Rasoolullah (SAW) is Noor

[Ashraaf Ali]

Assalaatu wa Salaam Ya Rasoolullah!

Assalaamu alaikum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuhu dear brothers in Islam:

I am posting this excellent article which I found online which persuasively prooves our aqeeda that Hazrat Muhammad Mustafa (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is indeed Noor, in fact, his Noor is created from the Noor of Allah Azzawajal:

http://www.nooremadinah.net/Documents/Ahle-SunnahWalJamaat/20)TheHolyProphetisNoor/TheHolyProphetisNoor.asp (http://www.nooremadinah.net/Documents/Ahle-SunnahWalJamaat/20)TheHolyProphetisNoor/TheHolyProphetisNoor.asp)


Some persons believe that the Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) is only a human being and not Noor (light). They say so based on the reason that the Holy Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) had wives, had children, and he used to eat and drink.
The Aqeeda of the Ahle Sunnat Wa Jama'at is that he is both Noor and a human being.
The being and existence of the Holy Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) is even before that of human beings, but when he came into this world he came in the garb of a human being.
The Sahaba of the Holy Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) lived with him and observed him with his wives and children. They saw him eating, drinking, talking, etc. but still accepted him to be Noor.
We know that Hazrat Jibraeel (alaihis salaam) is made of Noor but when he used to appear before Hazrat Maryam (radi Allahu anha) he used to appear in the form of a human being. Allah Ta'ala states in the Holy Quran: "Thus he used to appear before her in the form of a healthy (well-built) man." (Part 16, Ruku 5)
Hazrat Umar Farouk (radi Allahu anhu) narrates that once a person came before them. The Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) asked him if he knew who that person was, he replied: "Allah Ta'ala and His beloved Rasool (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) know better." The Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) said that it was Jibraeel (alaihis salaam). (Mishkaat; Bukhari Shareef) This Hadith proves that although the Sahaba referred to Hazrat Jibraeel (alaihis salaam) as a man since they saw him in the form of a human being, yet they accepted that he was in actual fact an Angel made from Noor. On many instances, he came in the form of Sahabi-e-Rasool named Hazrat Wahia Kalbi (radi Allahu anhu).
The Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) has stated, "The very first thing which Almighty Allah created was my Noor." (Tafseer Roohul Bayaan; Madarijun Nabuiwat)
Once Hazrat Jaabir (radi Allahu anhu) asked the Holy Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) whom Allah Ta'ala created before anything else. The Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) stated: "O Jaabir! Verily, before the creation of anything else, Almighty Allah created the Noor of your Nabi from His Noor." (Muwahibul Laduniya; Zirkani Shareef)
Sayyida Halima Sa'adiya (radi Allahu anha), the wet-nurse of the Holy Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam), believed the Holy Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) to be Noor. She said that when she used to feed the Holy Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) milk in his infancy, she never felt the need for a light in her house. (Bayaanul Miladun Nabwi; Tafseer Mazhari).
Sayyida Safiya (radi Allahu anha), the aunt of the Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) states that on the eve of the birth of the Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) she was present in his house. She said that she saw his Noor became more powerful than the light from the lamp. (Shawaahidun Nubuiwat)
Hazrat Ali Murtuza (radi Allahu anhu) said that when the Beloved of Allah (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) spoke, Noor (light) used to be seen emerging from between his blessed teeth. (Muwahibul Laduniya; Anwaarul Muhammadiyah)
Hazrat Abu Hurairah (radi Allahu anhu) states that when the beloved Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) smiled, then the walls use to glow with his Noor. (Muwahibul Laduniya; Shifa Shareef)
Hazrat Anas (radi Allahu anhu) states that the day in which the Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) arrived in Madinatul Munawwarah, everything in Madinatul Munawwarah became bright through his Noor. (Tirmizi Shareef; Ibn Majah)
Ummul Mo'mineen, Sayyida Aisha Siddiqa (radi Allahu anha) is recorded to have said: "In total dark nights, I used to put the thread into a needle with the help of the Noor of the Holy Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam)." (Shara Shifa Bar Hashia Naseemur Riaz)
Hazrat Imam-e-Azam Abu Hanifa (radi Allahu anhu) praises the Holy Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) in the following poem: "You are that Noor that the full Moon is brightened by your Noor and you are with your beauty and elegance a shining sun." (Qasidaul Nu'maan)
Hazrat Jabir bin Abdullah Ansari (radi Allahu anhu) reports: I asked: "O Prophet of Allah (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam), What did the Almighty Allah first create?" The Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) replied: "Allah first created my Noor (Light) of His Noor. This Noor travelled about according to the Will of Allah. At that time, there was no Heaven, Hell, Lawh (Divine Tablet), Pen, Earth, Skies, Sun, Moon, Jinn or Human Beings. When He decided to create, He divided that Noor into four parts. From one part He created the Pen, from the second, the Lawh and from the third, he made the Arsh (Throne).

"He divided the fourth part into a further four parts. From one, He created those Angels who carry the Arsh, from the second, the Kursi (Divine Chair) and from the third, He created the Angels.

"He again divided the remaining parts into a further four parts. From one, He created the skies. The second was used in creating the planets. From the third, Heaven and Earth were created.

"Once again, He divided the fourth part into a further four parts. From one part He created the power with which the believers see. From the second, He created in the hearts of the Believers the Noor of Marifat. From the third, He created in the tongues of the Believers, Noor, so that they can read the Kalima of Tauheed". (Dalaa'il-un-Nubuwwat, Imam Baihaqi)
This astonishing Hadith Shareef proves that Sayyiduna Rasoolullah (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) is the life of this world and everything in it. When he is the life of this world, then everything that happens in it is clear to him and nothing is concealed from him. Who then can deny that he is not Noor (light)?

[Abu Mus'ab]

We're not barelwis :zzz:

[Ashraaf Ali]

We're not barelwis :zzz:

You don't have to be. Just accept the true aqeeda, Rasoolullah (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is Noor, the following hadeeth proves it:

Once Hazrat Jaabir (radi Allahu anhu) asked the Holy Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) whom Allah Ta'ala created before anything else. The Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) stated: "O Jaabir! Verily, before the creation of anything else, Almighty Allah created the Noor of your Nabi from His Noor." (Muwahibul Laduniya; Zirkani Shareef)

[Abu Mus'ab]

You don't have to be. Just accept the true aqeeda, Rasoolullah (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is Noor, the following hadeeth proves it:

Once Hazrat Jaabir (radi Allahu anhu) asked the Holy Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) whom Allah Ta'ala created before anything else. The Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) stated: "O Jaabir! Verily, before the creation of anything else, Almighty Allah created the Noor of your Nabi from His Noor." (Muwahibul Laduniya; Zirkani Shareef)
I'll never accept your baatil aqeedah.

[MMS]

teri surat ke liye aya hai surah noor ka
:outta:

[ibn suleman]

You don't have to be. Just accept the true aqeeda, Rasoolullah (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is Noor, the following hadeeth proves it:

Once Hazrat Jaabir (radi Allahu anhu) asked the Holy Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) whom Allah Ta'ala created before anything else. The Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) stated: "O Jaabir! Verily, before the creation of anything else, Almighty Allah created the Noor of your Nabi from His Noor." (Muwahibul Laduniya; Zirkani Shareef)

ive never heard of that hadith or that book..have u got more on its compiler?

see what i dont get is....if this is as u say it is, then how comes there is no mention of it in the main six books of hadith? how come no mention of it in the Qur'an? how comes no mention of it from the sahabah? the four imams?

[ur_yusra]

Assalaatu wa Salaam Ya Rasoolullah!

Assalaamu alaikum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuhu dear brothers in Islam:

I am posting this excellent article which I found online which persuasively prooves our aqeeda that Hazrat Muhammad Mustafa (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is indeed Noor, in fact, his Noor is created from the Noor of Allah Azzawajal:



Sounds like christianity :rubeyes:

[Fais]

ive never heard of that hadith or that book..have u got more on its compiler?

see what i dont get is....if this is as u say it is, then how comes there is no mention of it in the main six books of hadith? how come no mention of it in the Qur'an? how comes no mention of it from the sahabah? the four imams?

Must be a weak hadith if non of the other have it in their books ...

[*IslamicGirl*]

:start:

:salams

Chehra Mustafa :saw: jab dikaya giya

Jook gaye tare or chand sharm agaiya ~ Jashne Amade Rasool :saw: Peace and Blessings of Allah be upon him and his famiy

:wswrwb:

[Fais]

:start:

:salams

Chehra Mustafa :saw: jab dikaya giya

Jook gaye tare or chand sharm agaiya ~ Jashne Amade Rasool :saw: Peace and Blessings of Allah be upon him and his famiy

:wswrwb:

Are you shia by any chance?

Its not an insult or anything, im just asking.

[*IslamicGirl*]

:start:

:salams

Are you shia by any chance?

Its not an insult or anything, im just asking.

I think i'm a mixture of quite a few number of 'sects' but i'm not going to label myself just to fit in :insha:


May i ask what brought the question on? :)


:wswrwb:

[Fais]

:start:

:salams



I think i'm a mixture of quite a few number of 'sects' but i'm not going to label myself just to fit in :insha:


May i ask what brought the question on? :)


:wswrwb:


:wswrwb: .. Oh ok, no problem.

Yes i asked because your replies are just slightly different ... Not that its a bad thing or theres anything wrong with that, Was just wondering. :o

[muwahid]

Question:
Was Prophet Muhammad a "Noor" or "Bashar", and is it true that he had no shade even in light?.

Answer:
Praise be to Allaah.

Our Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) is the leader of all the sons of Adam, and he is a human being, one of the sons of Adam. He was born from two parents, he ate food and married woman, he got hungry and fell sick, and he felt joy and sorrow. One of the clearest signs of his humanity is that Allaah caused him to die as He causes all souls to die, but what distinguishes the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) from others is Prophethood and Revelation.

Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Say (O Muhammad): I am only a man like you. It has been revealed to me that your Ilaah (God) is One Ilaah (God ___ i.e. Allaah)”

[al-Kahf 18:110]

The state of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) in his humanity is the same as that of all the Prophets and Messengers. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And We did not create them (the Messengers, with) bodies that ate not food, nor were they immortals”

[al-Anbiya’ 21:8]

Allaah condemned those who wondered at the humanity of the Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), as He says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And they say: Why does this Messenger (Muhammad) eat food, and walk about in the markets (as we)…?”

[al-Furqaan 25:8]

It is not permissible to overstep the mark with regard to what the Qur’aan states about the message and humanity of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). For example, it is not permissible to describe him (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) as being noor (light) or as casting no shadow, or to say that he was created from light. Rather this is a kind of exaggeration which the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) forbade when he said: “Do not exaggerate about me as was exaggerated about ‘Eesa ibn Maryam. Say: the slave of Allaah and His Messenger.” Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 6830.

Moreover it is proven that the angels are the ones who were created from light, not any of the sons of Adam. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “The angels were created from light, and Iblees was created from smokeless fire, and Adam (peace be upon him) was created from what has been described to you.” Narrated by Muslim, 2996.

Shaykh al-Albaani (may Allaah have mercy on him) said in al-Silsilah al-Saheehah (458):

This indicates that the well known hadeeth that is in circulation among people – “The first thing that Allaah created was the light of your Prophet, O Jaabir” – is false, and so are other similar ahaadeeth which say that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) was created from light. This hadeeth clearly indicates that the angels are the only ones who are created from light, not Adam and his sons, so pay heed and do not be negligent. End quote.

The Standing Committee for Issuing Fatwas was asked the following question:

Here in Pakistan the scholars of the Bareilawi sect believe that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) cast no shadow, which indicates that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) was not human. Is this hadeeth saheeh which says that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) had no shadow?

They replied:

This view is false and goes against the texts of the Qur’aan and the saheeh Sunnah which indicate that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) was human and did not differ in his human make-up from other people. He had a shadow like any other human. The Prophethood with which Allaah honoured him did not alter the fact that he was human as Allaah created him, with a father and mother. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Say (O Muhammad): I am only a man like you. It has been revealed to me that your Ilaah (God) is One Ilaah (God ___i.e. Allaah)”

[al-Kahf 18:110]

“Their Messengers said to them: We are no more than human beings like you”

[Ibraaheem 14:11]

With regard to the report that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) was created from the light of Allaah, this is a fabricated hadeeth. End quote.

Fataawa al-Lajnah al-Daa’imah, 1/464

See also question no. 4509 and 6084.

Islam Q&A

[Hekmaa]

Love the reference Muwahibul Laduniya; Zirkani Shareef both barelwi scholars.

How about you dig something from bukhari or muslim, if i was in better health, i would have wrote you a pakka reply.

[Ashraaf Ali]

Assalaatu wa salaam Ya Rasoolullah!
Assalamu alaikum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuhu


how come no mention of it in the Qur'an?


'O people of the Book! Undoubtedly, Our Messenger has come to you who makes clear to you much of that which you had hidden in the Book and pardons much. Undoubtedly, there has come to you from Allah a Light and a Book, luminous. (Al-Maidah 5:15)

And just because Rasoolullah (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) was made from Noor, it doesn't mean he isn't a human being. All of the Anbiya are human beings, including our beloved Mustafa (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam), but he is a special human being, like no other.

Here is another verse where Rasoolullah (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is revealed to be sirajan muneer (lamp emitting light)!

O Prophet! Truly We have sent thee as a Witness, a Bearer of Glad Tidings, and Warner. And as one who invites to Allah's (grace) by His leave, and as a lamp spreading light (Al-Ahzab 33:45-46)


ive never heard of that hadith or that book..have u got more on its compiler?


The compiler of this hadith is Imam Qastalani.

Jazak Allah khair.

[Ibn Sina]

He is not literally light if that what you're trying to imply ....

[Mu'awiya]

Asalaamu alaikum warahmatulah wabarakatuh. :)O Prophet! Truly We have sent thee as a Witness, a Bearer of Glad Tidings, and Warner. And as one who invites to Allah's (grace) by His leave, and as a lamp spreading light (Al-Ahzab 33:45-46)
[وَسِرَاجاً مُّنِيراً]

(and as a lamp spreading light.) means, `the Message that you bring is as clear as the sun shining brightly, and no one can deny it except those who are stubborn.'


Tafsir Ibn Kathir 33:45-6 (http://tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=33&tid=41877)
Say: "I tell you not that with me are the treasures of Allah, nor do I know what is hidden, nor do I tell you I am an angel. I but follow what is revealed to me." Say: "can the blind be held equal to the seeing?" Will ye then consider not?

[Qur'an 6: 50]


Say: "I am but a man like yourselves, (but) the inspiration has come to me, that your Allah is one Allah: whoever expects to meet his Lord, let him work righteousness, and, in the worship of his Lord, admit no one as partner.

[Qur'an Al Kahf 18: 110]


http://tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=6&tid=15448

[khanbaba]

Allamah Aloosi r.h has written that anyone who says PROPHET s.a.w was not a Bashar but a Noor, he is a kafir.

[MMS]

Asalaamu alaikum warahmatulah wabarakatuh. :)
[وَسِرَاجاً مُّنِيراً]

(and as a lamp spreading light.) means, `the Message that you bring is as clear as the sun shining brightly, and no one can deny it except those who are stubborn.'


Tafsir Ibn Kathir 33:45-6 (http://tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=33&tid=41877)
Say: "I tell you not that with me are the treasures of Allah, nor do I know what is hidden, nor do I tell you I am an angel. I but follow what is revealed to me." Say: "can the blind be held equal to the seeing?" Will ye then consider not?

[Qur'an 6: 50]


Say: "I am but a man like yourselves, (but) the inspiration has come to me, that your Allah is one Allah: whoever expects to meet his Lord, let him work righteousness, and, in the worship of his Lord, admit no one as partner.

[Qur'an Al Kahf 18: 110]


http://tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=6&tid=15448



tah be fair theres a difference of opinion on the verses 33:45-46
i believe in both tafsir al-jalalayn and tafsir ibn abbas it is said that the illuminating lamp refers to rasoolAllah :saw:

not to say that we was created from light but he was a light for mankind to bring them out of the darkness

and Allah knows best

[Tax-Man]

lol people take their love for the prophet(pbuh) to extremes, the prophet was flesh and blood he was created like any other man and women.

[Mu'awiya]

tah be fair theres a difference of opinion on the verses 33:45-46
i believe in both tafsir al-jalalayn and tafsir ibn abbas it is said that the illuminating lamp refers to rasoolAllah :saw:

not to say that we was created from light but he was a light for mankind to bring them out of the darkness

and Allah knows best


Asalaamu alaikum warahmatulahi wabarakatuh.



Jazaak Allaah khayrun :)

[Abu Mus'ab]

He is not literally light if that what you're trying to imply ....
That is what he's saying, that's what barelwis believe.

[Ebony]

Can I ask whats the point of debating whether the Prophet (saw) was noor? Or hazir/nazir? What benefit is there in doing so?

Aren't you all wasting time arguing over things that are of little or no use to anyone??

[alld]

Can I ask whats the point of debating whether the Prophet (saw) was noor? Or hazir/nazir? What benefit is there in doing so?

Aren't you all wasting time arguing over things that are of little or no use to anyone??

wise words mashaAllah :up:

[Tax-Man]

Can I ask whats the point of debating whether the Prophet (saw) was noor? Or hazir/nazir? What benefit is there in doing so?

Aren't you all wasting time arguing over things that are of little or no use to anyone?? People who hold the view that the Prophet(pbuh) are commiting bidah so it's duty as muslims to inform them otherwise.

[Ebony]

People who hold the view that the Prophet(pbuh) are commiting bidah so it's duty as muslims to inform them otherwise.

Well then "inform" them and move along. Harping on about it and in the hope of having them change their view on the spot isn't going to work, but is simply going to drive their own POV more deeper.

[Tax-Man]

Well then "inform" them and move along. Harping on about it and in the hope of having them change their view on the spot isn't going to work, but is simply going to drive their own POV more deeper. Well that's your opinion, there's nothing wrong with intellectual debate, both sides present their argument and inshallah truth shall be known

[Omar]

Well that's your opinion, there's nothing wrong with intellectual debate, both sides present their argument and inshallah truth shall be known

well the problem with this here then is the intellectual part. Coz No one here is intelligent :up:

[Ebony]

There is little point in these discussions in that it serves as a distraction.

You'll have people debating on this issue in mosques for frigging weeks on end - with no end conclusion when they could be discussing other topics of importance.

[Tax-Man]

There is little point in these discussions in that it serves as a distraction.

You'll have people debating on this issue in mosques for frigging weeks on end - with no end conclusion when they could be discussing other topics of importance. But seriously whats the point of a forum if it isn't to debate and discuss issues which concern the ummah, I had issues with aspects of islam, I lost a few debates along the years to people in the real world and have changed my Aqeeda accordingly.

[cl@rity]

You don't have to be. Just accept the true aqeeda, Rasoolullah (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is Noor, the following hadeeth proves it:

Once Hazrat Jaabir (radi Allahu anhu) asked the Holy Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) whom Allah Ta'ala created before anything else. The Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) stated: "O Jaabir! Verily, before the creation of anything else, Almighty Allah created the Noor of your Nabi from His Noor." (Muwahibul Laduniya; Zirkani Shareef)

The above does not denote that the prophet (s) IS noor. Its implying that the noor around the prophet (s) is from Allah (swt).

[Omar]

mashaAllah internet debates between these intellectuals is very awe inspiring. i learn so much from you guys

[Ebony]

I think there are other issues that require more attention than whether the Prophet (saw) was noor or not.

Carry on with your "debate" :up: Its been done to death numerous times before.

[Tax-Man]

I think there are other issues that require more attention than whether the Prophet (saw) was noor or not.

Carry on with your "debate" :up: Its been done to death numerous times before. And havn't the rest, I doubt the average muslim even knows of this debate.

[Debater]

Since Prophet Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is not a Man but is made of Noor of Allah means that he is part of Allah like Jesus is the part of God (His son), ma'athAllah. Therefore what is written in Surat al Akhlaas is a lie, ma'athAllah, and since Muhammad is made of Noor and we Muslims are made of Earth, we can't do what Muhammad did, so lets brothers and sisters convert to Hindus and worship all the great Dead like 'Abdul Qadir Jeelani etc.

Happy Ashraaf Ali, or you want us all to prostrate to the Fire (Noor) right now?

[Abu Mus'ab]

well the problem with this here then is the intellectual part. Coz No one here is intelligent :up:
:rotfl:

you're not intelligent either :|

[S@Z]

:lahawla:
There is little point in these discussions in that it serves as a distraction.

You'll have people debating on this issue in mosques for frigging weeks on end - with no end conclusion when they could be discussing other topics of importance.sahi

[khanbaba]

Once Hazrat Jaabir (radi Allahu anhu) asked the Holy Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) whom Allah Ta'ala created before anything else. The Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) stated: "O Jaabir! Verily, before the creation of anything else, Almighty Allah created the Noor of your Nabi from His Noor." (Muwahibul Laduniya; Zirkani Shareef)

First of all there is no sanad of this hadees. And it was narrated by Imam Abdur Razzak and Muhaddith ibn Adi said about him that his narrations about fazaail are such that no one agrees with him. Also Allamah Muhammed Tahiq al Hanafi (died 586) said that Ahmed bin Abdullah entered falses narrations in the books of Imam Abdur Razzak.

Hazrat Shah Abdul Azeez says about Imam Abdur Razzak:

"His ahadees about fazail, were not taken by fuqaha, infact there is ijma among then against his narrations"

Allamah Abdul Hassan ALi Nadawi has also stated that his narrations about fazail were false and against the Quran especially the above mentioned hadees.

And Mullah ALi Qari said that here *noor* is referring to the Rooh of Prophet s.a.w.. (Mirqaat).

Hafiz ibn Hajar Asqali said:
"First thing that was created was al-Qalam"

This aqeeda that Prophet s,a,w is made of Noor was taken from Shias.

[Debater]

This aqeeda that Prophet s,a,w is made of Noor was taken from Shias.
The root of deviation from Islam has been provided by the Shia Faith, Rafidhism. This is the cancer which has inflicted upon a great part of Ummah. For example one of the Foundations of Barelvism is Shi'ism (beliefs imported from shi'ism).

[Omar]

:rotfl:

you're not intelligent either :|

i know im not and im not deluded like you to say i have knowledge on these things

[khanbaba]

Shaykh Muhammad bin Yahya Al-Husayni Al-Ninowy said:

Whosoever believes that Allah is light, has departed from the fold of Islam, and became a blasphemer.

Light is a creation of Allah. Allah Ta’ala said in Surat Al-An’aam, ayah 1:
)الحمد لله الذي خلق السماوات والارض وجعل الظلمات والنور ثم الذين كفروا بربهم يعدلون (

The meaning of this ayah is: “Praise to Allah, Who has created the heavens and the earth, and appointed (created) darkness and light. Yet those who disbelieve ascribe rivals unto their Lord”.

The ayah clearly states the darkness and light are creations of Allah. Hence, Allah Ta’ala, cannot be attributed with that, this is a Torah/Bible stemmed idea. An-Noor, as one of the names of Perfection of Allah, does not mean light which consists of streaming photons, etc.. An-Noor means Al-Haady, The Lord who guides to the right path. That of course is the closes interpretation by the scholars based on the Book and the Saheeh of the Sunnah. Yet, know, may Allah guide us and you, that no one knows the true significance and meanings of the names of Allah but Allah, Ta’ala.

[alld]

i know im not and im not deluded like you to say i have knowledge on these things

:rotfl:

[Debater]

These people who preach the belief that Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam was made of Nur of Allah must be asked to repent and if they don't repent and come back to Islam then they must be killed under an Islamic State or Ameer.
If it was done in the beginning such Fitnah Makers would have perished by now.

Woe to our predecessors who neglected the Fitnah of Shi'ism and all related Deviations that today we have a number of such Deviant Sects.

[alld]

These people who preach the belief that Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam was made of Nur of Allah must be asked to repent and if they don't repent and come back to Islam then they must be killed under an Islamic State or Ameer.
If it was done in the beginning such Fitnah Makers would have perished by now.

Woe to our predecessors who neglected the Fitnah of Shi'ism and all related Deviations that today we have a number of such Deviant Sects.

though hard but an interestingly positive piont :) . these deviant sects are like a parasite . :(

[Peacenik]

Assalaamu alaikum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuhu dear brothers in Islam

I am posting this excellent article which I found online which persuasively prooves our aqeeda that Hazrat Muhammad Mustafa (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is indeed Noor, in fact, his Noor is created from the Noor of Allah Azzawajal

Walaikum-a-salaam wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuhu

Isn't that Shirk ?

This is a highly danegrous statement to make.

May ALLAH (SWT) Protect us from such thoughts.

Ameen.

[Ashraaf Ali]

Assalaatu wa salaam Ya Rasoolullah! Assalaamu alaikum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuhu dear brothers in Islam:

I will just address a few points which have been raised. First, some of you are saying that since Huzoor (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) was created from the Noor of Allah Azzawajal, does this not imply that Huzoor (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) has the same substance or essence as Allah Taala? The answer is a big no!

Let's look at what Allah Taala says about how He created human being from His Rooh (Spirit):

But He fashioned him in due proportion, and breathed into him something of His spirit (As-Sajdah 32:9)

So if Allah Taala can create a normal human being from His own Rooh (Spirit), why is it so hard to believe that He created Huzoor (Sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) from His own Noor (Light)?

For more clarification on this topic: http://www.sunnah.org/aqida/light_of_the_prophet_sall.htm

[Peacenik]

...that since Huzoor (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) was created from the Noor of Allah Azzawajal

Brother, please stop saying such a highly dangerous statement as this.

Do you know what you're saying and implying ?

May ALLAH (SWT) Guide you.

Ameen.

[Abu Hurairah]

Ashraf Ali are you stating by your claim that Rasul'Allah (saw) is apparently made of noor that he was somehow Angelic?

Also if he is made of light do you believe he had no flesh and bones and therefore somehow unhuman?

If Rasul (saw) were cut are you saying rather then blood flowing there would be rays of light beeming out from him?

Are you saying unlike Adam (as) and other humans that were made of clay/ mud that Rasul (saw) instead was made of noor?

When you say:
.....He created Huzoor (Sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) from His own Noor (Light)?

Are you implying that our Rasul (saw) has been made of the same substance as Allah (swt) or from a part of him somehow?

[Peacenik]

Just goes to show how messed up certain Muslims are.

:(

[Ashraaf Ali]

Assalaatu wa salaam ya Rasoolullah

Dear brother Abu Huraira, (that's a beautiful name btw)

Rasoolullah (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is fully human, but he is also fully created from Noor. Yes, if he was cut he would bleed like any of us, and he was bleeding when the people of Taif began to harrass and stone him. However, it is also a fact that Rasoolullah (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) did not cast a shadow on the ground. Everyone who saw him described him as being illuminous like the full moon. People said he was giving off a radiant white light from all over his body. The Holy Quran has called him both as Noor and Sirajan Muneer. Why do you people refuse to accept the plain fact from the Holy Quran and Sunnat?

[Debater]

Just goes to show how messed up certain Muslims are.

:(
Yes, the Miracles of blind Taqlid.
If they didn't do blind taqleed of 'ulama they would be doing taqlid of Messenger of Allah.

[Ashraaf Ali]

This has nothing to do with taqleed. I am showing you plain references from Quran-e-Kareem and from Ahadeeth.

[Debater]

However, it is also a fact that Rasoolullah (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) did not cast a shadow on the ground. Everyone who saw him described him as being illuminous like the full moon. People said he was giving off a radiant white light from all over his body. The Holy Quran has called him both as Noor and Sirajan Muneer. Why do you people refuse to accept the plain fact from the Holy Quran and Sunnat?
You establish your beliefs on weak or fake hadiths forged by Irani Munafiqeen, why don't you follow Quran and Sahih Hadiths?
And in Quran even the Books of Allah have been called Noor, so the Quran we have in our houses is also made of Noor of Allah physically, ma'athAllah?
Is Quran the part of body of Allah, ma'athAllah.

Revert to Islam bro, leave your Munafiq scholars who guide you to the Hell.

By the way, Quran doesn't anywhere say that Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam was someone special from other Prophets, even 'Isa 'alayhis salam and Musa 'alayhis salam were given more miracles than Allah gave to Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam. I don't think there is any Prophet superior to all, because superiority is the virtue of Allah the Almighty only. If a Prophet has one quality, another Prophet has some other quality, you can't say this Prophet is the best of all.

We love Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam because he is the one through whom we were guided to the right path, we love him because he is our spiritual father, we love him more than we love our parents because he has more favours on us than our parents have.
It doesn't mean we start worshipping him like Christians do to 'Isa 'alayhis salam.

And sorry to say bro, you are also doing the same thing Christians do, ask forgiveness of Allah, you are being blasphemous, you are lowering the status of Allah the Almighty, our Prophet Muhammad is the Slave of Allah and a slave can't be equal to Allah. What you are trying to do is to make Muhammad equal to Allah or part of Him that deserves a Painful Death in my eyes.

If I were the Khalifah of this Ummah, I would slaughter all those people who slander Allah that Muhammad is made of Nur of Allah.

[Peacenik]

I wonder if Ashraf's seen the chicken-dance video ?

And whether he agrees with that ('dance') ?

:rolleyes:

[al faqeer]

You establish your beliefs on weak or fake hadiths forged by Irani Munafiqeen, why don't you follow Quran and Sahih Hadiths?
And in Quran even the Books of Allah have been called Noor, so the Quran we have in our houses is also made of Noor of Allah physically, ma'athAllah?
Is Quran the part of body of Allah, ma'athAllah.

Revert to Islam bro, leave your Munafiq scholars who guide you to the Hell.

By the way, Quran doesn't anywhere say that Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam was someone special from other Prophets, even 'Isa 'alayhis salam and Musa 'alayhis salam were given more miracles than Allah gave to Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam. I don't think there is any Prophet superior to all, because superiority is the virtue of Allah the Almighty only. If a Prophet has one quality, another Prophet has some other quality, you can't say this Prophet is the best of all.

We love Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam because he is the one through whom we were guided to the right path, we love him because he is our spiritual father, we love him more than we love our parents because he has more favours on us than our parents have.
It doesn't mean we start worshipping him like Christians do to 'Isa 'alayhis salam.

And sorry to say bro, you are also doing the same thing Christians do, ask forgiveness of Allah, you are being blasphemous, you are lowering the status of Allah the Almighty, our Prophet Muhammad is the Slave of Allah and a slave can't be equal to Allah. What you are trying to do is to make Muhammad equal to Allah or part of Him that deserves a Painful Death in my eyes.

If I were the Khalifah of this Ummah, I would slaughter all those people who slander Allah that Muhammad is made of Nur of Allah.

And you follow the Khalaf YUK ! Ibn Taymiiyah and ahlul Tajseem :) .

[Ashraaf Ali]

Please control your emotions before you say something that is going to cause fitnah. You must always control what you say and write, and be careful not to do anything that goes against shariat.

First of all, brother Debater is telling me to revert to Islam, implying that I am somehow a non-Muslim, and he is also calling the pious ulama of Ahle Sunnat wa'l Jamaat as, auzubillah, munafiqeen.

Even worse he is calling the compilers of ahadeeth as "Irani munafiqeen"
(astaghfirullah). I wander who he is talking about, all of the great muhaditheen, like Hazrat Imam Bukhari (rahmatullah alaih), and others, like Imam Tirmizi, and Imam Nasai, they were all great Persian Muslims, and we owe very much towards them. It is not right to accuse these great people of, God forbid, nifaq.

Brother, please I appeal to you don't trash the unity of the Muslims. We are all Muslims, we all believe that Allah Taala is the One Lord, and Huzoor (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is the Khatamul Anbiya, the Last of the Prophets.

And no one is saying that Huzoor (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is part of Allah, or has the same essence of Allah. Yes, Huzoor (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is created from the Noor of Allah, just like Angels are, and like human beings are made from the Rooh of Allah (as-sajdah 32:9). We are not saying that Rasool-e-Paak (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is inhuman, but we are saying that he is a great human, and he was a Prophet of Allah while Nabi Adam (alaihi salaam) was still being made.

Jazak Allah khair.

[al faqeer]

Please control your emotions before you say something that is going to cause fitnah. You must always control what you say and write, and be careful not to do anything that goes against shariat.

First of all, brother Debater is telling me to revert to Islam, implying that I am somehow a non-Muslim, and he is also calling the pious ulama of Ahle Sunnat wa'l Jamaat as, auzubillah, munafiqeen.

Even worse he is calling the compilers of ahadeeth as "Irani munafiqeen"
(astaghfirullah). I wander who he is talking about, all of the great muhaditheen, like Hazrat Imam Bukhari (rahmatullah alaih), and others, like Imam Tirmizi, and Imam Nasai, they were all great Persian Muslims, and we owe very much towards them. It is not right to accuse these great people of, God forbid, nifaq.

Brother, please I appeal to you don't trash the unity of the Muslims. We are all Muslims, we all believe that Allah Taala is the One Lord, and Huzoor (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is the Khatamul Anbiya, the Last of the Prophets.

And no one is saying that Huzoor (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is part of Allah, or has the same essence of Allah. Yes, Huzoor (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is created from the Noor of Allah, just like Angels are, and like human beings are made from the Rooh of Allah (as-sajdah 32:9). We are not saying that Rasool-e-Paak (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is inhuman, but we are saying that he is a great human, and he was a Prophet of Allah while Nabi Adam (alaihi salaam) was still being made.

Jazak Allah khair.

Debater cant help it , His Salafi :) .

[Debater]

First of all, brother Debater is telling me to revert to Islam, implying that I am somehow a non-Muslim, and he is also calling the pious ulama of Ahle Sunnat wa'l Jamaat as, auzubillah, munafiqeen.
Pardon me, only a minority of Sunnis believes that the Prophet Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam was made from Nur of Allah and they themselves have separated themselves from the Jama'at of Muslims by inventing such 'aqeedahs, and sorry to say I don't have any good names for those who cut themselves off from the Jama'at of Sahabah as we don't have any sound reports that Sahabah held the same beliefs about Prophet Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam as yours.



Even worse he is calling the compilers of ahadeeth as "Irani munafiqeen"
(astaghfirullah). I wander who he is talking about, all of the great muhaditheen, like Hazrat Imam Bukhari (rahmatullah alaih), and others, like Imam Tirmizi, and Imam Nasai, they were all great Persian Muslims, and we owe very much towards them.

Well, you know who I am calling Munafiqeen in this context, they are those people who forged hadiths which are the Divine Revelations for your sect. Imam Bukhari and others didn't forge any hadiths, they were compilers of their books, and if a fake hadith is found in the book of for example Imam Tirmidhi then that is considered the mistake of Tirmidhi, that was his ijtihaad he accepted that hadith to be sound. It is no where written in Quran that if a hadith is found in Bukhari or Sunan Tirmidhi is 100% authentic and whoever rejects that is a Kafir. This is 'Ulama of hadith who check the authenticity of hadiths and it is obvious that the hadiths your sect is depending on are not accepted by the mainstream of Ummah. You are a minority sect which believes in making Fitnahs by raising those issues which are not proven by Quran and Sahih Hadiths but proven by Fitnah Makers sectarian work only.

And no one is saying that Huzoor (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is part of Allah, or has the same essence of Allah. Yes, Huzoor (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is created from the Noor of Allah, just like Angels are, and like human beings are made from the Rooh of Allah (as-sajdah 32:9). We are not saying that Rasool-e-Paak (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is inhuman, but we are saying that he is a great human, and he was a Prophet of Allah while Nabi Adam (alaihi salaam) was still being made.[/quote]
Have some shame man, you are continuously viling at Allah the Almighty, angles are the creations, Nur or Light is the creation of our Lord Allah. The word / term Nur has been used in Quran in different contexts, one thing is confirmed that Allah can't be His own Creation, He can't be light as light is His creation. As for verses like Allah is the Nur of the heavens and the earth are mutashabeh verses, we have only to believe that they are the words of Allah, we don't go into details of them, because in the 7th verse of Aal Imran Allah says those who interpret mutashabeh verses are the Fitnah Mongers, and you and your sect are happen to be doing the same.
Fear Allah, enter Islam.

[Debater]

Debater cant help it , His Salafi :) .
At least I am a human being, not a monkey like you.

[MMS]

And you follow the Khalaf YUK ! Ibn Taymiiyah and ahlul Tajseem :) .

At least I am a human being, not a monkey like you.

mashallah :rolleyes::rolleyes:

[Debater]

mashallah :rolleyes::rolleyes:
jazakAllah:inlove:

[Ashraaf Ali]

Bismillahi Arrahmani Arraheem

Assalaatu wa salaam ya Rasoolullah

Have some shame man, you are continuously viling at Allah the Almighty, angles are the creations, Nur or Light is the creation of our Lord Allah. The word / term Nur has been used in Quran in different contexts, one thing is confirmed that Allah can't be His own Creation, He can't be light as light is His creation. As for verses like Allah is the Nur of the heavens and the earth are mutashabeh verses, we have only to believe that they are the words of Allah, we don't go into details of them, because in the 7th verse of Aal Imran Allah says those who interpret mutashabeh verses are the Fitnah Mongers, and you and your sect are happen to be doing the same.
Fear Allah, enter Islam.

No one believes that Allah Azzawajal is literally Noor (made from Noor), because you correctly point out, Noor is the creation of Allah Taala. And Rasool-e-Paak (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is the creation of Allah, and the Malaikah are the creation of Allah. We are not interpreting any verses, we are accepting what the Holy Quran says without question, and the Holy Quran says that Rasool-e-Paak (Sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is Sirajan Muneer (Al-Ahzab 33:46). And the ahadeeth testify that Rasool-e-Paak (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) did not have a shadow, and in his own words our beloved (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) said that before the creation of anything else, Allah Taala created our Nabi from the Noor of His Noor.

[MMS]

jazakAllah:inlove:

dunno what ur gettin excited about :rolleyes: the barelwi has better manners than u :rolleyes:

[Peacenik]

Ashraf, let me ask you this ?

What is your point ?

[hkrespect]

Asalamu alaikum

Ashraaf Ali - people who don't believe what you believe about the noor, are they still considered Muslims according to your beliefs?

anyine - tafsir of 32.9 would be interesting

ws

[Abu Mus'ab]

mashallah :rolleyes::rolleyes:
Not like it's anything new *Roll Eyes*

Omar was right, there's too much ignorance, this thread should be binned.

[Abu Mus'ab]

jazakAllah:inlove:
You DO know that MMS is a sister right? :rolleyes:

[Debater]

You DO know that MMS is a sister right? :rolleyes:
Just now I learnt that, before I didn't.

[Debater]

dunno what ur gettin excited about :rolleyes: the barelwi has better manners than u :rolleyes:
You suggest I should convert to be a barelvi to learn good manners.

[Debater]

No one believes that Allah Azzawajal is literally Noor (made from Noor), because you correctly point out, Noor is the creation of Allah Taala. And Rasool-e-Paak (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is the creation of Allah, and the Malaikah are the creation of Allah. We are not interpreting any verses, we are accepting what the Holy Quran says without question, and the Holy Quran says that Rasool-e-Paak (Sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is Sirajan Muneer (Al-Ahzab 33:46). And the ahadeeth testify that Rasool-e-Paak (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) did not have a shadow, and in his own words our beloved (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) said that before the creation of anything else, Allah Taala created our Nabi from the Noor of His Noor.
This is where you create the Problem, bro. See you mix Quranic verses with weak or forged narrations, this is exactly as following the Mutashabeh (unclear) verses of Quran in order to seek Fitnah. What you are trying to do here will create more differences in the Ummah.
What is the need to raise this issue?

If Quran calls Rasoolullah sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam siraj al muneer, it says many things to him, e.g Bashir and Nazir.
Does it mean Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is made of two more things as well as Nur, i.e being Bashir and Nazir?

By the way what is Nur of Allah from which Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is made?

And what about the verse(s) in Quran according to which Books of Allah (like Quran) are also Nur?

[Ashraaf Ali]

Ashraaf Ali - people who don't believe what you believe about the noor, are they still considered Muslims according to your beliefs


I don't want to comment on this, because the Holy Quran says that Rasoolullah (Sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is Noor:

يَا أَهْلَ الْكِتَابِ قَدْ جَاءكُمْ رَسُولُنَا يُبَيِّنُ لَكُمْ كَثِيرًا مِّمَّا كُنتُمْ تُخْفُونَ مِنَ الْكِتَابِ وَيَعْفُو عَن كَثِيرٍ قَدْ جَاءكُم مِّنَ اللّهِ نُورٌ وَكِتَابٌ مُّبِينٌ

(Al-Maidah 5:15)

So what do you think? If someone rejects an ayat of the Holy Quran, should we consider that person to be a Muslim? You can decide on my behalf.

According to Tafsir Jalalain, Noorun without a doubt refers to the Nabi (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam).

Jazakum Allah

[Debater]

I don't want to comment on this, because the Holy Quran says that Rasoolullah (Sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is Noor:

يَا أَهْلَ الْكِتَابِ قَدْ جَاءكُمْ رَسُولُنَا يُبَيِّنُ لَكُمْ كَثِيرًا مِّمَّا كُنتُمْ تُخْفُونَ مِنَ الْكِتَابِ وَيَعْفُو عَن كَثِيرٍ قَدْ جَاءكُم مِّنَ اللّهِ نُورٌ وَكِتَابٌ مُّبِينٌ

(Al-Maidah 5:15)

So what do you think? If someone rejects an ayat of the Holy Quran, should we consider that person to be a Muslim? You can decide on my behalf.

Jazakum Allah
That is where you are seeking Fitnah, as Allah exposed people like you in the verse 3:7 of Quran, you people interpret Unclear (Mutashabeh) verses of Quran.

If you believe Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is Nur from Allah then what are the qualities of this Nur?
Doesn't it mean that Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is Lower in status than other Prophets who were not Nur because the Angels are Inferior to Humans according to Quran and angles are made of Nur, no?

[Ashraaf Ali]

That is where you are seeking Fitnah, as Allah exposed people like you in the verse 3:7 of Quran, you people interpret Unclear (Mutashabeh) verses of Quran.

If you believe Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is Nur from Allah then what are the qualities of this Nur?
Doesn't it mean that Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is Lower in status than other Prophets who were not Nur because the Angels are Inferior to Humans according to Quran and angles are made of Nur, no?


Assalaamo alaikum dear brother Debater,

As far as interpreting mutashabh verses, we are not interpreting anything. We are only affirming what Allah has said regarding the Nabi (Sallallahu alaihi wa salaam). To explain the qualities of this Noor and to say it is metaphorical etc., that is interpretation, and whosoever is doing that, they are going astray. And the angels are not lower in status than human beings because they are made from noor. The angels are inferior because they don't have free will, so please don't confuse this issue.

Jazakum Allah

[Debater]

Assalaamo alaikum dear brother Debater,

As far as interpreting mutashabh verses, we are not interpreting anything. We are only affirming what Allah has said regarding the Nabi (Sallallahu alaihi wa salaam).
Wa 'alaikum assalam wa Rahmatullah

No, you are not affirming this, rather you are EXPLAINING that Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is Bashar (Man) as well as Nur which means you are TRYING to prove that here in this verse Nur means Muhammad is made of Nur though in that verse it doesn't say at all about what Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is made of.

To explain the qualities of this Noor and to say it is metaphorical etc., that is interpretation
If it is not metaphorical and is clear then why Allah used the same word / term Nur for Himself and for His Books?
Now see, 3 entities are made of Nur as would be implied through your approach; (1) Allah Himself (2) Prophet Muhammad s.a.w (3) Allah's Books.

Allah is not Human, Prophet Muhammad is Human, and Allah Books are Allah's words, but you are implying here that here Nur means Muhammad is made of Nur of Allah, then why Quran is not made of Nur of Allah?

And the angels are not lower in status than human beings because they are made from noor. The angels are inferior because they don't have free will, so please don't confuse this issue.
Does Quran say that they are inferior to Humans because they don't have free will?
It was you who claimed that Muhammad s.a.w is made of Nur of Allah the way Angels aer made of Nur of Allah.
So if you advocate this belief that Muhammad s.a.w is a man as well as a Nur from Allah, does it give him a high status or a lower one?

[Abu Mus'ab]

I don't want to comment on this, because the Holy Quran says that Rasoolullah (Sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is Noor:

يَا أَهْلَ الْكِتَابِ قَدْ جَاءكُمْ رَسُولُنَا يُبَيِّنُ لَكُمْ كَثِيرًا مِّمَّا كُنتُمْ تُخْفُونَ مِنَ الْكِتَابِ وَيَعْفُو عَن كَثِيرٍ قَدْ جَاءكُم مِّنَ اللّهِ نُورٌ وَكِتَابٌ مُّبِينٌ

(Al-Maidah 5:15)

So what do you think? If someone rejects an ayat of the Holy Quran, should we consider that person to be a Muslim? You can decide on my behalf.

According to Tafsir Jalalain, Noorun without a doubt refers to the Nabi (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam).

Jazakum Allah
You barelwis really dont understand anything :rubeyes:

Why don't you check what the 'noor' was? you afraid that you'll find that the noor is guiding people from darkness into light? i.e. from kufr to islam

[Ashraaf Ali]

Does Quran say that they are inferior to Humans because they don't have free will?
It was you who claimed that Muhammad s.a.w is made of Nur of Allah the way Angels aer made of Nur of Allah.
So if you advocate this belief that Muhammad s.a.w is a man as well as a Nur from Allah, does it give him a high status or a lower one?


And where does Holy Quran say that Angels are inferior to human beings because they are made from Noor?

Actually, this is in the Holy Quran, but it is a quote of Iblees:

(Iblis) said: "I am not one to prostrate myself to man, whom Thou didst create from sounding clay, from mud moulded into shape." (Al-Hijr 15:33)

And regarding the authenticity of the hadeeth narrated by Abdur Razzaq, there is no doubt as to it being authentic. Imam Bukhari (rahmatullah alaih) took 120 narrations from him, and Imam Muslim (rahmatullah alaih) took 400.

[Debater]

And where does Holy Quran say that Angels are inferior to human beings because they are made from Noor?

Actually, this is in the Holy Quran, but it is a quote of Iblees:

(Iblis) said: "I am not one to prostrate myself to man, whom Thou didst create from sounding clay, from mud moulded into shape." (Al-Hijr 15:33)
Bro, Allah commanded all Angels including Iblees to prostrate to Aadam 'alayhis salam and Allah gave the reason there that He the Almighty taught Aadam 'alayhis salam names i.e gave him knowledge. So it is knowledge from Allah which makes Humans superior to Angels, according to Quran.
Now if you think that Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is made of Nur like Angels, then it will imply that Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam if obeyed Allah then it wasn't a big deal, because he had the characterisitcs of Angels to obey Allah and naturally it will conclude that what Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam did i.e practised Islam is not possible for Humans, because Muhammad himself was not 100% Human, no?

[Ashraaf Ali]

So it is knowledge from Allah which makes Humans superior to Angels, according to Quran.

Subhan Allah! And it is none other than Huzoor (Sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) who is the most knowledgable creation of Allah Taala.


Now if you think that Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is made of Nur like Angels, then it will imply that Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam if obeyed Allah then it wasn't a big deal, because he had the characterisitcs of Angels to obey Allah and naturally it will conclude that what Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam did i.e practised Islam is not possible for Humans, because Muhammad himself was not 100% Human, no?


Completely wrong. Our Nabi (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is made from Noor, but that does not mean He is an angel. He is a human being, but a unique human being, don't you know the hadeeth:
"I am not like any one of you". (Tirmidhi; Sahih Bukhari)

Don't you know that the perspiration of ordinary human beings has a bad smell, but the Sahaba-e-Karam (razi Allah Taala anhum) used to use the perspiration of Nabi (Sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) as perfume! So tell me, is there any other human being like our Nabi (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam)? Is there any other human being who is Rahmatul Aalimeen?

Jazakum Allah

[ADZ w3]

:salams


READ THE BELOW POST!!!! END OF DISCUSSION!! check the tasir the ummah is agreeded upon...:)

[alld]

You barelwis really dont understand anything :rubeyes:

Why don't you check what the 'noor' was? you afraid that you'll find that the noor is guiding people from darkness into light? i.e. from kufr to islam

good piont . that clears up the matter . JazakAllah khayr .

[Cashew]

Huh.

The Prophet (pbuh) was at the same time entirely human and entirely the Holy Spirit...

Seems like I've heard something like that before...in Christianity.

[Debater]

Subhan Allah! And it is none other than Huzoor (Sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) who is the most knowledgable creation of Allah Taala.
Where did you read this information?


Completely wrong. Our Nabi (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is made from Noor, but that does not mean He is an angel. He is a human being, but a unique human being, don't you know the hadeeth:
"I am not like any one of you". (Tirmidhi; Sahih Bukhari)

And if Prophet Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is not like us means he is a strange creation of Allah; a mixtuer of human and angel both?

Don't you know that the perspiration of ordinary human beings has a bad smell, but the Sahaba-e-Karam (razi Allah Taala anhum) used to use the perspiration of Nabi (Sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) as perfume! So tell me, is there any other human being like our Nabi (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam)? Is there any other human being who is Rahmatul Aalimeen?

Jazakum Allah
Does Quran provide all this information about Prophet Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam?
Do Hadiths provide all information about other Prophets and Messengers of Allah too?

Quran was descent on Prophet Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam, but Tauraat and Injeel didn't descent on him. Maybe there were more more virtues of 'Isa 'alayhis salam and Musa 'alayhis salam mentioned in their Books or their hadiths.

Quran gives us only as much knowledge as is required by us, it doesn't encompass all the knowledge from Allah.

By the way the perspiration of Prophet Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam had a sweet smell like perfume then the perspiration of other great Messengers of Allah like Ibrahim, Musa 'alayhimus salam smelt badly, ma'athAllah?
Were they also made of Nur of Allah?

[Debater]

Huh.

The Prophet (pbuh) was at the same time entirely human and entirely the Holy Spirit...

Seems like I've heard something like that before...in Christianity.
Christians walked on the same path our Barelvis have chosen. Their distorted version of Islam is going to take them to the same level of Kufr and Shirk Christian reached for their deviations.

[Sulaiman Harun]

][/COLOR]
Assalaamu alaikum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuhu dear brothers in Islam:
:wswrwb:

I am posting this excellent article which I found online which persuasively prooves our aqeeda that Hazrat Muhammad Mustafa (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is indeed Noor, in fact, his Noor is created from the Noor of Allah Azzawajal:

THIS IS COMPLETELY SHIRK!!! :mad: :torture:

[al faqeer]

[/COLOR]
:wswrwb:

[COLOR=darkgreen][COLOR=#000000]
THIS IS COMPLETELY SHIRK!!! :mad: :torture:

Yeah according to salafi non comprehension everything is Shirk , their minds are too small to Contemplate .

They are so Holy on Shirk yet they make the worst TAJSEEM :) .

[Cashew]

'...Hazrat Muhammad Mustafa (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is indeed Noor, in fact, his Noor is created from the Noor of Allah Azzawaja. ..."

From the Nicene Creed:

" We believe in one God the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.

And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all worlds, God of God, Light of Light, Very God of Very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father by whom all things were made..." (emphasis mine)

[Sulaiman Harun]

Yeah according to salafi non comprehension everything is Shirk , their minds are too small to Contemplate .

They are so Holy on Shirk yet they make the worst TAJSEEM :) .

Do you support him?????????? :mad: ARe you supporting him in his shirk?

[al faqeer]

Do you support him?????????? :mad: ARe you supporting him in his shirk?

Dont accuse people of shirk Just because your mind cant comprehend something Bro .

No i Do not support you or him .

I leave it as Allahu a3lam .

[alld]

Dear moneeb . I am fine alhamdulilah and thanks for the pm. your stand is ok here so just ignore bro fakeer . :)

JazakAllah khayr .

[al faqeer]

Dear moneeb . I am fine alhamdulilah and thanks for the pm. your stand is ok here so just ignore bro fakeer . :)

JazakAllah khayr .

Yeah ignore me while the Ummah ignore salafism .

[Sulaiman Harun]

Dont accuse people of shirk Just because your mind cant comprehend something Bro .

That person is associating prophet (SAWS) with Allah (SWT) and you are saying it is not shirk!! That's stupid of you big brother!! :mad:

[Debater]

Yeah according to salafi non comprehension everything is Shirk , their minds are too small to Contemplate .

They are so Holy on Shirk yet they make the worst TAJSEEM :) .
Of course it is shirk to believe that Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is created from the Nur of Allah, you don't consider it shirk means you are the accomplice of them.

A monkey like you can't prove that Salafis believe in Tajseem of the Almighty.

[al faqeer]

That person is associating prophet (SAWS) with Allah (SWT) and you are saying it is not shirk!! That's stupid of you big brother!! :mad:

No its not its stupid to you cause your mind doenst understand whats being said .

think b4 you speak and leave it as Allah knows best the best Fatwa of all .

[al faqeer]

Of course it is shirk to believe that Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is created from the Nur of Allah, you don't consider it shirk means you are the accomplice of them.

A monkey like you can't prove that Salafis believe in Tajseem of the Almighty.


:) I ****ed u off eh :) you calling names now .

I like to bring the worst out in you PAAN eaters .

[Peacenik]

:) I ****ed u off eh :) you calling names now .

I like to bring the worst out in you PAAN eaters .

Why has he not been banned ?

[alld]

mods will ban once they see the language being used here .

[al faqeer]

Why has he not been banned ?

:) Its not Shirk to sayprophet mu7ammad PBUH was created from light or Clay We dont know :) .

Only Allah knows , If you call people monkeys you will be humiliated as easy as that :) .

[Peacenik]

al-faqeer, your use of this icon >>>>>>> ' :) ' will not excuse you for your comments.

Please bear that in mind.

JZK

[Samurai]

out of the precentage of sunnis, how many believe Mohammad (saw) true nature is noor, and Allah (swt) is the noor of all noor, and Mohammad (saw) is the best of all and most complete of all created noor?

[Samurai]

[/COLOR][/FONT]
Were they also made of Nur of Allah?

yes, indirectly, Mohamamd (saw) was the first noor, and all things have been created from his noor, everything descends from Mohammad (saw) he being the first creation and the highest point, Allah (swT) has the treasure of all things, and Mohammad (saw) is the most highest of all creation containing all the treasures and tajali of Allah (swt) found in universe

Allah (swt) is the light of all light, a light higher then all light, bringer down of light, limiter of the light, and light by which no light is like

I have a question, do sunnis have du'a jawthan al-kabeer in their sources?

[Sulaiman Harun]

No its not its stupid to you cause your mind doenst understand whats being said .

think b4 you speak and leave it as Allah knows best the best Fatwa of all .

:start:

:salams

:alhumdull

What wrong have I said????? Its better for you to remain silent since you aren't sure. There is absolutely no doubt that ALLAH (SWT) knows best. One more thing, prophet (SAWS) was also a human.

:jkk:

:wswrwb:

[Debater]

yes, indirectly, Mohamamd (saw) was the first noor, and all things have been created from his noor, everything descends from Mohammad (saw) he being the first creation and the highest point, Allah (swT) has the treasure of all things, and Mohammad (saw) is the most highest of all creation containing all the treasures and tajali of Allah (swt) found in universe

Allah (swt) is the light of all light, a light higher then all light, bringer down of light, limiter of the light, and light by which no light is like

I have a question, do sunnis have du'a jawthan al-kabeer in their sources?
Congratulations! You and Christians are brothers in Similar Faith..

[Samurai]

Also, Allah (swt) is the only real existance, and he is with all creation, the light of his face is found in all creation in various degrees, to believe otherwise to me is disbelief.

Allah (swt) is infinite, but if things were not created by his light, we would have no way of knowing him, it's true we never reach God, but all the beautiful names descended from the infinite ahadi sacred essence, all glory belongs to him, all beautiful names belong to him, all praise belongs to him, and Mohammad (saw) is Al-Ahmad Al-Amjad Al-Akram of all creation.

[Peacenik]

I still don't see what the point of this thread is ?

:confused:

[Samurai]

Congratulations! You and Christians are brothers in Similar Faith..

I find the gospel of John very enlightening, I just don't see it the way blind christians see it, congratulations, you and the jews who wanted to kill Isa (as) hearts are both the same, they can't understand a thing of God's light

[Debater]

I find the gospel of John very enlightening, I just don't see it the way blind christians see it, congratulations, you and the jews who wanted to kill Isa (as) hearts are both the same, they can't understand a thing of God's light
If Jews had Barelvis they would understand the Light, thanks a lot, Muslims and Christians both have Barelvis.

[Tax-Man]

the light of his face is found in all creation in various degrees, to believe otherwise to me is disbelief. This is a very dangerous statement to make, I persume you mean the signs of his creation can be found in everyone.

[Sulaiman Harun]

Samurai, you are constantly uttering filthy shirk!! :mad: May Allah (SWT) guide you to the staright path. Alahumma Ameen!

[Debater]

Also, Allah (swt) is the only real existance, and he is with all creation, the light of his face is found in all creation in various degrees, to believe otherwise to me is disbelief.
What about the Excreta of Humans and Animals?
Have some shame and go and die in some filth before barking this Kufr at Allah the Almighty.

You don't have any evidence from Quran al Kareem to support your Kafir-Ideas.

[Samurai]

This is a very dangerous statement to make, I persume you mean the signs of his creation can be found in everyone.

What is meant by signs of God in Quran? What signs of God are in our souls that God promised he will show to be sure of God's meeting?

How does everything glorify God if having no link to God?

Read more attentively, why only humble believe in God's signs? What is meant by it in Quran. What is mean by to God belongs the treasures of the heavens and the earth but the hypocrites can't understand this? What does it mean honor belongs to God, his Messenger, and believers, but hypocrites can't understand this? What does it mean when Quran says there is nothing but we are the treasurers of it and we don't bring down except in measurement?

What did Iblees deny and reject?

What was the great signs Mohammad (saw) was shown where no Angel could approach?

What did Musa (as) see when he bow downed and said I am repent to you and first to believe? And then Allah (swt) tells him he will not show the signs to the proud, what is the link with what he experienced and the signs of God?

And what does it mean that everyone on the boat will dissappear and God's face shall remain?

[Tax-Man]

What is meant by signs of God in Quran? What signs of God are in our souls that God promised he will show to be sure of God's meeting?

How does everything glorify God if having no link to God?

Read more attentively, why only humble believe in God's signs? What is meant by it in Quran. What is mean by to God belongs the treasures of the heavens and the earth but the hypocrites can't understand this? What does it mean honor belongs to God, his Messenger, and believers, but hypocrites can't understand this? What does it mean when Quran says there is nothing but we are the treasurers of it and we don't bring down except in measurement?

What did Iblees deny and reject?

What as the great signs Mohammad (pbuh) was shown where no Angel could approach?

What did Musa (as) see when he bow downed and said I am repent to you and first to believe? And then Allah (swt) tells him he will not show the signs to the proud, what is the link with what he experienced and the signs of God?

And what does it mean that everyone on the boat will dissappear and God's face shall remain? I fail how you asking me numerous questions serves your point, I have issues with yous saying the noor from the face of allah is in everyone? care to prove this?

[Samurai]

I fail how you asking me numerous questions serves your point, I have issues with yous saying the noor from the face of allah is in everyone? care to prove this?

Quran is for people who humble their hearts and fear God, cry due to the knowledge from there, like God said when his signs were recited to his friends, they fell down crying, and those who given knowledge, when read Quran fall down crying. As for the proud, they are cursed and can't understand a single word of the majestic book.

[Tax-Man]

Quran is for people who humble their hearts and fear God, cry due to the knowledge from there, like God said when his signs were recited to his friends, they fell down crying, and those who given knowledge, when read Quran fall down crying. As for the proud, they are cursed and can't understand a single word of the majestic book. so in other words u can't back your claim up :D

[Samurai]

so in other words u can't back your claim up :D

I can but knowledge is meant to be entered by it's doors like humility, sincerity, etc..

Everyone who don't enter the houses through it's doors, bear a burden they can't bear.

Quran is meant to be known by heart not mind.

What has been repeated in Quran in many ways, you are denying. "they say we believe in it but no one remembers but the possessors of understanding"

[Debater]

What is meant by signs of God in Quran? What signs of God are in our souls that God promised he will show to be sure of God's meeting?
Did God tell you what He meant by those signs?
Where is the explanation of those signs, revealed to your Dabba Pir?

Since everything is created from Allah's light, everything is as Holy as Allah is, then go make Idols of Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam from Clay which is Allah's creation, and prostrate to those Idols like your Hindu Brothers. Go worship snakes and genitals of humans as they are also Allah's creations and according to you they are made of Allah's light, ma'athAllah.

[Debater]

What has been repeated in Quran in many ways, you are denying. "they say we believe in it but no one remembers but the possessors of understanding"
And you nowhere refer to Quran to support your Kafir-Beliefs, you only are talking about your own imaginations which you learnt from Shayateen.

[Sulaiman Harun]

What is meant by signs of God in Quran? What signs of God are in our souls that God promised he will show to be sure of God's meeting?
Signs of Allah (SWT) means the things that prove the existence of ONENESS OF ALLAH (SWT).

How does everything glorify God if having no link to God?
We have link to Allah (SWT) when we perform As Salaah, when we make du'a and others


Read more attentively, why only humble believe in God's signs? What is meant by it in Quran. What is mean by to God belongs the treasures of the heavens and the earth?

Read the Tafsir to get answers

What does it mean when Quran says there is nothing but we are the treasurers of it and we don't bring down except in measurement?
Where is this mentioned in the Qur'an?, please quote a verse.

What did Iblees deny and reject?
Read Surah al-Baqarah and you'll, :insha: get the answer


What as the great signs Mohammad (pbuh) was shown where no Angel could approach?

What do you mean?

[/quote]What did Musa (as) see then he bow down and say I am repent to you and first to believe? And then Allah (swt) tells him he will not show the signs to the proud, what is the link with what he experienced and the signs of God?[/quote]
Please quote the verses from the Qur'an.

[IndianMuslim]

BismillahirRahmanirRahim,

As Salato Was Salamo Alaika Yaa Sayeedi Yaa RASOOLALLAH Sallal Laho Alaihi Was Salam.

Alhumdulillaah.

Rasoolullah (SAW) is Noor

I wish to draw the attention of my brethren to the fact [acceptable by every denomination of UMMAH E MOHAMMADI (SAW), INSHA-ALLAH (SWT)] - AL MIRAJ, Alhumdulillaah.

We in the present times know for a fact that speed of light (NOOR) is the fastest and no one can travel at the speed of light & survive as the mass which is considered as constant in other forms of travels do not remain constant while traveling at the speed of light (RELATIVITY THEORY). Hence, for humans to survive traveling at such speed is not possible.

Further, muslims always believed ANGELS (A.S.) do travels at speed of light as they (A.S.) are made of light (NOOR), INSHA-ALLAH (SWT). (32:05)

AL MIRAJ, is a fact as confirmed by Surah 17. Al-Israa (Bani Israel) & Surah 53. An-Najm, Alhumdulillaah.

In the light of the above proof, can we still deny the fact that, Rasoolullah (SAW) is Noor???

May ALLAH SUBHANA WA TAALA have mercy on HIS (SWT) slaves and bless us with hearts to feel HIS (SWT) Glorious Truth, Amin.

And peace be unto those sent (to warn).
And praise be to Allah, Lord of the Worlds!

[khanbaba]

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i72/khanbaba21/saad.jpg

This is the Dua which Prophet s.a.w made to Allah asking for Noor, so if Prophet was already Noor, why would he make this dua. Hazrat Maulana Idrees Kandhalvi said in his book of Aqaid tht anyone who says Prophet s.a.w is from the Noor of Allah is a mushrik.

[Sulaiman Harun]

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i72/khanbaba21/saad.jpg

This is the Dua which Prophet s.a.w made to Allah asking for Noor, so if Prophet was already Noor, why would he make this dua. Hazrat Maulana Idrees Kandhalvi said in his book of Aqaid tht anyone who says Prophet s.a.w is from the Noor of Allah is a mushrik.

:up:

[al faqeer]

Whether the Propeht PBUH was created of Noor and clay is not up to any of you or your 2 by 4 Khalafi scholars to decide guys :) .

HE PBUH is the best of Allah SWT creation and a Mercy to All the worlds , So you who under estimate him PBUH , can be prepared for humiliation in the life and the hereafter Ameen .

[Debater]

We in the present times know for a fact that speed of light (NOOR) is the fastest and no one can travel at the speed of light & survive as the mass which is considered as constant in other forms of travels do not remain constant while traveling at the speed of light (RELATIVITY THEORY). Hence, for humans to survive traveling at such speed is not possible.

Further, muslims always believed ANGELS (A.S.) do travels at speed of light as they (A.S.) are made of light (NOOR), INSHA-ALLAH (SWT). (32:05)

AL MIRAJ, is a fact as confirmed by Surah 17. Al-Israa (Bani Israel) & Surah 53. An-Najm, Alhumdulillaah.

In the light of the above proof, can we still deny the fact that, Rasoolullah (SAW) is Noor???
SubhaanAllah, barelvis into science, lol.

Rasoolullah sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam split moon which is one of his miracles, was he able to do that because he was made of Nur or his finger made a spade of Nur in the space to cut moon into two?

Barelvis shouldn't use their dumb logic as they are Jahils and they can't talk about common sense, there is no proof in Quran that angels travel with the speed of light for they are made of light (Nur). If so then do we humans move with the speed of earth or clay as we are made of earth?

[Debater]

Whether the Propeht PBUH was created of Noor and clay is not up to any of you or your 2 by 4 Khalafi scholars to decide guys :) .

HE PBUH is the best of Allah SWT creation and a Mercy to All the worlds , So you who under estimate him PBUH , can be prepared for humiliation in the life and the hereafter Ameen .
According to Quran men are made of clay and men are not made of Nur, if you don't accept this clear message of Quran then go and hide your face in the shameland.

According to Quran, Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is a man, so he is made of clay, Aadam 'alayhis salam is also made of clay, if this makes Rasoolullah sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam inferior then Jahils like you should know that it would make Aadam 'alayhis salam inferior too. Aadam 'alayhis salam is father of all humans and all Prophets, he is as good as Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is. And nowhere in Quran Allah says that Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is the best of all Creations, if you find one show me where.
You Jahil people walk on the same path Yahood and Nasaara walked to have fallen into unnecessary and imaginary beliefs and deviated from the right path.

[alld]

According to Quran men are made of clay and men are not made of Nur, if you don't accept this clear message of Quran then go and hide your face in the shameland.

According to Quran, Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is a man, so he is made of clay, Aadam 'alayhis salam is also made of clay, if this makes Rasoolullah sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam inferior then Jahils like you should know that it would make Aadam 'alayhis salam inferior too. Aadam 'alayhis salam is father of all humans and all Prophets, he is as good as Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is. And nowhere in Quran Allah says that Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is the best of all Creations, if you find one show me where.
You Jahil people walk on the same path Yahood and Nasaara walked to have fallen into unnecessary and imaginary beliefs and deviated from the right path.


Al-Baqarah (The Cow) Ayah : 285-285 Chapter 2


The Messenger has believed in the Guidance which has been sent down to him from his Lord, and those who believe in the Messenger have also sincerely accepted the same. They all believe in Allah, His Angels, His Books and Messengers. And they say, "We do not discriminate against any of His Messengers. We have heard the Message and submitted to it. Our Lord, we look up to You for forgiveness, for to You we shall all return."

[al faqeer]

According to Quran men are made of clay and men are not made of Nur, if you don't accept this clear message of Quran then go and hide your face in the shameland.

According to Quran, Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is a man, so he is made of clay, Aadam 'alayhis salam is also made of clay, if this makes Rasoolullah sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam inferior then Jahils like you should know that it would make Aadam 'alayhis salam inferior too. Aadam 'alayhis salam is father of all humans and all Prophets, he is as good as Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is. And nowhere in Quran Allah says that Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is the best of all Creations, if you find one show me where.
You Jahil people walk on the same path Yahood and Nasaara walked to have fallen into unnecessary and imaginary beliefs and deviated from the right path.

The Prophet PBUH was a Human being but like No other , How exactly he was created we do not know , So we leave it as Allahu a3lam .

We are not Jaahil since we are not salafis and we do not follow the khalaf like your self :D

[Peacenik]

Again, what is the point of this thread ?

[Debater]

The Prophet PBUH was a Human being but like No other
No other in what sense, in general all human beings are different from each other but their basic structures are the same, they all are the children of Aadam 'alayhis salam whether is Muslims or Kafirs. Only Taqwa makes difference and Rasoolullah sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam has the Most Taqwa in this Ummah, he is our leader, our guide, our Prophet, in our Ummah he is the best, but we can't say that he is best of all the Prophets and all the Creations as we don't read anything like that in Quran or sahih hadiths.

How exactly he was created we do not know , So we leave it as Allahu a3lam .
You don't even know how exactly you yourself are created, not to speak of Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam. We don't need to know that either.

[Debater]

Again, what is the point of this thread ?
To create Fitnah and destory Peace

[Debater]

According to Quran, Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is a man, so he is made of clay, Aadam 'alayhis salam is also made of clay...
Correction:

I made a mistake here to say Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is made of Clay, his Father Aadam 'alayhis salam was made of Clay and about Muhammad and all humans Allah knows the best.

[Peacenik]

To create Fitnah and destory Peace

I wondered as much.

Can someone please close this thread ?

[Debater]

I wondered as much.

Can someone please close this thread ?
We can wait for Barelvis to come back and answer my questions, if they think they can. Otherwise leave this thread as it is inshaAllah. If you close it they will think we are being defensive and they may have the misunderstanding they hold the correct view.
Things like that happen on sunniforum who are as intolerant as shias of shiachat.

[al faqeer]

No other in what sense, in general all human beings are different from each other but their basic structures are the same, they all are the children of Aadam 'alayhis salam whether is Muslims or Kafirs. Only Taqwa makes difference and Rasoolullah sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam has the Most Taqwa in this Ummah, he is our leader, our guide, our Prophet, in our Ummah he is the best, but we can't say that he is best of all the Prophets and all the Creations as we don't read anything like that in Quran or sahih hadiths.


You don't even know how exactly you yourself are created, not to speak of Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam. We don't need to know that either.


So its better for your like to believe what you do , and let us take care of the more complicated stuff :D .

Inshallah we will be with whom we loved in the Jannah and with who we didnt under estimate .

:)

[The Deen]

In the name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful

Assalaamu `alaykum waRahmatullahi Wabarakatoh

It is important to know what is meant by noor. The meaning of noor is light. Allah Ta’ala in the Qur’an has mentioned the moon as being noor.

هو الذى جعل الشمس ضياء والقمرنورا

Allah is the being who created the sun bright and the moon noor.

Noor is a light on its own and also gives light to others. The meaning that will be taken for noor will be that which is apparent and makes apparent. For this same reason the Prophets are called noor. They are guided and they are the medium for others to get guidance. In the dua اللهم اجعلنى نورا the same is meant. The names Noorudeen, Noorulislam, Noorullah are kept with the same purpose. Noor comes in the Qur’an for guidance just as Dhulmat (darkness) comes for going astray. Allah Ta’ala says in the Qur’an:

اومن كان ميتا فاحييناه وجعلنا له نورا يمشى به فى الناس كمن مثله فى الظلمات ليس بخارج منها

He who is dead, then We granted him life and gave him a light by which he may walk among people better than someone like him who is a multitude of darkness from which he will not come out?(Al-Anaam-122)

For something to be noor does not mean that it cannot be human also. If this was the case then it would not be correct for a human to make this dua اللهم اجعلنى نورا, because it would mean, O Allah take me out of the fold of humanity.

Rasullah (Sallalahu Alaihi Wasallam) was human as well as noor. Allah Ta’ala says in the Qur’an:

قُلْ إِنَّمَا أَنَا بَشَرٌ مِثْلُكُمْ

Say (O Muhammad) I’m verily a human like yourselves. (Al-Kahf-110)

Allah Ta’ala say in the Qur’an:

قَدْ جَاءَكُمْ مِنَ اللَّهِ نُورٌ وَكِتَابٌ مُبِينٌ

‎Verily came to you from Allah noor and the clear book. (Al-Maidah-15)

Many Mufassireen (Commentators of the Qur’an) have stated that by noor here is meant Rasullah (Sallalahu Alaihi Wasallam). The prophet was noor. He was guidance for the whole of mankind. Therefore, he was both noor and human.

To say that Rasullah (Sallalahu Alaihi Wasallam) is made of noor or made from the noor of Allah and is not human is incorrect. Him being human is proven from the ayat of Qur’an.

Fatawa Mahmoodia (1:102) Maktaba Mahmoodia

Ahsan Al-Fatawa (1:56) H.M. Saeed Company

And Allah knows best

Wassalam

Ml. Ehzaz Ajmeri,
Student Darul Iftaa

Checked and Approved by:

Mufti Ebrahim Desai
Darul Iftaa, Madrassah In'aamiyyah








So this clearly explains that the Prophet :saw: was noor, not literally but metaphorically (meaning guidance). He wasn't made of light, he was human just like us.

http://the-deen.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=863

[Rosey]

if he (saw) was just man like us then tell me why dint he have a shadow? why dint he ever smell? his (saw) sweat was sweeter than perfume. tell me why the angel gibreal (as) who is made out of actual light cudnt pass sidra muntaha where no angel or nabi has ever been passed but the nabi (saw) went passd? allah swt says if it wasnt for u oh muhammad nothing wud have been created. allah swt created the noor of the holy prophet pbuh before anything else in creation.

[Samurai]

Allah (swt) created the darkness and the light, blind be who remains blind because his heart was devoted to others then Allah (swt).

The guided are only guided by the light of God's face,try to cover the light as much as you like, you only cause yourself to perish.

Adam (as) was chosen above all creation because he was Ayatal Kubra where all the ayat and tajali in universe combined in him.

Take the path of Iblees if you like, what you are denying is repeated in the Quran many times, but soon you shall see the truth you denied.

Ahmad (as) is no doubt the most brightest and highest light Allah (swt) created. Might want to read suratal nur, Allah (swt) himself has called some men his light. But the subject is repeated over and over again, the subject of noor and yamal qayama and Mohammad (pbuh) and true position of man and guidance and sight, it's all connected.

[khanbaba]

Qadi Iyad Maliki said:

"Without a doubt Prophet s.a.w and all the Prophets were "bashar" and the blessed body of Prophet Muhammed s.a.w was bashar..."
Shifa vol 2, page

Allamah Shami writes there are 3 types of bashar,

1. Prophets
2. Sahabas
3. Regular people

Shami vol 1, page 492

Imam Mujaddad Alfe Sani Shaikh Ahmed Sarhindi writes:

"With sucha a high status, Prophet s.a.w was still a bashar"

It says in Fatawa Alamgeeri:

"Anyone who says that I am not sure if Prophet s.a.w was bashar or jin, then he is a kafir"

Allamah ZarQani al-Maliki quotes Shaikh Waliudeen al-Iraqi:

"Anyone who says that I am not sure if Prophet s.a.w was bashar or angel, then there is no doubt in his kufar"

Muhadditth Imam Abu Hatim al Kabeer says:

"We dont find anything fazail higer in Abu Bakar r.a and Umer r.a higher than that they were created from same dirt, from which Prophet s.a.w was created"

Prophet s.a.w said Me, Abu Bakar r.a and Umer r.a were created from same dirt and will be burried together in that"

[khanbaba]

allah swt created the noor of the holy prophet pbuh before anything else in creation
Hafiz ibn Hajar r.h has stated that from saheed ahadees we know that first thing that was created was al-qalam"

Mauduat e Kabeer page 31.

Also there are clear/saheeh ahdees which says that Prophet s.a.w did have a shadow, and ahadees that talk of other wise are weak/baatil ahadees.

[Al-Irhaab]

the prophet (saw) was a man and was made from that which all men were made from...

however he *saw* was the best from amongst creation

Chapter 2: THE EMINENCE OF OUR PROPHET (MAY PEACE BE UPON HIM) OVER THE WHOLE CREATION
Book 030, Number 5655:
Abu Huraira reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: I shall be pre-eminent arriongst the descendants of Adam on the Day of Resurrection and I will be the first intercessor and the first whose intercession will be accepted (by Allah).

[Debater]

the prophet (saw) was a man and was made from that which all men were made from...

however he *saw* was the best from amongst creation

Chapter 2: THE EMINENCE OF OUR PROPHET (MAY PEACE BE UPON HIM) OVER THE WHOLE CREATION

Book 030, Number 5655: Abu Huraira reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: I shall be pre-eminent arriongst the descendants of Adam on the Day of Resurrection and I will be the first intercessor and the first whose intercession will be accepted (by Allah).

I don't know what's wrong in the head is with you people, where in this hadith it says that Prophet Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is the best of all Creations?
The above hadith shows one of the virtues of Rasoolullah sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam but people like you HAVE to cause fitnah by making stupid statements and preaching false beliefs in the guise of Islam.

[alld]

I don't know what's wrong in the head is with you people, where in this hadith it says that Prophet Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is the best of all Creations?
The above hadith shows one of the virtues of Rasoolullah sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam but people like you HAVE to cause fitnah by making stupid statements and preaching false beliefs in the guise of Islam.

Didn't Allah swt choose the best among human creation to revael Quraan . ?

Further there is an Ayah in the Quraan which says Prophet :saw: is the best example to follow .

[Al-Irhaab]

I don't know what's wrong in the head is with you people, where in this hadith it says that Prophet Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is the best of all Creations?
The above hadith shows one of the virtues of Rasoolullah sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam but people like you HAVE to cause fitnah by making stupid statements and preaching false beliefs in the guise of Islam.

i suppose you learnt bad manners from other than the prophet (saw) and those that followed him from the companions and the tabieen and taba tabieen and those that continue to follow them until the day of qiyamah because no person of knowledge speaks to muslims like that may allah (swt) forgive you and the ones from whom you learnt these bad manners..

the title for this hadith was not chosen by myself but was by the great muhaddith who recorded it and he labeled it as...

'Chapter 2: THE EMINENCE OF OUR PROPHET (MAY PEACE BE UPON HIM) OVER THE WHOLE CREATION'

further more many of the ulema have stated this position that he (saw) is the best from the messengers (as) because of his virtues and the blessings that allah (swt) has bestowed upon him

[hkrespect]

I don't want to comment on this, because the Holy Quran says that Rasoolullah (Sallallahu alaihi wa salaam) is Noor:

يَا أَهْلَ الْكِتَابِ قَدْ جَاءكُمْ رَسُولُنَا يُبَيِّنُ لَكُمْ كَثِيرًا مِّمَّا كُنتُمْ تُخْفُونَ مِنَ الْكِتَابِ وَيَعْفُو عَن كَثِيرٍ قَدْ جَاءكُم مِّنَ اللّهِ نُورٌ وَكِتَابٌ مُّبِينٌ

(Al-Maidah 5:15)

So what do you think? If someone rejects an ayat of the Holy Quran, should we consider that person to be a Muslim? You can decide on my behalf.

According to Tafsir Jalalain, Noorun without a doubt refers to the Nabi (sallallahu alaihi wa salaam).

Jazakum Allah

asalamu alaikum

ok, many believe the Beloved Prophet (peace be upon him) is noor in the sense of guidance.

are you saying, the people not believing in the literal/physical noor renders them kaafir?

ws

[Debater]

Didn't Allah swt choose the best among human creation to revael Quraan . ?
Quran is the Book of Allah as are Tauraat and Injeel, you can't say Quran is the best and previous books were not. We don't read anywhere in Quran that Allah chose the best among all (human) creations to reveal Quran, these are all fantasies in the minds which carve unnecessary ideas to throw us into confusion. There is no need to think and search for the best creation of Allah among humans besides there is no evidence in the Book of who (of the Prophets) exactly the best is.

Further there is an Ayah in the Quraan which says Prophet :saw: is the best example to follow .
Obviously, it can't be Ibrahim, Musa and 'Isa 'alayhimus salaam and their Ummahs to follow Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam. If there is such verse in Quran that is definitely for the Ummah of Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam and certainly to us Prophet Muhammad's life gives the best example to follow.

[Debater]

i suppose you learnt bad manners from other than the prophet (saw) and those that followed him from the companions and the tabieen and taba tabieen and those that continue to follow them until the day of qiyamah because no person of knowledge speaks to muslims like that may allah (swt) forgive you and the ones from whom you learnt these bad manners..
Thanks for the reminder, I will try to learn good manners inshaAllah.

the title for this hadith was not chosen by myself but was by the great muhaddith who recorded it and he labeled it as...

'Chapter 2: THE EMINENCE OF OUR PROPHET (MAY PEACE BE UPON HIM) OVER THE WHOLE CREATION'

further more many of the ulema have stated this position that he (saw) is the best from the messengers (as) because of his virtues and the blessings that allah (swt) has bestowed upon him
Many 'ulama and a greath muhaddith can't dictate us what our beliefs should be, we only believe which comes from Allah and His Messenger Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam; if something comes from a few people doesn't mean that is the unanimous position of the Ummah.

[MMS]

I don't know what's wrong in the head is with you people, where in this hadith it says that Prophet Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam is the best of all Creations?
The above hadith shows one of the virtues of Rasoolullah sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam but people like you HAVE to cause fitnah by making stupid statements and preaching false beliefs in the guise of Islam.

wa rafa'na laka dhikrak :torture::torture::torture:

[Al-Irhaab]

Thanks for the reminder, I will try to learn good manners inshaAllah.


Many 'ulama and a greath muhaddith can't dictate us what our beliefs should be, we only believe which comes from Allah and His Messenger Muhammad sallAllahu 'alayhe wasallam; if something comes from a few people doesn't mean that is the unanimous position of the Ummah.

mashallah akhi may allah *Swt* put good manners into all of us

akhi if ur saying that there is ijma that the prophet *Saw* was not the greatest of the anbiya *as* and the greatest of ar rusul *as* then give some proof for this from the quran or ahadith or from the salaf as saliheen...

and the ayah which you quoted la nufarriqu... then what is the tafseer of this because from what i know it is that we do not reject any of the messengers ie believe in one and not the other.... not that they have equal status..

[Debater]

mashallah akhi may allah *Swt* put good manners into all of us

akhi if ur saying that there is ijma that the prophet *Saw* was not the greatest of the anbiya *as* and the greatest of ar rusul *as* then give some proof for this from the quran or ahadith or from the salaf as saliheen...

and the ayah which you quoted la nufarriqu... then what is the tafseer of this because f