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View Full Version : Allahu Akbar.....The Response To Five Misconceptions About Jihad



MXXXXM
02-05-07, 08:19 AM
Assalam Alicom

Misconception 1
They say
The Prophet peace be upon Him
"Jihad is going until the day of judgment"

And the response to that is.
Jihad is going as long as the conditions are met and we are able does it
Like praying, fasting and the rest of obligations
And we all know that we must do them
Until the Day of Judgment
As long as we are able to
And whenever we are not
They fall and we are not obligated to do them.
Example
You don't have to fast when you are traveling

So is it possible that all these obligations are restricted to the rule which says
Do it as long as you can

And some people come and say
Jihad is going and has no conditions and no restrictions
And going until the Day of Judgment whether we can do it or not????

And the evidence on all of that is

The Hadith which is mentioned in Sahih Muslim
Where the Prophet peace be upon Him tells us about 'Eisa
that He (Eisa) is about to fight some people
and Allah says to Him that He is unable to fight them
so take my slaves and don't fight.

Add to that evidence
One of the main evidences which is
We all know that the Prophet peace be upon Him
didn't fight the Mushrikeen in Mecca
and the first clash between Muslims and Mushrikeen
was more than 10 years after the beginning or Islam

and the list of evidences go on and on

so the question is
did the Prophets Muhammed and Eisa peace be upon both of them
leave Jihad when they were unable to do it
because they don't like it, believe in it or want to stop it????

We leave the reader to answer.

Misconception 2
They say that the Jihad which we are doing
Is defensive Jihad
(called in Shariah, Jihad Dafe' )
(refers to the Jihad when the enemy attacks the Muslims)
and this type of Jihad has no conditions whatsoever
and needs no ability

and the response to that is

this is just weak

we can just ask those people
is this Jihad recommended or obligatory ???

if the answer is recommended
we say you can't obligate people with what's recommended
and we all know that there is no sins or anything wrong
with leaving a recommended act whatsoever

if the answer is obligatory
we all know that all obligations in Islam
without any exception
fall and can be left and never done if we are unable to do them
and the biggest evidence on that is
the Hadith by the Prophet peace be upon Him which says
" whatever I command you to do, do what your able to do from it "

and also the verse
" fear Allah as much as you can "
and also

" On no soul doth Allah Place a burden greater than it can bear "

and again
the situation of Muslims in Mecca before migrating to Madenah

and the ability which we are talking about
is not the ability to carry a gun and stand in front of the enemy
nor the ability to use a gun and shoot few bullets on the enemy
nor the ability to hide in caves and between trees

the ability in defensive Jihad is
to be able to protect the Muslims
and stop the attack on the Muslims
and their lands
and more importantly
to be able to take the enemy out of the land of the Muslims

otherwise what's the point of hiding in caves and shooting at the enemy
if the enemy is killing our children in the cities
and shedding our blood and raping our women

and what kind of defense is that ?????

Misconception 3

they say that
we don't need a lot of ability to go for Jihad
and we don't need to have all the numbers and weapons
and the evidence on that is when the Prophet peace be upon Him
fought the Mushrikeen in many occasions
where the Muslims were much less in numbers than the non Muslims
and also the verse
" didn't you see how many times a small group won a big group "

and the response to that is

at those days
the wars were simple
and the weapons were simple

soldiers, swords, horse, camels, armors, arrows and so on
and all done by hand

and those weapons were in both sides
with the Muslims and the non Muslims
they both had the same type of weapons

while now

the weapons are much much advanced

where we have airplanes, rockets, machineguns
and weapons which we didn't even imagine that it's possible to manufacture

and not only that

those weapons are owned by the enemy and all that we have on us is
knives, hand guns, and small rockets
which don't even damage a small tank
which the enemy use as a toy

not only that
but also

the Muslims at that time even though they were less in numbers
their faith and religion
was correct and much higher than our situation today
where you see
the Sufi, the Shi'ee, the Khariji, the Ba'thi and much more.
And people even don't know how to pray properly
Nor how to fast

So how can you compare us today
With the companions at those times

And the biggest evidence on that is
In Uhud the Muslims lost the fight because few Sahabis
disobeyed the Prophet peace be upon Him
and went to get their share or money

and another example is
in Hunain
when the Muslims lost faith in Allah
because they thought their number will cause them to win the fight
and they almost lost the fight but Allah helped them

Misconception 4
they say
you guys have this big nightmare about non Muslims
and their ability
and the response to that is

in religion we have to separate our emotions
and look at the facts and the situation around us
and take logic and the circumstances around us into consideration


Misconception 5

they say
so what do you want us to do with the people of Palestine and Iraq and the rest
do we just sit down ????

and the response to that is

we have to go back to Quran and Sunnah and learn our religion
we have to forget about our emotions and focus on following the evidence
we have to increase our faith and go back to the path of Assalaf Assaleh

so what those people who claim to be on the path of Jihad nowadays
to stop the blood shed of Muslims
listen and obey to the rulers whom Allah chose for them
and stick to their Islamically lawful commands
follow what Olama' and scholars say and gather around them
stop spreading the Fitnah around the Muslims
And wake up from their dreams and illusions
And leave their emotions behind them
And more importantly to learn from the 50 years of bloodshed
In Palestine which brought nothing but destruction death to Muslims
And learn from what's happened in Lebanon few months ago
What happened and still happening in Iraq and Afghanistan

Do we need another 50 years in Iraq?
And another 50 in Afghanistan to wake up?????

May Allah preserve our blood and our lands?

Assalam Alicom
MXXXXM

tayfah-mansurah
02-05-07, 09:01 AM
whats is all this defeatist talk, useless. complete joke


[QUOTE=MXXXXM;1837557][CENTER]Assalam Alicom

Misconception 1
They say
The Prophet peace be upon Him
"Jihad is going until the day of judgment"

MXXXXM
02-05-07, 09:05 AM
this is Jihad based on Quran and Sunnah
and this is the path of Ahlul Sunnah Wal Jama'aa

brother/sister

if you think that i made a mistake in any part of what's mentioned above please qoute and respond to it properly.

may guide me on your hands and so you get all the reward.

and i'm sure you know the great reward behind that.

as for labelling all this useless and complete joke.

may Allah skip that for you.

and please remember that there are many Hadiths and verses up there.

Assalam Alicom
MXXXXM

tayfah-mansurah
02-05-07, 09:14 AM
you just wrote some defeatist comments, the neo salafi way, read these and learn:

Is jihad invalid if there is no khaleefah? http://www.islam-qa.com/index.php?ref=5275&ln=eng&txt=jihad

Ruling on Jihad and kinds of Jihad: http://www.islam-qa.com/index.php?ref=20214&ln=eng&txt=jihad

ruling on physical Jihad: http://www.islam-qa.com/index.php?ref=34830&ln=eng&txt=jihad

punishment for neglecting Jihad for the sake of Allah: http://www.islam-qa.com/index.php?ref=46807&ln=eng&txt=jihad

The conditions of Jihad in Iraq/Afghanistan/Palestine etc today is fard ayn, individual obligation, so dont beat around the bush and mislead muslims



this is Jihad based on Quran and Sunnah
and this is the path of Ahlul Sunnah Wal Jama'aa

brother/sister

if you think that i made a mistake in any part of what's mentioned above please qoute and respond to it properly.

may guide me on your hands and so you get all the reward.

and i'm sure you know the great reward behind that.

as for labelling all this useless and complete joke.

may Allah skip that for you.

and please remember that there are many Hadiths and verses up there.

Assalam Alicom
MXXXXM

MXXXXM
02-05-07, 10:28 AM
Akhi.....

it's one of two.....
you either didn't read what i wrote.
or you didn't read the links which you posted.

anyway.....
AlHamdullilah that you take from Islam qa because that will make it much easier to disscuss the issue
now....

the first one......

Is jihad invalid if there is no khaleefah?

that's a rule in Islam and no one disagrees on it.

in attacking Jihad you need an Imam.
in defenseive Jihad you don't need a one, you don't need a one if the enemy is close.

and this approved in the second link if you read it all.

anyway......
in my whole thread i never talked about this topic....
the topic of having a leader for Jihad.
please qoute me if you think i did.

so i don't know what's the point of posting the first link.

the second link is a very good one so please read it if you didn't.

the third and the last......
i don't know how did you conclude from what i said that Jihad doesn't exist or that i'm against it.

all that i'm saying is......
there are misconceptions about Jihad nowaday and i mentioned some of them and the response to them.

again.... if you think that i said something wrong
please qoute this part and respond to it.
it's as simple as that.


The conditions of Jihad in Iraq/Afghanistan/Palestine etc today is fard ayn,

i never said there is no Jihad in those places and i don't give a Fatwa on that since i don't have enough knowledge and even if i do i don't know the situation there.

all that i said there is most if not all of the groups who claim to be doing Jihad are doing it wrong and the evidence on that is the hundreds of Muslims who get killed on a daily basis which no one can deny.
so what kind of Jihad are they doing if we still see Muslims dying ?????
and how could this be Jihad if nothing is achieved.
remember we are not playing soccer here.....
we are missing with souls.

and one last thing......
if you really think that it's an individual obligation.....
why are you sitting behind your computer disscussing the topic with me. why don't you go for it. also remember that leaving Jihad when it's an obligation is a very great sin.

so are you a great sinner???????


so dont beat around the bush and mislead muslims

Akhi prove it and correct me.....
please qoute and respond by evidence.

i'll be waiting for your response Akhi.

may Allah guide us and you.

Assalam Alicom
MXXXXM

tayfah-mansurah
02-05-07, 10:56 AM
yes i was waiting for a foolish talafi response, you hear news from hear and there, bbc,cnn and you think you know everything happening on the ground there. people get killed in war, get that through your head


Akhi.....


all that i said there is most if not all of the groups who claim to be doing Jihad are doing it wrong and the evidence on that is the hundreds of Muslims who get killed on a daily basis which no one can deny.
so what kind of Jihad are they doing if we still see Muslims dying ?????
and how could this be Jihad if nothing is achieved.
remember we are not playing soccer here.....
we are missing with souls.

and one last thing......
if you really think that it's an individual obligation.....
why are you sitting behind your computer disscussing the topic with me. why don't you go for it. also remember that leaving Jihad when it's an obligation is a very great sin.

so are you a great sinner???????



Akhi prove it and correct me.....
please qoute and respond by evidence.

i'll be waiting for your response Akhi.

may Allah guide us and you.

Assalam Alicom
MXXXXM

Le Croyant
02-05-07, 01:45 PM
What a fool... spokeperson for the tawghoot regimes.

Islamiyyah
02-05-07, 01:50 PM
What a fool... spokeperson for the tawghoot regimes.

Innit?


This is a load of BS.

Wa La Howla Wa La Quwataa Illah Billah!!!

tayfah-mansurah
02-05-07, 02:29 PM
hahaha, glad im not the only one who feels this way, thanks people:up:


Innit?


This is a load of BS.

Wa La Howla Wa La Quwataa Illah Billah!!!

RashidD
02-05-07, 03:43 PM
You should read Thawaabit Ala Darb Al Jihad by Sheikh Uyayri or listen to Imam Anwar Al Awlaki's talks on it or both InshaALLAH.

UPS
02-05-07, 03:44 PM
Same people that follow Ibn Baz fatwah on leaving Filisteen to the jews

Khubaib
02-05-07, 03:49 PM
I'd simply like to point out that the OP has not brought any daleel. Not a single verse of Qurah nor any hadith.

:lailah:

RashidD
02-05-07, 04:00 PM
Same people that follow Ibn Baz fatwah on leaving Filisteen to the jews

When did he say that?

MXXXXM
03-05-07, 05:13 AM
Assalam Alicom


yes i was waiting for a foolish talafi response, you hear news from hear and there, bbc,cnn and you think you know everything happening on the ground there. people get killed in war, get that through your head

brother/sister.....

1- i never take from the channels you are takling about because english is not my mother tongue so i won't understand it all and i know that they tell lies.

2- i take from arabic and Islamic channels and websites.

3- i live in the middle east and i know what's happening around and i have relates who live in some of those areas.

4- the same arguement can be used against you by saying that, how do you know that we are not dying and that we are doing well, even though you live in the US or UK ?????


What a fool... spokeperson for the tawghoot regimes.

may Allah skip that for you Akhi/Ukhti and forgive you for the insult

as for the issue of rulers and goverments i have another thread which talks about it. and here is the link.
and i don't really know what's the link between Jihad and governers.

and here is a little gift for my brother/sister

the Prophet peace be upon Him
" whomever believes in the day of judgment, let Him say good or keep silent "



Innit?


This is a load of BS.

sister......
this is an Islamic forum and we all know what you meant by the two letters and i reported it to the mods and it's up to them to decide.

anyway......
if you really think so....
please qoute and response by evidence.

if not keep those words for yourself. i'm here to learn and teach if possible not to learn how to swear.

may Allah skip that for you and preserve your son Talha, if you have a one.


hahaha, glad im not the only one who feels this way, thanks people

Subhan Allah.....
so if the majority thinks something....
does that make it right ?????

Akhi here is a little gift for you.
didn't you read the Prophet peace be upon Him saying
" Islam started as a strange thing and will come back as a strange thing, so give glad tidings to the strangers "

Subhan Allah.....
today people take by majority and neglect the evidence



You should read Thawaabit Ala Darb Al Jihad by Sheikh Uyayri or listen to Imam Anwar Al Awlaki's talks on it or both InshaALLAH.

masha'Allah Akhi......
i really thank you for your politeness.
i wish the rest would learn from you Akhi.

i ask Allah to reward you for that.
as for the Shiekhs....
with all due respect
i only heard about Al Awlaki but never heard anything for him
because as i said earlier i prefer arabic over english because it's much easier
so if you have any arabic resources that would be great.

but anyway i'll try to listen to what you recommended.
may Allah cover my souls and yours with mercy.


Same people that follow Ibn Baz fatwah on leaving Filisteen to the jews


this is a lie which the Shia use against whom they call Wahhabi's

the Shiekh never issued such a Fatwa and i guess you know that there is a lot of lies going around.

but something similar was said by Him and Shiekh Al Albani....
and this is very well known in Islam which is.
if your enemy is occupying your land and prohibits you from performing your obligations like prayer and so......
then it becomes an obligation to migrate. and it's one of the greatest sins if you don't do so, and this is well proven in the Quran before Sunnah.


I'd simply like to point out that the OP has not brought any daleel. Not a single verse of Qurah nor any hadith.

first i don't know what you mean by OP and i hope it's a good thing
so can you please tell me or anyone else if possible

as for what you said about evidence. at the end you'll find a repeated post of the original with the evidence written in Red insha'Allah



When did he say that?

he never said that Akhi and i talked about it up there.

anyway......
Subhan Allah.
from all the response i didn't see a single academic response.
not even polite except for brother Rashid's may Allah reward Him

so please......
if you guys think that there is an error in the thread.
please qoute and response to it. if you keep going like that we'll keep going in circles and we'll learn nothing.

so i'll be waiting for your responses to the topic using the qoute function.

Assalam Alicom
MXXXXM

MXXXXM
03-05-07, 05:21 AM
Assalam Alicom

Misconception 1
They say
The Prophet peace be upon Him
"Jihad is going until the day of judgment"

And the response to that is.
Jihad is going as long as the conditions are met and we are able does it
Like praying, fasting and the rest of obligations
And we all know that we must do them
Until the Day of Judgment
As long as we are able to
And whenever we are not
They fall and we are not obligated to do them.
Example
You don't have to fast when you are traveling

So is it possible that all these obligations are restricted to the rule which says
Do it as long as you can

And some people come and say
Jihad is going and has no conditions and no restrictions
And going until the Day of Judgment whether we can do it or not????

And the evidence on all of that is

The Hadith which is mentioned in Sahih Muslim
Where the Prophet peace be upon Him tells us about 'Eisa
that He (Eisa) is about to fight some people
and Allah says to Him that He is unable to fight them
so take my slaves and don't fight.

Add to that evidence
One of the main evidences which is
We all know that the Prophet peace be upon Him
didn't fight the Mushrikeen in Mecca
and the first clash between Muslims and Mushrikeen
was more than 10 years after the beginning or Islam

and the list of evidences go on and on

so the question is
did the Prophets Muhammed and Eisa peace be upon both of them
leave Jihad when they were unable to do it
because they don't like it, believe in it or want to stop it????

We leave the reader to answer.

Misconception 2
They say that the Jihad which we are doing
Is defensive Jihad
(called in Shariah, Jihad Dafe' )
(refers to the Jihad when the enemy attacks the Muslims)
and this type of Jihad has no conditions whatsoever
and needs no ability

and the response to that is

this is just weak

we can just ask those people
is this Jihad recommended or obligatory ???

if the answer is recommended
we say you can't obligate people with what's recommended
and we all know that there is no sins or anything wrong
with leaving a recommended act whatsoever

if the answer is obligatory
we all know that all obligations in Islam
without any exception
fall and can be left and never done if we are unable to do them
and the biggest evidence on that is
the Hadith by the Prophet peace be upon Him which says
" whatever I command you to do, do what your able to do from it "

and also the verse
" fear Allah as much as you can "
and also

" On no soul doth Allah Place a burden greater than it can bear "

and again
the situation of Muslims in Mecca before migrating to Madenah

and the ability which we are talking about
is not the ability to carry a gun and stand in front of the enemy
nor the ability to use a gun and shoot few bullets on the enemy
nor the ability to hide in caves and between trees

the ability in defensive Jihad is
to be able to protect the Muslims
and stop the attack on the Muslims
and their lands
and more importantly
to be able to take the enemy out of the land of the Muslims

otherwise what's the point of hiding in caves and shooting at the enemy
if the enemy is killing our children in the cities
and shedding our blood and raping our women

and what kind of defense is that ?????

Misconception 3

they say that
we don't need a lot of ability to go for Jihad
and we don't need to have all the numbers and weapons
and the evidence on that is when the Prophet peace be upon Him
fought the Mushrikeen in many occasions
where the Muslims were much less in numbers than the non Muslims
and also the verse
" didn't you see how many times a small group won a big group "

and the response to that is

at those days
the wars were simple
and the weapons were simple

soldiers, swords, horse, camels, armors, arrows and so on
and all done by hand

and those weapons were in both sides
with the Muslims and the non Muslims
they both had the same type of weapons

while now

the weapons are much much advanced

where we have airplanes, rockets, machineguns
and weapons which we didn't even imagine that it's possible to manufacture

and not only that

those weapons are owned by the enemy and all that we have on us is
knives, hand guns, and small rockets
which don't even damage a small tank
which the enemy use as a toy

not only that
but also

the Muslims at that time even though they were less in numbers
their faith and religion
was correct and much higher than our situation today
where you see
the Sufi, the Shi'ee, the Khariji, the Ba'thi and much more.
And people even don't know how to pray properly
Nor how to fast

So how can you compare us today
With the companions at those times

And the biggest evidence on that is
In Uhud the Muslims lost the fight because few Sahabis
disobeyed the Prophet peace be upon Him
and went to get their share or money

and another example is
in Hunain
when the Muslims lost faith in Allah
because they thought their number will cause them to win the fight
and they almost lost the fight but Allah helped them

Misconception 4
they say
you guys have this big nightmare about non Muslims
and their ability
and the response to that is

in religion we have to separate our emotions
and look at the facts and the situation around us
and take logic and the circumstances around us into consideration


Misconception 5

they say
so what do you want us to do with the people of Palestine and Iraq and the rest
do we just sit down ????

and the response to that is

we have to go back to Quran and Sunnah and learn our religion
we have to forget about our emotions and focus on following the evidence
we have to increase our faith and go back to the path of Assalaf Assaleh

so what those people who claim to be on the path of Jihad nowadays
to stop the blood shed of Muslims
listen and obey to the rulers whom Allah chose for them
and stick to their Islamically lawful commands
follow what Olama' and scholars say and gather around them
stop spreading the Fitnah around the Muslims
And wake up from their dreams and illusions
And leave their emotions behind them
And more importantly to learn from the 50 years of bloodshed
In Palestine which brought nothing but destruction death to Muslims
And learn from what's happened in Lebanon few months ago
What happened and still happening in Iraq and Afghanistan

Do we need another 50 years in Iraq?
And another 50 in Afghanistan to wake up?????

May Allah preserve our blood and our lands?

Assalam Alicom
MXXXXM

tayfah-mansurah
03-05-07, 08:14 AM
theres an excellent lecture series by Anwar Awlaki called constants of Jihad, recommend it


You should read Thawaabit Ala Darb Al Jihad by Sheikh Uyayri or listen to Imam Anwar Al Awlaki's talks on it or both InshaALLAH.

tayfah-mansurah
03-05-07, 08:29 AM
and since when do muslims need tanks and aircraft to defeat kuffar lol, didn't Allah give victory to the mujahideen when they expelled the Russians from Afghanistan? did these mujahideen have tanks and aircraft? and if you look back on the islamic history, how often where the muslims outnumbered and outgunned by their enemy? many times, but Allah still gave them victory. A small company overpowered (defeated) a larger company by Allahs will.

And Muslim blood and property is precious, so how can you say lets not let our emotions get the best of us when blood is spilled. or lets go and study islam for 50 years while the ummah burns. this is cowardist defeatist talk. Prophet (peace be upon him) said this ummah is one body, if one part of the body suffers, rest of the body takes a fever and feels the pain.

the scholars have said even sinful muslims and a sinful ruler must go and help the muslims in time of need.

and do you think the prophet (peace be upon him) would have went to battle of Badr with 5 people on his side? ofcourse not, thats why there was preaching, bring people into islam, raise an army, to spread and defend the deen

Sheikh Ibn Tamiyah said: "The religion can only be established by a guiding book and a helping sword"

[QUOTE=MXXXXM;1839795][CENTER]Assalam Alicom

Misconception 1
They say
The Prophet peace be upon Him
"Jihad is going until the day of judgment"

MXXXXM
03-05-07, 09:00 AM
Al Hamdullilah

you see how it's much better to response based on evidence.

now......


didn't Allah give victory to the mujahideen when they expelled the Russians from Afghanistan? did these mujahideen have tanks and aircraft?

first i'd like to add that......
the previous Jihad in Chechnya, Bosnia and the one against Saddam.

in all of these cases.... the Mujahideen had all the power needed to defeat the enemy . yes they had aicrafts, tanks, cars and much more they had the full support of countries like Saudi Arabia may Allah preserve it and many other countries. and they even had the support and help of the CIA and the US army. and the Mujahideen had almost the same type of power as the Russians and that's why they won.

and this can be used as an evidence in the arguement to prove that we must have power to go for Jihad. which is that......
since they had the full support of goverments and Muslims around the world they won, even Olama' sent some of their students to fight since that type of Jihad was clear and no comment about it and one of those Shiekhs was Ibn Othaimeen may Allah preserve Him , while now, they have been fighting and nothing is happening and the biggest example is Chychniya which has been occupied since 99 now and still nothing has happened and also around 5 years in Afghanistan and 4 years in Iraq. what happened ??????
nothing but bloodshed against Muslims and turning Iraq into a Shia state.


and if you look back on the islamic history, how often where the muslims outnumbered and outgunned by their enemy? many times, but Allah still gave them victory. A small company overpowered (defeated) a larger company by Allahs will.

Akhi......
i talked about this part in a whole section.
please read Akhi .
and here it is



Misconception 3

they say that
we don't need a lot of ability to go for Jihad
and we don't need to have all the numbers and weapons
and the evidence on that is when the Prophet peace be upon Him
fought the Mushrikeen in many occasions
where the Muslims were much less in numbers than the non Muslims
and also the verse
" didn't you see how many times a small group won a big group "

and the response to that is

at those days
the wars were simple
and the weapons were simple

soldiers, swords, horse, camels, armors, arrows and so on
and all done by hand

and those weapons were in both sides
with the Muslims and the non Muslims
they both had the same type of weapons

while now

the weapons are much much advanced

where we have airplanes, rockets, machineguns
and weapons which we didn't even imagine that it's possible to manufacture

and not only that

those weapons are owned by the enemy and all that we have on us is
knives, hand guns, and small rockets
which don't even damage a small tank
which the enemy use as a toy

not only that
but also

the Muslims at that time even though they were less in numbers
their faith and religion
was correct and much higher than our situation today
where you see
the Sufi, the Shi'ee, the Khariji, the Ba'thi and much more.
And people even don't know how to pray properly
Nor how to fast

So how can you compare us today
With the companions at those times

And the biggest evidence on that is
In Uhud the Muslims lost the fight because few Sahabis
disobeyed the Prophet peace be upon Him
and went to get their share or money

and another example is
in Hunain
when the Muslims lost faith in Allah
because they thought their number will cause them to win the fight
and they almost lost the fight but Allah helped them


And Muslim blood and property is precious, so how can you say lets not let our emotions get the best of us when blood is spilled

Akhi you misunderstood my words totally.

when did i say that.

what i said was that going for Jihad needs power...
that means that we have to stop fighting the enemy and going with fights with it because the response can't be stopped.
it's like when you fight with someone who taller, bigger in build and much stronger than you.
you have two options.....

to stop teasing Him and try to have a peace agreement with Him.
or to run away.

and the situation here is the same.

if you can't make Jihad.

have a peace agreement
and this is proven by the treaty between the Prophet peace be upon Him and the Mushrikeen of Macca
or
migrate if the oppression continues
and this is proven by a verse in the Quran which is the verse 97 of Surat Al Nissa (chapter 4)


When angels take the souls of those who die in sin against their souls, they say: "In what (plight) Were ye?" They reply: "Weak and oppressed Were we in the earth." They say: "Was not the earth of Allah spacious enough for you to move yourselves away (From evil)?" Such men will find their abode in Hell,- What an evil refuge! -


and all of these are temporary sulotions
until you become able to go for Jihad.
and this is done to preserve the Muslim blood.

instead of going to Jihad outnumbered and ourpowered which means that all of your army would die and all of your youth and men would be killed and this would result in occupying the country.

bottom line is......
we never cancel the Jihad but we delay it until we are able to do it.
and all of that is to preserve the Muslim blood.

i hoped that cleared everything up.

can one last thing........
can you please respond to this.



The conditions of Jihad in Iraq/Afghanistan/Palestine etc today is fard ayn,
and one last thing......
if you really think that it's an individual obligation.....
why are you sitting behind your computer disscussing the topic with me. why don't you go for it. also remember that leaving Jihad when it's an obligation is a very great sin.

so are you a great sinner???????

and don't be from this group Akhi.....
may allah preserve us and you from it.


Do ye enjoin right conduct on the people, and forget (To practise it) yourselves, and yet ye study the Scripture? Will ye not understand?

Al Baqarah chapter 2 verse 44

Assalam Alicom
MXXXXM

tayfah-mansurah
03-05-07, 09:39 AM
Ah more disgraceful and defeatist talk:


"while now, they have been fighting and nothing is happening and the biggest example is Chychniya which has been occupied since 99 now and still nothing has happened and also around 5 years in Afghanistan and 4 years in Iraq. what happened ??????
nothing but bloodshed against Muslims and turning Iraq into a Shia state."


"instead of going to Jihad outnumbered and ourpowered which means that all of your army would die and all of your youth and men would be killed and this would result in occupying the country."


Allah decided outcomes of battles, and mujahideen do not rely on their numbers or their guns, they rely on their piety, taqwa, emaan, tawhid and complete trust and reliance on Allah. Mujahideen seek either of 2 things: Victory or Martyrdom, Paradise. Jihad goes on till the day of judgement and they dont fear the blame of blamers, just like the crusades went on for atleast 150 years till jerusalem was liberated, same will happen in Iraq/Afghanistan until Victory belongs to the muslims, Inshallah.

4-5 Years in Afghanistan is nothing, just look back at the crusades and see how long that lasted. you should be making dua to Allah to bring victory to the mujahideen struggling in all the places, its the least you can do, instead of criticizing and playing armchair general

Le Croyant
03-05-07, 02:03 PM
so bro/sis MXXXXM,

so since u say that we should sit with our hands tied behinds our backs in Iraq, Afghanistan, Palestine, Chechnya, Kashmir, etc...

So what solution do u have, do we just switch on our tv & watch the news abt muslims being killed everyday, muslims lands being occupied by the kuffar.

Btw do u support the American invasion of Iraq?

Barracuda
03-05-07, 02:25 PM
UPS

Can you please post the Fatwa by Shaikh Bin Baz (RA) about leaving the Palestine?

tayfah-mansurah
03-05-07, 02:30 PM
i wont brother reply to any comments from that mxxx guy, hate people that put doubts into peoples hearts, anyone remember the hipocrites led by Abdullah bin Ubai during prophet (peace be upon him) times?



so bro/sis MXXXXM,

so since u say that we should sit with our hands tied behinds our backs in Iraq, Afghanistan, Palestine, Chechnya, Kashmir, etc...

So what solution do u have, do we just switch on our tv & watch the news abt muslims being killed everyday, muslims lands being occupied by the kuffar.

Btw do u support the American invasion of Iraq?

UPS
03-05-07, 02:36 PM
Ibn Baaz between reality and illusion
By Sheikh Ayman az-Zawaahiri (HA)

I listened to the fataawaa of Ibn Baaz, like many other millions of Muslims, which was broadcasted all over (the world). He was calling the Muslims to pray in Masjid al-Aqsaa and permitted trade with Israel.

Then I heard the response of the prime minister of Israel, Is'haaq Raabeen, saluting and welcoming the "honourable" mufti. [1]

Unlike many people, I wasn’t very surprised from what that man (Ibn Baaz) said, because I have a very firm opinion about him, despite the great elevation that many people have given him. In my simple understanding, it is impossible for a man to be an imaam, mufti, person of fatwaa, example of education, and simultaneously have one of the highest religious positions in the regime of Aal-Sa'oud (the Saudi government) – America's greatest agent.

So how does Aal-Sa'oud pay that man (Ibn Baaz) all these salaries, and give him all these positions whilst they are the strongest followers (allies) of America, except if the presence of that man in those positions was a major benefit for Aal-Sa'oud. Aal-Sa'oud are the ones who are ruling the Muslims by the edge of the sword (by dictatorship), without any mercy or compromise.

And if it occurred to them (the Saudi regime) once, that this sheikh will ever oppose them, or be of any kind of threat to their authority, they would have taken so many measures to silence him through isolation or even by killing him. And the history of Aal-Sa'oud of killing their oppositions goes without say.

All of the above is not the main purpose of this speech (article), but the purpose is as follows…

Verily many people have taken Ibn Baaz and those with him as an example in the Deen and as a reference for their fataawaa. They refer to their (Ibn Baaz and his followers) fataawaa and publications in the vital issues of the Deen, i.e. in 'aqeedah and tawheed, and in the most dangerous issues related to the Muslims - being the apostate rulers who are ruling the Muslim lands.

And those followers, despite all what they choke about in regards to their independence (disassociation) from taqleed (blind following) and madhaahib (schools of thought), they are the biggest people of taqleed towards him (Ibn Baaz) and his people. And this da'wah has spread amongst thousands of Muslim youth until it has become the normality.

Until we saw someone like Safar al-Hawaali coming out with the idea that democracy might be a necessity to rescue the country from chaos, referring to Algeria as an example, he is referring all of this (i.e. the idea of democracy) to Bin Baaz, in his tape no.4661 Tasjeelaat al-Hidaayah al-Islaamiyyah in Dammaam, lecture dated 23/06/1412. All of this is despite al-Hawaali's knowledge in 'Ilm ut-Tawheed and despite all his books about secularism. If this was the case with Safar al-Hawaali, so what about anybody else? (In other words, if someone "knowledgeable" as Sheikh Safar al-Hawaali could be misguided by Ibn Baaz, what about those who are less knowledgeable)?

Thousands of youth have been living as prisoners to these dazzling names, Bin Baaz, 'Uthaymeen and Abee Bakr al-Jazaa'iri, who they follow and will not even dare to oppose, even though their mistakes are so great, and their deviation is so outrageous.

And I used to wonder how do those people imitate in their Deen a man (Ibn Baaz) who never sacrificed anything for the sake of Allah and was never tested? On the contrary, he doesn’t get his salary except by defending the interests of the tawaagheet (false gods or those who do not rule by Islam). So how do these people ask him about the solution for the tawaagheet and about the sanctity of their blood and to wipe out their authority? (In other words, how can people ask him how they should deal with the tawaagheet when he himself was a defender of taaghout)?

It is about time for the Muslim youth to free themselves from these empty ringing names who have exaggerated their nifaaq (hypocrisy) with the tawaagheet until they have become a laughing-stock in front of friends and enemies. [2]

And it is about time for these youth to gather around the 'ulamaa al-'aamileen (sincere active scholars) who are suffering and being tested for the sake of their Deen, the ones who Allah (SWT) has described them as, "And we made from among them [Children of Israel], leaders, giving guidance under Our Command, when they were patient and used to believe with certainty in Our Aayaat [proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, divine rules etc.]." (EMQ as-Sajdah, 32:24)

It is also about time for these youth to wake up from their unconsciousness which they are living in, and understand that the battle of Islam and kufr, haq and baatil, is a crucial battle and there is no escaping it. And whoever is not going to prepare himself for it and get ready, he is going to be the first victim of it.

It would have been possible for us to stay silent about those people (Ibn Baaz and his cronies), if only they themselves accepted to keep their mouths shut, and just speak about what is not going to make the rulers angry - the personal ritual affairs of the Deen, even though that would have been impossible since all these tawaagheet are so evil and corrupted. But those 'ulamaa have turned into the destroyers and demolishers of the 'aqeedah for the youth, making excuses for the kufr (apostasy) of the taaghout, go against commanding good and forbidding evil, permit the settlement of the invading forces of the American crusaders in the Arabian peninsula, and bless the policies of normalising relationship with Israel and the Jewish upper hand on the Muslim land.

Now this is what nobody with one atom's weight of shame in his heart can accept, let alone to have one atom of imaan in his heart (in other words, if a person has an atom's weight of shame in his heart he will never accept this, let alone to have an atom's weight of imaan).

And I know my words are going to be too much for many of the good people who are still living in the illusion, or for the people who agree with me but have no bravery or courage to come out with it, fearing that others might start accusing them of belittling the 'ulamaa, or because they cannot go against what they have been repeating (regurgitating) for many years.

However, the haq is ablaj (clear), and the baatil is shaken; indeed Ibn Baaz and his taa'ifah (entity, group, followers etc.) are the government scholars who are selling us (the believers) to our enemies in return for some salary and some position. Let whoever wants to be angry be angry, and whoever wants to be pleased, let them be pleased (with what I am saying).

Indeed the camp of imaan can confront the camp of kufr; we have to get rid of the munaafiqeen and the fraudsters,

"And thus do we explain the Aayaat [proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.] in detail, that the way of the mujrimoon [criminals, polytheists, sinners], may become manifest." (EMQ al-An'aam, 6:55)

The Magazine of the Mujaahidoon, 11th edition, first year, Wednesday the 3rd of Sha'baan 1415


Footnotes

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 Allah (SWT) says in the Qur'aan: "And never will the Jews and Christians be pleased with you until you follow their millah ([eligion, way of life etc.]" (EMQ al-Baqarah, 2:120)
2 On one hand these people condemn those who do not rule by what Allah has revealed, yet they defend the apostate rulers and heretically justify all their crimes.

tayfah-mansurah
03-05-07, 02:47 PM
beautiful, jazakallah Khair
[QUOTE=UPS;1840506]Ibn Baaz between reality and illusion
By Sheikh Ayman az-Zawaahiri (HA)

I listened to the fataawaa of Ibn Baaz, like many other millions of Muslims, which was broadcasted all over (the world). He was calling the Muslims to pray in Masjid al-Aqsaa and permitted trade with Israel.

Le Croyant
03-05-07, 02:58 PM
i do why muslims would b against trading with Israel but what does prayin masjid al-aqsa have to do with anything? Why can't we pray there?

Barracuda
03-05-07, 03:17 PM
Ibn Baaz between reality and illusion
By Sheikh Ayman az-Zawaahiri (HA)

I listened to the fataawaa of Ibn Baaz, like many other millions of Muslims, which was broadcasted all over (the world). He was calling the Muslims to pray in Masjid al-Aqsaa and permitted trade with Israel.

Then I heard the response of the prime minister of Israel, Is'haaq Raabeen, saluting and welcoming the "honourable" mufti. [1]

Unlike many people, I wasn’t very surprised from what that man (Ibn Baaz) said, because I have a very firm opinion about him, despite the great elevation that many people have given him. In my simple understanding, it is impossible for a man to be an imaam, mufti, person of fatwaa, example of education, and simultaneously have one of the highest religious positions in the regime of Aal-Sa'oud (the Saudi government) – America's greatest agent.

So how does Aal-Sa'oud pay that man (Ibn Baaz) all these salaries, and give him all these positions whilst they are the strongest followers (allies) of America, except if the presence of that man in those positions was a major benefit for Aal-Sa'oud. Aal-Sa'oud are the ones who are ruling the Muslims by the edge of the sword (by dictatorship), without any mercy or compromise.

And if it occurred to them (the Saudi regime) once, that this sheikh will ever oppose them, or be of any kind of threat to their authority, they would have taken so many measures to silence him through isolation or even by killing him. And the history of Aal-Sa'oud of killing their oppositions goes without say.

All of the above is not the main purpose of this speech (article), but the purpose is as follows…

Verily many people have taken Ibn Baaz and those with him as an example in the Deen and as a reference for their fataawaa. They refer to their (Ibn Baaz and his followers) fataawaa and publications in the vital issues of the Deen, i.e. in 'aqeedah and tawheed, and in the most dangerous issues related to the Muslims - being the apostate rulers who are ruling the Muslim lands.

And those followers, despite all what they choke about in regards to their independence (disassociation) from taqleed (blind following) and madhaahib (schools of thought), they are the biggest people of taqleed towards him (Ibn Baaz) and his people. And this da'wah has spread amongst thousands of Muslim youth until it has become the normality.

Until we saw someone like Safar al-Hawaali coming out with the idea that democracy might be a necessity to rescue the country from chaos, referring to Algeria as an example, he is referring all of this (i.e. the idea of democracy) to Bin Baaz, in his tape no.4661 Tasjeelaat al-Hidaayah al-Islaamiyyah in Dammaam, lecture dated 23/06/1412. All of this is despite al-Hawaali's knowledge in 'Ilm ut-Tawheed and despite all his books about secularism. If this was the case with Safar al-Hawaali, so what about anybody else? (In other words, if someone "knowledgeable" as Sheikh Safar al-Hawaali could be misguided by Ibn Baaz, what about those who are less knowledgeable)?

Thousands of youth have been living as prisoners to these dazzling names, Bin Baaz, 'Uthaymeen and Abee Bakr al-Jazaa'iri, who they follow and will not even dare to oppose, even though their mistakes are so great, and their deviation is so outrageous.

And I used to wonder how do those people imitate in their Deen a man (Ibn Baaz) who never sacrificed anything for the sake of Allah and was never tested? On the contrary, he doesn’t get his salary except by defending the interests of the tawaagheet (false gods or those who do not rule by Islam). So how do these people ask him about the solution for the tawaagheet and about the sanctity of their blood and to wipe out their authority? (In other words, how can people ask him how they should deal with the tawaagheet when he himself was a defender of taaghout)?

It is about time for the Muslim youth to free themselves from these empty ringing names who have exaggerated their nifaaq (hypocrisy) with the tawaagheet until they have become a laughing-stock in front of friends and enemies. [2]

And it is about time for these youth to gather around the 'ulamaa al-'aamileen (sincere active scholars) who are suffering and being tested for the sake of their Deen, the ones who Allah (SWT) has described them as, "And we made from among them [Children of Israel], leaders, giving guidance under Our Command, when they were patient and used to believe with certainty in Our Aayaat [proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, divine rules etc.]." (EMQ as-Sajdah, 32:24)

It is also about time for these youth to wake up from their unconsciousness which they are living in, and understand that the battle of Islam and kufr, haq and baatil, is a crucial battle and there is no escaping it. And whoever is not going to prepare himself for it and get ready, he is going to be the first victim of it.

It would have been possible for us to stay silent about those people (Ibn Baaz and his cronies), if only they themselves accepted to keep their mouths shut, and just speak about what is not going to make the rulers angry - the personal ritual affairs of the Deen, even though that would have been impossible since all these tawaagheet are so evil and corrupted. But those 'ulamaa have turned into the destroyers and demolishers of the 'aqeedah for the youth, making excuses for the kufr (apostasy) of the taaghout, go against commanding good and forbidding evil, permit the settlement of the invading forces of the American crusaders in the Arabian peninsula, and bless the policies of normalising relationship with Israel and the Jewish upper hand on the Muslim land.

Now this is what nobody with one atom's weight of shame in his heart can accept, let alone to have one atom of imaan in his heart (in other words, if a person has an atom's weight of shame in his heart he will never accept this, let alone to have an atom's weight of imaan).

And I know my words are going to be too much for many of the good people who are still living in the illusion, or for the people who agree with me but have no bravery or courage to come out with it, fearing that others might start accusing them of belittling the 'ulamaa, or because they cannot go against what they have been repeating (regurgitating) for many years.

However, the haq is ablaj (clear), and the baatil is shaken; indeed Ibn Baaz and his taa'ifah (entity, group, followers etc.) are the government scholars who are selling us (the believers) to our enemies in return for some salary and some position. Let whoever wants to be angry be angry, and whoever wants to be pleased, let them be pleased (with what I am saying).

Indeed the camp of imaan can confront the camp of kufr; we have to get rid of the munaafiqeen and the fraudsters,

"And thus do we explain the Aayaat [proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.] in detail, that the way of the mujrimoon [criminals, polytheists, sinners], may become manifest." (EMQ al-An'aam, 6:55)

The Magazine of the Mujaahidoon, 11th edition, first year, Wednesday the 3rd of Sha'baan 1415


Footnotes

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 Allah (SWT) says in the Qur'aan: "And never will the Jews and Christians be pleased with you until you follow their millah ([eligion, way of life etc.]" (EMQ al-Baqarah, 2:120)
2 On one hand these people condemn those who do not rule by what Allah has revealed, yet they defend the apostate rulers and heretically justify all their crimes.
Thanks but no thanks!

I can't accept this gobblydygook as credible at all. I just finished my research and so far has been unable to find a Fatwa by Shaikh Ibn Baz asking to leave Palestine as you have maliciously claimed without supporting evidence. But I will insha Allah continue my search.

You must be carefuly and must not slander the Ullema and/or Scholars of Islam as they are the heirs of the Prophet Muhammad (SAW).

MXXXXM
05-05-07, 09:12 AM
Allah decided outcomes of battles, and mujahideen do not rely on their numbers or their guns, they rely on their piety, taqwa, emaan, tawhid and complete trust and reliance on Allah. Mujahideen seek either of 2 things: Victory or Martyrdom, Paradise. Jihad goes on till the day of judgement and they dont fear the blame of blamers, just like the crusades went on for atleast 150 years till jerusalem was liberated, same will happen in Iraq/Afghanistan until Victory belongs to the muslims, Inshallah.

brother/sister Tayfah......

if you have a sickness in your body......
wouldn't you treat it and seek medication ?????

the answer is yes.
can someone come and say this would go against the will of Allah????
since Allah sent the sickness to you so how can you reject that and seek medication ?????
of course no one can say so....
because Allah commanded us to take by reasons as well.

which means......

even though we believe that Allah's will is above everything, this doesn't mean that we go and hold a gun in our mouths and say that if Allah wants us to die we will, and if we don't, we won't and so go and shoot.....
this is called insanity.....
we have to balance between our belief in the will of Allah and the facts around us and the reasons for vitory.

do the reasons of vitory exist ??????

no......

of course Allah's will is there, but still we have to balance between the two. and this is well known in Islam.
between the will of Allah, and the reasons of victory.
example.....

you can't go and hold a kitchen knife and fight someone who has got a sniper gun, where he can shoot you from a kilometer. this happens in films only not in reality.

so what you said is true and there is nothing about it....
but all the examples which you gave had the reasons of vitory available.

faith..... and ....... power.


just like the crusades went on for atleast 150 years till jerusalem was liberated

true....
but.....

how lond did it take to prepare the Muslims for it ?????

didn't you read about the biography of Salahudeen and how since he was a kid he got trained on fighting and prepared for it ??????

so it took years and years......

otherwise why didn't Salahudeen laberate Jerusalim since he was 10 ????


4-5 Years in Afghanistan is nothing, just look back at the crusades and see how long that lasted. you should be making dua to Allah to bring victory to the mujahideen struggling in all the places, its the least you can do, instead of criticizing and playing armchair general


5-4 years is nothing ???????

Subhan Allah.....
the Prophet peace be upon Him tells you
" the killing of a Muslim is worse to Allah than the eleminating the whole earth and what's on it "
and you come and say.....

4-5 years of death and killings......
and the people whom you call Mujahideen, are in their safe caves issueing tape after tape warning and threatening and at the end they go and blow up between civilians and Muslims around the world and even in Muslim lands ????
leaving the army which they have next to their caves......
and tell me please.....

since when did the Prohet peace be upon Him or any of His companions leave the villages and the cities of their women and children to be killed and raped and go to caves.
didn't they always secure their cities and houses and the safety of their women and children and then went to fight, and when they couldn't they stayed with them like in Al Ahazab.

Allahu Al Musta'aan

is the Muslim blood that cheap for you Akhi.......

anyway.....
i'm asking you for the third time....
since you think this so called Jihad is Fard 'Ain on every Muslim until the day of judgment and the so called jihad these days is really Jihad , why are you still behind your keyboard ??????

may Allah guide you Akhi.....


So what solution do u have, do we just switch on our tv & watch the news abt muslims being killed everyday, muslims lands being occupied by the kuffar.


the answer was given in the first post.....


so what those people who claim to be on the path of Jihad nowadays
to stop the blood shed of Muslims
listen and obey to the rulers whom Allah chose for them
and stick to their Islamically lawful commands
follow what Olama' and scholars say and gather around them
stop spreading the Fitnah around the Muslims
And wake up from their dreams and illusions
And leave their emotions behind them

don't come after more than 100 years of innovations, Shirk, distance from religion and corruption and expect to fix all of our problems up in a couple of years.
Allah's would've put us in this situation if we weren't far from our religion in the first place.

don't blame religion, but blame yoursleves.


Btw do u support the American invasion of Iraq?

i and no Muslim can support the invasion of any Muslim country on the face of eath whatsoever.


i wont brother reply to any comments from that mxxx guy, hate people that put doubts into peoples hearts, anyone remember the hipocrites led by Abdullah bin Ubai during prophet (peace be upon him) times?


Akhi don't bother to reply to me....
but reply to the evidence.

leave your emotions behind you.
defiest talk or not..... it doesn't change the facts and the evidence.

the evidence applies to the situation and not the situation which applies to the evidence.

brother/sister UPS

the brother/sister asked you for the Fatwa by Shiekh Bin baz which was given by Him, not Al Zawahiri's opinion about Shiekh Bin Baz which is full of lies and occusation.

and i'm also also waiting for that Fatwa.


i do why muslims would b against trading with Israel but what does prayin masjid al-aqsa have to do with anything? Why can't we pray there?

this is a complete lie against Shiekh Bin Baz Wallahu A'alam.

i never heard of the trading with Israel Fatwa.


Thanks but no thanks!

I can't accept this gobblydygook as credible at all. I just finished my research and so far has been unable to find a Fatwa by Shaikh Ibn Baz asking to leave Palestine as you have maliciously claimed without supporting evidence. But I will insha Allah continue my search.

You must be carefuly and must not slander the Ullema and/or Scholars of Islam as they are the heirs of the Prophet Muhammad (SAW).


Akhi/Ukhti.....

to some people the words of Zawahiri and Bin Laden are like Quran and Hadith , an evidence which can be used to prove anything.

Hassan Basri
05-05-07, 11:37 AM
Here is a detailed Academic Study on the Fiqh of Jihad by Imam Anwar Al-Awlaki:

http://www.salaattime.com/anwar.html

MXXXXM
05-05-07, 12:20 PM
Akhi....
with all the respect to the brother....
but i don't see what his Islamic Education is and i don't see that he did any Islamic studies.

the words which i wrote are gathered from sayings of the biggest Olama' in the Salafi Da'wah Akhi.

Hassan Basri
05-05-07, 01:28 PM
Akhi....
with all the respect to the brother....
but i don't see what his Islamic Education is and i don't see that he did any Islamic studies.

the words which i wrote are gathered from sayings of the biggest Olama' in the Salafi Da'wah Akhi.

Salam Aleikum, did you actually listen to the series? Imam Anwar Al-Awlaki is well respected for his dawah in Islam. Listen to the detailed Academic Study on the Fiqh of Jihad which he references the Quran, and the Sunnah as well as the actions of the Companions. You will learn a lot if this subject interests you.

http://www.salaattime.com/anwar.html

Fudhayl
05-05-07, 05:06 PM
Same people that follow Ibn Baz fatwah on leaving Filisteen to the jews
Actually from the little I know- Shaykh Bin Baz (rahimullah) never wrote any fatawah asking our brethren in occupied Philistine to leave their land.

As for the differences between our respective scholars and leaders i.e the Mujahid Shaykh Dr. Ayman (Hafidh'Allah) and his critique of Shaykh Bin Baz (rahimullah) than this is something for our 'Ullema to discuss on their platform, not us laymen.

Abu Mus'ab
05-05-07, 05:35 PM
Akhi....
with all the respect to the brother....
but i don't see what his Islamic Education is and i don't see that he did any Islamic studies.

the words which i wrote are gathered from sayings of the biggest Olama' in the Salafi Da'wah Akhi.
And what is YOUR Islamic education?

alld
05-05-07, 05:44 PM
Actually from the little I know- Shaykh Bin Baz (rahimullah) never wrote any fatawah asking our brethren in occupied Philistine to leave their land.

As for the differences between our respective scholars and leaders i.e the Mujahid Shaykh Dr. Ayman (Hafidh'Allah) and his critique of Shaykh Bin Baz (rahimullah) than this is something for our 'Ullema to discuss on their platform, not us laymen.

Jazakallah khayr akhi . that's most proper .

tayfah-mansurah
06-05-07, 12:59 AM
which talafi cult brainwashed you akhi?





[QUOTE=MXXXXM;1844049]do the reasons of vitory exist ??????

no......

MXXXXM
06-05-07, 09:38 AM
Salam Aleikum, did you actually listen to the series? Imam Anwar Al-Awlaki is well respected for his dawah in Islam. Listen to the detailed Academic Study on the Fiqh of Jihad which he references the Quran, and the Sunnah as well as the actions of the Companions. You will learn a lot if this subject interests you.

Akhi.....
i know that the brother is a well known Da'iyah. but those issues are so sensitive and only big scholars talk about them and go into their details.
because th scholars must know of all of the evidences and the Fiqh related to the issue. i'll try to have a look at the series but i'd be thank full if you extract the evidence and what the brother says which refutes what i said up there.


As for the differences between our respective scholars and leaders i.e the Mujahid Shaykh Dr. Ayman (Hafidh'Allah) and his critique of Shaykh Bin Baz (rahimullah) than this is something for our 'Ullema to discuss on their platform, not us laymen.

you bring Al Zawahiri to the status of Imam Allama Bin Baz.....
Subhan Allah.....

your Shiekh Mujahid supports blowing up in the Muslim lands and on the top of them Saudi Arabia.....
Subhan Allah....
it wonders me what kind of Shiekhs that supports the shedding of Muuslim blood.
which is one of the greatest sins in Islam.


And what is YOUR Islamic education?

the words are mine...but the rules arn't.
these rules are one of the cores in the ideology Ahlul Sunnah Wal Jama'aa
these are the rules set by the Salafi Shiekhs over the history.

all that i've done is to collect them and word them properly so people would understand them.


which talafi cult brainwashed you akhi?

the Quran and Sunnah brainwashed my brain Akhi.... and what an honor is that.


[quote=MXXXXM;1844049]do the reasons of vitory exist ??????

no......

so how would you go and fight ?????????
and why would go for this so called Jihad?????
woudln't this be throwing your soul to death?????

JiHaDiYa
06-05-07, 11:03 AM
Some people may ask, can we fight jihad even if we dont have an Amir?

Yes, we fight even if we do not have an amir. No-one has said that the absence of a community of Muslims under an Amir cancels the Fard of Jihad. We have seen muslims in emergency situations, at the time of the Crusades and during the Tatar invations, fighting with different Amir's, and also brothers and sisters in Egypt there was more than one Amir.

Some of these even asked help from the Christians against their brother Amir, as what happened when Shawar asked help from the Christians against another Amir, Dar Gham, in Egypt.

Name me one scholar that has said that such a situation and such corruption cancels the obligation of Jihad for the defence of the muslim lands? huh :rolleyes:

Anyway on the contrary it multiplies the obligation!
Not one scholar of Ahul Sunnah Wal Jammah have said that there is no Jihad under these conditions, in fact, the scholars of Ahul Sunnah Wal Jammah were themselves in the front lines of Andalusia.

If maybe the Imam or the Amir-ul-mumineen is not present, this does not annul the obligation of fighting and defence of the muslim lands.

The mujahideen choose their Amir for jihad from amongst themselves. He organises them, unifies their efforts and make the strong support the weak. Its reported in an authentic Ahadith from Uqbah bin Ammar, who was among the to-be-mentioned party, he said: The prophet (saw) sent us out in a party and he chose from amongst us a swordsman (leader). When we returned, i have not seen the like of when the prophet (saw) blamed us. He said, 'Are you unable, that if i send a man and he fails to apply my order, to replace him with one who applies my order?'(Abu Dawud)

In a Ahadith by the nabi (saw) he states: "Surley there will be predicaments and predicaments so whoever wants to disrupt and divide the order of this ummah after they have been united, kill him, whoever he is." ( This was reported by muslim, which is the 3rd most authentic book after the Quran)

Whoever comes to you while you are united under one man, and wants to disrupt your unity, kill him...(Muslim)

Allahualim :rolleyes:

JiHaDiYa
06-05-07, 11:17 AM
so how would you go and fight ?????????
and why would go for this so called Jihad?????
woudln't this be throwing your soul to death?????

Akhi just to touch up on something, the best of jihad fisibili'Allah is when someone runs into the battle field with no weapons, but the only thing he has is Tawakal (relience) in Allah azawalgal.....Subhana'Allah the muslims that are fighting may be a few in number, but do you ever question why sometimes we are winning the battle? :rolleyes:

A man whose face was covered with an iron mask came to the nabi (saw) and said "O Allah's apostle! Shall i fight or embrace islam first?" Our beloved nabi (saw) said: "Embrace islam first and then go and fight". So he embraced islam, and was martyred. The nabi (saw) said:" A little work, but a great reward." (He did very little after embracing islam, but he will be rewarded
in abundance).

And this is reported in Bukhari, as we all no that this is the 2nd most authentic book after the Qur'an

RashidD
06-05-07, 12:59 PM
Akhi....
with all the respect to the brother....
but i don't see what his Islamic Education is and i don't see that he did any Islamic studies.

the words which i wrote are gathered from sayings of the biggest Olama' in the Salafi Da'wah Akhi.

He studied in Yemen in the younger ages of his life as far as i know and his talk is based on the book Mashari Al Ashwaaq Ila Masari Ala Ushaaq (i think that's how it's spelt) by Imam Ibn Nuhaas (which is acclaimed by many as being one of the best books on Jihad)

Abu Mus'ab
06-05-07, 04:35 PM
the words are mine...but the rules arn't.
these rules are one of the cores in the ideology Ahlul Sunnah Wal Jama'aa
these are the rules set by the Salafi Shiekhs over the history.

all that i've done is to collect them and word them properly so people would understand them.

Don't give me that baloney, i asked you what's YOUR Islamic education? nothing else

MXXXXM
06-05-07, 06:59 PM
Assalam Alicom

sister JiHaDiYa your post shows that you know what are you talking about and willing to disscuss the evidence as a student of knowledge......
so may Allah guide both of us to the truth...

you said.....


Some people may ask, can we fight jihad even if we dont have an Amir?

Yes, we fight even if we do not have an amir. No-one has said that the absence of a community of Muslims under an Amir cancels the Fard of Jihad. We have seen muslims in emergency situations, at the time of the Crusades and during the Tatar invations, fighting with different Amir's, and also brothers and sisters in Egypt there was more than one Amir.

Some of these even asked help from the Christians against their brother Amir, as what happened when Shawar asked help from the Christians against another Amir, Dar Gham, in Egypt.

the issue of an Amir for Jihad does exist......
in attacking Jihad we must have an Amir and that's agreed on by Ahlul Sunnah Wal Jama'aa....
in defensive Jihad, that's a complicated issue and a seperate topic.

anyway.....
the whole topic wesn't talked about in my original thread. it's a different topic and i'm not willing to talk about it now sister....

you said as well......


Name me one scholar that has said that such a situation and such corruption cancels the obligation of Jihad for the defence of the muslim lands?

again from the irginal post which i hope you read.

Allah said in Quran....

" fear Allah as much as you can "

" On no soul doth Allah Place a burden greater than it can bear "

and from the Sunnah.....

The Hadith which is mentioned in Sahih Muslim
Where the Prophet peace be upon Him tells us about 'Eisa
that He (Eisa) is about to fight some people
and Allah says to Him that He is unable to fight them
so take my slaves and don't fight.


We all know that the Prophet peace be upon Him
didn't fight the Mushrikeen in Mecca
and the first clash between Muslims and Mushrikeen
was more than 10 years after the beginning or Islam
also what Khalid Bin al Waleed in Mu'tah when he withdrew
since the Muslims couldn't cope with 200 000 roman fighters

and much more but that's enough.

all of the above are talking about ability to do any kind of act in religion.
what wonders me is how some people don't include Jihad under that.
so if people want to do that.... must bring an evidence.

as for the sayings of Olama'

i have sayings from many of them.....
and here is a one by Shiekh Ibn Othaimeen may Allah shower His soul with mercy. and i hope that Shiekh Ibn Othaimeen is not out of Ahlul Sunnah Wal Jama'aa to you.

He said about Jihad

" if it was Fardh A'ain or Fardh Kifaya, it must have conditions and the most important of it is Ability, and if the person doesn't have the ability, then he shouldn't throw himself to death "
Al Bab Al Maftooh meeting number 42 question 1095

but please if you are going to insult the Shiekh.... don't do it, and just choose another Shiekh and i'll bring you another saying. because today, to most people who claim to be Mujahideen, most of our Olama' are agents and scholars for dollars. so please choose your Shiekh.


The mujahideen choose their Amir for jihad from amongst themselves. He organises them, unifies their efforts and make the strong support the weak. Its reported in an authentic Ahadith from Uqbah bin Ammar, who was among the to-be-mentioned party, he said: The prophet (saw) sent us out in a party and he chose from amongst us a swordsman (leader). When we returned, i have not seen the like of when the prophet (saw) blamed us. He said, 'Are you unable, that if i send a man and he fails to apply my order, to replace him with one who applies my order?'(Abu Dawud)

off topic....



In a Ahadith by the nabi (saw) he states: "Surley there will be predicaments and predicaments so whoever wants to disrupt and divide the order of this ummah after they have been united, kill him, whoever he is." ( This was reported by muslim, which is the 3rd most authentic book after the Quran)

Whoever comes to you while you are united under one man, and wants to disrupt your unity, kill him...(Muslim)

with all the respect to my sister.......
you totally misunderstood the evidence.

and so......
here is a little gift for my sister.

the two Hadiths above are talking about sticking to the rule of a ruler that was choosen by the Ummah. obedience of the ruler.
and it's used against the Khawarij and all the groups that allow overthrowing the rulers and want to fight them and spread insecurity between the Ummah.

so the evidence is against the people who want to overthrow our rulers today.

and i'm not one of those people.

and you can refer to any Shiekh for the explaination of the Hadiths. even the extreme Shiekhs of Khawarij know that this is the meaning of the Hadith.

may Allah guide me and you.....
hope you benefit from the gift. :)

my brother Rashid said.....


Akhi just to touch up on something, the best of jihad fisibili'Allah is when someone runs into the battle field with no weapons, but the only thing he has is Tawakal (relience) in Allah azawalgal.

no weapons......

Akhi a simple question......
why do you go to work even though you believe and i believe that you won't die before getting every single cent Allah wrote for you......
there is Tawakul.... and there is Tawakkul....
and they are different.
the first, is like someone who doesn't work and says i'm waiting for my Rizq from Allah.
the second is like someone who works and does his best to gain his money but at the same time knows that at the end of the day, he will get what's written for him.

so again.....
why would you go to work ?????
because you have to take by the reasons of getting money, so don't expect to get paid while you are setting at home.

and the same applies to Jihad.

don't expect to win if you don't work for it, proper Faith in Allah and power. and the first is more important.



Subhana'Allah the muslims that are fighting may be a few in number, but do you ever question why sometimes we are winning the battle?

the difference in numbers was explained in the original post.
please refer to it.


A man whose face was covered with an iron mask came to the nabi (saw) and said "O Allah's apostle! Shall i fight or embrace islam first?" Our beloved nabi (saw) said: "Embrace islam first and then go and fight". So he embraced islam, and was martyred. The nabi (saw) said:" A little work, but a great reward." (He did very little after embracing islam, but he will be rewarded
in abundance).

can you please tell me what's the point you want to prove ?????
and can you please give me the Hadith number so i can have a look at it.


He studied in Yemen in the younger ages of his life as far as i know and his talk is based on the book Mashari Al Ashwaaq Ila Masari Ala Ushaaq (i think that's how it's spelt) by Imam Ibn Nuhaas (which is acclaimed by many as being one of the best books on Jihad

ok Akhi.....
can you please extract from his sayings what's contradictive to what's said up there and the evidence behind it?????

i would've done so, but i don't have time Wallahi......


Don't give me that baloney, i asked you what's YOUR Islamic education? nothing else

Akhi why are you like that........
if someone differs with you on something.... you mistreat Him.
Subhan Allah......

now Akhi.....
our brother Anwar gives lectures and explains Jihad and goes into its deatails and many other Islamic topics
so before anyone takes from Him he/she must know what's his education and where did he get his knowledge from,or at least that's what i do.

i'm just writing in an internet forum, extracting from Olamas articles, sayings and rulings.

so does it matter what my education is?????

Akhi.....
if you want to contribute to the topic and study it then do so, otherwise leave it to the people who want so that we could all benefit from this disscussion.

Assalam Alicom
MXXXXM

Abu Mus'ab
06-05-07, 07:52 PM
now Akhi.....
our brother Anwar gives lectures and explains Jihad and goes into its deatails and many other Islamic topics
so before anyone takes from Him he/she must know what's his education and where did he get his knowledge from,or at least that's what i do.

i'm just writing in an internet forum, extracting from Olamas articles, sayings and rulings.

so does it matter what my education is?????


What's good for the goose is good for the gander, since you say no one should take from Anwar Awlaki unless they know what his education is, so why can't you give your education so that people can take from you?

So yes it does matter very much what your education is.

mujahid84
06-05-07, 08:11 PM
[QUOTE=JiHaDiYa;1846005]Akhi just to touch up on something, the best of jihad fisibili'Allah is when someone runs into the battle field with no weapons, but the only thing he has is Tawakal (relience) in Allah azawalgal.....Subhana'Allah the muslims that are fighting may be a few in number, but do you ever question why sometimes we are winning the battle? :rolleyes:

Assalam alaikum wa rahmatullah wa barakatuh.
A person asked, “Should I tie my camel and have Tawakkul (trust in Allah for her protection) or should I leave her untied and have Tawakkul.” The Messenger, Sall Allaahu `alayhi wa sallam replied, “Tie her and then have Tawakkul.” (Reported by Tirmidzi from Anas)
the above hadith shows that we need faith in Allah subhanaAllah wa ta Ala but also to plan and be ready.
Of coarse victory only comes from Allah subhanaAllah wa ta Ala and we must ask for help in these matters.
Wa Salam
:mujahida:

JiHaDiYa
06-05-07, 08:38 PM
[Quote]i have sayings from many of them.....
and here is a one by Shiekh Ibn Othaimeen may Allah shower His soul with mercy. and i hope that Shiekh Ibn Othaimeen is not out of Ahlul Sunnah Wal Jama'aa to you.[Quote]

Akhi Akhi Akhi....:rolleyes: was there a need for that? Because of what i wrote before, you seem to look at me like im one of those people you are quick to label me as a Khawarij! Astuful'Allah latheem...

Akhi ive noticed with alot of so called "salafies", they claim to be the rightly guided ones, they claim everyone to be deviant, there quick to call you
Khawarij, also ive noticed with alot of them there quick to make remarks about other people...Allahumustan!

Akhi i dont want this to exculate into an argument....

Ibn Taymiyyah said: "The first obligation after Iman is the repulsion of the enemy aggressor who assaults the religion and the wordly affairs."
(Al-Fatawa Al-Kubra 4/608)

Akhi im a bit lost in what your trying to get at in the first place, whats your point, i dont understand?.....

JiHaDiYa
06-05-07, 08:46 PM
Akhi MXXXXXM whats your view on Offensive Jihad?

tayfah-mansurah
07-05-07, 12:33 AM
sre you crazy? i told you before, mujahideen pursue either victory or martyrdom, so why you say it like death is big loss, your not that learned are you, too many nifaq statements


Akhi.....

so how would you go and fight ?????????
and why would go for this so called Jihad?????
woudln't this be throwing your soul to death?????

MXXXXM
07-05-07, 03:53 AM
Assalam Alicom

our brother Abu Mus'ab may allah forgive Him said.......


What's good for the goose is good for the gander, since you say no one should take from Anwar Awlaki unless they know what his education is, so why can't you give your education so that people can take from you?

So yes it does matter very much what your education is.

Akhi.....

the original post is in front of you. it has evidence and it's backed by the sayings of Olama'.
if you want to refute it, do so.
if you want to study it, do so.
if you want to follow up with the disscussion, do so.
if you wan to take it as it is, do so.
and if you want to leave it, do so.

if i wanted people to know who am i, i would've written by my real name.

again....
if you want to contribute with some beneficial knowledge, please do so.

may allah forgive you and take you to heaven without punishment nor judgment.

our brother Mujhid may Allah forgive Him said......


Assalam alaikum wa rahmatullah wa barakatuh.
A person asked, “Should I tie my camel and have Tawakkul (trust in Allah for her protection) or should I leave her untied and have Tawakkul.” The Messenger, Sall Allaahu `alayhi wa sallam replied, “Tie her and then have Tawakkul.” (Reported by Tirmidzi from Anas)
the above hadith shows that we need faith in Allah subhanaAllah wa ta Ala but also to plan and be ready.
Of coarse victory only comes from Allah subhanaAllah wa ta Ala and we must ask for help in these matters.
Wa Salam

may Allah reward you Akhi for the input.
and that's what we have been trying since the biggening of this thread.

and so here is a little gift for my brother Mujahid.

the Hadith is Hassan according to Shiekh Al Albani, and not authantic. so some might argue about this.

our sister Jihadiya may Allah forgive her said......



Akhi Akhi Akhi.... was there a need for that? Because of what i wrote before, you seem to look at me like im one of those people you are quick to label me as a Khawarij! Astuful'Allah latheem...

Akhi ive noticed with alot of so called "salafies", they claim to be the rightly guided ones, they claim everyone to be deviant, there quick to call you
Khawarij, also ive noticed with alot of them there quick to make remarks about other people...Allahumustan!

Akhi i dont want this to exculate into an argument....

may Allah protect us from those people....
and don't forget the people who spread Takfeer and labell people with it by dozens without any evidence or a drop of knowledge.

anyway sister
you misunderstood me......

what i wanted to know is, the Shiekh whom you trust and take from so i would look in their books and get what you need from them. because i've in disscussions with people who reject the sayings of Olama' just because of their names.
anyway.....

but since you mentioned Ibn Taymiyya then i'll qoute from Him insha'Allah.

but before that i hope that i looked at the evidence which i posted. because at the end of the day, the saying of the scholar is wieghtless unless it's according to the evidence.

now here is what Shiekhul Islam Ibn Taymiyya said.


ومن كان عاجزاً عنإقامة الدين بالسلطان والجهاد، ففعلما يقدر عليه من النصيحة بقلبه والدعاء للأمة، ومحبة الخير، وفعل مايقدر عليه من الخير، لم يُكَلَّف مايعجز عنهه

which translate roughly.....

who is unable to implement the religion by power and Jihad, all that he can do is advice from his heart and Dua' (supplication) to the Ummah and to love the goodness and to do whatever he can from goodness and is not obligated to do what he can't do.

and you can find this the Fatawa...... book 28 / 396 (arabic)

and this is the rule in Ahlul Sunnah Wal Jama'aa which all Olama' agreed on without a single exception.

you are not obligated with something unless you can do it.

also refer to Fatawas by the Shiekh
book number 18/ 281
book number 28/240

and Al Mughnee
book number 9/ 236, 237

all in arabic order.

and again this is what He may Allah cover His soul with mercy said in
" The Correct Answer " Book 1/74 (arabic)

" the Prophet peace be upon Him was commanded to fight the Kuffar by His tongue and not His Hand, so He would invite them, talk to them, argue with them in good manners. and He was prohibited from fighting them due to the weakness and inability of the Muslims. and then when He migrated to Madennah and had friends and helpers. He was allowed to fight, and when they became strong, they were obligated to fight. and they weren't obligated to fight the people who didn't fight them (who were peacefull) because they were unable to fight all the Muslims "

and there are more if you want.

what do we understand from all of this in addition to the evidence.

we understand that unless the Muslims are able to fight they shouldn't fight.

and the biggest example is the Prophet peace be upon Him as Shiekhul Islam said.
when He was in Mecca, He was prohibited to fight.
when He migrated He was allowed to fight.
when He had an army and power, He was obligated to fight.

and now......
we are like the Muslims when they were in Mecca.
less in numbers because we are busy with this life. and outpowered because we don't have any power.

and again with the qoute you posted......


Ibn Taymiyyah said: "The first obligation after Iman is the repulsion of the enemy aggressor who assaults the religion and the wordly affairs."
(Al-Fatawa Al-Kubra 4/608)

so do you see alot of Iman and proper faith in our Ummah nowadays.....
so not just outnumbered but also outfaithed.



Akhi MXXXXXM whats your view on Offensive Jihad?

offesive Jihad nowdays doesn't exist at all.
not a single condition of it's conditions does exist.

but anyway.....
all what have been said apply to both types Offensive and Defensive Jihad except a certain situation in Defensive Jihad which is called Def' Al Sa'el.

anyway.....
Offesnsive has got more conditions for it.

our brother/sister Tayfah may Allah forgive him/her said

sre you crazy? i told you before, mujahideen pursue either victory or martyrdom, so why you say it like death is big loss, your not that learned are you, too many nifaq statements

Akhi.......
itn't possible to leave the emotions behind you and talk to me by the evidence . why can't you talk without the insults and disrespect.

anyway may Allah skip that for my brother/sister Tayfah.

Akhi.......

the martyrdom which you are talking about is a personal issue. we use it on an individual scale. you can't apply this to the whole Ummah or the whole army.

you can't come to me and say those Mujihdeen want martyrdom or vitory.

on a group scale victory is what we look at.
on an individual scale we look at martyrdom.

why ??????

because what's the point of Jihad ????
to spread the word of Allah or restore it.
in simple english, the only point of Jihad is not victory or to feel happy or to die in the sake of Allah. but to implement religion
evidence ??
Al Thariyat (chapter 51) verse 56
"I have only created Jinns and men, that they may serve Me."

also.....
Al Anfal (chapter 8) verse 39
"And fight them on until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah altogether and everywhere"

also.....
when the Prophet peace be upon Him was asked about someone who fights out of bravery, another who fights out of protection, and another out of showing off.
so the Prophet peace be upon Him said.
" whomever fights so that the word of Allah would be the highest, then it's for the sake of Allah "
and the Hadith is both Sahih Muslim and Bukhari.

so the point of Jihad is to spread the word of Allah, restore it or implement religion. and if you are saying that the Mujahideen (all of them) fight for victory or martyrdom, and you never look at their ability to fight. they will all die if they were unable to cope with the enemy.

so who is going to imlplement this Shari'ah.
and who is going to spread the word of Allah.
and who is going to protect the lands of the Muslims in case of a reaction from the enemy.

so martyrdom is there yes.......
but you are looking at it as a group which is against religion and logic.

not only that.....
you or most people today are making martyrdom the reason for Jihad. and the evidence on that is, even though they know and even though people tell them that ......
we are unable to fight, they go and fight and never mind wether we are in a situation of fighting or not. which is against the verses and the Hadiths which tell you the reason behind Jihad and why Allah legistlated it.

it's like someone who says i want to pray to give Dua's for Allah since giving Dua's during prayer and specially in the prostration position is highly accepted .
or someone who says that i want to fast to give Dua' before i break my fast since this is the time which highly accepted.

here you are saying......

i'm going for Jihad to get to heaven and be with Hoor Al 'Een which is totally wrong. add to this, when you say that the whole army should fight for martyrdom. and here is becomes insanity. since this implies that if the whole army dies or at least most of them, there will be no one to fight back, protect the lands of the Muslims, nor spread the word of Islam.

Jihad is fighting.....
fighting is based on faith, power and thinking/planing....
there is no place for emotions here.

i hope you think about these words Akhi/Ukhti.

Fudhayl
07-05-07, 05:49 AM
you bring Al Zawahiri to the status of Imam Allama Bin Baz.....
Subhan Allah.....

your Shiekh Mujahid supports blowing up in the Muslim lands and on the top of them <st1:country-region><st1>:place>Saudi Arabia</st1>:place></st1:country-region>.....
Subhan Allah....
it wonders me what kind of Shiekhs that supports the shedding of Muuslim blood.
which is one of the greatest sins in Islam.

Na'am it is true I bring both the likes of Shaykh Bin Baz (rahimullah) and Shaykh Dr. Ayman (Hafidh'Allah) to a raised ground giving them both equal respect as our 'Ullema, despite the differences that may exist between them of which some seek to highlight. I do so for I regard them both as righteous scholars but am not stating their equal in knowledge but rather that I recognise them both as respective scholars in our deen.

And so in similar vain like I wouldn't dare slander or backbite the likes of Shaykh Bin Baz (rahimullah) I would also fear Allah (swt) when observing our Mujahid Shaykh Dr. Ayman (Hafidh'Allah) so as to not belittle or have enmity towards him accusing him of anything or falling for the lies that the kuffar spread through CNN.

Our scholars our the heirs of the Ambiyah (as), laymen like us should try to avoid feeding on their flesh for it is poison, this applies to both our beloved shouyukhs Shaykh Bin Baz (rahimullah- may Allah grant him Jannah- Ameen) and Shaykh Dr. Ayman al Zawahiri (Hafidh'Allah- may Allah protect him and grant him victory- Ameen).

Fudhayl
07-05-07, 05:58 AM
now Akhi.....
our brother Anwar gives lectures and explains Jihad and goes into its deatails and many other Islamic topics
so before anyone takes from Him he/she must know what's his education and where did he get his knowledge from,or at least that's what i do.
In regards to Imam Anwar (Hafidh'Allah- may Allah protect him- Ameen) as to his educational background whilst living in Yemen for eleven years during his young age he received the early part of his Islamic education from the traditional scholar of his homeland.

He then went to the <st1:country-region><st1>US</st1></st1:country-region> and was made Imam in <st1><st1>Colorado</st1>, </st1><st1><st1>California</st1></st1>, and later in the <st1><st1:city>Washington</st1:city>, <st1>D.C.</st1></st1> area where he headed the Dar Al-Hijrah Islamic Center and was also the Muslim Chaplain at the <st1><st1>George </st1><st1>Washington</st1> <st1>University</st1></st1>.

As for his secular knowledge he holds a B.S. in Civil Engineering from <st1><st1>Colorado </st1><st1>State</st1> <st1>University</st1></st1>, a M.A. in Education Leadership from <st1><st1>San Diego</st1> <st1>State</st1> <st1>University</st1> </st1>and was working on a Doctorate degree in Human Resource Development at <st1><st1>George</st1><st1> Washington </st1><st1>University</st1></st1>.

Furthermore, he returned to <st1:country-region><st1>Yemen</st1></st1:country-region> to continue his Islamic education and was was studying Islamic Jurisprudence with prominent scholars there, that is until he was detained by the tyrants.
<!--[endif]-->
May Allah (swt) preserve Imam Anwar and free him- Ameen.


i'm just writing in an internet forum, extracting from Olamas articles, sayings and rulings.

so does it matter what my education is?????

And has Imam Anwar somehow strayed from the teachings of our 'Ullema in regards to his teachings on the subject of qhitaal?

In regards to his audio series 'Mashari Al-Ashwaq' also known as 'The Story of Ibn Al-Akwa' please note he too is extracting the ilm from 'Ullema, in this instance it was from the classical book of Jihad from the Mujahid scholar Ibn Nuhas (rahimullah).
Listen and learn here: http://islambase.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=182&Itemid=181

In regards to his audio series 'Constants of Jihad' he extracted the ilm from in that instance the contemporary Mujahid scholar Dr. Yusuf Al Ayyari (rahimullah).
Listen and learn here: http://islambase.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=308&Itemid=181

In regards to his other audio works like the 'Lives of the Prophets (as)' and 'The Hereafter' series, etc. these are all based again on the works of our 'Ullema like classical scholars such as Ibn Kathir (rahimullah).

abidmalayalam
07-05-07, 07:20 AM
In my opinion there is no question of logic or utility.Only two options are before you, either to:rolleyes: fightback the 'dalims' or to become their slaves.

MXXXXM
07-05-07, 10:51 AM
Assalam Alicom

our brother Abu Hurrairah may Allah forgive Him said....


And so in similar vain like I wouldn't dare slander or backbite the likes of Shaykh Bin Baz (rahimullah) I would also fear Allah (swt) when observing our Mujahid Shaykh Dr. Ayman (Hafidh'Allah) so as to not belittle or have enmity towards him accusing him of anything or falling for the lies that the kuffar spread through CNN.


Akhi.....
a scholar has got to main characters...

1- His knowledge.
2- implementation of this knowledge.

i'll take it that Al Zawahiri has got the first one for the sake of the arguement what about the second one.

blowing up in Muslim lands, and between civilians, what's this ??????
where does this fit in religion ?????

this mentality and ideology is well known. the mass Takfeer and the shedding of Muslim blood. and He approved it many times in his Fatwas and praised the blasts of Saudi and many other lands in the Muslim world and he encouraged youth around the world to support these blasts and participate in them.

this is not from CNN nor from anyone else.
this is from Him directly, through his videos, Fatwas and letters.



Our scholars our the heirs of the Ambiyah (as),

Akhi someone who justifies those acts and supports them, can't be a heir of the Prophet peace be upon Him.


And so in similar vain like I wouldn't dare slander or backbite the likes of.....

and the Prophet peace be upon Him told us not to slander nor to backbite, but to chop the heads of the people who kill other Muslims and justify the shedding of Muslim blood, and want to spread insecurity in our countries and communities.


In regards to Imam Anwar (Hafidh'Allah- may Allah protect him- Ameen) as to his educational background whilst living in Yemen for eleven years during his young age he received the early part of his Islamic education from the traditional scholar of his homeland.

He then went to the US and was made Imam in Colorado, California, and later in the Washington, D.C. area where he headed the Dar Al-Hijrah Islamic Center and was also the Muslim Chaplain at the George Washington University.

As for his secular knowledge he holds a B.S. in Civil Engineering from Colorado State University, a M.A. in Education Leadership from San Diego State University and was working on a Doctorate degree in Human Resource Development at George Washington University.

Furthermore, he returned to Yemen to continue his Islamic education and was was studying Islamic Jurisprudence with prominent scholars there, that is until he was detained by the tyrants.

May Allah (swt) preserve Imam Anwar and free him- Ameen.

Akhi this is what was written in the previous link which one of the brothers posted.
anyway....
our topic is not the education of brother Anwar.


And has Imam Anwar somehow strayed from the teachings of our 'Ullema in regards to his teachings on the subject of qhitaal?

good Akhi.....
can you please extract the things which i contradicted the brother with.
and post it with the evidence Akhi.....

so that we can disscuss it.

you are the third person to ask you to do that.

may Allah grant us and you heaven.

Assalam Alicom
MXXXXM

MXXXXM
07-05-07, 10:54 AM
In my opinion there is no question of logic or utility.Only two options are before you, either to fightback the 'dalims' or to become their slaves.

Akhi....
there is no personal opinions in these matters.

you either have an evidence and follow it so can you please post it.

or you just follow your desire and emotions and here i have nothing to say.

may Allah cover our soul and yours with mercy.

Assalam Alicom
MXXXXM

Abu Mus'ab
07-05-07, 10:59 AM
the original post is in front of you. it has evidence and it's backed by the sayings of Olama'.
if you want to refute it, do so.
if you want to study it, do so.
if you want to follow up with the disscussion, do so.
if you wan to take it as it is, do so.
and if you want to leave it, do so.

if i wanted people to know who am i, i would've written by my real name.


So in other words you have no islamic education?

Could you not have said that in the beginning and saved everyone the trouble?

MXXXXM
07-05-07, 11:07 AM
our brother Abu Mus'ab may Allah forgive Him said.....


So in other words you have no islamic education?

Could you not have said that in the beginning and saved everyone the trouble?

Akhi....
i don't know how you got that out of my words ????

anyway....
i said it before and i'm saying it for the second time.
our topic here is about Jihad, and not about my education or the education of brother Anwar.

and here is a gift for my brother Abu Mus'ab.

the Prophet peace be upon Him said:
"whomever beieves in the day of judgment, let him say goodness or keep silent"

so if you want to contribute to the disscussion please do and that would be an honour to me. but if you don't, don't get into off topic disscussions.

may Allah grant both of us heaven.

Assalam Alicom
MXXXXM

RashidD
07-05-07, 02:59 PM
We are like the muslims of Makkah? No, our situation is not... The hukm still stands that Jihad is obligatory (either kifayah or 'ayn) and now it's Fard 'Ayn - Defence of the muslim lands, freeing the muslim prisoners, establishing Khilafah etc.

mujahid84
08-05-07, 06:19 AM
and so here is a little gift for my brother Mujahid.

the Hadith is Hassan according to Shiekh Al Albani, and not authantic. so some might argue about this.

Assalam Alaikum wa rahmatullah,

Brother you said this about the evidence i used, i know it is not Sahih but according to; Khattabi (d. 388 A.H.), a commentator on Sunan Abu Dawud, defined Hasan:

"It refers to a Hadith which is known, its reporters are famous, the majority of the scholars have accepted it as evidence and the jurists utilize it."

So i doubt many will argue against a Hasan Hadith?
Also it was you who mentioned the education of Imam Anwar al-Awlaki and in a previous post you quoted


with all the respect to the brother....
but i don't see what his Islamic Education is and i don't see that he did any Islamic studies.

the words which i wrote are gathered from sayings of the biggest Olama' in the Salafi Da'wah Akhi.

then later


anyway....
i said it before and i'm saying it for the second time.
our topic here is about Jihad, and not about my education or the education of brother Anwar.

The reason behind this does not matter and I hope that our brothers and sisters will not continue to follow this up but brother MXXXXM i feel you should take more time when posting comments. Especiallly as to avoid offence and hurt to other.
JazakAllah Khair

:mujahida:

MXXXXM
08-05-07, 08:14 AM
our brother Rashid may Allah forgive Him said.....


We are like the muslims of Makkah? No, our situation is not

can you please show me how wer are not?????



The hukm still stands that Jihad is obligatory (either kifayah or 'ayn)

Akhi....
every obligation falls if you are unable to do it.
if you can't fast, you don't fast.
if you can't pray, you don't pray.
if you can't fo to hajj, you don't go to hajj.
and the list goes on.
no one argues that Jihad is obligatory....
i'm talking about a rule which is, if we are unable to do Jihad then we shouldn't do it. but people nowdays say that, Jihad must be done wether we can or not and this is completely wrong since this can lead to mass death of our youth and men.



now it's Fard 'Ayn - Defence of the muslim lands, freeing the muslim prisoners, establishing Khilafah etc.

Akhi.......

if it's Fardh 'Ayn, then why Akhi you are not on the battle field ?????

can you please answer this.

as for establishing the Khilafa that doesn't fall under defensive Jihad but under offensive Jihad and there is a great difference between the two.

our brother Mujahid may allah forgive Him said.....


Assalam Alaikum wa rahmatullah,

Brother you said this about the evidence i used, i know it is not Sahih but according to; Khattabi (d. 388 A.H.), a commentator on Sunan Abu Dawud, defined Hasan:

"It refers to a Hadith which is known, its reporters are famous, the majority of the scholars have accepted it as evidence and the jurists utilize it."

So i doubt many will argue against a Hasan Hadith?

Akhi....
i said some people might use the arguement.
i personally wouldn't do that. that's all i'm saying.
becaue the Hadiths and the evidence i posted was all authantic with no comment about them at all.
and still it didn't convince them.
so what would happen if you post a Hassan Hadith.

anyway....
again Jazakum Allah Khair for the second input, i hope that they read it as well .


The reason behind this does not matter and I hope that our brothers and sisters will not continue to follow this up but brother MXXXXM i feel you should take more time when posting comments. Especiallly as to avoid offence and hurt to other.
JazakAllah Khair

Akhi Wallahi i didn't intend to offend anyone.
there reason i said i wanted to know his education is because i didn't find anything about him, except that he is an Imam in a mosque and he spent some of his childhood in yemen where he gained some studies that's all.
and those topics are sensetive which only senior Olama' and scholars talk about, and that's why i wanted to know who he is and still i didn't get anything that answers my question, so i'm ready to leave the sayings of Olama' like Ibn Taymiyya and Bin Baz and Ibn Othaimeen for someone i don't know about. again with all the respect to the brother. but this is the way i deal with it. someone i don't know, is someone i don't take from.

anyway....
i'm not going back to this issue again.

i said it before.....

1- i hope the brothers and sisters to respond to the evidence posted.
2- the brothers and sisters can extract the sayings and evidence used by brother Anwar and use it against me if there is something i contradicted him with.

simple......

may Allah guide us all

Assalam Alicom
MXXXXM

RashidD
08-05-07, 10:59 AM
our brother Rashid may Allah forgive Him said.....



can you please show me how wer are not?????

We have the orders to fight, as per the hadith and Qur'an i.e. as i mentioned earlier the hukm still stands. We have the numbers - the Ummah is generally larger than it has ever been before etc. Explain how the Ummah is like the Makkans? Don't say no money or strength please as we're witnesses before our eyes the movements in Sheeshan (Chechnya) and Afghanistan where the Mujahideen will InshaALLAH conquer and reign.




Akhi....
every obligation falls if you are unable to do it.
if you can't fast, you don't fast.
if you can't pray, you don't pray.
if you can't fo to hajj, you don't go to hajj.
and the list goes on.
no one argues that Jihad is obligatory....
i'm talking about a rule which is, if we are unable to do Jihad then we shouldn't do it. but people nowdays say that, Jihad must be done wether we can or not and this is completely wrong since this can lead to mass death of our youth and men.

Then please try to make a means for it, we have seen our brothers making good this obligation e.g. Abu Waleed (Rahimahullah), Khattab (Rahimahullah), Nek Mohamed (Rahimahullah), Sheikh 'Abdullah Azzam (Rahimahullah) [May ALLAH (Azzawajall) accept them from among the Shuhadah]

It is not worthy to say obligations fall if one doesn't have capabilities, one has to take necessary means to make good those obligations. I'm not talking about those who have legitimate excuses such as blindness or are physically disabled etc.

Can i ask, did Ahl-Al-Badr back down because they were fewer in number? Possibly also in wealth and weaponry. Look at their status in the Eyes of ALLAH... An entire Surah was pretty much revealed about them (Al-Anfal which is also known as Surat-Al-Qittal) ALLAH makes firm the hearts of the believers, and He is the Source of All Strength, Power and Might.



Akhi.......

if it's Fardh 'Ayn, then why Akhi you are not on the battle field ?????

can you please answer this.

as for establishing the Khilafa that doesn't fall under defensive Jihad but under offensive Jihad and there is a great difference between the two.


Please make excuses for our brothers - a line i read some time before... Weep like a woman for what you couldn't defend like a man...

May ALLAH forgive you also Akhee and Wa ALLAHu Alam and Ameen to your du'aa about guidance :)

JiHaDiYa
08-05-07, 05:18 PM
MXXXXM you said that offensive jihad (fisibil'allah) is not on in this day and age!

Akhi where the disbelievers are not gathering to fight the muslims, the fighting becomes Fard kifayah with the minimum requirements of appointing believers to guard borders, and the sending of an army at least once a year.

It is a duty upon the Imam to assemble and send out an army unit into the land of war once or twice a every year right?

And akhi its the responsibility of the muslims population to assist him, and if he does not send an army he is in a sin. (This could be found akhi Hashiyah ibn Abidin 3/238)

Also the scholars of Ahul Sunnah Wal Jammah have mentioned that this type of jihad is for the maintaning the payment of Jizya. The scholars of the principles of religion have also said: "Jihad is dawah with a force, and is obligatory to perform with all available capabilities, until there remains only muslims or people who submit to islam....( Hashiyah Ash-Shirwani and Ibn Al-Qasim in Tuhfah Al-Muhtaj Alal-Minhaj 9/213)


Now akhi we will take a look at what the 4Imams views are on this bizni'Allah tala:

Hanafi (ra)Fiqh:

Jihad becomes Fard Ain if the enemy attacks one of the borders of the muslims and it becomes Fard Ain upon those close by......

Maliki (ra) Fiqh:

Jihad becomes Fard Ain upon a suprise attack by the enemy. Wherever this happens, Jihad immediately becomes Fard Ain upon everybody, even women, slaves and children.....

Shafi (ra) Fiqh:

If they approach one of our lands and the distance between them and us becomes less than the distance permitting the shortening of prayers, then the people of that territory must defend it and it becomes Fard Ain even upon the people for whom there is usually no jihad: the poor, the children, the slaves etc...

Hanbali (ra) Fiqh

Jihad becomes Fard Ain in three situations

1) If the two slaves meet in battle and they approach each other
2) If the disbelievers enter a land, jihad becomes Fard Ain upon its people.
3) If the Imam calls people to march forward it is obligatory upon them to march forward.

Now Akhi the majority have said that if the kuffars enter our lands, then jihad becxome Fard Ain, Sa?

Also Akhi Ibn Taymiyyah (rh) said: If the enemy enters a muslim land, there is no doubt that it is obligatory for the closest and then the next closest to repel him, because the muslim lands are like one land. It is obligatory to march to the territory even without the permission of parents or creditor....(Al-Fatawa Al-Kubara)

Akhi take heed of these beautyful words:

Al-Qurtubi said: "Anyone who is aware of the weakness of the muslims in the face of the enemy and knows that he can reach them and assist them, it is also incumbent upon him to march forward."

Insh'allah tala we take heed on this :rolleyes:

Allahumustan

Le Croyant
08-05-07, 08:35 PM
so bro/sis MXXXXM,

so since u say that we should sit with our hands tied behinds our backs in Iraq, Afghanistan, Palestine, Chechnya, Kashmir, etc...

So what solution do u have, do we just switch on our tv & watch the news abt muslims being killed everyday, muslims lands being occupied by the kuffar.

What is the responsibility of Muslim nations towards Iraq?

Btw do u support the American invasion of Iraq?

Waiting for your answer.... unless u don't have one.

MXXXXM
10-05-07, 12:11 PM
our brother Rashid may Allah forgive Him said......


We have the orders to fight, as per the hadith and Qur'an i.e. as i mentioned earlier the hukm still stands. We have the numbers - the Ummah is generally larger than it has ever been before etc

and also we have the orders to pray, fast and make hajj.....
if we are not able to do these....
they turn from being obligatory to being allowed (Mubah)
and in some cases to being prohibited if would cause death for example.

so does the Hukm stand here as well ????
or course not Akhi.

if i'm unable to make Hajj, the Hukm still stands, but am i obligated to do it????
we say no.....
it's allowed to do it.

another example is fasting.....

if i'm diabatic....
i can't fast, so the Hukm stands, but it's not obligatory.
it's allowed, and i guess as a student of knowledge you know the difference between allowed and obligatory ;)

not only that......
but also.....
it becomes proibited to fast, if this would cause death.

and if this applies to the five pillars of Islam......
doesn't apply to Jihad ???????


the Ummah is generally larger than it has ever been before

no one would argue about that.
but Akhi.....

you know better than me the situation that Muslims are in today.
how from religion are they.

1.5 billion Muslim on the face of earth.

don't you agree that if all of them, would pray 5 times a day, fast Ramdan and do their basic obligations, do you think that we would be in our situation today ??????

bottom line is.......

in Hunain, at the time of the Prophet peace be upon Him, the Muslims were more than the Kuffar. and the Muslims we are talking about here are Sahaba. and you know how good their faith is, at least they had the Prophet peace be upon Him between them.
and they were about to lose the fight???????
why ??????
because of their number ?????
no....
because of their faith and trust in Allah.

and the same applies here.....
we have the numbers, but our faith and trust in Allah is not there.


Explain how the Ummah is like the Makkans?

as said before.....
less in numbers, power and weaker in faith.

less in numbers... since you wouldn't expect a Sufi, a Tablighi or a Shie to do Jihad, and not only that.... a sinner who drinks or commits Zina also wouldn't go for Jihad. and you know how many of these we have today in our Ummah.

less in power...... and this is well known, the technolgy which we have in our cuontries are well weaker than those in the west and the non Muslim countries. and enough for us to know, that not a single Muslim country is even considered one of the G8 countries and we don't have any country to be condiered to be advanced.


Don't say no money or strength please as we're witnesses before our eyes the movements in Sheeshan (Chechnya) and Afghanistan where the Mujahideen will InshaALLAH conquer and reign.

at the old times.... in the 90s
yes....

because it was fully supported by not just all the Muslim countries but also by the US. and we all know that Usama himself was trained by the CIA.

bottom line is......
at those days, we had the power, and that the Jihad paied off.
while these days.....
we see nothing but new orphans and new widows everyday.


It is not worthy to say obligations fall if one doesn't have capabilities, one has to take necessary means to make good those obligations. I'm not talking about those who have legitimate excuses such as blindness or are physically disabled etc.

the meaning of.....
" the obligation falls" means that it's not obligatory anymore, but it becomes allowed, or sometimes prohibited.

and i said before.....
if it's allowed, then you can't obligate people with what's allowed nor what's recommended.

so yuo can't say that Jihad is obligatory. and that those who don't do it are sinners.


Can i ask, did Ahl-Al-Badr back down because they were fewer in number? Possibly also in wealth and weaponry. Look at their status in the Eyes of ALLAH... An entire Surah was pretty much revealed about them (Al-Anfal which is also known as Surat-Al-Qittal) ALLAH makes firm the hearts of the believers, and He is the Source of All Strength, Power and Might.

i responded to this misconception in the original post please refer to it.

the wars at that time were different than today.


Please make excuses for our brothers

Akhi.....
simple question.....

do you consider them sinners or not ??????

in simple english.....

do you consider yourself and me and everyone who doesn't go for Jihad to Iraq and the rest of the world as sinners and will punished on the day of judgment.
keep in mind that if Jihad is Fardh A'ain and you don't go for it, it's a major sin .
like Riba, drinking, committing Zina and so on........

so do you consider me, you and the rest of those people at the same status of those sinners ??????

yes or no....??????

may Allah grant you heaven without punishment nor judgment.
masha'Allah....
disscussion with you Akhi is of a great benefit to me....
so please keep going.

sister Jihadiya may Allah forgive you......

offensive Jihad is called in Shariah Jihad Talab.
which means that......
you go for Jihad and offend the enemy.
the point of it, is to spread the word of Allah.

example......

to prepare an army to attack the US and conquere it. (sorry for the spelling)

so what are the conditions for this.

many.....
and one of which is.....

to have enough power to accomplish this mission.

applying this to our example.....

to have enough power to attack and conquere the United States of America.

i'm telling you we don't have enough power to respond to defend our children and you are telling me to go and prepare an army twice a year ??????
which is something i never heard of, so i'd really apreciete it if you post the evidence on that the " twice a year " thingy.

so that's why i told you it doesn't exist.

because we are not in the situation for a defensive Jihad, so imagine offensive Jihad.

as for the evidence you posted.......

1- i need to refer back to it and have a look at it and ask about it, i have an answer but i just want to make sure so excuse me in that sister, please give me some time.

2- you need to respond as well to the evidence which i posted. which states that everything is restrected to ability.

3- can you please post the full text of what's said.

i hope you keep on with the disscussion.


so bro/sis MXXXXM,

so since u say that we should sit with our hands tied behinds our backs in Iraq, Afghanistan, Palestine, Chechnya, Kashmir, etc...

So what solution do u have, do we just switch on our tv & watch the news abt muslims being killed everyday, muslims lands being occupied by the kuffar.

What is the responsibility of Muslim nations towards Iraq?

Btw do u support the American invasion of Iraq?

Waiting for your answer.... unless u don't have one.

i gave you a detailed answer to that sister/brother.....

please refer to it.

i think it's in this thread.

Assalam Alicom
MXXXXM

Le Croyant
10-05-07, 01:37 PM
so bro/sis MXXXXM,

so since u say that we should sit with our hands tied behinds our backs in Iraq, Afghanistan, Palestine, Chechnya, Kashmir, etc...

So what solution do u have, do we just switch on our tv & watch the news abt muslims being killed everyday, muslims lands being occupied by the kuffar.

What is the responsibility of Muslim nations towards Iraq?

Btw do u support the American invasion of Iraq?

Waiting for your answer.... unless u don't have one.



i gave you a detailed answer to that sister/brother.....

please refer to it.

i think it's in this thread.

Assalam Alicom
MXXXXM

I m sorry but I can't find it in the thread. I did ask u this before but u ignored it like this time.

Um Abdullah
10-05-07, 01:38 PM
can someone tell me how did zawahiri become a shaykh and scholar?
where did he study Islamic shariah?
who are his teachers?
any complete bio of him?

MXXXXM
10-05-07, 01:58 PM
I m sorry but I can't find it in the thread. I did ask u this before but u ignored it like this time.

sister i never ignore a single post....
i posted a response to your post......
if it's not here then in another thread....
i have three threads in the whole forum refer to them and check the response out.

Zaid the Great
10-05-07, 02:00 PM
can someone tell me how did zawahiri become a shaykh and scholar?
where did he study Islamic shariah?
who are his teachers?
any complete bio of him?

he was one of the students of sayyid quttub rahimahullah apparently

Um Abdullah
10-05-07, 08:08 PM
he was one of the students of sayyid quttub rahimahullah apparently

akhi
it is well known that sayed Qutub rahimahu ALlah himself wasn't a shaikh or a scholar.

Zaid the Great
10-05-07, 08:20 PM
akhi
it is well known that sayed Qutub rahimahu ALlah himself wasn't a shaikh or a scholar.

i dunno but they say he studied......... thats what i read about him.... the only guy they mentioned on some english bio was sayyid qutub rahimahullah..

MXXXXM
12-05-07, 09:51 AM
brother/sister.....Le Croyant may Allah frgive you.

here is the response again, just that you don't feel sad or angry.


So what solution do u have, do we just switch on our tv & watch the news abt muslims being killed everyday, muslims lands being occupied by the kuffar.

this is answered in the original post.
and here is the answer


they say
so what do you want us to do with the people of Palestine and Iraq and the rest
do we just sit down ????

and the response to that is

we have to go back to Quran and Sunnah and learn our religion
we have to forget about our emotions and focus on following the evidence
we have to increase our faith and go back to the path of Assalaf Assaleh

so what those people who claim to be on the path of Jihad nowadays
to stop the blood shed of Muslims
listen and obey to the rulers whom Allah chose for them
and stick to their Islamically lawful commands
follow what Olama' and scholars say and gather around them
stop spreading the Fitnah around the Muslims
And wake up from their dreams and illusions
And leave their emotions behind them
And more importantly to learn from the 50 years of bloodshed
In Palestine which brought nothing but destruction death to Muslims
And learn from what's happened in Lebanon few months ago
What happened and still happening in Iraq and Afghanistan

MXXXXM
20-05-07, 12:49 PM
pump for the benefit of the members.....

may Allah educate us about religion.

Le Croyant
21-05-07, 01:49 PM
brother/sister.....Le Croyant may Allah frgive you.

here is the response again, just that you don't feel sad or angry.



this is answered in the original post.
and here is the answer

ur solution is to sit & watch as things unfold... there's no plan for what happens next. I m not disagreeing that we need to follow Islam to the fullest extent... but actions have to taken, it doesn't have to guns or bombs. But if u don't give an alternative way to stop these occupations, ppl will fight. No one is goin to sit & watch as their family is being killed & raped.

Al-ghurabah
21-05-07, 02:00 PM
Misconception 5

they say
so what do you want us to do with the people of Palestine and Iraq and the rest
do we just sit down ????

and the response to that is

we have to go back to Quran and Sunnah and learn our religion
we have to forget about our emotions and focus on following the evidence
we have to increase our faith and go back to the path of Assalaf Assaleh

so what those people who claim to be on the path of Jihad nowadays
to stop the blood shed of Muslims
listen and obey to the rulers whom Allah chose for them
and stick to their Islamically lawful commands
follow what Olama' and scholars say and gather around them
stop spreading the Fitnah around the Muslims
And wake up from their dreams and illusions
And leave their emotions behind them
And more importantly to learn from the 50 years of bloodshed
In Palestine which brought nothing but destruction death to Muslims
And learn from what's happened in Lebanon few months ago
What happened and still happening in Iraq and Afghanistan

Do we need another 50 years in Iraq?
And another 50 in Afghanistan to wake up?????

May Allah preserve our blood and our lands?


salam akhi what you on bro..listen to rulers who rule by non islam? who have armies soldiers weapons yet ont do anything to help other muslims countries
the same rulers who support kuffar and fund them
same rulers who arrest and punish good ulema

if your so called rulers were good they would get their armies and eneter palestine and stop them not sit in their palace and do jack..

what have the saudi and other rulers done for the palestinains israel is surrounded by musli mcountries who has helped?

MXXXXM
21-05-07, 04:59 PM
our sister/brother Le may Allah forgive her/him said.....


ur solution is to sit & watch as things unfold... there's no plan for what happens next. I m not disagreeing that we need to follow Islam to the fullest extent... but actions have to taken, it doesn't have to guns or bombs. But if u don't give an alternative way to stop these occupations, ppl will fight. No one is goin to sit & watch as their family is being killed & raped.

i gave you an alternative sister/brother.....

we are in this situation because of our disobedience to Islam in the first place.
and this has been going for 100s of years and still going.....

so don't expect to solve the problems which occured due to a 100 years of disobedience in a couple of years. and don't expect to see a solution which will solve all of our problems in a couple of days.

so please lets be realistic here.


our brother/sister Al-ghurabah may Allah forgive Him/Her said.....



salam akhi what you on bro..listen to rulers who rule by non islam? who have armies soldiers weapons yet ont do anything to help other muslims countries
the same rulers who support kuffar and fund them
same rulers who arrest and punish good ulema

if your so called rulers were good they would get their armies and eneter palestine and stop them not sit in their palace and do jack..

what have the saudi and other rulers done for the palestinains israel is surrounded by musli mcountries who has helped?

Akhi/Ukhti......

did those rulers come from Mars or the Moon??????

they came from us.
me and you.....
our people.

and in the same why those bad rulers come into power from between us......
good ones can come as well from between us.

but do you think that with the disobedience to Allah.....
and with all the sinning......
and with all the distance from Islam.....
and with all the Takfeer.....
and with all distance from Olama'
which we have in our lands......

do you think that we can produce good rulers.....

that's a question which you should be asking yourself Akhi/Ukhti before you ask me.

and the rule is......

bad people are ruled by bad rulers and good people are ruled by good ones.

and the history is the biggest evidence on that.


all of that if we were to consider all rulers to be Kuffar.
but if they are Muslims..... that's when you have to listen and obey.

katy
21-05-07, 10:54 PM
i ve just joined this forum, salamo alikom brothers and sisters . :) :lailah:

MXXXXM
22-05-07, 11:24 AM
i ve just joined this forum, salamo alikom brothers and sisters

Wa Alicom Assalam......

i hope you benefit from us and we benefit from you insha'Allah.

katy
22-05-07, 07:33 PM
yes i m sure i ll learn a lot here in this blessed forum. i m really interrested in what s being discussed .
:75: :)

MXXXXM
22-05-07, 08:04 PM
AlHamdullilah.....

just be carefull to take what's proven by evidence.

don't follow any emotional talks or anything withou evidence from Quran and Sunnah.....

i guess you know that without me telling you.....

may Allah guide us all

Resistance
26-05-07, 01:53 PM
MXXXXM,

you should really listen to lectures Thawaabit Ala Darb Al Jihad by Imam Anwar Al Awlaki's (may Allah protect him) talks.

please read carefully: taken from ( http://talk.islamicnetwork.com/showthread.php?t=1604 )

<HR style="COLOR: #d1d1e1" SIZE=1> <!-- / icon and title --><!-- message -->
Jihad will Remain until the Day of Judgment

All of the nations today are standing with their claws clamoring over the lands of the Muslims. All this power lay to waste from one aspect of this deen, and that is Jihad in the path of Allah. This is path that Allah obligated upon us by His words.

This is a part of the deen that the kuffar nations have said is *terror and extremism and fundamentalism*. And they have been helped by some of those that ascribe to Islam using hypocritical methods, and words such as saying that “Jihad is only defensive and not offensive”, that “Jihad is not allowed except to rescue the occupied territories of Palestine” and that the “Jihad (even defensive at that) can only take place with the permission of the ruler.” Or that “Jihad is not appropriate in this day and age, the age of the new world order and peace.”

One thing we do know is that ever since the time of the Prophet (sallallahu alayhi wasallam) the ummah was clear on the topic of Jihad and what it was about. Its markers and Fiqh were made clear and obvious. We are not in any need for any alphabet-soup group to come and develop new ways of understanding the Jihad. We have enough in our heritage to know about the conditions, obligations, sunnah and factors of Jihad.

Above all of this, we know that the Jihad of fighting will remain in the Ummah until Allah’s Legislation rules over the earth. This is from the Thawabit of Jihad in the path of Allah.

The proofs from the Qur'an:
1. "O you who believe! Whoever from among you turns back from his religion, Allāh will bring a people whom He will love and they will love Him; humble towards the believers, stern towards the disbelievers, fighting in the Way of Allāh, and never afraid of the blame of the blamers. That is the Grace of Allāh that He bestows on whom He wills. And Allāh is All Sufficient for His creatures’ needs, All Knower." [5:54]

There is a point related to eloquence in Arabic in this ayah. Whenever a present tense verb is used in this manner it indicates continuity.

Shaykh ul-Islām Ibn Taymiyyah said:

“There is no group that apostates from Islām except that Allāh brings fourth a people that He loves and that wages Jihād for His sake and they are the at-Tā’ifah al-Mansūrah until the last hour.”

2. “And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah) and (all and every kind of) worship is for Allah (Alone). But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)” [2:193]

The Fitnah here is Kufr and fighting will remain until it is removed. The scholars say that Kufr will remain until Isa ibn Maryam descends and breaks the cross, kills the swine, and abolishes the Jizyah, and then his followers will die and then the last hour will come when there is no more believers and it comes upon the most evil of creation.

3. “Fight against those who (1) believe not in Allah, (2) nor in the Last Day, (3) nor forbid that which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger (4) and those who acknowledge not the religion of truth (i.e. Islam) among the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians), until they pay the Jizyah with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. “ [9:29]

The Kuffar use this against the Muslims but the truth has been established and is fixed.

“There is no compulsion in religion. Verily, the truth has become distinct from the falsehood. Whoever disbelieves in Taghut and believes in Allah, then he has grasped the most trustworthy handhold that will never break. And Allah is All-Hearer, All-Knower.” [2:256]

4. “Verily, Allah has purchased of the believers their lives and their properties; for the price that theirs shall be the Paradise. They fight in Allah's Cause, so they kill (others) and are killed. It is a promise in truth which is binding on Him in the Taurat (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel) and the Qur'an. And who is truer to his covenant than Allah? Then rejoice in the bargain which you have concluded. That is the supreme success.” [9:111]

This truth has been fixed and can not be restricted to one time and not another.

Evidence from the Sunnah:
1. the Hadith of Urwah:
Narrated 'Urwa Al-Bariqi: The Prophet said, "Good will remain (as a permanent quality) in the foreheads of horses (for Jihad) till the Day of Resurrection, for they bring about either a reward (in the Hereafter) or booty (in this world.)"

Ibn Hajr, in his explanation of sahih al Bukhari, said that Imam Ahmad used this as a proof because he explained this hadith to imply that Jihad would remain. In the last part of the Hadith, the reason for the good in the forelocks of the horses is due to the reward they bring or the spoils of war. Naturally, this can only take place in Jihad. In this Hadith there is also an encouragement upon keeping horses to wage jihad. Islam will remain until the day of judgment because as long as there is Jihad there will be mujahidun, and they are Muslims.

2. In abu dawud, Hadith from Anas:
The Prophet (sallallahu alayhi wa sallam) was reported to have said: “The Jihad will remain from the time Allah sent me until the time which the last of my Ummah fights the Dajjal. It will not be invalidated by the crime/corruption of the corrupt one nor by the justice of the just one.”

Jihad will remain because the kuffar will remain until the time of Isa when he (alayh salam) kills the Dajjal.


3. In the two sahih:
“There will never cease to be a group from my Ummah fighting upon the truth until the last hour is established.” In the narration of Bukhari: “They will not be harmed by those that oppose them or abandon them.” In Imam Ahmad’s narration: “They will not be concerned by those that oppose them or abandon them.”

This hadith and others like these confirm the quality that the Qur’an gave the believers: waging jihad in the path of Allah not fearing the blame of the blamers.

4. The hadith narrated by Abu Hurayrah about the command:
The Prophet (sallallahu alayhi wa sallam) said, “I have been commanded to fight the people until they testify to la ilaha illah Allah Muhammad rasulullah and establish the salah and pay the zakah and if they do that then they are safe in their blood and wealth except for the command of Islam and their account is with Allah.” (Muslim)

This is from the Thawabit without doubt. These texts that have been mentioned are clear cut.

If we understand this Thabit and put it in front of us, then no matter how difficult it gets and what happens, we must always be there to support the banner of Jihad for that is where the victorious group is that Allah is pleased with.

If we believe that, then we must hold that the powers of Kufr and the Munafiq nations of the Arab regimes can not ever succeed in erasing the banner of Jihad. They might be able to restrict to one place but it will always be even if all of mankind and jinn gather to eliminate the Jihad, they will not be able to because it was raised by Allah and His permission, and it is He who made it such that it would remain until the last of the Ummah fights the Dajjal.

This is the Aqidah that we must depart with in our battles and fights, the Aqidah of Yaqin and the belief in the promise of Allah.

(reference: notes from Thawabit 'ala darb al Jihad)

MXXXXM
27-05-07, 08:07 PM
i'll read it and get back to you Akhi/Ukhti......

i had a quick look at it and there some important points that the brother missed out.

JiHaDiYa
27-05-07, 08:38 PM
Akhi MXXXXM ive noticed among many of the so-called "salafies" they dont take from people who dont call themselves "Salafies"....So im sure you wouldnt take from this brother here!

MXXXXM
27-05-07, 09:05 PM
our sister Jihadiya may Allah forgive Her said......



Akhi MXXXXM ive noticed among many of the so-called "salafies" they dont take from people who dont call themselves "Salafies"....So im sure you wouldnt take from this brother here!

Ukhti.....

a Salafi is someone who follow Assalaf Assaleh in the interpretation of the evidence and wouldn't follow anything or take from anyone except the evidence.

Salafi, Sufi, Sh'ee, Habashi, Khawariji.......anything else.

i don't care about their names. i care about their evidence.

and that's why i told the brother/sister that i'll get back to Him/Her. because i need to extract the evidence, and its explaination and see wether it's right or not.

but somehow you assumed that i didn't take from the brother.

and one last thing.......

i haven't come across any of the well known Shiekh who says about Himself that he is a Salafi, like Bin Baz.....
i never heard him say that, even read Him say it.

so i guess you are saying i don't take from Him......??????


anyway.......

bottom line is.....
the evidence is what i look for.....
whether it's brother Anwar who is saying it or Shiekh Bin Baz who is saying it.
everyone is taken from and responded to.....
except the Prophet peace be upon Him

JiHaDiYa
27-05-07, 09:11 PM
our sister Jihadiya may Allah forgive Her said......



Ukhti.....

a Salafi is someone who follow Assalaf Assaleh in the interpretation of the evidence and wouldn't follow anything or take from anyone except the evidence.

Salafi, Sufi, Sh'ee, Habashi, Khawariji.......anything else.

i don't care about their names. i care about their evidence.

and that's why i told the brother/sister that i'll get back to Him/Her. because i need to extract the evidence, and its explaination and see wether it's right or not.

but somehow you assumed that i didn't take from the brother.

and one last thing.......

i haven't come across any of the well known Shiekh who says about Himself that he is a Salafi, like Bin Baz.....
i never heard him say that, even read Him say it.

so i guess you are saying i don't take from Him......??????


anyway.......

bottom line is.....
the evidence is what i look for.....
whether it's brother Anwar who is saying it or Shiekh Bin Baz who is saying it.
everyone is taken from and responded to.....
except the Prophet peace be upon Him

May Allah forgive you MXXXXM:

Akhi i no this!.... The reason for me saying what i did is because
there is a masjid near to me, and they call themselves "salfi", and they STRESS soooooo much on people labelling themselves as salafi, and IF they dont call themselves "salafi" then they dont take from them!!!!

MXXXXM
27-05-07, 09:26 PM
sister there is a lot of ignorance going around.

but this is not something big when you compare it to some people who say that if you don't agree with us you are in Hellfire, from both sides, Salafis and others.

anyway......

some wise words from Shiekh Ibn Othaimeen may Allah allow both of us to meet Him in Heaven and kiss His forhead.

labelling oneself a Salafi for the sake of creating creeds and groups and deviding the Ummah is not allowed. but labelling onesself a Salafi to show that they follow the ideology of Assalaf Assaleh and that they just follow the evidence and nothing else is allowed.

may Allah guide those people.....

all you have to do is, if they say something which goes with the evidence and the sayings of the well known and senior scholars of all times.....

take it from them, and leave anything bad or anything which contradicts the evidence or the well known ideology of Assalaf Assaleh.

but no matter what......

don't follow your emotions.......
even if the evidence is against your own family and even soul.

and here is a gift for my sister Jihadiya.......

Shiekh Al Albani may Allah allow both of us to meet Him in Heaven said......

a student of knowledge needs as single evidence to be convenced.
while a follower of the desire/emotions, can't be convinced even by 100 evidences.

ibnmuadh
01-08-08, 11:51 AM
.....

ibnmuadh
01-08-08, 11:58 AM
To start with

:start:

:salams

Jihad; Our remedial Pad


The literalist, talks of struggle
For the scholar, it is battle
Men with courage, flood and rattle
Giving the enemy, a likewise bristle
Even with words and coins, engaged in grapple
To spread the truth, and suppress false shuttle
A battle never-ceasing, till demise of cattle
Reclining new scholars, also talk of struggle
What a sway, he is just a riddle
Reality is truth, but they shuffle
Only when you dig, will you solve the puzzle

Brave Khalid, raised the firm den
Abu-Ayyub, and much above ten
It was a canopy, taking most men
To them, they didn’t seek the Yen
Within their span, Allah raised the gen
They were sincere, actualizing words of pen
Without action, we deceitfully learn
How can our kens, bring success then

Islam spread, so went the trend
Many came, trying to extend
If any foe, tried honour bend
They sent troops, to make amend
Mu’tasim, refused prisoner fend
Guatanamo today, is dishonour blend
Those mourning Abu-Ghraib, are targets of rend
I wonder when, justice will descend
Even mere advocates, are forced to bend
And they insist, they have freedom to lend
When Mahdi comes, I pray we attend
And not call him names, as we tend
Or Jesus after descent, he will spend
And fight kuffar, with no stipend

AbdulWahhab’s son, strived for revival
He gained it, entrusting nation survival
Only to turn out, as caliphate rival
A twist of vow, and Shari’ah denial
Since then, true rule went to trial
Forceful disbelief, is now ruling canal
Horns of pleasure, truth is never temporal
On leaving truth, problems turn suicidal
Indecency and vices, and more so brutal
All because, the law is fatal
It is clear, and very normal
As Ibn Katheer, stated on recital
When constitution is supreme, divine seen local
There is no belief, except when temporal
When the norm is divine, with little removal
No nation today, escaped upheaval


How surprising, when horns came helping
Against another horn, they see obstructing
Scholars said go, defend the nation fighting
They are Muslims, we should be supporting
This horn replaced, the original fitting
Why not same, in the new horn’s treating
Just because, they have us kneeling
In second phase, it’s scholars rejecting
Any fighter, whom they sent calling
Only because, new horn is venting
And the subs, keenly pursuing
Forgetting soon, the pearl worth having
Forgetting soon, what the horns are fighting
Any unlucky one, who heard the call running
Today is Hell, prison is steaming
Any scholar, with correct thinking
With knowledge, devoid of false lining
Then prison, will welcome him smiling

Oh Ummah! We embraced crime line
Jihad is must, and we recline
Qurtubi stated, and scholars define
Ibn Taymiyyah, Dahhak made his sign
When the horns, attack to dine
Just as Rasul, foretold the tine
Or the leader, points for nine
Or the foe prisons, do not decline
Or you see, enemies align
Then obligation, becomes the design
We have all these, but leader to shine
Nevertheless, obligation is fine
No scholar, stopped this design
Azzam’s valid fatwa, on cool doctrine

Gone is gone, the living must post
Or even go, and meet the host
You might laugh, or forget about Khost
Seeking to follow, the misguided toast
Many indeed, get trapped in coast
Slandering Mujahideen, and filled with boast
Go read yourself, not your ghost
And mind the media, void are most

Palestine, and many a nest
No other way, will bring them rest
Only jihad, shows real interest
Stop right now, open your chest
What have I done, to bring them rest?
It’s not about, I might try my best
Nor reading rhymes, and making jest
Strategize now, and seek the crest
We all know, life is test
They cry and die, we sleep deepest
They swim in blood, we fashion best
We should plan today, to kick the pest
And follow the plan, whether in east or west
Jihad is the route, for a pure world nest
With Islam as rule, vices permanently rest
No one knows, the soul-taking guest
Will arrive, without behest
What have we done, for the global quest?


High time! For marching forth
High time! To clear their wrath
If not, what do we worth?
Our size is big, over mammoth
Some chant priority, to be knowledge cloth
Perfecting deeds first, Jihad then fourth
These only stay smooth, after marching forth
New Muslims and Sahabah, all went north
Some say Makkan Period, thinking it’s moth
With occupied lands, failing causes wrath

Allah points, arouse them to fight
You should fight, even they turn in plight
Many more places, Allah orders fight
The prophet conveyed, defend your right
Against the horns, with spoken light
With yourselves, and financial might
These horns, have cowardly sight
Mere words, disrupt their night
They have armours, we defeat with kite
We hope soon, they will be in flight

Have you forgotten, of martyrdom price?
Seventy-two Hoors, and he never dies
Hoors so nice, they really suffice
Forgiveness, when the blood drop lies
Seventy relatives, will receive his pies
For sincere martyrs, not who lies
Superior in Jannah, martyrs have it nice
More to that, just give some tries
Oh Allah! Grant paradise


Oh Allah! Crush the horn unit
Oh Allah! Unify us in feat
Oh Allah! Shari’ah will rule the street
Oh Allah! Hasten victory in seat
And guide, all those who treat
The Mujahideen, as if some peat
Those who insist, and want to beat
Only You knows, their rightful heat


A ray to lay, we must say
Since everyday, many play
Or sink in sway, or trivial way
Whether to eat this hay, where beard should stay
When in our bay, people under slay
Their blood like clay, killed by gay
Who fight for play, and little pay
But we fight and pray, for Islam to stay
They hate death tray, no promise hey!
But we embrace the tray, for glad-tidings lay



Inability to trace the author physically leaves the option of the words arranging themselves by chance!
Anyway, the message is the concern and not the history, let's read between lines and get the message to analyze the words.

FadlUH
01-08-08, 11:27 PM
:salams


i'll read it and get back to you Akhi/Ukhti......

i had a quick look at it and there some important points that the brother missed out.

Bro MXXXXM, you haven't responded yet to the post:


MXXXXM,

you should really listen to lectures Thawaabit Ala Darb Al Jihad by Imam Anwar Al Awlaki's (may Allah protect him) talks.

please read carefully: taken from ( http://talk.islamicnetwork.com/showthread.php?t=1604 )

<HR style="COLOR: #d1d1e1" SIZE=1> <!-- / icon and title --><!-- message -->
Jihad will Remain until the Day of Judgment

All of the nations today are standing with their claws clamoring over the lands of the Muslims. All this power lay to waste from one aspect of this deen, and that is Jihad in the path of Allah. This is path that Allah obligated upon us by His words.

This is a part of the deen that the kuffar nations have said is *terror and extremism and fundamentalism*. And they have been helped by some of those that ascribe to Islam using hypocritical methods, and words such as saying that “Jihad is only defensive and not offensive”, that “Jihad is not allowed except to rescue the occupied territories of Palestine” and that the “Jihad (even defensive at that) can only take place with the permission of the ruler.” Or that “Jihad is not appropriate in this day and age, the age of the new world order and peace.”

One thing we do know is that ever since the time of the Prophet (sallallahu alayhi wasallam) the ummah was clear on the topic of Jihad and what it was about. Its markers and Fiqh were made clear and obvious. We are not in any need for any alphabet-soup group to come and develop new ways of understanding the Jihad. We have enough in our heritage to know about the conditions, obligations, sunnah and factors of Jihad.

Above all of this, we know that the Jihad of fighting will remain in the Ummah until Allah’s Legislation rules over the earth. This is from the Thawabit of Jihad in the path of Allah.

The proofs from the Qur'an:
1. "O you who believe! Whoever from among you turns back from his religion, Allāh will bring a people whom He will love and they will love Him; humble towards the believers, stern towards the disbelievers, fighting in the Way of Allāh, and never afraid of the blame of the blamers. That is the Grace of Allāh that He bestows on whom He wills. And Allāh is All Sufficient for His creatures’ needs, All Knower." [5:54]

There is a point related to eloquence in Arabic in this ayah. Whenever a present tense verb is used in this manner it indicates continuity.

Shaykh ul-Islām Ibn Taymiyyah said:

“There is no group that apostates from Islām except that Allāh brings fourth a people that He loves and that wages Jihād for His sake and they are the at-Tā’ifah al-Mansūrah until the last hour.”

2. “And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah) and (all and every kind of) worship is for Allah (Alone). But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)” [2:193]

The Fitnah here is Kufr and fighting will remain until it is removed. The scholars say that Kufr will remain until Isa ibn Maryam descends and breaks the cross, kills the swine, and abolishes the Jizyah, and then his followers will die and then the last hour will come when there is no more believers and it comes upon the most evil of creation.

3. “Fight against those who (1) believe not in Allah, (2) nor in the Last Day, (3) nor forbid that which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger (4) and those who acknowledge not the religion of truth (i.e. Islam) among the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians), until they pay the Jizyah with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. “ [9:29]

The Kuffar use this against the Muslims but the truth has been established and is fixed.

“There is no compulsion in religion. Verily, the truth has become distinct from the falsehood. Whoever disbelieves in Taghut and believes in Allah, then he has grasped the most trustworthy handhold that will never break. And Allah is All-Hearer, All-Knower.” [2:256]

4. “Verily, Allah has purchased of the believers their lives and their properties; for the price that theirs shall be the Paradise. They fight in Allah's Cause, so they kill (others) and are killed. It is a promise in truth which is binding on Him in the Taurat (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel) and the Qur'an. And who is truer to his covenant than Allah? Then rejoice in the bargain which you have concluded. That is the supreme success.” [9:111]

This truth has been fixed and can not be restricted to one time and not another.

Evidence from the Sunnah:
1. the Hadith of Urwah:
Narrated 'Urwa Al-Bariqi: The Prophet said, "Good will remain (as a permanent quality) in the foreheads of horses (for Jihad) till the Day of Resurrection, for they bring about either a reward (in the Hereafter) or booty (in this world.)"

Ibn Hajr, in his explanation of sahih al Bukhari, said that Imam Ahmad used this as a proof because he explained this hadith to imply that Jihad would remain. In the last part of the Hadith, the reason for the good in the forelocks of the horses is due to the reward they bring or the spoils of war. Naturally, this can only take place in Jihad. In this Hadith there is also an encouragement upon keeping horses to wage jihad. Islam will remain until the day of judgment because as long as there is Jihad there will be mujahidun, and they are Muslims.

2. In abu dawud, Hadith from Anas:
The Prophet (sallallahu alayhi wa sallam) was reported to have said: “The Jihad will remain from the time Allah sent me until the time which the last of my Ummah fights the Dajjal. It will not be invalidated by the crime/corruption of the corrupt one nor by the justice of the just one.”

Jihad will remain because the kuffar will remain until the time of Isa when he (alayh salam) kills the Dajjal.


3. In the two sahih:
“There will never cease to be a group from my Ummah fighting upon the truth until the last hour is established.” In the narration of Bukhari: “They will not be harmed by those that oppose them or abandon them.” In Imam Ahmad’s narration: “They will not be concerned by those that oppose them or abandon them.”

This hadith and others like these confirm the quality that the Qur’an gave the believers: waging jihad in the path of Allah not fearing the blame of the blamers.

4. The hadith narrated by Abu Hurayrah about the command:
The Prophet (sallallahu alayhi wa sallam) said, “I have been commanded to fight the people until they testify to la ilaha illah Allah Muhammad rasulullah and establish the salah and pay the zakah and if they do that then they are safe in their blood and wealth except for the command of Islam and their account is with Allah.” (Muslim)

This is from the Thawabit without doubt. These texts that have been mentioned are clear cut.

If we understand this Thabit and put it in front of us, then no matter how difficult it gets and what happens, we must always be there to support the banner of Jihad for that is where the victorious group is that Allah is pleased with.

If we believe that, then we must hold that the powers of Kufr and the Munafiq nations of the Arab regimes can not ever succeed in erasing the banner of Jihad. They might be able to restrict to one place but it will always be even if all of mankind and jinn gather to eliminate the Jihad, they will not be able to because it was raised by Allah and His permission, and it is He who made it such that it would remain until the last of the Ummah fights the Dajjal.

This is the Aqidah that we must depart with in our battles and fights, the Aqidah of Yaqin and the belief in the promise of Allah.

(reference: notes from Thawabit 'ala darb al Jihad)

abdusamad
02-08-08, 05:02 AM
Misconception 2
They say that the Jihad which we are doing
Is defensive Jihad
(called in Shariah, Jihad Dafe' )
(refers to the Jihad when the enemy attacks the Muslims)
and this type of Jihad has no conditions whatsoever
and needs no ability

and the response to that is

this is just weak

we can just ask those people
is this Jihad recommended or obligatory ???

if the answer is recommended
we say you can't obligate people with what's recommended
and we all know that there is no sins or anything wrong
with leaving a recommended act whatsoever




Shall we all abandon Qiyamul Layl? and never pray it again? Sad you made that statement brother. We should always STRIVE to do that which is recommended and forefront of that striving should be the Scholars and their students to lead the people to the GOOD.






if the answer is obligatory
we all know that all obligations in Islam
without any exception
fall and can be left and never done if we are unable to do them
and the biggest evidence on that is
the Hadith by the Prophet peace be upon Him which says
" whatever I command you to do, do what your able to do from it "

and also the verse
" fear Allah as much as you can "
and also

" On no soul doth Allah Place a burden greater than it can bear "

and again
the situation of Muslims in Mecca before migrating to Madenah

and the ability which we are talking about
is not the ability to carry a gun and stand in front of the enemy
nor the ability to use a gun and shoot few bullets on the enemy
nor the ability to hide in caves and between trees

the ability in defensive Jihad is
to be able to protect the Muslims
and stop the attack on the Muslims
and their lands
and more importantly
to be able to take the enemy out of the land of the Muslims


How do you think a nation can be defended,an attack on the people and the land repelled, and the enemy out of the lands of the muslims taken, When you can not even fight? (because we cant at the moment?)

And no mujahid would have hidden in a cave or in between trees, had the leaders and their scholars not betrayed them. Are you belittling the fortresses (caves and trees ) which Allaah provided for the mujahideen as a shelter and camouflage from the planes of the kuffar?

And Also,

Were the numbers of the muslimeen under the leadership of Saad ibn Abi Waqqas when facing the Persians a number equal to that of the Persians? What was the number of the muslimeen? Were their weapons equal? Please reflect.

Are you implying that actually standing in defence of the muslim lands collectively as muslimeen, is a burden which we can not collectively carry? The answer is No. How can Allaah burden a soul when He Himself said:

" On no soul doth Allah Place a burden greater than it can bear "

Verily it is only their cowardly hearts which is stopping them from standing up for the haqq.


otherwise what's the point of hiding in caves and shooting at the enemy
if the enemy is killing our children in the cities
and shedding our blood and raping our women

and what kind of defense is that ?????


A very cheap shot taken at your own brothers, when they are the ones enjoining good and forbidden evil with their hands. I advise you brother;

Abu Hurairah, radiyallahu 'anhu, reported that the Messenger of Allah, sallallahu 'alayhi wasallam, said:



"Let whosoever believes in Allah and in the Last Day either speak good or be silent..... (bukhari and muslim)

You expect Men equipped with little more than Propelled Grenades and Machine Gun to stand in front of F 16 fighter jets and Tanks. Yet, you excuse everyone else including the military firepower and manpower of governments ruling muslim lands

" On no soul doth Allah Place a burden greater than it can bear "



Fear Allaah


and Allaah knows best.