Relationship with your bhabi ( sister in-law) and dhulabahi ( brother in-law).

[Showkat]

Salaams All

Its typical of asian families that the brother in-law is accepted to joke around with his elder brothers wife. It could be his elder cousins wife or anyone else he regards as an older brother who has a wife.

I have seen people joking with their bhabi and some of the discussions and jokes are very explicit and filthy.

Also it is accepted to get physical in terms of the joking and I have seen this as well, often unintentionally certain parts of the body is touched, but since its only joking and messing about it is seen as normal.

The result of such joking and messing about is that it sometimes leads to fornication and again I have heard of many such cases. The child of such a liason is brought up not knowing who the father is and the real father does not know that his nephew/neice is actually his son/ daughter.

I would like to know the views of other members on this:

How can we prevent such practices?

How do we explain to our parents/ elders who are pious in terms of their ibadat that such things is haram?

And have you seen or experienced such cultural practices?

Some excellent views here http://www.7cgen.com/index.php?showtopic=13640&st=0#entry227192

[Arsalan]

Well a brother should know how to kick the crap out of his brother in law.

Problem solved.

I put my foot down on my inlaws after i got married. Made sure that i made life unpleasent for them in case they had plans to take liberties in other ways.

Put your foot down , like you would put your foot down on a snake!!!

Now they dont talk to me, and i dont talk much to them. Its about power, control and domination brothers.

[MG]

Salaams All

Its typical of asian families that the brother in-law is accepted to joke around with his elder brothers wife. It could be his elder cousins wife or anyone else he regards as an older brother who has a wife.

I have seen people joking with their bhabi and some of the discussions and jokes are very explicit and filthy.

Also it is accepted to get physical in terms of the joking and I have seen this as well, often unintentionally certain parts of the body is touched, but since its only joking and messing about it is seen as normal.

The result of such joking and messing about is that it sometimes leads to fornication and again I have heard of many such cases. The child of such a liason is brought up not knowing who the father is and the real father does not know that his nephew/neice is actually his son/ daughter.

I would like to know the views of other members on this:

How can we prevent such practices?

How do we explain to our parents/ elders who are pious in terms of their ibadat that such things is haram?

And have you seen or experienced such cultural practices?

Some excellent views here http://www.7cgen.com/index.php?showtopic=13640&st=0#entry227192


wa alaikum aslaam

i also find it frustrating seeing this, especially in backhome countries i find it even more rife than here.

I have seen bro-in-laws blatantly flirting and indirectly coming on to their sis-in-laws while hubby sits there watching on like a plonk thinking "ahh my family is so hunky dory":rolleyes:

i have seen bro-in-laws lieing there with their heads in their sis-in-law's laps in front of others thinking its ok cos they are "brother and sister" in relation :rubeyes::rubeyes::rubeyes:


and of course we dont need to go on about the amount of actual illicit realtionships that have developed between bro-in-laws and sis-in-laws becos they are "bro and sis and allowed to act like this"
:rolleyes:
nastiness

[Guvna]

kick the living daylightds out of em,..should sort it! :up:

[ify]

wa alaikum aslaam

i also find it frustrating seeing this, especially in backhome countries i find it even more rife than here.

I have seen bro-in-laws blatantly flirting and indirectly coming on to their sis-in-laws while hubby sits there watching on like a plonk thinking "ahh my family is so hunky dory":rolleyes:

i have seen bro-in-laws lieing there with their heads in their sis-in-law's laps in front of others thinking its ok cos they are "brother and sister" in relation :rubeyes::rubeyes::rubeyes:


and of course we dont need to go on about the amount of actual illicit realtionships that have developed between bro-in-laws and sis-in-laws becos they are "bro and sis and allowed to act like this"
:rolleyes:
nastiness
Salaamz,

c now i cnt relate 2 that at all!! In my family - asian- (Alhamdulillah) it's jst not th done thing 2 even sit nxt 2 ur brother-in-law - even in th presence of othrs - n wen i get marrid i wudn't think of doing n e lyk tht with my brother in-law etha....cuz thats th way i'v bin brought up...:S :)

[Eemaan]

mine does all the housework. its great :o

[.: Galaxy :.]

Hahahaha i got a dhulabhai....:D but not a real one yet tho :(

[MG]

Salaamz,

c now i cnt relate 2 that at all!! In my family - asian- (Alhamdulillah) it's jst not th done thing 2 even sit nxt 2 ur brother-in-law - even in th presence of othrs - n wen i get marrid i wudn't think of doing n e lyk tht with my brother in-law etha....cuz thats th way i'v bin brought up...:S :)


wa aslaams thank goodness they are not close relations

[Saeed Al-Muslim]

Wa Alaikum Salaam,How can we prevent such practices?Live separately, and have a lot of protective jealously, the Arabic word slips my mind. See anything not so Islamic, confront it there and then. My uncle tried it with my cousin when he came over from Pakistan. Some girls tend to think their in love and forget right from wrong. Some/many guys are the devils reincarnate, they are just plain disgusting creatures who have no shame.

Ma'aSalaama

[Abu Mu'adh]

Wa Alaikum Salaam,Live separately, and have a lot of protective jealously, the Arabic word slips my mind. See anything not so Islamic, confront it there and then. My uncle tried it with my cousin when he came over from Pakistan. Some girls tend to think their in love and forget right from wrong. Some/many guys are the devils reincarnate, they are just plain disgusting creatures who have no shame.

Ma'aSalaama

The word you're looking for is gheera.

[.: Rashid :.]

Wa Alaikum Salaam,Live separately, and have a lot of protective jealously, the Arabic word slips my mind. See anything not so Islamic, confront it there and then. My uncle tried it with my cousin when he came over from Pakistan. Some girls tend to think their in love and forget right from wrong. Some/many guys are the devils reincarnate, they are just plain disgusting creatures who have no shame.

Ma'aSalaama

Gheerah

-Rashid

[Abu Mu'adh]

I'm paraphrasing a hadith but it mentions that the brother in law is like death!

that should be warning enough to not get too friendly even in a jokey way.

[.: Galaxy :.]

:eek: :shock: NOOOOOOOOOOO!!! naaa bay , :0: aren't you forgetting "Alan" ;) :hidban: haha :outta:


heeeeeey???? affne quai takhi ayliy? i mean wer did u cum 4rm "samantha"? wer hav u beeeen? :scratch: neway...oh yeah! now how cud i 4get bout Alan? awww:( now itz gna b sumtime befor i geta dhulabhai

[habibti]

heeeeeey???? affne quai takhi ayliy? i mean wer did u cum 4rm "samantha"? wer hav u beeeen? :scratch: neway...oh yeah! now how cud i 4get bout Alan? awww:( now itz gna b sumtime befor i geta dhulabhai


good things come to those who wait :torture:"simon" remember that lil one! ;):D awww yayyy samantha - u're back!! :D:inlove:

[Showkat]

Some great points so far, please have a look at the link and you will some fantastic replies plus the hadith which someone mentioned

[Abu Mu'adh]

Salaamz,

c now i cnt relate 2 that at all!! In my family - asian- (Alhamdulillah) it's jst not th done thing 2 even sit nxt 2 ur brother-in-law - even in th presence of othrs - n wen i get marrid i wudn't think of doing n e lyk tht with my brother in-law etha....cuz thats th way i'v bin brought up...:S :)

Salaam

I have nothing against you, but is it really so difficult to type in proper english?

I had to read over what you wrote 3-4 times to makes sense of what you're trying to convey.

[ADZ w3]

Salaam

I have nothing against you, but is it really so difficult to type in proper english?

I had to read over what you wrote 3-4 times to makes sense of what you're trying to convey.


loool..get wid d times...looooooool..jokes..
*runs away*

[Medievalist]

How can we prevent such practices?

How do we explain to our parents/ elders who are pious in terms of their ibadat that such things is haram?

And have you seen or experienced such cultural practices?

Some excellent views here http://www.7cgen.com/index.php?showtopic=13640&st=0#entry227192

:wswrwb:

mashaALLAH my brother, an EXCELLENT topic and much needed.

Indeed in our Indo-Pak culture there is this attitude of devar/bhabhi or dulhabhai/saali jokey and informal relationship. Its hard to explain to people because its part of the culture and explaining how it is wrong and immoral gets funnay looks.

I've seen these types of relationships - one in particular annoys me a great deal. At weddings the sister-in-law dances with her husbands younger brother. Its bad enough that a woman dance infront of men but this one does it with full vigour and zeal and its become an accepted practice in this families weddings. Innaa lillahi wa innaaa ilayhi raaji'oon.

How do we stop this?
We are only responsible for our own actions and for what we can prevent. This is a principle - whatever is in our capability we fulfill inshaALLAH. At the very least - in all situations we are to have hatred for this illicit relationship. Moving on from this if we have the ability to speak against it - in our family and social circle then we should. And if we have ability to prevent it then alhamdulillah.

Before I got married - we had a dholki for one night. It wasnt entirely legit but it wasnt organised by me in anyway - my father wanted it done. Anyhoo - in that gathering I didnt have a problem with my cousins (male) dancing - that was ok and I even watched. But then in all that group of men - this one woman began to dance with her bro-in-law. In that situation I had ability to prevent it by hand - I grabbed the mans hand and threw it down so he lost his hold on his sis-in-law and gave ishaarah to her to move away - you'd have thought that would be humiliating but people who lack shame do as they please.
Point being when you have the abilit prevent it.

Secondly its about example - I dont live in another persons house so I cant regulate how they behave nor am I required to. But I can and should regulate how my family behaves with my wife and how my wife behaves with my family.

There are limits - alhamdulillah my brothers know well that they dont touch my wife, my wife knows well that she doesnt speak to my brothers beyond the minimum and more often than not goes into another room.

If we bring about a change in our own families - then that inshaALLAH has benefit. Today you dont speak or look at your cousins wife - tomorrow when he objects to your wife veiling in their house you can give an answer - I dont look at yr wife and its not my fault she dresses like that. Actions speak louder than words.

[Kubs]

It's absolutely unacceptable for a brother in law to flirt with his brothers wife. If that was the case I'd make sure they never spoke to each other again.

Needless to say, in Turkish culture...there is nothing wrong with the brothers wife having a conversation with the brother in law....as long as there are others around. Also there is a certain barrier which should not be crossed. Two people can have a decent conversation without flirting! :rolleyes:

[LiveIslam]

i think its disgusting , ive seen someone in my own family acting like that and i found it disturbing and left the room. i felt so sad:(

[ImaanSeeker]

Alhamdulillah, Islam is a religion of preemptive measures. We take caution before things can get out of hand. And the same applies to in-law relations.

Today, we see many ill-fated thought processes such as 'if they ever flirt again, I will make sure they stop talking to each other' , 'I will beat him up if he ever gets close to her again' But for a true Muslim it should not even get that close to begin with.

Observe the laws of hijaab from day one. Make sure everyone understands who each others mahrams are, and that they are respectful of the laws pertaining to that.

If the laws of hijaab are carried out from day one, there is less pain, more peace, and Inshallah more barakah from Allah(swt).

[Saeed Al-Muslim]

The word you're looking for is gheera.GheerahJazaak Allahu khair.

I came across something interesting on Google, I wonder if someone would be able to shed some more light onto the subject Insha’Allah:Men who do not care about how their women behave and appear in front of other men and don’t enforce hijaab upon their wives or women-folk are called Dayyooth. Being a Dayyooth is a major sin and a detailed description of this evil characteristic can be found in adh-Dhahabee’s book of Major Sins (Kitaab ul-Kabaa’ir).Source: http://www.allaahuakbar.net/womens/reviving_our_sense_of_gheerah.htm

I do not trust the website, because they seem to have it in for everyone. But what about the quote above?

Jazaak Allahu khair.

Ma’aSalaama

[binAadam]

I have a bhabi/paabi/perjaai who lives abroad so no worries, but when my next bro brings another paabi for me, I know I would be doing pardah, I would change the floor of the house of course, because I know paabi is very dangerous, she's like any other girl in the street, or maybe I'll leave my home and live in a jungle, with lots of jungli paabis :D

[Showkat]

Some interesting views by everyone and I am happy to see that we are all against such cultural practices which are un-Islamic.

Its also very important for married couples to have thier own place because in houses in the west its hard to avoid contact with non-mahrams.

[Medievalist]

Sa'eed:

The definition/description of dayyooth is correct. It being described as a major sin is also true. It being mention in Imam Dhahabee's Kitab - I dont know but it doesnt seem unlikely.

Dayyooth - also includes within it the man who does not mind which men come and go to his house.

[`asiya]

Sa'eed:

The definition/description of dayyooth is correct. It being described as a major sin is also true. It being mention in Imam Dhahabee's Kitab - I dont know but it doesnt seem unlikely.

Dayyooth - also includes within it the man who does not mind which men come and go to his house.

sah this is based on the hadith of the prophet salAllahu alleyhi wa salam :

narrated ibn `Abaas, The Prophet said, "A woman should not travel except with a Mahram, and no man may visit her home except in the presence of a Mahram " A man got up and said, "O Allah's Apostle! I intend to go to such and such an army and my wife wants to perform Hajj." The Prophet said (to him), "Go along with her (to Hajj)." (sahih bukhari)

it not permissible for a non mahram man such as a brother in law, to be in a house with a woman who has no mahram with her, and in the case of those men who marry and live with their wives live at their parents homes, they should not have any brothers living in that house with their wives and parents, this is expressly forbidden because of the fitnah that can arise out of that situation and as the prophet salAllahu alleyhi wa salam said " the brother in law is death" bukhari

( scloars narrate this hadith refers to the death of their iman )

[Showkat]

Some very disturbing stories, but inshAllah it will educate people about this taboo subject within our communities.

[LostInThought]

I've had a sister-in-law for around 1.5 years and have only spoken to her once. And that was because she asked me where her husband was. Other than that, there has never been a need to speak to her.

[Raziel]

Salaamz,

c now i cnt relate 2 that at all!! In my family - asian- (Alhamdulillah) it's jst not th done thing 2 even sit nxt 2 ur brother-in-law - even in th presence of othrs - n wen i get marrid i wudn't think of doing n e lyk tht with my brother in-law etha....cuz thats th way i'v bin brought up...:S :)

sis alhumdulillah, None of my brothers would dare to do any of the stuff like touching or putting forth filthy remarks even as jokes...:up:

but is it permissible for My wife to talk to them, without my presence, I mean they are Mahram (prohibited from marriage) ? :scratch:

Is it haram for them (my bro's) to converse with my Wife? :scratch:

:jkk:

[muwahid]

“Beware of private audiences with women.” A man from the Al-Ansaar asked, “O Messenger of Allah! What about the in-laws?” The Messenger sallallahu `alayhi wa sallam answered, “ The in-laws are death!”
[Sahih Al Bukhaari and Muslim]

[Raziel]

“Beware of private audiences with women.” A man from the Al-Ansaar asked, “O Messenger of Allah! What about the in-laws?” The Messenger sallallahu `alayhi wa sallam answered, “ The in-laws are death!”
[Sahih Al Bukhaari and Muslim]

explanation of that Hadith?

this is Obviously referring to Evil-Mongers, and not classing In-Laws as Satanic or Evil...

as one day, virtually everyone will end up being In-Laws if they are fortunate enough to have a son/daughter married of...

:jkk:

[MG]

sis alhumdulillah, None of my brothers would dare to do any of the stuff like touching or putting forth filthy remarks even as jokes...:up:

but is it permissible for My wife to talk to them, without my presence, I mean they are Mahram (prohibited from marriage) ? :scratch:

Is it haram for them (my bro's) to converse with my Wife? :scratch:

:jkk:

your brothers would not be mehram to your wife, she is allowed to marry them.

[Saeed Al-Muslim]

your brothers would not be mehram to your wife, she is allowed to marry them.
As far as I'm aware once the marriage has been consummated she cannot marry her husbands brother. Nor can her husbands brother marry her sister. As is widely practised in Pakistan.

But Allaah (swT) knows best.

Ma'aSalaama

[MG]

As far as I'm aware once the marriage has been consummated she cannot marry her husbands brother. Nor can her husbands brother marry her sister. As is widely practised in Pakistan.

But Allaah (swT) knows best.

Ma'aSalaama


but if they are her mehram then why does she have to over in front of them? i.e. behave with them as if they are her mehram?

[Saeed Al-Muslim]

but if they are her mehram then why does she have to over in front of them? i.e. behave with them as if they are her mehram?
Allaahu Alim, maybe I am wrong... Insha'Allaah, will do some research into this later today.

Ma'aSalaama

[Raziel]

your brothers would not be mehram to your wife, she is allowed to marry them.

Whaaaat?!!!! :eek3:

are you kidding me?!!!!

so your telling me a brother can marry his brothers wife?!!!! :eek3: :smack:

Nauzubillah!

where did this idea come from?!!! :eek3:

your statement is incorrect, and Haram.

Nauzubillah! Min-Zaliq!

[`asiya]

As far as I'm aware once the marriage has been consummated she cannot marry her husbands brother. Nor can her husbands brother marry her sister. As is widely practised in Pakistan.

But Allaah (swT) knows best.

Ma'aSalaama

Whaaaat?!!!! :eek3:

are you kidding me?!!!!

so your telling me a brother can marry his brothers wife?!!!! :eek3: :smack:

Nauzubillah!

where did this idea come from?!!! :eek3:

your statement is incorrect, and Haram.

Nauzubillah! Min-Zaliq!

:0: im not sure what people are confused about here... so forgive me if i misunderstood, but it seems ukhti MG is correct in what she is saying.


The prophet salAllahu alleyhi wa salam said the inlaws are death, which refers to the death of a persons iman. It is not permissible for a woman to be around her husbands brothers,and it is not permissible for a womans husband to be around her sisters.

The husbands brothers, are not mahrams to her, and if she divorces her husband yes she can marry anyone of his brothers. Allah has clearly stated who is not permissible for marriage in the Quran, 4:23

Prohibited for you (in marriage) are your mothers, your daughters, your sisters, the sisters of your fathers, the sisters of your mothers, the daughters of your brother, the daughters of your sister, your nursing mothers, the girls who nursed from the same woman as you, the mothers of your wives, the daughters of your wives with whom you have consummated the marriage - if the marriage has not been consummated, you may marry the daughter.( after divorcing the mother) Also prohibited for you are the women who were married to your genetic sons. Also, you shall not be married to two sisters at the same time - but do not break up existing marriages. Allah is all Forgiving, Most Merciful


which is the womans, husbands, father,her father in law and her ex-husbands grandfather, who remain mahrams for life even after divorce. A woman can marry her ex-husbands brother nothing haram in that. And a womans sister, can marry her sisters husbands brother, nothing haram in that, they are not mahrams to each other through marriage at all.

[Raziel]

:0: im not sure what people are confused about here... so forgive me if i misunderstood, but it seems ukhti MG is correct in what she is saying.

If you can provide some daleel for this claim of a Brother marrying his own brothers wife, then I would like to read it...

The prophet salAllahu alleyhi wa salam said the inlaws are death, which refers to the death of a persons iman. It is not permissible for a woman to be around her husbands brothers,and it is not permissible for a womans husband to be around her sisters.


this does not quite make sense sis, what exactly does it mean that "In laws are Death" ? that they are Evil?!!! if this is the case everyone will end up being an in-law at some point and also be death for others...

therefore this explanation does not make sense to me, if you can elaborate further by quoting the Hadith (with reference) and any commentaries by any Scholars I would be glad to read it... :o

The husbands brothers, are not mahrams to her, and if she divorces her husband yes she can marry anyone of his brothers. Allah has clearly stated who is not permissible for marriage in the Quran, 4:23

If she divorces her Husband then she can marry here former Husbands brothers... o.k sis

Prohibited for you (in marriage) are your mothers, your daughters, your sisters, the sisters of your fathers, the sisters of your mothers, the daughters of your brother, the daughters of your sister, your nursing mothers, the girls who nursed from the same woman as you, the mothers of your wives, the daughters of your wives with whom you have consummated the marriage - if the marriage has not been consummated, you may marry the daughter.( after divorcing the mother) Also prohibited for you are the women who were married to your genetic sons. Also, you shall not be married to two sisters at the same time - but do not break up existing marriages. Allah is all Forgiving, Most Merciful


which is the womans, husbands, father,her father in law and her ex-husbands grandfather, who remain mahrams for life even after divorce. A woman can marry her ex-husbands brother nothing haram in that. And a womans sister, can marry her sisters husbands brother, nothing haram in that, they are not mahrams to each other through marriage at all.

also if you can answer this question sis, "Is it permissible for my wife to speak to my bro's?"

it would be much appreciated... :o

:jkk:

[`asiya]

alkso if you can answer this question sis, "Is it permissible for my wife to speak to my bro's?"

:jkk:

yes of course she has to be divorced from the husband before she could marry his brother, a woman can only marry one man at a time and a man cannot be married to two sisters at the same time either.

Question: My husband's family always ridicule me for wearing my headscarf even when I'm in the house with them during family gatherings or Eid celebrations. They say you dont have to cover up amongst family members. I know about the rules of women aurat amonst non mahram in Islam and would like to preseve it, How can I counter their comments amicably yet preach on them about the wholesome adoption of Islam? Also, are husband's nephews mahram to his wife? I have checked with some ustaz and they told me they are not. However, because of family and husband's insistance ( so as not to hurt their feelings) , I still salam (handshake) with them as this is normal practice in the family. I feel very trubled about it and seek Allah guidance abd forgiveness.

Answer: Praise be to Allaah.

Firstly:

We ask Allaah to help you to do good, and to make things easy for you and relieve you of your distress. For what a Muslim woman hears and sees of those who have turned away from the religion of Allaah or whose commitment has become very weak, she has to bear that with patience and seek reward for things that she suffers. She had to have hope in her Lord and ask Him to help her to remain steadfast.

It is not permissible for her to respond to their demands or to go along with their whims and desires for her to mix with them, look at them, shake hands with them and give up hijaab, because if she pleases them in this manner she will incur the wrath of her Lord.

Secondly:

The sons of your husband’s brothers and sisters are not mahrams, rather they are among the people of whom you should be extra cautious, because the Prophet SAWS (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) likened them to death.


It was narrated from ‘Uqbah ibn ‘Aamir that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said:

“Beware of entering upon women.” A man from among the Ansaar said, “O Messenger of Allaah, what about the in-law?” He said, “The in-law is death.”

(Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 4934; Muslim, 2172)

Al-Nawawi said: The scholars of Arabic language are agreed that al-hamu (translated here as “in-law”) refers to the relatives of a woman’s husband, such as his father, paternal uncle, brother, brother’s son (nephew), cousin (son of paternal uncle), etc. Akhtaan (sing. khatan) refers to the relatives of a man’s wife, and ashaar (sing. suhr) refers to both.

With regard to the Prophet’s words “The in-law is death,” what this means is that there is more fear with regard to him than anyone else, and evil is to be expected of him, and the fitnah (temptation) is greater because he is able to reach the woman and be alone with her without anyone denouncing that, unlike the case of one who is a stranger. What is meant by “in-law” (hamu) here is the relatives of the husband apart from his father/grandfather and sons/grandsons.

Fathers/grandfathers and sons/grandsons are mahrams for his wife and it is permissible for them to be alone with her. The word “death” here does not refer to them. Rather what is meant is the brother, brother’s son, paternal uncle, cousin, etc, who are not mahrams. People are usually careless about this matter and a man may let his wife be alone with his brother. This is what is referred to by “death” and should be prevented more than her being alone with a stranger for the reasons mentioned above. What we have mentioned is the correct meaning of the hadeeth.

Sharh Muslim, 14/154

Shaykh ‘Abd al-‘Azeez ibn Baaz (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:

It is permissible for a woman to sit with her husband’s brothers or cousins, etc. (with her mahram) if she is wearing complete shar’i hijaab, which means covering her face, hair and entire body, because she is ‘awrah and fitnah. That is if there is nothing dubious about the gathering.

But if the gathering is one in which there is something dubious, then it is not permitted, such as sitting with them in order to listen to singing and musical instruments, etc.; and it is not permissible for her to be alone with any one of them or with anyone else who is not a mahram for her, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “No man should be alone with a (non-mahram) woman unless she has a mahram with her.” (Saheeh; agreed upon).


And he (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “No man should be alone with a (non-mahram) woman, for the third one present will be the Shaytaan.” (Narrated by Imam Ahmad with a saheeh isnaad from ‘Umar ibn al-Khattaab. May Allaah be pleased with him). And Allaah is the Source of strength.

Fataawa al-Mar’ah al-Muslimah, 1/422, 423

Thirdly:

As for a woman shaking hands with a non-mahram man, this is haraam. It is not permitted for you to take this matter lightly just because your relatives or your husband’s relatives want you to.

It was narrated from ‘Urwah that ‘Aa’ishah told him about the bay’ah (oath of allegiance) given by the women: “The hand of the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) never touched the hand of any woman. When he accepted the oath of allegiance from a woman, he would accept her words and then say, ‘Go, for you have sworn your allegiance.’”

(Narrated by Muslim, 1866)

So this infallible one, the best of all mankind, the leader of the sons of Adam on the Day of Resurrection, did not touch women, even though the bay’ah or oath of allegiance originally was done by giving one's hand. So the ruling should be even more strict with regard to other men?

It was narrated that Umaymah the daughter of Raqeeqah said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “I do not shake hands with women.”
(Narrated by al-Nasaa’i, 4181; Ibn Maajah, 2874; classed as saheeh by Shaykh al-Albaani in Saheeh al-Jaami’, 2513)

Shaykh Ibn Baaz (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:

Shaking hands with women with a barrier in between is something that is subject to further debate, but the view which is most likely to be correct is that it is not allowed at all, based on the general meaning of the ahaadeeth, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said, “I do not shake hands with women,” and so as to ward off the means (that may lead to immoral actions). And Allaah knows best.

Haashiyat Majmoo’ah Rasaa’il fi’l-Hijaab wa’l-Sufoor, 69.




************************************************** ********


Question :

There are two married brothers living in one apartment. Is it permissible for their wives to uncover their faces in front of one another’s husband, knowing that both of them are righteous?

Answer :

Praise be to Allaah.

If the families are living all together, then the women must observe hijaab in front of those who are not their mahrams. It is not permissible for the wife of one brother to uncover her face in front of his brother, because his brother is like any other man in the street with regard to looking and being non-mahram. It is also not permissible for his brother to be alone with her if he (the husband) is outside the home.

This is a problem which is affecting many people, such as when brothers are living in the same home and one of them is married. It is not permissible for the one who is married to leave his wife with his brother if he goes out to work or to study, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “No man should be alone with a [non-mahram] woman.”

And he said: “Beware of entering upon women.” They said, “O Messenger of Allaah, what do you think about the brother-in-law [meaning the husband’s relatives]?” He said, “The brother-in-law is death.”


There are always questions about the crime of adultery (zina) in such cases, where a man goes out and leaves his wife and his brother in the house, then the Shaytaan tempts them and he commits adultery with her – Allaah forbid – with his brother’s wife. This is worse than committing adultery with his neighbour’s wife, indeed it is more terrible than that. I want to say something that so that I will have discharged my responsibility before Allaah. It is not permissible for a man to leave his wife in the same house as his brother, no matter what the circumstances, even if his brother is one of the most trustworthy, sincere and righteous of people, for the Shaytaan flows through the son of Adam like blood, and sexual desire knows no bounds, especially among young people.

But what should we do if two brothers are living in the same house and one of them is married? Does that mean that when he goes out he must take his wife out to work with him?

The answer is no, but the house may be divided in two, one half for the brother on his own, with a door that can be locked, for which the key should be kept by the husband when he goes out to work. So the wife will be in a separate part of the house, and the brother will be in another separate part of the house. But the brother may argue with his brother and say, “Why are you doing that? Don’t you trust me?”

The answer to that is to tell him, “I am doing this in your own best interests, because the Shaytaan flows through the son of Adam like blood. Maybe he will tempt you and desire may overwhelm reason, in which case you will do something haraam. I am doing this to protect you. It is in your best interests as well as mine.” If he gets angry because of this then let him get angry and do not worry about him.

I am telling you these things so as to discharge my responsibility before Allaah, and your reckoning will be with Allaah.

With regard to uncovering the face, it is haraam; it is not permissible for a woman to uncover in front of her husband’s brother because he is a stranger (non-mahram) to her, so he is just like any other man in the street.

Shaykh Muhammad ibn Saalih al-Uthaymeen in al-Fataawa al-Jaami’ah li’l-Mar’ah al-Muslimah, part 3, p. 806 (www.islam-qa.com)




Dangers in the Home

Book by Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid

http://www.islam-qa.com/index.php?pg=article&ln=eng&article_id=4

[Raziel]

yes of course she has to be divorced from the husband before she could marry his brother, a woman can only marry one man at a time and a man cannot be married to two sisters at the same time either.

I knew that sis, I thought it wouldn't be permissible for her to mary or my bro to mary her even if She divorced me... thanks for the Correction...

Question: My husband's family always ridicule me for wearing my headscarf even when I'm in the house with them during family gatherings or Eid celebrations. They say you dont have to cover up amongst family members. I know about the rules of women aurat amonst non mahram in Islam and would like to preseve it, How can I counter their comments amicably yet preach on them about the wholesome adoption of Islam? Also, are husband's nephews mahram to his wife? I have checked with some ustaz and they told me they are not. However, because of family and husband's insistance ( so as not to hurt their feelings) , I still salam (handshake) with them as this is normal practice in the family. I feel very trubled about it and seek Allah guidance abd forgiveness.

Answer: Praise be to Allaah.

Firstly:

We ask Allaah to help you to do good, and to make things easy for you and relieve you of your distress. For what a Muslim woman hears and sees of those who have turned away from the religion of Allaah or whose commitment has become very weak, she has to bear that with patience and seek reward for things that she suffers. She had to have hope in her Lord and ask Him to help her to remain steadfast.

It is not permissible for her to respond to their demands or to go along with their whims and desires for her to mix with them, look at them, shake hands with them and give up hijaab, because if she pleases them in this manner she will incur the wrath of her Lord.

Secondly:

The sons of your husband’s brothers and sisters are not mahrams, rather they are among the people of whom you should be extra cautious, because the Prophet SAWS (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) likened them to death.


It was narrated from ‘Uqbah ibn ‘Aamir that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said:

“Beware of entering upon women.” A man from among the Ansaar said, “O Messenger of Allaah, what about the in-law?” He said, “The in-law is death.”

(Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 4934; Muslim, 2172)

Al-Nawawi said: The scholars of Arabic language are agreed that al-hamu (translated here as “in-law”) refers to the relatives of a woman’s husband, such as his father, paternal uncle, brother, brother’s son (nephew), cousin (son of paternal uncle), etc. Akhtaan (sing. khatan) refers to the relatives of a man’s wife, and ashaar (sing. suhr) refers to both.

With regard to the Prophet’s words “The in-law is death,” what this means is that there is more fear with regard to him than anyone else, and evil is to be expected of him, and the fitnah (temptation) is greater because he is able to reach the woman and be alone with her without anyone denouncing that, unlike the case of one who is a stranger. What is meant by “in-law” (hamu) here is the relatives of the husband apart from his father/grandfather and sons/grandsons.

Fathers/grandfathers and sons/grandsons are mahrams for his wife and it is permissible for them to be alone with her. The word “death” here does not refer to them. Rather what is meant is the brother, brother’s son, paternal uncle, cousin, etc, who are not mahrams. People are usually careless about this matter and a man may let his wife be alone with his brother. This is what is referred to by “death” and should be prevented more than her being alone with a stranger for the reasons mentioned above. What we have mentioned is the correct meaning of the hadeeth.

Sharh Muslim, 14/154

Shaykh ‘Abd al-‘Azeez ibn Baaz (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:

It is permissible for a woman to sit with her husband’s brothers or cousins, etc. (with her mahram) if she is wearing complete shar’i hijaab, which means covering her face, hair and entire body, because she is ‘awrah and fitnah. That is if there is nothing dubious about the gathering.

But if the gathering is one in which there is something dubious, then it is not permitted, such as sitting with them in order to listen to singing and musical instruments, etc.; and it is not permissible for her to be alone with any one of them or with anyone else who is not a mahram for her, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “No man should be alone with a (non-mahram) woman unless she has a mahram with her.” (Saheeh; agreed upon).


And he (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “No man should be alone with a (non-mahram) woman, for the third one present will be the Shaytaan.” (Narrated by Imam Ahmad with a saheeh isnaad from ‘Umar ibn al-Khattaab. May Allaah be pleased with him). And Allaah is the Source of strength.

Fataawa al-Mar’ah al-Muslimah, 1/422, 423

Thirdly:

As for a woman shaking hands with a non-mahram man, this is haraam. It is not permitted for you to take this matter lightly just because your relatives or your husband’s relatives want you to.

It was narrated from ‘Urwah that ‘Aa’ishah told him about the bay’ah (oath of allegiance) given by the women: “The hand of the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) never touched the hand of any woman. When he accepted the oath of allegiance from a woman, he would accept her words and then say, ‘Go, for you have sworn your allegiance.’”

(Narrated by Muslim, 1866)

So this infallible one, the best of all mankind, the leader of the sons of Adam on the Day of Resurrection, did not touch women, even though the bay’ah or oath of allegiance originally was done by giving one's hand. So the ruling should be even more strict with regard to other men?

It was narrated that Umaymah the daughter of Raqeeqah said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “I do not shake hands with women.”
(Narrated by al-Nasaa’i, 4181; Ibn Maajah, 2874; classed as saheeh by Shaykh al-Albaani in Saheeh al-Jaami’, 2513)

Shaykh Ibn Baaz (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:

Shaking hands with women with a barrier in between is something that is subject to further debate, but the view which is most likely to be correct is that it is not allowed at all, based on the general meaning of the ahaadeeth, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said, “I do not shake hands with women,” and so as to ward off the means (that may lead to immoral actions). And Allaah knows best.

Haashiyat Majmoo’ah Rasaa’il fi’l-Hijaab wa’l-Sufoor, 69.




************************************************** ********


Question :

There are two married brothers living in one apartment. Is it permissible for their wives to uncover their faces in front of one another’s husband, knowing that both of them are righteous?

Answer :

Praise be to Allaah.

If the families are living all together, then the women must observe hijaab in front of those who are not their mahrams. It is not permissible for the wife of one brother to uncover her face in front of his brother, because his brother is like any other man in the street with regard to looking and being non-mahram. It is also not permissible for his brother to be alone with her if he (the husband) is outside the home.

This is a problem which is affecting many people, such as when brothers are living in the same home and one of them is married. It is not permissible for the one who is married to leave his wife with his brother if he goes out to work or to study, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “No man should be alone with a [non-mahram] woman.”

And he said: “Beware of entering upon women.” They said, “O Messenger of Allaah, what do you think about the brother-in-law [meaning the husband’s relatives]?” He said, “The brother-in-law is death.”


There are always questions about the crime of adultery (zina) in such cases, where a man goes out and leaves his wife and his brother in the house, then the Shaytaan tempts them and he commits adultery with her – Allaah forbid – with his brother’s wife. This is worse than committing adultery with his neighbour’s wife, indeed it is more terrible than that. I want to say something that so that I will have discharged my responsibility before Allaah. It is not permissible for a man to leave his wife in the same house as his brother, no matter what the circumstances, even if his brother is one of the most trustworthy, sincere and righteous of people, for the Shaytaan flows through the son of Adam like blood, and sexual desire knows no bounds, especially among young people.

But what should we do if two brothers are living in the same house and one of them is married? Does that mean that when he goes out he must take his wife out to work with him?

The answer is no, but the house may be divided in two, one half for the brother on his own, with a door that can be locked, for which the key should be kept by the husband when he goes out to work. So the wife will be in a separate part of the house, and the brother will be in another separate part of the house. But the brother may argue with his brother and say, “Why are you doing that? Don’t you trust me?”

The answer to that is to tell him, “I am doing this in your own best interests, because the Shaytaan flows through the son of Adam like blood. Maybe he will tempt you and desire may overwhelm reason, in which case you will do something haraam. I am doing this to protect you. It is in your best interests as well as mine.” If he gets angry because of this then let him get angry and do not worry about him.

I am telling you these things so as to discharge my responsibility before Allaah, and your reckoning will be with Allaah.

With regard to uncovering the face, it is haraam; it is not permissible for a woman to uncover in front of her husband’s brother because he is a stranger (non-mahram) to her, so he is just like any other man in the street.

Shaykh Muhammad ibn Saalih al-Uthaymeen in al-Fataawa al-Jaami’ah li’l-Mar’ah al-Muslimah, part 3, p. 806 (www.islam-qa.com)



Dangers in the Home

Book by Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid

http://www.islam-qa.com/index.php?pg=article&ln=eng&article_id=4

:alhumdull my wife wears the hijab always, :oonly takes it off when she's in her room with me, or when sleepin... :o

thanks for the Reply, I'll have a good read through it... :o

:jkk:

[sunrise]

your wife wears hijab when shes asleep, wow

[Raziel]

your wife wears hijab when shes asleep, wow

Nooooo! :smack: That and when she is alone in my room, is the times she takes it off sis... :smack: :outta:

I wrote it in white before I think you missed it... :o

:jkk:

[Arsalan]

Deck em, deck em al brothers in lawz.

Just deck em.

[Treasured Soul]

wow ... interesting thread ... didnt know such sins were committed :(

[Omar]

yeah hate it when people fink of i was bough up wid dme we more like brothers nd sisters 8-)

i dont mean cousins ere incase nyones thinkin tht :p but same applies coz they non mehram inda end

[Raziel]

Deck em, deck em al brothers in lawz.

Just deck em.

whad ya mean by deck em bro?!!! :eek: :outta:

:jkk: