school because he is so bored, then he can become disruptive in lessons thru boredom? also if bored and seperated from the friends in his year he might start wanting to skip school and give u trouble going there in mornings... so u may be better of letting him stay in his class sis
he is doing ok with school work, although the main complaint i get every year is that he becomes easily distracted etc thats a re-ocurring complaint but thats normal right?
im more worried about knocking his confidence if i were to put him back a year, like the example sis ummbillal gave of her son?
he is doing ok with school work, although the main complaint i get every year is that he becomes easily distracted etc thats a re-ocurring complaint but thats normal right?
That's absolutely normal- especially for boys!
in_exile
12-01-08, 09:16 PM
nooooooooo
trust me dont put him back...
i was one of the youngest in my year....it is so good with development when you are with elder children but still you are younger so your brain can pick up things quicker than they can thus you have an advantage over them....
you see there is a steady rate of decline as you get older to the ammount of new information you are able to process, so the rate of learning actually decreases as you grow older.... that is why children should be exposed to the basics of learning much younger than they are know.... because that will mean the basics are much easier for them when they grow....
trust me biggest mistake you will make is if you put him back....
no formal education until at least 7! :nono:
kids need to play... let their energy out...interact with other kids whilst playing etc... the last thing they need is to be sitting down stuck in a class.
kids will get plenty of time to catch up with their education later on.
i started school quite late... must have been about 5-6 years old. although i was quite behind compared to the rest of the class at first, i soon caught up and even overtook most the others by the time i finished secondary school.
in_exile
12-01-08, 11:17 PM
no formal education until at least 7! :nono:
kids need to play... let their energy out...interact with other kids whilst playing etc... the last thing they need is to be sitting down stuck in a class.
kids will get plenty of time to catch up with their education later on.
i started school quite late... must have been about 5-6 years old. although i was quite behind compared to the rest of the class at first, i soon caught up and even overtook most the others by the time i finished secondary school.
7 no way.... education should start at a very ung age... they dont have to go to school, can even be with the mother.... the sooner they start the better for them.... u just need to make the education fun and part of their play as well
nooooooooo
trust me dont put him back...
i was one of the youngest in my year....it is so good with development when you are with elder children but still you are younger so your brain can pick up things quicker than they can thus you have an advantage over them....
you see there is a steady rate of decline as you get older to the ammount of new information you are able to process, so the rate of learning actually decreases as you grow older.... that is why children should be exposed to the basics of learning much younger than they are know.... because that will mean the basics are much easier for them when they grow....
trust me biggest mistake you will make is if you put him back....
yes but what about the pressures of having to "keep up"?
no formal education until at least 7! :nono:
kids need to play... let their energy out...interact with other kids whilst playing etc... the last thing they need is to be sitting down stuck in a class.
kids will get plenty of time to catch up with their education later on.
i started school quite late... must have been about 5-6 years old. although i was quite behind compared to the rest of the class at first, i soon caught up and even overtook most the others by the time i finished secondary school.
7? *faints*
.: Anna :.
13-01-08, 04:55 AM
aslaam alaikum
sis i got some of what u sed in there but i found the rest quite confusing to understand :rubeyes: u knwo how slow i am sis....are u saying what anna is saying below?
he is doing ok with school work, although the main complaint i get every year is that he becomes easily distracted etc thats a re-ocurring complaint but thats normal right?
im more worried about knocking his confidence if i were to put him back a year, like the example sis ummbillal gave of her son?
sis i think that complaint is quite common and it can sometimes be because the child is very bright and finds the work boring? or maybe he has a dif preference of learning.. like better with hands on type thing than from books/writing? u think that could be the case? one of my nephews is a bit like that, he likes the practical side and he is very clever but doesnt like to sit down and do this spelling etc and things, although he can do it, doesnt want to concentrate. was watching something on c5 the other day aswell were this brain trainer woman took primary school kids and helped them in ways of learning, the one she took to the end he was very bright bt better in practical and kinesthetic (i think is the word?) learning than just sitting there.. so she took him to do spelling by diving in the swimming pool and fishing out letters and all that kind of stuff and it helped him? dnt know if that kind of thing will b relevant for ur son or not?
dhakiyya
13-01-08, 08:31 AM
Yeah, its what Anna said:
to sum up - below average kids may benefit from being moved down a year.
above average kids it will make their problems worse.
If you want more detailed advice inshaAllah can you pm me some more detailed info about him and I can give advice - being easily distracted is normal behaviour, can occur for a number of reasons. If its happening in your son because he finds the work too easy and is bored in class he should definintely NOT move down a year because the work will be more boring for him, he'll be more distractable.
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