Arabic Grammar

[Sulaiman Harun]

:start:

:salams

:alhumdull

I studied, in year 12, Arabic of year 6 in AD which no doubt was a bit hard for me just a bit! I remember studying some stuff like maf'ool bihi, maf'ool mutlaq, something called mansoob, majzoub, marfoo', majroor and etc..

Can someone help me regarding these grammatical terms?

:jkk:

:wswrwb:

[.: Anna :.]

okay yeh i will try

maf3ool bihi means "object" of the sentence
mansoob is in the case which takes a fatha, aka accusative
majzoom is in the jussive, these r the ones which have a sukoon or can b closed up like yakun instead of yakoon
majroor is with a kasra, aka genetive
marfoo3 is the standard one with the damma, nomnitive case
maf3ool mu6laq is called absolute object, erm i have forgotten wat this is tho sorry

neway i found for u one glossary explaning wat the terms in arabic are called in english, altho it doesnt hav explanation so if u forget totally wat something is like wat i have done for the mafool mutlaq then it doesnt explain
still insha allah it can b useful for u

http://www.dalilusa.com/Arabic_Course/glossary_arabic_grammar.asp

[Sulaiman Harun]

:start:

:salams

:jkk: sis!

[arab]

http://www.languageguide.org/arabic

[Sulaiman Harun]

:start:

:salams and :jkk: brother!!!

[Sulaiman Harun]

:start:

:salams

When you want to say "they do"(feminine) in plural form, do we say:

تَفْعَلْنَ
or is it يفْعَلْنَ?

[the_middle_road]

:start:

:salams

When you want to say "they do"(feminine) in plural form, do we say:

تَفْعَلْنَ
or is it يفْعَلْنَ?

:wswrwb:

It's the second one.

[.: Anna :.]

the second as middle road said but just to try and explain to make it easy for you...

ya on the front is for the third person, like yaf3al - he does, yaf3aloon - they do, so its logical also for the women yaf3alna with a ya for third person.
ta for 2nd person like taf3al - u do, taf3aloon - you lot do, then taf3alna would be for women only "you do"
but because female "she" in 3rd person also uses a ta i think that is the reason for the confusion.
but u can think of ya for the third person, and nun un niswa for the female plural... then u put them together, and that is how u get yaf3alna.
lol i hope that made sense and did not just make things worse :p

[chechnya]

maf3ool mu6laq is called absolute object, erm i have forgotten wat this is tho sorry

neway i found for u one glossary explaning wat the terms in arabic are called in english, altho it doesnt hav explanation so if u forget totally wat something is like wat i have done for the mafool mutlaq then it doesnt explain
still insha allah it can b useful for u

http://www.dalilusa.com/Arabic_Course/glossary_arabic_grammar.asp
salamu 'aleikum
maf3ool mu6laq is a masdar mansoub, yadhkarou ba3da fi3il...mathalan :
أكل أكلاً كثيراً
akalou aklan kathiran : i3raabou aklan : maf3ool mu6laq mansoub wa 3alamoutou nasbihi alfetra athahira 3ala akhirihi
Wa Allahou 'alam
[sorry for mistakes in the phonetic transcription]

[Sulaiman Harun]

تَفْعَلُ
is used for saying You Do (masculine) and She Does right?

Are these grammatically correct?:

هِيَ تَفْعَلُ الوَاجِبْ؟
اَنْتَ تَفْعَلُ الوَاجِبْ؟

[Sulaiman Harun]

the second as middle road said but just to try and explain to make it easy for you...

ya on the front is for the third person, like yaf3al - he does, yaf3aloon - they do, so its logical also for the women yaf3alna with a ya for third person.
ta for 2nd person like taf3al - u do, taf3aloon - you lot do, then taf3alna would be for women only "you do"
but because female "she" in 3rd person also uses a ta i think that is the reason for the confusion.
but u can think of ya for the third person, and nun un niswa for the female plural... then u put them together, and that is how u get yaf3alna.
lol i hope that made sense and did not just make things worse :p

no sister, I understand it very well! <smiles>

[the_middle_road]

تَفْعَلُ
is used for saying You Do (masculine) and She Does right?

Are these grammatically correct?:

هِيَ تَفْعَلُ الوَاجِبْ؟
اَنْتَ تَفْعَلُ الوَاجِبْ؟

It's correct. Although the word al-waajib should have gotten a fathah since it is the object of the sentence. The object should be mansub.

[chechnya]

It's correct. Although the word al-waajib should have gotten a fathah since it is the object of the sentence. The object should be mansub.
sahih, but not in the end of the sentence [In the end of sentence, all words are saakina, the same when you speak in arabic]
Wa Allahou a'lam

[the_middle_road]

sahih, but not in the end of the sentence [In the end of sentence, all words are saakina, the same when you speak in arabic]
Wa Allahou a'lam

But if you were asked to give the i'rab of that sentence, then what would it be?

[.: Anna :.]

yes but you never actually write a sukoon on it.. you just pronounce it without the sound but write what should be there?
well that is how i learned.

[chechnya]

But if you were asked to give the i'rab of that sentence, then what would it be?
You use the means for the i3raab. The majority of books in arabic haven t harakaat, so you understand the book with the means in the sentence.
And u know all words in the end of the sentence are saakina, so any problem for the i3raab.

[.: Anna :.]

yes it doesnt have harakat written, its fine to just not write it, but to literally place a sukoon on there is grammatically not correct... this is his point

[Saudi Prince]

تَفْعَلُ
is used for saying You Do (masculine) and She Does right?

Are these grammatically correct?:

هِيَ تَفْعَلُ الوَاجِبْ؟
اَنْتَ تَفْعَلُ الوَاجِبْ؟

Strictly speaking no! You need to use a proper verb. For example.

هي تؤدي الواجبَ
أنت تؤدي الواجبَ

[Saudi Prince]

okay yeh i will try

maf3ool bihi means "object" of the sentence
mansoob is in the case which takes a fatha, aka accusative
majzoom is in the jussive, these r the ones which have a sukoon or can b closed up like yakun instead of yakoon
majroor is with a kasra, aka genetive
marfoo3 is the standard one with the damma, nomnitive case
maf3ool mu6laq is called absolute object, erm i have forgotten wat this is tho sorry

neway i found for u one glossary explaning wat the terms in arabic are called in english, altho it doesnt hav explanation so if u forget totally wat something is like wat i have done for the mafool mutlaq then it doesnt explain
still insha allah it can b useful for u

http://www.dalilusa.com/Arabic_Course/glossary_arabic_grammar.asp


Mansoob can take a kasrah aswell- like in jam3 almo2annath assalem.

إن الحسناتِ يذهبن السيئات

Mansoob can also take ya2 instead of wow like in jam3 almothakkar assalem

جاء المسلمون..................رأيت المسلمين

or 'ya2' instead of 'alef' like in almothanna.

قالت الفتاتان...................شجعت الفتاتين

Mjroor can also take ya2 and not just kasra.
So, It's not that simple there are many rules to be learnt.

[.: Anna :.]

Yes jazakallah khayr I was just explaining it for singular nouns

[Sulaiman Harun]

:start:

:alhumdull

:salams

1) Just wanted to make sure if I am right:

مَا means What or whatever depending on the context
أَيْنَ مَا means Wherever
أَيٌمَا means Whichever
مَنْ means Who or whoever depending on the context



Was (m) is كَانَ
Was (f) is كَانَتْ


I do not remember what is IS


Were (m) is كَانُوْا
Were (f) is كَانُوْا
Are (m) is يَكُونُون
Are (f)is تَكُونُون


2) Is this grammatically correct:

هَوَ كَانَ فِي الْمَدْرَسَة
He was in the school

Is it ok without هَوَ?

And if it was plural for masculine, it would have been كَانُوْا instead of كَانَ also with the addition of إٍنهُمْ right?



3) Why are some verbs' plural ending with Waau and Alif whilst other verbs end with Waau and noon?

[Enigma Dreamer]

:start:

:alhumdull

:salams

1) Just wanted to make sure if I am right:

مَا means What or whatever depending on the context
أَيْنَ مَا means Wherever
أَيٌمَا means Whichever
مَنْ means Who or whoever depending on the context



Was (m) is كَانَ
Was (f) is كَانَتْ


I do not remember what is IS


Were (m) is كَانُوْا
Were (f) is كَانُوْا
Are (m) is يَكُونُون
Are (f)is تَكُونُون


2) Is this grammatically correct:

هَوَ كَانَ فِي الْمَدْرَسَة
He was in the school

Is it ok without هَوَ?

And if it was plural for masculine, it would have been كَانُوْا instead of كَانَ also with the addition of إٍنهُمْ right?



3) Why are some verbs' plural ending with Waau and Alif whilst other verbs end with Waau and noon?



I think the first one. The female one should be kunna instead of kanu.
The second one, it seems that the ha has fath thereby reading as hawa, that is not right. It should be huwa with the 'ha' having raf'. Also for the plural of هَوَ كَانَ فِي الْمَدْرَسَة, you don't need to add إٍنهُمْ. All you need to do is, after changing kana to kanu as you did, change huwa to hum so that you have Hum kanu fil madarasah. This one I am not very well sure but I think the ones that end with noon are female plural one i.e. in male (plural) you will say 'hum sharibuu al maaa' and in female(plural) you would say 'hunna sharibnal maaa' so I guess it is about gender. Female plural end with noon and male plural end with waw.

[sunrise]

:start:

:alhumdull

:salams

1) Just wanted to make sure if I am right:

مَا means What or whatever depending on the context

'maa' means what and is used when asking questions that don't involve a verb e.g. 'what is your name?' but if the question involves a verb e.g. 'what are you DOING? then it would start with 'matha.'


أَيْنَ مَاmeans Wherever

yes but it is all one word


أَيٌمَا means Whichever

as far as i know whichever is 'ayy' (alif yaa' - just like which)


مَنْ means Who or whoever depending on the context

Yes, and is usually used in questions e.g. 'who is that?'


Was (m) is كَانَ

Correct

Was (f) is كَانَتْ


Correct
I do not remember what is IS

There is no 'is' in Arabic it is incorporated into the subject


Were (m) is كَانُوْا

Correct

Were (f) is كَانُوْا

Correct

Are (m) is يَكُونُون

yes

Are (f)is تَكُونُون



not sure what this means? what are you trying to say?


2) Is this grammatically correct:

هَوَ كَانَ فِي الْمَدْرَسَة

Yes but you don't need the 'Huwa'

He was in the school



Is it ok without هَوَ?

Yes it is, 'Kaana' indicates that it is a male, he it only used for masculine singular.


And if it was plural for masculine, it would have beenكَانُوْا instead ofكَانَ also with the addition ofإٍنهُمْ right?



Yes the plural is Kaanou, no you don't need 'inaahom' it depends on what you are saying.... 'inaahom' means usually depending on the sentence 'indeed they are...' or 'verily they are...' you can have 'kaanu' by itself.


3) Why are some verbs' plural ending with Waau and Alif whilst other verbs end with Waau and noon?

It depends on what tense it is, waw noun are present tense verbs and waw alif are either past tense verbs or in the subjunctive case.






See above for answers inshAllah, please if i have any mistakes please correct me.

[Sulaiman Harun]

not sure what this means? what are you trying to say?

Sis, by تَكُونُون I meant the feminine of يَكُونُون

[sunrise]

Sis, by تَكُونُون I meant the feminine of يَكُونُون


can you give a sentence using the word please?

[NiqaaBi_InBlack]

( تكتبون -انتم-plural male /or a group of female and male

the plural of female alone that would be انتن تكتبن (antunna taktubna)
*and we use this when the group ur talking too is present :المخطب

يكتبون -هم:is for plural male or a group of male and females who aren't present at that moment ur talking (al ghaaiib)

if u want to say something about a group of only females who aren't present u say: هن يكتبن (hunna yaktubna)

[Sulaiman Harun]

:start:

:salams

can you give a sentence using the word please?

For example:

هُمْ يَكُونُونْ فِي الْحَدِيقَة

So for female (plural) do we use تَكُونُون instead of the male form?( تكتبون -انتم-plural male /or a group of female and male

the plural of female alone that would be انتن تكتبن (antunna taktubna)
*and we use this when the group ur talking too is present :المخطب

يكتبون -هم:is for plural male or a group of male and females who aren't present at that moment ur talking (al ghaaiib)

if u want to say something about a group of only females who aren't present u say: هن يكتبن (hunna yaktubna)

:jkk: sister.

One question here, isn't همboth for male and female in plural form?

[sunrise]

:start:

:salams



For example:

هُمْ يَكُونُونْ فِي الْحَدِيقَة


It doesn't sound natural to say it this way, try not to translate from English to Arabic it won't always sound natural or necessarily be correct. Rather learn and see the natural flow of Arabic inshAllah, if you say 'Hom fil hadika' it carries the same meaning and sounds better. In English we have 'is' and 'are' but in Arabic it's in the subject so you don't need it.


So for female (plural) do we use تَكُونُون instead of the male form?

:jkk: sister.

One question here, isn't همboth for male and female in plural form?

Hom applies to males, and can apply to females if they are mixed with males e.g. you have a group mixed of males and females you can use 'hom' when describing them. However if it is a group of only females you would use 'Huna'.



See above inshAllah

[Enigma Dreamer]

:start:

:salams



For example:

هُمْ يَكُونُونْ فِي الْحَدِيقَة

So for female (plural) do we use تَكُونُون instead of the male form?

:jkk: sister.

One question here, isn't همboth for male and female in plural form?
I think the plural will be 'hunna yakuununna fil hadeeqah.' The plural of hum for female is, I think, hunna. I think you yourself pointed that out in your earlier post when you said: I quote.
يكتبون -هم:is for plural male or a group of male and females who aren't present at that moment ur talking (al ghaaiib)

if u want to say something about a group of only females who aren't present u say: هن يكتبن (hunna yaktubna)

[Sulaiman Harun]

:start:

See above inshAllah

So in what cases do I use Yakunoon or Yakununna?

كٌنْتٌ فِي الْمَسْجِدْ لَيْالَةِ الْمَاضِية
I was in the Masjid last night

Is this grammatically correct?

[Enigma Dreamer]

:start:



So in what cases do I use Yakunoona or Yakununna?[/SIZE]

I think the former for male and the latter for female with hum and hunna respectively.

كٌنْتٌ فِي الْمَسْجِدْ لَيْالَةِ الْمَاضِية
I was in the Masjid last night

Is this grammatically correct?

Yeah. It is grammatically correct but the spelling is wrong. There should be no alif between the ya and lam. It should be لَيْلَةِ

[Sulaiman Harun]

I think the former for male and the latter for female with hum and hunna respectively.



No bro, I know that but as sis sunrise said, "It doesn't sound natural to say it this way, try not to translate from English to Arabic it won't always sound natural or necessarily be correct. Rather learn and see the natural flow of Arabic inshAllah, if you say 'Hom fil hadika' it carries the same meaning and sounds better. In English we have 'is' and 'are' but in Arabic it's in the subject so you don't need it."


Yeah. It is grammatically correct but the spelling is wrong. There should be no alif between the ya and lam. It should be لَيْلَةِ

That's my stupid typo. I pressed h which ALIF instead of g which is LAAM

[Enigma Dreamer]

No bro, I know that but as sis sunrise said, "It doesn't sound natural to say it this way, try not to translate from English to Arabic it won't always sound natural or necessarily be correct. Rather learn and see the natural flow of Arabic inshAllah, if you say 'Hom fil hadika' it carries the same meaning and sounds better. In English we have 'is' and 'are' but in Arabic it's in the subject so you don't need it."



I didn't see what sunrise wrote bro. What did she mean bro.

[Sulaiman Harun]

:start:

what I understood was that in the example I gave, it wasn't necessary to have Yakunoon in it as it was implied using Hum and it also sounded better.

So the question arises, where should one use Yakunoon or Yakununna if it is implied?

[Enigma Dreamer]

:start:

what I understood was that in the example I gave, it wasn't necessary to have Yakunoon in it as it was implied using Hum and it also sounded better.

So the question arises, where should one use Yakunoon or Yakununna if it is implied?
Oh sorry, I didn't get it. Yeah, that is true. You can very much ignore it and just say 'hum fil hadiiqah' or 'hunna fil hadiiqah'. The verb will be implied then. One should use yakuununa or yakuununna in the present form only as it is fi'il mudhaara'. So when you say (male) 'hum fil hadiiqah' it is only present like they ARE in the garden. But if you want to talk about yesterday (past), then you should add the verb and say (male) 'hum kaanuu fil hadiiqah' meaning they WERE in the garden. Same with the future tense which you should add the verb.

[sunrise]

:start:



So in what cases do I use Yakunoon or Yakununna?

كٌنْتٌ فِي الْمَسْجِدْ لَيْالَةِ الْمَاضِية
I was in the Masjid last night

Is this grammatically correct?



You need 'Al' on the layla... it is a noun adjective structure you can't have al on the 'almadiya' and not on the layla, because it is not an idafa (where the second or last word takes 'al' only)

So it should be 'al layla al madiya'

I advise learning in depth about the idafa construction and noun adjective phrases they are very important and form the basis on Arabic grammar especially the idafa. They are not too hard to learn and will help you inshAllah.

:start:

what I understood was that in the example I gave, it wasn't necessary to have Yakunoon in it as it was implied using Hum and it also sounded better.

So the question arises, where should one use Yakunoon or Yakununna if it is implied?


It doesn't sound right in the present tense, you can use it in the past future tense like Enigma said. E.g. 'Kaanu fil masjid' or 'Sawfa yakonun fil masjid.'

So in the present tense you don't need it, just use it for past and future.

[NiqaaBi_InBlack]

:start:

what I understood was that in the example I gave, it wasn't necessary to have Yakunoon in it as it was implied using Hum and it also sounded better.

So the question arises, where should one use Yakunoon or Yakununna if it is implied?

that's true like sunrise said it doesn't sound good but grammatically it's correct and u will see it in grammar books because it's often used to explain the i'raab of a sentence if kaana or yakunu etc. is used
it's called kaana wa akhwaatuhaa( wa kaana wa akhwaatuhaa tadkhulu 'ala jumlatun ismiyya)

the i'raab changes because of the verb Kaana:
- the mubtadda changes to ism kaanna and it stays marfuu'
- the khabbar changes to khabbar kaanna and it becomes mansuub

for example:

*Yakunuun attullaabun fee almadrasati (attullaabun-group of male/or group of female and male-hum)

yakunuun;fi'il mudaari' marfuu' wa 'alamatu raf'ihi thubuut a nuun (li anahu minnal af'aal al khamsah) wa huwa naasikh naaqis

attullaabuun: ism yakunnu marfuu' wa 'alaamatu raf'ihi alwauw

fee : harf jar mabniy
al madrassatiy: ism majruur wa 'alamata jarihi al kasrah addaahir

fee almadrassatiy: fee mahal nasb khabbar yakunuun

*yakununna attallibaatu fee al madrassati (group of females-hunna)
this is grammatical correct same as above

[.: Anna :.]

can use kaana in present form after some particles like 'an', otherwise there is no need it does not look/sound right just keep it for past